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cuppacoffee
09-24-2006, 10:08 PM
Should we call Tampa Bay and offer Carr for their #1 next year?

Think Tampa would go for it?

I am a Carr :homer: but the guy can't win here :dangit: no matter what he does.

Give him a fresh start and make a large % of your fan base happy.

:coffee:

New_Texans
09-24-2006, 10:13 PM
And get who Brady Quinn?


Id much rather keep Carr than having another rookie qb and a losing record for another 5 years.

tburdette
09-24-2006, 10:16 PM
And get who Brady Quinn?


Id much rather keep Carr than having another rookie qb and a losing record for another 5 years.

I agree w/ this. A rookie takes a few years to get up to speed with the pro game and we cannot afford to go thru that growing stage again. Carr is putting up good numbers and seems to have turned the corner. Now if we can just get a defense to help him out we might be a good team.

tburdette
09-25-2006, 02:09 PM
I've got news for you. We ARE in that growing stage. It's like starting from scratch. By the time we are competitive, Carr will be around 30 and will most likely only have a few years left in his career. Hence, a very small window of opportunity to win a SB

I just think though that getting another rookie QB will set us back another 4 years where right now we have a chance to be good in 2.

kingh99
09-25-2006, 02:20 PM
I agree w/ this. A rookie takes a few years to get up to speed with the pro game and we cannot afford to go thru that growing stage again. Carr is putting up good numbers and seems to have turned the corner. Now if we can just get a defense to help him out we might be a good team.

Sage Rosenfelds won 6 games in a row last year. Now they'll tell you it's a team game but 6 wins is six wins. They need to make a change, a radical change if they expect people to stay with them. 5 years is enough of this stuff with Carr. He's perfected the theory that a QB will never get benched for getting sacked but always get benched for throwing INT's. So he plays not to throw INT's. Which is fine if you are all about playing it safe and building that QB rating. Personally I'd rather have the worst QB and some wins.

TexasJedi
09-25-2006, 02:24 PM
When I heard about Simms' injury last night, I knew someone would suggest this. Tampa is a better team than us, so we would probably be talking about a mid to late 1st rounder. Not worth it, IMO, plus I like Carr.

infantrycak
09-25-2006, 02:30 PM
Sage Rosenfelds won 6 games in a row last year. Now they'll tell you it's a team game but 6 wins is six wins.

You have said this before and been corrected on it. STOP. Sage didn't even play in 6 games last year. He has started 2 games in his career and both were losses.

kingh99
09-25-2006, 02:33 PM
You have said this before and been corrected on it. STOP. Sage didn't even play in 6 games last year. He has started 2 games in his career and both were losses.

I am sorry. I thought he had a 6 game winning streak. Who won those games? Ferrotte?

wrestler4life
09-25-2006, 02:34 PM
I am sorry. I thought he had a 6 game winning streak. Who won those games? Ferrotte?

just stop

infantrycak
09-25-2006, 02:36 PM
I am sorry. I thought he had a 6 game winning streak. Who won those games? Ferrotte?

Yes Frerote started 15 of 16 games last year including the end of the season run of 6 wins.

Heywood
09-25-2006, 02:36 PM
carr would collapse under gruden's pressure. carr isn't man enuf for that- carr has spent his entire adult life being babied.

i prefer dealing with oakland- they are likely to have the #1 pick next year. trade carr for their #1 plus burgess. now, that's a trade!

course i'm guessing carr can't be traded must be a part of the horrific extension he got.

hollywood_texan
09-25-2006, 02:40 PM
There is no way we get a 1st rounder for Carr in a trade.

Sage was not the starting QB for the Dolphins when they won six straight last year. He played a lot for one of those wins and very little in another one. Bottom line, that winning streak wasn't because of Sage. Otherwise, he would have stayed in Miami.

Second Honeymoon
09-25-2006, 02:40 PM
If you think Tampa Bay would give us a #1 pick for Carr you are greatly mistaken. His current contract and his lack of a good W-L record preclude that from ever becoming reality.

Bottom line is that Carr has made progress this year and is not the reason we are 0-3. The only thing that getting rid of Carr would do is show the locker room that anyone can be gotten rid of at any time and that eventually we need results. We would get a 2nd or 3rd round for him and that is it. If he finished the season with a 100+ QB rating, we may be able to pilfer a late 1st rounder in the offseason but why would you do that? Brady Quinn doesnt impress me. No QBs in college currently impress me. Our best bet is to stick with Carr or sign a veteran FA that is hungry for a starting job. Now if Carr doesnt keep improving I may be more open to getting rid of him, but anyone who thinks he is the problem right now is fooling themselves...i am one of the biggest Carr bashers out there but aside from the fumbilitis he has improved under Kubiak's wing.

Doug from The Woodlands

kingh99
09-25-2006, 02:42 PM
He said it; because, like the Nazi Propaganda Minister Joseph Goebbels showed, if you repeat a lie enough and with conviction eventually people will believe you. This is what blind hatred of David Carr has done to him. Have pity for the poor soul.

