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View Full Version : Our Secondary Is Terrible--Ahmad Carroll.


WILLIEG
09-11-2006, 12:04 AM
One of our biggest problems this year is the play or lack of play from our secondary. D. robinson is the only bright spot, but I feel as if his coverage skills aren't shinning like they were when he was a rookie. Everyone else is averahge and that's putting it nicely. They are ging to be the achilles heel of this year. And I really wish we had the type of LB's that could drop into coverage and help out our secondary, but we don't. However, D. Ryans is going to be a great MLB, so at least that's a bright spot.

DBCooper
09-11-2006, 12:08 AM
Then our front 4 need to get after the QB before he can pick em apart.

MYDAUGHTER'STEXANS
09-11-2006, 01:09 AM
One of our biggest problems this year is the play or lack of play from our secondary. D. robinson is the only bright spot, but I feel as if his coverage skills aren't shinning like they were when he was a rookie. Everyone else is averahge and that's putting it nicely. They are ging to be the achilles heel of this year. And I really wish we had the type of LB's that could drop into coverage and help out our secondary, but we don't. However, D. Ryans is going to be a great MLB, so at least that's a bright spot.

It also hurts not having Faggins in there........:crutch:

The Dude Abides
09-11-2006, 01:09 AM
I saw little to no pressure on McNabb all game. That said, I thought Lewis Sanders looked terrible. Dunta only got beat on one play but he made some really good plays that made up for it.

Grid
09-11-2006, 01:29 AM
Dunta is just fine.

He is playing as hard as he did his Rookie year, he just doesnt have as much help.

utahmark
09-11-2006, 01:32 AM
its hard for me to be to hard on the secondary with the protection mcnabb had.

YoungTexanFan
09-11-2006, 09:33 AM
It also hurts not having Faggins in there........:crutch:

No it doesn't. He is slower than and less talented than Sanders and Buchanon. Believe me, you would be calling for him to be benched if you saw him play today.

Texans Horror
09-11-2006, 09:40 AM
Dunta played an excellent game. He was all over the place. It felt like every three tackles belonged to either Dunta or Demeco.

That being said, we are going to be lit up if we can't rush the QB. The secondary, overall, is one of our weakest areas. Hopefully this next offseason (only four months away!) we can get an effective secondary through trades, FA, or picks.

real
09-11-2006, 09:44 AM
It also hurts not having Faggins in there........:crutch:

Sanders had a good game...We didn't miss Faggins...

beerlover
09-11-2006, 09:49 AM
only one game. we already knew that the Texans defensive short commings we're in the secondary, no big surprise there, Philly realized this and took advantage of it. I'd almost bet a beer that the Texans draft a DB in the 1'st rd. in the 2007 NFL draft. also they release Phillip Buchanaon :yikes:

V Man
09-11-2006, 10:04 AM
I'd almost bet a beer that the Texans draft a DB in the 1'st rd. in the 2007 NFL draft. also they release Phillip Buchanaon :yikes:

I'd almost bet one that the Texans draft two to three DBs in next years draft. Not to mention another good LB.

real
09-11-2006, 10:08 AM
only one game. we already knew that the Texans defensive short commings we're in the secondary, no big surprise there, Philly realized this and took advantage of it. I'd almost bet a beer that the Texans draft a DB in the 1'st rd. in the 2007 NFL draft. also they release Phillip Buchanaon :yikes:

I think he is a free agent after this year..IIRC....But IMO, he is one of our more talented DB's...We would have to really re-load to let him walk...

Rightnow
09-11-2006, 10:16 AM
Yes, our secondary is probably the weakest spot on the team. It is questionable if Sanders, Earl or Brown would be starters on most teams and definitely wouldn't be starting on playoff teams. Besides Ryans our LB core is made up of backups as well. Orr and Greenwood are little more than warm bodies in the position and certainly aren't playmakers.

No pass rush with a below average secondary equals losing record for the year.

SheTexan
09-11-2006, 10:17 AM
Sanders had a good game...We didn't miss Faggins...


