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View Full Version : Stop Bashing Mario Williams!!!!!!!!!


redbul41
09-25-2006, 09:03 PM
Guys, you are so pesimistic. You have to remember that he is a rookie. He will get better as the season comes along. You cant expect him to have sacks yet. He is not a speed rusher. He is a power rusher and player who MUST use technique. he is very raw, but he has all the tools to be great with GOOD coaching.:challenge

gtexan02
09-25-2006, 09:10 PM
I think we can bash him all we want.
#1 - He was sold to us as an all around rusher (meaning SPEED as well as power)

#2 - He has been stood up by RBs. Benching a lot doesn't mean you are a good power rusheer, and he's shown nothing other than combine #s to indicate he's a power rusher.

#3 - We were told we couldn't draft VY because he was a project. We were told we didn't draft Bush b/c we already had Davis. We were told Williams would help us out right now. So why do we have to wait for him?

Basically, he did little in college against good teams. He had a great combine, and has now shown us zero, zippo, nada on the field. I think we can complain. If it takes us 3 years to coach himinto a probwol player, it was a bad pick. A #1 overall DE should be NFL ready in his first year. Look at Peppers, Freeney, Rice, etc's numbers.

redbul41
09-25-2006, 09:14 PM
He does gather double teams on almost every play, which SHOULD open up things for the other players on defense. He is getting tackles, but i agree with you, he should have at least 1 sack. Just dont forget he is a rookie.

kbourda
09-25-2006, 09:20 PM
He does gather double teams on almost every play, which SHOULD open up things for the other players on defense. He is getting tackles, but i agree with you, he should have at least 1 sack. Just dont forget he is a rookie.

He is getting double teamed as much as I am. Sorryo is a big boy i'm sure he does not need anyone to coddle him.

gtexan02
09-25-2006, 09:21 PM
I agree, you shouldn't expect pro bowl #s for a rookie. But also remember, he is the #1 OVERALL pick. That means he should be better than every other player in the NFL who is also a rookie, and we haven't seen that.

Also, watch the games again. I have only seen double teams on MW during the Philly game. He was being blocked by TEs and RBs in the Washington game. They were toying with him

Scooter
09-25-2006, 09:22 PM
If it takes us 3 years to coach him into a probwol player, it was a bad pick. A #1 overall DE should be NFL ready in his first year. Look at Peppers, Freeney, Rice, etc's numbers.

i'll take a sub-par 2 years from mario if he developes into a probowler from year 3 on ... it worries me that you wouldnt. mario williams is a very RAW talent and that was obvious before the draft. he was not going to get 3 sacks and 8 tackles in his first game, and was probably going to be slow to adjust because he's young and inexperienced. i'm not sure why people think we got him to make an immediate impact because i dont see how that'd be the case. we got him because he was the best defensive player on the board, and someone we could build this new defense around. we are an expansion team again, this time we're doing it right by drafting defense and offensive line. anybody that thinks those arent what wins games, obviously hasnt ever watched a texans game.

and for the whiners, mario williams has as many sacks as reggie bush and vince young's touchdown totals COMBINED! quite a feat when the saints played green bay and cleveland (two very poor teams).

Vinny
09-25-2006, 09:23 PM
VY has a TD pass scooter

texflex513
09-25-2006, 09:23 PM
I think we can bash him all we want.
#1 - He was sold to us as an all around rusher (meaning SPEED as well as power)

#2 - He has been stood up by RBs. Benching a lot doesn't mean you are a good power rusheer, and he's shown nothing other than combine #s to indicate he's a power rusher.

#3 - We were told we couldn't draft VY because he was a project. We were told we didn't draft Bush b/c we already had Davis. We were told Williams would help us out right now. So why do we have to wait for him?

Basically, he did little in college against good teams. He had a great combine, and has now shown us zero, zippo, nada on the field. I think we can complain. If it takes us 3 years to coach himinto a probwol player, it was a bad pick. A #1 overall DE should be NFL ready in his first year. Look at Peppers, Freeney, Rice, etc's numbers.
Its only been 3 games gimme a break lol what player in the top ten drafted this year has blown the nfl out of the water so far this year please tell me i really would like to know. All rookies have to have some kind of adjustment period allow OUR OWN to have his.. of course we want him to be the best right away but time will tell and if it takes 3 seasons for him to become a pro bowler i say that is just in time... THE 1ST OVERALL PICK CRAP IS WAY OVERRATED.

gtexan02
09-25-2006, 09:25 PM
i'll take a sub-par 2 years from mario if he developes into a probowler from year 3 on ... it worries me that you wouldnt. mario williams is a very RAW talent and that was obvious before the draft. he was not going to get 3 sacks and 8 tackles in his first game, and was probably going to be slow to adjust because he's young and inexperienced. i'm not sure why people think we got him to make an immediate impact because i dont see how that'd be the case. we got him because he was the best defensive player on the board, and someone we could build this new defense around. we are an expansion team again, this time we're doing it right by drafting defense and offensive line. anybody that thinks those arent what wins games, obviously hasnt ever watched a texans game.

and for the whiners, mario williams has as many sacks as reggie bush and vince young's touchdown totals COMBINED! quite a feat when the saints played green bay and cleveland (two very poor teams).

VY has played minimally and has recorded a TD. Bush doesn't get goalline carries. MW has been on almost every single defensive play. And our defense is on the field A LOT.

I don't think we should have to wait 3 years for a DE to develop if he's the #1 overall pick. I can understanding waiting for a QB to develop. Maybe even a skill player. But someone like MW should make an immediate impact. And even if he doesn't, at least he shouldn't be making a negative impact (which he is)

Scooter
09-25-2006, 09:26 PM
VY has a TD pass scooter

i must've missed it, i thought he got his TD off of a fumble or something like that. either way he's got a rating of 58 and has as many INT's as TD's so i'll stand by the statement.

kbourda
09-25-2006, 09:29 PM
i'll take a sub-par 2 years from mario if he developes into a probowler from year 3 on ... it worries me that you wouldnt. mario williams is a very RAW talent and that was obvious before the draft. he was not going to get 3 sacks and 8 tackles in his first game, and was probably going to be slow to adjust because he's young and inexperienced. i'm not sure why people think we got him to make an immediate impact because i dont see how that'd be the case. we got him because he was the best defensive player on the board, and someone we could build this new defense around. we are an expansion team again, this time we're doing it right by drafting defense and offensive line. anybody that thinks those arent what wins games, obviously hasnt ever watched a texans game.

and for the whiners, mario williams has as many sacks as reggie bush and vince young's touchdown totals COMBINED! quite a feat when the saints played green bay and cleveland (two very poor teams).


Oh, how soon we forget. What in the heck is DeMeco's excuse? He's a rookie? That kid, whom by the way is half the size of Sorryo, plays his heart out every Sunday. But you guys are right, we shouldn't expect a ROOKIE to play like a pro-bowler. The player SHOULD have it in their heart or not!

And for the record, VY threw a TD. So please stop with all the player comparisons. Bush and VY don't play here. So stop bringing up their names when Sorryo does not perform. It is pretty weak.

UberDork
09-25-2006, 09:30 PM
I tend to think we should bash management for making the choice rather than Williams for being what he is...

From what I have read around here, it doesn't seem like Williams is just slacking because he was picked #1...

I think it will just be a while...he does not appear to have that fire that makes him naturally terrorized everybody on the field...thus if he is to have any chance of being worthy of his selection, he must master the mental part...that will just take time...not his fault...bash management for selecting him at the wrong spot...bash coaches for not bringing him along properly. By that, I mean moving him all over the line, I think he needs to work on technique for just one spot.

gtexan02
09-25-2006, 09:30 PM
You do realize that Bush is used as an extra offensive weapon, not the featured back. And that Vy has played only a few series, right?

Vinny
09-25-2006, 09:30 PM
i must've missed it, i thought he got his TD off of a fumble or something like that. either way he's got a rating of 58 and has as many INT's as TD's so i'll stand by the statement.
no, it was a nice drive and a pass in the deep middle of the end zone. Spin isnt your strong suit.

Tennessee Titans at 07:59
1-10-TEN31 (7:59) V.Young pass short right to B.Jones to TEN 41 for 10 yards (Q.Jammer).
1-10-TEN41 (7:24) V.Young pass short left to R.Williams ran ob at SD 42 for 17 yards.
1-10-SD42 (6:53) (Shotgun) L.White left end to SD 36 for 6 yards (D.Florence).
2-4-SD36 (6:22) L.White right tackle to SD 31 for 5 yards (J.Cesaire).
1-10-SD31 (5:45) L.White left tackle to SD 31 for no gain (D.Robinson, C.Polk).
2-10-SD31 (5:05) V.Young pass incomplete deep right to B.Jones.
3-10-SD31 (4:59) V.Young pass incomplete deep left to R.Williams (B.Jue).
4-10-SD31 (4:53) V.Young scrambles up the middle to SD 19 for 12 yards (D.Edwards).
1-10-SD19 (4:15) C.Brown left end to SD 19 for no gain (T.Kiel, C.Polk).
PENALTY on TEN-B.Troupe, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at SD 19 - No Play.
1-20-SD29 (4:08) (Shotgun) V.Young up the middle to SD 22 for 7 yards (C.Polk, S.Cooper).
2-13-SD22 (3:23) V.Young pass incomplete short right to D.Givens.
PENALTY on SD-S.Phillips, Defensive Offside, 4 yards, enforced at SD 22 - No Play.
2-9-SD18 (3:19) V.Young pass incomplete short right to B.Wade.
3-9-SD18 (3:13) (Shotgun) V.Young pass deep left to D.Bennett for 18 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playbyplay/NFL_20060917_TEN@SD

gtexan02
09-25-2006, 09:32 PM
Everyone was so excited when Williams' story about quitting football to take care of his sister came out. We should have been scared, and realized he didn't have that obsessive love of the game that the great ones do. I think he lacks a little motivation

PS: No matter how great or terrible Vy and RB play, MW's value is determined solely by his play. So far, he's been awful

Wolf
09-25-2006, 09:33 PM
I wonder what Weavers excuse is?

gtexan02
09-25-2006, 09:35 PM
I wonder what Weavers excuse is?

Weaver - 3-4 DE brought in to play 4-3 DE. Too slow to be a pass rusher?

Wolf
09-25-2006, 09:37 PM
too slow to stop the run either?

I mention him because he was our prize too and no production out these guys..


Robaire Smith? would he have helped this defense? ( I believe that was a salary cap casualty for the future)

I am flabbergasted at our front 4 and how easily this should be the most talented group of guys we have had ...(1-7)

has Gary Walker been picked up by anyone yet?

Scooter
09-25-2006, 09:39 PM
Oh, how soon we forget. What in the heck is DeMeco's excuse? He's a rookie? That kid, whom by the way is half the size of Sorryo, plays his heart out every Sunday. But you guys are right, we shouldn't expect a ROOKIE to play like a pro-bowler. The player SHOULD have it in their heart or not!

And for the record, VY threw a TD. So please stop with all the player comparisons. Bush and VY don't play here. So stop bringing up their names when Sorryo does not perform. It is pretty weak.

wow, sorryo. i didnt know we had that many titans fans around here that were mad at the pick. do you even watch the games? point out a play where mario displays "no heart". dont worry, i'll wait. since you missed it, mario's always chasing the play and trying to pump up his teammates. he hasnt quit on a single down. where he's getting beat is on his recognition skills, something that since you're new to football, happens a lot with younger players. he misreads offensive plays and gets beat on poor decisions. the tight end that blocks mario that everyone loves to mention ... follow the whole play. once mario figures out it was a cutback on his side (which at that point is too late), mario throws the TE to the ground effortlessly. he's going to take time to learn.

texflex513
09-25-2006, 09:40 PM
Oh, how soon we forget. What in the heck is DeMeco's excuse? He's a rookie? That kid, whom by the way is half the size of Sorryo, plays his heart out every Sunday. But you guys are right, we shouldn't expect a ROOKIE to play like a pro-bowler. The player SHOULD have it in their heart or not!

And for the record, VY threw a TD. So please stop with all the player comparisons. Bush and VY don't play here. So stop bringing up their names when Sorryo does not perform. It is pretty weak.
Demeco's job is read and react....mario's job is contact AT THE SNAP you cant compare the 2 mario's job is much more challenging the only thing is meco is better at what he does than mario is at his job right now.. mario needs time this is not a 3 game judgement project give it time.. realisticly how much could a few sacks by mario matter so far anyway... not much!!! our problems are much deeper than mario himself. focus on the real problem THE ENTIRE DEFENSE!!

PapaL
09-25-2006, 09:52 PM
Stop it, stop it, stop it....your going to make him cry. In all seriousness; it's easy to pile on when things are bad. Its not like the guy is going out there and laying on his face all game long. Give him his fair share of the blame, but remember how money and first round picks we have on the line. They are ALL terrible right now.

Scooter
09-25-2006, 09:54 PM
no, it was a nice drive and a pass in the deep middle of the end zone. Spin isnt your strong suit.

i made a mistake and confused it with his first preseason TD. as i said, i must've missed it.

2-8-DEN 13 (11:48) 10-V.Young scrambles up the middle to DEN 2 for 11 yards (21-H.Abdullah). FUMBLES (21-H.Abdullah), and recovers at DEN 0. TOUCHDOWN.

kbourda
09-25-2006, 09:58 PM
wow, sorryo. i didnt know we had that many titans fans around here that were mad at the pick. do you even watch the games? point out a play where mario displays "no heart". dont worry, i'll wait. since you missed it, mario's always chasing the play and trying to pump up his teammates. he hasnt quit on a single down. where he's getting beat is on his recognition skills, something that since you're new to football, happens a lot with younger players. he misreads offensive plays and gets beat on poor decisions. the tight end that blocks mario that everyone loves to mention ... follow the whole play. once mario figures out it was a cutback on his side (which at that point is too late), mario throws the TE to the ground effortlessly. he's going to take time to learn.

Attack me all you choose to. Questioning my football knowledge? Ok, i'll take that. Chasing a play, that takes superior heart you're right. Hey, the guy looks like Jason Babin did in his rookie year. I say he plays with no heart and it shows.

Mr. White
09-25-2006, 09:59 PM
I think the blame goes on Richard Smith. When Mario came in, we kept hearing about a great "raw talent."

Who's job is it to refine raw talent? I'll go out on a limb and say the coaches. And by no stretch is that happening.

Even the refined talent on the defense looks like hell right now.

kbourda
09-25-2006, 09:59 PM
Stop it, stop it, stop it....your going to make him cry. In all seriousness; it's easy to pile on when things are bad. Its not like the guy is going out there and laying on his face all game long. Give him his fair share of the blame, but remember how money and first round picks we have on the line. They are ALL terrible right now.

No doubt.

kbourda
09-25-2006, 10:05 PM
Demeco's job is read and react....mario's job is contact AT THE SNAP you cant compare the 2 mario's job is much more challenging the only thing is meco is better at what he does than mario is at his job right now.. mario needs time this is not a 3 game judgement project give it time.. realisticly how much could a few sacks by mario matter so far anyway... not much!!! our problems are much deeper than mario himself. focus on the real problem THE ENTIRE DEFENSE!!

I know what Sorryo's job is as well as what DeMeco's job is. But don't make it sound like every single play is coming DeMeco's way every single time. That guy plays from sideline to sideline and sometimes from endzone to endzone too. And besides it's not like the other teams are letting DeMeco get to the tackle everytime.

Mysteryhunt
09-25-2006, 10:11 PM
look at other #1 picks in their first year and compare. PLEASE

TEXANRED
09-25-2006, 10:13 PM
no, it was a nice drive and a pass in the deep middle of the end zone. Spin isnt your strong suit.