If you are still a Carr defender after 5 years of his follies then Heaven has a special place you you. With the puppies and children. It's not that he's drop dead bad. It's not like Mike Lamb is drop dead bad at 1st base on defense either. But it's the intangibles, say for Lane it's the ability to throw straight under pressure or pick the ball clean under pressure, that gets guys like this relegated to the bench in spite of their prodigious capabilities. When there are two guys wide open in the flat on 3rd and 6 and the OLine is actually hold up on the play and Carr panicks and imagines pressure before throwing the incompletion over the middle, it's not going to show in the box score but he sucked it up on the play. That's what we are fed up about.

hollywood_texan
09-25-2006, 02:49 PM
Carr is not the biggest problem of the team. Yes, he some good stats at times and plays well on the first drive at home and does some clean up work in the fourth. In the second and third quarters, Carr is nonexistent, just like the rest of the team, not to mention some mistakes that shouldn't happen.

Let's get one thing straight, Carr has not shown he can play all four quarters over an extended period time, which is the point of having an expensive quarterback. Granted he hasn't had much help, but I don't see how he can hang around 3 to 4 more years when the help could come around if Kubiak can get his act together.

kingh99
09-25-2006, 03:14 PM
It also won't show when he bails out his offensive line by moving away from a defender coming clean from his blindside and he throws away the ball, or when he hits his recievers in the hands and they drop it. That happened yesterday I saw it, and the dropped pass still counts against Carr as an incompletion even though he did everything he could to put it in his reciever's hands.

And I saw him pitifully underthrow the receiver on the curl route in the 3rd quarter. The receiver was reduced to trying to break up the interception. Another play I saw him almost come out of his shoes to throw the ball 20 yards. He's not the cannon people make out. Not by a loooong shot.

cuppacoffee
09-25-2006, 03:18 PM
carr would collapse under gruden's pressure. carr isn't man enuf for that- carr has spent his entire adult life being babied.

i prefer dealing with oakland- they are likely to have the #1 pick next year. trade carr for their #1 plus burgess. now, that's a trade!

course i'm guessing carr can't be traded must be a part of the horrific extension he got.

Oakland trade sounds good.

I only mentioned Tampa because I suspect they may go into panic mode with Simms being out.

Carrs contract would probably put the skids on any trade talks.

Just thinking out loud and throwing it out there for discussion.


:coffee:

The Pencil Neck
09-25-2006, 03:53 PM
Bottom line is that Carr has made progress this year and is not the reason we are 0-3.
<snip>
Doug from The Woodlands

This is something I never thought I'd see without sarcasm involved.

mexican_texan
09-25-2006, 04:29 PM
I've said it before, I'll say it again: Gradkowski will play for the Bucs.

I'm more interested in Adrian Wilson and Karlos Dansby from the Cards. They could use McKinney and are looking to trade Dansby. Wilson is an elite safety...not really on the block, but I want him.

edo783
09-25-2006, 04:36 PM
When there are two guys wide open in the flat on 3rd and 6 and the OLine is actually hold up on the play and Carr panicks and imagines pressure before throwing the incompletion over the middle, it's not going to show in the box score but he sucked it up on the play. That's what we are fed up about.

See, there ya go again just making stuff up like the Sage six win thing. This didn't actually happen either. You really need to stop listning to those voices in your head.

Goatcheese
09-25-2006, 04:57 PM
When there are two guys wide open in the flat on 3rd and 6 and the OLine is actually hold up on the play and Carr panicks and imagines pressure before throwing the incompletion over the middle, it's not going to show in the box score but he sucked it up on the play. That's what we are fed up about.

So what you're saying is Carr needs to dump it off short of a first down? I would prefer he try and keep the chains moving and throw for the first personaly, but some peoples idea of success differ from mine.

Yes, he some good stats at times and plays well on the first drive at home and does some clean up work in the fourth. In the second and third quarters, Carr is nonexistent, just like the rest of the team, not to mention some mistakes that shouldn't happen.


Carr is pretty much a none factor in the 3rd quarter, more because the opposing offense is on the field for 12 of the 15 minutes than because he doesn't get anything accomplished.

In the second quarter Carr is 15 of 25 for 174 yards. Nothing spectacular, but definately respectable.

The biggest problem the offense has right now is shooting itself in the foot with stupid penalties and drive killing mistakes. Wether it's a crucial 3rd down drop, a fumbled snap or a dump penalty they need to cut down on the mistakes. There were atleast 3 series that were killed by one of these issues. A Pitts false start backed us up 5 yards and we fell 1 yard short of the first for example. The fumbled snaps are by far the worst. It's a simple exchange they have done thousands of times in their careers. It seems like Carr has this problem more than any QB in the league and had 1 almost every game for his first 2 years.

It seems silly that before the season start everyone was just looking for improvement from Carr and some just wanted to see him 'manage' the game. He's far exceeded any expectations I set for him and I don't see why people are on his back over these losses. He has 3 games in this new system and already is showing flashes of brilliance.

You can't say he only cares about his QB rating and will take a sack instead of risking an int when he throws downfield to AJ or Walter(wasn't this guy supposed to be a good pickup?) trusting them to go up for the ball and beat the corner. The pass to AJ ended up as a penalty and the Walters pass was picked off while he just stared at it.

