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View Full Version : David Carr's Redemption ?


nunusguy
11-06-2006, 12:14 PM
"When you've got a quarterback like Carr giving up his body and you don't win, it makes you feel even worse," defensive end N.D. Kalu said. "He took control. He gave it up for the team. He gained my respect. I hope his critics back off for a while."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4312579.html
*****************************
Carr needed that play, needed a game like that.
But was it enough after his debacle in Nashville last week ?

TexanFanInCC
11-06-2006, 12:20 PM
tough to say.

i said earlier that i didnt like the lil jump shot mocking of strahan that he did. it was fine for mario bc he did his job and has been for at least 4 weeks straight. DC just came off of a benching, and should be worrying more about not being the QB of an inefficient offense as opposed to mocking the great DE's of the NFL. we lost the game, and only scored 10 points. carr had all the protection he needed and 10 points is simply not good enough. sure the running game did nothing to help, but you still have 2 of the best recievers in the NFL and a great TE target in daniels, and i dont think the numbers are what they shoulda been, but i do like carrs guts in going for the TD plunge.

Meloy
11-06-2006, 12:21 PM
"When you've got a quarterback like Carr giving up his body and you don't win, it makes you feel even worse," defensive end N.D. Kalu said. "He took control. He gave it up for the team. He gained my respect. I hope his critics back off for a while."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4312579.html
*****************************
Carr needed that play, needed a game like that.
But was it enough after his debacle in Nashville last week ?A 10-7 lead against Giants? If anyone thought before the game we would have the lead at that point of game, he/she ought to be selling "peeks" into the future. Were there bad plays? Sure, but I saw a FOOTBALL GAME. I think Carr re-established himself with team, coaches and most importantly himself.

Double Barrel
11-06-2006, 12:22 PM
I think Carr rebounded nicely yesterday. I did not get the impression of a QB who was constantly looking over his shoulder. I think he completely understands where Kubiak is coming from and wanted to prove something to both himself and the HC.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: this team is winning and losing because of the team. One player is not going to win our games by his lonesome self, but will be part of a unit that succeeds and fails together. This is what I'm seeing from a Kubiak team, and it is the mentality that is possessed by winning teams.

Texans Front Row Crew
11-06-2006, 12:38 PM
In a post game interview, Kubiak was asked if Carr had some redemption today? And Kubiak responded (I'm paraphrasing since I don't have a direct quote):

David played well today. What we are looking for is consistant playmaking. We need him to perform well everygame. Not just good one game, bad another, and OK the next.

He seemed positive about DC, and I would like see him play well every week.

I know one thing for sure, he did not look like the David Carr of last week...

Good job team, keep fighting, its all I ask.

OrangeCountyTexansFan
11-06-2006, 12:55 PM
A 10-7 lead against Giants? If anyone thought before the game we would have the lead at that point of game, he/she ought to be selling "peeks" into the future. Were there bad plays? Sure, but I saw a FOOTBALL GAME. I think Carr re-established himself with team, coaches and most importantly himself.

Ditto.
After his touchdown plunge, I thought he would end up with an injured wrist the way he landed. He showed he had guts, and he proved very clearly who our starting quarterback is.
:texan:

real
11-06-2006, 01:01 PM
I'm surprised I haven't seen any one talking about the 5 WR sets we were in most of the game...

Goldeagle
11-06-2006, 01:04 PM
"When you've got a quarterback like Carr giving up his body and you don't win, it makes you feel even worse," defensive end N.D. Kalu said. "He took control. He gave it up for the team. He gained my respect. I hope his critics back off for a while."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4312579.html
*****************************
Carr needed that play, needed a game like that.


He has played that way though. Remember the Atlanta game where he ran for 20 yards to set up the game winning field goal? He could not throw because his arm was basically attached at the shoulder! They had to bring Lance Berkman in to teach him how to slide.

aj.
11-06-2006, 01:19 PM
I'm surprised I haven't seen any one talking about the 5 WR sets we were in most of the game...

fwiw, I just re-watched the Texans last 24 plays of the game (they ran 57 total) and I saw 5 wides two times.

As far as redemption and all that, the whole team needs to become more consistent and eliminate the wild swings in performance from week to week. Minimize the variation and raise the mean ...

real
11-06-2006, 01:45 PM
fwiw, I just re-watched the Texans last 24 plays of the game (they ran 57 total) and I saw 5 wides two times.


I'm not going to argue with you about this, because I haven't re-watched the game and counted the amount of times we were in the set...BUT....

