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infantrycak
10-15-2006, 04:14 PM
Someone please, please explain again how we have a pretty good rushing game.

Oh and by the way--Dexter McCleon needs to be put out to pasture as a DB and there is no NO excuse for not signing Troy Vincent or Derrick Strait or someone else this week. Pathetic.

Hervoyel
10-15-2006, 04:17 PM
I believe all thoughts of us having any kind of running game (good, bad, "other") are out the window. We might as well not even have any running backs on our roster. Why waste the space? We could line any one of our TE's back there and get these results.

As for signing of other players I am at a complete loss. Apparently any bum who played for Denver once or who Gary thinks is "one of his guys" )or Sherm's) can get a job (Hey, they'll even cut one of the current stiffs to make room) but free agents that could actually improve our circumstances aren't worth looking at.

Scott747
10-15-2006, 04:18 PM
I'll continue to support GK.

But at the same time, I am seriously questioning some of the decision making that is going on now. Having a back that takes what seems like five seconds to hit the line is getting stale.

infantrycak
10-15-2006, 04:18 PM
I want at least a story that Houston tried to sign Vincent. Otherwise I am giving the big middle finger. Still a fan, still buy seats, not quiting, but that is my feedback.

TexanSam
10-15-2006, 04:19 PM
I want at least a story that Houston tried to sign Vincent. Otherwise I am giving the big middle finger. Still a fan, still buy seats, not quiting, but that is my feedback.

I heard on the radio last week that the Texans had no interest in Vincent.

sleepwalker
10-15-2006, 04:24 PM
Our offensive line played like a bunch of panzies...Our inability to run the ball was a huge factor in this loss.

I don't care what scheme they try to use and I have said this before *You just can't polish a turd*

I think we all see now how important some kind of running game is!!!

Texas_Thrill
10-15-2006, 04:28 PM
Run & Shoot anyone?

I mean b/c at this point running is POINTLESS.

Vendetta, R.
10-15-2006, 04:30 PM
Maurice Jones Drew. Very late 2nd round, the steal of the draft. Imagine if Bush had 2 games of 2tds like drew does. Espn would explode.

Dubya
10-15-2006, 04:30 PM
Run & Shoot anyone?

I mean b/c at this point running is POINTLESS.

I know. I was pissed. Everytime I saw DC hand the ball off I screamed at the TV "WHY?!"

OzzO
10-15-2006, 04:31 PM
Someone please, please explain again how we have a pretty good rushing game.

Oh and by the way--Dexter McCleon needs to be put out to pasture as a DB and there is no NO excuse for not signing Troy Vincent or Derrick Strait or someone else this week. Pathetic.

cak, I'm stealing part your words for a quote.

J-Storm
10-15-2006, 04:32 PM
What I don't get even as a huge Domanick Davis fan was that we all knew he was a liability coming into the season. Yet... even with that in mind and the # of backs that were available around, we didn't try to get anybody until Gado and Jacobs. Now if someone can explain this logic to me then I'm quite willing to listen, because I know we have other guys we can use that we have drafted. But why did we not seem to go after a name RB...why???

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 04:33 PM
Was it just me or did the backs seem like they were running in slow motion today at Dallas?

I mean it took forever for them to get to the line of scrimmage...

With this running game and collection of backs, we will never get to where we want to be. I have been saying this for a long time now and have received so many neg reps it's not even funny.

But the running game is BROKE, period. It must be addressed in the 07 draft with the first pick, not try and find a bloomer in the 2nd to 7th rounds. We have tried that every year now and look were we are. The time is now my friends, The hub has no wheels...

infantrycak
10-15-2006, 04:34 PM
Lee Suggs is sitting out there but evidently along with the CB thumb, the RB thumb is stuck squarely in a sphincter.

Mr teX
10-15-2006, 04:34 PM
Absolutely PATHETIC! no other words describe that.

run-david-run
10-15-2006, 04:36 PM
What I don't get even as a huge Domanick Davis fan was that we all knew he was a liability coming into the season. Yet... even with that in mind and the # of backs that were available around, we didn't try to get anybody until Gado and Jacobs. Now if someone can explain this logic to me then I'm quite willing to listen, because I know we have other guys we can use that we have drafted. But why did we not seem to go after a name RB...why???

We acctually tried to trade up for DeAngelo Williams on draft day, but it didnt happen. Its hard to tell exactly who's at fault, but its looking like both the line and the backs are screwing up pretty badly.

tsip
10-15-2006, 04:38 PM
I want at least a story that Houston tried to sign Vincent. Otherwise I am giving the big middle finger. Still a fan, still buy seats, not quiting, but that is my feedback.

I'm still trying to figure out why Kubiak said-virtually from day one-we had 'no problrms' with our RBs or DBs---saying this even when it was clear that Davis may be out...what was he thinking?
:yahoo:

Wolf
10-15-2006, 04:39 PM
Lee Suggs is sitting out there but evidently along with the CB thumb, the RB thumb is stuck squarely in a sphincter.

I am with you, you can't tell me there isn't someone out there that would help this team.. and also one that we would sign for the league minimum

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 04:39 PM
We acctually tried to trade up for DeAngelo Williams on draft day, but it didnt happen. Its hard to tell exactly who's at fault, but its looking like both the line and the backs are screwing up pretty badly.

I don't blame the line at all after what I saw on TV. Exactly how long do they need to open a hole up and HOLD it for peeks sake? I mean come on, we have 0 speed in the backfield right now. And don't even get me started on the DB's, that is another thread...

Dubya
10-15-2006, 04:40 PM
Its hard to tell exactly who's at fault, but its looking like both the line and the backs are screwing up pretty badly.

I agree. They line is doing better at protecting DC so far but they can't seem to open up the run game. And the backs aren't helping by being so dern slow.

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 04:41 PM
Someone please, please explain again how we have a pretty good rushing game.

Oh and by the way--Dexter McCleon needs to be put out to pasture as a DB and there is no NO excuse for not signing Troy Vincent or Derrick Strait or someone else this week. Pathetic.

I'll point out that Dallas has a highly ranked run defense. OUr pretty good run game didn't have a chance today. if we only ran the ball 14 times, for the entire game, we played right into their hands.

It's not only about gaining yards, yes that is a big part of it, but it's also about keeping the other team off balanced.

We need to improve our running game, that ain't no lie, but dedicated to the run game, and 14 carries a game is an oxymoron...... it don't work like that, and it won't work like that.

Just like the Miami game, where our run game kept us on the field, and them off the filed, & kept David from trying to win the game with 4776 pass attempts.

I will say for the way this offensive line is playing, that Dayne & Gado aren't fast enough to be of any use to us. at the same time, Mariion Barber would be having a hard time. If Kubiak is going to make our running game work, he's going to have to activate Lundy, and live with it.

Mr. White
10-15-2006, 04:42 PM
Run & Shoot anyone?

I mean b/c at this point running is POINTLESS.

I caught myself thinking the same thing watching this game.

JDizzle
10-15-2006, 04:43 PM
Ron Dayne sucks. Suckon Nogain sucks, too. Why trade away our only explosive back for a slightly less fat Ron Dayne? Ray Charles had better vision than those 2 combined.

Marcus
10-15-2006, 04:46 PM
I'm going to make this short and sweet.

The running backs are not the problem.

Did anyone see any holes being opened on any of those running plays?

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 04:47 PM
What I don't get even as a huge Domanick Davis fan was that we all knew he was a liability coming into the season. Yet... even with that in mind and the # of backs that were available around, we didn't try to get anybody until Gado and Jacobs. Now if someone can explain this logic to me then I'm quite willing to listen, because I know we have other guys we can use that we have drafted. But why did we not seem to go after a name RB...why???

They felt really good about Lundy in TC, and the preseason. Then after a bad half in philly, they just flip-flopped on him, and won't even activate him for a game.


That says something about our running game, when David goes against a stout Defense, not get sacked, and nobody is happy about it.

Hulk75
10-15-2006, 04:48 PM
Ron Dayne before today was 35 in rushing yards in the NFL.

Does anyone out there know were we can find a RB?????????????

JDizzle
10-15-2006, 04:48 PM
Plenty of opportunities for them to bounce it outside and gain some yards. The only thing bouncing were Ron Dayne's man boobs.

Scooter
10-15-2006, 04:48 PM
I'm still trying to figure out why Kubiak said-virtually from day one-we had 'no problrms' with our RBs or DBs---saying this even when it was clear that Davis may be out...what was he thinking?
:yahoo:

we might not have had any problems when he said it. what happened is we dont have the guys he was talking about. none of the running backs from training camp & preseason are playing. this is poor management, to put it lightly. lundy's on the bench, morency's in green bay, taylor's on the practice squad, DD's on injured reserve, and antwain smith didnt make the team.

all of which are typical denver backs. instead we have green bay "power i" runningbacks.

that being said, our offensive line is still horrible (we have ALWAYS been a pathetic run blocking team, despite DD's relative success) and it's not all the backs' fault. if mckinney or weigert make our roster next season, i'll (as one of kubiak's biggest promoters) be first in line to scream for new management.

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 04:50 PM
Ron Dayne before today was 35 in rushing yards in the NFL.

Does anyone out there know were we can find a RB?????????????

Yes, in the 1st round of the 07 draft...

Koolbrz
10-15-2006, 04:53 PM
Lee Suggs is sitting out there but evidently along with the CB thumb, the RB thumb is stuck squarely in a sphincter.

Lee Suggs is an injury waiting to happen. Last 3-4 yrs he has spent alot of time on IR list. Would not want him around here. We have enough stiffs running around in the backfield as it is, dont want another.