There are alot of things wrong with the Texans right now. Carr is the very least of them.

eric138
09-25-2006, 05:12 PM
Howabout we trade Chicago Defense for ours plus our next three years 1st round drafts.

hollywood_texan
09-25-2006, 05:38 PM
It seems silly that before the season start everyone was just looking for improvement from Carr and some just wanted to see him 'manage' the game. He's far exceeded any expectations I set for him and I don't see why people are on his back over these losses. He has 3 games in this new system and already is showing flashes of brilliance.

You can't say he only cares about his QB rating and will take a sack instead of risking an int when he throws downfield to AJ or Walter(wasn't this guy supposed to be a good pickup?) trusting them to go up for the ball and beat the corner. The pass to AJ ended up as a penalty and the Walters pass was picked off while he just stared at it.

There are alot of things wrong with the Texans right now. Carr is the very least of them.

Considering how bad this team is and what we have seen so far, I really don't see how Carr is an effective part of the solution.

This is probably going to 2008 to field a .500 team with what we have seen thus far this year.

How do you keep Carr as your starting quarterback that long? That is year 8 of David Carr's career and the last year of his extension.

cuppacoffee
09-25-2006, 05:59 PM
That may be but he isn't as bad as you think he is either. Be thankful we aren't in the Raiders shoes as far as QBs go.

Saw a picture on profootballtalk.com of a Raider fan in full Raider fan gear, spikes on the sholders, leather vest, etc. the works.

(don't know how to link pictures)

This fan also was wearing a black blindfold, like a lone ranger mask without eyeholes.

Guess he just couldn't bear to watch.

Raider fan had an original thought....no copycat bag on the head for this guy.


:coffee:

Goatcheese
09-25-2006, 06:00 PM
How old was Elway when he won his Super Bowls? 36/7? Carr has been durable so far and I see no reason he can't play for another decade.

Tulip
09-25-2006, 06:02 PM
How old was Elway when he won his Super Bowls? 36/7? Carr has been durable so far and I see no reason he can't play for another decade.

Yeah, Elway was already headed to the Hall of Fame before he won his Super Bowls. He was not only durable - he was really good, too.

hollywood_texan
09-25-2006, 07:15 PM
How old was Elway when he won his Super Bowls? 36/7? Carr has been durable so far and I see no reason he can't play for another decade.

There is no way you can compare Carr's first 4 years to Elway's.

It is one thing to be able to physically play in the NFL, it's another thing to be the reason and the leader of a winning football program in the NFL.

There are lot of question marks about David Carr. Do you want to give this a guy decade? Carr hasn't gotten a lot of help, but I don't see how he makes guys on the offense better around him.

Goatcheese
09-25-2006, 08:43 PM
There is no way you can compare Carr's first 4 years to Elway's.

Elway wasn't drafted by an expansion franchise with negative skill on the offensive line.

It is one thing to be able to physically play in the NFL, it's another thing to be the reason and the leader of a winning football program in the NFL.

Despite having no running game and poor pass protection(again) Carr is picking up 200 yards, and 2 TDs a game. The passing game is the only thing the Texans are having success with. If we had a Defense that could hold an opponent under 20 points, stop them on 3rd and a mile and not lose the time of possession battle 2:1 the Texans are 2 and 1 even without a solid running attack. Carr has his faults and makes his mistakes, but he has shown enough improvement that I will support him and hope for more success.

There are lot of question marks about David Carr. Do you want to give this a guy decade? Carr hasn't gotten a lot of help, but I don't see how he makes guys on the offense better around him.

If he keeps improving at the rate he has been I'll give him as long as he wants. He's not perfect by any means, but no one should have expected him to be. New coach, new system, new weapons. It's going to take time and experience for him to be comfortable and reach his full potential.

Alot of people seem to forget how aweful this team was(including Carr) at the beggining of last year. They couldn't manage a hundred yards of offense to save their lives and the defense made JP Lossman look like an all pro. After watching that disaster the start of this season has been a breath of fresh air(on offense).

Will Carr ever be as good as Elway? Mayby. He has all the physical tools and now he has the coaching. We're commited for the next 3 years so I guess we'll see.

Runner
09-25-2006, 08:47 PM
How old was Elway when he won his Super Bowls? 36/7?

Right on! How old was Brunnell when he set the single game consecutive pass completion record?

srstex
09-25-2006, 09:00 PM
Before the year started the talk was Carr needs to go, now he has the highest QB rating in the NFL and those same people are saying QB rating means nothing, he has to go. As to fumbling the snap Warren Moon holds the all-time record, David Craig is second ( yes I have posted this stat before ) Moon is in the HOF and was in the playoffs seven years in a row with Oilers, so stop making a big deal becuase Carr lost one fumble yesterday. Texans had 3 lost 1, Redskins lost 1 also.
Winning is all that matters and that is the problem, but the loss was because across the board we were beat. The D was poor, the Running was poor, and Thomas ( Not Travis ) Johnson, cost us a defensive TD with his second unneccessary roughness penalty, there's someone to blame.
Did anyone see Eli throw 3 INT's in Seatlle?