PDA

View Full Version : Offense........it is starting to click.


Hulk75
08-28-2006, 10:58 AM
I tell you what, if this was a complete game, we win this sucker. Our Offense was picking up speed and was clicking starting right before the half and it carried on into the 3rd..............Our Defense was salty all night.

Carr looked very good and was throwing the ball with accuracy and with smart possition of the football.You have to remeber that this is a new system for this guy and the team, he looked a little unsure the last 2 games, BUT last night it looked like it started to fire and started to click in Carr.AND this was against Denvers 1st D:cool: . At the beginning when they were doing bad, the sideline lady ask kubiak about the start of the football game and he said that, "We did not give him good calls to work with". And that ball had some hot sauce on it last night. Going trough his progressions nicely as well.

Vernond Morency looked awsome, would you guys agree? Did you see the Reggie Bushness come out:shades: when he was heading toward the sideline? But really I thought he played well.

Oline played well accept for one wiegert play:crying: , but all together they played as a group.Spencer is our new starting LT, the guy is a beast and we need to get his name out there.

Owen Daniels looked good catching that ball from Carr rolling out. And thank you for jumping on the ball Owen.

E-Weeeeeez-E-Eric Moulds..........Love how this guy plays and is taking to his roll without complaining. Did very well..............EXCEPT on the deep ball, did it look like he started off the ball for about 6 yards jogging? It did to me, and just like Starling Sharpe said "You will never know how well that ball was thrown, cause it looked like Moulds lost a step."

Defense did a great job a great job considering who we were playing and how tough there Offense was and is.

All around rest all our starters next week, cause we got it clicking down here and I am pumped about our season, I think we are going to be a surprise, a big surprise this year.

texflex513
08-28-2006, 11:05 AM
:backsout:

Cjeremy635
08-28-2006, 11:32 AM
I tell you what, if this was a complete game, we win this sucker. Our Offense was picking up speed and was clicking starting right before the half and it carried on into the 3rd..............Our Defense was salty all night.

Carr looked very good and was throwing the ball with accuracy and with smart possition of the football.You have to remeber that this is a new system for this guy and the team, he looked a little unsure the last 2 games, BUT last night it looked like it started to fire and started to click in Carr.AND this was against Denvers 1st D:cool: . At the beginning when they were doing bad, the sideline lady ask kubiak about the start of the football game and he said that, "We did not give him good calls to work with". And that ball had some hot sauce on it last night. Going trough his progressions nicely as well.

Vernond Morency looked awsome, would you guys agree? Did you see the Reggie Bushness come out:shades: when he was heading toward the sideline? But really I thought he played well.

Oline played well accept for one wiegert play:crying: , but all together they played as a group.Spencer is our new starting LT, the guy is a beast and we need to get his name out there.

Owen Daniels looked good catching that ball from Carr rolling out. And thank you for jumping on the ball Owen.

E-Weeeeeez-E-Eric Moulds..........Love how this guy plays and is taking to his roll without complaining. Did very well..............EXCEPT on the deep ball, did it look like he started off the ball for about 6 yards jogging? It did to me, and just like Starling Sharpe said "You will never know how well that ball was thrown, cause it looked like Moulds lost a step."

Defense did a great job a great job considering who we were playing and how tough there Offense was and is.

All around rest all our starters next week, cause we got it clicking down here and I am pumped about our season, I think we are going to be a surprise, a big surprise this year.

Sorry, I must have been watching a totally different game or you must have been watching one of the "other camera angles". :tease: I saw nothing Bushesque in Morency, though I don't think Bush is all he's cracked up to be. The only resemblance on the play you speak of was that he should have hit a hole and went North & South..not side to side. I didn't see much or any zone blocking and "one cut and go" running attacks. Moulds is a solid # 2 who seems to have lost a step but he has good hands and YAC and I feel what he contributes in leaderships & experience as well as what he does on the field will prove to be invaluable. Carr only looked sharp at the end against the 2nd team defense IIRC. Yes, they started to gel but I think it would have been too little too late in a real game. We need to improve in a lot of areas and that's what this game was for. I am still optomistic about this year but I didn't get your flavor of koolaid at the supermarket....they must have been sold out.

J-Man
08-28-2006, 11:42 AM
I will have to say that the offense again started slow and was clearly picking up some steam. That has been opposite of our M.O. in recent past...and I can live with that. It's always better to be solid the whole game but if you have to pick a half to have your stuff together it would be the 2nd.

My one big complaint about the defense was the play of the D-tackles. Several mental mistakes that need to be cleaned up. Mario consistently drew double teams or chips which, again, is fine with me. I thought that Weaver was solid and Jason Babin off the bench was bringing some heat as a pass rusher.

Overall I thought that Lundy and Morency were very solid and I am very impressed with Ryans and Owen Daniels. I have to admit that the crop of draft picks this year definetly seem to be shaping up. I think it will be a tough year but I suspect we will continue to see signs of a bright future.

powerfuldragon
08-28-2006, 11:46 AM
Our offense seemed impotent last night. The desire may have been there, but they seemed to lack finishing ability.

[insert cleverly phrased viagra joke]

Texanfan4ever
08-28-2006, 11:46 AM
I like Hulk's koolaid.

HOU-TEX
08-28-2006, 11:55 AM
I tell you what, if this was a complete game, we win this sucker. Our Offense was picking up speed and was clicking starting right before the half and it carried on into the 3rd..............Our Defense was salty all night.

Carr looked very good and was throwing the ball with accuracy and with smart possition of the football.You have to remeber that this is a new system for this guy and the team, he looked a little unsure the last 2 games, BUT last night it looked like it started to fire and started to click in Carr.AND this was against Denvers 1st D:cool: . At the beginning when they were doing bad, the sideline lady ask kubiak about the start of the football game and he said that, "We did not give him good calls to work with". And that ball had some hot sauce on it last night. Going trough his progressions nicely as well.

Vernond Morency looked awsome, would you guys agree? Did you see the Reggie Bushness come out:shades: when he was heading toward the sideline? But really I thought he played well.

Oline played well accept for one wiegert play:crying: , but all together they played as a group.Spencer is our new starting LT, the guy is a beast and we need to get his name out there.

Owen Daniels looked good catching that ball from Carr rolling out. And thank you for jumping on the ball Owen.

E-Weeeeeez-E-Eric Moulds..........Love how this guy plays and is taking to his roll without complaining. Did very well..............EXCEPT on the deep ball, did it look like he started off the ball for about 6 yards jogging? It did to me, and just like Starling Sharpe said "You will never know how well that ball was thrown, cause it looked like Moulds lost a step."

Defense did a great job a great job considering who we were playing and how tough there Offense was and is.

All around rest all our starters next week, cause we got it clicking down here and I am pumped about our season, I think we are going to be a surprise, a big surprise this year.

Thier offense was clicking too. Offensively, IMO, we were average at best against thier 1st D. IIRC, I don't think one ball was thrown to a WR while thier 1st D was in. They were all drops to the RB. We have to improve offensivly. I think our D did an excellent job considering the field position the offense gave the Broncs. I think we've improved leaps and bounds compared to last year. With that being said, there's plenty to work on.:ok:

TexansFan99
08-28-2006, 12:02 PM
Did you forget to add :sarcasm:

hollywood_texan
08-28-2006, 12:03 PM
I think the offense has way to go. Carr did ok.

After the game, I started think that if AJ doesn't start getting the ball in a serious manner, I don't know how we will be able to keep him. I know we can franchise him, but that is like a last resort and causes all sorts of problems. Kubiak, has to get Carr cranking a little bit more to give AJ the catches he needs. Otherwise, I think he will be looking to split after next year.

I guess it was Sterling Sharpe doing the commentary on the NFL Network during the game, and he said something I have been saying for the last month. Sharpe was going through the Texans schedule and how tough it is. Sharpe said if the Texans don't beat the Eagles, they may not get a W until Thanksgiving. I think he was exaggerating a bit but was making a good point. Those first six games are killers and they have to start off strong with a W against the Eagles. Otherwise, they will more than likely start in a very big hole when they start on the easy stretch of their schedule with game 7.

From what I have seen so far, don't look for the offense to put up amazing numbers and points at the early part of the season.

The Eagles game really concerns because they need that game because of the next five they could easily lose.

Either win a nail bitter or the defense just dominates with turnovers that returned for touchdowns in a route, my prediction for the Eagles game.

infantrycak
08-28-2006, 12:04 PM
IIRC, I don't think one ball was thrown to a WR while thier 1st D was in.

2nd Qtr
1-10-HOU47 (2:07) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 47 for 6 yards (Da.Williams).
2-8-DEN40 (1:22) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to E.Moulds.
3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).
4-3-DEN35 (1:01) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 30 for 5 yards (Da.Williams, I.Gold).

3rd Qtr--still 1st team D
1-10-HOU20 (15:00) D.Carr pass short right to A.Johnson ran ob at HST 34 for 14 yards.
2-6-DEN47 (12:48) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to E.Moulds.
3-6-DEN47 (12:41) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to A.Johnson (Da.Williams).

Vinny
08-28-2006, 12:07 PM
Funny.....but I have people from all over the country emailing me and telling me Carr looked awful last night...I tell them hell, he looked better last night than I'm used too. The only people who tell me Carr looks like a legit big time QB are our homers, and people who never get to see him and still think his mega contract means he is good.

Kaiser Toro
08-28-2006, 12:12 PM
Second verse same as the first. Carr starting slow and picking up is not somehting new. In fact, it is the rule. But the unfortunate part of the story is that the 4th quarter is worse than the 1st quarter.

These are DC's 2005 situational splits, scroll to the Quarter breakdown:
http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/306268/splits/2005

We have four years of data. We have four years of obeservations. Carr has been one thing and that is consistent.

