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View Full Version : The Official Start Sage Rosenfels Thread!!!


rodog
09-18-2006, 01:23 PM
Well someone had to do it so here it is. And for all you people that say Carr's passing rating is high,

His 2td passes vs. the Colts came in garbage time.:stirpot:

real
09-18-2006, 01:25 PM
Well someone had to do it so here it is. And for all you people that say Carr's passing rating is high,

His 2td passes vs. the Colts came in garbage time.:stirpot:

Carr isn't the problem...

Johnny Utah
09-18-2006, 01:26 PM
Since Carr's rating is so high I don't think his trade value will get any better. Let's ship him off for a 3rd round pick while we have the chance.

Kaiser Toro
09-18-2006, 01:26 PM
Carr starts. If Sage put up Carr's numbers yesterday everyone would want Sage to continue to start. Your Rosenfels thread does nothing but instigate the Carr apologists and Carr haters while most of us who actually watch the games want the best players out on the field at their position and right now that is Carr at QB.

SESupergenius
09-18-2006, 01:29 PM
Well someone had to do it so here it is. And for all you people that say Carr's passing rating is high,

His 2td passes vs. the Colts came in garbage time.:stirpot:
Didn't Sage have good preseason games against 2nd and 3rd stringers? We should have just drafted Vince Young because he can't win the fans of those Young supports, of which many are still bitter.

gtexan02
09-18-2006, 01:29 PM
*yawn* at this thread. been here done that.

Runner
09-18-2006, 01:31 PM
BUMP


Because it's so darn fresh and interesting.

rodog
09-18-2006, 01:32 PM
Carr starts. If Sage put up Carr's numbers yesterday everyone would want Sage to continue to start. Your Rosenfels thread does nothing but instigate the Carr apologists and Carr haters while most of us who actually watch the games want the best players out on the field at their position and right now that is Carr at QB.

I'm a season ticket holder I've seen the games, hence the thread. Garbage time can make anyone look good.

Kaiser Toro
09-18-2006, 01:35 PM
Garbage time can make anyone look good.

Garbage time in HS/College is a lot different than garbage time in the NFL. Answer this question, if Sage put up those numbers would you want him starting again or would you hold garbage time against him?

Goatcheese
09-18-2006, 01:35 PM
Carr isn't the problem...

^^^

cuppacoffee
09-18-2006, 01:36 PM
I'm a season ticket holder I've seen the games, hence the thread. Garbage time can make anyone look good.

Think again.

Have you seen our defense?

D-Vizzl
09-18-2006, 01:37 PM
The optimist in me says DC is totally not the prob, and you can't argue with stats and the stats say DC is completing 75% of his passes and has a higher ypa than Manning.

The pessimist in me says that we all watch the games and DC puts up Steve McNair type numbers, very accurate but it's because of the fact that the ball wasn't thrown 15 yards downfield. Which should I lean toward?

Either way Rosenfels isn't in my mind after week 2, I seem to recall that the Texans made a move after week 2 last year, how did that pan out?

jdog
09-18-2006, 01:39 PM
Well someone had to do it so here it is. And for all you people that say Carr's passing rating is high,

His 2td passes vs. the Colts came in garbage time.:stirpot:

Carr is our man, but he needs to become THE man.

jerek
09-18-2006, 01:39 PM
Garbage time in HS/College is a lot different than garbage time in the NFL. Answer this question, if Sage put up those numbers would you want him starting again or would you hold garbage time against him?

Gotta love the logic. Despite his obvious onfield deficiencies, Carr has looked much improved and is putting up tremendous stats, albeit a few of them in "garbage time."

Yet, Sage put up a similar preseason stat line, purely against 2nd and 3rd teamers, and hey, it's "let's bring in Sage."

That response is all the dignity I'm going to give the original post. I suspect it will be ignored by said poster, DFTW, Napa, and the usual crew.