I was watching the TEXAN/EAGLE game. What were you watching?! Sanders got burned all day. I can't wait for Petey to get back. Sanders can keep the bench warm! JMO!!!

real
09-11-2006, 10:26 AM
I was watching the TEXAN/EAGLE game. What were you watching?! Sanders got burned all day. I can't wait for Petey to get back. Sanders can keep the bench warm! JMO!!!

I will rewatch the whole game and I will get back to you with a definite response...BUT...from just what I remember He played well...He had two nice pass break-ups that I remember, and I don't remember him "getting burned all day"....I know he was atleast not burned too bad in the first half....

chuckm
09-11-2006, 10:30 AM
You can put Deion Sanders, Lester Hayes, Ronnie Lott, and Jake Scott back there but if the QB has all day to throw .......... :cool:

Texans Horror
09-11-2006, 10:45 AM
No defensive pass rush, and low talent (do NOT include Dunta in that statement) in the secondary. At least this year we don't play any teams known for passing offenses (Philly, Indy, Dallas, Jax). Oh, snap...

:ohsnap:

jdog
09-11-2006, 11:03 AM
I will rewatch the whole game and I will get back to you with a definite response...BUT...from just what I remember He played well...He had two nice pass break-ups that I remember, and I don't remember him "getting burned all day"....I know he was atleast not burned too bad in the first half....

I thought Sanders was a bright spot on defense. He made some great plays.

El Amigo Invisible
09-11-2006, 11:57 AM
Why didn't we address this in the offseason?:challenge :fireball: :bowser:

El Tejano
09-11-2006, 12:00 PM
I thought Sanders was a bright spot on defense. He made some great plays.
I'm not sure how Sanders eats with those hands. He let two ints drop.

The whole DB field just stunk today.

Rightnow
09-11-2006, 12:02 PM
Why didn't we address this in the offseason?:challenge :fireball: :bowser:

We just couldn't address everything at once. As far as I know the Texans desperately sought a good, veteran corner in free agency, but didn't find one.

Sanders doesn't worry me as much as our safties. Earl and Brown are second stringers on nearly any other team in the league.

A very bad thing to come out of yesterday's loss was the total exposure of our secondary and pass rush. Every team we play this year is going to watch the Eagles and Colts game to see how they won. I think our defense is going to be in at the bottom of the league once again this year statistically speaking.

It's going to be a long season.

humbleone
09-11-2006, 02:03 PM
I'm not sure how Sanders eats with those hands. He let two ints drop.

The whole DB field just stunk today.

That is not what I saw. With the exception of one breakdown (CC Browns) the DB's played hard and made some nice plays.

What I saw was McNabb actually having so much time from Q2 on that on occassion that I actually think I saw him "smiling" on a couple of replays while we was camped out in the pocket. To be fair, no defensive backfield could have shut down the Eagles yesterday given the total lack of effective pressure we put on their QB.

El Tejano
09-11-2006, 02:04 PM
What happened to Buchannon?

kcwilson
09-11-2006, 02:05 PM
We just couldn't address everything at once. As far as I know the Texans desperately sought a good, veteran corner in free agency, but didn't find one.

Sanders doesn't worry me as much as our safties. Earl and Brown are second stringers on nearly any other team in the league.

A very bad thing to come out of yesterday's loss was the total exposure of our secondary and pass rush. Every team we play this year is going to watch the Eagles and Colts game to see how they won. I think our defense is going to be in at the bottom of the league once again this year statistically speaking.

It's going to be a long season.
I am not throwing in the towel yet. But I expected no more than a 6-10 maybe 7-9 season, and game 1 is surely different than the preseason in that the other team preps for you vs. running base coverages.

The defense was bad, and we all knew the sceondary is a problem. 2 year rebuilding plan as I have always said, is what we are going through. Whoever said 13-3 is greatly optimistic and I love your enthusiasm, but I just hope we see the team mature over the next few weeks and learn to make some plays are critical times.

Mario and the D-live has to figure out how to get to the qb.