TexansJunkE
10-15-2006, 04:56 PM
CC Brown just sucks! How does Troy Vincent or Carroll, or Strait sit out there without jobs, But 6th rd pick CC Brown has one............Look I understand the past coaches and GM have ruined our drafts beyond belief, but...........................This Organization is finding it hard to cheer for them.:crying:

sleepwalker
10-15-2006, 04:56 PM
Plenty of opportunities for them to bounce it outside and gain some yards. The only thing bouncing were Ron Dayne's man boobs.

hahahahahahahahaha thank you I needed that laugh!!!

Hulk75
10-15-2006, 04:57 PM
Yes, in the 1st round of the 07 draft...

http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2004/images/10/09/tx_peterson_ap.jpg

Texans_Chick
10-15-2006, 04:57 PM
I'm going to make this short and sweet.

The running backs are not the problem.

Did anyone see any holes being opened on any of those running plays?

Hard to tell with TV angles, but the amount of push that the defenses are getting doesn't look great for the Texans.

It can't help that it just seems as though one-cut running means run up the back of your linemens' legs.

Just arbitrarily picking numbers based on what I've seen in the games so far, I think it is 70/30 percent on the run blocking/running back responsibility on this. Pass blocking has looked better, but I think that is partially due to having plays that have more options to throw to.

infantrycak
10-15-2006, 04:58 PM
Lee Suggs is an injury waiting to happen. Last 3-4 yrs he has spent alot of time on IR list. Would not want him around here. We have enough stiffs running around in the backfield as it is, dont want another.

That's nice, but you know what--he made as many yards from his couch to his beer cooler today as the Texans RB's did and probably in less attempts.

Koolbrz
10-15-2006, 04:58 PM
I'm going to make this short and sweet.

The running backs are not the problem.

Did anyone see any holes being opened on any of those running plays? Holes may not have been there, but there was plenty of running room to the outside. Then again with the type of speed Dayne and Gado have it would not have worked out for us either. We seriously need an upgrade at the RB position. No excuses from me anymore, our backs freakin sux!!!

Texans_Chick
10-15-2006, 04:59 PM
CC Brown just sucks! How does Troy Vincent or Carroll, or Strait sit out there without jobs, But 6th rd pick CC Brown has one............Look I understand the past coaches and GM have ruined our drafts beyond belief, but...........................This Organization is finding it hard to cheer for them.:crying:

Technically speaking, CC was the Texans top tackler today. Don't want that to be your safety, but it is what it is.

Koolbrz
10-15-2006, 05:00 PM
That's nice, but you know what--he made as many yards from his couch to his beer cooler today as the Texans RB's did and probably in less attempts.

Okay, lets pick him up and lets let him get injured and then we will have another back on the roster that is not contributing. Sounds like a plan dude. If he was that good he would be playing somewhere today, dont you think??

Mr. White
10-15-2006, 05:01 PM
I'm going to make this short and sweet.

The running backs are not the problem.

Did anyone see any holes being opened on any of those running plays?

It looks like maybe 3 of us on this board are seeing this. The popular consensus around here seems to be that the RBs are the problem.

Dayne got 98 yards with a long of 55 last year on the Dallas D. The Cowboys defense isn't that much different than it was last year.

Maybe you guys see holes, but I don't.

Texans_Chick
10-15-2006, 05:01 PM
Holes may not have been there, but there was plenty of running room to the outside. Then again with the type of speed Dayne and Gado have it would not have worked out for us either. We seriously need an upgrade at the RB position. No excuses from me anymore, our backs freakin sux!!!

If the play call is an inside run then it is an inside run. One of the few good Dayne runs was in the first quarter to the outside.

The stuffing is so bad, I am starting to wonder if there is any telegraphing of the plays or if it is just bad. I am thinking it is just bad, but you never know.

I didn't notice any of that Power I stuff today--did I miss it?

JDizzle
10-15-2006, 05:02 PM
Picking up Lee Suggs would have been like using those free cologne samples in magazines before a hot date .... very little investment involved, but it could result in a huge score afterwards. If you don't score, so what, you didn't spend that much and you've got some money left over for a couple DVD's and some beer to ease your pain.

Hulk75
10-15-2006, 05:03 PM
I'm going to make this short and sweet.

The running backs are not the problem.

Did anyone see any holes being opened on any of those running plays?

Yes it is, there are holes, but they do close faster BECAUSE our RBs are too slow to it them..........Do we have a gamebreaker our even a guy that can take it the distance? NO!

Koolbrz
10-15-2006, 05:06 PM
If the play call is an inside run then it is an inside run. One of the few good Dayne runs was in the first quarter to the outside.

The stuffing is so bad, I am starting to wonder if there is any telegraphing of the plays or if it is just bad. I am thinking it is just bad, but you never know.

I didn't notice any of that Power I stuff today--did I miss it?


I look at it this way, if a call is made to run inside and a hole is not there, you dont run right up your linemans azz!!! You try and bounce to the outside. Make something out of nothing. Even if its for a 3-4 yd pick up. Hell i'll take that over our less than 2 ypc. I know football and we do not have a running game.

barzilla
10-15-2006, 05:07 PM
The Texans are in a conundrum that seemingly has no solution. As someone said earlier, you cannot abandon the running game and no team has been successful without a credible running threat. Yet, it is maddening to watch a team run the ball on third down when they clearly have shown they can't do it. So, what do you do? Do you run the ball 25-30 times a game and gain 40 yards or do you bite the bullet and start chucking 50-60 times a game?

I liked what I saw from Ryans and Williams today, but this secondary is sub-par. I'm at a loss on the offensive line.

TexansJunkE
10-15-2006, 05:09 PM
Technically speaking, CC was the Texans top tackler today. Don't want that to be your safety, but it is what it is.
So What! That just means that the bums in front of him( Ryans not included in that) are not getting off blocks. Tell me when he has made a play or INT? I'll wait for your response:cool:

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 05:11 PM
But the running game is BROKE, period. It must be addressed in the 07 draft with the first pick, not try and find a bloomer in the 2nd to 7th rounds. We have tried that every year now and look were we are. The time is now my friends, The hub has no wheels...

over the coarse of this season, our QB has been sacked 15 times in just 5 games, that # is still way too high.

to help our offense the most, we need to get soe better gaurds, and a better center in here.

stingray
10-15-2006, 05:11 PM
God do we need Adrian Peterson!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 05:13 PM
over the coarse of this season, our QB has been sacked 15 times in just 5 games, that # is still way too high.

to help our offense the most, we need to get soe better gaurds, and a better center in here.

Why? So another bumbling back can run over there leg and break it too?

The line was not the problem, the speed, or lack of is the problem in the backfield. Let's just agree that we disagree...

NJTexanFan
10-15-2006, 05:13 PM
Man i blame the play on both the offensive line and the running backs i watched the line practicually the whole game and they didn't make not one hole it, and the running backs made me even more angry they would run into the middle with no hole, they were running into the offensive line we have no speed running back they just look dumb out there

Mr teX
10-15-2006, 05:15 PM
The Texans are in a conundrum that seemingly has no solution. As someone said earlier, you cannot abandon the running game and no team has been successful without a credible running threat. Yet, it is maddening to watch a team run the ball on third down when they clearly have shown they can't do it. So, what do you do? Do you run the ball 25-30 times a game and gain 40 yards or do you bite the bullet and start chucking 50-60 times a game?
I liked what I saw from Ryans and Williams today, but this secondary is sub-par. I'm at a loss on the offensive line.


In this league you cannot be one dimensional & still expect to win games. With that, we are coming into games one dimensional, teams know we can't run so they don't really make any strides to try & stop our run.

JDizzle
10-15-2006, 05:19 PM
A Chris Brown trade is looking pretty dern good right now.

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 05:19 PM
Plenty of opportunities for them to bounce it outside and gain some yards. The only thing bouncing were Ron Dayne's man boobs.

I can agree with this, but the strength of the backs that run in the Denver system, is not being able to bounce it outside. Not TerrellDavis' strong suite, not OlandisGary's strong suit, not Mike Anderson, Reuban droagns(sp), not Grifith, not even TatumBell/Mike Bell.

Koolbrz
10-15-2006, 05:22 PM
I can agree with this, but the strength of the backs that run in the Denver system, is not being able to bounce it outside. Not TerrellDavis' strong suite, not OlandisGary's strong suit, not Mike Anderson, Reuban droagns(sp), not Grifith, not even TatumBell/Mike Bell.

Do you seriously know what the difference is between the backs you just mentioned and the backs we have??? SPEED!!!!! and lots of it. They also have better vision and the ability to cut back if they have too. All we have are a couple of slow moving objects coming out of the backfield that only run in one direction. Right up there linemans AZZ!!!!

Mr teX
10-15-2006, 05:23 PM
A Chris Brown trade is looking pretty dern good right now.

That's what i'm hoping for right now, Anything but what we have now.

Hardcore Texan
10-15-2006, 05:23 PM
Bad run blocking + lack of explosive running backs + injuries = 1st draft pick in '07.

I hope it doesn't come down to this but without some sort of running game we are doomed! We can't even convert a 3rd and 1 with a handoff or a QB sneak. I thought we would do much better than this in the running game this year. Ironic that we relied on DD for the last 3 years and had no passing game and now we are better at pass protection with no running game. I heard somewhere once there are O-Lines out there that can actually do both.

I guess our OL just can't grasp or doesn't have the physical attributes for the ZBS, and we are playing some sort of hybrid scheme with big, powerful, and slow backs. I think we will see a big overhaul on the O-line in the offseason...and that may send us back to the drawing board again.