I also love how anyone with a gripe prefaces it with "I'm a season ticket holder." As if going to the games in person or paying for a product you don't like (should call into question your judgment in the first place) qualifies your negative opinions versus mine or any of the other 60k season ticket holders, many of whom are also on this board and happen to disagree.

Hottoddie
09-18-2006, 01:48 PM
Well someone had to do it so here it is. And for all you people that say Carr's passing rating is high,

His 2td passes vs. the Colts came in garbage time.:stirpot:

Being as you're a season ticket holder & all :rolleyes:, I'm sure you've already recognized the error in your original post. It was 3TD passes.

rodog
09-18-2006, 01:49 PM
Carr is our man, but he needs to become THE man.

Well put.

rodog
09-18-2006, 01:49 PM
Being as you're a season ticket holder & all :rolleyes:, I'm sure you've already recognized the error in your original post. It was 3TD passes.
yes but 2 in GARBAGE time nice try

Sco-tai
09-18-2006, 01:53 PM
The "fans" that are calling for SAGE are the same kind of fans that called for "Cody" and "Bucky". Let's see....Moon is in the HOF...and the others...yeah...you get the point.

Having said that, I am NOT saying Carr will be in the HOF. But I am saying that in my opinion CARR and SAGE have 2 completely different levels of upside. I believe WITH protection and patience in the new system, CARR is a pro-bowl caliber QB. I can NOT say the same for Sage.

Do I get frustrated with Carr's performance. Sure. He looked like a ROOKIE yesterday for the majority of the 1st 3 quarters. But calling for Sage just seems like a stretch and a step in the WRONG direction.

:shades:

Scott747
09-18-2006, 01:56 PM
yes but 2 in GARBAGE time nice try

Ever thought that while it was in "garbage" time, that it might just be an indication on what Carr could do if he ever was given some time?

I think Sage is sitting over thinking that those 2nd and 3rd team "no longer in the league" defenses, sure didn't seem that fast.....

Hottoddie
09-18-2006, 02:09 PM
yes but 2 in GARBAGE time nice try

All 3 were in the 4th quarter. At what point does it become garbage time? With the exception of the last drive, looking at the Play by Play on NFL.com, it was mostly starters making the tackles. Nice try.

rodog
09-18-2006, 02:17 PM
All 3 were in the 4th quarter. At what point does it become garbage time? With the exception of the last drive, looking at the Play by Play on NFL.com, it was mostly starters making the tackles. Nice try.


Opposing team up by at least 20, and offense in complete control of the game scoring at will.

If you noticed and I'm sure you did:rolleyes: the 2nd team CB's were in the game.

double nice try

wrestler4life
09-18-2006, 02:18 PM
This is all just stupid. We have a team that needs to figure out how to best work together on the field, not change what works right now.
Sage is a lifelong backup for a reason.

texan_fan_8
09-18-2006, 02:20 PM
Ever thought that while it was in "garbage" time, that it might just be an indication on what Carr could do if he ever was given some time?

I think Sage is sitting over thinking that those 2nd and 3rd team "no longer in the league" defenses, sure didn't seem that fast.....

You all forget Sage won his last 6 of 6 games against first stingers with miami.

David hasn't won 6 games total in his last 28 starts.
For Carr to have that many wins you have to go athe way back to week 8 in 2004.

We have nothing to lose at this point and it would simply prove is it David Carr or the Offensive line or see if platooning is the right answer. Try anything because this way isn't working. And Kubiak is right, this team doesn't win until Carr gets his act togather.

Hervoyel
09-18-2006, 02:21 PM
I do not think Sage Rosenfels is the answer.

Having said that I wish the Texans had started him the last two weeks.

Then the people who don't know what they're looking at when they see him play would shut up.






On second thought nevermind. They'd just start posting threads asking us to pick up Drew Henson or something. There's not going to be a simple way to shut them up that doesn't come from David Carr.

beerlover
09-18-2006, 02:22 PM
stick a fork in him David Carr is done.....yada yada yada :tease: its going to be difficult without the abiltiy to run the ball. against a team like the Colts you need to keep the ball, run the clock and rest the D. the first series said it all, yet there is Carr series after series trying to force the ball up the field yet having to dump it off for short insignificant completions. David is either hot on the first series & drives downfield with ease or it takes him 3 quaters to get the monkey off his back.

