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View Full Version : Honeymoon over?


El Tejano
09-25-2004, 10:13 PM
I have to say that for the past three years I have never seen such a week of negative responses to our team's losses. Many of us have predicted many great things this year so I can understand the disappointment. My question to yall is, is the Honeymoon over? I am not asking if you still support this team with all your heart like I do. I am asking are you now putting the inexperience factors aside and now expecting a winning tradition of football?

Don't give up on our team guys. They've pulled off many miracles before and I feel the big miracles are ahead of us. :woot

Jwwillis
09-25-2004, 10:34 PM
That is a fair question. To which I say "Yes". The way to judge is if the fans are willing to accept 2 losses in a row and say, "Well, they are an expansion team give em a break.". I dont see ANY of that goin on this week in the forums so the Honey Moon is over, deservadly or not. Every player and coach has been critisized to the point of absurdity this week. This can be a good thing, I mean it takes passion for the team, to want to fire Capers so badly after 2 seasons and 2 games of existance. I would have hoped for 3 solid yrs before too much front office and player bashing but this IS the age of NOW and they are 0-2.

Vinny
09-25-2004, 10:50 PM
Well, I'd say no, and would also say that this board is not reflective of the vast majority of Texans fans because I think there is a certain knee-jerk factor to being anonymous on a message board. I think Joe-average fan understands that this is still a growth year and really didn't expect a fully mature, playoff caliber team.

Marcus
09-25-2004, 11:10 PM
Well, I'd say no, and would also say that this board is not reflective of the vast majority of Texans fans because I think there is a certain knee-jerk factor to being anonymous on a message board. I think Joe-average fan understands that this is still a growth year and really didn't expect a fully mature, playoff caliber team.

I couldn't agree with that assessment more. I've been astounded with some of the alarmist negativity on this board recently. I certainly understand the disappointment by some who have let high expectations get the better of them. But to lose faith, and call it a lost season just because they have started 0-2, is rediculous.

The same people who criticized every aspect of the team, will be rushing to buy playoff tickets if they suddenly win two in a row.

TexansTrueFan
09-25-2004, 11:32 PM
Win or lose i think you should support ur team no matter what !!! If we dont they'll be running off to L.A or some place like that where fans havent had football in a while and might appreciate them alittle more ! We might not be an expasion team any more but we are still a young team,,,, it might be hard to stay faithful to the team at this point but we have all got to watch the team grow up before our eyes (so it'll be twice as sweet when they do start winning) !! Its a game of Victory and Defeat thats what makes it so great !!!!

Speedy
09-25-2004, 11:52 PM
It doesn't matter if we were 13-1, if we lost the next game, to go 13-2, there would be people wanting heads to roll. I guess that's just the nature of message boards.

I will support this team for as long as it exists. Or maybe I should say....as long as it stays in Houston.

Last year's Titans game at Reliant was the first time I really got mad about a loss. As fans of a 3rd year expansion team, I think it's right around that time to start shaking the expansion tag. I think it's about that time that the game on the field starts to carry a little more importance.

The first 2 years have been a great experience. The excitement, the atmosphere, the tailgating, the best stadium in football. Now it's time to be an NFL team, not an expansion team. For me, the games, the play calling, coaching decisions and all of that, I will focus on a little more. And even more next year.

It's time to play football now. It's time to develop passions, time to bleed battle red, survive the tough times and celebrate the good. This team WILL win!

But as far as people coming to a message board wanting the head coach, or off. coordinator, or QB fired every time the team loses, well, that's going to happen. Every team, every sport, every message board.

Keldar
09-26-2004, 12:34 AM
I don't think that it is the 0-2 start that upsets most people. I think the WAY they've lost and the appearance of no improvement and maturity thus far, has many a feather ruffled.

I think patience for poor execution and dumb mistakes is gone. In that sense, the honeymoon is over!!!!!

blockhead83
09-26-2004, 01:07 AM
I don't think the honeymoon between fans like myself and the Texans will ever be over. I'll always wake up on sunday's expecting to see the Texans lay a whooping on somebody. The expansion tag however, is gone IMO. We've had plenty of off-seasons and drafts to contend with other teams. In this day and age of the NFL dynasty's emerge and fall in three years. I don't expect the Texans to be a dynasty by now, but hopefully you see my point - just about every team in the league is experiencing a flux of personnel and at this point we're no different. We're definitely a team that's still building talent and depth, but we have quality starters and decent depth. We are a NFL franchise that can run with the big boys now, and we should no longer use the expansion team line as a scapegoat for failure.

texasguy346
09-26-2004, 01:17 AM
I don't think that it is the 0-2 start that upsets most people. I think the WAY they've lost and the appearance of no improvement and maturity thus far, has many a feather ruffled.

