PDA

View Full Version : Billy Miller


TEXANS84
09-26-2004, 08:40 PM
Nice to see Billy back in the mix...even if he only caught 3 passes. His catches were clutch and at the right time.

Its just great to see him back.

J-Man
09-27-2004, 11:20 AM
I second that emotion...I am a big Billy fan, he pulled in some great grabs on the 3rd and long plays.

Bill's/TexanFan
09-27-2004, 01:55 PM
Because of size limitations ....Billy Miller will never be the blocker M.B. is but on the other hand....M.B. will never be the receiver he his. I was a little idonno: when we signed Mark because I saw him a number of times when he played for the Steeler's and I never for the life of me understood what current Bill's G.M.Tom Donahoe saw in him to draft him number one when he was the Steeler G.M. .....Mark has always been a singles hitter.....good block...no catch.

infantrycak
09-27-2004, 02:07 PM
Mark has always been a singles hitter.....good block...no catch.

Not exactly, that is just the way the Steelers used him after his rookie season.

COLLEGE: Three-year starter who finished career as UW's school-record holder for catches by a tight end with 90, ranking eighth overall…totaled 1,012 receiving yards to rank third on school receiving yardage list for a tight end

Rookie year--caught 26 passes for 238 yards (9.2 avg.) and three TDs.

After that the Steelers only passed to him in the end-zone pretty much. Throughout training camp and the pre-season , Bruener has been doing a very good job of catching the balls thrown his way. IMO the Steelers were missing out on part of his game.

TheOgre
09-27-2004, 02:19 PM
Bruener has always had good hands but not speed. He is the TE equivalent to a possession receiver, as he usually won't go very far after catching it. That is why he was so effective at the goal when he was with the Steelers.

J-Man
09-27-2004, 02:27 PM
Ogre...I seem to recall Bruener catching a couple in preseason and bulldozing for some serious YAC. As powerful as he is he is a pretty good threat if you can creat a mismatch against a DB with him...providing you throw the hook or inside slant to guard aginst the pick-off.

I agree that he is better in the hands department than most folks believe...this is partly due to the role of the TE in general in the Steeler offense and the fact that he can block as well as most starting guards in the league.

Bill's/TexanFan
09-27-2004, 07:10 PM
Not exactly, that is just the way the Steelers used him after his rookie season.

Rookie year--caught 26 passes for 238 yards (9.2 avg.) and three TDs.

After that the Steelers only passed to him in the end-zone pretty much. Throughout training camp and the pre-season , Bruener has been doing a very good job of catching the balls thrown his way. IMO the Steelers were missing out on part of his game.

I've watch Mark his entire career and as I indicated earlier.....he was unworthy of being a number one draft choice. Keep in mind....the Steeler's didn't stop throwing to him for no reason. After a "reasonable" first year teams started paying a little more attention to him in the short areas and when that happened...it took away his game. Without the speed to get deep he is/was really limited.....most teams use only their strong side LB to cover him and when that happens the strong safety becomes a problem for your passing game. What we need is a TE who blocks like Bruener but catches and runs like Billy "Red" Miller. :thumbup

texanfan
09-28-2004, 12:00 PM
I've watch Mark his entire career and as I indicated earlier.....he was unworthy of being a number one draft choice. Keep in mind....the Steeler's didn't stop throwing to him for no reason. After a "reasonable" first year teams started paying a little more attention to him in the short areas and when that happened...it took away his game. Without the speed to get deep he is/was really limited.....most teams use only their strong side LB to cover him and when that happens the strong safety becomes a problem for your passing game. What we need is a TE who blocks like Bruener but catches and runs like Billy "Red" Miller. :thumbup


A tight end who blocks like Bruener but catches and runs like Billy Miller. Sounds like they already have that tight end on the roster. Murphy.

El Tejano
09-28-2004, 02:49 PM
A tight end who blocks like Bruener but catches and runs like Billy Miller. Sounds like they already have that tight end on the roster. Murphy.
Or on the IR. Too bad we wont see him for a long time though. :thumbdown

infantrycak
09-28-2004, 03:03 PM
Or on the IR. Too bad we wont see him for a long time though. :thumbdown

Joppru is on the PUP list and can start practicing after week 6. The Texans then have 21 days I believe to decide whether to add him to the active roster.