David Carr is a conundrum, a riddle. the answear to this question is not Sage Rosenfels but sooner rather than later without protection Carr will get hurt and then all those calling for off with his head will get Sage Rosenfels thrown to the wolves as well :bowser:

Reddevil63
09-18-2006, 02:25 PM
yes but 2 in GARBAGE time nice try
Garbage time... against second and third stringers yes?? Who was Sage playing against in the preseason? 2nd and 3rd stringers, most of whom didnt make the team.

jerek
09-18-2006, 02:25 PM
I do not think Sage Rosenfels is the answer.

Having said that I wish the Texans had started him the last two weeks.

Then the people who don't know what they're looking at when they see him play would shut up.

On second thought nevermind. They'd just start posting threads asking us to pick up Drew Henson or something. There's not going to be a simple way to shut them up that doesn't come from David Carr.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Hervoyel again.

:)

rodog
09-18-2006, 02:27 PM
Garbage time... against second and third stringers yes?? How was Sage playing against in the preseason? 2nd and 3rd stringers, most of whom didnt make the team.


Can a brother get a shot at starting a game? Just a chance?

HOU-TEX
09-18-2006, 02:29 PM
I do not think Sage Rosenfels is the answer.

On second thought nevermind. They'd just start posting threads asking us to pick up Drew Henson or something. There's not going to be a simple way to shut them up that doesn't come from David Carr.

Jeff George is still available.:francis:

swtbound07
09-18-2006, 02:33 PM
I didn't think David was the answer in the offseason (and truthfully would still prefer to see him gone), but now that i've read and studied the WCO a little better I think he could potentially work in this system. After actually getting to watch a game live, here is what i think.

1) He needs to settle down in the pocket a little bit. I don't care how or why, but he does. There are problems that need to be addressed for this to happen, but I trust Kubiak will make the adjustments on the line.

2) He needs to pick up his throws a little bit. 4 or 5 times he made the correct read and threw short, but threw so low it forced a reciever down to the ground instead of allowing for them to be able to continue their route downfield. If he can hit a few more of those recievers on their upfield shoulder I think the offense will move more efficiently.

3) He has to take 2 or 3 more shots downfield to force the corners to play off. I don't care if he just throws it out of bounds deep, but you can't let the safeties and help sit on the short routes and minimize gains.

Hulk75
09-18-2006, 02:34 PM
I just Vomited! Yepsure did.

I have a better idea lets just start the DBs and leave the Dline off the field, pretty much would have the same effect.

TexansTailg8r
09-18-2006, 02:34 PM
Did Carr play perfect? No he didn't, but... at this stage I'm way more concerned that our new and "improved" defense got drove for 43 points than I am with Carr. :stirpot:

Line_Producer
09-18-2006, 02:35 PM
Since our defense played like garbage...I propose that we count all of Peyton's td's and throws as garbage too! lmfao.

ronaldod1
09-18-2006, 02:39 PM
Since our defense played like garbage...I propose that we count all of Peyton's td's and throws as garbage too! lmfao.



Exactly. I'd take those second string Indi DB's over Houstons ANY DAY.

gwallaia
09-18-2006, 02:50 PM
Sage Rosenfels career stats.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/235151

Second Honeymoon
09-18-2006, 02:58 PM
Any Carr homer that points to his stats yesterday as validation needs to wake up and smell the coffee. Carr didn't do a thing until the game was no longer a game. He is a poor competitor, poor leader, and still looks like a rookie going into Year 5...no amount of blatant homering will change that. The only things the organization's blind and unsubstantiated loyalty gets us is a retardation of the franchise's development. We have already wasted 5 years of the Texans existence on Lil Davey...enuf is enuf