I think patience for poor execution and dumb mistakes is gone. In that sense, the honeymoon is over!!!!!

I think you hit the nail on the head there. I don't think we would have seen such a knee jerk reaction if we had lost those games after playing tough the whole game. There would still be some dissappointment, but people would turn around and say "We'll get them next time around." I think everyone on this message board isn't going to stop loving the Texans anytime soon, and perhaps are love for them isn't what the average Texan fan experiences. That also could contribute to the mounting frustrations with their performance in the last two games. I would point out that we have turned the corner yet again, and we're looking forward to KC and have faith we'll have a good showing this time around. So to answer you're question maybe the honeymoon is over, but the relationship is just beginning and can only get better with time.

Carr Bombed
09-26-2004, 01:35 AM
speaking of the KC game do they even have a message board. I went over there and couldn't find it, just wanted to sneak on by and see what their thoughts on the matchup was. BTW the honeymoon is over, but the marriage has just begun. :thumbup So we're newlyweds, still got a while before the bickering and fighting starts.

kbourda
09-26-2004, 03:13 AM
Well, i'd have to say I don't know at this point. I, for one, am truely disappointed at the 0-2 start. I'm not expecting playoffs this year (not now or before the season started) but I do expect to see improvement. And i'm just not seeing it right now. Plus, in my mind, they have gotten progressively worse in each year in their exsistence. Ok, you might say the offense is moving the ball now. And to that I say you are right but i'm not ready to say the Charger and Lion "D" is something to be fearful of. And since i'm on the subject of "D", the next time our "D" comes up with a crucial stop when we need it will be the first time this year. With what I believed to be the "strong" side of our team is our biggest problem. But this is only my opinion though.

bckey
09-26-2004, 08:40 AM
I will watch the Texans every week regardless of their record. Did the same with the Oilers and you all now their were some lean years for them. I moved to Corpus Christi in 1977 and I still drive up to Houston for games. I just went to a couple of Astros games. I don't like when some fans get on here and question whether other people are still fans because they said something negative about the team or the coach. Folks if we stunk up the place the first 2 games then tell it like it is. Don't clap your hands and comb your hair over like Pardee did when the Oilers lost to Buffalo. Tell it like it is. We are fans and we're passionate about the Texans. It doesn't mean we are suddenly going to stop watching the Texans and become Cowboy fans. It means we just lost to the Chargers and the Lions and we don't like it.

I have to disagree with Vinny about this board not being reflective of the vast majority of Texan fans. All the fans I know here in Corpus Christi weren't real happy with those 2 losses and the way we lost them. No one is claiming the expansion team excuse any more. Most fans expected wins in those first 2 games as part of an 8-8 or 7-9 prediction for the year which is reasonable. If we go 5-11 or less I for one will not be excited about our 5 year plan. I would think that it needs to be looked at and corrected. If the Texans don't show improvement in the win/loss column this year then players with contracts up are going to start leaving and free agents will be harder to attract here. It is critical this year that we show improvement.

Bill's/TexanFan
09-26-2004, 08:50 AM
Well, I'd say no, and would also say that this board is not reflective of the vast majority of Texans fans because I think there is a certain knee-jerk factor to being anonymous on a message board. I think Joe-average fan understands that this is still a growth year and really didn't expect a fully mature, playoff caliber team.

That's an interesting opinion but I find it somewhat laughable. Certainly there will always be a certain amount of what I call "shooting from the lip" from some fans but to say people who post here are..... "not reflective of the vast majority of Texas fans" is a strange comment. What are we Vinny....people outside of the norm? The fact we (the posters) take the time to not only read but to post messages should speak for us.
Does this board belong to the Texans where only "feel good" comments can be posted? It seems to me if a poster comes on and says something "stupid" like...."we're going to the Super Bowl this year" they are embraced but if you deal in reality........you're offered your last meal! idonno:

Lucky
09-26-2004, 10:04 AM
Does this board belong to the Texans where only "feel good" comments can be posted?
No. But, have you posted anything on this board except negative comments? All you've done here is bash Casserly, Capers, & Carr...where's the evidence that you are a Texan fan and not some troll from another board?