HOU-TEX
08-28-2006, 12:29 PM
2nd Qtr
1-10-HOU47 (2:07) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 47 for 6 yards (Da.Williams).
2-8-DEN40 (1:22) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to E.Moulds.
3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).
4-3-DEN35 (1:01) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 30 for 5 yards (Da.Williams, I.Gold).

3rd Qtr--still 1st team D
1-10-HOU20 (15:00) D.Carr pass short right to A.Johnson ran ob at HST 34 for 14 yards.
2-6-DEN47 (12:48) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to E.Moulds.
3-6-DEN47 (12:41) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to A.Johnson (Da.Williams).

Not that it matters but I think thier 2nd teamers slowly started coming in late 2nd quarter and into the third. Either way, the offense needs improvement.:)

Crowd noise appeared to be a factor in a false start penalty against the Texans, who drove into the red zone against the Broncos second-team defense. The fourth-down penalty backed the Texans up enough to require a field goal, which Brown made. Denver held a 10-6 lead.

http://www.denverbroncos.com/page.php?id=341&contentID=5812

Vinny
08-28-2006, 12:32 PM
Second verse same as the first. Carr starting slow and picking up is not somehting new. In fact, it is the rule. But the unfortunate part of the story is that the 4th quarter is worse than the 1st quarter.

These are DC's 2005 situational splits, scroll to the Quarter breakdown:
http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/306268/splits/2005

We have four years of data. We have four years of obeservations. Carr has been one thing and that is consistent.
Here is Carr on 3rd down this preseason. He has passed 10 times and converted ZERO 3rd downs into 1st downs.

3-5-HOU40 (9:54) D.Carr pass short middle to E.Moulds to HST 44 for 4 yards (D.Johnson, P.Surtain).
3-23-HOU32 (13:48) D.Carr pass short left to W.Lundy to HST 45 for 13 yards (W.Witherspoon).
3-10-HOU29 (9:37) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to A.Johnson.
3-11-STL19 (3:24) D.Carr sacked at SL 28 for -9 yards (C.Chavous). FUMBLES (C.Chavous), touched at SL 28, RECOVERED by SL-C.Chavous at SL 30. C.Chavous to SL 41 for 11 yards (F.Weary). Play Challenged by HST and REVERSED. D.Carr pass incomplete short left to A.Johnson [C.Chavous].
3-7-HOU42 (13:52) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to A.Johnson.
3-7-HOU35 (4:44) D.Carr pass incomplete short left to A.Johnson (D.Groce).
3-4-50 (6:44) D.Carr sacked at 50 for 0 yards (K.Lang). FUMBLES (K.Lang), touched at DEN 48, ball out of bounds at HST 44.
3-4-HOU48 (3:22) D.Carr sacked at HST 41 for -7 yards (E.Ekuban).
3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).
3-5-DEN11 (:12) D.Carr spiked the ball to stop the clock.

infantrycak
08-28-2006, 12:34 PM
You missed one--still a bleak picture:

3-6-DEN29 (10:16) D.Carr pass to E.Moulds to DEN 18 for 11 yards (C.Cox; K.Paymah).
1-10-DEN18 (9:22) V.Morency left guard to DEN 16 for 2 yards (C.Vaughn).

Vinny
08-28-2006, 12:35 PM
You missed one--still a bleak picture:

3-6-DEN29 (10:16) D.Carr pass to E.Moulds to DEN 18 for 11 yards (C.Cox; K.Paymah).
1-10-DEN18 (9:22) V.Morency left guard to DEN 16 for 2 yards (C.Vaughn).
Ok...one.

Lucky
08-28-2006, 12:36 PM
I guess it was Sterling Sharpe doing the commentary on the NFL Network during the game, and he said something I have been saying for the last month. Sharpe was going through the Texans schedule and how tough it is. Sharpe said if the Texans don't beat the Eagles, they may not get a W until Thanksgiving.
This is the same Sterling Sharpe that at the expansion draft said the Texans would win the AFC South in their first year of existence. The Texans won't lose their first 6 games of the season. Or win their first 6 games in the season. The answer lies somewhere in between. I don't know how many, neither does Sterling Sharpe.

infantrycak
08-28-2006, 12:37 PM
Not that it matters but I think thier 2nd teamers slowly started coming in late 2nd quarter and into the third.

Just like the Texans putting in Malone during the 1st half, the Broncos rotate players a lot--not the same thing as putting in the 2nd D. Look at who made all the plays on that last draft--DJ Williams, Al Wilson, Darrent Williams, Ian Gold--all 1st teamers.

SESupergenius
08-28-2006, 12:37 PM
Funny.....but I have people from all over the country emailing me and telling me Carr looked awful last night...I tell them hell, he looked better last night than I'm used too. The only people who tell me Carr looks like a legit big time QB are our homers, and people who never get to see him and still think his mega contract means he is good.
Man you are ruthless with Carr. He by far was not spectacular last night (either was Andre Johnson), but he was decent. He actually threw to TE's and settled down a bit. We had some really good long drives that led to scores (no TD's however) I'm not panicking on Carr as I know it will take a little time for him to click with this type of offense (notice he Kubiak didn't really rip him for the slow start).

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 12:38 PM
Funny.....but I have people from all over the country emailing me and telling me Carr looked awful last night...I tell them hell, he looked better last night than I'm used too. The only people who tell me Carr looks like a legit big time QB are our homers, and people who never get to see him and still think his mega contract means he is good.

No doubt man, everyone not drinking battle red kool-aid sees Carr for what he is....which is a below average QB. One day these homers will wake up and smell the losses. Dude still looks like a rookie and his delivery has totally regressed in his mechanics. I can't believe anyone would say he looked good. He looked terrible. I hope the guy improves but if he doesnt I want us to be horrible this year so we can finally get rid of that loser and sign someone worth a crud.

If I hear from another person on this board that Carr looks good or the offense was 'clicking' I think I am going to vomit battle red kool aid. Also Lindy looked like arse as well. Morency better be the starter come opening day because he runs better and more importantly blocks better.

I want to see where the Carr supporters are when we are 3-13 at the end of the season. I hope you guys just disappear into a hole or something because to be honest I am sick of all the homering and excuses. Enough is enough and please admit you were wrong. Carr sucks.

doug from the woodlands

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 12:38 PM
Man you are ruthless with Carr. He by far was not spectacular last night (either was Andre Johnson), but he was decent. He actually threw to TE's and settled down a bit. We had some really good long drives that led to scores (no TD's however) I'm not panicking on Carr as I know it will take a little time for him to click with this type of offense (notice he Kubiak didn't really rip him for the slow start).
Kubiak himself acctually took the blame.

Vinny
08-28-2006, 12:38 PM
Man you are ruthless with Carr. He by far was not spectacular last night (either was Andre Johnson), but he was decent. He actually threw to TE's and settled down a bit. We had some really good long drives that led to scores (no TD's however) I'm not panicking on Carr as I know it will take a little time for him to click with this type of offense (notice he Kubiak didn't really rip him for the slow start).I just tell it like I see it. Nothing ruthless about that. I'm not panicing on Carr either. I just don't think he is a very good QB.

texan279
08-28-2006, 12:40 PM
Here is Carr on 3rd down this preseason. He has passed 10 times and converted ZERO 3rd downs into 1st downs.

3-5-HOU40 (9:54) D.Carr pass short middle to E.Moulds to HST 44 for 4 yards (D.Johnson, P.Surtain).
3-23-HOU32 (13:48) D.Carr pass short left to W.Lundy to HST 45 for 13 yards (W.Witherspoon).
3-10-HOU29 (9:37) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to A.Johnson.
3-11-STL19 (3:24) D.Carr sacked at SL 28 for -9 yards (C.Chavous). FUMBLES (C.Chavous), touched at SL 28, RECOVERED by SL-C.Chavous at SL 30. C.Chavous to SL 41 for 11 yards (F.Weary). Play Challenged by HST and REVERSED. D.Carr pass incomplete short left to A.Johnson [C.Chavous].
3-7-HOU42 (13:52) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to A.Johnson.
3-7-HOU35 (4:44) D.Carr pass incomplete short left to A.Johnson (D.Groce).
3-4-50 (6:44) D.Carr sacked at 50 for 0 yards (K.Lang). FUMBLES (K.Lang), touched at DEN 48, ball out of bounds at HST 44.
3-4-HOU48 (3:22) D.Carr sacked at HST 41 for -7 yards (E.Ekuban).
3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).
3-5-DEN11 (:12) D.Carr spiked the ball to stop the clock.

Didn't you post this in another thread?

No offense but people who post stats as 'proof' a guy can play have no clue to begin with. Football is not a game like baseball where you can look at a stat line and determine the talent of skills of a player. Just posting a ton of stats and saying a guy is this or that is folly and borderline amusing imo.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 12:43 PM
Sorry, I must have been watching a totally different game or you must have been watching one of the "other camera angles". :tease: I saw nothing Bushesque in Morency, though I don't think Bush is all he's cracked up to be. The only resemblance on the play you speak of was that he should have hit a hole and went North & South..not side to side. I didn't see much or any zone blocking and "one cut and go" running attacks. Moulds is a solid # 2 who seems to have lost a step but he has good hands and YAC and I feel what he contributes in leaderships & experience as well as what he does on the field will prove to be invaluable. Carr only looked sharp at the end against the 2nd team defense IIRC. Yes, they started to gel but I think it would have been too little too late in a real game. We need to improve in a lot of areas and that's what this game was for. I am still optomistic about this year but I didn't get your flavor of koolaid at the supermarket....they must have been sold out.
The Bush thing was ment for a joke big dog. And the play I am talking about is not the one you think, I am talking about the throw to him were he looked like he was running out of bounds then stopped and then spun for 2 more yards.
Carr only looked sharp against the second team?.........Well hate to burst your bubble but their 1st team D was in just as long as our O was........Unless Champ Lynch and Darrent change #s with someone else.
Kooliad? or Truth.

chuckm
08-28-2006, 12:44 PM
Carr had a rough game ... rough ... Kubiak knows more about all this than I do though, so I'll trust him to push the proper buttons ....