I was just asking because David was on 610 this morning and HE said they were in a lot of 5 wide....not me....He was talking about how it made the game easier.....

Hardcore Texan
11-06-2006, 01:53 PM
fwiw, I just re-watched the Texans last 24 plays of the game (they ran 57 total) and I saw 5 wides two times.

As far as redemption and all that, the whole team needs to become more consistent and eliminate the wild swings in performance from week to week. Minimize the variation and raise the mean ...

I couldn't agree more, I have been saying the same thing. If we can play more consistently like we did against the Jags and the Giants, we will win alot more games. I believe overall team performance in both of these games was far better thatn the rest of the year. After we beat the Jags I thought things were clicking and we would get on a roll, then we laid an egg in Tennesse. We have to put it together week-in, week-out.

And we need a steady, strong, reliable running game to help us get there.

Hulk75
11-06-2006, 02:04 PM
It was a great play and showed his character, the guy wants to win.

I thought it was great when everyone mobed him after the TD jump, I saw Travis, Mario, Dunta, Moulds all come up to him and give him hugs, HE needed that so much.

The best TD I have seen from Carr. That meant the most to him I am sure.

real
11-06-2006, 02:12 PM
It was a great play and showed his character, the guy wants to win.

I thought it was great when everyone mobed him after the TD jump, I saw Travis, Mario, Dunta, Moulds all come up to him and give him hugs, HE needed that so much.


I was laying down watching the game and I jumped up and almost hit my head on the ceiling because I jumped so high....I was pumped, so I KNOW those guys out there actually playing were livid...

Wharton
11-06-2006, 02:17 PM
No redemption yet.

I'll say, DC played better then I expected yesterday and better then he played last year, but no where near good.

DC is still playing scared and it shows in his pass selection. On the majority of plays, DC chooses the dump off and in allot of instances its the right choice. But when you dump off constantly, the defense starts to cheat up and takes away the running game. It was easy to see the Giants game plan yesterday. Shut down the run, make DC beat you over the top. I can only think of one pass play over twenty yards and it was incomplete. There may have been more, I didn't tape the game so I'm going off of memory. DC did exactly what the Giant thought he would do - Dump.

Also, DC is going to have to prove himself within a game. I think DC took a stride forward yesterday by coming back from the benching and playing well. Now lets see him get in trouble in a game and work his way out. I think once this happens, DC be a better, more constant QB.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, DC may have more potential then Sage but at this point in their development, Sage is the better QB.

Texanfan4ever
11-06-2006, 02:18 PM
I jumped up, ran around the room, kissed the tv, and then realized how stupid I looked. LOL I need help!!! :yikes:

TK_Gamer
11-06-2006, 02:23 PM
I'm not going to argue with you about this, because I haven't re-watched the game and counted the amount of times we were in the set...BUT....

I was just asking because David was on 610 this morning and HE said they were in a lot of 5 wide....not me....He was talking about how it made the game easier.....

yeah they went to 5 wide about 4 times total in the game, but since it amounted to no deep passes once again. once again we handcuff our best weapons until Kubiak feels secure enough to take the training wheels off the offense and David Carr.

ridn4_8
11-06-2006, 02:25 PM
I think the last game may the the sparking point for the team, coupled w/ DC's team mates backing him up from last week. We went into a game that everyone predicted was gonna be this butt whooping like never seen before....yet those guys held their own against one of the best teams in the NFL to date. To lose to a team like the Giants by only 4 points, using a first year offensive system, is nothing to be ashamed of. It looks to me like these guys are starting to click w/ the systems, and which each other, which, IMO, will just lead to better things in the future.
As far as DC's game, I saw a guy that seemed to settle down to some degree with some confidence, and be the decisive leader he needs to be for the offense...

Kaiser Toro
11-06-2006, 02:32 PM
Carr responded to the benching well. More importantly, the team responded to him scoring the TD in essence coming to a maligned brother's side.

However, we lost. There may have been redemption for Carr, but the Texans are still looking for more value out of the 7.2 million they are spending. Until he plays consistently and we win there is no redemption for the bottom line in my opinion.

bkparsons
11-06-2006, 02:38 PM
Don't get all excited because Carr did what he was supposed to do. He didn't do anything special. He didn't turn the ball over, he threw safe short passes. That's not what I want. No turnovers, sure, but I'm tired of the dump passes for short gains. This guy is afraid to look downfield. Somewhere in the late 3rd or early 4th quarter, we were driving and there was a crucial 3rd down play where Carr dropped back and then Weigart had a holding penalty and that kille the drive. If you look at that play, that was all Carr. He dropped back, and instead of stepping up in the pocket, he stayed back and Weigart had to grab the defender to keep him from sacking Carr. This happens over and over. Yesterday, car never stepped up in the pocket. When he felt pressure, he ran. The runs were good, but he didn't have to do that on all the runs. Step up away from the pressure, buy yourself a second or two, and find your reciever. I'm tired of hearing all the props this guy is getting for just doing his job. Have we owered our standards that much?