TexanFanInCC
09-11-2006, 02:06 PM
its hard for me to be to hard on the secondary with the protection mcnabb had.

thank you! its not the secondaries fault at all. mcnabb could have played the game in a wheel chair. he had all the time to sit around and let the routes develop. the secondary can only cover for so long.

done88
09-11-2006, 02:19 PM
The pass rush had nothing to due with the fact every pass thrown to a reciever coverd by Sanders was caught. CC Brown bit on a fake handoff and made the Laughing stock of the week play. In the NFL no one should ever be that wide open. Our secondary made the team look like a lughing stock. Mcnabb had some pressure. He is very good at feeling the pressure and getting rid of the ball. The problem was that even when he threw to a coverd reciever the catch was made. They simply ran all the recievers away from Daunte and said no one else in your secondary can cover and they were correct.

humbleone
09-11-2006, 02:27 PM
The pass rush had nothing to due with the fact every pass thrown to a reciever coverd by Sanders was caught. CC Brown bit on a fake handoff and made the Laughing stock of the week play. In the NFL no one should ever be that wide open. Our secondary made the team look like a lughing stock. Mcnabb had some pressure. He is very good at feeling the pressure and getting rid of the ball. The problem was that even when he threw to a coverd reciever the catch was made. They simply ran all the recievers away from Daunte and said no one else in your secondary can cover and they were correct.

Actually Sanders had two passes defended that I can remember...one of which saved a touchdown. :shades:

Battle Red Flash
09-11-2006, 02:44 PM
It was one game. & the Eagles are very good.

Double Barrel
09-11-2006, 03:39 PM
Then our front 4 need to get after the QB before he can pick em apart.

yep. I thought that was the plan of action before yesterday. :howdy: It worked on the chaulkboard!

WILLIEG
09-11-2006, 03:54 PM
Many of you guys are correct in stating that our secondary is just horrible. It's a good thing that this years draft is full of many talented and fast CB's. We are just ging to have to live with the fact that many of the good passing teams are goning to have a field day against our secondary. McNair wants to believe that we are going to be competitive this year and we are, but a wining season is looking very far away and that's just the reality of what the former coaching staff has done to this organization. This really sucks, but I have no doubt that GK and his staff are going to have us realizing most of our dreams, in going to the playoofs and possible Super Bowl Championship.

cbnjwill
09-11-2006, 04:04 PM
our secondary is actually pretty decent dunte is a stud back there if your looking to blame someone for the poor performance yesterday its gotta be the d-line. this was supposed to be a strong point of your team after being the focal point of your off season... come on... could mario williams actually come close to a qb every once in a while. this guy seems soft to me poor technique and i dont think he has the motor or the heart to be really goood. mcnabb had all day to throw the ball we could have had the best corners in the history of football out there and we would have gotten killed. the pash rush is non existent. didnt bob mcnair say we took williams because we have to beat the colts and get pressure on manning. yeah right i dont think mario will get close enough to sneeze on manning let alone cause some serious pressure.. 6'7 300 pounds of crap... wheres reggie?

kingh99
09-11-2006, 04:14 PM
One of our biggest problems this year is the play or lack of play from our secondary. D. robinson is the only bright spot, but I feel as if his coverage skills aren't shinning like they were when he was a rookie. Everyone else is averahge and that's putting it nicely. They are ging to be the achilles heel of this year. And I really wish we had the type of LB's that could drop into coverage and help out our secondary, but we don't. However, D. Ryans is going to be a great MLB, so at least that's a bright spot.


A guy in my office told me the TV broadcast showed Andy Reid seconds before the Stallworth burn play for a touchdown throwing his play card to his assistance coach. The guy said he lip read Reid to say "Watch this". We wuz skewled.

SESupergenius
09-11-2006, 04:17 PM
One of our biggest problems this year is the play or lack of play from our secondary. D. robinson is the only bright spot, but I feel as if his coverage skills aren't shinning like they were when he was a rookie. The reason he looked so good his rookie year is because he played the other side. He's should be our #2 CB and look for us to address this in the offseason. Dunta plays well on the run when he sniffs out a play but will get blown up by a blocker. He gives up the big play from time to time that is costly to us. Sanders had 2 ints in his hands, he shouldn't even be starting and should be a dime back. Pbuc, your mom called and wants to know when you are coming out of the bathroom.

David's Busted Carr
09-11-2006, 04:34 PM
I was saying this ALL offseason and after the draft and everyone's response was...