Texans_Chick
10-15-2006, 05:25 PM
So What! That just means that the bums in front of him( Ryans not included in that) are not getting off blocks. Tell me when he has made a play or INT? I'll wait for your response:cool:

Your wait is over.

Safety blitz for a sack of Bledsoe. Today. 9 tackles, 1 assist, 1 sack. :cool:

There is a lot not working in the secondary, but today isn't really a day to call out CC Brown in particular.

abbest
10-15-2006, 05:26 PM
http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2004/images/10/09/tx_peterson_ap.jpg

You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.

Scooter
10-15-2006, 05:27 PM
Why? So another bumbling back can run over there leg and break it too?

The line was not the problem, the speed, or lack of is the problem in the backfield. Let's just agree that we disagree...

i completely disagree here. while our backs arent very good, almost noone can produce behind this line. wand got cut and spencer's out so the left side takes a major hit. flanagan while not the best run blocker, is needed for the passing game and pitts is doing pretty well assisting flanagan ... flanagan's doing decently at taking that double team with pitts and then peeling off to the second level. the best thing the texans can do this offseason is trade weigert & mckinney to a division rival for a bag of peanuts. between those two and flanagan not being that great of a run blocker, the entire right side is impossible to run behind.

rmartin65
10-15-2006, 05:28 PM
You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.

There are exceptions to every rule. If our running game stays this bad, or heaven forbid gets worse, Kubiak will probably pick a runningback in the first round. he likes to run the ball, and who we have now wont cut it.

Koolbrz
10-15-2006, 05:29 PM
Bad run blocking + lack of explosive running backs + injuries = 1st draft pick in '07.

I hope it doesn't come down to this but without some sort of running game we are doomed! We can't even convert a 3rd and 1 with a handoff or a QB sneak. I thought we would do much better than this in the running game this year. Ironic that we relied on DD for the last 3 years and had no passing game and now we are better at pass protection with no running game. I heard somewhere once there are O-Lines out there that can actually do both.

I guess our OL just can't grasp or doesn't have the physical attributes for the ZBS, and we are playing some sort of hybrid scheme with big, powerful, and slow backs. I think we will see a big overhaul on the O-line in the offseason...and that may send us back to the drawing board again.


I agree with the slow comment but not the powerful. They were dropping like flies today. We need a quick fix if they are serious about improving there record from last yr. If they dont do something soon we will be the first team in history to have back to back 1st rd. picks and if that were to happen they would probably screw it up like this last draft. Just my opinion.

JDizzle
10-15-2006, 05:29 PM
I can agree with this, but the strength of the backs that run in the Denver system, is not being able to bounce it outside. Not TerrellDavis' strong suite, not OlandisGary's strong suit, not Mike Anderson, Reuban droagns(sp), not Grifith, not even TatumBell/Mike Bell.

So why start a reject from the same system? Picking up Ron Dayne wasn't a bad move, but making him our starting RB was. Morency should have never been traded and him and Lundy should be our main ballcarriers.

abbest
10-15-2006, 05:35 PM
Bad run blocking + lack of explosive running backs + injuries = 1st draft pick in '07.

I hope it doesn't come down to this but without some sort of running game we are doomed! We can't even convert a 3rd and 1 with a handoff or a QB sneak. I thought we would do much better than this in the running game this year. Ironic that we relied on DD for the last 3 years and had no passing game and now we are better at pass protection with no running game. I heard somewhere once there are O-Lines out there that can actually do both.

I guess our OL just can't grasp or doesn't have the physical attributes for the ZBS, and we are playing some sort of hybrid scheme with big, powerful, and slow backs. I think we will see a big overhaul on the O-line in the offseason...and that may send us back to the drawing board again.

ok now who will be the Texans 1st pick next year? another 6'9" freak of nature that would neutralize the potent Colts offense. I can hardly wait.

abbest
10-15-2006, 05:47 PM
So why start a reject from the same system? Picking up Ron Dayne wasn't a bad move, but making him our starting RB was. Morency should have never been traded and him and Lundy should be our main ballcarriers.

I agree with u on that. The running game was impressive in the preseason. After one regular season game you dump your two main ball carriers for someone else`s baggage. I am wondering now if that is the reason Kube was never offered a head coach position before.

TexansSeminole
10-15-2006, 05:48 PM
I am wondering now if that is the reason Kube was never offered a head coach position before.

Who said he was never offered a head coach position before??

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 05:52 PM
Yes it is, there are holes, but they do close faster BECAUSE our RBs are too slow to it them..........Do we have a gamebreaker our even a guy that can take it the distance? NO!

Larry Johnson has 14 yards on 10 carries in the first half......... sounds kinda like Ron Dayne.. Maybe we can get a trade from KC, straight up.

DenverBorn
10-15-2006, 05:54 PM
Frankly we had a better running game last year with JONATHAN WELLS! GMAB

JDizzle
10-15-2006, 05:55 PM
TK if you don't think that LJ would be an upgrade over Dayne your are not right in the head.

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 06:03 PM
You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.

It's common knowledge, that Kubiak was working a deal for us to get a Franchise running back in the first round.

I was wrong about Kubiak taking a running back early in the draft.....

It turns out that Denver hasn't done it because they never had the opportunity.

J-Storm
10-15-2006, 06:04 PM
I'm beginning to think that a stoned Ricky Williams could be better than what we have atm. I'd take him stoned, Domanick on crutches and a 1 legged crossbred hickbilly over what we have let alone LJ or LT...

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 06:05 PM
I agree with u on that. The running game was impressive in the preseason. After one regular season game you dump your two main ball carriers for someone else`s baggage. I am wondering now if that is the reason Kube was never offered a head coach position before.

I do agree..... getting Dayne made sense.... & I could see getting Gado on our squad. But one or the other only.

I don't get the Trade, then not activating Lundy for any game since Philly....

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 06:05 PM
You can forget that. Coach Kube doesn`t believe in drafting franchise RB`s in the 1st round. Our running attack is reduced to a slow stroll.

And if that happens, you can bet on one thing for sure...

Reliant Stadium will look like the Astrodome... Empty and dusty...

How long do you think it will take before people quit wasting there time and money supporting a team that does not want to win? And by "does not want to win", I mean bypassing someone like a top running back in the draft when your running game sucks?????

To me, and this is just my opinion, Kubes gambled on his running game plan and lost. The personel are not as good as he had hoped. Do I think Mr. Reggie was the answer? Heck no, but I thought De'Angelo was... And I think that maybe, just maybe, Adriann P is the answer, but time will tell...

TexansSeminole
10-15-2006, 06:07 PM
I'm beginning to think that a stoned Ricky Williams could be better than what we have atm. I'd take him stoned, Domanick on crutches and a 1 legged crossbred hickbilly over what we have let alone LJ or LT...

Weed is what made Ricky Williams good.

TexansSeminole
10-15-2006, 06:09 PM
To me, and this is just my opinion, Kubes gambled on his running game plan and lost.

Yea, but there are so many problems on this team...he has to lose somewhere.

Wolf
10-15-2006, 06:12 PM
Yea, but there are so many problems on this team...he has to lose somewhere.

thank Dom and Charlie for that

barzilla
10-15-2006, 06:14 PM
Everyone keeps mentioning these trade options. My question is whether it is worth it to make a trade. We are already 1-4. I say if we can't get to the playoffs we use this season to figure out which players fit the Kubiak system and which ones don't. Go ahead and give Winston some starts. Go ahead and activate Lundy and give him some starts. I don't want to give up a 3rd-4th round pick for someone that is mediocre at best.

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 06:14 PM
TK if you don't think that LJ would be an upgrade over Dayne your are not right in the head.

The point is that even Larry Johnson, who is known to bounce to the outside every now and again gets stuffed. We met a better defense today(and against Miami).

If you're going to give up on Dayne after facing Dallas(3.1 ypc) & Miami (2.9 ypc) then LarryJohnson ought to be on the chopping block for facing Pittsburgh (3.4 ypc) & managing just 1.8 ypc(12 for 22 right now, and he is still in the game) & 2.25(16 for 36) against Arizona who gives up 4.3 ypc.

The guys on the other side of the ball gets payed pretty well to do what they do, and we've just gone against two of the top 4.

thunderkyss
10-15-2006, 06:19 PM
Everyone keeps mentioning these trade options. My question is whether it is worth it to make a trade. We are already 1-4. I say if we can't get to the playoffs we use this season to figure out which players fit the Kubiak system and which ones don't. Go ahead and give Winston some starts. Go ahead and activate Lundy and give him some starts. I don't want to give up a 3rd-4th round pick for someone that is mediocre at best.

WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 06:24 PM
WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.

And Tennessee beat Washington today...

Now we have allot of needs to fill. No way can all of these holes be filled in 1 season. Not writing the season off, but it sure doesn't look any better now than it did last year.

I just wished I had this magic ball that I could read and see what is in the future for us fans.

A Star Running Back?
A Star Defensive Back?
A Star Wide Receiver?
A Star Line Backer?

Who knows, I surely don't. I was very disappointed in the Dallas game today, not that we lost, but how we lost. Leading 6 - 3 at halftime, the running game being completely broken, but the D was holding it's own.

What team came out in the 2nd half? It surely wasn't the same team that played the 1st half....

JDizzle
10-15-2006, 06:34 PM
The point is that even Larry Johnson, who is known to bounce to the outside every now and again gets stuffed. We met a better defense today(and against Miami).

If you're going to give up on Dayne after facing Dallas(3.1 ypc) & Miami (2.9 ypc) then LarryJohnson ought to be on the chopping block for facing Pittsburgh (3.4 ypc) & managing just 1.8 ypc(12 for 22 right now, and he is still in the game) & 2.25(16 for 36) against Arizona who gives up 4.3 ypc.