Texanfan4ever
11-06-2006, 02:44 PM
Don't get all excited because Carr did what he was supposed to do. He didn't do anything special. He didn't turn the ball over, he threw safe short passes. That's not what I want. No turnovers, sure, but I'm tired of the dump passes for short gains. This guy is afraid to look downfield. Somewhere in the late 3rd or early 4th quarter, we were driving and there was a crucial 3rd down play where Carr dropped back and then Weigart had a holding penalty and that kille the drive. If you look at that play, that was all Carr. He dropped back, and instead of stepping up in the pocket, he stayed back and Weigart had to grab the defender to keep him from sacking Carr. This happens over and over. Yesterday, car never stepped up in the pocket. When he felt pressure, he ran. The runs were good, but he didn't have to do that on all the runs. Step up away from the pressure, buy yourself a second or two, and find your reciever. I'm tired of hearing all the props this guy is getting for just doing his job. Have we owered our standards that much?


You need to go back and re-watch the game. He stepped up in the pocket a lot. And correct me if I am wrong, he is given plays by the coaches, he doesn't get to make them himself. That's where Kubiak had him playing yesterday, and that was safe, which is what everyone is complaining about.

And he should get props for his play yesterday. We might not have won, but he had a great game against a great team, even if you don't want to admit it. Not to mention how the rest of the team played too.

I'm giving them all props!

real
11-06-2006, 02:48 PM
He stepped up in the pocket a lot.

I don't recall David stepping up in the pocket "alot" if at all.....

NFLforher
11-06-2006, 03:11 PM
Carr responded to the benching well. More importantly, the team responded to him scoring the TD in essence coming to a maligned brother's side.

However, we lost. There may have been redemption for Carr, but the Texans are still looking for more value out of the 7.2 million they are spending. Until he plays consistently and we win there is no redemption for the bottom line in my opinion.


Yes, consistancy is the key, as well as the team eliminating stupid mistakes, drops, missed coverages, trips. etc. etc.

Honoring Earl 34
11-06-2006, 03:38 PM
I thought Carr did OK , does this mean he's out of the woods ... not by a long shot . My problem is ... I can't help but to feel Carr doing good is average for the rest of the league .


When Carr and the Texans win close games I'll be convinced that he has arrived , until then stay tuned .

thunderkyss
11-06-2006, 03:45 PM
As far as redemption and all that, the whole team needs to become more consistent and eliminate the wild swings in performance from week to week. Minimize the variation and raise the mean ...

Now that you mention it, I think we had more penalties in this game than usual.

None by Salaam, but we had offsides on defense, holding on special teams, roughing the passer, multiple false starts.... Pass interference.... unsportsman like conduct...

I'd dare say we got every flag in the book.


Very, very sloppy game.

ridn4_8
11-06-2006, 03:48 PM
...he threw safe short passes. That's not what I want. No turnovers, sure, but I'm tired of the dump passes for short gains. This guy...

Gotta learn to walk before you can run....

tsip
11-06-2006, 03:48 PM
"And correct me if I am wrong, he is given plays by the coaches"

True, he's 'given' the play but-on passing plays-it's Carr's decision on who to throw the ball to.....

infantrycak
11-06-2006, 04:17 PM
True, he's 'given' the play but-on passing plays-it's Carr's decision on who to throw the ball to.....

True, but the coaches also call the routes and depths. When Moulds is hooking at 4 yds rather than running a deep post that is on the coaches. Now obviously when folks are getting down field and Carr doesn't make the throw then the options have been reduced to the WR or Carr.

wolf123
11-06-2006, 05:44 PM
yeah they went to 5 wide about 4 times total in the game, but since it amounted to no deep passes once again. once again we handcuff our best weapons until Kubiak feels secure enough to take the training wheels off the offense and David Carr.

Do you think before you speak? Just curious, cuz you tend to shoot from the hip to prove a point and tend to exagerate. The Texans broke out 5WR 17 times during the game, motioning Lundy to the backfield 3 times. And 5 wide is designed for shorter routes because protection is limited due to lack of close TE or blocking RB's.