Double Barrel
08-28-2006, 12:44 PM
JMO, but DC doesn't look comfortable, much less in command, during the game. I see glimpses of signs of confidence, but it is inconsistent. But, hey, it's the pre-season, so I'm still holding out hope that the regular season *magically* changes things for the better.

Vinny
08-28-2006, 12:46 PM
Didn't you post this in another thread?yeah, you can't quantify players with 11-20 163. You can't tell a hitch pass from a 30 yard pass with what you did. I didn't do that, and I'm shocked you aren't smart enough to see a difference.

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 12:49 PM
Carr looked very good and was throwing the ball with accuracy and with smart possition of the football.

This is the only area I think we have to critic Carr on last night. IMHO, that's a plus. all this jittery shakey business, in regards to last nights game is way off. He looked calm cool and collected for the most part.

That third and whatever, when he left the pocket, thought about throwing it away, then deciding to run, and loosing the fumble, was one of his two really bad plays. & I've only got two things to say about that.
1)always protect the friggin football
2)always go with your first instinct........ right or wrong, you don't have time to weigh your options. even if it were a pick, but it on your list of situations where it's not a good idea to throw it.

But he definitely didn't show much as far as accuracy, and his placement could've/should've been better.

I also question if the dump offs were the best option......... but as we couldn't see what our recievers were doing, I can't say for sure.

Overall, I think he is progressing.........

texan279
08-28-2006, 12:49 PM
yeah, you can't quantify players with 11-20 163. You can't tell a hitch pass from a 30 yard pass with what you did. I didn't do that, and I'm shocked you aren't smart enough to see a difference.

Posting stats are posting stats, whether it is 11-20 163 or Carr being 1 for 10 on converting 3rd downs. I can't tell whether AJ dropped a pass, or Lundy ran out of bounds when he had open field to run, or whether Kevin Walter tripped and fell short of the marker based on what you posted. You can't quantify Carr on 3rd down conversions based on what his receivers may have done or not done to fail to convert the third down. On 3 of those plays the pass was completed, one a couple of others he was sacked and on one he spiked the ball, you cannot seriously blame Carr for not converting a 3rd down because he spiked the ball to stop the clock can you?

Vinny
08-28-2006, 12:51 PM
Posting stats are posting stats, whether it is 11-20 163 or Carr being 1 for 10 on converting 3rd downs. I can't tell whether AJ dropped a pass, or Lundy ran out of bounds when he had open field to run, or whether Kevin Walter tripped and fell short of the marker based on what you posted.
Well, I figure we all watched the game last night, and I pulled up specific situations and gave you the play by play. You pull up some general summaries from years ago and think you are making a fine point....remind me not to get pulled over in needville.

texan279
08-28-2006, 12:55 PM
Well, I figure we all watched the game last night, and I pulled up specific situations and gave you the play by play. You pull up some general summaries from years ago and think you are making a fine point....remind me not to get pulled over in needville.

Well I didn't watch the game last night and the stats you posted were from the entire preseason. But hey, if you want to hold Carr accountable for spiking the ball to stop the clock on 3rd down and failing to convert the third down or getting sacked on third down and not converting that third down go ahead.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 12:55 PM
This is the only area I think we have to critic Carr on last night. IMHO, that's a plus. all this jittery shakey business, in regards to last nights game is way off. He looked calm cool and collected for the most part.

That third and whatever, when he left the pocket, thought about throwing it away, then deciding to run, and loosing the fumble, was one of his two really bad plays. & I've only got two things to say about that.
1)always protect the friggin football
2)always go with your first instinct........ right or wrong, you don't have time to weigh your options. even if it were a pick, but it on your list of situations where it's not a good idea to throw it.

But he definitely didn't show much as far as accuracy, and his placement could've/should've been better.

I also question if the dump offs were the best option......... but as we couldn't see what our recievers were doing, I can't say for sure.

Overall, I think he is progressing.........
The ball to Owen could have only been in one spot and that was low, right were he put it.

The ball to Moulds outside and away from the CB, was right on.

Lead all his RBs when they caught their balls.

Moulds deep ball was right on, BUT Moulds jogged off the line, Go back and watch it. Sterling Sharpe also said it was a nice thrown ball just Moulds lost a step.

The 1st down on 4th down to Andre was fired right into his chest were the CB could not knock it down.

The roll out to Dre on Champ was right on in the opening of the 3rd Q.

The post to Moulds could have been highier but still worked for 15 yards.

The drag to Dre was right on for 7 yards or so.
Playing almost three full quarters, David Carr had a solid day by completing a game-high 15 passes for a 68 percent completion rate. Aside from a screen pass that was deflected and intercepted, the Texans' starting signal-caller showed good command of the offense.

Vinny
08-28-2006, 12:58 PM
Well I didn't watch the game last night and the stats you posted were from the entire preseason. But hey, if you want to hold Carr accountable for spiking the ball to stop the clock on 3rd down and failing to convert the third down go ahead.If you can't see a trend in never converting a first down from a 3rd down (or perhaps once in 3 games)...I can't help you. You make all the excuses you want to make yourself comfy...but I'll keep pointing out that your offense goes to the sidelines when you can't convert a 3rd down.

texan279
08-28-2006, 01:01 PM
If you can't see a trend in never converting a first down from a 3rd down (or perhaps once in 3 games)...I can't help you. You make all the excuses you want to make yourself comfy...but I'll keep pointing out that your offense goes to the sidelines when you can't convert a 3rd down.

So it's Carr's fault alone for not converting the third downs? Out of those 10 situations you posted, he completed three passes, had four incomplete passes, was sacked twice, and spiked the ball once. Why not post "Here are the Texans on 3rd down" instead of "Here is Carr on third down"? Is he the only one out there?

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 01:02 PM
No doubt man, everyone not drinking battle red kool-aid sees Carr for what he is....which is a below average QB.

I don't think he's that bad.... I'm looking at him as if we drafted him #1 overall this year.

I don't think he is doing any worse than any QB picked #1 overall since 2002.

None of those guys were expected to light the league on fire their first year, and I don't expect Carr to.

I'm totally forgetting he's been a starter for the last 4 years...... to me, they never happened.
I hope the guy improves but if he doesnt I want us to be horrible this year so we can finally get rid of that loser and sign someone worth a crud.

quuuuuuuaaaaaaack ptttoooooiiii

I want to see where the Carr supporters are when we are 3-13 at the end of the season.
doug from the woodlands

while I am anything but a Carr Homer, if we go 3-13, I know it won't be because of David Carr alone.

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 01:03 PM
Kubiak himself acctually took the blame.

that's what a good coach does.......


and what a good QB should do.

Double Barrel
08-28-2006, 01:05 PM
I don't think he is doing any worse than any QB picked #1 overall since 2002.

What about any QB picked in the first round (instead of first overall)? :hmmm:

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 01:08 PM
The ball to Owen could have only been in one spot and that was low, right were he put it.

The ball to Moulds outside and away from the CB, was right on.

Lead all his RBs when they caught their balls.

Moulds deep ball was right on, BUT Moulds jogged off the line, Go back and watch it. Sterling Sharpe also said it was a nice thrown ball just Moulds lost a step.

The 1st down on 4th down to Andre was fired right into his chest were the CB could not knock it down.

The roll out to Dre on Champ was right on in the opening of the 3rd Q.

The post to Moulds could have been highier but still worked for 15 yards.

The drag to Dre was right on for 7 yards or so.

You saw what you saw...... I can't argue with that..... but I'll give you the pass to Eric, where Moulds was sleeping..... that was obvious. and a good throw.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 01:09 PM
Well I didn't watch the game last night and the stats you posted were from the entire preseason. But hey, if you want to hold Carr accountable for spiking the ball to stop the clock on 3rd down and failing to convert the third down or getting sacked on third down and not converting that third down go ahead.
O my gosh, did he really blame him for that?

Respect is falling fast..........Carr looked to the freaking sideline and Kubiak told him to waite and spike it, give me a break Vinny. Take a chance and get it picked, no thanks just kick the FG, like we did.

And if your blaming him for the sack you need mental help, Wiegert got smoked, great move from the DE Ebenizer.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 01:11 PM
that's what a good coach does.......


and what a good QB should do.
Yep...............

You have been here a while David Carr always takes the blame for his guys, he has never thrown anyone under the bus.

hollywood_texan
08-28-2006, 01:12 PM
This is the same Sterling Sharpe that at the expansion draft said the Texans would win the AFC South in their first year of existence. The Texans won't lose their first 6 games of the season. Or win their first 6 games in the season. The answer lies somewhere in between. I don't know how many, neither does Sterling Sharpe.

The point is they have to beat the Eagles, otherwise they will be looking at 1-5 or 0-6 square in the face because they play as follows:

Indy on the road
Redskins at home
Fins at Home
Cowboys on the Road
Jags at home

That is the point I took from it. Texans have a brutal front end schedule and need to post a W quickly.

Vinny
08-28-2006, 01:15 PM
O my gosh, did he really blame him for that?

Respect is falling fast..........Carr looked to the freaking sideline and Kubiak told him to waite and spike it, give me a break Vinny. Take a chance and get it picked, no thanks just kick the FG, like we did.