"mario williams and the pass rush will solve all our problems and relieve the secondary"

LOL

Texans Horror
09-11-2006, 04:36 PM
I hear you, man. I was hoping we would drop down and pick up Huff. I thought that would be a great boon to us playing in the division we are in, but hey, them's the breaks.

infantrycak
10-03-2006, 06:02 PM
GREEN BAY, Wisc. -- A tough night has cost cornerback Ahmad Carroll his roster spot.

The Green Bay Packers on Tuesday released the 2004 first-round pick, who struggled a night earlier in a 31-9 loss to the Philadelphia Eagles.

Against the Eagles, Carroll was beaten for a 45-yard touchdown by wide receiver Greg Lewis in the third quarter. He also was called for pass interference and a defensive holding penalty later in the second half, setting up two more Philadelphia touchdowns.

Selected 25th overall in 2004 out of Arkansas, Carroll played in 34 games with 28 starts for the Packers, recording three interceptions.

Link (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2611948&campaign=rss&source=NFLHeadlines)

Third CB taken in the 2004 draft behind DeAngelo Hall and Dunta. Anyone watched Green Bay enough to have formed an informed opinion on him? Started a bunch of games until GB got Charles Woodson and now dumped in a move which seems as strange as waiving Wand. Hard to believe he wouldn't be an upgrade on McCleon.

4.26 must have been from a pro-day reporting.

Link (http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/ahmad_carroll)

edo783
10-03-2006, 06:40 PM
Being beaten like a rented mule in the game isn't a high recomendation, but Sherman should be able to give some inside info.

MasterC25
10-03-2006, 06:43 PM
Carroll who was a first round pick CB by Sherman and his crew up in Green Bay. Just got cut today after a horrible display against the Eagles in MNF. The fans and management just got tired of him. But I don't belive he recieved the proper coaching do yall believe the Texans we take a chance at him see they would have the bye week to work with him. Carroll has legit 4.2 speed and hits like a linebacker, but apperently has horrible horrible technique.

Wolf
10-03-2006, 06:57 PM
At this point ..I'd look at Chris Dishman's grandma :heh:

seriously, why not?

NJTexanFan
10-03-2006, 07:18 PM
I say that we pick him up, let me see the worse case scenario is that our secondary continues to get abused hmm seems like u can't go wrong with pick him up then

scourge
10-03-2006, 07:24 PM
I'd love for us to pick him up... He couldn't be any worse than Buchanon and at least he can tackle.

Bamaborn-Texasbred
10-03-2006, 07:50 PM
I'm just going to echo the replies that say Dunta isn't getting much help. He needs a good, consistent pass rush. He also needs a free safety and strong safety that have the heart, skills, and smarts necessary to back up a defensive backfield.

There isn't a corner in the league that isn't going to get burnt a couple of times a game in this league without the kind of help mentioned above. Cornerbacks are guys that didn't have the size, speed, and hands to be wide receivers.

Unless a cornerback of Dunta's caliber makes a stupid mental mistake, you can't hold him accountable for giving up a deep ball or two if he isn't getting good help from the rest of the defense.

aj.
10-03-2006, 07:52 PM
If there is little or no off-field baggage - and Sherman should know ... and

If the Texans think Carroll is better than Derrick Johnson .... and

If Kubiak, Smith and Hoke think they can coach him up ... and

Given the fact that the contract is not a biggie to assume ....

Then, it's a no brainer.

Bamaborn-Texasbred
10-03-2006, 07:56 PM
If there is little or no off-field baggage - and Sherman should know ... and

If the Texans think Carroll is better than Derrick Johnson .... and

If Kubiak, Smith and Hoke think they can coach him up ... and

Given the fact that the contract is not a biggie to assume ....

Then, it's a no brainer.

I couldn't have said it this well.

This organization doesn't seem afraid to tinker with things. I like that. This defense will get better. The running game will get better.

I think we will all be foaming at the mouth for a playoff game this time next year.

ArlingtonTexan
10-03-2006, 09:27 PM
I'd love for us to pick him up... He couldn't be any worse than Buchanon and at least he can tackle.


Yes, he can be and is worse than P-Buch. Buchannon at least had a year or so (oakland) where he looked decent and made a few plays. This has never been the case with Carroll. I guess throw him a line hope you get lucky, but not expecting too much if he comes here myself.

infantrycak
10-03-2006, 09:54 PM
but not expecting too much if he comes here myself.