The guys on the other side of the ball gets payed pretty well to do what they do, and we've just gone against two of the top 4.

LJ's slow start is still better than Dayne's. Then there's that whole thing about LJ racking up 1700+ yards and 20TD's in 9 starts last year, while Ron Dayne was thinking of 1700 different ways to order his Whataburger. Sometimes I wonder what planet you're from.

tsip
10-15-2006, 06:34 PM
WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.

Tenn and Detroit won today, with the Titans playing good against the Colts last week,as well-oh, and TB won with a rookie QB--we're fast running out of teams we have a chance to beat=Skins got beat today, as did the Eagles by the Saints (who also have a new HC and QB)--seems like most teams ahead of us are getting better while we're.....

blockhead83
10-15-2006, 06:40 PM
The running game was pathetic today. The blocking sucked and so did the RB's. I could've sworn I saw some cutback lanes today, but I don't think our backs have the speed/vision to find those cutback lanes. How many times were we faced with 3rd and 1, 4th and 1, 3rd and 2 and ended up getting stuffed and having to punt or kick a FG. Until our running game steps up, we're going to continue to get slapped around by good teams.

Maddict5
10-15-2006, 07:08 PM
Plenty of opportunities for them to bounce it outside and gain some yards. The only thing bouncing were Ron Dayne's man boobs.


+rep..too funny

Imatexanfan
10-15-2006, 07:19 PM
CC Brown just sucks! How does Troy Vincent or Carroll, or Strait sit out there without jobs, But 6th rd pick CC Brown has one............Look I understand the past coaches and GM have ruined our drafts beyond belief, but...........................This Organization is finding it hard to cheer for them.:crying:

You know what I gotta stop ya right there. CC is the only reason we had a chance at sacking DB today and that is final. Matter of fact I put CC up there by DRob in my book ahead of MW. But DRy is the man. CC he WAS defense today.:yikes:

Imatexanfan
10-15-2006, 07:26 PM
WE put the players on the field, that gives us the best chance to win. If we ever stop trying to win football games, then this franchise is done.....

As fans, we should understand that we aren't going to win everygame, but the coach has an obligation to us fans, to the players, and to the organization to put the best team on the field, and try to win a game.

You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.

NAH MAN WE LOST TO DALLAS!!! Thats way more than what washington has done yet, does washington have an "instate" team uuuuhhhh nah so dude come on with that one.

barzilla
10-15-2006, 07:49 PM
You guys act like we've lost to Tennesse, the Raiders, and Detroit. Washington beat us, but they've got more to hang their heads about, than we do.

Thunderkyss,

It's not about not trying to win football games. It's about asking a very pointed question: how much better is Chris Brown than what we have? I don't want to give up a middle round pick for someone that isn't going to be a part of the long-term future. Perhaps it gets us from 6-10 to 7-9. Or maybe we go from 5-11 to 6-10.

There's a big difference between tanking games and simply not mortgaging your future for a mediocre player.

chuckm
10-15-2006, 07:51 PM
Dayne is a total zero ...... he runs like he has his eyes closed ...

Hervoyel
10-15-2006, 08:02 PM
Something I keep coming back to in my mind is that the running game does not look anything like it did in the preseason and I'm not even remotely talking about the results we're getting with it.

I'm talking about the way we're running the ball and what our linemen are doing during running plays. I'm not the most insightful poster in here but I'm not seeing anything "Denver" about our rushing attack. I'm not seeing any lanes to cut back through at all. The only thing I'm seeing is a slow back or a quicker back running straight into the line whether a hole is there or not.

Like I said I'm not the guy you go to if you want to take apart a series of plays and find out what everyone on the line was (or wasn't) doing. I do have a general idea what Denvers offense looks like and this isn't even close.

I believe this is all Green Bay and Mike Sherman and I think that we have a real problem. One thing I do know when I see it is an offense that's straddling philosophies. I watched Capers/Palmer try to coexist for three seasons. This looks a lot like that.

Hervoyel
10-15-2006, 08:04 PM
Dayne is a total zero ...... he runs like he has his eyes closed ...


That's not accurate. Dayne is a 30 carry per game back who needs to line up deep behind the line so that he gets some momentum built up and who needs a good line to open holes for him. He's not a total zero man, he's just not a good fit for what we're apparently trying to do here right now with the players we have at the moment.

Texans_Chick
10-15-2006, 08:10 PM
Something I keep coming back to in my mind is that the running game does not look anything like it did in the preseason and I'm not even remotely talking about the results we're getting with it.

I'm talking about the way we're running the ball and what our linemen are doing during running plays. I'm not the most insightful poster in here but I'm not seeing anything "Denver" about our rushing attack. I'm not seeing any lanes to cut back through at all. The only thing I'm seeing is a slow back or a quicker back running straight into the line whether a hole is there or not.

Like I said I'm not the guy you go to if you want to take apart a series of plays and find out what everyone on the line was (or wasn't) doing. I do have a general idea what Denvers offense looks like and this isn't even close.

I believe this is all Green Bay and Mike Sherman and I think that we have a real problem. One thing I do know when I see it is an offense that's straddling philosophies. I watched Capers/Palmer try to coexist for three seasons. This looks a lot like that.

Amen brother.

Kubiak is coaching the QB/K.Shanahan the receivers/Pariani the tight ends--totally Denver.

Sherman is coaching the line. The blocking doesn't appear to the be same sort of ZBS that Denver does, or even what the Texans did last year.

Runner
10-15-2006, 08:11 PM
I believe this is all Green Bay and Mike Sherman and I think that we have a real problem. One thing I do know when I see it is an offense that's straddling philosophies. I watched Capers/Palmer try to coexist for three seasons. This looks a lot like that.

If it's true we aren't running the Denver scheme, asking most of our lineman to lose so much weight might have been a mistake.

Maybe that's why Spencer looked so good to everyone - he's the only guy that didn't make his target weight, or if he did make it he had the highest target.

Kaiser Toro
10-15-2006, 08:12 PM
Pathetic. The lack of a running game in Kubiak's philosophy basically spells doom no matter who you have at QB or WR. It is no wonder that we perform well on the first drive of the game, every game. It is the only element of surprise we have the entire game and they must only respect the run for that one drive. They adjust and then we are done offensively.

If they do not get the running game solved, we will not win another game. I see no one on the Offense getting better, thankfully Ryans and Williams are showing consistency and improvement respectively on the defensive side of the ball.

This just in, we suck.

Hervoyel
10-15-2006, 08:14 PM
A Star Running Back?
A Star Defensive Back?
A Star Wide Receiver?
A Star Line Backer?




You draft the RB with your 1 next season, sign the best veteran DB you can find and draft another one in either the 2nd or 3rd rounds (depending on which is deeper, LB or DB) and you stand pat with your receivers as they are.

Of course if the Texans had taken Derrick Johnson instead of Travis Johnson then LB would be pretty much set right now. Likewise if we had bothered to try and hang on to Kenny Wright and Marlon McCree (and even Aaron Glenn for another year) we wouldn't be the disaster we are in the secondary.

Don't even get me thinking about what holes we could have plugged with the picks we threw away to get Phillip "should I return this one?" Buchanon and Jason "check out my ink" Babin. Granted I'm not terribly down on Babin but the trade was a train wreck just like the one for Buchanon.

Texans_Chick
10-15-2006, 08:16 PM
If it's true we aren't running the Denver scheme, asking most of our lineman to lose so much weight might have been a mistake.

Maybe that's why Spencer looked so good to everyone - he's the only guy that didn't make his target weight, or if he did make it he had the highest target.

The weight thing is an interesting deal.

If you talk the weight training/nutrition staff, they make a big point of not being weight focused--that they think it is a mistake to get people at a certain target weight number--they look more at proportions of the weight--muscle and distribution.

I know that Kubiak is very number specific and had target numbers for different linemen. It is very difficult to hit target weights in a short period of time without sacrificing muscle and not having enough energy to do stuff.

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 08:20 PM
You draft the RB with your 1 next season, sign the best veteran DB you can find and draft another one in either the 2nd or 3rd rounds (depending on which is deeper, LB or DB) and you stand pat with your receivers as they are.

Of course if the Texans had taken Derrick Johnson instead of Travis Johnson then LB would be pretty much set right now. Likewise if we had bothered to try and hang on to Kenny Wright and Marlon McCree (and even Aaron Glenn for another year) we wouldn't be the disaster we are in the secondary.

Don't even get me thinking about what holes we could have plugged with the picks we threw away to get Phillip "should I return this one?" Buchanon and Jason "check out my ink" Babin. Granted I'm not terribly down on Babin but the trade was a train wreck just like the one for Buchanon.


Wow, I don't believe it. I never knew anyone on this board could see things as I see them. This is the very first post that anyone has posted that agrees with what I have been saying. Pos reps coming your way.... Thanks

Runner
10-15-2006, 08:23 PM
I know that Kubiak is very number specific and had target numbers for different linemen. It is very difficult to hit target weights in a short period of time without sacrificing muscle and not having enough energy to do stuff.

Excellent point. The players did lose some muscle as well as the pure mass. Now throw into the mix that right after the players lose the weight they go into training camp in the Texans heat and humidity. I'm surprised more lineman didn't go down from the stress.