TexanExile
09-28-2004, 08:12 PM
Joppru is on the PUP list and can start practicing after week 6. The Texans then have 21 days I believe to decide whether to add him to the active roster.

Let's save the drama and cut the guy now. I just don't think he'll ever play a down in the NFL. Even if he does, he'll have as much staying power as Charles Rogers over the middle--or Warren Sapp on the South Beach Diet.

Bill's/TexanFan
09-29-2004, 07:24 AM
Of course "some people" will be quick to say "hindsight" but when we drafted B. Joppru with our second round draft selection I was just a little idonno:
Sure, Bennie had a "nice" senior year at Michigan as far as catches & TD's but I felt at the time and still do, that we perhaps jumped a little early when we drafted him that high. And keep in mind, the fact he's been hurt for two years has nothing to do with how I feel. I saw a number of Michigan games on TV and I can't remember thinking...."wow, that guys good...we should draft him". My other team, Buffalo, I know for a fact had some interest in Bennie but that interest ended when the Texans jumped for him with the 9th selection in round two (2). The Bill's felt he could linger until round number three. I should point out that TE's such as L.J. Smith of the Eagles and Jason Witten of the Cowboy's were still on the board when Joppru was taken. Of course I'm leaving the door open for Texan "bu++ki$$er's" to rush in and say...."How was Casserly to know that those guys would be players?"
(But, in case they do....it's his job!) And to make me shake my head even more....we not only passed on Jason Witten in round two but round three as well! I wonder how many Texan fans shook their heads as I did as I watched Witten catch that TD pass on Monday night for the team with the star.

infantrycak
09-29-2004, 07:57 AM
My other team, Buffalo, I know for a fact had some interest in Bennie but that interest ended when the Texans jumped for him with the 9th selection in round two (2). The Bill's felt he could linger until round number three.

Not much of a stretch knowing for a fact that their interest ended when Houston took him--every team's interest ended at that point because he was off the board. Did the Bills hold a press conference and announce everyone they had an interest in and what round they thought they might have lasted to? I know for a fact the Texans' interest in Willis Mcgahee ended when the Bills took him in the 1st round. They felt he could linger to round 2. Uhh, sure....

I should point out that TE's such as L.J. Smith of the Eagles and Jason Witten of the Cowboy's were still on the board when Joppru was taken. Of course I'm leaving the door open for Texan "bu++ki$$er's" to rush in and say...."How was Casserly to know that those guys would be players?"
(But, in case they do....it's his job!)

There is no reason to believe that Casserly & Co. didn't think those guys would be good players. They had coached Joppru at the Senior Bowl and thought he would be better. So the correct question to pose to you is not how was Casserly to know that those guys would be players, but how was Casserly to know Joppru would have a freak injury that would keep him out this long?

As for your head shaking, after the Texans drafted Joppru in the 2nd are you seriously saying you thought they should have also drafted Witten in the 3rd?

Lucky
09-29-2004, 12:50 PM
Of course "some people" will be quick to say "hindsight" but when we drafted B. Joppru with our second round draft selection I was just a little idonno:
Yeah, I would've double-bagged it. :rolleyes:

Maybe if you had made your point prior to Joppru's injuries, someone might take you seriously. Instead you're just kicking someone while they're down. I really respect that. "Some people will be quick to say hindsight"...because it is hindsight.

blockhead83
09-29-2004, 02:15 PM
Yeah, I would've double-bagged it. :rolleyes:

Maybe if you had made your point prior to Joppru's injuries, someone might take you seriously. Instead you're just kicking someone while they're down. I really respect that. "Some people will be quick to say hindsight"...because it is hindsight.

lol pwned.

Mistril48
09-29-2004, 05:47 PM
Of course "some people" will be quick to say "hindsight" but when we drafted B. Joppru with our second round draft selection ...
Do your comments really advance your agenda?