Most of us are all for dealing in reality. A lot of people are disappointed in the 0-2 start, and should be. For every positive step the Texans have made this season (like moving the ball on offense), they've taken 2 steps back (like turnovers and not protecting the QB). The defense is relatively healthy, but isn't playing up to the level of the piecemeal group the Texans had on the field late in '03. Asking why is reasonable as is searching for reasonable answers.

Like I said reasonable answers. Not the Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc logic you've deployed thus far. If you're looking for folks here to embrace you, mix in something positive on occasion and cease with the faulty logic.

nunusguy
09-26-2004, 11:07 AM
Personally, I'll hang in there indefinitely no matter how bad their season(s) might
end up being, but at the same time I'll sure be critical when I feel like it. But sitting at home watching the season opener from Reliant, when I heard the boos from the hometown fans in the second half, yea I knew the honeymoon was over. The problems center aound the D: some of the vets have simplay hit the wall in the last 24 months since the inaugural season.

aj.
09-26-2004, 11:10 AM
Texans v. Raiders. Texans enter the game 0-3.

1st Quarter. 1st series. 2nd play (2nd and 7) handoff to DD that goes nowhere. BOOOOOOOO! from the upper environs. Honeymoon over? For a lot of people, absolutely. The fans will be ripping the Texans during the Oakland game unless they come out with high quality offensive and defensive efforts. The incessant whining and droning about firing coaches and play calling gets real old, but fans are pissed right about now and I don't blame them. I hope I'm wrong but I have a feeling the mood will be worse exactly one week from now.

Marcus
09-26-2004, 11:49 AM
What are we Vinny....people outside of the norm?


For the most part . . . YES.

It's the knee-jerk aspect to this message board that is unreal. It's the 'Fire Capers, Fire Casserly, Fire this Fire that" along with things like mocking Capers note taking, to David Carr's hair length, and . . . a favorite . . . " a conservative coaching philosophy" is the underlying cause of all the fumbles. :crazy:

I can see being angry and disgusted and needing to 'vent' a day or two after the game. But after that, a little less emotion, and a little more reason would be preferable.

I would characterize most the posters on this message board to be somewhat tempermental.

(Which reminds me of a Three Stooges cartoon I saw a while back. Curly says to Moe, "Hey I'm a tempermental guy". To which Moe replies: "Yeah, 90% temper, 10% mental.")

Jwwillis
09-26-2004, 11:55 AM
Well, I'd say no, and would also say that this board is not reflective of the vast majority of Texans fans because I think there is a certain knee-jerk factor to being anonymous on a message board. I think Joe-average fan understands that this is still a growth year and really didn't expect a fully mature, playoff caliber team.

I hope you are right. The last thing I want to see is a coaching change right now. I think it would set us back 3 to 5 yrs. Bud Adams had a history of firing coaches year after year and look where it got em. It wasnt untill Bum that he actually started keeping coaches around. I'll never forget "Black Sunday" the day Bum got fired ( also the day the Oilers lost to Buffalo in the playoff comeback win but that a diffrent story ). You have to admit Bud has learned his lesson since Fisher is one of the longest active coaches with one team in the league now. Capers needs the whole 5yrs.

texasguy346
09-26-2004, 12:16 PM
...to say people who post here are..... "not reflective of the vast majority of Texas fans" is a strange comment. What are we Vinny....people outside of the norm?

We're definately outside the norm. The majority of fans don't spend much time thinking about, much less writing about, the Texans until Sunday. Everyone on this message board follows the Texans and the NFL more closely than your average NFL fan. We critique every move that the organization makes, and we debate the outcome of the game on Sunday. Then, on Monday, we come back and debate why we won or lost, and start to discuss the weaknesses and strengths of our upcoming opponent. Your average Texan fan will watch the game on Sunday, and might engage in some water cooler talk come Monday. After that the Texans don't come back to mind till the following Sunday morning. So we're definately not like the majority of Texans fans, and in this case I don't mind being part of the minority.

Vinny
09-26-2004, 01:04 PM
That's an interesting opinion but I find it somewhat laughable. Certainly there will always be a certain amount of what I call "shooting from the lip" from some fans but to say people who post here are..... "not reflective of the vast majority of Texas fans" is a strange comment. What are we Vinny....people outside of the norm? The fact we (the posters) take the time to not only read but to post messages should speak for us.
Does this board belong to the Texans where only "feel good" comments can be posted? It seems to me if a poster comes on and says something "stupid" like...."we're going to the Super Bowl this year" they are embraced but if you deal in reality........you're offered your last meal! idonno:
Anonymous people tend to go to more extremes. That is just a fact.