Hervoyel
10-15-2006, 08:31 PM
Wow, I don't believe it. I never knew anyone on this board could see things as I see them. This is the very first post that anyone has posted that agrees with what I have been saying. Pos reps coming your way.... Thanks


Well then it's a pleasant coincidence. I've been thinking RB with the #1 since this season started and every game makes me more certain that this is the way to go. We do need help at DB but I don't think what we need is going to come from putting a rookie (even a first rounder) opposite Dunta. It's not a question of physical ability here, we need a veteran with some game. We need Aaron Glenn from 2003 for instance. Still I'd get me a DB and a LB on day one if I could following that first round RB.

On the DB I'd take the best of CB or FS, whichever one is ranked higher on my board.

The Texans need a lot of help but they also need to sign some veterans to take the place of the ones we don't have thanks to lousy drafting. We've got a shortage of players and an abundance of athletes.

HomeBred_Texan
10-15-2006, 08:43 PM
Well then it's a pleasant coincidence. I've been thinking RB with the #1 since this season started and every game makes me more certain that this is the way to go. We do need help at DB but I don't think what we need is going to come from putting a rookie (even a first rounder) opposite Dunta. It's not a question of physical ability here, we need a veteran with some game. We need Aaron Glenn from 2003 for instance. Still I'd get me a DB and a LB on day one if I could following that first round RB.

On the DB I'd take the best of CB or FS, whichever one is ranked higher on my board.

The Texans need a lot of help but they also need to sign some veterans to take the place of the ones we don't have thanks to lousy drafting. We've got a shortage of players and an abundance of athletes.

Well in a different thread, college part, I kept saying we need to get a franchise rb with first pick, everyone would jump me for it, no we need D help. I said look at what drafting D has gotten us so far. Not that we don't need it, we just haven't drafted real smart for whatever reason.

Which brings up the Adrian P debate... In my opinion, a real good high quality running back can make a sub-par O-line look much better. When you get a running game threat, the opposing D can't sit on just 1 part of your game plan. Then I had to hear how DD is great and can walk on water. I have never been a DD fan. If DD was so great, why did the Texans feel they needed to give away a high 2nd rounder for Hollings? Because all coaches knows our running game sucks and until it is fixed, we will never be successful.

It's not that I mind losing, cause sometimes you have to lose in order to win and it makes it much sweeter, but it is more of the way we are losing. We are getting blown out in these games because we cannot control the ball. Once we control the ball, then we have game management and the other team cannot score if they don't have the ball. I want to see more O on the field instead of the D all the time. I like some of our D players, but I didn't pay all of my season ticket money just to see them...

Sorry, got long winded...

Mr. White
10-15-2006, 09:00 PM
The dogging on the RB's is knee-jerk.

What's different about Dayne since last year when he put 100 yards on the Cowboys?

What's different about the Cowboys' defense since he put 100 yards on them?

I don't think there's much difference in either case. Ron Dayne was just as fat last year as he is now. The Dallas defense is just as good as it was last year.

That leaves the Offensive Line. He had a good line last year and he doesn't this year. From the first game this season, it's been obvious that the run blocking has deteriorated. Vernand Morency didn't do all that great when he was running behind this line either against Philly.

****Speculation disclaimer. I could be totally off-base, but I doubt it.****

Mike Sherman's got an ego. He's been in the NFL too long to run a rookie HC's offense. I also think that he's got more input than he gets credit for. It was probably a condition of his taking the Asst. HC job.

We've got 1 guy who holds the title of Offensive Coordinator on our staff. We've got 2 guys that used to be OC's. I've got my doubts as to who is actually running the offense.

Runner
10-15-2006, 09:16 PM
The dogging on the RB's is knee-jerk.

What's different about Dayne since last year when he put 100 yards on the Cowboys?

What's different about the Cowboys' defense since he put 100 yards on them?

I don't think there's much difference in either case. Ron Dayne was just as fat last year as he is now. The Dallas defense is just as good as it was last year.


Maybe the knee jerk reaction is expecting anything more out of Dayne. Last year seems to be the anomaly. Maybe we are overworking him though - he had almost as many carries in the first three games this year as he had in his ten games last year.

-----------------------Games----Runs-------Yds-----Ave
2000-New York Giants------16-----228-------770-----3.4
2001-New York Giants------16-----180-------690-----3.8
2002-New York Giants------16-----125-------428-----3.4
2003-New York Giants-------0-------0----------0------0
2004-New York Giants------14------52-------179-----3.4
2005-Denver Broncos-------10------53-------270-----5.1
2006-Houston Texans--------3------47-------153-----3.3
TOTAL---------------------75-----685------2490-----3.6

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/187386


We've got 1 guy who holds the title of Offensive Coordinator on our staff. We've got 2 guys that used to be OC's. I've got my doubts as to who is actually running the offense.

How much like last year can this team get?

V Man
10-15-2006, 10:16 PM
Frankly we had a better running game last year with JONATHAN WELLS! GMAB


I was just thinking about that. Jonathan is still available isn't he. At least he acts like he runs with passion.

HJam72
10-15-2006, 10:26 PM
I was just thinking about that. Jonathan is still available isn't he. At least he acts like he runs with passion.

I like that idea but Wells ain't doing nothing behind our current run blocking. I'm not sure Emmitt Smith could do much either.

Porky
10-15-2006, 10:36 PM
I also agree with Herv. We need a top shelf impact RB with the #1 next year. Not sure how/if the collarbone will affect Adrian Peterson's draft status, but I think Marshawn Lynch may be just as good or better. At least one person has compared him to Tomlinson. He is more of a dual threat that AP, and so far at least, has proven to be more duarble. I have only seen one Cal game, but I will be trying to catch another or two along the way, as I think he would be terrific as a Texan.

Hervoyel
10-15-2006, 11:21 PM
Maybe the knee jerk reaction is expecting anything more out of Dayne. Last year seems to be the anomaly. Maybe we are overworking him though - he had almost as many carries in the first three games this year as he had in his ten games last year.

I actually think we're underworking him but I don't think we have much alternative. Until our line can open a hole for Dayne (or Gado, or Lundy) to run through we're not going to have a back get hot on us.

I believe that Ron Dayne is a guy who you beat against the other team steadily all day long and who starts to really punish them in the second half. I kind of think of him as a dinosaur type player in the league today and I don't think New York ever gave him those kind of carries. I think if they had then he'd probably not be in the league today. Those kind of backs don't hold up long term and NFL teams don't often run guys into the ground these days, at least not in that way. It's a bit of a different era.

The flip side of that is that Dayne isn't very productive in a system where he gets fewer touches. In New York he was very ordinary. He produced in Denver during limited action but then it's been demonstrated clearly that anyone halfway capable can produce in Denver. Our offensive line is not Denvers offensive line. I seriously question whether or not any our guys could even make the #2 spot on the depth chart in Denver right now. Some of them wouldn't even make the team. Dayne isn't going anywhere behind this mess.

rittenhouserobz
10-15-2006, 11:33 PM
Well, here is my opinion.

The Texans will have an aweful running game this year, but next year will have to be an improvement. I don't care what you say. We will not rush the ball for less than 50 yards next year. Kubiak had to start somewhere. He couldn't build the team out of thin air. To be honest, I expect the Texans will not have a winning season next year. For now, I will scan the remaining schedule and look for some possible high points.

Keldar
10-15-2006, 11:52 PM
Was it just me or did the backs seem like they were running in slow motion today at Dallas?

It just looked that way compared to how fast our weakling O-line was getting tossed on their bee-hinds by the Dallas D.

ledzeppelin229
10-16-2006, 12:11 AM
I actually think we're underworking him but I don't think we have much alternative. Until our line can open a hole for Dayne (or Gado, or Lundy) to run through we're not going to have a back get hot on us.

I believe that Ron Dayne is a guy who you beat against the other team steadily all day long and who starts to really punish them in the second half. I kind of think of him as a dinosaur type player in the league today and I don't think New York ever gave him those kind of carries. I think if they had then he'd probably not be in the league today. Those kind of backs don't hold up long term and NFL teams don't often run guys into the ground these days, at least not in that way. It's a bit of a different era.

The flip side of that is that Dayne isn't very productive in a system where he gets fewer touches. In New York he was very ordinary. He produced in Denver during limited action but then it's been demonstrated clearly that anyone halfway capable can produce in Denver. Our offensive line is not Denvers offensive line. I seriously question whether or not any our guys could even make the #2 spot on the depth chart in Denver right now. Some of them wouldn't even make the team. Dayne isn't going anywhere behind this mess.

In some instances I would buy into this, but I'm having difficulty with Dayne. True he might be a talented running back behind a top 5 run blocking line, but right now he's showing that hes only productive in a system where the RB can be crappy talent wise but still produce due to the OL -- which equals Dayne is crappy. Add that to our offensive line seems a little crappy (average at best) and you get crappy with a side of extra crappy. Today I just saw him run into his own teammates too many times to ever see him wearing out the defense. Everytime he runs it seems like he's searching for the biggest pile of Texans players and seeing if he can be a bowling ball against them, but it never works. What was his longest run today? a few yards? I don't care how good the D is or how bad the OL is, that won't cut it in any situation.

phan1
10-16-2006, 12:42 AM
I'm probably making a totally unintelligent statement right now, but it's obvious getting Sherman hasn't been as valuable as I had previously thought. I mean, he's totally F'n up our Oline! C'mon, we've never ever been this bad on the ground. But we've also never been this good in pass protection either... One Oline problem or another eh? This is really, really depressing.

Scottyboy
10-16-2006, 01:06 AM
This Running game is a joke.

THis Team is a joke..... :-(

cUT nON HACKERS AND get solid players..