Looking for an improvement at dime not anywhere higher in the food chain.

TK_Gamer
10-03-2006, 10:14 PM
personally I was very dissappointed that Pbuc got hurt early on, he was trying really hard in camp, working on tackling, good things looked like they were happening, who knows how he will do if and when he gets a starting spot, I think I would rather have him than mecleon or sanders. heck i'd rather have him at FS than cc brown for that matter. brown is a SS no matter what hat he puts on. and sanders plays like a safety, come to think of it what exactly does a safety look like? we really havent had one have we?.....

HJam72
10-03-2006, 10:17 PM
I still think Buchannon would make an excellent free safety and CC Brown can move to SS.

Tayton
10-03-2006, 10:55 PM
I have said for several months that WE NEED ANOTHER CORNER. No one seemed to listen. That being said, and I may be the only one to say this, but I have been pleasanty surprised with Sanders. Maybe it's because I expected so very little. I am not a Faggins fan and don't think he is a significant upgrade over Sanders. Our nickle package will be better when Faggins gets back. Sanders is not a great cover corner but has ben in position to make some plays and he can tackle. I personally think Buchanan is pretty useless both in coverage and tackling, and misses alot of wholes in the return game. (Sorry for the run on sentences but I'm tired.)

mexican_texan
10-03-2006, 10:56 PM
I still think Buchannon would make an excellent free safety and CC Brown can move to SS.
We're trying to get rid of CC Brown, not Glenn Earl. Glenn Earl is the only DB making plays.

Texans86
10-03-2006, 11:46 PM
Why the heck has Buchanon not been on the field. Is he really that bad in the coaches eyes? Surely he can't be that bad, can he?

thunderkyss
10-03-2006, 11:53 PM
I have said for several months that WE NEED ANOTHER CORNER. No one seemed to listen. That being said, and I may be the only one to say this, but I have been pleasanty surprised with Sanders. Maybe it's because I expected so very little. I am not a Faggins fan and don't think he is a significant upgrade over Sanders. Our nickle package will be better when Faggins gets back. Sanders is not a great cover corner but has ben in position to make some plays and he can tackle. I personally think Buchanan is pretty useless both in coverage and tackling, and misses alot of wholes in the return game. (Sorry for the run on sentences but I'm tired.)

If you want to shut down a WR, you put a guy like Buchannon on him, and let him do what he do. PBuchanon can be a shutdown corner, much more so than Dunta. If you need your corners for run Support, then Dunta is your man.

So far, the only bad play I've seen from Sanders, was biting on the playfake, and letting Stallworth score that TD. ChrisChambers did get away from him once, but landed out of bounds. Other than that, he's actually been more of a shutdown corner than Dunta, and has had more opportunity to intercept passes(if dude could catch, he'd have 6 by now).

Dunta is getting beat on the line, on the run, being turned around by guys with surgically repaired knees....... & he hasn't been looking for the ball.

Blake
10-04-2006, 12:01 AM
What makes any of you think that Batman would want to come to this team?

infantrycak
10-04-2006, 12:04 AM
I am not a Faggins fan and don't think he is a significant upgrade over Sanders.

Faggins would have INT'd 2-3 of the 5 opportunities Sanders has blown so far. Sanders has done better than I expected but those kinds of opportunities being cashed in on are what elevates teams.

Vinny
10-04-2006, 12:06 AM
Ahmad Carroll has been considered a bust for a while...but I agree with aj and infantry up there ^^...some players are late bloomers or just need another start on a fresh team. Won't hurt to give him a look-see.

ComstockLode
10-04-2006, 12:56 AM
I still think Buchannon would make an excellent free safety and CC Brown can move to SS.

Safeties have to actually make tackles....or at least try to make tackles. :shoot:

Tayton
10-04-2006, 08:40 AM
Those that think that our only bad play has come from Sanders haven't been watching McCleon. I'm missing what evidence there may be that Buchanan is a "shut down corner". We don't have one of them.

real
10-04-2006, 08:49 AM
I'm missing what evidence there may be that Buchanan is a "shut down corner".