Also, the ball was thrown over 20yds 3 times total. All three were incomplete. 1) Underthrown to Moulds, could have been caught but underthrown none the less. 2) Overthrow to AJ 3) Perfectly thrown to Daniels across the middle...dropped. There were also a couple (2) 15 yarders caught.

Blaming this whole game on Carr or even saying Carr played badly is a poorly constructed argument. Although he had three poorly thrown balls and was stepped on by flanagan once, he put the ball where it could be caught and brought the team to where they could have/did score 5 of 7 times. Several players had crucial drops that killed drives this week, Lundy, Cook, Moulds, AJ, and Daniels. Also, Browns missed FG and Stanley's pathetic excuse for a leg. 38yrd punt was the longest of the day...absolutely horrible...think DANIEL SEPULVEDA (Baylor) for next draft in the 7th or undrafted...the kid is beyond amazing.

aj.
11-06-2006, 05:59 PM
I'm not going to argue with you about this, because I haven't re-watched the game and counted the amount of times we were in the set...BUT....

I was just asking because David was on 610 this morning and HE said they were in a lot of 5 wide....not me....He was talking about how it made the game easier.....

Not arguing.... You said about they used 5 wides "most" of the time. I didn't think that was the case from watching the game live. I happened to be re-watching the second half when I read your post so I made a mental note of the times I saw it (twice in the last two drives of 24 plays or so). Not sure exactly how many times they used it before that but yeah it was probably more often than usual -- but certainly not 'most' of the plays -- unless it was most of the 3rd and longs, etc., that you are talking about. No biggie. They were showing different looks to try and spread the Giants D out a bit and make the reads easier. It's nice to see some variation in the formations and sets. It shows that they are getting deeper into the playbook, and doing some innovative game planning at the mid-point of the season. What a concept./

phan1
11-06-2006, 10:03 PM
I hope we see Carr scramble more like he did in this game. Let's face it, his pocket presence just isn't very good. But he does have a good pair of legs, so picking up 5-6 yards here is definitely better than taking sacks. It seems like he was much more eager to get out and scramble today than he has in the past. Honestly the only franchise QB that has as bad a pocket presence as Carr is Vick, and you know he's willing to get out of the pocket and make something happen. And he'll grow more comfortable in the pocket as the years go by. Until then, RUN DAMMIT!

Tulip
11-06-2006, 10:43 PM
Our (fans') expectations have become disturbingly low. We are helping our team creating a losing culture.

:(

Timbuck2
11-07-2006, 12:30 AM
what impressed me most about the game sunday was the pass protection. carr didn't seem hurried, pressured, or knocked down,(tv stats). that being said, why didn't we score more points? bottom line is dc may have played better sunday than against the titans but still not good enough for the win. i know people are staying positive about this past weekend, but let's not settle for mediocrity. 10 pts? won't win on most sundays.

TexansLucky13
11-07-2006, 12:39 AM
what impressed me most about the game sunday was the pass protection. carr didn't seem hurried, pressured, or knocked down,(tv stats). that being said, why didn't we score more points? bottom line is dc may have played better sunday than against the titans but still not good enough for the win. i know people are staying positive about this past weekend, but let's not settle for mediocrity. 10 pts? won't win on most sundays.

Neither does 14 points.

We played well in a game that we were not even expected to have a chance. The defense (namely Glenn Earl, DeMeco Ryans and Mario Williams) had a huge day only allowing 14 points and making some awesome plays.

As for the offense.... I was pleased to see Lundy getting attention and I think the running game is coming together nicely. We played against a strong defense at their house. David didn't have a stellar day but it is a step forward from last week. The O-line looks stable and we may have ourselves a football team, gentlemen.

I am very excited about this team.

GNTLEWOLF
11-07-2006, 01:08 AM
[QUOTE=Wharton;491371]No redemption yet.


DC is still playing scared and it shows in his pass selection. On the majority of plays, DC chooses the dump off and in allot of instances its the right choice. But when you dump off constantly, the defense starts to cheat up and takes away the running game. It was easy to see the Giants game plan yesterday. Shut down the run, make DC beat you over the top. I can only think of one pass play over twenty yards and it was incomplete. There may have been more, I didn't tape the game so I'm going off of memory. DC did exactly what the Giant thought he would do - Dump.


Am I the only one here who remembers the superbowl 49'ers or the superbowl Ravens? They both lived and breathed on the short pass.

TK_Gamer
11-07-2006, 05:25 AM
Our (fans') expectations have become disturbingly low. We are helping our team creating a losing culture.