I mean this thing is bad. :brickwall

Ibar_Harry
10-16-2006, 01:10 AM
The only person who should be running the ball on this team is Carr. Why, because at least they have to respect the fact that he can throw the ball. That gives him an edge the other backs don't have and it is the only way we are going to make any yards. Unfortunately that may well lead to the early demise of David. I keep saying we have to pass, pass, pass, pass, pass the ball until the other team believes we are only going to pass the ball. Then, our running game wil have some success.

Ibar_Harry
10-16-2006, 01:12 AM
Oh, and yes, I thought Kubiak would play the game exactly the way he did against Dallas. Yes, I thought this would be the end result. It was literally a fore gone conclusion as how this game would play out and it did. They were ours for the taking is we did nothing but pass the ball and get a lead. We didn't do it and you now see the result.

thunderkyss
10-16-2006, 01:34 AM
LJ's slow start is still better than Dayne's. Then there's that whole thing about LJ racking up 1700+ yards and 20TD's in 9 starts last year, while Ron Dayne was thinking of 1700 different ways to order his Whataburger. Sometimes I wonder what planet you're from.

That means absolutely nothing..... Kinda like a lot of folks waiting for Jamal Lewis to break 2000 yards again.... ain't gonna happen. one year wonder, that's LJ. he won't ever break 1400 yards again, he'll be an avg back from now on.

Dayne's gonna get those Whataburgers, don't you worry about that.

Tenn and Detroit won today, with the Titans playing good against the Colts last week,as well-oh, and TB won with a rookie QB--we're fast running out of teams we have a chance to beat=Skins got beat today, as did the Eagles by the Saints (who also have a new HC and QB)--seems like most teams ahead of us are getting better while we're.....

So what are you saying?? we need to change our QB??

I'm not even going there.

Thunderkyss,

It's not about not trying to win football games. It's about asking a very pointed question: how much better is Chris Brown than what we have? I don't want to give up a middle round pick for someone that isn't going to be a part of the long-term future. Perhaps it gets us from 6-10 to 7-9. Or maybe we go from 5-11 to 6-10.

There's a big difference between tanking games and simply not mortgaging your future for a mediocre player.

I'd much rather fix the problem. If we're going to be trading our picks let's get something that will fix something. Get us a good Gaurd, or a good Center....

in 5 games, David Carr's been sacked 15 times... that's 3 per game. in a 16 game season, that's 48 times. That is way too much. We can't protect the QB, and we can't run the ball..... Duh, lets get a gaurd & or Center that will help us do both.

Or we can get us a Runningback that will (maybe, what they heck has ChrisBrown done??) improve our runing back, but our QB still get's sacked 50 times for the season.

thunderkyss
10-16-2006, 01:45 AM
You draft the RB with your 1 next season, sign the best veteran DB you can find and draft another one in either the 2nd or 3rd rounds (depending on which is deeper, LB or DB) and you stand pat with your receivers as they are.


Personally, I'd rather go with Kubiaks approach..... the one he used this past offseason.

Well, first, I'd start Activating WaliLundy.... he can start Dayne if he wants. He can start Gado if he wants..... but to go into the game with those two, who are basically the same guy, doesn't make sense to me. Dayne or Gado, and Lundy.

But in the offseason, look at what's available in FA, and pick from the best. From that group of best, who would he want to work with. then go after him. Weaver, Moulds, Walter, Cook, Putz....... that's how we got those guys, and I like those guys. All of them minus Moulds has plenty of years left in them, and I like what they all have brought so far.

IF we can get another WR, cool, if there are no DBs, cool, if we can find a good young gaurd, cool.......

Then go into the draft taking BPA in the first round, based on need.

Of course if you've got one player, like a true shutdown Corner that is way, way better than anything you're going to be able to get latter in the draft(which usually isn't the case with Running backs or WideReciever), then do what you gotta do to get him.

thunderkyss
10-16-2006, 02:01 AM
I'm probably making a totally unintelligent statement right now, but it's obvious getting Sherman hasn't been as valuable as I had previously thought. I mean, he's totally F'n up our Oline! C'mon, we've never ever been this bad on the ground. But we've also never been this good in pass protection either... One Oline problem or another eh? This is really, really depressing.



This Running game is a joke.

THis Team is a joke..... :-(

cUT nON HACKERS AND get solid players..

I mean this thing is bad. :brickwall


I personally wouldn't go that far.

Sheman's job is to teach, and prepare. While I do blame the Ol for our follie running the ball, I don't know how much we can blame on this GB vs Denver controversy we think is going on.

Kubiak has stated he's installed his system 3 times. Go back to the beginning every time. He's also said that our guys don't know what the heck they are doing. Well, he said they are in the beginning phase.

If you were an OL coach, what would be the first thing you'd work on??

Me, I'd work on penalties, and getting rid of them. FalseStarts, Holding, Formation...... & this team is light years ahead of any team we've put on the field as far as penalties go.

IMHO, this game, we looked more Denver than Greenbay. This is the first game that I think we've been more Denver than Greenbay. So I think Kubiak is thinking we'll be turning the corner soon. I'll admit I was wrong about our running game showing up this week. Maybe next week. I've noticed everybody looks like they know what they are supposed to be doing(my opinion of what they are supposed to be doing). it's only been a couple of plays(running plays) where it looked like one or two guys were working against the rest of the line. I don't know how long it's going to take to fix that.

I was hoping to watch the denver game tonight, but I didn't. I wanted to see how they played in their system. Our guys seem to want to get in front of the defender, and get in his way.

Washington's OL wanted to move you off your spot.... they didn't go to block the LBs, they went to put him on his ass........ go ask Demeco. I wanted to see how Denver did it. To me, it looks like our guys are in practice, offensively, we didn't lay any good hits on anyone..... well, Cook did, but he wasn't hitting guys like Ellis, and Canty, and he ain't got enough junk in the trunk to move those guys.

Leach being a bit bigger might have changed the face of our running game today....

Anyway, just saying.......... looks like we are turning the corner, and will be more Denver before long.

jerek
10-16-2006, 02:02 AM
I'm going to make this short and sweet.

The running backs are not the problem.

Did anyone see any holes being opened on any of those running plays?

You absolutely have to be kidding me.

The holes were there. They closed before Dayne could take two steps. He's too slow and is completely incapable of making a direcitonal change.

Herv is right -- might as well teach Owen Daniels a handoff.

TKyss -- I don't know in what world in which you have three downs to advance the ball ten yards would you continue to run the ball at 1.3 YPC.

Sarg01
10-16-2006, 02:04 AM
We acctually tried to trade up for DeAngelo Williams on draft day, but it didnt happen.

Maybe the line is so focused on keeping Carr upright that they can't run block. Does that even make sense? I never played any line, so someone will have to clue me in.

Oh, and trading up for DeAngelo Williams would have been a bad mistake. I breathed a big sigh of relief when Chicago muffed the trade up for us. That's the DeMeco pick you're talking about trading up from - plus one of our other picks, probably the Winston or Daniels one.

We're too focused on the "system" at the moment, and the line isn't ready to execute the system. We need a guy who can run off-tackle until we can get Davis back.

Runner
10-16-2006, 05:45 AM
Dayne points the finger at the o-line and then says, "it's on me":

"It's tough when you have to run through your guys and theirs," Dayne said, pointing to his offensive line being pushed into the backfield on a number of occasions. "It's tough when there are eight or nine (defenders) in the box and guys are not getting the push, but I should have just got (the necessary yard) the times I was in there to run it. It was on me, and I'm going to work on it in practice this week to get better at that."


A bad stat:


Not coincidentally, the Texans had seven plays on which they needed one yard or less to make a first down, and they failed to convert on any of those opportunities. (Twice, David Carr threw incompletions.)

"It eats at your manhood when you can't get three feet," guard Chester Pitts said.



Maybe it is time to work smarter and not harder. The coaches need to do an honest root cause analysis of the running problems:

"Frustrating is the word to describe it," Gado said. "I don't know what else we can do as a unit. ... Coaches have an extra emphasis in meetings, and we've had extra meetings with the line, running backs and tight ends and extra walk-throughs. It just hasn't seemed to work."


http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/4261407.html

joshri
10-16-2006, 08:06 AM
I'd be thrilled if the Texans managed to pry Michael Turner away from San Diego. Of course I wouldn't trade a first for him.

thunderkyss
10-16-2006, 08:38 AM
You absolutely have to be kidding me.

TKyss -- I don't know in what world in which you have three downs to advance the ball ten yards would you continue to run the ball at 1.3 YPC.

ugh...... no, that would be stupid. if you mean to run the ball three times in a row. I'm just saying even thought the running game wasn't working, we've got to have the appearance of sticking with the run game, to keep the defense honest. that 1.3 ypc was a 4 yard run a couple of times, a 7 yard run once, and a few 3 yard runs.

KC never stopped running the ball, even though they were blown out worse than we were. If you know your team needs to work on running the ball, why not run the ball during the game, so you'd at least have something to look at Monday Morning??

When we got to pass, pass, pass...... we weren't going to do anything any way, because they knew it was going to be pass, pass, pass.

When we were going pass, run, pass, or whatever combination, more times than not, we'd pick up a first down or two, and move the ball. doesn't matter that we weren't getting much on each run.

Vinny
10-16-2006, 08:50 AM
Dayne is a journeyman...for a reason. Gado was not drafted...for a reason. Lundy was available in the 6th round...for a reason. So much for that "plug any ol' back" into the Kubes system stuff. Sure, plug anyone in...but that doesn't mean they won't suck. On the other theme to this thread...McCree, Wright and Glenn were all cut. They all play prominent roles on other teams now. Our talent evaluators have sucked since day 1 and much of the reason we are one of the worst teams in football year in, year out.