He has good footwork and the athletic ability to stay with and jump with most recievers....He also is pretty good at finding the ball once it has been thrown...The only thing buch lacks is a physical nature...:twocents:

Vinny
10-04-2006, 08:50 AM
Those that think that our only bad play has come from Sanders haven't been watching McCleon. I'm missing what evidence there may be that Buchanan is a "shut down corner". We don't have one of them.

Buchanan is the Cowardly Lion of cornerbacks.....but there is no Oz in the NFL. Nobody is going to grant him a heart. imo Sanders and McCleon have both struggled.

Mr teX
10-04-2006, 09:20 AM
He has good footwork and the athletic ability to stay with and jump with most recievers....He also is pretty good at finding the ball once it has been thrown...The only thing buch lacks is a physical nature...:twocents:

pretty good at finding the ball? i don't know what you've been looking at but all i've seen from dude since he got here is terrible footwork & missed tackles. Now having said that, all of our DB's are looking like that, but at least all of them will make a tackle every now & then.

O.G.
10-04-2006, 09:21 AM
Ahmad Carroll has been considered a bust for a while...but I agree with aj and infantry up there ^^...some players are late bloomers or just need another start on a fresh team. Won't hurt to give him a look-see.

Agreed. Maybe he needs a change of scenery.

Mr teX
10-04-2006, 09:24 AM
Agreed. Maybe he needs a change of scenery.

That's what they said about P-burnt, & look what he has brought to the team. IMO, they need to replace CC & Morlon Greenwood. Whether you guys believe it or not, the LB's play a huge role in coverage as well.

Vinny
10-04-2006, 09:25 AM
That's what they said about P-burnt, & look what he has brought to the team. IMO, they need to replace CC & Morlon Greenwood. Whether you guys believe it or not, the LB's play a huge role in coverage as well.The big difference is that nobody is going to give up two picks for Carroll. Linebackers generally zone the underneath stuff....I wouldn't call it a "huge" role. Our sam stuggles much more than our will in coverage so far.

texasguy346
10-04-2006, 09:29 AM
I'm sure it's already been said, but I'll go ahead and say it again. Carroll has got to be better than McCleon so provided he comes at a reasonable price then go for it.

Mr teX
10-04-2006, 09:31 AM
In case you didn't see the Washington game, that's all Brunell threw was "underneath" stuff & yeah i agree about the draft picks but Carroll's already had 2 years in the league & I am just not a firm believer in the "change of scenery" thing with anyone other than QBs.

NJ Texan
10-04-2006, 09:33 AM
Wasn't Carroll released? Meaning we could pick him off of waivers? Or am I wrong here?

Vinny
10-04-2006, 09:34 AM
In case you didn't see the Washington game, that's all Brunell threw was "underneath" stuff & yeah i agree about the draft picks but Carroll's already had 2 years in the league & I am just not a firm believer in the "change of scenery" thing with anyone other than QBs.I probably go over games as obsessively as anyone here and stand behind my comment. I'd blame our scheme as much or more than our players with that Washington debacle.

Texans_Chick
10-04-2006, 09:35 AM
Here's a Green Bay fan's perspective from the NFL Fanhouse:

Link (http://packers.aolsportsblog.com/2006/10/03/cheeseheads-get-their-wish-carroll-gets-the-boot/#comments)

Since being drafted by Mike Sherman in the first round of the 2004 NFL draft, Carroll had been a cancer both on and off the field, displaying both a lack of maturity and an complete inability to cover wideouts without making illegal contact. While he seemed to have all of the athletic tools and potential to eventually turn into a good corner, Carroll's cocky attitude and lack of a learning curve made him popular with only the men in zebra stripes.

Mr teX
10-04-2006, 09:38 AM
Wasn't Carroll released? Meaning we could pick him off of waivers? Or am I wrong here?

No, he's still in GB, getting eaten alive out there. Case in point, in the Philly game he came off the bench when woodson went down, & Philly IMMEDIATELY went after him & he didn't disappoint.

Vinny
10-04-2006, 09:38 AM
No, he's still in GB, getting eaten alive out there. Case in point, in the Philly game he came off the bench when woodson went down, & Philly IMMEDIATELY went after him & he didn't disappoint.He was released.

