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the wonger need food
09-11-2006, 02:37 PM
You guys know me... I am not a big fan of David Carr. I was disappointed in him (again) on Sunday because I thought he could have made a few more plays. However, he was statistically better than a lot QB's in the NFL and better than what we saw last year on average...


QB rating: 102.1 ('05 average 77.2) NFL Ranking = 5
Completion %: 66.7 ('05 average 60%) NFL Ranking = 7
Yards Per Attempt: 7.7 ('05 average 5.8) NFL Ranking = 7
20+ yard completions: 3 ('05 total = 18)
40+ yard completions: 1 ('05 total = 2)
Passing Yards: 208 ('05 average 156)


The thing that jumps out to me the most is that he was throwing downfield more than normal and doing it successfully. This wasn't a breakout game by any stretch, but maybe he is turning the corner...

Battle Red Flash
09-11-2006, 02:41 PM
I think it was funny that Carr was booed on both of the scoring drives. Seems people went there just to boo him.

Texans86
09-11-2006, 02:42 PM
I think it was funny that Carr was booed on both of the scoring drives. Seems people went there just to boo him.

People would rather see him fail than succeed. It's sad really.

Tx'nFanLostInSkinCountry
09-11-2006, 02:52 PM
You guys know me... I am not a big fan of David Carr. I was disappointed in him (again) on Sunday because I thought he could have made a few more plays. However, he was statistically better than a lot QB's in the NFL and better than what we saw last year on average...


QB rating: 102.1 ('05 average 77.2) NFL Ranking = 5
Completion %: 66.7 ('05 average 60%) NFL Ranking = 7
Yards Per Attempt: 7.7 ('05 average 5.8) NFL Ranking = 7
20+ yard completions: 3 ('05 total = 18)
40+ yard completions: 1 ('05 total = 2)
Passing Yards: 208 ('05 average 156)


The thing that jumps out to me the most is that he was throwing downfield more than normal and doing it successfully. This wasn't a breakout game by any stretch, but maybe he is turning the corner...

Wonger thanks for the stats. IMO Carr will get better every game just a slow process. Give him the season as the O-Line inproves so does carr. I know your not a fan but I think the 1st drive is a glimps of the future.

michaelm
09-11-2006, 02:58 PM
You guys know me... I am not a big fan of David Carr. I was disappointed in him (again) on Sunday because I thought he could have made a few more plays. However, he was statistically better than a lot QB's in the NFL and better than what we saw last year on average...


QB rating: 102.1 ('05 average 77.2) NFL Ranking = 5
Completion %: 66.7 ('05 average 60%) NFL Ranking = 7
Yards Per Attempt: 7.7 ('05 average 5.8) NFL Ranking = 7
20+ yard completions: 3 ('05 total = 18)
40+ yard completions: 1 ('05 total = 2)
Passing Yards: 208 ('05 average 156)


The thing that jumps out to me the most is that he was throwing downfield more than normal and doing it successfully. This wasn't a breakout game by any stretch, but maybe he is turning the corner...


I finally get the feeling that it is possible for you to have a little objectivity when it comes to Carr.
One post doesn't make a trend though...

the wonger need food
09-11-2006, 03:10 PM
I finally get the feeling that it is possible for you to have a little objectivity when it comes to Carr.
One post doesn't make a trend though...

Carr had been a sub-par NFL QB over his previous 30 or so games. Yesterday was the first time in a long time that he looked decent. Not good, but decent.

Let's just hope that trend continues.

Cjeremy635
09-11-2006, 03:33 PM
You guys know me... I am not a big fan of David Carr. I was disappointed in him (again) on Sunday because I thought he could have made a few more plays. However, he was statistically better than a lot QB's in the NFL and better than what we saw last year on average...


QB rating: 102.1 ('05 average 77.2) NFL Ranking = 5
Completion %: 66.7 ('05 average 60%) NFL Ranking = 7
Yards Per Attempt: 7.7 ('05 average 5.8) NFL Ranking = 7
20+ yard completions: 3 ('05 total = 18)
40+ yard completions: 1 ('05 total = 2)
Passing Yards: 208 ('05 average 156)


The thing that jumps out to me the most is that he was throwing downfield more than normal and doing it successfully. This wasn't a breakout game by any stretch, but maybe he is turning the corner...