And if your blaming him for the sack you need mental help, Wiegert got smoked, great move from the DE Ebenizer.
I just posted all his 3rd downs. You guys are the ones having a hissy fit.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 01:15 PM
The point is they have to beat the Eagles, otherwise they will be looking at 1-5 or 0-6 square in the face because they play as follows:

Indy on the road
Redskins at home
Fins at Home
Cowboys on the Road
Jags at home

That is the point I took from it. Texans have a brutal front end schedule and need to post a W quickly.
Your right but if our offense can get going like it did in the 2nd and 3 Q and our Defense plays tough like it did, then I can see us beating more then just 2 teams in that stretch, but I see what your saying.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 01:17 PM
I just posted all his 3rd downs. You guys are the ones having a hissy fit.
No hissy fits I am not 2 years old, just telling what happened.

hollywood_texan
08-28-2006, 01:17 PM
Kubiak himself acctually took the blame.

You could take this several ways.

First, Kubiak could be deflecting the blame to himself to avoid a QB controversary.

Second, Kubiak has basically said the offense cannot handle the entire offense. Maybe he pushed them a little and they didn't stack up.

Kubiak is a smart guy and a good coach. I think you have to read between the lines a little on this one and he could be trying to avoid controversaries.

I don't think you can say Carr doesn't have any responsibility for the play of the offense in the first half.

texan279
08-28-2006, 01:19 PM
I just posted all his 3rd downs. You guys are the ones having a hissy fit.

And you said he passed 10 times on 10 third downs when in reality going by what you posted Carr is 3/7 for 22 yards this preseason on 3rd down.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 01:21 PM
You could take this several ways.

First, Kubiak could be deflecting the blame to himself to avoid a QB controversary.

Second, Kubiak has basically said the offense cannot handle the entire offense. Maybe he pushed them a little and they didn't stack up.

Kubiak is a smart guy and a good coach. I think you have to read between the lines a little on this one and he could be trying to avoid controversaries.
I take it as they gave him bad plays, Kubiak tells the truth and is very blunt. He calls guys out all the time, he took this one on him this time.

Vinny
08-28-2006, 01:22 PM
And you said he passed 10 times on 10 third downs when in reality going by what you posted Carr is 3/7 for 22 yards this preseason on 3rd down.
eh...I'm just talking about his passing. my opinion of Carr is at an all time low right now. I figured I'd see progress under Kubiak, but I just see the same ol' workout warrior....anyway....to each his own. I'm gonna back out of the Carr debate thing here. I've said enough

Keep sippin' that koolaide

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 01:24 PM
eh...I'm just talking about his passing. my opinion of Carr is at an all time low right now. I figured I'd see progress under Kubiak, but I just see the same ol' workout warrior....anyway....to each his own

Keep sippin' that koolaide
What was wrong with how he played?

Lucky
08-28-2006, 01:26 PM
while I am anything but a Carr Homer, if we go 3-13, I know it won't be because of David Carr alone.
Correct. But this team isn't going 3-13.

This is not a bad football team. Denver had one of the top 5 teams in football, as well as one of the toughest home fields. And the Texans played them tough. Not smart, but tough.

Tennessee, that's a bad football team. New Orleans is a bad football team. The Texans will be in that large morass of parity that engulfs much of the NFL. They no longer lay claim to having the worst offense and the worst defense in football.

I heard the announcers last night speak about the team needing confidence. I think Texan fans need a little confidence boost, too. As a fan base, we have a losing mentality. Makes sense, because this team has lost for 4 seasons. I've seen a lot of bad football during that time, but I'm seeing better football now. That gives me hope (yeah, hope is a 4 letter word) that this team can continue to get better. If that makes me a koolaid drinker or sunshine spreader, so be it. But I think the fans who think this team will go 3-13 or have the #1 pick in the draft are flat out wrong.

texan279
08-28-2006, 01:28 PM
eh...I'm just talking about his passing. my opinion of Carr is at an all time low right now. I figured I'd see progress under Kubiak, but I just see the same ol' workout warrior....anyway....to each his own

Keep sippin' that koolaide

Not sipping any kool-aid, go back and read my posts from the past couple of days, I have said "Carr right now is average at best" and made several other not so great comments about him. Also go check the first two game threads and see what I said about him. I am not just going to give up on the guy after what about 4 or 5 quarters of preseason play? Especially after the first 4 seasons, and especially after a coaching change, change of offense, and several new guys starting on offense. Miracles don't happen overnight.

santo
08-28-2006, 01:29 PM
You could take this several ways.

First, Kubiak could be deflecting the blame to himself to avoid a QB controversary.

Second, Kubiak has basically said the offense cannot handle the entire offense. Maybe he pushed them a little and they didn't stack up.

Kubiak is a smart guy and a good coach. I think you have to read between the lines a little on this one and he could be trying to avoid controversaries.

I don't think you can say Carr doesn't have any responsibility for the play of the offense in the first half.


[Qoute] on QB David Carr (http://houstontexans.com/team/roster_detail.php?PRKey=12)) A lot of the things that happened early in the game were Davids fault. On the interception I think he tried to dump it to Wali Lundy. He (Carr) has to protect the ball. He is in charge of protecting the ball. I think we proved that we can be a pretty good team, without the turnovers. [/quote]

http://houstontexans.com/news/detail.php?PRKey=2797&section=N%20Latest%20News


I agree with Hulk, Kubiak will tell it how it is.



on QB David Carrs early struggles) As a coach you have to try to find someway to calm him down with some automatic completions. Those are hard to come by in this league. He did come back and make some very nice plays, but as a coach I need to figure out how to start the game and calm down.


That is the real cool thing about Kubiak, is that he will admit when he did a mistake, but also will call out the players when they mess up.


Houston now has a real coach!!!

Runner
08-28-2006, 01:31 PM
The last quote about "automatic completions" may explain the vanilla offense calls and more down field chances for Sage.

HJam72
08-28-2006, 01:31 PM
Well, at this point we've already spent 4 years on Carr and you can call it five now because that's what it's going to be. My resolution is that we're just gonna have ta stick with him until he wins a Super Bowl. :tease:



Patience people, patience. :homer:

hollywood_texan
08-28-2006, 01:32 PM
I think Carr and the offense have a lot to work on. The running game is good, but the passing looks enemic.

It seems to me that Kubiak wants to use more of the offense but is holding back a little. IMO, Kubiak is taking the blame for not getting them up to speed to the point he expects for his play calling. He pushed them a bit last night knowing it might not work. That is why is taking the blame in my opinion.

We'll see on Sept. 10. I think we know what to expect against the Eagles. An offense that will struggle early and a defense that will play good considering the circumstances.

aj.
08-28-2006, 01:34 PM
Carr looked very good and was throwing the ball with accuracy and with smart possition of the football..
I've seen some homer takes but that one takes the cake. But it's understandable.

Until Carr can get out of this frantic and frenzied mental mode he's in, this offense will never be able to be run as designed and Carr won't be a legit NFL QB. Maybe a sedative before the game would help.

The rollout scramble/fumble was inexcusable. You have to take care of the ball better than that.

The point blank rocket he threw at (behind) Lundy and into traffic was totally uncalled for since he was under no pressure. That reminded me of the same stuff he was doing with DD over the middle on those laughable short screens years ago. He could have waited a second of two for Lundy to clear or even rolled right - there was no one there - but no....rocket that bad boy into traffic and see what happens. Can he not see further downfield than 15 yards?

There are things we are seeing that we shouldn't be seeing in Year 5 regardless of the previous regime/situation. It's the between the ears things that Kubiak and Calhoun now have to contend with.

Kubiak and Calhoun having to draw up 'special' plays at the beginning of the game just to get their 5 yr veteran quarterback comfortable means they are having to crutch the system and get away from the 15 scripted that they would rather run.

When I continue to hear this "continue to give him things to help him build his confidence" spoon feeding crap like what came out of Sterling Sharpe's mouth last night I want to put my foot through the tv. If our QB was Phillip Rivers or Alex Smith (or Jay Cutler) I could understand.

Jay Cutler looked more poised than Carr. (yes I know -- anyone would look poised on that offense, bur yes, Carr would look just as frantic against pressure - imagined or real - from second stringers).

The fact that we're even having these seemingly endless debates proves that all is not right...

hollywood_texan
08-28-2006, 01:35 PM
[Qoute] on QB David Carr (http://houstontexans.com/team/roster_detail.php?PRKey=12)) A lot of the things that happened early in the game were Davids fault. On the interception I think he tried to dump it to Wali Lundy. He (Carr) has to protect the ball. He is in charge of protecting the ball. I think we proved that we can be a pretty good team, without the turnovers.

http://houstontexans.com/news/detail.php?PRKey=2797&section=N%20Latest%20News


I agree with Hulk, Kubiak will tell it how it is.



[B][/SIZE]


That is the real cool thing about Kubiak, is that he will admit when he did a mistake, but also will call out the players when they mess up.


Houston now has a real coach!!!





[/QUOTE]

Yep, but my remarks were in reference directly to Kubiak's comment at half time and that it was his fault for the offense's poor play due to play calling.

You really proved my point. He was taking the blame there himself.

real
08-28-2006, 01:35 PM
I think Carr and the offense have a lot to work on. The running game is good, but the passing looks enemic.

It seems to me that Kubiak wants to use more of the offense but is holding back a little. IMO, Kubiak is taking the blame for not getting them up to speed to the point he expects for his play calling. He pushed them a bit last night knowing it might not work. That is why is taking the blame in my opinion.

We'll see on Sept. 10. I think we know what to expect against the Eagles. An offense that will struggle early and a defense that will play good considering the circumstances.

i don't think thats entirely true...In pre-season most teams aren't going to show you their whole hand...most keep it pretty vanilla...And IMO, Kubaik taking "the blame" was just the diplomatic thing to do...

tsip
08-28-2006, 01:35 PM
2nd Qtr
1-10-HOU47 (2:07) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 47 for 6 yards (Da.Williams).
2-8-DEN40 (1:22) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to E.Moulds.
3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).
4-3-DEN35 (1:01) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 30 for 5 yards (Da.Williams, I.Gold).