Mr teX
10-04-2006, 09:40 AM
I probably go over games as obsessively as anyone here and stand behind my comment. I'd blame our scheme as much or more than our players with that Washington debacle.

Agreed, just as long you know that our personel is trash as well.

Mr teX
10-04-2006, 09:41 AM
He was released.

really, did they pick him back up or something b/c i could've sworn he was out there in the Monday night game.

NJ Texan
10-04-2006, 09:42 AM
really, did they pick him back up or something b/c i could've sworn he was out there in the Monday night game.

He was. I believe he was released yesterday.

TexanFanInCC
10-04-2006, 12:20 PM
We're trying to get rid of CC Brown, not Glenn Earl. Glenn Earl is the only DB making plays.

exactly. glenn earl has been the only guy forcing turnovers. he is the closest thing the texans have to a troy polamalu. i say we take a chance on ahmad carroll. of course he has ties to sherman. its really a low risk and possibly a rewwarding risk. the thing with the secondary not being able to cover has alot to do with the front 7. either they sack the QB or they dont get close at all. most of the time, the turnovers are forced when the sack isnt made, but the QB is having to scramble and throw on the run and out of timing that is most effective.

Double Barrel
10-04-2006, 12:41 PM
Since being drafted by Mike Sherman in the first round of the 2004 NFL draft, Carroll had been a cancer both on and off the field, displaying both a lack of maturity and an complete inability to cover wideouts without making illegal contact. While he seemed to have all of the athletic tools and potential to eventually turn into a good corner, Carroll's cocky attitude and lack of a learning curve made him popular with only the men in zebra stripes.

Maybe the dude just hasn't had the right leader and coach to show him the way. If he's got the goods, then it's all in his head, and there is a chance that someone could focus him to be a productive corner.

I say give him a chance. We need the help, and if he turns it around, he'll be happy to be here. If he sucks, let him go.

edo783
10-04-2006, 12:44 PM
Mmmm, that says "He is a cancer both on and off the field", does that sound like the type of guy we usually pick up?

Double Barrel
10-04-2006, 12:48 PM
Mmmm, that says "He is a cancer both on and off the field", does that sound like the type of guy we usually pick up?

No, it doesn't. But at some point we're going to have to put the "character first" requirement away and look for dudes that can straight up play ball. Not saying Carroll is 'the man', but there are many good players with questionable backgrounds that get overlooked because of our owner's desire to put a team of boy scouts on the field.

the wonger need food
10-04-2006, 12:49 PM
Maybe he needs a change of scenery.

Let's see what kind of magic Coach Hoke can work with him like he did with PBust... and Dunta Bustinson.

mexican_texan
10-04-2006, 12:52 PM
No, it doesn't. But at some point we're going to have to put the "character first" requirement away and look for dudes that can straight up play ball. Not saying Carroll is 'the man', but there are many good players with questionable backgrounds that get overlooked because of our owner's desire to put a team of boy scouts on the field.
would you be opposed to a Bengals-like team then?

Double Barrel
10-04-2006, 12:57 PM
would you be opposed to a Bengals-like team then?

Not if they post W's on the scoreboard.

SBTexans08
10-04-2006, 01:08 PM
I still think Buchannon would make an excellent free safety and CC Brown can move to SS.

Not when FS are supposed to lay the hard hits and P-Buc is afraid of hits.

mexican_texan
10-04-2006, 01:26 PM
Not if they post W's on the scoreboard.
Can't say I agree. It's embarassing to see your team's player's in the news for DUIs and suicide attempts.

O.G.
10-04-2006, 01:29 PM
I'm sure it's already been said, but I'll go ahead and say it again. Carroll has got to be better than McCleon so provided he comes at a reasonable price then go for it.

It hasn't from what I've seen and I agree. You are getting a player a 3rd of the season in so what is it that you are risking?

Texans_Chick
10-04-2006, 01:33 PM
Mmmm, that says "He is a cancer both on and off the field", does that sound like the type of guy we usually pick up?

It's just the opinion of one Green Bay fan, and I was only posting it to give a Green Bay fan point of view and why he would get let go. I was not posting it as fact, because I don't know myself what his story is.

Sometimes guys that don't live up to their contracts just get into such a hole with their original teams that they just have to go elsewhere.