Tennessee Titans at 07:59
1-10-TEN31 (7:59) V.Young pass short right to B.Jones to TEN 41 for 10 yards (Q.Jammer).
1-10-TEN41 (7:24) V.Young pass short left to R.Williams ran ob at SD 42 for 17 yards.
1-10-SD42 (6:53) (Shotgun) L.White left end to SD 36 for 6 yards (D.Florence).
2-4-SD36 (6:22) L.White right tackle to SD 31 for 5 yards (J.Cesaire).
1-10-SD31 (5:45) L.White left tackle to SD 31 for no gain (D.Robinson, C.Polk).
2-10-SD31 (5:05) V.Young pass incomplete deep right to B.Jones.
3-10-SD31 (4:59) V.Young pass incomplete deep left to R.Williams (B.Jue).
4-10-SD31 (4:53) V.Young scrambles up the middle to SD 19 for 12 yards (D.Edwards).
1-10-SD19 (4:15) C.Brown left end to SD 19 for no gain (T.Kiel, C.Polk).
PENALTY on TEN-B.Troupe, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at SD 19 - No Play.
1-20-SD29 (4:08) (Shotgun) V.Young up the middle to SD 22 for 7 yards (C.Polk, S.Cooper).
2-13-SD22 (3:23) V.Young pass incomplete short right to D.Givens.
PENALTY on SD-S.Phillips, Defensive Offside, 4 yards, enforced at SD 22 - No Play.
2-9-SD18 (3:19) V.Young pass incomplete short right to B.Wade.
3-9-SD18 (3:13) (Shotgun) V.Young pass deep left to D.Bennett for 18 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playbyplay/NFL_20060917_TEN@SD

Why are you defending our arch enemy?

I don't care he is from Houston

I don't care he was a Long Horn

He is playing for a team that is going to cause me to root for the Cowboys.

Besides, looks like he was in the game last eight minutes with the game well out of reach. What do the Carr haters call that? Garbage time?

To get back on topic, Mario is stinking it up. We should fire the D-line coach and get someone in there to get Mario to understand how to play with leverage. Mario is just straight up trying to bull rush and this is the NFL not college. I thought that Mario would have developed some sort of tech by now. That boys and girls, is a failure directly reflected upon his D-line coach.

cbnjwill
09-25-2006, 10:32 PM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

texflex513
09-25-2006, 10:33 PM
I know what Sorryo's job is as well as what DeMeco's job is. But don't make it sound like every single play is coming DeMeco's way every single time. That guy plays from sideline to sideline and sometimes from endzone to endzone too. And besides it's not like the other teams are letting DeMeco get to the tackle everytime.

exactly meco is going to the ball as a linebacker mario is trying to do the same as an end not every play is ran to mario's side either and mario has still got to deal with misdirections and playfakes which are easier to read from meco's position READ AND REACT.... i am not debating who is better meco has a better nose for the ball than mario right now all i am saying is let williams learn and adapt. Sorryo lol! that is fine call him that but when he improves and gets better realize that you were one of the doubters that he has proven wrong and this is a good thing...for the good of the team right?

Napa Auto Parts
09-25-2006, 10:36 PM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice




Let me sound like a total hater like some of the posters around but who have the saints played if we had there schedule we would be 2-0 also they havent beat nobody:stirpot:

Mr. White
09-25-2006, 10:38 PM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

I don't think that's ever been brought up on this board. You get my vote for the most original post. Ever on this board.

Doesn't even matter that you don't puctuate....or use capital letters....or complete sentences.

You, sir, have truly broken new ground.

dantem
09-25-2006, 10:42 PM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

Looks like you made the wrong choice your rooting for the Texans, and at the same time spending all your energy mocking and degrading them.

Wow thats pretty impressive!

cbnjwill
09-25-2006, 10:44 PM
didnt realize that we were writing a term paper that would be graded im sure your english teacher would be very proud. true saints have capitalized on their weak schedule but going into this weekend this board was full of how terrible the redskins are post and how we should win this weekend

texflex513
09-25-2006, 10:45 PM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

Are you refering to all those TD's that bush has scored to put NO ahead??? LOL

TexanBearkat
09-25-2006, 10:47 PM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

Having Bush on the Texans doeswn't make them 3-0 nor would the Saints having Mario make them 0-3. Bush has not done anything spectacular for the Saints either, though thus far has produced more than Mario. Our Defense has been awful, again Bush would not be of any help there either.

cbnjwill
09-25-2006, 10:48 PM
lets all be homers and only have positive things to say about our 2-17 team. carr is a future hall of famer. mario is the greatest DE that will ever play the game. in this scheme we can put anyone at RB and they are gonna put up great numbers. ok guys we just need to give this team our support and they will be great. yippeee. cant wait we are such an improving team.

Mr. White
09-25-2006, 10:50 PM
didnt realize that we were writing a term paper that would be graded im sure your english teacher would be very proud. true saints have capitalized on their weak schedule but going into this weekend this board was full of how terrible the redskins are post and how we should win this weekend

You must have been looking at a different board than me. There wasn't a whole lot of "how terrible the redskins are post" and "how we should win this weekend." There's always a few cheerleaders, though.

Most people with any common sense know that a 2-14 team won't beat a playoff team.

Mr. White
09-25-2006, 10:52 PM
lets all be homers and only have positive things to say about our 2-17 team. carr is a future hall of famer. mario is the greatest DE that will ever play the game. in this scheme we can put anyone at RB and they are gonna put up great numbers. ok guys we just need to give this team our support and they will be great. yippeee. cant wait we are such an improving team.


Yeah. You're right. We should fire the coach, his staff, the GM, and cut about 20-25 players.

cbnjwill
09-25-2006, 10:52 PM
look there will always be fans who see what they want to see. this team can go 0-16 and there will be post about how we are improving and next year with a couple of good moves we can be right in the playoff hunt. if thats what you choose to believe thats what your always gonna see. personally after year three of the expansion i put away the excuses and see this team for what they are on the field and right now they are a pathetic team.

axman40
09-25-2006, 10:56 PM
i must've missed it, i thought he got his TD off of a fumble or something like that. either way he's got a rating of 58 and has as many INT's as TD's so i'll stand by the statement.
How nice of you to reject reality to substitute your own!Repaet after me lilttle Fonzie I was wro.......the opposite of right!
:redtowel:

TEXANRED
09-25-2006, 10:57 PM
lets all be homers and only have positive things to say about our 2-17 team. carr is a future hall of famer. mario is the greatest DE that will ever play the game. in this scheme we can put anyone at RB and they are gonna put up great numbers. ok guys we just need to give this team our support and they will be great. yippeee. cant wait we are such an improving team.

I know the Texans are bad, but I don't think even they could find an extra three loses.

axman40
09-25-2006, 10:59 PM
Oh by the way the Mario bashing will end when Mario starts bashing Qbs and Rbs!

:texflag:

Mr. White
09-25-2006, 11:01 PM
personally after year three of the expansion i put away the excuses and see this team for what they are on the field and right now they are a pathetic team.

Very astute observation.

Scooter
09-25-2006, 11:02 PM
How nice of you to reject reality to substitute your own!Repaet after me lilttle Fonzie I was wro.......the opposite of right!
:redtowel:

you really should read all of the posts before replying.

texflex513
09-25-2006, 11:05 PM
look there will always be fans who see what they want to see. this team can go 0-16 and there will be post about how we are improving and next year with a couple of good moves we can be right in the playoff hunt. if thats what you choose to believe thats what your always gonna see. personally after year three of the expansion i put away the excuses and see this team for what they are on the field and right now they are a pathetic team. I agree... i see a bad team and BELIEVE they will get better and you see a pathetic team who you criticize like it is not gonna get better. Of course you have your reasons for pessimism and i have mine for optimism. I guess its just about the individual. If your not willing to give it more time CONVERT to a colts fan lol!

wolf123
09-25-2006, 11:07 PM
look there will always be fans who see what they want to see. this team can go 0-16 and there will be post about how we are improving and next year with a couple of good moves we can be right in the playoff hunt. if thats what you choose to believe thats what your always gonna see. personally after year three of the expansion i put away the excuses and see this team for what they are on the field and right now they are a pathetic team.

Okay...so why are you here? Obviously the Texans aren't your team. The first step is admittance...say it with me now" I am...a Troll"

dantem
09-25-2006, 11:10 PM
lets all be homers and only have positive things to say about our 2-17 team. carr is a future hall of famer. mario is the greatest DE that will ever play the game. in this scheme we can put anyone at RB and they are gonna put up great numbers. ok guys we just need to give this team our support and they will be great. yippeee. cant wait we are such an improving team.

Lets all show our true colors as (questionable) fans by mocking our own team, scoffing at them when they make mistakes, hawking over the TV set during the game just waiting for David Carr to screw up so that we can jump with Glee that now we can finally post the message to end all messages. hoping for Mario to play poorly so that we can say that We called it... We're smarter than the texans coaches, they should let us run the team.

I have never seen so many cry babies in one place before.

wolf123
09-25-2006, 11:14 PM
VY has played minimally and has recorded a TD. Bush doesn't get goalline carries. MW has been on almost every single defensive play. And our defense is on the field A LOT.

I don't think we should have to wait 3 years for a DE to develop if he's the #1 overall pick. I can understanding waiting for a QB to develop. Maybe even a skill player. But someone like MW should make an immediate impact. And even if he doesn't, at least he shouldn't be making a negative impact (which he is)

I know your trying to make a point, but lets now exagerate here. MW starts, but misses atleast a quarter of the snaps on D. The D line continually rotates, almost every other play. How else do you think Weaver, Kalu, Babin, and Peek(other than WK3) get a nice amount of playing time. Also remember, this kid is 21...he declared his true Junior year...one of the youngest to step onto the field...he has to learn.

blockhead83
09-25-2006, 11:17 PM
Everyone was so excited when Williams' story about quitting football to take care of his sister came out. We should have been scared, and realized he didn't have that obsessive love of the game that the great ones do. I think he lacks a little motivation

PS: No matter how great or terrible Vy and RB play, MW's value is determined solely by his play. So far, he's been awful

This is some crap, IMO. His brother in law is KIA, and he offers to take care of his sister, a widow with one child and another on the way, and you say he has lack of motivation for offering to give it all up to support her? It's one thing to lack motivation, but it's another to put a freakin game above the well being of your family. Mario Williams isn't playing real well right now, but it's not because he cares about his family more than the game of football. As far as the great one's having an obsession for the game; Is that why Barry Sanders retired when most thought he had plenty of good years left? There have been plenty of great one's who had large interests in things other than football.

kbourda
09-26-2006, 12:01 AM
Oh by the way the Mario bashing will end when Mario starts bashing Qbs and Rbs!

:texflag:

Amen to that!

Kaiser Toro
09-26-2006, 12:09 AM
Hey, the guy looks like Jason Babin did in his rookie year. I say he plays with no heart and it shows.

Is this one of those heart on a sleeve deals?

Napa Auto Parts
09-26-2006, 12:16 AM
Didn't read this thread completely but somebody said, "Check out the stats."

Jevon Kearse: 1999 (rookie year)
16 games
48 tackles
9 assists
14.5 sacks

Michael Strahan: 1993 (rookie year)
9 games
1 tackle
2 assists
1 sack

Dwight Freeney: 2002 (rookie year)
16 games
40 tackles
1 assist
13 sacks

Jason Babin: 2004 (rookie year)
16 games
51 tackles
12 assists
4 sacks

Kevin Carter: 1995 (rookie year)
16 games
33 tackles
4 assists
6 sacks

Kalimba Edwards: 2002 (rookie year)
16 games
28 tackles
8 assists
6.5 sacks

Julius Peppers: 2002 (rookie year)
12 games
28 tackles
7 assists
12 sacks
1 interception

Simeon Rice: 1996 (rookie year)
16 games
41 tackles
9 assists
12.5 sacks

Jason Taylor: 1997 (rookie year)
13 games
30 tackles
12 assists
5 sacks

Mario Williams: 2006 (rookie year)
3 games
6 tackles
2 assists


FWIW
:stirpot:



Good point but some of these players weren't the 1st overall Selection i would venture to say none of the players above are the 1st overall selection of there draft class. i would even go as far as to say some of the names on this list might even be third 2nd to 3rd Rounders.

Kaiser Toro
09-26-2006, 12:36 AM
I also think Mario is a bust, but it is time to forget about it. Let's move on and see if we can win a game GOD knows they need us......we have to help them any7 way that we can.

Nooooooo, we cannot forget. We must continue to let the world know. Please promise you will continue to give us these informative and riveting takes on Mario being a bust.

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 12:40 AM
I think we can bash him all we want.
#1 - He was sold to us as an all around rusher (meaning SPEED as well as power)

He is........ you can't watch these games, and not see it.

#2 - He has been stood up by RBs. Benching a lot doesn't mean you are a good power rusheer, and he's shown nothing other than combine #s to indicate he's a power rusher.

No he hasn't. Tell me when & where, I'll find it...... this is a myth started by Reggie & Vince trolls..... it's just easy to sell to fans of a loosing team on a witch hunt........ don't fall for it.

#3 - We were told we couldn't draft VY because he was a project. We were told we didn't draft Bush b/c we already had Davis. We were told Williams would help us out right now. So why do we have to wait for him?

Get over it. If you want to continue the argument for drafting Vince Young, pick on the QB.... the one with the highest QB rating after three games.

Upset we didn't take Reggie.... fuggetaboutit......... we got a TE in the 4th, that we can split out as a reciever, or motion in as a fullback. He can run routes like a reciever, and he can catch out of the backfield. If we leave him on the line, Defenses have to wonder if he is there for protection...... because he can block very well. or if he'll threaten the middle of the field & open up our WRs......


...... oh yeah..... he also has two touchdowns....

Basically, he did little in college against good teams.

He was also a Junior........

He had a great combine, and has now shown us zero, zippo, nada on the field. I think we can complain. If it takes us 3 years to coach himinto a probwol player, it was a bad pick. A #1 overall DE should be NFL ready in his first year. Look at Peppers, Freeney, Rice, etc's numbers.

It's only been three games..... at least let him make it to the bye week...... our schedule eases up a little bit there..... he'll have plenty of multisack games...... if we're lucky, we'll even get to see if he can catch VinceYoung. fingers crossed.

Let's look at this no pressure that we are getting on the Qb........

PeytonManning....... against the Giants....... sacked once...... against the Texans(who put absolutely no pressure on the QB whatsoever.........) sacked twice.... against the Jacksonville Jaguars..... who hands down have the best defense in the AFC South..... 2 sacks.

So we tie with the best defense in the AFC South.

Now...... Donovan McNabb....... sacked once by the Texans.... that's us. sacked once by the Giants...... that's the team with OsiUmenyiora, Lavar Arrington, MathiasKiwanuka, & oh yeah the single season sack record holder..... MichaelStrahan.
& three times against the 49ers..... Manny Lawson probably had two of those.

Now... MarkBrunnel.... sacked zero times by Minnesota.... & six times by Dallas........ who runs a 3-4..... a defensive scheme, that we as fans said wasn't any good. They also didn't have to worry about Clinton Portis.....
and 0 times by Houston........

so...... sack wise...... we're coming up about avg as a team. through all the stupid defensive scheming & 4 man rushing...... and moving Mario to tackle, then switching the side of the line...... then playing with someone different on your left side(or your right side, depending since you are Mario Williams and you play both sides) every other down........

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 12:51 AM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

SeanPayton...... he dumped all his linebakers, and got three FAs to start.

lets all be homers and only have positive things to say about our 2-17 team. carr is a future hall of famer. mario is the greatest DE that will ever play the game. in this scheme we can put anyone at RB and they are gonna put up great numbers. ok guys we just need to give this team our support and they will be great. yippeee. cant wait we are such an improving team.

Are you married?? Have you everbeen??

if you are, or have, then you'll know what I mean. If you haven't then it really shouldn't be too hard to imagine.