Answer me one question, ye of so much misguided faith? What will it take for you to admit that Carr is a failure and that you were wrong in thinking he would ever be worth a krap? 2-14 again? 1-15? 0-16? When will you stop blaming everyone but Carr on his own ****ty development? I just want to know when I can come into our team's message board without being mired in a pool of myopic and clueless homers....that is all

doug from the woodlands

SESupergenius
09-18-2006, 03:04 PM
Any Carr homer that points to his stats yesterday as validation needs to wake up and smell the coffee. Carr didn't do a thing until the game was no longer a game. He is a poor competitor, poor leader, and still looks like a rookie going into Year 5...no amount of blatant homering will change that. The only things the organization's blind and unsubstantiated loyalty gets us is a retardation of the franchise's development. We have already wasted 5 years of the Texans existence on Lil Davey...enuf is enuf

Answer me one question, ye of so much misguided faith? What will it take for you to admit that Carr is a failure and that you were wrong in thinking he would ever be worth a krap? 2-14 again? 1-15? 0-16? When will you stop blaming everyone but Carr on his own ****ty development? I just want to know when I can come into our team's message board without being mired in a pool of myopic and clueless homers....that is all

doug from the woodlands
I saw the Giants D not give up yesterday when their QB threw TD's late in the game, did you see our D do that? Carr was still fighting to win and was trying to get the job done. Eli Manning threw his TD's in mop up time too, but guess what, he had a D that helped him immensely, had 2 3-and-outs and forced a fumble. What did our D do to get us back in the game?

AlbinoRat
09-18-2006, 03:09 PM
I don't understand why people don't think Carr is any good. Put him starting on the Colts, he throws for 400 yards. If you have talent around you, you tend to perform better. On the other hand, if you don't have talent around you, you don't perform as well. David Carr has good receivers, a terrible Offensive Line, and as of now, no running game. The numbers he is putting up right now should be considered very good for his teams talent. If you think that Sage Rosenfels is going to come in and do better, you are truly a fool. Carr is the Quarterback for this team. There is no need to bring in a new quarterback in until you get an upgraded offensive line. No QB can perform without a decent offensive line. For further proof, look at Dante Culpepper. In Minnesota, he was a great QB. Now, he keeps finding himself on his back. Also, maybe someone else can verify this, Peyton Manning stayed in the whole game for "Garbage Time" too.

Brandon420tx
09-18-2006, 03:27 PM
"The Official Start Sage Rosenfels Thread!!!"

Go play in traffic.

noxiousdog
09-18-2006, 03:41 PM
You all forget Sage won his last 6 of 6 games against first stingers with miami.

And Trent Dilfer won a Super Bowl.

Sage is a career 49.5% passer and has as many interceptions as he does TDs.

He's terrible. If David isn't the answer, Sage sure as hell isn't.

jerek
09-18-2006, 03:45 PM
Any Carr homer that points to his stats yesterday as validation needs to wake up and smell the coffee. Carr didn't do a thing until the game was no longer a game. He is a poor competitor, poor leader, and still looks like a rookie going into Year 5...no amount of blatant homering will change that. The only things the organization's blind and unsubstantiated loyalty gets us is a retardation of the franchise's development. We have already wasted 5 years of the Texans existence on Lil Davey...enuf is enuf

Answer me one question, ye of so much misguided faith? What will it take for you to admit that Carr is a failure and that you were wrong in thinking he would ever be worth a krap? 2-14 again? 1-15? 0-16? When will you stop blaming everyone but Carr on his own ****ty development? I just want to know when I can come into our team's message board without being mired in a pool of myopic and clueless homers....that is all

doug from the woodlands

Homer :blah: myopic :blah: clueless :blah: blind :blah:

LBC_Justin
09-18-2006, 03:48 PM
these are the kind of threads that make me want to stay off the message board.

Hmmm...lets take one of our few bright spots, and talk about replacing it. great. Let's cut Ryans, AJ, Moulds, and Owens while were at it.