:(

yes and making excuses for kubiak seems to be replacing making excuses for carr. some people are really blind if they think david carr is free to audible , change formations, go deep at will. he isnt allowed to do any of those things. yet he is still blamed for not producing. just as our running backs and oline are criticized even when we line up in big sets and power I's only to run right into the pile on the weak side. if we were really gonna rely on screen passes to create offense why are we starting our running back with the least vision and worst initial moves. sorry I just see a disparity between what kubiak said he was gonna do at the start of the year and what he actually does on the field. play to win? create a winning attitude? I'm not seeing that.

ArlingtonTexan
11-07-2006, 10:09 AM
Our (fans') expectations have become disturbingly low. We are helping our team creating a losing culture.

:(

I don't about how much fans influence the culture inside the team, but I agree with the sentiment too many people seem satisfied with not embarrasing ourselves in defeat and looking to 2007 8 games into the 2006 season.

real
11-07-2006, 10:13 AM
I don't about how much fans influence the culture inside the team, but I agree with the sentiment too many people seem satisfied with not embarrasing ourselves in defeat and looking to 2007 8 games into the 2006 season.

Baby steps....

We were 2-14 last year...

No one is content with "not emarrasing ourselves"....But more so content with the improvement we have seen....

Baby steps.....

Mr teX
11-07-2006, 10:23 AM
[QUOTE=Wharton;491371]No redemption yet.


DC is still playing scared and it shows in his pass selection. On the majority of plays, DC chooses the dump off and in allot of instances its the right choice. But when you dump off constantly, the defense starts to cheat up and takes away the running game. It was easy to see the Giants game plan yesterday. Shut down the run, make DC beat you over the top. I can only think of one pass play over twenty yards and it was incomplete. There may have been more, I didn't tape the game so I'm going off of memory. DC did exactly what the Giant thought he would do - Dump.


Am I the only one here who remembers the superbowl 49'ers or the superbowl Ravens? They both lived and breathed on the short pass.

Me personally i can't see why everyone is so upset that he dumped the ball off. I know people want to see exciting football 20 + yd gains but, I'm just happy that we were in 3rd and manageable most of the game (except when penalties hit us) than 3rd and 587907 when the defense knew we had to pass.

As for DC, I think he just looked a bit more decisive than normal. When he made his up his mind to run he ran, & when he "anticipated" something would be open he made the throw. granted they all weren't on target but what QB makes all his throws throughout a game? The answer is none; heck i just watched Brady throw 4 picks. When have we ever seen that from him?

Mr teX
11-07-2006, 10:24 AM
Baby steps....

We were 2-14 last year...

No one is content with "not emarrasing ourselves"....But more so content with the improvement we have seen....

Baby steps.....


co-sign

ArlingtonTexan
11-07-2006, 10:34 AM
Baby steps....

We were 2-14 last year...

No one is content with "not emarrasing ourselves"....But more so content with the improvement we have seen....

Baby steps.....

Seem like you just proved my point. I should be having to delete post after post with people using angry language about how the Texans blew that game. Instead I am supposed just fold my hands, yeah the Texans were awful last year,but now we are just another bad football team who will be better next year.

real
11-07-2006, 10:40 AM
Seem like you just proved my point. I should be having to delete post after post with people using angry language about how the Texans blew that game. Instead I am supposed just fold my hands, yeah the Texans were awful last year,but now we are just another bad football team who will be better next year.

Well....I think you are being unrealistic....

If you expect the Texans to be a top notch team after coming off such a horrible season you are setting yourself up for a let down....

No one is saying to be content with being a bad team...No one is even saying be content with a loss....

But if you can't see the progress we've made then I don't know what to tell you....Seems as if you're setting unrealistic expectations for the team and expecting them to live up to them...

All I'm saying is that we have gotten better, and that is what you should be content with...You should be content with the fact that we finally have a competent head coach...That we absolutely killed in the draft...That Carr is looking better...That we are actually competing with playoff bound, "superbowl contending" teams.... You act as if you expected the team to jump from A-Z....

I'll say it again.....Baby steps....

As a team we've improved every week....and sooner rather than later that improvement will translate into wins....

patience grasshopper.......

thunderkyss
11-07-2006, 11:01 AM
Well....I think you are being unrealistic....

If you expect the Texans to be a top notch team after coming off such a horrible season you are setting yourself up for a let down....

No one is saying to be content with being a bad team...No one is even saying be content with a loss....

But if you can't see the progress we've made then I don't know what to tell you....Seems as if you're setting unrealistic expectations for the team and expecting them to live up to them...