NObody is perfect. That woman is going to do things that is going to upset you. She's going to frustrate you at times...... just being her..... not trying to get your goat or anything... but just because she is she, and you are you.

Now..... you can talk to her, let her know what things upset you, and what things don't...... tell her what you'd like her to do more of, and what you'd like to see her do less of. She is not going to take all your suggestions. Especially if you're yelling your head off, and insulting her just as much as you "criticize" her.

Now when you go talk to her family..... if you go about "criticizing" her the way you are criticizing our team....... our organization........ you better believe they are going to treat you & everything you say the way you are being treated here.

Not everyone who criticizes Mario or David for that matter is getting the treatment you are getting........

think about it.

southtexan
09-26-2006, 12:54 AM
I'm a MW supporter, eventually he will play up to his potential. What bothers me the most is that the Redskins 6th round pick got a sack and recovered Carr's fumble, I don't know the guys name.

Kaiser Toro
09-26-2006, 12:55 AM
I have come to the conclusion that Mario is a bust. I have no faith in him or our defense. That said, I AM A TEXANS fan and i want them to win, so I have decided to move on. Le's do our best to win the next game. I have nothing else to say

You just came to the conclusion?

Kaiser Toro
09-26-2006, 12:56 AM
Mario IS a bust. Let's try and move on and help this team get a win. I have been one of his biggest critics and it's clear that he can't play. Let's move obn and TRY and get a win.


Good to see you are moving on still.

southtexan
09-26-2006, 12:59 AM
Good to see you are moving on still.

Hola mod de los amigos invisibles, do I sense some sarcasm?

Kaiser Toro
09-26-2006, 01:00 AM
Hola mod de los amigos invisibles, do I sense some sarcasm?

Thick as Houston humidity.

gtexan02
09-26-2006, 01:07 AM
Why do you bother to defend yourself? People know what they believe, and this baord isn't going to change them. Some people know RB is bust despite what he does, and others believe him to be superman despite how he plays.
The truth is, it makes no difference how RB plays. This thread is about how bad Mario Williams is playing.
Maybe RB isn't superman. Or, maybe his mere presence is giving confidence to the fans, which then gives confidence to the players. A team that believes in themselves can win a lot of games.

The fact of the matter is, MW's worth will only be determined by how many sacks/tackles/ff/pressures/etc he puts up. Right now he is sorely lcking in every statistical category. So quit arguing about Bush. He is irrelevent. The issue at hand is how bad our #1 pick is playing, and whether or not its fair to jump on him this early in the year.

gtexan02
09-26-2006, 01:11 AM
Sheesh I wish this thread would get closed. Half the people think he's a bust after 3 games, the others think he's doing well and citing watching the game (where are you seeing this???). This is like two deaf people yelling at each other. Both somehow think their arguments arer going to change the tide, but no one is listening

MasterC25
09-26-2006, 01:14 AM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

Saints are 3-0 one because of there schedulemore then there drafting of Bush. Reggie Bush effect has been minimal. He could have not played and they still would have won those three games

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 01:17 AM
Sheesh I wish this thread would get closed. Half the people think he's a bust after 3 games, the others think he's doing well and citing watching the game (where are you seeing this???). This is like two deaf people yelling at each other. Both somehow think their arguments arer going to change the tide, but no one is listening

ahh a futile post about a futile argument..........


what could be more futile??





uh....... wait a minute....

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 01:18 AM
Have you really watched him? At this point, he is a major bust and this team IS bad. Let's just accept it and move on. Hopefully we can get Adrian Peterson, a solid safety, and a good corner in the next draft

Start your AdrianPetson Bowl right now, and you'll find out the real reason we didn't draft Reggie.......

number1stunner
09-26-2006, 03:37 AM
The problem I have with the pick of Mario Williams is the fact that the Texans needed/need an identity. When you think of these teams, what do you think of?

Baltimore?
Indianapolis?
Pittsburgh?
Denver?

The selection of Reggie Bush would've IMO solitified our offense. We weren't going to the Super Bowl this year so fix one side of the ball at a time. Look at what Bush is doing for the Saints. How much attention did the Falcons D pay to Bush on the reverse? Their D didn't stay at home because of the threat of what Bush can do. You line up Bush in the slot on the Texans and Johnson and Moulds will get plenty of opportunities to make plays because of the threat of Reggie Bush.

Mario Williams is not a #1 overall pick. The Texans put Williams behind the 8-ball of pressure by taking him #1. If you wanted to fix this team on both sides of the ball, they should have dealt the pick for multiple picks, plain and simple.

By the way, what sense did it make to have Casserly running the draft when you knew you were going to cap him in a month? I'm still trying to figure that one out.

Scooter
09-26-2006, 03:51 AM
The problem I have with the pick of Mario Williams is the fact that the Texans needed/need an identity. When you think of these teams, what do you think of?

Baltimore?
Indianapolis?
Pittsburgh?
Denver?


defense
peyton
defense
kubiak

denver has 2 rings, for the first they had the 4th ranked defense. for the second they had the 12th ranked (and top 5 against the run). indy got good with manning, but they keep going farther as their defense improves. pittsburgh had the 4th ranked defense last year, and the 1st the year before during their 15-1 season. baltimore ranked 1st in 2000 for their superbowl. st louis (greatest show on turf) had the 3rd ranked defense in their 01 superbowl loss and 7th (first in rushing D) for their 99 superbowl win. the patriots were 7th & 9th respectively in 03 & 04 ... the only oddity is being ranked 24th in 01 (top 3 however in TD's allowed).


the theme? coaching and defense.

number1stunner
09-26-2006, 04:02 AM
defense
peyton
defense
kubiak

denver has 2 rings, for the first they had the 4th ranked defense. for the second they had the 12th ranked (and top 5 against the run). indy got good with manning, but they keep going farther as their defense improves. pittsburgh had the 4th ranked defense last year, and the 1st the year before during their 15-1 season. baltimore ranked 1st in 2000 for their superbowl. st louis (greatest show on turf) had the 3rd ranked defense in their 01 superbowl loss and 7th (first in rushing D) for their 99 superbowl win. the patriots were 7th & 9th respectively in 03 & 04 ... the only oddity is being ranked 24th in 01 (top 3 however in TD's allowed).


the theme? coaching and defense.

The point is they don't have an identity. I'd rather have Bush and we lose 28-21 or 35-28 every week with a solid offense than lose the way they are now. Getting your head kicked in every week is not fun to watch.

If you go defense in the draft, they should've went CB or LB. The 3-4 was not a bad system. We just had the wrong players for it. Babin is not an OLB and neither is Peek. If you want the blueprint of how to beat the Colts, ask San Diego. They laid the blueprint and the Steelers followed it perfectly. Your LB's and safety's need to apply pressure to Manning by blitzing. A DE is not going to get to Manning because their line is too good.

Scooter
09-26-2006, 04:35 AM
edit: nevermind, way past my bedtime

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 08:23 AM
The problem I have with the pick of Mario Williams is the fact that the Texans needed/need an identity. When you think of these teams, what do you think of?

Baltimore?
Indianapolis?
Pittsburgh?
Denver?

SteveMcNair
Peyton
Cowher
ZBS

& like it or not, the Texans' identity has to do with the number of sacks we've given up in the past 4.3 seasons..... & that ain't going to change by adding Reggie to our roster.

The selection of Reggie Bush would've IMO solitified our offense. We weren't going to the Super Bowl this year so fix one side of the ball at a time.

What's wrong with our offense now??
Running the ball?? Reggie doesn't do that... a significant deep threat?? We have two of them, just have a problem getting them the ball.
We even have a 4th round gem that keeps the defense from keying in on either of these guys, and he's got two touch downs in 3 games to prove it. And, he can pass block, run block, & lead block. We can split him out as a WR, Slot reciever, H-back, & he can catch coming out of the Fullback position.

Look at what Bush is doing for the Saints. How much attention did the Falcons D pay to Bush on the reverse?

about as much attention as we've been giving to LedellBetts, BrianWestbrook, AntowaineRandle-El, SantanaMoss, & J.Addai

Their D didn't stay at home because of the threat of what Bush can do.

The Reggie Bush who has been tackled by the first guy to touch him all night??
D.Brees pass short right to R.Bush to NO 25 for 5 yards (C.Crocker).
R.Bush left end to NO 45 for -3 yards(M.Boley).
R.Bush up the middle to 50 for 5 yards (R.Coleman(DT), M.Boley).
R.Bush left tackle to NO 28 for 3 yards (G.Jackson(DT))
R.Bush left guard to NO 23 for 8 yards (P.Carrington(DT)).
D.Brees pass incomplete short middle to R.Bush.
R.Bush left guard to NO 34 for 9 yards (K.Brooking(LB))
R.Bush right guard to NO 38 for 4 yards (M.Boley(LB))
D.Brees pass short left to R.Bush ran ob at NO 42 for 4 yards (J.Webster(CB))
R.Bush up the middle to 50 for 13 yards (K.Mathis(FS))
D.Brees pass short right to R.Bush pushed ob at ATL 49 for 1 yard (K.Brooking(LB)).
R.Bush right guard to ATL 11 for 2 yards (K.Brooking(LB))
R.Bush right tackle to ATL 2 for no gain (M.Boley(LB), J.Webster(CB)).
R.Bush right guard to ATL 2 for no gain (P.Kerney(DE)).

& I could go on & on... no mismatches...... just base personnel..... & Reggie looking like an avg running back. His coach yelling at him, his QB telling him to run his route past the sticks on third down..... just another rookie RB. LIke Joseph Addai, LaurenceMaroney, & D'AngeloWilliams.

You line up Bush in the slot on the Texans and Johnson and Moulds will get plenty of opportunities to make plays because of the threat of Reggie Bush.

If you've been watching, you'd notice the problem is not that these two can't get open.....

Mario Williams is not a #1 overall pick. The Texans put Williams behind the 8-ball of pressure by taking him #1. If you wanted to fix this team on both sides of the ball, they should have dealt the pick for multiple picks, plain and simple.

So what are you saying?? that you wouldn't have drafted Reggie either??

By the way, what sense did it make to have Casserly running the draft when you knew you were going to cap him in a month? I'm still trying to figure that one out.

Casserly was the face man......... Kubiak ran that draft, and will run future drafts.....

Second Honeymoon
09-26-2006, 11:05 AM
I think we can bash him all we want.
#1 - He was sold to us as an all around rusher (meaning SPEED as well as power)

#2 - He has been stood up by RBs. Benching a lot doesn't mean you are a good power rusheer, and he's shown nothing other than combine #s to indicate he's a power rusher.

#3 - We were told we couldn't draft VY because he was a project. We were told we didn't draft Bush b/c we already had Davis. We were told Williams would help us out right now. So why do we have to wait for him?

Basically, he did little in college against good teams. He had a great combine, and has now shown us zero, zippo, nada on the field. I think we can complain. If it takes us 3 years to coach himinto a probwol player, it was a bad pick. A #1 overall DE should be NFL ready in his first year. Look at Peppers, Freeney, Rice, etc's numbers.

QFT. Quoted For Truth.

Bottom line is that Bush came off as arrogant to McNair and arrogant let his pride get in the way of common sense...thus he wasn't picked...then Vince was never even an option because they didn't want to hurt Carr's feelings and were happy with Carr. Mario looks like a truly horrible pick right now but lets give the guy the rest of the year before we pass judgement on him...

doug from the woodlands

powerfuldragon
09-26-2006, 11:10 AM
How can he all out rush when he's shuffled like a deck in vegas.

El Tejano
09-26-2006, 11:11 AM
We should all be upset that Mario hasn't worked by now. If he had gotten a sack we might be willing to say okay the kid is going to be a player. Truth is though he hasn't held up to the bargain that our staff has asked us to agree with and that is that he makes an immediate impact to our team and makes everyone else better and that he was needed for us to become a better football team.

If you ask me, I would rather lineup anybody else right now in his place because it would be the same difference.

Now to say that we should've drafted Bush, well I don't think Bush would've helped us win those games because in order for him to play our defense has to get on the field. Our defense sucks and Mario has been a contributor to that.

Hulk75
09-26-2006, 11:14 AM
“I was disappointed in his play,” Kubiak said about Williams. “There were some communication issues, and we’ll get it corrected.

“He’d done some good things but not this week. He knows I’m disappointed in his play.” .,...........

Texans_Chick
09-26-2006, 12:07 PM
Lots of stuff in this thread. I think like much on this team, there are valid criticisms and ones that are exaggerated.

"Williams = just a workout warrior":

Mario Williams: 126 solo tackles / 25 1/2 sacks / 55 1/2 tackles for loss

Julius Peppers: 128 solo tackles / 30 1/2 sacks / 53 tackles for loss

Their junior stats are pretty similar too:

Mario Williams: 62 tackles, 14.5 sacks, 2 forced fumbles, 1 blocked kick, 1 safety, 4 fumble recoveries, 27.5 tackles for loss

Julius Peppers: 63 tackles, 9.5 sacks, 1 forced fumble and 3 interceptions, including one returned for a touchdown.

Williams stats come as a true junior, and Peppers stats come as a redshirt junior.


I don't know whether Williams will be a great player or not, but the coaches need to figure out how to put all the players in positions to help them succeed.

Kubiak has eluded to stuff being too confusing to a lot of the defense, and ultimately, as a player if you are thinking too much and not just playing, you won't be able to succeed.

Let's just say that there is nothing in the track record of Richard Smith that inspires confidence that he knows the right way to develop players or scheme stuff. It is hard not to think of him as a big cheeseball (http://nfl.aolsportsblog.com/2006/08/25/the-texans-defense-got-rocks-in-their-lockers/).

And I have read enough Kubiak/Shanahan stuff to know that it is a good sign if he accurately describes a player's play when asked about it. If he stops talking about you or if he reaches to say something nice, then that is bad.

Like saying nice stuff during the Kubiak show about Thomas Johnson after he blew it on the unnecessary roughness call--"It is on us to make sure he knows the rules in that situation."

He has also said how he needs for Mario to play better sooner. Why? Because it is not like he is being added to a probowl line. We spend money on the line, but the Texans offense line used to be the most expensive one in the league too.

People see what they want to see with Maria, or Sorryio, or whatever pejorative you want to use for a player in his 3rd game in the league.

My view: he's young, it's his third game, he has mostly young guys on the line with him (with exception of Weaver), and he has Richard Smith has his defensive coordinator. You can see those as making excuses, or you can see as just what the reality is.

eriadoc
09-26-2006, 12:10 PM
Mario looks like a truly horrible pick right now but lets give the guy the rest of the year before we pass judgement on him...

doug from the woodlands

I definitely agree. I believe every player should have final judgment passed after their rookie season. If we fans deem Mario a bust after his rookie year, maybe we can demand that McNair cut him outright.

Vinny
09-26-2006, 12:13 PM
Don't worry Comrades...the Texans are installing jammers so that the Dolphins don't confuse Mario with triple team holograms. Comrade Mario should have big week!

Blake
09-26-2006, 12:14 PM
Im breaking out the new Avatar from [Seeing Red] for Mario to get his first sack/forced fumble. 2nd Quarter, Culpepper is going down, and losing the ball via Mario Williams. Mark it down.

EVERYONE GET UP!!!

Mr teX
09-26-2006, 01:49 PM
Good point but some of these players weren't the 1st overall Selection i would venture to say none of the players above are the 1st overall selection of there draft class. i would even go as far as to say some of the names on this list might even be third 2nd to 3rd Rounders.

You guys place way too much emphasis on the # 1 overall selection thing. If he turns out to be a bust, he won't be the 1st & surely won't be the last (Especially for this franchise). Though not many, other teams had him as the best player over Bush, Young & Lienart. Plus, every 1st round selection is expected to make an impact with the exception of the super bowl winner's that year. So if we had taken him 5th or 20th overall what would you guys be saying?