I think some people need to be beat over the head with a HUGE freaking club that says "Football is a team sport", until it finally sinks in.

infantrycak
09-18-2006, 04:05 PM
You all forget Sage won his last 6 of 6 games against first stingers with miami.

Are folks just making things up now? Sage has started two games in his career and both were loses.

Bamaborn-Texasbred
09-18-2006, 04:14 PM
shouldn't this be bunched in with any other number of Carr sucks or start rosenfels now threads?

HJam72
09-18-2006, 04:16 PM
I'll sign it. Carr will sign it too. He needs a break. Rosenfel is starting his own petition to make Carr stay out there.

Battle Red Flash
09-18-2006, 04:39 PM
Well someone had to do it so here it is. And for all you people that say Carr's passing rating is high,

His 2td passes vs. the Colts came in garbage time.:stirpot:

I point out he has no INT's in two games.
... and it's the West Coast Offense. That means short passes.

rodog
09-18-2006, 05:38 PM
And Trent Dilfer won a Super Bowl.

Sage is a career 49.5% passer and has as many interceptions as he does TDs.

He's terrible. If David isn't the answer, Sage sure as hell isn't.

yea to bad your passer rating doesn't win ball games. What about his career Wins and losses, forget for a moment the 49.5 passer rating what about wins and losses compare.

rmartin65
09-18-2006, 06:52 PM
yea to bad your passer rating doesn't win ball games. What about his career Wins and losses, forget for a moment the 49.5 passer rating what about wins and losses compare.
Dude, have you listened? Sage has 2 starts, both losses.

Mike Kerns
09-18-2006, 07:00 PM
these are the kind of threads that make me want to stay off the message board.

Hmmm...lets take one of our few bright spots, and talk about replacing it. great. Let's cut Ryans, AJ, Moulds, and Owens while were at it.


I think some people need to be beat over the head with a HUGE freaking club that says "Football is a team sport", until it finally sinks in.

Agreed. I used to post a ton more when there was actually people with intelligence about football that posted on here. Now all it is is "Carr sucks, He shows no poise! Start Sage!" If Sage is the second coming of John Elway, why is the guy a career backup? He isn't even as good as Matt Schaub... If you must bash one guy, why not bash The Invisible Man (Mario)? Because I certainly haven't seen our pick justified yet.

Wolf
09-18-2006, 07:06 PM
wow I wonder if the the Texans would fire up another server to handle the posts if Carr put up horrible stats in "garbage" time.

well if it was "garbage" time, why didn't our defense stop them?(they still score 13 points in "garbage" time)

axman40
09-18-2006, 07:09 PM
Didn't Sage have good preseason games against 2nd and 3rd stringers? We should have just drafted Vince Young because he can't win the fans of those Young supports, of which many are still bitter.

I am one of the guys that wanted VY but I am not bitter and understand that Carr is the Texans starting QB ,the last thing the Texans need is a rotating QB situation IMHO!
:cowboy1:

Lucky
09-18-2006, 07:14 PM
I'm all for starting Sage. If he can play Right Tackle or Free Safety.

The Pencil Neck
09-18-2006, 07:50 PM
wow I wonder if the the Texans would fire up another server to handle the posts if Carr put up horrible stats in "garbage" time.

well if it was "garbage" time, why didn't our defense stop them?(they still score 13 points in "garbage" time)

If it was garbage time, why didn't he get these numbers LAST year? Let's face it, he had a lot of garbage time last year. If you don't get these numbers in garbage time, how are you supposed to have a great comeback? Is he supposed to just stop playing at some point and get called a quitter?

Erratic Assassin
09-18-2006, 07:56 PM
I'm all for starting Sage. If he can play Right Tackle or Free Safety.

You beat me to it. I was really excited when I realized that our back up QB could magically cure our defensive line problems, our secondary problems, our offensive line problems, and our running game problems.

Sage Rosenfels is a superhero!

Hottoddie
09-18-2006, 10:09 PM
Opposing team up by at least 20, and offense in complete control of the game scoring at will.