Thanks for the stat break down Wonger. It is kinda shocking to see that has already completed 1/2 of his plays for 40+ yards that he had all of last year and it was only game 1. I am curious how many attempts were taken at the long ball last year ( I know not many at all). Do you have that stat as well? Hopefully this progression trend will continue, I'm not ready to give up on the lad yet. I just feel bad for ruining his career with our last regime if he can't be salvaged at this point because there wasn't a lot of question about his potential or athleticism coming out of college, it's mainly been after being pummeled for 4 straight years.

Texans_Chick
09-11-2006, 03:37 PM
He had a 134.4 quarterback rating in the first half.

I found his performance remarkable given how terrible the run game was. In the past, if the run game was sorry, we were just doomed.

Titan "Tack" Fan
09-11-2006, 03:47 PM
Yeah but you forgot this one very important stat:

David Carr (0-1)

Blu
09-11-2006, 03:50 PM
Yeah but you forgot this one very important stat:

David Carr (0-1)
3-4, 1 INT!
Titans 0-1 (against the jets no less)
Collins? 4 shots and a tall boy.hehehe!

El Tejano
09-11-2006, 03:53 PM
Yeah but you forgot this one very important stat:

David Carr (0-1)
You know about 0-1 don't you.

Anyways. Our offense struggled today because 2nd down always became 2 and 10 or longer for a good part of the day.

utahmark
09-11-2006, 03:56 PM
You guys know me... I am not a big fan of David Carr. I was disappointed in him (again) on Sunday because I thought he could have made a few more plays. However, he was statistically better than a lot QB's in the NFL and better than what we saw last year on average...


QB rating: 102.1 ('05 average 77.2) NFL Ranking = 5
Completion %: 66.7 ('05 average 60%) NFL Ranking = 7
Yards Per Attempt: 7.7 ('05 average 5.8) NFL Ranking = 7
20+ yard completions: 3 ('05 total = 18)
40+ yard completions: 1 ('05 total = 2)
Passing Yards: 208 ('05 average 156)


The thing that jumps out to me the most is that he was throwing downfield more than normal and doing it successfully. This wasn't a breakout game by any stretch, but maybe he is turning the corner...

how did you like your seats? i saw one of the helment guys on tv.

the wonger need food
09-11-2006, 04:00 PM
how did you like your seats? i saw one of the helment guys on tv.


The seats are great. On most plays, I was closer to the Eagles WR's than our Cornerbacks.

You probably saw us on TV also. We were on the Jumbotron thing like 5 times.

PhillyFan
09-11-2006, 04:22 PM
The seats are great. On most plays, I was closer to the Eagles WR's than our Cornerbacks.


Im sorry, but that is funny :P

SESupergenius
09-11-2006, 04:22 PM
The wonger giving props to Carr? What parallel universe am I in? Is this one of those wierd Star Trek episodes?

Seriously, I commend him for at least giving him half a credit. :whip:

RiotCommander
09-11-2006, 04:26 PM
In the first half it felt like I was watching another team. Everything just seemed to be working (Except the running game). We made some stupid mistakes, but those are very correctable.

The Eagles adjustments at halftime were the difference in the game.


I'm feeling very positive about this team. I think we will continue to grow each week. We have a brutal early schedule, but we could surprise some teams.

Kaiser Toro
09-11-2006, 05:15 PM
Carr played well in the first quarter. After that he and the remiander of the offense fell into a lull save for a failed attempt in the RZ which resulted in a FG.

I am still waiting for an adjustment to ever be made by a Texans offense. I trust there is a piece of the Kubiak/Sherman tutelage that has not been offered as of yet and that is actual film breakdown over the course of the game. You must have a baseline and yesterday's game is just that. We will get better. No turnovers is a step in the right direction.

bigTEXan8
09-11-2006, 05:37 PM
the secondary was a pure embarrassment yesterday. don't get me wrong; stallworth is a solid WR, westbrook is as dangerous out of the backfield as any RB in the game, but they looked like men amongst boys. it sems like d-rob has lost that fire.

afcman
09-11-2006, 05:42 PM
To be fair.....a lot of QB's had a bad day. Lets wait for about 4-5 games.

TEXANS84
09-11-2006, 06:09 PM
I think it was funny that Carr was booed on both of the scoring drives. Seems people went there just to boo him.

The loud boo I would hope would be for the offensive line. I know that Carr took some boos for tripping backwards out of the snap.