Mr teX
10-04-2006, 01:33 PM
Can't say I agree. It's embarassing to see your team's player's in the news for DUIs and suicide attempts.


Or stomping on someone's head with metal cleats.....................

Texian
10-04-2006, 02:06 PM
Carroll was known for his use of illegal contact to gain advantage over receivers. He was repeatedly burned and was well known for this throughout the league. Many taller and faster receivers could take advantage of his lack of attention and weak man coverage. Many teams knew that if they passed to the receiver he was covering that a penalty would usually follow. He was known by a few nicknames in the league and they were "Highway 28" and "Grabby Smurf".

Ahmad Carroll was cut by Green Bay after the worst game of his career in the loss to the Philadelphia Eagles on October 2, 2006. The game was televised on Monday Night Football by ESPN.

Batman was arrested for beating up a bouncer in a Fayetteville, Arkansas bar in February 2006. [1]

[edit]
NFL career
34 Games played with the Green Bay Packers by cornerback Ahmad Carroll

28 Games in which Carroll started

33 Total penalty flags thrown against Carroll

26 Penalties called for coverage violations such as pass interference, illegal contact and holding

256 Penalty yards marched off as a result of his 24 infractions that weren't declined or offset by another penalty

11 Touchdowns Carroll allowed in coverage

3 Interceptions by Carroll

$1.8 million Remaining portion of the $3.95 million in guaranteed money Carroll received as a rookie that the Packers must count against their salary cap either this year or next[
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmad_Carroll

rmartin65
10-04-2006, 02:14 PM
Carroll was known for his use of illegal contact to gain advantage over receivers. He was repeatedly burned and was well known for this throughout the league. Many taller and faster receivers could take advantage of his lack of attention and weak man coverage. Many teams knew that if they passed to the receiver he was covering that a penalty would usually follow. He was known by a few nicknames in the league and they were "Highway 28" and "Grabby Smurf".

Ahmad Carroll was cut by Green Bay after the worst game of his career in the loss to the Philadelphia Eagles on October 2, 2006. The game was televised on Monday Night Football by ESPN.

Batman was arrested for beating up a bouncer in a Fayetteville, Arkansas bar in February 2006. [1]

[edit]
NFL career
34 Games played with the Green Bay Packers by cornerback Ahmad Carroll

28 Games in which Carroll started

33 Total penalty flags thrown against Carroll

26 Penalties called for coverage violations such as pass interference, illegal contact and holding

256 Penalty yards marched off as a result of his 24 infractions that weren't declined or offset by another penalty

11 Touchdowns Carroll allowed in coverage

3 Interceptions by Carroll

$1.8 million Remaining portion of the $3.95 million in guaranteed money Carroll received as a rookie that the Packers must count against their salary cap either this year or next[
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmad_Carroll

Good info. After reading that I think we should not take a look at him.

Double Barrel
10-04-2006, 03:09 PM
Can't say I agree. It's embarassing to see your team's player's in the news for DUIs and suicide attempts.

I don't deny the embarrassment for the team (why would you be personally embarrassed?). But character alone should not be the deciding factor.

Just about every championship team has it's share of miscreants, usually balanced out with good character guys. But the one thing they all have in common is that they are great football players, first and foremost.

I just don't want a front office that consistently looks over players because they might have a black mark in their past. I don't think it's that unreasonable, to be honest with you.

These guys are not role models to me or my kid. They are entertainers, and they are human. Nobody is perfect. Can you imagine if we held our music and movie stars to the same standards?

NJTexanFan
10-04-2006, 03:17 PM
I see everyone saying how he get burned and alot penalties but watch how salty everyone is going to be after the bye week and we have to face Terry Glenn and TO, our corners against them HA!!! sometimes i feel bad for D-Rob but mark my words i don't want to hear no complaints after they give up about 5 touchdowns, I'm just hoping our offense can outplay their offense

Nbkan
10-05-2006, 12:34 AM
I am praying for Philly to beat the Cowboys up a bit. I never pray for injuries, but a few dents and dings will do.

jmerog
10-05-2006, 11:32 AM
According to CBS Sportsline, we have 2 of the best corners in the league...

http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/player...gularseason/DB