Let's look at the draft in question

Round 1. Andre Johnson (enough said)
Round 2. Benny Joppru (they traded back, together with a 4th, to get an extra 3rd pick and then took the guy that their staff had worked with for a week, AND KNEW WELL.
Round 3. Antwan Peek
. . . . . . Seth Wand
. . . . . . Tony Hollings pick (thru Oakland)
. . . . . . Dave Ragone
Round 4. Domanick Davis (rookie of the year)
Round 6. Drew Henson (becomes first day pick in 2005)

If you nit pick a selection in this draft (the first time in the history of the NFL that 2 rookies gained over 960 yards in the same year!!), you can't be a fan of this team.

Bummer that the Tacks are 1-2, with 2 home losses in division. They got within a yard and now it's all slipping away ...

no81
09-29-2004, 06:03 PM
A tight end who blocks like Bruener but catches and runs like Billy Miller. Sounds like they already have that tight end on the roster. Murphy.

I agree, They need to involve Murphy in the offense more than just use him on special teams, he has proven that he can block and catch. :spot:

Bill's/TexanFan
09-29-2004, 09:04 PM
Do your comments really advance your agenda?

Let's look at the draft in question

Round 1. Andre Johnson (enough said)
Round 2. Benny Joppru (they traded back, together with a 4th, to get an extra 3rd pick and then took the guy that their staff had worked with for a week, AND KNEW WELL.
Round 3. Antwan Peek
. . . . . . Seth Wand
. . . . . . Tony Hollings pick (thru Oakland)
. . . . . . Dave Ragone
Round 4. Domanick Davis (rookie of the year)
Round 6. Drew Henson (becomes first day pick in 2005)

If you nit pick a selection in this draft (the first time in the history of the NFL that 2 rookies gained over 960 yards in the same year!!), you can't be a fan of this team.

Bummer that the Tacks are 1-2, with 2 home losses in division. They got within a yard and now it's all slipping away ...

When trying to convince people how "wise" you are it's always smart to get you facts right. You may want to double check as to which round Tony Hollings was drafted.

aj.
09-29-2004, 09:28 PM
The "Tony Hollings pick" originated from a Texans' 3rd (83rd overall) and 7th round pick (262nd overall) in 2003.

Bill's/TexanFan
09-29-2004, 10:00 PM
Not much of a stretch knowing for a fact that their interest ended when Houston took him--every team's interest ended at that point because he was off the board. Did the Bills hold a press conference and announce everyone they had an interest in and what round they thought they might have lasted to? I know for a fact the Texans' interest in Willis Mcgahee ended when the Bills took him in the 1st round. They felt he could linger to round 2. Uhh, sure....



There is no reason to believe that Casserly & Co. didn't think those guys would be good players. They had coached Joppru at the Senior Bowl and thought he would be better. So the correct question to pose to you is not how was Casserly to know that those guys would be players, but how was Casserly to know Joppru would have a freak injury that would keep him out this long?

As for your head shaking, after the Texans drafted Joppru in the 2nd are you seriously saying you thought they should have also drafted Witten in the 3rd?

It puts a huge smile on my face knowing that you find enjoyment sitting on and picking apart my every word. That's very good of you to do that and hopefully if you pay close enough attention.....you just may learn something along the way. Currently...I fear you are not really ready for primetime! If you carefully re-read what I said I made it very clear that Joppru's injury had nothing to do with how I rated him. I've only seen Bennie as a college player and based on what I saw there....I liked Jason Witten better. Witten looked really good at Tennessee and even though he left school early.....I would have selected him over Joppru. Will Bennie become a better pro than Jason? If he does then we will have a super TE.

Do the Bills hold a press conferences and announce everyone they had an interest in and what round they thought they might have lasted to? Did your mom raise you to be this way? Oh, I can't answer a question with another question...let me try again. No, not to my knowledge. But what they do is bring players in work them out....prior to the draft they will talk in general terms and they not say about saying things like....we are impressed.....he had a good work out....if he's around at a certain point he would be someone we would take a look at. After the draft they have and do say things like....we couldn't get into position to draft him....we knew he'd go early.....we tried to make a move up but it didn't work out.....or we had a third round grade on him. Perhaps if you did less :yap you too could pick up on some of what they say. What they said about Joppru was that they liked him but he "went off the board real early." I have a link to the article but I'm sure you'd have something else "stupid" to say after reading it.
By the way....when I said linger I did not say in the 2nd round.....I said 3rd. If you want to quote me at least get it right!