3rd Qtr--still 1st team D
1-10-HOU20 (15:00) D.Carr pass short right to A.Johnson ran ob at HST 34 for 14 yards.
2-6-DEN47 (12:48) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to E.Moulds.
3-6-DEN47 (12:41) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to A.Johnson (Da.Williams).


...wow, 7 passes for 30 yds...maybe it is the distance that gets people confused, thinking that 4 ypa must surely be to an rb or te--or maybe the intent is to get it to the wr so he can get yac

Runner
08-28-2006, 01:36 PM
I think Carr and the offense have a lot to work on. The running game is good, but the passing looks enemic.


Nice Freudian slip.

Did you mean:
anemic: lacking power, vigor, vitality, or colorfulness; listless; weak: an anemic effort; anemic tones.

or are you coining a new word from the root word enema?

I'd believe either.

hollywood_texan
08-28-2006, 01:38 PM
Nice Freudian slip.

Did you mean:
anemic: lacking power, vigor, vitality, or colorfulness; listless; weak: an anemic effort; anemic tones.

or are you coining a new word from the root word enema?

I'd believe either.

I wish I could take credit for that one. I just screwed up and used the wrong word, actually the right word, but not by design.

Sometimes do you something hilarious and you don't even know it. This is one of those times for me.

Thanks for pointing it out.

eriadoc
08-28-2006, 01:42 PM
I posted a short write-up on the passing plays in the Rams game, as it pertained to Carr's decision-making in that game. I haven't had a chance to go back over the Tivo from this game, but my initial impression is that Carr was definitely worse than last week in the first quarter than at any point last week, yet better in the second quarter than at any point last week. It's very frustrating. If we see more of the second quarter version of Carr (and offensive gameplan), wherein the team takes chances downfield and throws to someone besides a running back, then I'll be happy, within reason. If we keep doing the little dump-offs, I don't think anyone will be happy with Carr.

Someone else posted this, and I agree with it, on short thought - it's not the decisions that Carr makes, it's the ones he doesn't make. Trust your WRs more, even if they have dropped a ton of balls before, or not gotten open. Trust your line more, even if they have let rushers through like water through a sieve. It's easier said than done, but if he doesn't show signs of improving in those areas, we need to draft a QB in 2007.

Vinny was kind enough to add his comments to my write-up last week, noting the 3rd down play-by-play. Yet he chose to ignore the specifics of each play. As stated, you can't take stats at face value and there is more to each of those plays than just "Carr failed again on 3rd down". I think that is what people are trying to point out. It seems as if you're letting your distaste for Carr affect your objectivity. Just my 2c.

Vinny
08-28-2006, 01:47 PM
Vinny was kind enough to add his comments to my write-up last week, noting the 3rd down play-by-play. Yet he chose to ignore the specifics of each play. As stated, you can't take stats at face value and there is more to each of those plays than just "Carr failed again on 3rd down". I think that is what people are trying to point out. It seems as if you're letting your distaste for Carr affect your objectivity. Just my 2c.So you don't think that a total inability to convert on 3rd downs via the pass isn't any sort of a trend with your QB? Carr struggled on 3rd down in his previous years here too. My distaste for Carr only stems from his play...his play is the only thing I question.

eriadoc
08-28-2006, 01:50 PM
So you don't think that a total inability to convert on 3rd downs via the pass isn't any sort of a trend with your QB? Carr struggled on 3rd down in his previous years here too.

I believe the offense has had a hard time converting 3rd downs. I am trying to determine how much of that is Carr. I am in no way suggesting Carr gets a pass, and I was bipolar about his play last night, but I am trying to be somewhat objective about it at this point. Given the framework of "He's our QB and that's not changing until 2007 at earliest", it's all I can do.

Looking inside the stats is one way for me to try and figure it out. Other people use different methods, I'm sure.

eriadoc
08-28-2006, 01:52 PM
My distaste for Carr only stems from his play...his play is the only thing I question.

I have stated so before, but I'll reiterate - I don't intend to imply otherwise. All my comments are strictly football-related.

Vinny
08-28-2006, 01:54 PM
I have stated so before, but I'll reiterate - I don't intend to imply otherwise. All my comments are strictly football-related.
I probably misunderstood this comment then...

It seems as if you're letting your distaste for Carr affect your objectivity. Just my 2c.

michaelm
08-28-2006, 01:54 PM
There have been many good points made by both sides of the Carr debate.

One observation I'd like to make is that the Denver defense is the best that we've seen this preseason. In my opinion, it is better than the KC and St. Louis defenses by a good margin, although the Ram blitzes did give us fits.

Check back later in the year after we've had a chance to see them in action for awhile, but I think Denver's defense is better than last year's and will be one of the top Ds in the league this year.

Kaiser Toro
08-28-2006, 01:56 PM
I believe the offense has had a hard time converting 3rd downs. I am trying to determine how much of that is Carr. I am in no way suggesting Carr gets a pass, and I was bipolar about his play last night, but I am trying to be somewhat objective about it at this point. Given the framework of "He's our QB and that's not changing until 2007 at earliest", it's all I can do.

Looking inside the stats is one way for me to try and figure it out. Other people use different methods, I'm sure.

It is just not the stats, which show trending and their consequent red flags are all over the place. But we all are observing similar play on the field. Where is Carr 2.0? What is the significant change in his style of play, his leadership, etc?

What makes you believe that Carr is better than before or will be better, given the stats and your observations. And please make it something that Carr has done or is doing. He is a big boy and should no longer need more help from a staff, O Line and playmakers.

the wonger need food
08-28-2006, 01:57 PM
Kubiak himself acctually took the blame.

Just when you thought you had seen every excuse possible for Carr.

You Carr apologists are hilarious. Does he have photos of you guys or something?

CloakNNNdagger
08-28-2006, 01:58 PM
I've seen some homer takes but that one takes the cake. But it's understandable.

Until Carr can get out of this frantic and frenzied mental mode he's in, this offense will never be able to be run as designed and Carr won't be a legit NFL QB. Maybe a sedative before the game would help.

The rollout scramble/fumble was inexcusable. You have to take care of the ball better than that.

The point blank rocket he threw at (behind) Lundy and into traffic was totally uncalled for since he was under no pressure. That reminded me of the same stuff he was doing with DD over the middle on those laughable short screens years ago. He could have waited a second of two for Lundy to clear or even rolled right - there was no one there - but no....rocket that bad boy into traffic and see what happens. Can he not see further downfield than 15 yards?

There are things we are seeing that we shouldn't be seeing in Year 5 regardless of the previous regime/situation. It's the between the ears things that Kubiak and Calhoun now have to contend with.

Kubiak and Calhoun having to draw up 'special' plays at the beginning of the game just to get their 5 yr veteran quarterback comfortable means they are having to crutch the system and get away from the 15 scripted that they would rather run.

When I continue to hear this "continue to give him things to help him build his confidence" spoon feeding crap like what came out of Sterling Sharpe's mouth last night I want to put my foot through the tv. If our QB was Phillip Rivers or Alex Smith (or Jay Cutler) I could understand.

Jay Cutler looked more poised than Carr. (yes I know -- anyone would look poised on that offense, bur yes, Carr would look just as frantic against pressure - imagined or real - from second stringers).

The fact that we're even having these seemingly endless debates proves that all is not right...
Kub (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/detail.php?PRKey=2797&section=N%20Latest%20News) is basically saying the same thing in a "diplomatic" and more veiled approach..........you can feel that he too is beginning to get frustrated with the same ole, same ole.

(on QB David Carr) “A lot of the things that happened early in the game were David’s fault. On the interception I think he tried to dump it to Wali Lundy. He (Carr) has to protect the ball. He is in charge of protecting the ball. I think we proved that we can be a pretty good team, without the turnovers.”

(on QB David Carr’s early struggles) “As a coach you have to try to find someway to calm him down with some automatic completions. Those are hard to come by in this league. He did come back and make some very nice plays, but as a coach I need to figure out how to start the game and calm down.”

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 02:00 PM
I've seen some homer takes but that one takes the cake. But it's understandable.

Until Carr can get out of this frantic and frenzied mental mode he's in, this offense will never be able to be run as designed and Carr won't be a legit NFL QB. Maybe a sedative before the game would help.

The rollout scramble/fumble was inexcusable. You have to take care of the ball better than that.

The point blank rocket he threw at (behind) Lundy and into traffic was totally uncalled for since he was under no pressure. That reminded me of the same stuff he was doing with DD over the middle on those laughable short screens years ago. He could have waited a second of two for Lundy to clear or even rolled right - there was no one there - but no....rocket that bad boy into traffic and see what happens. Can he not see further downfield than 15 yards?

There are things we are seeing that we shouldn't be seeing in Year 5 regardless of the previous regime/situation. It's the between the ears things that Kubiak and Calhoun now have to contend with.

Kubiak and Calhoun having to draw up 'special' plays at the beginning of the game just to get their 5 yr veteran quarterback comfortable means they are having to crutch the system and get away from the 15 scripted that they would rather run.

When I continue to hear this "continue to give him things to help him build his confidence" spoon feeding crap like what came out of Sterling Sharpe's mouth last night I want to put my foot through the tv. If our QB was Phillip Rivers or Alex Smith (or Jay Cutler) I could understand.

Jay Cutler looked more poised than Carr. (yes I know -- anyone would look poised on that offense, bur yes, Carr would look just as frantic against pressure - imagined or real - from second stringers).

The fact that we're even having these seemingly endless debates proves that all is not right...
Okay you covered 2 bad plays................now how about the 15 he completed.
You guys are funny and crafty.

real
08-28-2006, 02:02 PM
Okay you covered 2 bad plays................now how about the 15 he completed.
You guys are funny and crafty.

He gets payed to play well...that is expected of him...So why would anyone make a fuss over a couple completions?