In addition, many here wanted to take Young 1st overall, & he is considered a project much like Mario by almost every team, If Williams had not come out & we took Vince would you guys still be saying "you shouldn't take a player that is a project that high overall." It's time to stop all the arm-chair GM stuff.:wild:

TheOgre
09-26-2006, 01:55 PM
Kubiak has eluded to stuff being too confusing to a lot of the defense, and ultimately, as a player if you are thinking too much and not just playing, you won't be able to succeed.


That can be a contributing factor. I experienced that by having 3 HC's during high school. Needless to say, it was a bit confusing. When you are not 100% sure what you are supposed to do on a given play, it makes you tentative. I see that in Mario Williams right now. I think he is in his head too much.

TheOgre
09-26-2006, 01:57 PM
Don't worry Comrades...the Texans are installing jammers so that the Dolphins don't confuse Mario with triple team holograms. Comrade Mario should have big week!

The Dolphins will counter that by having subterranean beams sent from the core of the Earth (it is new Chinese technology).

kastofsna
09-26-2006, 02:01 PM
while i agree you should feel free to bash whoever is on your team, i also think you have to take into consideration that he IS a rookie and that he never had great technique to begin with, so it'll take some time to get it all sorted out.

btw, as the resident dolphins fan, i have a huge feeling that he's going to get it "sorted out" this week. because the dolphins are notorious for allowing rookies and other players of the like have huge games. it's what we do! plus our line blows and culpepper is really slow.

Vinny
09-26-2006, 02:04 PM
You guys place way too much emphasis on the # 1 overall selection thing. If he turns out to be a bust, he won't be the 1st & surely won't be the last (Especially for this franchise). Teams that pay 60 mil to rookies in the cap era over and over just to have them play like average players generally end up bad teams.

HOU-TEX
09-26-2006, 02:07 PM
while i agree you should feel free to bash whoever is on your team, i also think you have to take into consideration that he IS a rookie and that he never had great technique to begin with, so it'll take some time to get it all sorted out.

btw, as the resident dolphins fan, i have a huge feeling that he's going to get it "sorted out" this week. because the dolphins are notorious for allowing rookies and other players of the like have huge games. it's what we do! plus our line blows and culpepper is really slow.

Well then it should be a nice match up. The way our defense is allowing QBs to have player of the week type games, things might even out to provide a decent game.:redtowel:

kastofsna
09-26-2006, 02:08 PM
Well then it should be a nice match up. The way our defense is allowing QBs to have player of the week type games, things might even out to provide a decent game.:redtowel:
i'm fully expecting culpepper to complete his first 23 passes.

HOU-TEX
09-26-2006, 02:15 PM
i'm fully expecting culpepper to complete his first 23 passes.

LOL! Well I hope not, but the way things have been going I'm not going to exclude the possibility.:yikes:

Hulk75
09-26-2006, 02:23 PM
Teams that pay 60 mil to rookies in the cap era over and over just to have them play like average players generally end up bad teams.

Wow.Simply Amazing.

Mr teX
09-26-2006, 02:30 PM
Teams that pay 60 mil to rookies in the cap era over and over just to have them play like average players generally end up bad teams.

That is true, but the point i was trying to make is that people on this board when confronted with comparative stats on how other DE's played through there rookie year always come back with "so in so wasn't the # 1 overall pick" & neglect the fact that there is no guarantee in drafts. Just cause (insert player name here) dominated in College from the jump doesn't mean he will in the NFL. Everyone remembers players like Curtis Ennis, Tim Biakabutuka, Eric Metcalf (Reggie Bush?) & Hershcel Walker. They were sureto dominate in the NFL too, & well look what happened to them. Heck, one of the Greatest DE's to ever play only had what 6.5 sacks his rookie year (Bruce Smith)?

Vinny
09-26-2006, 02:31 PM
It's not amazing...it's mathematics. No unlimited cap mean you can't waste your money on average.

abigfan
09-26-2006, 02:33 PM
Shun Merrimon, Demarcus Ware of the Cowboys, and a few others were rookies, and they did well their first year. Mario only had one move when he was in college, and being one dimesional isn't good.

Porky
09-26-2006, 02:59 PM
I agree totally with Vinny. And BTW, Hershel Walker was not avg. :ok:

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 03:10 PM
while i agree you should feel free to bash whoever is on your team, i also think you have to take into consideration that he IS a rookie and that he never had great technique to begin with, so it'll take some time to get it all sorted out.

btw, as the resident dolphins fan, i have a huge feeling that he's going to get it "sorted out" this week. because the dolphins are notorious for allowing rookies and other players of the like have huge games. it's what we do! plus our line blows and culpepper is really slow.

Houston vs Miami, will most likely be a repeat of Washington @ Houston. A poor offense vs a poor defense usually goes the way of the offense. Hint... use a lot of screen passes.
An avg offense who keeps getting in their own way vs a veteran above avg defense doesn't bode well for the offensive team.


There will be plenty of seats available, try eBay or something.... don't settle for seats outside the 30s....

kastofsna
09-26-2006, 03:13 PM
lol @ screen passes. i don't think we've run a single one this year, despite it being obvious that we need to do such a thing. mularkey is a moron.

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 03:16 PM
lol @ screen passes. i don't think we've run a single one this year, despite it being obvious that we need to do such a thing. mularkey is a moron.

I'll bet you money RichardSmith is an even bigger Moron.

Bring the screen.. I gaurantee you 500 yards of total offense.

kingh99
09-26-2006, 03:18 PM
Now to say that we should've drafted Bush, well I don't think Bush would've helped us win those games because in order for him to play our defense has to get on the field. Our defense sucks and Mario has been a contributor to that.

Bush was a big tent problem for McNair. McNair isn't secure enough to accept a guy like Bush at this time. The fact that the offense can't convert on 3rd down has a lot to do with how the defense is performing. I bought season tickets 2 days before the draft expecting Bush this year. I feel like I got royally screwed by McNair. Royally. Was willing to watch a work in progress for the chance to see Bush break one. Now he isn't tearing it up but his team is 3-0. Scoreboard.

kastofsna
09-26-2006, 03:19 PM
I'll bet you money RichardSmith is an even bigger Moron.

Bring the screen.. I gaurantee you 500 yards of total offense.
well that's the problem: it'll WORK. so we won't use it. it's as simple as that.

kingh99
09-26-2006, 03:19 PM
lol @ screen passes. i don't think we've run a single one this year, despite it being obvious that we need to do such a thing. mularkey is a moron.

?? I saw a couple last Sunday.

Runner
09-26-2006, 03:30 PM
We had some pretty effective screens in the dreaded pre-season.

kastofsna
09-26-2006, 03:31 PM
?? I saw a couple last Sunday.
i didn't. what game were you watching?

Mr teX
09-26-2006, 03:40 PM
I agree totally with Vinny. And BTW, Hershel Walker was not avg. :ok:

Let's put it this way, He was expected to do waaaaaYYY more than he did. Maybe not avg. slightly better than average. only 2 1000 yd. rushing seasons & 2 relatively decent years recieving for a guy who came out with as much hype as Reggie Bush? Add in the fact that he was garbage in the post season & was eventually traded for the early 90's Dallas dynasty? I'm sorry but I can't agree; At least give Mario a season before you label him as a bust The statement you made above is a joke.

Stros5Texans80
09-26-2006, 04:08 PM
Hey after watching that Saints/Falcons game, they beat a NFC Championship caliber team. I know they were playing with more emotions due to the location and what has happened there, but they completely DOMINATED that game.

joetexan
09-26-2006, 07:37 PM
The Saints dominated in no small part because of the distraction created by defenses focusing on Reggie. The ESPN crew last night spotlighed examples of this during the game last night. His capabilities as a home run hitter are enough to open up the entire offense, and you saw last night how good it looked.

Plus, there were a couple of plays when a hole opened up, and BAM - Bush was through it for 10 yards before you could blink. Granted, he did not score on two straight carries near the goal line, but other than that, he did impact that game and also did so without touching the ball.

Mario, on the other hand...heck, it seems the offenses are focusing their stuff TOWARD him, knowing that (a) he can be blocked by a tight end or fullback, or (b) he can be easily faked. He has not shown himself to be strong or quick.

As an aside - If Mario wishes to address the media, maybe he could take some blame instead of making stupid excuses like "I was double and triple teamed all day" (which is a flat out lie). If he doesn't play big Sunday - really big - look out; the bottom will fall out and even those who still defend him will be doubting.

Double Barrel
09-26-2006, 07:56 PM
He does gather double teams on almost every play, which SHOULD open up things for the other players on defense.

This, my friend, is an urban legend. Mario may even believe that he's getting double- and triple-teamed, but the reality is that he is not good enough right now for teams to have to consistently do that to him.

Go to the game, and disregard the play while you specifically watch Mario with binoculars. Trust me. It is quite the revealing sight...he has yet to beat his man in three games.

I'm not going to dog Mario and call bust...at least not at this point in time. Yeah, he's a rookie, playing for a horrible d-coordinator, with a squad full of mediocre, untested talent...

BUT, I'd like to see at least ONE PLAY in a game where you can say to yourself, "wow, now that's why they picked him first overall in the draft". I'm looking, hoping, waiting, to see that one revealing play. Trust me, I want to see it, I yearn to see it, I ask the football gods to see it...so I'll be patient and give the man 16 regular season games.

We shall see... [to be continued in January]

Texan1
09-26-2006, 08:05 PM
Mario hasn't played like an NFL caliber player, regardless of age or what round he was drafted.

He was drafted #1 overall, so he plays every down. So you have a player - who should not be on the field - playing every down. Fans have a right to complain.

Vinny
09-26-2006, 08:15 PM
This, my friend, is an urban legend. Mario may even believe that he's getting double- and triple-teamed, but the reality is that he is not good enough right now for teams to have to consistently do that to him.

Go to the game, and disregard the play while you specifically watch Mario with binoculars. Trust me. It is quite the revealing sight...he has yet to beat his man in three games. [queue theme music from the Mother Country] Comrade, the Washington Capitalist pigs were sending in holograms of extra blockers to confuse Comrade Williams. He was triple and quadruple teamed on some plays. The Mother Franchise has installed jammers so that they do not confuse Comrade Williams any more.

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 08:25 PM
The Saints dominated in no small part because of the distraction created by defenses focusing on Reggie. The ESPN crew last night spotlighed examples of this during the game last night. His capabilities as a home run hitter are enough to open up the entire offense, and you saw last night how good it looked.


I'm sorry, but that is not the way it happened. They didn't give him any more attention than they would give any other player in a skilled position. 1 man tackeled him behind the line of scrimmage. His coach was yelling at him on the sideline for dancing & not running, for not knowing where he was on the field, and not getting a 3rd down conversion.

The Falcons didn't get caught in any mismatches, they covered him with a linebacker when he left the backfield as a reciever.

The first guy to touch him tackled him on every occassion. whether it was a DT, a DE, a LB, or a DB...... & I believe he is credited with a sack.... I know he blew a blocking assignment miserably, but I'm not sure if it led to a sack.. I think it did..... could be wrong.

So far, Reggie is not a threat anymore than anyone, and there doesn't appear to be any special attention afforded to him by anyone who doesn't work for ESPN.

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 08:33 PM
Go to the game, and disregard the play while you specifically watch Mario with binoculars. Trust me. It is quite the revealing sight...he has yet to beat his man in three games.


What did it look(through the Binoculars) like where he terribly beat #76 who was called for a hold??

During the Philly game, when he got into the backfield & chased McNabb from the pocket, how'd that look in the ole binoculars??

How'd he look when he grabbed Westbrook & brought him down with one hand??

mean mark8
09-26-2006, 10:02 PM
How'd he look as he gets suckered inside on every play they pitch around him? How'd he look when he had contain on Brunel and couldn't catch him on a rollout? I thought the guy had 4.7 speed but I have yet to see him run anything down. When a play goes away from him, he stops. He goes half speed a lot. Maybe it's because he's winded or maybe it's because he already has $26 million in the bank nobody can touch. What's to learn playing on the defensive line? You find the ball, throw your blocker aside, and tackle the guy with the ball. If you go all out on every play, like Ryans or Robinson, you make a lot of tackles. If your heart isn't in it, you claim you're getting "double" or "triple" teamed on plays. Does he really think we can't see he's getting handled one-on-one? He gets handled without anyone blocking him; just fake the ball one way and pitch outside of him the other. Babin will keep chasing the carrier, Williams will become a spectator.

Mr teX
09-26-2006, 10:03 PM
I'm sorry, but that is not the way it happened. They didn't give him any more attention than they would give any other player in a skilled position. 1 man tackeled him behind the line of scrimmage. His coach was yelling at him on the sideline for dancing & not running, for not knowing where he was on the field, and not getting a 3rd down conversion.

Yeah, that's basically how i saw it. Theisman & company were trying to make it look like they were paying extra attention to him on that reverse & in reality they just defended it like every other team would have. I watched the 1st half of that game & IMO the only real asset of RB is his speed; everything else he has/does is just average at best. His cutback running style is not going to cut it in the NFL, he's going to have to change that period. You could see it in the game, every time he got the ball he tried to bust it outside before he even hit the hole. This is coming from someone who wanted the Texans to draft him.

mean mark8
09-26-2006, 10:08 PM
If this leaning towards a Reggie Bush thread, we already know from Vernand Morency, Reggie Bush is not Kubiak's style of runner. Kubiak wants one cut and go. My take is, he wouldn't have had Barry Sanders on his team either.

thunderkyss
09-26-2006, 11:01 PM
How'd he look as he gets suckered inside on every play they pitch around him? How'd he look when he had contain on Brunel and couldn't catch him on a rollout? I thought the guy had 4.7 speed but I have yet to see him run anything down. When a play goes away from him, he stops. He goes half speed a lot. Maybe it's because he's winded or maybe it's because he already has $26 million in the bank nobody can touch. What's to learn playing on the defensive line? You find the ball, throw your blocker aside, and tackle the guy with the ball. If you go all out on every play, like Ryans or Robinson, you make a lot of tackles. If your heart isn't in it, you claim you're getting "double" or "triple" teamed on plays. Does he really think we can't see he's getting handled one-on-one? He gets handled without anyone blocking him; just fake the ball one way and pitch outside of him the other. Babin will keep chasing the carrier, Williams will become a spectator.

you didn't see him run down JAddai against INdy??

Robinson is has been our worst DB in the last three games.


He looks like a rookie... yes. He is a rookie.

joetexan
09-26-2006, 11:12 PM
Sorry, but if you guys didn't see the Atlanta defense keying on Bush, you guys weren't watching closely. Most of the game reports (multiple sources) mention it as well.

shadowdrinker_x
09-26-2006, 11:14 PM
Yeah. You're right. We should fire the coach, his staff, the GM, and cut about 20-25 players.

That's exactly what New Orleans did, minus firing the GM...

Mario might become better, but not until there is some really good talent around him...which is true for most players in the NFL.

But, I can say that the Texans screwed the pooch by passing on Bush...Money was not the issue, because they paid Mario quite well, and the Saints had a high priced RB allready too.

Bush hasn't produced eye popping numbers, but what he has done is force toerh teams to actually gameplan for the saints offense...something we haven't been making teams do for quite a while...We use Bush as a decoy most of the time, and it works like a charm, plus the revamped Defene is helping a bucnh too.

But, yeah..Williams was not a #1 overall pick...the Saints have done that sort of thing many, many times...now..the Texans are doing it...thankfully, we were right behind you guys.

southtexan
09-27-2006, 06:52 AM
I don't understand the infatuation with Bush and the Saints. If you're a Texans fan why should you care about the Saints and Bush? I know....we could've selected Bush but guess what, we didn't. I'm as frustrated as most of you but the ONLY choice that I've is to be patient and wait for this team to turn the corner.