Also, if you knew me better you would not imply I am a homer. I am as hard on this team as anyone here over the years. Most people would laugh at that implication. Frankly most people would wish I would gloss more about things such as a playoff appearance or the Super Bowl.

Bill's/TexanFan
09-26-2004, 01:10 PM
No. But, have you posted anything on this board except negative comments? All you've done here is bash Casserly, Capers, & Carr...where's the evidence that you are a Texan fan and not some troll from another board?
************************************************** **************

Where's the evidence? My evidence is this. While sitting in Ralph Wilson Stadium last year and seeing former Texan Jeff Posey hit David Carr from his blindside, knocking from the game, I was perhaps the only fan there not cheering. Inside.....I was sick and saying to myself..."please get up David and show the Bill's and Buffalo what you've got." Sadly that didn't happen but those were my thoughts.
And please, go back and read my posts and find one negative thing I've ever said about David Carr.
And any "bashing" I've ever done to Casserly or Capers in my opinion they've deserved.
Both of these men have done some good things in their careers but in the NFL it's "what have you done for me lately". And to both of these guy's it time to start putting up or start thinking about getting off the pot!
You may make your living being a Texan "bu++ki$$er"... I choose not to and I'll give credit where credit is due!

Lucky
09-26-2004, 01:19 PM
You may make your living being a Texan "bu++ki$$er"...
What? I get 10x the money you get for posting here.

TexanBacker93
09-26-2004, 04:05 PM
I can't speak for every fan, but what I expect is this team to be prepared and play hard every game, every down. This team won some games by playing over their heads in the first 2 years. This year in the 2 plus games I have seen they have been outplayed and outcoached. They make a lot of mistakes in key situations, from the wrong players on the field, penalties that cost field position, running the wrong routes, poor defensive schemes, etc..

This team was an expansion team 3 years ago, but it isn't like they fielded a team full of players that had never played the game. They had a lot of veterans, especially on defense. I think this year the team from the ball boys to the GM has to show more than moral victories.

This team is going to be special. I don't expect them to be a playoff team until next season, but they shouldn't make the mistakes they continue to make. Capers set a tough precedent in Carolina when they went to the conference championship game in their second season. If you look at their schedule, though, they won 8 of their 12 against teams with 6 wins or less.

El Tejano
09-28-2004, 03:25 PM
Great responses. I have to say the comment about the honeymoon being over but the relationship just starting is really true.

Let me ask this now. Do you feel that this last game against KC may be the game that turns things around for us? We have a few injuries in key positions.

Who would've thought that after week three we would be tied for last with Tenn?

edo783
09-28-2004, 03:58 PM
Tied for last, yes, that thought enterd my head, but with the Titanics???? Nope, didn't go there.

El Tejano
09-28-2004, 03:59 PM
Don't give up hope yet.

Doug
09-28-2004, 04:15 PM
I don't know if this will be the turning point or not....I hope it is. Regardless of KC's record they could have easily blown this team out of the water with the weapons they have but we found a way to keep it close and a way to win. To me that says alot, regardless of how ugly we played in the first two games and part of the third. For me it's still too early to start asking for peoples heads and ranting and raving about what to fix. It's hard to be realistic and optimistic at the same time when we played the first few games the way we did but I'm finding a way to get it done. I try and look for the good points more than the bad because anyone can find things that need to be fixed plus I'm not the one getting payed thousands to make those decisions. Call me naive, stupid, etc. but I'm just happy to be rooting for a Houston Pro Football team again. I want this team to win but my extremely high expectations are being saved for next year. For now I'd be happy with a record better than last year and if it doesn't happen then we took a step backward instead of forward now didn't we?

texasguy346
09-28-2004, 04:46 PM
I think it gives some encouragement to a team that was having a rough couple of weeks. Just look at KC to get an idea what it would have been like for the Texans to go down 0-3 for the season. Vermeil called it a "disheartening loss", and Tony G described it as being in a headlock that you can't get out of. I wouldn't call it a turning point, but it makes the locker room a more friendly place heading home to prepare for the Raider and the Vikings. The team showed the heart we've all been accustomed to seeing the past two seasons, but they only showed it for part of the game. They still have to show it for an entire game before I'll call it a turning point.