If you noticed and I'm sure you did:rolleyes: the 2nd team CB's were in the game.

double nice try

Most teams that are as established as the Colts are, have 2nd teamers that are just a step down from the starters, & they play almost as many snaps as the starters. How does that qualify as garbage time?

I'll agree that the 3rd TD drive could be considered garbage time, but not the first 2. There were too many starters & 2nd teamers still in the game at that point. Keep trying.

Something you're going to have to face, & no amount of whining on a message board is going to change it, David Carr is our starter for the duration, & you're just going to have to live with it.:neener: :neener: :neener:

Second Honeymoon
09-18-2006, 11:25 PM
I saw the Giants D not give up yesterday when their QB threw TD's late in the game, did you see our D do that? Carr was still fighting to win and was trying to get the job done. Eli Manning threw his TD's in mop up time too, but guess what, he had a D that helped him immensely, had 2 3-and-outs and forced a fumble. What did our D do to get us back in the game?

This is true and our defense is just as responsible for starting 0-2 as Carr's problems at QB. One could easily argue that the defense is even more to blame but that doesn't have anything to do with Carr's ability to put his team in a position to win football games. Even Carr's current #1 fan Kubiak said as much post-game. Carr has problems with throwing from the pocket, handling the blitz, protecting the football, and game management still going into his 5th year. Those are things that capable QBs learn after their 1st or 2nd year. Eventually you have to step back and realize he may be just what you have seen for the past 5 years, a failed experiment.

That being said, I think we need to stick with Carr for this year because we are married to him by contract and by the lack of a much better option at backup QB. Next year we need to bring in some new QB talent (free agent and/or draft) and have a real competition for the starting QB position....

edo783
09-18-2006, 11:49 PM
I'll agree that the 3rd TD drive could be considered garbage time, but not the first 2. .:neener: :neener: :neener:

Even on the last one they had 6 starters in.

kcwilson
09-19-2006, 12:06 AM
Who gives a cr*p about garbage time?!?!?!

Basically, we have two qbs, and I like the decisions that Carr has made with the ball when he has had time to throw it. THe first play of the game was ridiculous... both Spencer and Weigert just let the ends lose. Not one, both!

That says a lot about the progress the OLine has made. First play of the game and two of the five don't show up. That single handedly pushed all momentum to Indy.

The botched exchange at center falls on Flanagan AND Carr. No doubt a factor of Carr wanting to get pack in the pocket since the OLIne obviously had issues.

I am more concerned about the run game, which supposedly the Texans should have been able to expose the interior line since they are undersized. I never see much audibling from Carr, but this could have been an area to exploit if we could have spread the field a little more.

RTP2110
09-19-2006, 12:09 AM
If you can't see the progress Carr is making, you're blind. Example: watch the play where Carr throws the 33 yard TD to Daniels. Carr drops back, looks left, looks over the middle, looks right, throws right, Touchdown. Even if Daniels doesn't get in, it's a good passing play. Readind defenses and making progressions was a big knock on Carr. He's getting better, but like the rest of the team, it will take time.

mefool3030
09-19-2006, 12:19 AM
If you can't see the progress Carr is making, you're blind. Example: watch the play where Carr throws the 33 yard TD to Daniels. Carr drops back, looks left, looks over the middle, looks right, throws right, Touchdown. Even if Daniels doesn't get in, it's a good passing play. Readind defenses and making progressions was a big knock on Carr. He's getting better, but like the rest of the team, it will take time.



Uhhh no

Cgold
09-19-2006, 05:08 AM
maybe they should put in sage so he can get his big "L" and has the stats that prove why he has never been chosen to be a starter on any team and then the "start sage" crap can stop and we can put our real qb in again...who i only feel sorry for, more and more each weak.. he a good qb and he doesnt deserve it. I dont know who beats him up worse the D's from the teams that are making our OL look ridiculous or the fans that tear him down when our defense gives up 40 points

Napa Auto Parts
09-19-2006, 05:20 AM
David Carr is not the problems guys its everyone else but david:brickwall