Heywood
09-27-2006, 09:41 AM
That's exactly what New Orleans did, minus firing the GM...

Mario might become better, but not until there is some really good talent around him...which is true for most players in the NFL.

But, I can say that the Texans screwed the pooch by passing on Bush...Money was not the issue, because they paid Mario quite well, and the Saints had a high priced RB allready too.

Bush hasn't produced eye popping numbers, but what he has done is force toerh teams to actually gameplan for the saints offense...something we haven't been making teams do for quite a while...We use Bush as a decoy most of the time, and it works like a charm, plus the revamped Defene is helping a bucnh too.

But, yeah..Williams was not a #1 overall pick...the Saints have done that sort of thing many, many times...now..the Texans are doing it...thankfully, we were right behind you guys.

at market prices, yours reggie bush for size. the NFL is a different game and he can't just outrun everybody. you should get down on your knees and be grateful deuce is such a marvel to come back from the injuries he's had.

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 09:50 AM
They don't understand that Gameplanning for players is not new in the NFL Battlered. They think that because Reggie Bush is on the field they are moving the ball b/c teams are keying on him & him alone. Joe Horn, Drew Brees & Duece McCallister are scrubs & haven't proven that they can play on the NFL level. I got news for you guys, the longest run play from scrimmage (duece 18 yds 2nd Qtr.) in that game bush wasn't even in the game.

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 09:56 AM
Bush hasn't produced eye popping numbers, but what he has done is force toerh teams to actually gameplan for the saints offense...something we haven't been making teams do for quite a while...We use Bush as a decoy most of the time, and it works like a charm, plus the revamped Defene is helping a bucnh too.

That's crap, The Saints now have what is called a capable QB & coach. You really think that If Brooks & haslett were still there they'd still be this solid offensively. Plus you're telling me that you paid him 62 mil just to be a decoy? I'm not buying it.

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 09:58 AM
All this decoy talk is overrated. Any offensive skill player who doesn't get the ball is a decoy.

real
09-27-2006, 10:01 AM
Bush hasn't produced eye popping numbers, but what he has done is force toerh teams to actually gameplan for the saints offense...something we haven't been making teams do for quite a while...We use Bush as a decoy most of the time, and it works like a charm, plus the revamped Defene is helping a bucnh too.

That's crap, The Saints now have what is called a capable QB & coach. You really think that If Brooks & haslett were still there they'd still be this solid offensively. Plus you're telling me that you paid him 62 mil just to be a decoy? I'm not buying it.

Are you trying to imply that having Reggie on the field doesn't make them more successful ?

done88
09-27-2006, 10:02 AM
Is this post aimed at Kubiack becasue he did some Mario bashing of his own. Mario needs to be a man and start hitting somebody. This patty cake he plays with the offense line of the other team has to stop.

real
09-27-2006, 10:07 AM
The Saints might be a good team without Reggie Bush, but he makes them better...period...

But what is that saying??? A lot of teams would be good with a player missing here, or there ? The Eagles were good before T.O...When he came he took them to another level....

Not saying RB is T.O status, but he definitely has to be accounted for and paid close attention to when he's on the field...And if you deny that you are lying to yourself...

I can't think of any other Rookie who is keyed on like RB is...

real
09-27-2006, 10:09 AM
All this decoy talk is overrated. Any offensive skill player who doesn't get the ball is a decoy.

lol...ok...so now you're saying that Randy Moss and Mark Bruener pose the same threat??? Terrell owens and Jabar Gafney would both command the same respect ?? How about a play fake to Ladanian vs. a play fake to Tony Hollings...The decoy talk is not overrated...The more of a threat a player is...The more attention he draws...And for RB to be drawing as much attention as he is as a rookie...shows that D.coordinators and players obviously disagree with your opinion...

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 10:14 AM
Let's call it what it is. The decoy talk is a built-in excuse for when he doesn't put up numbers.

Which he didn't.

real
09-27-2006, 10:25 AM
Let's call it what it is. The decoy talk is a built-in excuse for when he doesn't put up numbers.

Which he didn't.

Some may use it as an exscuse...Or you may just be paranoid....

Fact still remains....He is definitely keyed on...and draws more attention than any other rookie...

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 10:25 AM
The Saints might be a good team without Reggie Bush, but he makes them better...period...

But what is that saying??? A lot of teams would be good with a player missing here, or there ? The Eagles were good before T.O...When he came he took them to another level....

Not saying RB is T.O status, but he definitely has to be accounted for and paid close attention to when he's on the field...And if you deny that you are lying to yourself...

I can't think of any other Rookie who is keyed on like RB is...

But Reggie hasn't contributed like T.O. did. He had as many TDs as the rest of the team.... combined.

So far Reggie's can't punch it in from the two Yard line. He's an avg reciever...... we'd be bashing Gaffney for those kinds of numbers..... and a poor runningback.... 5 yards on 6 carries against GB.....

& how can you say he is being Keyed on, when there is only one guy covering him(a Linebacker at times....), who tackles him 100% of the time...

lol...ok...so now you're saying that Randy Moss and Mark Bruener pose the same threat??? Terrell owens and Jabar Gafney would both command the same respect ?? How about a play fake to Ladanian vs. a play fake to Tony Hollings...The decoy talk is not overrated...The more of a threat a player is...The more attention he draws...And for RB to be drawing as much attention as he is as a rookie...shows that D.coordinators and players obviously disagree with your opinion...

JAddai gets as much play on a playfake as Reggie does...... it's more about how the QB sells it, than who the RB is.

joetexan
09-27-2006, 10:27 AM
Again, for crying out loud - go watch the game tape. The Falcons keyed on Bush on several plays and it opened up the offense for the Saints to use Deuce/Colston/Horn/Henderson. It's not an "excuse", it's the obvious truth. :brickwall

Runner
09-27-2006, 10:34 AM
Again, for crying out loud - go watch the game tape. The Falcons keyed on Bush on several plays and it opened up the offense for the Saints to use Deuce/Colston/Horn/Henderson. It's not an "excuse", it's the obvious truth.

It is true, and kind of weird. Bush was doubled a couple of times when he went out for passes and the other receivers were left in single coverage. Joe Horn and their other receivers aren't chopped liver - they deserve some respect too.

The weird part is that they double the guy who hasn't done a whole lot yet as a pro. It looks like he is getting too much respect based on potential. I guess defensive coordinators either see something their or are as susceptible to hype as anyone else.

Vinny
09-27-2006, 10:35 AM
The weird part is that they double the guy who hasn't done a whole lot yet as a pro. It looks like he is getting too much respect based on potential. Bush leads the NFL in receptions as a RB so I hear.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/playersort/NFL/RB-RECEIVING/2006/regular

real
09-27-2006, 10:37 AM
But Reggie hasn't contributed like T.O. did. He had as many TDs as the rest of the team.... combined.
So far Reggie's can't punch it in from the two Yard line. He's an avg reciever...... we'd be bashing Gaffney for those kinds of numbers..... and a poor runningback.... 5 yards on 6 carries against GB.....
& how can you say he is being Keyed on, when there is only one guy covering him(a Linebacker at times....), who tackles him 100% of the time...

No...He hasn't contributed like T.O...but that's besides the point...I was just pointing out how one player can make a difference...And if you are trying to lead me to believe that the first guy is always tackling him...then I have this for you........:pigfly:

JAddai gets as much play on a playfake as Reggie does...... it's more about how the QB sells it, than who the RB is.

I don't buy that....This is just one of those things we'll have to agree to disagree about...The reason I don't think this is true is because veterans revel in the fact that they have just made a tackle on "the great" Reggie Bush...Like they are trying to prove to him that this isn't college anymore...They..as in the players.....know RB is talented...The coaches of opposing teams know he is talented....now for you to try to lead me to believe that he has the same clout as Joseph Adaai is sickening...We are the same ones who said Mario wasn't playing as well as he could because "he was moving around the line"...LMAO....Well imagine how many different things RB had to learn...KR,PR,WR,RB......And just WR and RB is a load....

He IS being focused on by defenses...Something other rookies don't have the pressure of...

He did have to learn a lot of plays for different positions....

And you're saying he's not a great RB or WR at this point....How come it's wait and see with Mario but judge Reggie now....who by the way has made more of an impact than Mario ????? :tease:

Runner
09-27-2006, 10:37 AM
Bush leads the NFL in receptions as a RB so I hear.

I haven't watched his stats that closely. Interesting.

However, how does he compare to receivers when lined up as a receiver? Those are the plays where I'm not sure he warrants the double team - yet.

real
09-27-2006, 10:40 AM
It is true, and kind of weird. Bush was doubled a couple of times when he went out for passes and the other receivers were left in single coverage. Joe Horn and their other receivers aren't chopped liver - they deserve some respect too.

The weird part is that they double the guy who hasn't done a whole lot yet as a pro. It looks like he is getting too much respect based on potential. I guess defensive coordinators either see something their or are as susceptible to hype as anyone else.


Exactly.....They may be showing him more respect than he deserves at this point...and I think thats really why the Saints are winning...and at the same time all the attention is keeping him from getting off, but letting everyone else do their thing....

edit: before I'm misunderstood...Reggie isn't the reason WHY they are winning but I think he is part of it...

Vinny
09-27-2006, 10:41 AM
I haven't watched his stats that closely. Interesting.

However, how does he compare to receivers when lined up as a receiver? Those are the plays where I'm not sure he warrants the double team - yet.I donno. Dogging Reggie or Vince or whomever because Mario has been a colossal disappointment is something I'm not interested in doing....homers do it though. Bush leads the NFL in receptions as a back after week 3 and Mario has yet to pressure the QB in the regular season or preseason. Let's just call it what it is and stop the Bush sucks propaganda...It makes us look stupid as a fan base. Not directing that at you...just what I'm thinking in general.

real
09-27-2006, 10:45 AM
I donno. Dogging Reggie or Vince or whomever because Mario has been a colossal disappointment is something I'm not interested in doing....homers do it though. Bush leads the NFL in receptions as a back after week 3 and Mario has yet to pressure the QB in the regular season or preseason. Let's just call it what it is and stop the Bush sucks propaganda...It makes us look stupid as a fan base. Not directing that at you...just what I'm thinking in general.

I absolutely agree.

srstex
09-27-2006, 10:49 AM
I don't know how Bush affects us, but our D needs all the help it can get. We have given up 98 points in 3 games, and the Giants have given up just 6 less with 92. So if ya'll want to draw comparisons let's talk D to D, the Giants have Stahan and the other DE, I can't spell or pronounce, that had over 20 sacks last year.So what's their excuse ? Can't be that they drafted Williams we did that. Let's look at the fact that maybe we were in need of more leadership at defense then we thought and Kubiak saw this, we brought in Weaver ( 1 sack ) & Kalu kept Babin ( 1 sack ) & Peek, and to have a successful outside rush you need a big man to plug the middle - Payne ? Obviously our choices at LB were, outside of Ryans, not the best, but if Wong comes back healthy we can field Wong-Ryans-Orr and I think that will help tremendously.
And if you still need a Bush fix, NO needs a winner as bad as us ,we shouldn't hate our nieghbors because they made a decision we decided not to.

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 10:53 AM
The Saints might be a good team without Reggie Bush, but he makes them better...

Well of course he makes them better, any player with his speed & catching ability makes them better in the position Bush is in. What i'm saying is that he has done nothing that suggests he will be any better than a Westbrook or any other pass catching RB with pretty good speed (Chad Morton, Laurence Maroney, Deangelo Williams anyone.) Right now Brees is making more of an impact than Bush is as far as Offseason acquistions b/c Brees is making smart decisions with the ball & not turning it over. & I don't want to misunderstood, I think the kid is good & will have a solid career, my statement was just in reference to the Homers who are already measuring his forehead for his bust in Canton.

run-david-run
09-27-2006, 10:53 AM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice
And im sure that 3-0 record is a direct result of Reggie's 3.5 ypc average and 0 TD's. It couldnt have anything to do with the fact the Saints were 8-8 the year before Katrina finally have Deuce McAllister healthy and have acctually added a decent QB...nope, that cant be it.

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 10:54 AM
Every "Mario sucks" thread is usually a "We should have drafted Reggie thread" in disguise.

I'm of the opinion that Reggie Bush should be judged by the same standard as Mario Williams.

If MW should be getting sacks by now, then why shouldn't RB be scoring TD's yet?

real
09-27-2006, 10:59 AM
The Saints might be a good team without Reggie Bush, but he makes them better...

Well of course he makes them better, any player with his speed & catching ability makes them better in the position Bush is in. What i'm saying is that he has done nothing that suggests he will be any better than a Westbrook or any other pass catching RB with pretty good speed (Chad Morton, Laurence Maroney, Deangelo Williams anyone.) Right now Brees is making more of an impact than Bush is as far as Offseason acquistions b/c Brees is making smart decisions with the ball & not turning it over.

So do you judge every rookie after 3 games or just Reggie Bush ??? thats the real question....How do you know what any players career will lookk like 7 or 8 years from now ?? And I don't think any one said RB is making more of an impact than Horn, Duece, or Brees...And none of those other rookies are under as much scrutiny as RB....and He's not just a "pass catching RB"...He actually plays reciever....

Vinny
09-27-2006, 11:01 AM
If MW should be getting sacks by now, then why shouldn't RB be scoring TD's yet?
I feel sorry for all you fans that quantify players with stats and can't see past that or perhaps don't watch many games. It's clear to see how Bush affects a defense and it's just as clear to see how Mario doesn't affect an offense.

real
09-27-2006, 11:03 AM
Every "Mario sucks" thread is usually a "We should have drafted Reggie thread" in disguise.

I'm of the opinion that Reggie Bush should be judged by the same standard as Mario Williams.

If MW should be getting sacks by now, then why shouldn't RB be scoring TD's yet?

How on earth can you say a TD=Sack....How does that compute???...whats the formula???...How can you even compare stats from an offensive player to a defensive player....get off of the stats thing...we are talking about impact...

real
09-27-2006, 11:04 AM
I feel sorry for all you fans that quantify players with stats and can't see past that or perhaps don't watch many games. It's clear to see how Bush affects a defense and it's just as clear to see how Mario doesn't affect an offense.

wow...I wish I'd have said that...

Vinny
09-27-2006, 11:06 AM
So do you judge every rookie after 3 games or just Reggie Bush ??? thats the real question....How do you know what any players career will lookk like 7 or 8 years from now ?? Carson Palmer and Steve McNair didn't even play their first years. At that pace no way they would ever be good /sarcasm.....once they hit the field you could see what the hype was all about.

Double Barrel
09-27-2006, 11:07 AM
What did it look(through the Binoculars) like where he terribly beat #76 who was called for a hold??

During the Philly game, when he got into the backfield & chased McNabb from the pocket, how'd that look in the ole binoculars??

How'd he look when he grabbed Westbrook & brought him down with one hand??

That's quite the list of impressive plays you've compiled there.... :ok: Took a whole three games, too!

I take it that you're not at the game giving Mario's playing time your undivided attention? Or you would not be touting such an uninformed opinion.

Give the guy time, he's a rookie, yada yada yada...how about ONE play where he DOMINATES as the FIRST OVERALL PICK? idonno:

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 11:13 AM
So do you judge every rookie after 3 games or just Reggie Bush ??? thats the real question....How do you know what any players career will lookk like 7 or 8 years from now ?? And I don't think any one said RB is making more of an impact than Horn, Duece, or Brees...And none of those other rookies are under as much scrutiny as RB....and He's not just a "pass catching RB"...He actually plays reciever....


No I don't & you just made my point. You have guys in here already declaring Williams a bust & he should be doing this & that & all of that is just crazy when he's only played 3 games. And as far as the bolded, By the way some people in here are talking, RB is the reason they are 3-0 conviently negelecting the addition of brees & the return of duece & the stellar play of the D. & maybe none of the other rooks aren't under as much scrutiny as RB, but alot of the scrutiny is not b/c of his actual play, but b/c of the controversy around NO & his alleged NCAA violations. & the last part What is he listed as?