Agreed.. most of us understand it takes time. After that embarrising loss in Tennessee, most of us here thought we'd get blown out by the Giants. the Optomistic amoung us thought it would be under 7 points........ I understand us being content with a 4 point loss.

Especially when looking at the game, you know the Giants didn't beat us. We beat us...... not as badly as we beat ourselves in Tennessee. We know there are things we could have done, to win that game..... and many here are voicing that oppinion as well.

I believe the Tennessee game was mainly because we were a little overconfident.... I'm glad we lost that game, and much prefer the loss to NewYork, than winning the game in Tennessee.

yeah, we stomped a hole in Tennessee, but because we were careless, we gave them the game. We took care of the ball better(not great, but better) and went toe to toe with Last years NFC East Champ, and this years NFC East front runner.

I think the second half of the season is going to be very, very exciting.

aj.
11-07-2006, 11:08 AM
"The lack of wins is disappointing. I wanted to be a lot further along from that standpoint."

- Kubiak (I tend to agree)

Baby steps my ass.

These are big boys.... Adult steps.

Anyone who is 'content' with the fact that we left two W's on the field the last two weeks has incredibly low goals set for themselves. Set low goals and you will probably achieve them. I can guarantee the Texans are not content with what's happened the last two weeks. .

I see the positives - but I don't refuse to acknowledge the negatives or use the 'new this/new that' crutch. Regardless of where anyone thought this team should be at this point, they could easily have been 4-4 and all the players and coaches know it.

thunderkyss
11-07-2006, 11:52 AM
"The lack of wins is disappointing. I wanted to be a lot further along from that standpoint."

- Kubiak (I tend to agree)

Baby steps my ass.

These are big boys.... Adult steps.

Anyone who is 'content' with the fact that we left two W's on the field the last two weeks has incredibly low goals set for themselves. Set low goals and you will probably achieve them. I can guarantee the Texans are not content with what's happened the last two weeks. .

I see the positives - but I don't refuse to acknowledge the negatives or use the 'new this/new that' crutch. Regardless of where anyone thought this team should be at this point, they could easily have been 4-4 and all the players and coaches know it.


So that's you, me, & Ibar who were in the 13-3 club right??

real
11-07-2006, 11:58 AM
I see the positives - but I don't refuse to acknowledge the negatives or use the 'new this/new that' crutch. Regardless of where anyone thought this team should be at this point, they could easily have been 4-4 and all the players and coaches know it.

You choose one extreme...Some(myself) choose to be neutral....

No one(me) has said to not be dissapointed with a loss, or even a bad play....

I was ticked at every loss this year....But I'm not ticked anymore....I got over it....I realized that we looked much better in those losses....I realized that Kubiak has the team on the right track....

I think you just need to get over the losses and realize we are moving forward....

real
11-07-2006, 12:02 PM
All my Denver friends have said before the season began:



1. They love Kubiak.

2. You will see improvement.

3. Wait until he has more of his kinda guys.

4. They like Rick Smith. (Smith can find guys, and oh, he counseled against the Maurice Clarett pick).



The guys Kubiak picked up so far in the draft have been nice fits, but yeah, you can't get everyone you want in one offseason.

:cowboy1:

aj.
11-07-2006, 04:58 PM
So that's you, me, & Ibar who were in the 13-3 club right??

uhh no.

I was in the 6 to 7 win club before the season started .... but that doesn't make the last two week's L's (that could easily have been W's) more palatable.

thunderkyss
11-07-2006, 05:28 PM
uhh no.

I was in the 6 to 7 win club before the season started .... but that doesn't make the last two week's L's (that could easily have been W's) more palatable.

I believe we should all be upset with the loss in Tennessee.... there was no excuse for what we saw.

The loss to NewYork.... considering that was a beat up team..... I can understand expecting a better outcome....

but the performance as a team..... there were just too many good things to be too upset about. I loved the Mario sack, followed by the Ryans sack, followed by Mario giving Eli the Heimliech..... then the roughing the passer, and seeing Mario getting fired up...... & David diving into the endzone, and scoring a touchdown in the third Qtr on the road...

This falls into the you win some you lose some category for me.

I'll admit, that I don't understand what Kubiak is thinking....... challenging a play that would give us the ball in the same position we had it at, wether we win or lose the challenge??

what happend to the pressure on the QB in the second half??

what do we need to do to open holes on the offensive line?? they looked like they took a step backwards in run blocking. the line isn't moving together, and we aren't getting the motion we'd seen in the previous two games....

and the play/clock management at the end of the game...... what happened there??.

So I do understand the frustration......

I also understand this is classic David Carr...... if he holds true to form, he'll lay an egg next week.