Also, if you have a QB that can't make plays anywhere else except underneath the linebacker drops and in the flat....it's tough to run.

that about sums it up for me.

beerlover
10-16-2006, 08:59 AM
Dayne is a journeyman...for a reason. Gado was not drafted...for a reason. Lundy was available in the 6th round...for a reason. So much for that "plug any ol' back" into the Kubes system stuff. Sure, plug anyone in...but that doesn't mean they won't suck. On the other theme to this thread...McCree, Wright and Glenn were all cut. They all play prominent roles on other teams now. Our talent evaluators have sucked since day 1 and much of the reason we are one of the worst teams in football year in, year out.

Also, if you have a QB that can't make plays anywhere else except underneath the linebacker drops and in the flat....it's tough to run.

that about sums it up for me.

add this to it for me- the Texans rushing game has gone from bad to worse since Spencer got hurt. :twocents:

DayneBum
10-16-2006, 09:09 AM
It looks like maybe 3 of us on this board are seeing this. The popular consensus around here seems to be that the RBs are the problem.

Dayne got 98 yards with a long of 55 last year on the Dallas D. The Cowboys defense isn't that much different than it was last year.

Maybe you guys see holes, but I don't.


Thank you Red Bull...EVERYONE needs to take heed to this statement....The Cowboys have the exact same defense they had last year. Dayne basically single handley beat the Cowboys last year on thanksgiving. He had 7 carries for about 100yards. A 16yrd td, along with a 55 yard OT winning run, with 14.1 avg.....ITS THE OFFENSIVE LINE!!!!!!!!!! NOT THE RB'S. In this Zone blocking scheme, u read your lineman. If there not doing there job, LT2 woulndt even look good.....you guys/gals gotta understand, the running game starts with the O_LINE!!!!!!! I dont know what Game or texans team you message board coaches have been watching, but the offensive line is a big problem.

Vinny
10-16-2006, 09:12 AM
when you dink and dunk underneath as your only passing game you just load the box with defenders and it is harder to run...you got to have a more vertical passing game to open up some of those rush lanes.

powerfuldragon
10-16-2006, 09:13 AM
^^you also have to have a good team.

real
10-16-2006, 09:21 AM
Thank you Red Bull...EVERYONE needs to take heed to this statement....The Cowboys have the exact same defense they had last year. Dayne basically single handley beat the Cowboys last year on thanksgiving. He had 7 carries for about 100yards. A 16yrd td, along with a 55 yard OT winning run, with 14.1 avg.....ITS THE OFFENSIVE LINE!!!!!!!!!! NOT THE RB'S. In this Zone blocking scheme, u read your lineman. If there not doing there job, LT2 woulndt even look good.....you guys/gals gotta understand, the running game starts with the O_LINE!!!!!!! I dont know what Game or texans team you message board coaches have been watching, but the offensive line is a big problem.


I don't really see how you can fully point the finger at either one....Both need an upgrade....We don't have world class backs or olineman...

It just depends on how you look at the situation....We definitely need our line to block better...but at the same time we don't really have a franchise back on our team....As little as I liked DD, I have to admit that he is missed right now, because if we got anything at all out of our running game we could give some teams headaches...There have been holes on some plays...I have watched the line and IMO, they aren't doing that bad of a job...They aren't just blowing people off the ball but when you're running backs are looking at the ground it doesn't help....

Texans_Chick
10-16-2006, 09:31 AM
when you dink and dunk underneath as your only passing game you just load the box with defenders and it is harder to run...you got to have a more vertical passing game to open up some of those rush lanes.

I haven't looked at the tape again, but it didn't look like they were loading the box.

You have to have the play calling that goes vertical. Also, yesterday's weather conditions were not the best for going way down field.

Vinny
10-16-2006, 09:33 AM
I haven't looked at the tape again, but it didn't look like they were loading the box.

You have to have the play calling that goes vertical. Also, yesterday's weather conditions were not the best for going way down field.We rarely challenge the deep middle in the Carr era. Defenses do not have to worry about the whole field if they play a team that throws most of it's passes under the linebacker drops. I don't have to relook at the tape to know this....this isn't a one game thing.

DayneBum
10-16-2006, 09:34 AM
I don't really see how you can fully point the finger at either one....Both need an upgrade....We don't have world class backs or olineman...

It just depends on how you look at the situation....We definitely need our line to block better...but at the same time we don't really have a franchise back on our team....As little as I liked DD, I have to admit that he is missed right now, because if we got anything at all out of our running game we could give some teams headaches...There have been holes on some plays...I have watched the line and IMO, they aren't doing that bad of a job...They aren't just blowing people off the ball but when you're running backs are looking at the ground it doesn't help....

Yea u maybe right. but it dont matter whose back there. When u run only 14 times, its not the rb's at all.......if there are no holes, no rb is gonna have success. It doesnt matter if there is some holes or not, its just not gonna happen. Dallas' defense were ranked higher last year, and Dayne carried 7times for 100 yrds. In the ZB scheme, it all begins with the o-line. Actually, it doesnt even look like they are running a zb scheme.

texan279
10-16-2006, 09:35 AM
Thank you Red Bull...EVERYONE needs to take heed to this statement....The Cowboys have the exact same defense they had last year. Dayne basically single handley beat the Cowboys last year on thanksgiving. He had 7 carries for about 100yards. A 16yrd td, along with a 55 yard OT winning run, with 14.1 avg.....ITS THE OFFENSIVE LINE!!!!!!!!!! NOT THE RB'S. In this Zone blocking scheme, u read your lineman. If there not doing there job, LT2 woulndt even look good.....you guys/gals gotta understand, the running game starts with the O_LINE!!!!!!! I dont know what Game or texans team you message board coaches have been watching, but the offensive line is a big problem.

Dallas has 5 players starting on their defense who either did not start last season, were not on the team last season, or played a different position last season, so while the scheme may be the same, the personnel is not. And they also have a different defensive line and linebacker coach this season.

TheOgre
10-16-2006, 09:35 AM
I keep hearing how this team wants to run the ball (through two regimes), yet to date we have spent no 1st rounders and one 2nd rounder on our RB's and O-line combined. That is just insane.

Vinny
10-16-2006, 09:36 AM
Dallas has 5 players starting on their defense who either did not start last season, were not on the team last season, or played a different position last season, so while the scheme may be the same, the personnel is not. And they also have a different defensive line and linebacker coach this season.

apparently they don't need 5 years to "gel".

Vinny
10-16-2006, 09:36 AM
I keep hearing how this team wants to run the ball (through two regimes), yet to date we have spent no 1st rounders and one 2nd rounder on our RB's and O-line combined. That is just insane.recipe for a bad team.

beerlover
10-16-2006, 09:38 AM
I don't really see how you can fully point the finger at either one....Both need an upgrade....We don't have world class backs or olineman...

It just depends on how you look at the situation....We definitely need our line to block better...but at the same time we don't really have a franchise back on our team....As little as I liked DD, I have to admit that he is missed right now, because if we got anything at all out of our running game we could give some teams headaches...There have been holes on some plays...I have watched the line and IMO, they aren't doing that bad of a job...They aren't just blowing people off the ball but when you're running backs are looking at the ground it doesn't help....

the holes close too quickly for the RB's the Texans have, blame it on the OL cause we don't have anyone able to hit the hole that quick.

now if the Texans had been able to trade up for DeAngelo Williams he would have addressed this need (however we would not have DeMeco Ryans). Looking forward to the draft I hope the Texans are able to trade down & pick up more picks. I would like to pick up a franchise LT (move Spencer to RT) then mid to late 1st rd. draft a RB like Kenny Irons who can explode through the hole, runs north & south, has excellent vision and burst to turn the edge, until then you can't blame the RB's who depend on their line to develop holes.

real
10-16-2006, 09:49 AM
Yea u maybe right. but it dont matter whose back there. When u run only 14 times, its not the rb's at all.......if there are no holes, no rb is gonna have success. It doesnt matter if there is some holes or not, its just not gonna happen. Dallas' defense were ranked higher last year, and Dayne carried 7times for 100 yrds. In the ZB scheme, it all begins with the o-line. Actually, it doesnt even look like they are running a zb scheme.

You need to go back and watch the film...there were holes...

It's not really fair to compare our line in it's first year under the system, to a Denver line who have been running it for years....

Like I said earlier....Im not really disagreeing with you...I would love a dominant O-line....But at the same time I did see some holes....

El Tejano
10-16-2006, 10:09 AM
These RBs stink but so does the rest of the team. The inability to run has been the reason our record is what it is. Get Chris Taylor and Wali Lundy in their because at least these kids have the rookie excuse. Not sure how Vernand Morency is doing in GB but he was showing something for us and we let him go.

It is pretty evident that Kubiak is just cleaning house.

tsip
10-16-2006, 11:04 AM
"So what are you saying?? we need to change our QB??"

...many of your posts either a) list the teams we'll beat on our schedule remaining because they are 'so bad' and we are better or b) make excuses why we lost to a team because they are so good and are SB bound...

My posts points out that many of these 'bad' teams are playing better--Titans,Browns,Raiders,for example--than the Texans..

..and that these--so called 'elite' teams--that beat us are getting beat, like the Redskins and Eagles...

Our problem is that this coaching staff does not take it 'one' game at a time and come up with a game plan that gives us a chance to beat that weeks opponent that week...instead, like Capers, we either have no game plan or a 'one fits all' game plan...

Plain and simple, this team is still being 'coached not to lose.' :brickwall :brickwall :brickwall

tsip
10-16-2006, 11:15 AM
"Anyway, just saying.......... looks like we are turning the corner, and will be more Denver before long."