Runner
09-27-2006, 11:15 AM
Not directing that at you...just what I'm thinking in general.

I know you aren't. I'm obviously not a Bush sucks propagandist.

I jumped into the end of this thread without reading it all. I had noticed Bush being doubled during the game and just wondered why.

real
09-27-2006, 11:15 AM
What I don't understand is how people can actually watch MW play...then watch RB play.....Then say RB sucks, and we definitely got the better man...honestly that is yet to be determined....At this point I can't say i know either one will be super stars...But I can say that I have been more impressed with RB...and thats without rewatching him on film...

Why are we constantly reminded that Mario came out as a Junior.....was Reggie not in the same boat???


Why is Reggie being judged after 3 games??? But Mario is not???

Why does Mario get a pass because he was DT and DE...and Reggie doesn't get the same pass for having to learn PR, KR, RB, WR???

Why can't we just call a spade a spade, and be honest that RB has done more for his team AT THIS POINT than Mario?? What does that mean??? It could mean nothing...or it could mean everything...we don't know....

2ToneBlue
09-27-2006, 11:18 AM
That's quite the list of impressive plays you've compiled there.... :ok: Took a whole three games, too!

I take it that you're not at the game giving Mario's playing time your undivided attention? Or you would not be touting such an uninformed opinion.

Give the guy time, he's a rookie, yada yada yada...how about ONE play where he DOMINATES as the FIRST OVERALL PICK? idonno:
He has 8 tackles on the year :shades: Almost 3 tackles a game average.

real
09-27-2006, 11:20 AM
. And as far as the bolded, By the way some people in here are talking, RB is the reason they are 3-0 conviently negelecting the addition of brees & the return of duece & the stellar play of the D. & maybe none of the other rooks aren't under as much scrutiny as RB, but alot of the scrutiny is not b/c of his actual play, but b/c of the controversy around NO & his alleged NCAA violations. & the last part What is he listed as?

If anyone thinks that they are winning soley BECAUSE of RB, or any one player for that matter is crazy...It's a team game...RB could have 5,000 yards rushing but if he never scores a TD, and the Defense never stops anyone then it goes for naught....

BUT you can not deny that he is definitely PART of the reason they are winning...thats all I'm saying....He has definitely opened things up for others on the offensive side of the ball...

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 11:20 AM
Why can't we just call a spade a spade, and be honest that RB has done more for his team AT THIS POINT than Mario?? What does that mean??? It could mean nothing...or it could mean everything...we don't know....


Well said, the point is its only 3 games & I would venture to say that most rookies even 1st rounders take at least their entire rookie season to adjust to playing ball in the NFL.

Blake
09-27-2006, 11:32 AM
Bush leads the NFL in receptions as a back after week 3 and Mario has yet to pressure the QB in the regular season or preseason. Let's just call it what it is and stop the Bush sucks propaganda

I have no problem with Bush or Vince doing well, but to say that Mario has yet to pressure the QB is a bit silly on your part. I understand you want to make Mario sound as bad as you can, but I know damn well that youve seen him pressure the QB a couple of times this year. If you want to deny that, and just focus on your anti-Mario campaign, then that is fine, but I think you need to be fair.

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 11:40 AM
How on earth can you say a TD=Sack....How does that compute???...whats the formula???...How can you even compare stats from an offensive player to a defensive player....get off of the stats thing...we are talking about impact...

Sounds almost like the same thing I've been saying since week 1 this season. Kind of like comparing football to basketball...or apples to oranges.

I just said they should be judged by the same standard. I never said it was a reasonable standard.

The Texans FO drafted a guy based on raw talent and physical tools. It's up to the coaches now to teach him some technique. It's no secret that he doesn't have any. Was it supposed to just appear magically by his 3rd game as a pro?

real
09-27-2006, 11:44 AM
Sounds almost like the same thing I've been saying since week 1 this season. Kind of like comparing football to basketball...or apples to oranges.

I just said they should be judged by the same standard. I never said it was a reasonable standard.

The Texans FO drafted a guy based on raw talent and physical tools. It's up to the coaches now to teach him some technique. It's no secret that he doesn't have any. Was it supposed to just appear magically by his 3rd game as a pro?

Right...So what is the argument......Mario Williams isn't very good right now...the end....

Vinny
09-27-2006, 11:47 AM
The Texans FO drafted a guy based on raw talent and physical tools. It's up to the coaches now to teach him some technique. It's no secret that he doesn't have any. Was it supposed to just appear magically by his 3rd game as a pro?
Raw talent and physical tools? Sounds like David Carr. 60 games later we should expect average production then I guess. That puts us around what...2010?

HomeBred_Texan
09-27-2006, 11:54 AM
I have no problem with Bush or Vince doing well, but to say that Mario has yet to pressure the QB is a bit silly on your part. I understand you want to make Mario sound as bad as you can, but I know damn well that youve seen him pressure the QB a couple of times this year. If you want to deny that, and just focus on your anti-Mario campaign, then that is fine, but I think you need to be fair.

Well I haven't missed a game yet, since day 1. But right now we are talking about this season... I have yet to see Mario pressure a QB. I want him to at least grab some jersey, or even get a flag for a late hit. I don't know what game you are watching, but please tell me which game you are referring to. I will re-watch it again because evidently I have missed something...

I am not against this pick nor am I for it. I am not going to bash a player for trying... I wanted D'Brick or D'Angelo Williams or both. Not D players. I don't think he is a bust nor do I think he is great. I won't make that determination until the end of the season along with many others...

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 11:56 AM
Right...So what is the argument......Mario Williams isn't very good right now...the end....

The argument is that it's on the coaches. I think if he was playing for Bill Cowher or John Fox or even Jim Haslett there wouldn't be an issue.

Go back and read some of your own posts and apply them to Mario Williams. Do you really think he'll be getting 2 tackles a game in 7-8 years? Or held up by TE's and RB's in 7-8 years?

Or better yet, keep hoping that he turns out to actually be a bust. Then you can really accomplish something by saying "I told you we should have picked Bush."

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 11:59 AM
Raw talent and physical tools? Sounds like David Carr. 60 games later we should expect average production then I guess. That puts us around what...2010?

Nice point. Carr has a coach that knows QB's now. He's improved. Maybe if they get a decent DC next year, then the same can happen with MW.

real
09-27-2006, 12:01 PM
The argument is that it's on the coaches. I think if he was playing for Bill Cowher or John Fox or even Jim Haslett there wouldn't be an issue.

Go back and read some of your own posts and apply them to Mario Williams. Do you really think he'll be getting 2 tackles a game in 7-8 years? Or held up by TE's and RB's in 7-8 years?

Or better yet, keep hoping that he turns out to actually be a bust. Then you can really accomplish something by saying "I told you we should have picked Bush."

O.k....again....what is your point??? Mario Williams isn't good right now...and hasn't done much in the short time he's been afforded.....the end......Doesn't mean he will be a bust....doesn't mean he'll be great....Im not sure where you are coming from....

P.S. I've never rooted for Mario to be a bust...I would like for Mario to be the best DE ever...do I think that will happen....no.....but I sure would like it...

GP
09-27-2006, 12:04 PM
Every "Mario sucks" thread is usually a "We should have drafted Reggie thread" in disguise.

I'm of the opinion that Reggie Bush should be judged by the same standard as Mario Williams.

If MW should be getting sacks by now, then why shouldn't RB be scoring TD's yet?


Wasn't there TWO big reasons to draft Reggie Bush?

1. He can break a game wide open all by himself. Well, he's not doing that.

2. He can be a decoy and cause others to get the ball more. Well, he IS doing that.

1 out of 2 for Reggie.

I think it's fair to say that the longer RB goes without doing No. 1 (breaking games wide open all by himself) then the less he cements himself as the "can't miss draft pick" that Houston was so "foolish" for looking over.

Being a decoy is fine. It's helping New Orleans at the moment.

But therein lies the drama: When do teams STOP focusing on Bush (the decoy) and thus start shutting down the other players? And if they DO stop focusing on Bush (the decoy) does that signify a switch that gets flipped whereby Bush starts getting those gamebreaking opportunities?

Should be interesting to watch.

I, for one, do not think that RB would even be a good decoy on our team at the moment. I think he would not even be effective as a decoy because we're just an awful team all the way around at the moment. I think he would be stinking worse with us, and I actually think Mario would be "cashing it in" in New Orleans if the situations were reversed.

Think about that: Let's play make-believe and replay the draft and switch picks. Reggie comes to us and he is less than what he is NOW with New orleans, and Mario goes to New Orleans and gets a couple sacks against Vick on Monday Night. And guess what? The media slam us for taking "the safe pick" and not the defensive stud Mario Williams whom we so "apparently" needed. And to top it off, we also get blamed for wasting Reggie Bush's talent.

It. Could. Be. Worse. Than. It. Is.

Just thank your stars above that the last scenario I mentioned has not happened. THEN...it would be very hard to stay a Texans fan.

real
09-27-2006, 12:10 PM
Wasn't there TWO big reasons to draft Reggie Bush?

1. He can break a game wide open all by himself. Well, he's not doing that.

2. He can be a decoy and cause others to get the ball more. Well, he IS doing that.

1 out of 2 for Reggie.

I think it's fair to say that the longer RB goes without doing No. 1 (breaking games wide open all by himself) then the less he cements himself as the "can't miss draft pick" that Houston was so "foolish" for looking over.

Being a decoy is fine. It's helping New Orleans at the moment.

But therein lies the drama: When do teams STOP focusing on Bush (the decoy) and thus start shutting down the other players? And if they DO stop focusing on Bush (the decoy) does that signify a switch that gets flipped whereby Bush starts getting those gamebreaking opportunities?

Should be interesting to watch.

I, for one, do not think that RB would even be a good decoy on our team at the moment. I think he would not even be effective as a decoy because we're just an awful team all the way around at the moment. I think he would be stinking worse with us, and I actually think Mario would be "cashing it in" in New Orleans if the situations were reversed.

Think about that: Let's play make-believe and replay the draft and switch picks. Reggie comes to us and he is less than what he is NOW with New orleans, and Mario goes to New Orleans and gets a couple sacks against Vick on Monday Night. And guess what? The media slam us for taking "the safe pick" and not the defensive stud Mario Williams whom we so "apparently" needed. And to top it off, we also get blamed for wasting Reggie Bush's talent.

It. Could. Be. Worse. Than. It. Is.

Just thank your stars above that the last scenario I mentioned has not happened. THEN...it would be very hard to stay a Texans fan.

LMAO!!!

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 12:22 PM
Think about that: Let's play make-believe and replay the draft and switch picks. Reggie comes to us and he is less than what he is NOW with New orleans, and Mario goes to New Orleans and gets a couple sacks against Vick on Monday Night. And guess what? The media slam us for taking "the safe pick" and not the defensive stud Mario Williams whom we so "apparently" needed. And to top it off, we also get blamed for wasting Reggie Bush's talent.

That's what most people don't understand about the media. XtruroyaltyX is right in that Mario just isn't very good right now, but thats not to say he won't be in the future once the talent level comes up around him. The Media is going to roll with the pick that is the most successful, & that right now is RB. Remember, there were 4 potential # 1 overall picks justified in their own right, the most probably ever in a draft. Plus, those clowns are still debating who got the better of the LT/Vick draft & how many years ago was that?

GP
09-27-2006, 12:37 PM
O.k....again....what is your point??? Mario Williams isn't good right now...and hasn't done much in the short time he's been afforded.....the end......Doesn't mean he will be a bust....doesn't mean he'll be great....Im not sure where you are coming from....

P.S. I've never rooted for Mario to be a bust...I would like for Mario to be the best DE ever...do I think that will happen....no.....but I sure would like it...

You would "like it" but you "don't think it will happen" ?

Then you are predisposed to reacting negatively from the very beginning.

You are biased in your comments and thus will only allow yourself to reinforce the predetermined decision you've made that Mario "will not be a success," and in other words you will "back your opinion" by pointing out every failing Mario has and/or will have, and comparing it to every success Reggie has and/or will have. Am I getting this right?

At least drop the "I hope he will" part from your stance. Go ahead and come right on out and be hardcore about your thoughts. Don't leave yourself room to backpedal like the Carr Haters do.

Why can't we just all be honest with ourselves and allow ourselves to understand that our ENTIRE TEAM is awful? Is that too honest?

Instead, I guess we're resorting to building straw men like Carr, and when that fades away...let's build the straw man named "Mario." Build 'em up and burn 'em down.

Who's fault will it be next week? Or next month?

This entire team is awful. They are not playing as a single unit. That's the most difficult aspect to get corrected. When it happens? I don't know. But then we'll all be drinking that free bub-a-lub and eating that rainbow stew.

Let's stop building up Judas Iscariots on our team as the reason why we stink so bad. It's a team "thang" and nothing more or less.

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 12:39 PM
And you're saying he's not a great RB or WR at this point....How come it's wait and see with Mario but judge Reggie now....who by the way has made more of an impact than Mario ????? :tease:

First....... I'm sorry, I meant to put "so far" in there.......
Second..... I'm not as thouroghly(sp) disappointed in the Mario pick...... I still think he warranted the #1 overall pick. I think we are getting pressure on the QB, maybe not enough but certainly as much as we should be expecting.

Just like David Carr is worthy of his #1 overall status but was on a poor offense(with a proBowl WR, and a 1000 yard per year over 3 years productive running back), Mario is on a bad defense............ Period.

We don't expect Carr to make everyone else on the team to look good( I do, most here don't)..... why should we expect Mario to be any different??

Meisterman
09-27-2006, 12:42 PM
What I do know is the last 4 first round draft picks have been used on THE DEFENSE. The results of these decisions speak for themselves. I don't blame any Texan fan for wishing they had an exciting playmaker like Bush.

Remember this organization allowed lame duck Casserly to hang around long enough to be the front man when the Mario pick was made. The vast majority of fans did not want Mario....but like an unexpected pregnancy...you make the best of a bad situation.

GP
09-27-2006, 12:45 PM
What I do know is the last 4 first round draft picks have been used on THE DEFENSE. The results of these decisions speak for themselves. I don't blame any Texan fan for wishing they had an exciting playmaker like Bush.

Remember this organization allowed lame duck Casserly to hang around long enough to be the front man when the Mario pick was made. The vast majority of fans did not want Mario....but like an unexpected pregnancy...you make the best of a bad situation.

Casserly didn't pick Mario.

Casserly was "out" long before the draft, but kept on the staff for obvious reasons: (1) To make Bob McNair look professional, and (2) To not give away to other teams our draft strategy--Not so much our first overal pick, but the direction we would be going with later round picks that we were targeting and did not want other teams to find out about.

Casserly, if anything, wanted Reggie Bush.

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 12:45 PM
I don't know how Bush affects us, but our D needs all the help it can get. We have given up 98 points in 3 games, and the Giants have given up just 6 less with 92. So if ya'll want to draw comparisons let's talk D to D, the Giants have Stahan and the other DE, I can't spell or pronounce, that had over 20 sacks last year.So what's their excuse ? Can't be that they drafted Williams we did that. Let's look at the fact that maybe we were in need of more leadership at defense then we thought and Kubiak saw this, we brought in Weaver ( 1 sack ) & Kalu kept Babin ( 1 sack ) & Peek, and to have a successful outside rush you need a big man to plug the middle - Payne ? Obviously our choices at LB were, outside of Ryans, not the best, but if Wong comes back healthy we can field Wong-Ryans-Orr and I think that will help tremendously.
And if you still need a Bush fix, NO needs a winner as bad as us ,we shouldn't hate our nieghbors because they made a decision we decided not to.