But overall, this team played better than I had expected against this team.

ArlingtonTexan
11-07-2006, 05:29 PM
uhh no.

I was in the 6 to 7 win club before the season started .... but that doesn't make the last two week's L's (that could easily have been W's) more palatable.

I am glad to see that I am not alone in the camp that when a team has an injured, disinterested team down in the 4th quarter you need to bring that fish on the boat. That is the objective view point. I don't believe you can wait until you think a team is good before ask them to win games that are winnable in the context of what happens on the field. It is not mutually exclusive to understand that you team is not a playoff football team, but expect them to take advantage of opportunity when it is there.

infantrycak
11-07-2006, 05:34 PM
I am glad to see that I am not alone in the camp that when a team has an injured, disinterested team down in the 4th quarter you need to bring that fish on the boat. That is the objective view point. I don't believe you can wait until you think a team is good before ask them to win games that are winnable in the context of what happens on the field. It not mutually exclusive to understand that you team is not a playoff football team, but expect them to take advantage of opportunity when it is there.

Exactly. No one should have expected the Texans to win that game but once they put themselves in a position to do it they needed to sink the gaff in and haul.

aj.
11-07-2006, 05:35 PM
You choose one extreme...Some(myself) choose to be neutral....

No one(me) has said to not be dissapointed with a loss, or even a bad play....

I was ticked at every loss this year....But I'm not ticked anymore....I got over it....I realized that we looked much better in those losses....I realized that Kubiak has the team on the right track....

I think you just need to get over the losses and realize we are moving forward....

Not sure what extremes you're talking about. I made an observation that the Texans could easily be 4-4. That may have been an unreasonable mid-year prediction before the season started, but after watching us play at TN and NY it's not that far fetched. (implicit in that statement is acknowledged improvement if anyone missed it)

Whether we're on the right track or not will ultimately be judged by wins and losses, not by periods of good play during losses.

Like I said somewhere else, the Texans have a good opportunity to win 3 of their next 5. They need to finish strong (something like 4-4 as opposed to 2-6) in the second half to show fans that there are real signs of progress instead of that notional wait and see - happy loser stuff.

Re: As far as what I need to 'get over,' I've been watching this game for a while and I think have a handle on how to respond to what I see in front of me, thank you very much.

Also, in response to some of the other posts above, learning how to win is as much or more important component of progress/improvement as a Mario sack or another Demeco 10 tackle game. That component is still very much missing and Coach admitted yesterday that he thought more progress would have been made in the W column by now.

real
11-07-2006, 06:12 PM
Not sure what extremes you're talking about. I made an observation that the Texans could easily be 4-4. That may have been an unreasonable prediction at the halfway point before the season started but after watching us play at TN and NY, it's not that far fetched. (implicit in that statement is acknowledged improvement if anyone missed it)

Whether we're on the right track or not will ultimately be judged by wins and losses, not by periods of good play during losses.

Like I said somewhere else, the Texans have a good opportunity to win 3 of their next 5. They need to finish strong (something like 4-4 as opposed to 2-6) in the second half to show fans that there are real signs of progress instead of that notional wait and see - happy loser stuff.

Re: As far as what I need to 'get over,' I've been watching this game for a while and I think have a handle on how to respond to what I see in front of me, thank you very much.

Also, in response to some of the other posts above, learning how to win is as much or more important component of progress/improvement as a Mario sack or another Demeco 10 tackle game. That component is still very much missing and Coach admitted yesterday that he thought more progress would have been made in the W column by now.

O.k you win.....Let's all be upset and gripe at the loss....

grrrrrrr....I'm mad......

Double Barrel
11-07-2006, 06:21 PM
I thought Kubiak and the team put themselves in a great position to win the game Sunday. We played our best 3rd quarter all season, and were marching down the field when one player made a mistake by fumbling the ball. How folks can micro-analyze some of these details is beyond me, because I thought we played a great game but lost to the better team (a team that will be a playoff contender and has a good chance of taking the division title).

Sure we made mistakes, and yeah, I was very disappointed in the fumble, the lack of playcalling before the half, and the lack of defensive fire for that last Giants drive. Hindsight is always 20/20 for us armchair QBs.

But c'mon, things are starting to look up, and to be realistic, we were not going to be a winning team this year with our new staff and lack of talent (and depth) at so many positions.

aj.
11-07-2006, 06:32 PM
O.k you win.....Let's all be upset and gripe at the loss....

grrrrrrr....I'm mad......

Reading comprehension is fundamental.

aj.
11-07-2006, 06:39 PM
But c'mon, things are starting to look up...