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 02:03 PM
Just when you thought you had seen every excuse possible for Carr.

You Carr apologists are hilarious. Does he have photos of you guys or something?
And your a hater, listen to the lady and what she says that Kubiak said, about the 1st half..

aj.
08-28-2006, 02:09 PM
Okay you covered 2 bad plays................now how about the 15 he completed.
.

...or maybe the other plays that might have been, that we'll never know about?

Crafty? That would mean I have an agenda against Carr, which I don't. I want him to do well because if he does, we do well. It doesn't take an Einstein to see he's not comfortable most of the time he drops back to pass, nor does he see the entire field. The game is still too fast for him and may always be. Love him or hate him, when your QB is as nervous as a cat, the whole offense suffers.

the wonger need food
08-28-2006, 02:11 PM
And your a hater, listen to the lady and what she says that Kubiak said, about the 1st half..

No, I'm a realist. Carr's performance last night would be laughable if it wasn't so sad. I'm really starting to feel sorry for the guy. 5 years in the league and he still can't do the simplest things...

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 02:13 PM
There have been many good points made by both sides of the Carr debate.

One observation I'd like to make is that the Denver defense is the best that we've seen this preseason. In my opinion, it is better than the KC and St. Louis defenses by a good margin, although the Ram blitzes did give us fits.

Check back later in the year after we've had a chance to see them in action for awhile, but I think Denver's defense is better than last year's and will be one of the top Ds in the league this year.

ON top of that.. what we saw last night, and the two games prior, are exactly what we were supposed to see.

David Carr struggling.

Remember how many times we've said..... well I can't blam this on him, because I don't know what the other guy was supposed to do........

Well, that's were Kubiak was until now. He's got some good film, David against the exotic StL blitzes, and against the no-nonsense DenverBronco's D. He knows exactly who was where, and what was what, & where the ball was supposed to go, and more importantly, he knows why things didn't go as planned.

Baby steps......... we'll get there.

Yankee_In_TX
08-28-2006, 02:22 PM
Kubiak and Calhoun having to draw up 'special' plays at the beginning of the game just to get their 5 yr veteran quarterback comfortable means they are having to crutch the system and get away from the 15 scripted that they would rather run.


Rumor has it Kubes used to take responsibility for players' mistakes back in Denver. Good or bad, that's how he works.

However, IMO, I agree. You don't toss the playbook out the window because your 5th year QB is a cat in a dog fight and sit around and keep preaching "He's the one."

Porky
08-28-2006, 02:28 PM
What was wrong with how he played?

Umm, he sucked? Is that close enough for you.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 02:35 PM
...or maybe the other plays that might have been, that we'll never know about?

Crafty? That would mean I have an agenda against Carr, which I don't. I want him to do well because if he does, we do well. It doesn't take an Einstein to see he's not comfortable most of the time he drops back to pass, nor does he see the entire field. The game is still too fast for him and may always be. Love him or hate him, when your QB is as nervous as a cat, the whole offense suffers.
Suffers? A couple series off not doing well is Sufering? Like it or not the guy is still learning the Offense, scared as a cat? Looked pretty calm to me on his deep ball, the 4th dn conversion, all of his rollouts and the one were Champ was blitzing stood there and got the ball off for a completion.

Is he perfect no, does he have stuff to work on sure, he is learning. BUT is he as bad as some of you THINK, No, not at all.

Give him some props, throw him a bone every now and again. People want to talk about 2 plays when he took these guys on drive that came out in points against a very tough Defense.
Okay so other then 1 play he said.............
I think we proved that we can be a pretty good team, without the turnovers.”

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 02:36 PM
Umm, he sucked? Is that close enough for you.
Bet I can show you more possative plays then negative plays. Thanks for the insight and knowledge by the way.

GP
08-28-2006, 02:41 PM
All the RB dump passes ( I was angry at first) were IMO Kubiak's way to look at how the defense is reacting to those. It clearly looked like David was directed to look at only the RB on those plays. You would have seen a SCREAMING Kubiak on the sideline if David had dumped it to the RB on his own all those plays. Kubiak isn't afraid to show his displeasure durig a game, especially with his QBs.

And, IMO, we were also trying to lure the defenders up so we could push some deeper routes later on (which we did, by the way).

Was it a "fun" game to watch? Nope. Did we do a better job against a team that was one win from a trip to the Super Bowl last season? I think so. Last year's preseaosn game against Denver was an absolute JOKE.

Nobody got seriously hurt. We're heading into the last game with our current starters and our entire defensive line and LB rotation healthy.

Be happy.

Porky
08-28-2006, 02:41 PM
Bet I can show you more possative plays then negative plays. Thanks for the insight and knowledge by the way.

What, a 3 yard dumpoff to the RB? Your right, that takes a #1 overall and an 8 million dollar extension for someone talented enough to do that. :sarcasm:

Kaiser Toro
08-28-2006, 02:45 PM
All the RB dump passes ( I was angry at first) were IMO Kubiak's way to look at how the defense is reacting to those. It clearly looked like David was directed to look at only the RB on those plays. You would have seen a SCREAMING Kubiak on the sideline if David had dumped it to the RB on his own all those plays. Kubiak isn't afraid to show his displeasure durig a game, especially with his QBs.

You probably know my standard response to this logic, but.... Why are we paying 8 mill per for a stooge?

It's like he is Derek Zoolander and Pendry or Calhoun are saying into his helmet, "you must destroy the Houston Texans' fans natural love for the game. Throw a dump off at 90 mph."

GP
08-28-2006, 02:49 PM
You probably know my standard response to this logic, but.... Why are we paying 8 mill per for a stooge?

It's like he is Derek Zoolander and Pendry or Calhoun are saying into his helmet, "you must destroy the Houston Texans' fans natural love for the game. Throw a dump off at 90 mph."

One question: Would Kubiak be visibly upset if Carr had not gone through progressions, throwing the ball to the RB over and over as he did?

I don't think that one's on Carr. And I don't buy the theory that Kubiak has put training wheels on his system for Carr.

Come on, guys. Get past the flame war that's going on in this thread.

Kaiser Toro
08-28-2006, 02:53 PM
One question: Would Kubiak be visibly upset if Carr had not gone through progressions, throwing the ball to the RB over and over as he did?

I don't think that one's on Carr. And I don't buy the theory that Kubiak has put training wheels on his system for Carr.

Come on, guys. Get past the flame war that's going on in this thread.

There is so much plausible innuendo being thrown around here, but come on man. Kubiak has plenty of tape on Carr rolling out and throwing dump off passes, we know he can do that well in the 2nd and 3rd quarters very well. When will we see something that is different? That is what has us most concerened. I thought I would see a much different Carr after the third game. I see other players and units getting better, but not at the QB position. Once again I am measuring Carr against Carr.

SESupergenius
08-28-2006, 03:04 PM
Vinny had me looking for the 3rd down conversion more closely this game, and really I came away thinking we did a decent job, not great, but not horrible. Carr does need to get better at the 3rd down coversions, but I felt he was starting to this game. The way I see it, Carr had a 3-7 3rd down coversion ( count the 4th down conversion as a 3rd down conversion because we are basically measuring his ability to convert for more downs, and don't coun't the spiked ball to go against him because that is what the coaches wanted.)
So he was 43% on conversions last night, which is above average in QB conversion for the 2005 season.

3-4-50 (6:44) D.Carr sacked at 50 for 0 yards (K.Lang). FUMBLES (K.Lang), touched at DEN 48, ball out of bounds at HST 44.

3-4-HOU48 (3:22) D.Carr sacked at HST 41 for -7 yards (E.Ekuban).

3-2-HOU28 (3:17) D.Carr pass short right to J.Cook to HST 35 for 7 yards (DJ.Williams).

3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).

4-3-DEN35 (1:01) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 30 for 5 yards (Da.Williams, I.Gold).

3-5-DEN11 (:12) D.Carr spiked the ball to stop the clock.

3-6-DEN47 (12:41) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to A.Johnson (Da.Williams).

3-6-DEN29 (10:16) D.Carr pass to E.Moulds to DEN 18 for 11 yards (C.Cox; K.Paymah).


I think Sage was 1-3 on 3rd down conversions, but did get the long TD pass.

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 03:07 PM
You probably know my standard response to this logic, but.... Why are we paying 8 mill per for a stooge?

It's like he is Derek Zoolander and Pendry or Calhoun are saying into his helmet, "you must destroy the Houston Texans' fans natural love for the game. Throw a dump off at 90 mph."
Dump offs? Thats all he threw.


I am so freaking tired of all the absolutes that are thrown around here, always, only, all the time.

He had some nice passes to Moulds Dre Owen Walters, you guys ALWAYS do this.

A stooge? Okay,:cool:

Hulk75
08-28-2006, 03:08 PM
Vinny had me looking for the 3rd down conversion more closely this game, and really I came away thinking we did a decent job, not great, but not horrible. Carr does need to get better at the 3rd down coversions, but I felt he was starting to this game. The way I see it, Carr had a 3-7 3rd down coversion ( count the 4th down conversion as a 3rd down conversion because we are basically measuring his ability to convert for more downs, and don't coun't the spiked ball to go against him because that is what the coaches wanted.)
So he was 43% on conversions last night, which is above average in QB conversion for the 2005 season.

3-4-50 (6:44) D.Carr sacked at 50 for 0 yards (K.Lang). FUMBLES (K.Lang), touched at DEN 48, ball out of bounds at HST 44.

3-4-HOU48 (3:22) D.Carr sacked at HST 41 for -7 yards (E.Ekuban).

3-2-HOU28 (3:17) D.Carr pass short right to J.Cook to HST 35 for 7 yards (DJ.Williams).

3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).

4-3-DEN35 (1:01) D.Carr pass short middle to A.Johnson to DEN 30 for 5 yards (Da.Williams, I.Gold).