Exactly
Against the Philladelphia Eagles,

Mario had 2 tackles, plus 1 assist..... 2.5 tackles.
Manny Lawson had...... 0 tackles...... .5 assists... 0.5 tackles.

Eagles 38 49ers 24
Eagles 24 Houston 14

McNabb vs the 49ers....... 296 yards 2 TDs 0 Ints
McNabb vs the Texans..... 314 yards 3 TDs 1 Int

Westbrook vs the 49ers.... 8 atts.... 117 yds...... 2 Tds 71 Long Rushing....... 4 catches 47 yards..... 1 TD 27 Long recieving...
Westbrook vs the Texans.... 17 carries 71 yds...... 0 TDs long 17 rushing.... 4 catches 61 yds 1 TD 31 long recieving.

RBrown vs the 49ers...... 5 catches for 106 yds.. 0 TDs 50 long.....
RBrown vs the Texans.... 2 catches for 20 yds.... 1 TD 15 long.....

Stallworth vs the Texans....... 6 catches... 141 yds..... 1 TD long 42.....

Eagles vs 49ers...... 416 total yards..... 150 rushing... 266 passing sacked 3 times for 30 yards 0 ints

Eagles vs the Texans.... 441 total yards... 130 rushing... 311 passing sacked 1 time for 3 yards... 1 pass intercepted.

Just a bunch of stats.... to me, looks like Mario had more of an impact against the Eagles than Manny Lawson did. Even though he was moved between LDE, RDE, & DT.

Blake
09-27-2006, 12:48 PM
Well I haven't missed a game yet, since day 1. But right now we are talking about this season... I have yet to see Mario pressure a QB. I want him to at least grab some jersey, or even get a flag for a late hit. I don't know what game you are watching, but please tell me which game you are referring to. I will re-watch it again because evidently I have missed something...

I am not against this pick nor am I for it. I am not going to bash a player for trying... I wanted D'Brick or D'Angelo Williams or both. Not D players. I don't think he is a bust nor do I think he is great. I won't make that determination until the end of the season along with many others...

Well as much as I would love to sit around and find each QB pressure that I see, I dont have the game tape to go over. I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

real
09-27-2006, 12:50 PM
Exactly

Stasts mean nothing...

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 12:52 PM
Every "Mario sucks" thread is usually a "We should have drafted Reggie thread" in disguise.

I'm of the opinion that Reggie Bush should be judged by the same standard as Mario Williams.

If MW should be getting sacks by now, then why shouldn't RB be scoring TD's yet?

Not only that, but after the draft when many fans suggested Mario may not set the rookie sack record, & that his presence will allow our other 1st rounders to make an impact..... we were told that it didn't make sense to spend $60 mil on someone to take up blocks.

Yet we ask them How Reggie impacted the Saints...... & they tell us that he's second on the Saints depth chart, and a Decoy........... unbelievable.

& believe it or not, I don't hate Reggie. I'd love to see him go off, and do some amazing stuff...... That's the only reason I watched MNF this past week..... to see him & Michael Vick put on a show. Instead, Vick is trying to act like a QB, and Reggie looked like a Rookie........

I'm also sort of a Saints fan(even though JoeHorn is the only person still on that team that I root for).......

GP
09-27-2006, 12:55 PM
I had said "Let's see what Manny Lawson does against the Eagles."

TK shows us the stats: Looks eerily similar to our effort against the Eagles with less sacks given up by our o line, more passing yards for us, and we gave up 20 less yards rushing than the Niners.

Lawson and Williams, facing roughly the same Eagles team (but 9ers NOT facing Stallworth) are just what they are: Rookies who are not making an impact against quality teams.

Lawson has had success in first two games, but look at the opponents.

On an apples-to-apples comparison, the two guys are equally unimpressive.

I also blame fantasy football for our harsh and quick-draw reactions to players and whether they are "producing" or not. In FF, you expect your guys to make an impact on gameday...and if they don't: You waive them and go acquire someone else who scored a TD the week that your "stud" rushed for 11 yards and was held to no TD.

We want production, and we want it now. Gone are the days where you looked at an athlete over the entire course of his career, where you watched him "develop" over time into a star player. Nope, now the guys have to be instant producers. Chew on that one...

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 12:58 PM
That's quite the list of impressive plays you've compiled there.... :ok: Took a whole three games, too!

I take it that you're not at the game giving Mario's playing time your undivided attention? Or you would not be touting such an uninformed opinion.

Give the guy time, he's a rookie, yada yada yada...how about ONE play where he DOMINATES as the FIRST OVERALL PICK? idonno:

Ok........ How about when the 6'7" 300lb stud chased down Santana Moss?? He was on Brunnels Right, Moss ran a reverse towards the left..... #45 is trying to cutblock Mario.... Mario gets around him, and catches Moss just as he crossed the 1st down marker.

DocBar
09-27-2006, 01:00 PM
saints about to go 3-0. texans 0-3. gee who you think made the right choice

The Texans. I would LOVE to have Deuce McAllister!!!!!!

real
09-27-2006, 01:01 PM
Yet we ask them How Reggie impacted the Saints...... & they tell us that he's second on the Saints roster, and a Decoy........... unbelievable.


You can only be a successful decoy if other teams respect what you're capable of.....

The difference between RB and MW is that we know what Reggie is capable of....We just don't know that he can do it on a consistent basis...

With Mario we don't know that he is capable of anything.....Until Mario shows something he will constantly be ridiculed and compared to Bush...

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 01:03 PM
Until Mario shows something he will constantly be ridiculed and compared to Bush...

Like comparing sacks to TD's.

real
09-27-2006, 01:03 PM
Ok........ How about when the 6'7" 300lb stud chased down Santana Moss?? He was on Brunnels Right, Moss ran a reverse towards the left..... #45 is trying to cutblock Mario.... Mario gets around him, and catches Moss just as he crossed the 1st down marker.

oh please....You are making it seem like Mario caught him in a foot race...Santanna wa trying to make people miss while Mario was free to just run....

Not saying I didn't like his effort, but it wasn't anything to hang your hat on...

real
09-27-2006, 01:04 PM
Like comparing sacks to TD's.

No like comparing impact vs. impact...

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 01:04 PM
What I don't understand is how people can actually watch MW play...then watch RB play.....Then say RB sucks, and we definitely got the better man...honestly that is yet to be determined....At this point I can't say i know either one will be super stars...But I can say that I have been more impressed with RB...and thats without rewatching him on film...

Why are we constantly reminded that Mario came out as a Junior.....was Reggie not in the same boat???


Why is Reggie being judged after 3 games??? But Mario is not???

Why does Mario get a pass because he was DT and DE...and Reggie doesn't get the same pass for having to learn PR, KR, RB, WR???

Why can't we just call a spade a spade, and be honest that RB has done more for his team AT THIS POINT than Mario?? What does that mean??? It could mean nothing...or it could mean everything...we don't know....


That's BS.... all of it. You guys are calling Mario a Bust after three games... We aren't calling Reggie a bust at all.

You guys are saying Reggie Impacted the game.... as a Decoy, when they've got Brees..... & Duece & Horn are healthy now.

You are the one who said a few days ago that you have to stop rewatching Mario on TiVo(or whatever) because when you do, you see why we took him #1. You see the plays he does make.... you see the power the kid has..... you see the ungodly speed(for someone so big) You said it's a matter of time before he puts it together.......

and now, he's a disappointment.

Nothing against Reggie........ I hope he is the next Gayle Sayers.... Lord knows the city of NewOrleans needs that more than we do.

We were 30th & 32nd as a ranked defense in a 32 team league...... WE need Mario to be big........ he hasn't yet, but it's only three games into the season. I don't see how anyone can study his play, and not see what he does bring to the table. When he gets rid of the Rookie tendancies & weeknesses.... he's going to be a Monster...... no doubt.

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 01:09 PM
No like comparing impact vs. impact...

OK...back to the decoy argument. That's the one that works this week.

real
09-27-2006, 01:12 PM
That's BS.... all of it. You guys are calling Mario a Bust after three games... We aren't calling Reggie a bust at all.

You guys are saying Reggie Impacted the game.... as a Decoy, when they've got Brees..... & Duece & Horn are healthy now.

You are the one who said a few days ago that you have to stop rewatching Mario on TiVo(or whatever) because when you do, you see why we took him #1. You see the plays he does make.... you see the power the kid has..... you see the ungodly speed(for someone so big) You said it's a matter of time before he puts it together.......

and now, he's a disappointment.

Nothing against Reggie........ I hope he is the next Gayle Sayers.... Lord knows the city of NewOrleans needs that more than we do.

We were 30th & 32nd as a ranked defense in a 32 team league...... WE need Mario to be big........ he hasn't yet, but it's only three games into the season. I don't see how anyone can study his play, and not see what he does bring to the table. When he gets rid of the Rookie tendancies & weeknesses.... he's going to be a Monster...... no doubt.

Well I'm human...and I have a right to change my opinion...not that my opinion has even changed....I still think Mario is "capable" of becoming a beast IF he ever puts it together...that hasn't changed...But the reason I said I was going to stop rewatching the game and go off of first reaction is because I don't think it's fair to go back and find every little scrap or hint of Mario doing something right, and flipping it to make it seem like he had a good game...He hasn't had a good game to date...and while it is true that he has used his power or used his speed...that doesn't prove that he is going to be a good FOOTBALL player.....I have seen power and speed...you're right...but I haven't seen ANY good football plays...Bottom line...when you re-watch the game you see all the things he did at the combine...all his athletics...when is he going to make a play....a good play...not an average tackle...when is he going to give us something to hang our hats on and anticipate good football to come???

That's all I'm sayin...And about the whole RB thing...man that's old...who cares...He has done more for his team than Mario has done for us...I don't see how you can deny that...Im not going to argue with you about the affect that Reggie has had already in HIS third game.....But what does that mean...like I said..It could mean nothing...and yet it could mean everything....None of us know what they're careers will be like so lets discuss facts and actual things that have happened...and not what if's and predictions....

MY POINT: Reggie has only played 3 games too..
Reggie came out as a junior too...Reggie has had to learn more than Mario...Reggie has helped his team more than Mario...the end

santo
09-27-2006, 01:14 PM
It'll be cool if Reggie Bush wins the Rookie of the year award as the best Decoy in the NFL.


:shades:

real
09-27-2006, 01:21 PM
OK...back to the decoy argument. That's the one that works this week.

What ever gets you through your day....

RB has done more for the Texans than Mario has...LMAO...

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 01:24 PM
The difference between RB and MW is that we know what Reggie is capable of....We just don't know that he can do it on a consistent basis...


You want to know if Reggie can be an affective decoy on a more consistant basis?? What??

'cause he hasn't done anything else at all in the regular season that anyone would want to see on a regular basis..... 5 yard punt returns?? 6 yard rushing games??

Reggie has done very little in the regular season, than run over bad teams, & take carries & TDs away from DueceMcAllister(yeah, that would've been a TD had Duece been in there. You know it, I know it, Payton knows it, Reggie knows it, Duece knows it........ heck my 5 year old was saying. " Duh... put the big guy in there")

GP
09-27-2006, 01:25 PM
Well I'm human...and I have a right to change my opinion...not that my opinion has even changed....I still think Mario is "capable" of becoming a beast IF he ever puts it together...that hasn't changed...But the reason I said I was going to stop rewatching the game and go off of first reaction is because I don't think it's fair to go back and find every little scrap or hint of Mario doing something right, and flipping it to make it seem like he had a good game...He hasn't had a good game to date...and while it is true that he has used his power or used his speed...that doesn't prove that he is going to be a good FOOTBALL player.....I have seen power and speed...you're right...but I haven't seen ANY good football plays...Bottom line...when you re-watch the game you see all the things he did at the combine...all his athletics...when is he going to make a play....a good play...not an average tackle...when is he going to give us something to hang our hats on and anticipate good football to come???

That's all I'm sayin...And about the whole RB thing...man that's old...who cares...He has done more for his team than Mario has done for us...I don't see how you can deny that...Im not going to argue with you about the affect that Reggie has had already in HIS third game.....But what does that mean...like I said..It could mean nothing...and yet it could mean everything....None of us know what they're careers will be like so lets discuss facts and actual things that have happened...and not what if's and predictions....

MY POINT: Reggie has only played 3 games too..
Reggie came out as a junior too...Reggie has had to learn more than Mario...Reggie has helped his team more than Mario...the end

Translation: "I am angry that Reggie is getting the love and Mario is not. I go with however the wind blows, especially after a whopping three games into his first season. Not much interested in long-term payoff. Would just like to see something happen immediately, and since it's not...then I don't think Mario will be good in the long run."

Please tell me that's NOT what you're saying. I think better of you than that.

Give it some time, royaltyx. Give it some time. There's always another football game after the last one that's been played.

eriadoc
09-27-2006, 01:25 PM
I love how people can't grip that MW may take some time to develop, yet they can justify taking VY because he was the hometown guy. Project, anyone?

If the Texans had drafted second and someone else had taken Bush #1, would we only be comparing MW to VY?

Bottom line - get over it. Bush doesn't play for the Houston Texans and it's pathetic that so much space on the TEXANS message board is dedicated to Bush. Shouldn't this thread be moved to the NFL Talk forum, since it's all about Bush now?

Mr. White
09-27-2006, 01:27 PM
What ever gets you through your day....

RB has done more for the Texans than Mario has...LMAO...

Not sure what that means...but whatever.

The excuse from Reggie's followers the last 2 weeks was his total yardage. This week, he has 72 total yards.....

Now the excuse is how good of a decoy he is.

real
09-27-2006, 01:29 PM
You want to know if Reggie can be an affective decoy on a more consistant basis?? What??

'cause he hasn't done anything else at all in the regular season that anyone would want to see on a regular basis..... 5 yard punt returns?? 6 yard rushing games??



So now this is a bash Reggie thread....get off of it because how ever small you make what Reggie has accomplished seem...Just know that what Mario has done is 10x smaller....

And I never said that Reggie has done anything...I said that we know he is capable of taking it to the house at any given moment...We know he can run the ball...we know he can catch....BUT we don't know that he can do it consistently...I don't know how you aren't following that....

real
09-27-2006, 01:36 PM
Translation: "I am angry that Reggie is getting the love and Mario is not. I go with however the wind blows, especially after a whopping three games into his first season. Not much interested in long-term payoff. Would just like to see something happen immediately, and since it's not...then I don't think Mario will be good in the long run."

Please tell me that's NOT what you're saying. I think better of you than that.

Give it some time, royaltyx. Give it some time. There's always another football game after the last one that's been played.

You can make whatever assumptions you want...Thats not my problem....

Mario hasn't shown me that he can make plays...I haven't seen it...college...or pro.....

Kaiser Toro
09-27-2006, 01:36 PM
Maybe we should rename this thread Start Bashing Mario Williams since we have so many impatient fans who want to vent.

real
09-27-2006, 01:40 PM
Not sure what that means...but whatever.

The excuse from Reggie's followers the last 2 weeks was his total yardage. This week, he has 72 total yards.....

Now the excuse is how good of a decoy he is.

O.K...But the difference between Reggie's exscuses and Marios exscuses is as follows...

People give exscuses for reggie as to why he isn't playing great yet....

People give exscuses for Mario as to why he won't suck forever....

What people don't understand is that Most of the exscuses made for Mario...can also be made for Reggie....

Learning different positions
Coming out as a junior
Rookie
Only 3 games
ect.....

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 01:40 PM
So now this is a bash Reggie thread....get off of it because how ever small you make what Reggie has accomplished seem...Just know that what Mario has done is 10x smaller....

And I never said that Reggie has done anything...I said that we know he is capable of taking it to the house at any given moment...We know he can run the ball...we know he can catch....BUT we don't know that he can do it consistently...I don't know how you aren't following that....