Yeah - this week.

But what about the week before? (rhetorical question)

I'd like to see two well played games in a row. And a W in at least one. Is that too much to ask as we enter the second half of Kubiak's first season? Or should we be content with 3 good quarters this week?

real
11-07-2006, 06:50 PM
Reading comprehension is fundamental.

I read what you wrote, but didn't feel like responding....

I do now....

Not sure what extremes you're talking about.

I'm talking about not being able to take the good with the bad...not acknowledging progress being made despite the fact that we still aren't where we're supposed to be....

Whether we're on the right track or not will ultimately be judged by wins and losses, not by periods of good play during losses.

Bologna....If you can't look at the way we have been playing and see the improvement from last year I don't know what to tell you...Wins and losses are another stat...an important stat, but a stat none the less...You can't judge progress, and improvement by wins and losses...

Like I said somewhere else, the Texans have a good opportunity to win 3 of their next 5. They need to finish strong (something like 4-4 as opposed to 2-6) in the second half to show fans that there are real signs of progress instead of that notional wait and see - happy loser stuff.

Again....I don't think anyone has said they were happy with the loss...thats crazy talk...I've said it a million times...People are happy with the progress that this team has made, but since you judge progress by stats I guess you can't see it...

Re: As far as what I need to 'get over,' I've been watching this game for a while and I think have a handle on how to respond to what I see in front of me, thank you very much.

Your Welcome


That component is still very much missing and Coach admitted yesterday that he thought more progress would have been made in the W column by now.

The coach also said that he was pleased with the PROGRESS some of the players were making....

Point: You can be mad and gripe about the loss all the wat until Sunday for all I care....all I was pointing out is that the team is moving in an upward direction, and I have seen improvement every week....No they haven't made the big jump yet....No they don't have as many wins as some predicted.......ok......But looking at the overall picture I am pleased with the direction we are headed....

real
11-07-2006, 06:52 PM
Yeah - this week.

But what about the week before? (rhetorical question)


Most were upset with the play of a specific player and not with the team in general.....

kcwilson
11-07-2006, 06:54 PM
Yeah - this week.

But what about the week before? (rhetorical question)

I'd like to see two well played games in a row. And a W in at least one. Is that too much to ask as we enter the second half of Kubiak's first season? Or should we be content with 3 good quarters this week?

3 good quarters this week is still better than 4 lousy quarters every week last season.

I think Kubiak needs to reel in the egos a little and don't let the team think that playing well and losing is a good thing. This week has the making of being a little cocky and arrogant and taking the Jags a little lightly after the butt kicking a few weeks back.

I think they need to come out firing this week and score points on the first drive, which by default means that at no point should we settle for a FG because Kris Brown is the rash on my butt that wont go away. He misses big kicks, and getting on the board first on the first drive against NY would have been huge.

With a soft schedule coming up, the Texans have to be looking at all these games as must wins, for the sake of the psyche of the team.

thunderkyss
11-07-2006, 06:58 PM
Exactly. No one should have expected the Texans to win that game but once they put themselves in a position to do it they needed to sink the gaff in and haul.

Good Point.... Understood.

aj.
11-07-2006, 07:14 PM
You can't judge progress, and improvement by wins and losses...
ookay

I'm talking about not being able to take the good with the bad...not acknowledging progress being made despite the fact that we still aren't where we're supposed to be....
I've acknowledged progress in spades in this thread and others. Again, take some time to read what I'm saying and let it sink in for a couple seconds before knee jerking your next response to what you think I'm saying or what you think I'm about.

And as far as not being able to take the good with the bad, I've been a NFL season ticket holder in this city for close to 30 years so I have a PhD in taking the bad ... lol ...

...and who answers rhetorical questions anyway? (that's another one)

The Pencil Neck
11-07-2006, 08:05 PM
Exactly. No one should have expected the Texans to win that game but once they put themselves in a position to do it they needed to sink the gaff in and haul.

Good teams find ways to win and bad teams find ways to lose. Right now, we're a bad team and even when we put ourself into a position to win, we're not finishing the deal. We're inconsistent. We have all the pieces to win, we just aren't putting them all together at the same time. But, except for the Titans game, we seem to be putting more and more of the pieces together more and more of the time.

If we collapse against the Jags, I'm going to be very bummed. Now is the time we need to start getting it together and start beating teams. Both teams we're supposed to beat and teams we're not supposed to beat.

The Pencil Neck
11-07-2006, 08:06 PM
...and who answers rhetorical questions anyway?

<raising hand...>