Cgold
09-11-2006, 06:37 PM
When i hear about people coming to the gave just to boo DC it makes me sick..I mean how lame of a fan can you be.. and he certainly didnt deserve it sunday..
I really think of this year as his first REAL year to succeed. This is the year I will really decide if he can be an elite quarterback. I have said he could since day one, and i still believe it.. I think he will produce this year and hopefully people will get off his back.. and if he doesn't ill say I was wrong and be disappointed that he didnt succeed, cuz i like the guy and I think he is good enough.
But I've never seen so many "fans" want to tear down a guy and the rest of the team just gets a pass..people would actually rather see him fail this year, than have to admit they were wrong if he turns out to be the man.. its to bad...

chuckm
09-11-2006, 06:42 PM
You guys know me... I am not a big fan of David Carr. I was disappointed in him (again) on Sunday because I thought he could have made a few more plays. However, he was statistically better than a lot QB's in the NFL and better than what we saw last year on average...


QB rating: 102.1 ('05 average 77.2) NFL Ranking = 5
Completion %: 66.7 ('05 average 60%) NFL Ranking = 7
Yards Per Attempt: 7.7 ('05 average 5.8) NFL Ranking = 7
20+ yard completions: 3 ('05 total = 18)
40+ yard completions: 1 ('05 total = 2)
Passing Yards: 208 ('05 average 156)


The thing that jumps out to me the most is that he was throwing downfield more than normal and doing it successfully. This wasn't a breakout game by any stretch, but maybe he is turning the corner...


WOW ..... that had to hurt huh?

Reddevil63
09-11-2006, 06:47 PM
the secondary was a pure embarrassment yesterday. don't get me wrong; stallworth is a solid WR, westbrook is as dangerous out of the backfield as any RB in the game, but they looked like men amongst boys. it sems like d-rob has lost that fire.
Any secondary is going to look bad if the QB has that long to stand there and wait for them to get open. The obvious exception is the Brown goof.

Double Barrel
09-11-2006, 06:47 PM
People would rather see him fail than succeed. It's sad really.

Actually, there is a poll in another thread that might suprise you. Well over 86% of forum fans want Carr to start. It seems to me that the true "Carr haters" are a very vocal minority. Sure, there are many "Carr doubters", and "Carr wait-and-seers", but I think most fans want him to succeed because it's what is good for the team.

the wonger need food
09-11-2006, 06:50 PM
WOW ..... that had to hurt huh?

Not at all. When Carr stinks it up (like he had done for the previous 30 or so games) I will be the first to point it out. And when he plays well I will be the first to point it out.

Now I'm not saying that he had a great game because he didn't. A great QB would have gotten his team into the end zone more than one time. But he cut down the mistakes and threw the ball downfield. And he actually stood firm in the pocket a few times. Baby steps are better than stepping backwards, which is all we have seen over the past 1.5 seasons.

coachdent
09-11-2006, 06:58 PM
Carr was much better and my gripe has always been with Chris Palmer. He put Carr back years with his development. Palmer was all about finding seventy ways to get the ball into the flat or at five yards to DDavis. With DD out, and Palmer gone, we are seeing the expansion of the offense.

We need to see more slants and crossing routes with AJ. A little too much vertical stuff when we are in 2nd and long and 3rd and long situations.

My biggest frustration came on Javon Kearse's sack. You CAN'T block Kearse with a tight end! That was the equivalent to giving him a Brett Favre giftwrapped sack to Strahan! Gotta get out of that protection!

------

Side note: The broadcast showed the Eagles bench just before the blown coverage on Stallworth's touchdown. You could see Andy Reid turn to an assistant and smile at him and say, "watch this". When I saw that, I started screaming at my tv for playaction pass! Ugh! Caught a bunch of fish with that hook!

run-david-run
09-11-2006, 07:15 PM
Not at all. When Carr stinks it up (like he had done for the previous 30 or so games) I will be the first to point it out. And when he plays well I will be the first to point it out.

Now I'm not saying that he had a great game because he didn't. A great QB would have gotten his team into the end zone more than one time. But he cut down the mistakes and threw the ball downfield. And he actually stood firm in the pocket a few times. Baby steps are better than stepping backwards, which is all we have seen over the past 1.5 seasons.
Peyton only had one TD on Sunday with 41 pass attempts and the other TD they scored was from a yard out. Even the "great" QB's struggle when they dont have other pieces in place, such as the running game.
On the other hand, Tom Brady had no receivers and he ended up with about 150 yards and complete reliance on the RB's, who delivered. Just goes to show you need talent around you to suceed, even when you are a multiple Pro Bowler or a 3 time SuperBowl winner.