(As for your head shaking, after the Texans drafted Joppru in the 2nd are you seriously saying you thought they should have also drafted Witten in the 3rd?)

Again.....re-read what I said and you will see that I never indicated that. :wacko:

Bill's/TexanFan
09-29-2004, 10:08 PM
The "Tony Hollings pick" originated from a Texans' 3rd (83rd overall) and 7th round pick (262nd overall) in 2003.

Your sure about that huh? Let me ask you in this manner. How many 3rd selections did the Texans have in 2003?

aj.
09-30-2004, 06:13 AM
Your sure about that huh? Yes, I'm sure.

How many 3rd selections did the Texans have in 2003? Going into the draft, the Texans had three 3rd round selections (#67, #83, and #88).

In the 2nd round of the 2003 draft, the Texans traded their 36th overall and a 4th rounder to New England in exchange for New England's 2nd rounder (41st overall - the Joppru pick) and NE's 3rd rounder (75th overall). In other words, the Texans moved down five spots in the 2nd round to select Joppru and pick up another 3rd rounder. The Pats selected Eugene Wilson with the 36th they acquired from the Texans. He is now their starting FS.

So after the trade with NE, the Texans had four 3rd round selections [67, 75 (from NE), 83, and 88].

They used #67 to take Peek, #75 to take Wand and #88 to take Ragone.

As I said before, in the third round the Texans traded pick #83 along with a 7th rounder to Oakland for the Raiders' 2004 2nd round pick. That 2nd rounder was ultimately used to select Hollings.

Any more questions?

Bill's/TexanFan
09-30-2004, 07:52 AM
Yes, I'm sure.

Going into the draft, the Texans had three 3rd round selections (#67, #83, and #88).

In the 2nd round of the 2003 draft, the Texans traded their 36th overall and a 4th rounder to New England in exchange for New England's 2nd rounder (41st overall - the Joppru pick) and NE's 3rd rounder (75th overall). In other words, the Texans moved down five spots in the 2nd round to select Joppru and pick up another 3rd rounder. The Pats selected Eugene Wilson with the 36th they acquired from the Texans. He is now their starting FS.

So after the trade with NE, the Texans had four 3rd round selections [67, 75 (from NE), 83, and 88].

They used #67 to take Peek, #75 to take Wand and #88 to take Ragone.

As I said before, in the third round the Texans traded pick #83 along with a 7th rounder to Oakland for the Raiders' 2004 2nd round pick. That 2nd rounder was ultimately used to select Hollings.

Any more questions?

I thank you for that very "detailed" report on the Texans 2003 draft. But here is what you are missing......Regardless of the trades which were made, RB Tony Holling WAS selected with a second (2nd) round draft selection! In an earlier post you said he was a third (3rd) rounder.....and as you have now made clear for other readers......he was not!

infantrycak
09-30-2004, 08:48 AM
By the way....when I said linger I did not say in the 2nd round.....I said 3rd. If you want to quote me at least get it right!

Try reading a little more closely--the linger into the second comment was about Willis McGahee. Your 3rd comment about Joppru was quoted correctly above.

PS--your original dispute over Hollings draft round was with Mistral not aj.

aj.
09-30-2004, 11:52 AM
RB Tony Holling WAS selected with a second (2nd) round draft selection! Uh... I know we used a 2nd round pick on Hollings. That's fairly common knowledge and exactly what I said in my last post -- a detail that you obviously missed.

I'll repeat what I said here again: "... in the third round the Texans traded pick #83 along with a 7th rounder to Oakland for the Raiders' 2004 2nd round pick. That 2nd rounder was ultimately used to select Hollings."


In an earlier post you said he was a third (3rd) rounder.....and as you have now made clear for other readers......he was not Where did I say anything about Hollings being a 3rd rounder? You need to take that up with Mistral.

I don't know this for a fact but looking at the way he composed that post, I think Mistral was attempting to highlight the fact that one of those 3rds in 2003 was used to get Hollings.

Again, the Hollings pick -- ultimately a 2nd rounder in 2004 -- "originated from..." a 3rd and a 7th in 2003.

Like infantry said, try reading more carefully so we don't have to post this stuff over and over again.