TK, where do you get this 'stuff?' Please enlighten me about 'what' we accomplished in the Dallas game that has 'turning the corner' written on it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:confused: :yikes: :confused: :backsout:

Malloy
10-16-2006, 11:18 AM
I believe this is all Green Bay and Mike Sherman and I think that we have a real problem. One thing I do know when I see it is an offense that's straddling philosophies. I watched Capers/Palmer try to coexist for three seasons. This looks a lot like that.

Interesting, and I agree 100%. I'm REALLY hoping that there's not some internal Kubiak-Sherman power struggle going on, that could kill what's left of this team.

JDizzle
10-16-2006, 12:11 PM
I did a little research and came upon a little stat that made me throw up in my mouth a little bit.

We've got more yards due to opponent penalties (345) than we do running the ball (338).

I say we suit up some yellow flags!

dat_boy_yec
10-16-2006, 12:19 PM
If the play call is an inside run then it is an inside run. One of the few good Dayne runs was in the first quarter to the outside.

The stuffing is so bad, I am starting to wonder if there is any telegraphing of the plays or if it is just bad. I am thinking it is just bad, but you never know.

I didn't notice any of that Power I stuff today--did I miss it?

You know why that run had a semblance of success. It was delayed. Carr dropped back as if he were going to pass and Dayne looked up as if he was going to pick up the blitz. Carr then handed the ball to Dayne. You know what made that successful. Dayne had that extra second where he could see where the hole was developing and went to it. What I also notice is that once he gets the ball he puts his head down and drives down hill. The man has no vision. We can't do that delay every time he has to keep his head up until he finds the hole.

Vinny
10-16-2006, 12:20 PM
I did a little research and came upon a little stat that made me throw up in my mouth a little bit.

We've got more yards due to opponent penalties (345) than we do running the ball (338).

I say we suit up some yellow flags!that's just sad.

barzilla
10-16-2006, 12:25 PM
in 5 games, David Carr's been sacked 15 times... that's 3 per game. in a 16 game season, that's 48 times. That is way too much. We can't protect the QB, and we can't run the ball..... Duh, lets get a gaurd & or Center that will help us do both.

Okay, so I repeat the question in another way. What centers or guards are available via trade that would be a long-term solution? If there are starter quality people out there that can be had for a mid round pick I say go for it. Somehow, I don't see how that is possible. After all, if they were starter quality then wouldn't they be starting?

The point is that it seems easy enough to say, "just make some changes to improve the ballclub," but I would assume that Kubiak and Smith have already studied the available field and have made their value judgement. At this point, I still trust their evaluation of talent a lot more than anyone in here. If they think there's nothing good available then I'm inclined to go with their word.

I think we underestimate what kind of damage a series of piss poor drafts did to this team. I don't think this is a case of make one little trade and all of our protection problems suddenly go away. The OL was neglected in the draft until this season (minus one second round bust) and it shows. To make matters worse, all of our free agent signings have gone up bust. This ain't going to be fixed overnight.

Meloy
10-16-2006, 12:44 PM
I'm beginning to think that a stoned Ricky Williams could be better than what we have atm. I'd take him stoned, Domanick on crutches and a 1 legged crossbred hickbilly over what we have let alone LJ or LT...It might take a stoned Ricky WIlliams a while to get to the line, but at least we would know why.:whip:

Meloy
10-16-2006, 12:53 PM
I did a little research and came upon a little stat that made me throw up in my mouth a little bit.

We've got more yards due to opponent penalties (345) than we do running the ball (338).

I say we suit up some yellow flags!I say we use a 2nd rounder on the yellow flag. Can't hurt as our over all record for this round ain't too good. Ryans looks great this year, but if those flags keep piling up the yards, I say go for it.:yawn:

SESupergenius
10-16-2006, 01:32 PM
Is yellow flag a free agent? Getting less than 20 yards is not tollerable, but more importantly, we can't gain a yard on 3rd or 4th down to sustain a drive. I see that if we are 2nd and 2 or less we try a pass....ok that is smart football because we have the 3rd down to get a couple of yards...no biggie, unless of course you can't run the ball. The Cowboys saw that we couldn't run the ball and dropped back into coverage, thus limiting Carr's options and forcing throws. If the running game can get going all they need to do is drop back. We use the dink and doink as our running game because they rush 4 guys and we can't even take that on with our linemen....pathetic.

thunderkyss
10-16-2006, 02:14 PM
Dallas has 5 players starting on their defense who either did not start last season, were not on the team last season, or played a different position last season, so while the scheme may be the same, the personnel is not. And they also have a different defensive line and linebacker coach this season.

Are you sure about that??

Spears, Ware, Canty(was the starter by December, he most likely played a lot in November as well), Ferguson, Henry, BradyJames, Williams & Newman all are returning to the spots they started last year.

Greg Ellis played an undersized DE till Canty got his thang going, Ayodele is new alltogether.

So that's only 2 of 11 new or converted players.

while on offense, we've got Dayne, Owen/Putz, Salaam, Moulds, Walter/Cook, Flanagan, & McKinney, & Pitts starting at positions they didn't start at last season. Salaam, Cook/Walter, & Dayne didn't even start at their position for the team they came from.

That's 8 of 11 starters. But you expect us to run against a team returning 9 of 11 starters??

Now let's recap this. Your argument is that Dallas D should have been weaker than it was last year, because you thought 5 of the players were new to the team.

only two of the 11 are actually knew to the team, or the position being played.

We have 8 of 11 starters that didn't start at their respective position with this team & you believe we should be stronger running the ball??

Is that right, is that the way you see this?? I don't want to put any words in your mouth, so please correct me if I misunderstood something.

Ibar_Harry
10-16-2006, 02:19 PM
I will repeat my self several times. The only person running the ball right now should be Carr. Probably get him killed, but he is the only back we have capable of running the ball. He is bigger, stronger and faster than anything we have called a RB or FB. Those guys should be bocking for him.

There is another reason I say that and that is they have to lay off a little bit, because he can throw the ball. He has an advantage that the other backs don't have in addition to that fact. He actually has to play Vic like for this team to have a chance. Yes, we have to PASS, PASS, PASS, PASS the ball until the other team is only worried about the PASS, then we can run the ball on occassion.

There is no vertical passing game even though we are capable of it. I repeat on short yardage they know KUBIAK must RUN the ball. That is his philosophy and the other teams love it. We may not win another ball game, but if at least we would do the above we would have a chance. Hey, Manning is basically doing it why can't we. Oh, yes David is not Manning, but he's not bad. We have to turn the confidence of this team around and you are not going to do it by playing to your weakness rather than your strength. If you loose playing your best game that is acceptable. But don't loose the game doing what you can not due..................

I will also say KUBIAK = CAPERS.................END OF STORY..............

Vinny
10-16-2006, 02:27 PM
passing the ball led to the easy Cowboys scores Ibar. I'm all for 4 yard passes, but just make sure your guy doesn't try to challenge the deep seam or get the ball over the linebackers. This isn't his strength.

jerek
10-16-2006, 02:32 PM
Speaking of passing, does anybody notice how opposing quarterbacks very deliberately target Sanders, McCleon, and even Buchanon? D-Rob had a pretty good showing in the first half and they didn't even look his way after that. IIRC all three T.O. catches were against horrible coverage by Sanders and McCleon. A notable halftime adjustment and one that I get tired of seeing, week after week.

This has been going on all season and I thought we were getting decent pressure up front against the Cowboys (though we still need line work.) I traditionally have thought well of Hoke but I'm beginning to question if that wasn't just Aaron Glenn being the man that whole time.

thunderkyss
10-16-2006, 02:35 PM
I will repeat my self several times. The only person running the ball right now should be Carr. Probably get him killed, but he is the only back we have capable of running the ball. He is bigger, stronger and faster than anything we have called a RB or FB. Those guys should be bocking for him.
I will also say KUBIAK = CAPERS.................END OF STORY..............

just stop it, you're being silly.

Did you by any chance see Anthony Henry pic that ball intended for AJ?? do you know why it was picked off??

because David was looking at AJ the whole time. He wasn't pressured, no Dallas Cowboy got close to him all day. He had time. Did he look for another reciever?? no.

Don't act like David is the only one on this team that is doing anything. Our defense actually held Dallas to two field goals before David gave them the short 23 yard field.

Dayne actually picked up 6(I thought it was 7) yards on a pitch to the left side. He was fast enough to beat everyone but a CB to the edge, and had that guy not yanked his face mask off his helmet(dirty play), Dayne would have tiptoed that one into the endzone.

As a matter of fact, Dayne played a huge role in getting us down to the 1 yard line to begin with.

JDizzle
10-16-2006, 02:37 PM
As a matter of fact, Dayne played a huge role in getting us down to the 1 yard line to begin with.

He also played a huge role in not scoring.

wags
10-16-2006, 02:41 PM
Did you by any chance see Anthony Henry pic that ball intended for AJ?? do you know why it was picked off??

because David was looking at AJ the whole time. He wasn't pressured, no Dallas Cowboy got close to him all day. He had time. Did he look for another reciever?? no.



It was intercepted because Carr threw off his back foot and didn't have any zip on the ball. That was by far his weakest pass of the day.

It would also help if AJ came back to the ball, but lets take it one step at a time. Baby steps to the professional level.

thunderkyss
10-16-2006, 02:44 PM
It was intercepted because Carr threw off his back foot and didn't have any zip on the ball. That was by far his weakest pass of the day.

It would also help if AJ came back to the ball, but lets take it one step at a time. Baby steps to the professional level.

yeah, ok...... you believe that.

but while we are talking about it, why would he be throwing off his back foot??

weren't any Cowboys around him.