CajunTexan
09-11-2006, 11:05 PM
Carr was much better and my gripe has always been with Chris Palmer. He put Carr back years with his development. Palmer was all about finding seventy ways to get the ball into the flat or at five yards to DDavis. With DD out, and Palmer gone, we are seeing the expansion of the offense.

We need to see more slants and crossing routes with AJ. A little too much vertical stuff when we are in 2nd and long and 3rd and long situations.

My biggest frustration came on Javon Kearse's sack. You CAN'T block Kearse with a tight end! That was the equivalent to giving him a Brett Favre giftwrapped sack to Strahan! Gotta get out of that protection!

------

Side note: The broadcast showed the Eagles bench just before the blown coverage on Stallworth's touchdown. You could see Andy Reid turn to an assistant and smile at him and say, "watch this". When I saw that, I started screaming at my tv for playaction pass! Ugh! Caught a bunch of fish with that hook!

I work in Dallas these days, and I had to laugh when I heard on talk radio that Palmer had taken his bell and implemented that "near career killin'" training tool in the Cowboys training camp.

2.7 seconds I believe they said. Wasn't it more like 1.7 with us?

Looks like it has worked the same magic for Bledsoe as it did for Carr.

GoTexans
09-11-2006, 11:40 PM
Carr looked great. 18 of 27 for over 200 yards. No INT's. I'll take those stats every week.

Offensive Line cost the game.
5 sacks. And aside from Carr's 4 carries for 25 yards. Lundy and Morency had a combined 45 yards on 16 carries. Not going to get it done.

Have to get the running game going before you can hit some 30-40 yard passes.

HJam72
09-12-2006, 12:29 AM
There are 2 main reasons that Carr played better (other than Kubiak):

Mike Flanagan and Eric Moulds.

It's not like he just suddenly gets it and has half as many passes over 20 yards as all of last year. Eric Moulds is out there and AJ has help.

The Pencil Neck
09-12-2006, 02:10 AM
My biggest frustration came on Javon Kearse's sack. You CAN'T block Kearse with a tight end! That was the equivalent to giving him a Brett Favre giftwrapped sack to Strahan! Gotta get out of that protection!


I went back through that and it almost looks like the running back was supposed to double with the TE on that play and took the wrong angle and ended up on the inside instead of the outside. I could be wrong, but that's what it looked like to me.

HJam72
09-12-2006, 04:43 AM
Actually, Owens did block Kearse successfully at least once, but I wouldn't want to count on that. :hides:

Hulk75
09-12-2006, 08:44 AM
I think it was funny that Carr was booed on both of the scoring drives. Seems people went there just to boo him.
I dont think they were booing just him, lets get that straight.

rockabilly
09-12-2006, 11:58 AM
Carr looked great. 18 of 27 for over 200 yards. No INT's. I'll take those stats every week.

Offensive Line cost the game.
5 sacks. And aside from Carr's 4 carries for 25 yards. Lundy and Morency had a combined 45 yards on 16 carries. Not going to get it done.

Have to get the running game going before you can hit some 30-40 yard passes.

I for one dont think that the 5 sacks were alot considering we passed almost every play. If we would of had a breath of a running game, those sacks wouldnt even exist.

Vinny
09-12-2006, 12:48 PM
Carr played well in the first quarter. After that he and the remiander of the offense fell into a lull save for a failed attempt in the RZ which resulted in a FG.

I am still waiting for an adjustment to ever be made by a Texans offense. I trust there is a piece of the Kubiak/Sherman tutelage that has not been offered as of yet and that is actual film breakdown over the course of the game. You must have a baseline and yesterday's game is just that. We will get better. No turnovers is a step in the right direction.Speaking of adjustments, the Eagles took away the waggle/roll and forced us to beat them from the pocket as their adjustment after the first drive. All year long we are going to see teams load up for the run and take away the roll/boot. Until the offense beats teams deep in the middle of the field consistently, we will struggle to run as well. Football is like chess as there is a countermeasure for everything. Teams will take away what you do best so you have to be good at multiple things to keep them honest and not over play certain elements of your offense. We aren't a good team when we are forced to pass from the pocket...and this is a very fundamental element of the NFL game.