3-5-DEN11 (:12) D.Carr spiked the ball to stop the clock.

3-6-DEN47 (12:41) D.Carr pass incomplete deep left to A.Johnson (Da.Williams).

3-6-DEN29 (10:16) D.Carr pass to E.Moulds to DEN 18 for 11 yards (C.Cox; K.Paymah).


I think Sage was 1-3 on 3rd down conversions, but did get the long TD pass.
Yea he did, against slap 1 and slap 2 playing CB and Saftey.

hollywood_texan
08-28-2006, 03:14 PM
Dump offs? Thats all he threw.


I am so freaking tired of all the absolutes that are thrown around here, always, only, all the time.

He had some nice passes to Moulds Dre Owen Walters, you guys ALWAYS do this.

A stooge? Okay,:cool:

Hulk, I think it is a vibe or feel that they are getting from the offense.

David did have a long thow that was incomplete last night. I believe it was too Moulds down the right sideline. Hence, Carr needs to get the ball downfield.

I think the point is, there is a real tendacy for Carr to do the dump off. Which is really their point.

Carr needs to make more throws downfield, even if they are incomplete. He needs to get defenses thinking he will go downfield at anytime. Right now, it seems like maybe one throw or so per half.

I see throwing downfield as like shots on goal in hockey. The more you have, the better chance of success. Not to mention in football, it opens up other parts of the game. One dimensional teams in the NFL usually get stuffed.

If Carr can get the ball downfield successfully (even incompletions but shows it can get done), then it will make other parts of the offense more productive becuase there isn't one thing a defense can key on.

Right now, I don't think there is one defensive coordinator in the league that is concerned about David Carr lighting them up.

rmartin65
08-28-2006, 03:21 PM
Its too bad the starters wont play much next week. The offense looked pretty good near the end of the second, and into the 3rd. Carr looked just as good as Sage did against second teamers, and started to pick it up against the starters. The RB's are really good. Morency and Lundy are both good backs.

kbourda
08-28-2006, 03:31 PM
Umm, he sucked? Is that close enough for you.

I have been laughing on this one for about 20 minutes!

Seriously people, this is the pre-season. I would much perfer Carr to do this now than in the season when it matters. In Carr's defense, Mc Nabb does the same thing (throw to his RB's alot) and so does Brady. That is just what the WCO brings. He is showing inconsistency and has not shown a solid game to this point (including last night) in the pre-season. I hope that will change. One more thing, Hulk when I say this I think I speak for a bunch of people on this board, Get Off Of Carr's ****, please! I don't even think you could get Carr's parents to say he had a good game last night. Stop. Just Stop! Let's all hope for the very best for the Texans, ok.

Kaiser Toro
08-28-2006, 03:35 PM
I have been laughing on this one for about 20 minutes!

Seriously people, this is the pre-season. I would much perfer Carr to do this now than in the season when it matters. In Carr's defense, Mc Nabb does the same thing (throw to his RB's alot) and so does Brady. That is just what the WCO brings. He is showing inconsistency and has not shown a solid game to this point (including last night) in the pre-season. I hope that will change. One more thing, Hulk when I say this I think I speak for a bunch of people on this board, Get Off Of Carr's ****, please! I don't even think you could get Carr's parents to say he had a good game last night. Stop. Just Stop! Let's all hope for the very best for the Texans, ok.

I think what many are missing here is that everyone is in agreement about the team doing incredibly better. But once something like success appears it tastes so good when it hits the lips and we expect it to be mirrored everywhere. If Kubiak came out said it will take DC one year to understand my system and we may have some trouble offensively then I buy into the let Carr go out and do that voo-doo that he supposedly does so well. But in the interim I am under the expectations that we are trying to win 16 games and that will not happen more than 6 times with Carr somewhere in, around and under the pocket.

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 03:38 PM
I think what many are missing here is that everyone is in agreement about the team doing incredibly better. But once something like success appears it tastes so good when it hits the lips and we expect it to be mirrored everywhere. If Kubiak came out said it will take DC one year to understand my system and we may have some trouble offensively then I buy into the let Carr go out and do that voo-doo that he supposedly does so well. But in the interim I am under the expectations that we are trying to win 16 games and that will not happen more than 6 times with Carr somewhere in, around and under the pocket.

Doesn't help that Cutler & Sage appear to be catching on quickly either.

kbourda
08-28-2006, 03:46 PM
I think what many are missing here is that everyone is in agreement about the team doing incredibly better. But once something like success appears it tastes so good when it hits the lips and we expect it to be mirrored everywhere. If Kubiak came out said it will take DC one year to understand my system and we may have some trouble offensively then I buy into the let Carr go out and do that voo-doo that he supposedly does so well. But in the interim I am under the expectations that we are trying to win 16 games and that will not happen more than 6 times with Carr somewhere in, around and under the pocket.

To me, I know enough about this offense to know he won't pick it up in one year. No way. Behind the scenes Coach Kubes knows this is a year maybe a year and a half thing to pick up. He's seen a few QB's in his day to know that. It might be time to lower the expectations for the QB and hope we play more games like the first two wins (where we won despite of the QB play) than last night.

kbourda
08-28-2006, 03:49 PM
Doesn't help that Cutler & Sage appear to be catching on quickly either.

I'm trying to make everyone see a bright side in all of this ok. You're not helping. *s*

Smash_Mouth_Mario
08-28-2006, 03:50 PM
Carr does best when he has no pass-rush pressure (as do most QBs). He's actually very good. It's when he runs around trying to make the long pass that he gets in trouble. Also, he seems to do better when he uses his TE and/or short passes to the WR. His longer passes seem to make him nervous.

tsip
08-28-2006, 04:24 PM
There have been many good points made by both sides of the Carr debate.

One observation I'd like to make is that the Denver defense is the best that we've seen this preseason. In my opinion, it is better than the KC and St. Louis defenses by a good margin, although the Ram blitzes did give us fits.

Check back later in the year after we've had a chance to see them in action for awhile, but I think Denver's defense is better than last year's and will be one of the top Ds in the league this year.

Do you remember last year when so many of the posters were 'raving' about the Bills defense and how 'great' it was? True, that defense was 'great' against us (almost everyone else,too) but no body else, costing their 'play-off' coach his job.

IMO, we need to start holding players (every player) accountable for their play on the field, so we can get rid of this 'roll-over' effect we have 'wait,gel,time,etc.'

GP
08-28-2006, 05:15 PM
There is so much plausible innuendo being thrown around here, but come on man. Kubiak has plenty of tape on Carr rolling out and throwing dump off passes, we know he can do that well in the 2nd and 3rd quarters very well. When will we see something that is different? That is what has us most concerened. I thought I would see a much different Carr after the third game. I see other players and units getting better, but not at the QB position. Once again I am measuring Carr against Carr.

It's not to see if DAVID can do it...it's to see what effect it has/had on the opposing defense. It MIGHT be (hold on to something, ok?) to see if Lundy can catch the ball consistently. After all, he coughed one up in the game...and he has been knocked for fumbling it earlier in camp.

Why is it that we are focused on EVERYTHING being geared toward "helping David," or "Getting David up to speed"? Could it be, and I know this is a real stretch for some of you, could it be that we designed multiple throws to the RB to evaluate the RB, or to evaluate the effect it had on the defense, to see if it would open up stuff downfield.

But nope, it's always got SOMETHING to do with David, doesn't it?

You'd think this team is just David Carr. What about Alfred Malone costing us the game by lining up over center? What about Chad Stanley shanking a punt that went 33 yards? What about all the other things that the other players ARE or ARE NOT doing that they "ought to be" or "should not be" doing? Every game there are players who make bad plays, and players who make good plays. Honestly, preseason does stink because it's not really a "full game" where we go from start to finish with the starters to see how it would really end up at the final tick of the clock. We played hard. We got away without injuries. And we lost by three points to a Broncos team that was a win away from the SUper Bowl last season...and added Javon Walker (and has arguably the best LB crew in the AFC).

It's as if we're judging this whole team, or at least the offense, on David Carr. There's 10 other guys on every snap that must also be performing excellently. As in: Moulds actually SPRINTING to the deep pass instead of jogging. And if that's his "high gear," then we're in trouble. As in: Daniels false starting and blowing us a shorter 4th down conversion attempt. Had we made the first, could we have gone on to score a TD? We'll never know.

Be happy.

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 05:33 PM
If you can't see a trend in never converting a first down from a 3rd down (or perhaps once in 3 games)...I can't help you. You make all the excuses you want to make yourself comfy...but I'll keep pointing out that your offense goes to the sidelines when you can't convert a 3rd down.

Your preaching to the choir, Carr has been embarassing...as for your boy Ryans, he is looking like a future Pro Bowlers for sure.

doug from the woodlands

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 05:37 PM
What was wrong with how he played?

Umm, I dont know, maybe the fact that he played poorly and has been all preseason, just like last year. But I guess we will hear the same lame excuses you homers gave last year. 'It's just preseason, wah wah wah'. Admit that he sucks one day, its all I ask, because anyone who has seen football knows he is not a good NFL quarterback, he is a workout warrior and a flatliner when it comes to football IQ and acumen

doug ftw

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 05:42 PM
Nobody got seriously hurt. We're heading into the last game with our current starters and our entire defensive line and LB rotation healthy.

Be happy.

Hallelujah to that fact. We did get through this preseason without any huge injuries. Mathis and DD were hurt before preseason. So that is one thing we can take out of the preseason, better luck wiht injuries. Now if your looking for competent QB play, you would still be looking....

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 05:48 PM
It's not to see if DAVID can do it...it's to see what effect it has/had on the opposing defense. It MIGHT be (hold on to something, ok?) to see if Lundy can catch the ball consistently. After all, he coughed one up in the game...and he has been knocked for fumbling it earlier in camp.