Because we don't know what he can do in the NFL...... We know what he can do against Fresno state....

& I'm not bashing Reggie..... how am I bashing him when I say he ran for 6 yards against the GB Packers??

real
09-27-2006, 01:45 PM
Because we don't know what he can do in the NFL...... We know what he can do against Fresno state....

& I'm not bashing Reggie..... how am I bashing him when I say he ran for 6 yards against the GB Packers??

Wow...Ok...I'll do you one better.....We know what Mario can do against Wake Forest...you know the rest....

And You are bashing Reggie because you aren't really being fair...not that I expect you to, but I call it like I see it...

All factors being equal...Reggie has made more of an impact...All exscuses aside...Reggie has made more impact....

Im not suggesting that Mario should be making the same impact as Reggie...Im not even saying that Reggie>Mario....But I am calling it how I see it...And however small you make Reggie's impact...Mario's is still smaller....

real
09-27-2006, 01:47 PM
It's not fair that you go back and watch Mario on film and then try to point out every little thing he does right...

And then bring up stats when talking about Reggie Bush...

If you went back and watched the film on Bush you'd see blocks he made...and attention he's drawn...

Is that really fair?? I mean not that comparing a RB impact vs. DE impact will ever be fair...But if that ain't cheatin I don't know what is...

thunderkyss
09-27-2006, 01:55 PM
It's not fair that you go back and watch Mario on film and then try to point out every little thing he does right...

And then bring up stats when talking about Reggie Bush...

If you went back and watched the film on Bush you'd see blocks he made...and attention he's drawn...

Is that really fair?? I mean not that comparing a RB impact vs. DE impact will ever be fair...But if that ain't cheatin I don't know what is...

Fair?? when did I say I was going to be fair??

Blocks?? I saw him miss that one where Brees got sacked... is that the one you are talking about??

& just like I've said for Mario, I have said for Reggie. the Fans on this board are setting themselves up for a heartbreak, if they think Reggie will be a bust. You can see how fast he is(you can see how fast Mario is) You can see his moves(You can see Mario's Power) It's only a matter of time, before he busts loose.....


But he hasn't yet in the Regular season(neither of them).... I'm telling you Mario is a good decoy on a bad team, and you're telling me Reggie is a good
Decoy on an explosive offense...... I bet Ray Lewis would love to play behind Mario.... Heck, our MLB leads the freaking league in tackles(or something like that)as a Rookie.

But of course you're going to tell me that has nothing to do with Mario.

whatever....... Yeah, you're being fair, and I got it all twisted.

real
09-27-2006, 02:01 PM
Fair?? when did I say I was going to be fair??

Blocks?? I saw him miss that one where Brees got sacked... is that the one you are talking about??

& just like I've said for Mario, I have said for Reggie. the Fans on this board are setting themselves up for a heartbreak, if they think Reggie will be a bust. You can see how fast he is(you can see how fast Mario is) You can see his moves(You can see Mario's Power) It's only a matter of time, before he busts loose.....


But he hasn't yet in the Regular season(neither of them).... I'm telling you Mario is a good decoy on a bad team, and you're telling me Reggie is a good
Decoy on an explosive offense...... I bet Ray Lewis would love to play behind Mario.... Heck, our MLB leads the freaking league in tackles(or something like that)as a Rookie.

But of course you're going to tell me that has nothing to do with Mario.

whatever....... Yeah, you're being fair, and I got it all twisted.


LMAO....There you go again....I never said that either was better than the other...Thats where you and everyone else seems to be falling asleep....All I said is that Reggie has made more of an impact that MW...lol...period...

And oh yeah...it's real fair to look at Reggies stats and then break down Mario's game film and say he's better...LMAO!!!

Any way you can spin it you will....I don't understand why we can't just be real and admit that we aren't soothe sayers...We don't know who will have the better career...we don't even know who will have a better game next week....But what we do know is that the Saints are 3-0(not soley due to reggie bush) and that the Texans are 0-3(not soley due to Mario Williams)....

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 02:10 PM
Well I'm human...and I have a right to change my opinion...not that my opinion has even changed....I still think Mario is "capable" of becoming a beast IF he ever puts it together...that hasn't changed...But the reason I said I was going to stop rewatching the game and go off of first reaction is because I don't think it's fair to go back and find every little scrap or hint of Mario doing something right, and flipping it to make it seem like he had a good game...He hasn't had a good game to date...and while it is true that he has used his power or used his speed...that doesn't prove that he is going to be a good FOOTBALL player.....I have seen power and speed...you're right...but I haven't seen ANY good football plays...Bottom line...when you re-watch the game you see all the things he did at the combine...all his athletics...when is he going to make a play....a good play...not an average tackle...when is he going to give us something to hang our hats on and anticipate good football to come???

You're contradicting yourself. You refuse to rewatch video of our games b/c it may validate what the coaches saw in him to be the # 1 pick but then you'd be willing to accept RB in houston as a decoy if we had taken him as the #1 overall? First of all it's arguable how much of an impact RB is making b/c he's off the field for a little over a third of the offensive plays. What does that leave? The other offseason acquistion D. Brees & the return of Duece who, mind you was a 1600 yd back the season before his injury. We're not even going to talk about the other draft picks. Look, nobody's saying MW is playing great, at least not me, But these "flashes" you guys speak of that RB has are in fact not all that. IMO they're equivalent to Mario's, just slightly better. If you go by preseason "flashes" then technically, Mario has had more of these than RB. If you go by Regular season, then nothing RB is doing is at all impresive & Mario.........well lets just say we as fans expected at least a little more than we're getting..... but that can be generalized to the Whole defense. The point is you keep talking of "impact" b/c that's what the talking heads at ESPN keep saying, but in fact it's probably neglible. I ask you how much of an impact can the guy have if he's not even on the field for a 3rd of the plays, & Again i can't believe that the saints drafted & payed him 62 mil just to be a decoy. His production might be fine for right now, but at some point (probably when the Saints start losing) he's going to have to start to put up stats.............you know those things that you say don't really matter.

real
09-27-2006, 02:17 PM
His production might be fine for right now, but at some point (probably when the Saints start losing) he's going to have to start to put up stats.............you know those things that you say don't really matter.

Can that be said for Mario as well??.... Dude Im not going to argue with you anymore because clearly you all have Texan Blinders on...and Im not mad at cha'....Im a Texan fan so Goooo Texans.....But I won't sit here and pretend that Mario has shown all these great things and R.Bush has proved to be a flop....I will say they are both even before I lie like that....but anyways...keep up the good posting....:ok:

Kaiser Toro
09-27-2006, 02:19 PM
Ready? Set? Go! Start Bashing Mario.....

Runner
09-27-2006, 02:21 PM
Wait Wait Wait!

I wasn't ready.

Mr teX
09-27-2006, 02:22 PM
Can that be said for Mario as well??.... Dude Im not going to argue with you anymore because clearly you all have Texan Blinders on...and Im not mad at cha'....Im a Texan fan so Goooo Texans.....But I won't sit here and pretend that Mario has shown all these great things and R.Bush has proved to be a flop....I will say they are both even before I lie like that....but anyways...keep up the good posting....:ok:

Absolutely, heck that's all anyone is pointing to.

texan_fan_in_tampa_bay
09-27-2006, 02:33 PM
3 games into a guy's rookie season is too early to start judging him. Give him a little time to learn the NFL game.

TexanFanInCC
09-27-2006, 04:22 PM
Guys, you are so pesimistic. You have to remember that he is a rookie. He will get better as the season comes along. You cant expect him to have sacks yet. He is not a speed rusher. He is a power rusher and player who MUST use technique. he is very raw, but he has all the tools to be great with GOOD coaching.:challenge

i think we need to bash richard smith, not mario williams.

name 1 player on defense that has made ur mouth drop because of how good he is....

i cant think of anyone. the closest is dunta robinson IMO

real
09-27-2006, 04:25 PM
i think we need to bash richard smith, not mario williams.

name 1 player on defense that has made ur mouth drop because of how good he is....

i cant think of anyone. the closest is dunta robinson IMO

Meco..

GP
09-27-2006, 04:31 PM
Meco..

Whoopee.

He's doing so "well" because so much stuff is getting past the d line.

It's sorta' like the cat sitting under the sink where you're cleaning/gutting some fish. He's going to get his dinner brought right to him.

Demeco (and ALL of our linebackers, for that matter) OUGHT to be racking up killer stats. They have the ball carrier in their face within 2 seconds of the snap.

kcwilson
09-27-2006, 04:35 PM
i think we need to bash richard smith, not mario williams.

name 1 player on defense that has made ur mouth drop because of how good he is....

i cant think of anyone. the closest is dunta robinson IMO

Thomas Johnson :sarcasm:
"I was just being overly aggressive," said Johnson, who almost certainly will be fined by the league for the play. "I saw the quarterback, so I took a shot on him. I shouldn't have done it. I wasn't aware of the rule. You learn from mistakes. from http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4211357.html MORON

C.C. Brown :sarcasm:

Vinny
09-27-2006, 04:36 PM
Whoopee.

He's doing so "well" because so much stuff is getting past the d line.

It's sorta' like the cat sitting under the sink where you're cleaning/gutting some fish. He's going to get his dinner brought right to him.

Demeco (and ALL of our linebackers, for that matter) OUGHT to be racking up killer stats. They have the ball carrier in their face within 2 seconds of the snap.that's not how it works...if you have poor lineplay the dl can't keep the second level blockers off the linebackers.

SF49erFaithful
09-27-2006, 04:42 PM
HOUSTON--Texans defensive end Mario Williams, the number one pick in the 2006 draft, has struggled early on, recording no sacks and only six tackles in three games. Since he’s clearly having trouble learning the defensive system, head coach Gary Kubiak has devised a plan to slow things for the youngster: bench him for the rest of the season.

“We really need to slow the game down for Mario, to simplify things so he doesn’t have as much to absorb,” Kubiak said. “A lot of times for rookies, the game moves so fast it's hard for them to keep up. Right now the best way to slow things down for Mario is to keep him on the sidelines. It doesn’t get any slower than that. If it's still not slow enough, we might have to cryogenically freeze him until next season.”

The Texans took a lot of heat for selecting Williams over consensus number one pick Reggie Bush, who went to the Saints and has already shown flashes of the brilliance that made him the Heisman trophy winner last year.

Now, with Williams’ slow start, coach Kubiak is forced to defend the team's decision once again.

“It’s much harder for rookie pass rushers than it is for rookie running backs,” said Kubiak. “Reggie just has to take the ball and go make some plays. For Mario, he has to memorize where he’s supposed to be for a variety of defenses and he has to learn how to read the opponent's blocking schemes. That’s why you see so many defenders get lost in this league and so many running backs go on to highly decorated careers. So to answer your question, I have no idea why we selected Mario Williams.”
http://thebrushback.com/kubiak_full.htm

:coolb:

real
09-27-2006, 04:42 PM
Whoopee.

He's doing so "well" because so much stuff is getting past the d line.

It's sorta' like the cat sitting under the sink where you're cleaning/gutting some fish. He's going to get his dinner brought right to him.

Demeco (and ALL of our linebackers, for that matter) OUGHT to be racking up killer stats. They have the ball carrier in their face within 2 seconds of the snap.

So u r not impressed with the play of Meco???

gjmac2
09-27-2006, 04:57 PM
I thought I might put my :twocents: in....


Mario's inexperience is working against him right now. Teams are running a heck of alot of misdirection plays at him, and he is getting caught in overpursuit (i.e. the Portis draw play on Sunday). Also, he is getting locked with Offensive Linemen way to often. His technique in shedding blocks is not really good right now (i.e. the Sellers block of him near the goaline, when Betts scored on the cutback).


None of this makes him a bust or a player who's dogging it (Courtney Brown), It makes him and inexperienced, young rookie. The coaches really did him a disservice by shifting him up and down the line in the preseason. They should have left him in one spot, but that's another topic.

The bottom line is this. Imo, Mario is going to be a good to great defensive lineman, once he learns the proper techniques and recognition of plays. He really needs to be out on the field as much as possible, and not part of the Defensive Lineman rotation.

Again, just my :twocents:

MAVERICK2910
09-27-2006, 05:14 PM
Mario is not playing great and it shows. At least he's got the excuse of being a rookie!. There are other players who deserve more blame. Travis Johnson (1st round pick) hasn't shown anything. Isnt this supposed to be his breakout year? Jason Babin (another 1st round pick.) not exactly tearing anything up. Anthony Weaver (x years experience). What has he done? If these players were to play up to their supposed expectations maybe Mario could play up to our expectations! Give Mario a break and let him develop. I have a feeling a lot of people are going to be eating thier words. Also, blitzing more would really help in every way.

Blake
09-27-2006, 05:17 PM
So u r not impressed with the play of Meco???

Seriously. This guy is a gamer, and is always around the ball. What more do you want from the dude? Do you really have to downplay his tackles because hes a texan?

real
09-27-2006, 05:42 PM
Seriously. This guy is a gamer, and is always around the ball. What more do you want from the dude? Do you really have to downplay his tackles because hes a texan?


Dude I think you should read and re-read before you post....

GP
09-27-2006, 05:57 PM
So u r not impressed with the play of Meco???

He's the best LB on our team...which speaks volumes about how bad our other LBs are. We easily have one of the worst LBing units in the NFL. A rookie is our leader.

Congratulations, Demeco: You're getting ballcarriers in your grill on every play. Wouldn't it be nice, Demeco, if your d line played well enough to allow you to slip into the backfield and get some sacks or stops-for-zero-yards or even stops-for-losses?

He's talented. But he's reaping the benefits of a poor d line, too.

real
09-27-2006, 06:04 PM
He's the best LB on our team...which speaks volumes about how bad our other LBs are. We easily have one of the worst LBing units in the NFL. A rookie is our leader.

Congratulations, Demeco: You're getting ballcarriers in your grill on every play. Wouldn't it be nice, Demeco, if your d line played well enough to allow you to slip into the backfield and get some sacks or stops-for-zero-yards or even stops-for-losses?

He's talented. But he's reaping the benefits of a poor d line, too.

Well...I don't know how you can say that....I think with better line play he will get better....Im not sure how poor line play=good linebacker play....forget the tackles he makes or doesn't make...He's a talented playmaker...

Although I hope We draft a true MLB next year or pick one up via FA...I think Meco would better serve us playing WLB....

Kaiser Toro
09-27-2006, 06:47 PM
I thought I might put my :twocents: in....


Mario's inexperience is working against him right now. Teams are running a heck of alot of misdirection plays at him, and he is getting caught in overpursuit (i.e. the Portis draw play on Sunday). Also, he is getting locked with Offensive Linemen way to often. His technique in shedding blocks is not really good right now (i.e. the Sellers block of him near the goaline, when Betts scored on the cutback).


None of this makes him a bust or a player who's dogging it (Courtney Brown), It makes him and inexperienced, young rookie. The coaches really did him a disservice by shifting him up and down the line in the preseason. They should have left him in one spot, but that's another topic.

The bottom line is this. Imo, Mario is going to be a good to great defensive lineman, once he learns the proper techniques and recognition of plays. He really needs to be out on the field as much as possible, and not part of the Defensive Lineman rotation.

Again, just my :twocents:

Good two cents and much more plausible than the standard Mario sucks.

Blake
09-27-2006, 07:43 PM
Dude I think you should read and re-read before you post....

"Dude" I was agreeing with you smarty.

Blake
09-27-2006, 10:41 PM
FYI I predict a 2 sack weekend for the Big Man. Mark it down.

real
09-28-2006, 02:19 PM
FYI I predict a 2 sack weekend for the Big Man. Mark it down.

I will ....

real
09-28-2006, 02:20 PM
Don't worry about it Super Mario, xtruroyaltyx is a bitter-man with a huge man crush on Reggie Bush.

LOL!!!