Wharton
09-12-2006, 02:17 PM
I on the same page as Wonger when it comes to DC but as a person who works with number most of the day, I don't have much faith in statistics.

As proof that the statistics of a QB are flawed (very flawed), I submit the Redskins vs. Vikings. I had an opportunity to watch the game last night and made a point of watching the QBs and comparing their play to DCís. Both Brad Johnson and Mark Brunell are crafty veterans who have seen it all. Comments made by the announcers (mostly Joe Thiesman) included things like:

* Brad knows were he wants to go with the ball before the snap.
* Brad looks one way, if the receiver isn't open; he immediately turns and throws the ball to the second receiver. He knows where the second receiver is at all times and knows if he will be open.
* Itís a credit to Mark to learn a new playbook and execute this offense.
* You'd better get to Brad fast because he doesn't hold onto the ball long.

IMHO, last night's game featured two excellent QBs who preformed much better then DC on Saturday; however, their QB Rating was 88.6 (Brad) and 76.9 (Mark).

Now having said that, DC is looking better this year, then last. Of course, thatís not saying much, anything would look better then his performance last year.

real
09-12-2006, 02:34 PM
I on the same page as Wonger when it comes to DC but as a person who works with number most of the day, I don't have much faith in statistics.

As proof that the statistics of a QB are flawed (very flawed), I submit the Redskins vs. Vikings. I had an opportunity to watch the game last night and made a point of watching the QBs and comparing their play to DCís. Both Brad Johnson and Mark Brunell are crafty veterans who have seen it all. Comments made by the announcers (mostly Joe Thiesman) included things like:

* Brad knows were he wants to go with the ball before the snap.
* Brad looks one way, if the receiver isn't open; he immediately turns and throws the ball to the second receiver. He knows where the second receiver is at all times and knows if he will be open.
* Itís a credit to Mark to learn a new playbook and execute this offense.
* You'd better get to Brad fast because he doesn't hold onto the ball long.

IMHO, last night's game featured two excellent QBs who preformed much better then DC on Saturday; however, their QB Rating was 88.6 (Brad) and 76.9 (Mark).

Now having said that, DC is looking better this year, then last. Of course, thatís not saying much, anything would look better then his performance last year.

I think Carr's numbers will be better because of the offense we run...It's very QB friendly...But Carr still had a good game

buddyboy
09-12-2006, 02:35 PM
i seem to recall on one of the early drives, maybe even the first one, where carr was like, 4-4 in completions. but then he got flushed out and threw the ball away and got booed. 4-5 marching down the field and throwing the ball away to avoid a sack? there should def. be NO boos for carr when he is 4-5 in completions.

SESupergenius
09-12-2006, 02:36 PM
We aren't a good team when we have to rely on the offensive line to hold their own and allow David to scan the field. With no running game that puts us in long situations from time to time, Carr will have to find the open man down the field, but as we have seen for almost 5 years now, the offensive line can not be counted on to do their job. Same old, same old. It's crystal clear to me that when Carr's line does good, Carr does good. If the line breaks down, Carr has the weapon of his legs to get us the 1st down, something that Johnson or Brunell do not have. Once Kubiak gets with Carr on a plan to counter the blitz, we are going to do well. It's early, but Carr is learning everything Kubiak is asking of him and will probably continue to progress under his eye.

BigBull17
09-12-2006, 03:09 PM
Carr was much better and my gripe has always been with Chris Palmer. He put Carr back years with his development. Palmer was all about finding seventy ways to get the ball into the flat or at five yards to DDavis. With DD out, and Palmer gone, we are seeing the expansion of the offense.

We need to see more slants and crossing routes with AJ. A little too much vertical stuff when we are in 2nd and long and 3rd and long situations.

My biggest frustration came on Javon Kearse's sack. You CAN'T block Kearse with a tight end! That was the equivalent to giving him a Brett Favre giftwrapped sack to Strahan! Gotta get out of that protection!

------

Side note: The broadcast showed the Eagles bench just before the blown coverage on Stallworth's touchdown. You could see Andy Reid turn to an assistant and smile at him and say, "watch this". When I saw that, I started screaming at my tv for playaction pass! Ugh! Caught a bunch of fish with that hook!

That was the part of the game that made me cringe. Why you would think a TE, and if Im mistaken a ROOKIE TE, could block Kearse. He isnt called the Freak for nothin.