Why is it that we are focused on EVERYTHING being geared toward "helping David," or "Getting David up to speed"? Could it be, and I know this is a real stretch for some of you, could it be that we designed multiple throws to the RB to evaluate the RB, or to evaluate the effect it had on the defense, to see if it would open up stuff downfield.

But nope, it's always got SOMETHING to do with David, doesn't it?

You'd think this team is just David Carr. What about Alfred Malone costing us the game by lining up over center? What about Chad Stanley shanking a punt that went 33 yards? What about all the other things that the other players ARE or ARE NOT doing that they "ought to be" or "should not be" doing? Every game there are players who make bad plays, and players who make good plays. Honestly, preseason does stink because it's not really a "full game" where we go from start to finish with the starters to see how it would really end up at the final tick of the clock. We played hard. We got away without injuries. And we lost by three points to a Broncos team that was a win away from the SUper Bowl last season...and added Javon Walker (and has arguably the best LB crew in the AFC).

It's as if we're judging this whole team, or at least the offense, on David Carr. There's 10 other guys on every snap that must also be performing excellently. As in: Moulds actually SPRINTING to the deep pass instead of jogging. And if that's his "high gear," then we're in trouble. As in: Daniels false starting and blowing us a shorter 4th down conversion attempt. Had we made the first, could we have gone on to score a TD? We'll never know.

Be happy.

Mr. Apologist, Malone and Stanley arent paid franchise QB money. That is why you wont hear about people complaining about those plays as much. Anyways, this thread is about the offense not ST and defense. If some of you would get your tongue out of David's mouth long enough, you may realize that yourself. I want to win and I want the Texans to progress, and I have come to the realization that it isnt' going to happen with Pretty Boy at QB.

doug

tulexan
08-28-2006, 06:09 PM
The Bush thing was ment for a joke big dog. And the play I am talking about is not the one you think, I am talking about the throw to him were he looked like he was running out of bounds then stopped and then spun for 2 more yards.
Carr only looked sharp against the second team?.........Well hate to burst your bubble but their 1st team D was in just as long as our O was........Unless Champ Lynch and Darrent change #s with someone else.
Kooliad? or Truth.

I remember that play. The defender was laughing after that play.

GP
08-28-2006, 09:13 PM
Umm, I dont know, maybe the fact that he played poorly and has been all preseason, just like last year. But I guess we will hear the same lame excuses you homers gave last year. 'It's just preseason, wah wah wah'. Admit that he sucks one day, its all I ask, because anyone who has seen football knows he is not a good NFL quarterback, he is a workout warrior and a flatliner when it comes to football IQ and acumen

doug ftw

LOL.

A billionaire and seven head coaching candidates who applied for the job, one of which has coached big-time QBs to Super Bowl wins, think David Carr is salvageable...but Doug from the Woodlands and "anybody who has seen football," as he claims, can see that he "sucks."

We look better. Period. And we have a guy, whom I admit is looking good too, who can stand in when needed.

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 09:19 PM
LOL.

A billionaire and seven head coaching candidates who applied for the job, one of which has coached big-time QBs to Super Bowl wins, think David Carr is salvageable...but Doug from the Woodlands and "anybody who has seen football," as he claims, can see that he "sucks."

We look better. Period. And we have a guy, whom I admit is looking good too, who can stand in when needed.

Carr has sucked, is sucking, and will continue to suck. There is a reason Al Saunders isnt our head coach. He knew what a pile of garbage Carr was, is, and will be...and that is why he is making more $ as asst. headcoach and off. coordinator of the Redskins than Kubes is as Texans HC.

As for 'we look better'. I agree with that and it looks like we got a heart transplant for our team, but this albatross of Carr has got to go before we can be a legitimate NFL franchise. The Carr experiment is over and is an abject failure....for some reason I bet if Carr was an African-American half of you would be calling for him to be dropped like a rock.....not surprising that yall are all probably McKKKLane Astro fans as well.....

btw if any of you are watching Carson Palmer play QB, you would see what a real QB looks like even after surgery, not a lot of work in preseason, and LOADS of pressure. This kumbaya (sic) schtick that yall pull out for Carr is just embarassing as a fellow fan. You may not like my opinion but I just want what is best for our team...and that would be to drop the hammer on Carr and turn page on that chapter. Of course 2-14 was a year ago and you must have forgotten how bad it was...well if Carr looks like he has his entire career expect more of the same in teh future with him at the helm.

doug from teh woodlands

p.s. keep the negative rep flowing. i call it like i see it and just because I dont drink the koolaid doesnt make me any less of a fan than half you homers.

doug

Rodman91
08-28-2006, 09:32 PM
I tell you what, if this was a complete game, we win this sucker. Our Offense was picking up speed and was clicking starting right before the half and it carried on into the 3rd..............Our Defense was salty all night.

Carr looked very good and was throwing the ball with accuracy and with smart possition of the football.You have to remeber that this is a new system for this guy and the team, he looked a little unsure the last 2 games, BUT last night it looked like it started to fire and started to click in Carr.AND this was against Denvers 1st D:cool: . At the beginning when they were doing bad, the sideline lady ask kubiak about the start of the football game and he said that, "We did not give him good calls to work with". And that ball had some hot sauce on it last night. Going trough his progressions nicely as well.

Vernond Morency looked awsome, would you guys agree? Did you see the Reggie Bushness come out:shades: when he was heading toward the sideline? But really I thought he played well.

Oline played well accept for one wiegert play:crying: , but all together they played as a group.Spencer is our new starting LT, the guy is a beast and we need to get his name out there.

Owen Daniels looked good catching that ball from Carr rolling out. And thank you for jumping on the ball Owen.

E-Weeeeeez-E-Eric Moulds..........Love how this guy plays and is taking to his roll without complaining. Did very well..............EXCEPT on the deep ball, did it look like he started off the ball for about 6 yards jogging? It did to me, and just like Starling Sharpe said "You will never know how well that ball was thrown, cause it looked like Moulds lost a step."

Defense did a great job a great job considering who we were playing and how tough there Offense was and is.

All around rest all our starters next week, cause we got it clicking down here and I am pumped about our season, I think we are going to be a surprise, a big surprise this year.

It'll be like a wrench was thrown in it after week 1.

jerek
08-28-2006, 09:34 PM
Carr has sucked, is sucking, and will continue to suck. There is a reason Al Saunders isnt our head coach. He knew what a pile of garbage Carr was, is, and will be...and that is why he is making more $ as asst. headcoach and off. coordinator of the Redskins than Kubes is as Texans HC.

The same Al Saunders that put up a big fat 0 points against the Patriots, 3 against the Bengals, and 14 against the Jets? If only Kubiak were such a winner.

Not sure what you're drinking but you should check the content for hallucinogens. P.S. Washington is known for overpaying ... everybody.

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 09:49 PM
The same Al Saunders that put up a big fat 0 points against the Patriots, 3 against the Bengals, and 14 against the Jets? If only Kubiak were such a winner.

Not sure what you're drinking but you should check the content for hallucinogens. P.S. Washington is known for overpaying ... everybody.

Al Saunders has been the orchestrator of some of the best scoring offenses in hte last decade. He, like Kubiak, is presently saddled with poor quarterbacks and a new system to implement.. Carr however has sucked non-stop since he came into this league....Don't even try and insinuate that I think Kubiak sucks. He has already made a difference in just a few months and I like the guy. I even think he could lead us to the playoffs but not with Carr at QB.

When we are circling the drain at 1-7 midseason will some of you homers call for a change at QB? What does it take? 2-14 wasnt enough. Do we have to go 1-15 or 0-16 for you guys to wake up and smell the garbage at the QB position? When is enough enough? What will it take? I thought some of you would wake up after 4 straight years of cr*p at QB....obviously I overestimated some of you....

p.s. thanks for the negative and positive rep.

doug :stirpot:

Wolf
08-28-2006, 09:52 PM
true and Dom had some pretty good defenses on his resume, yet w/the Texans we hit a defensive ranking of 31 last season.

:stirpot:

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 09:56 PM
LOL.

A billionaire and seven head coaching candidates who applied for the job, one of which has coached big-time QBs to Super Bowl wins, think David Carr is salvageable...but Doug from the Woodlands and "anybody who has seen football," as he claims, can see that he "sucks."

We look better. Period. And we have a guy, whom I admit is looking good too, who can stand in when needed.


If we have to "simplify" things to help David get off to a start, think of it as the beginning of the end...... because I think that's what we've been doing for the last 2 years.

cbnjwill
08-28-2006, 10:01 PM
look guys after 5yrs. of david carr at the helm the only conclusion you can come to is that carr is garbage. enough excuses about the o-line, play calling its only been 5yrs hes gona get better..... give me a break.. lets look at reality and actually watch his play. after every game on this board there are homers making excuses and coming up with reasons for his below average play. i have the answer for the reason of his below average play and that is he is a below average qb. its looking like we are gonna have to use that first round pick on a qb next yr.. maybe we can land brady quinn or another college stud as long as we dont take another d-lineman in the first round again.was hoping for peterson... but thats right in this system we dont need to use a high pick on rb...hate to say it but maybe we should trade andre johnson, this guy can be a great receiver but with carr here the guy is never gonna be able to take his game to superstar level. maybe we should just do him a favor and send him to a team with a legit qb.

Wolf
08-28-2006, 10:06 PM
look guys after 5yrs. of david carr at the helm the only conclusion you can come to is that carr is garbage. enough excuses about the o-line, play calling its only been 5yrs hes gona get better..... give me a break.. lets look at reality and actually watch his play. after every game on this board there are homers making excuses and coming up with reasons for his below average play. i have the answer for the reason of his below average play and that is he is a below average qb. its looking like we are gonna have to use that first round pick on a qb next yr.. maybe we can land brady quinn or another college stud as long as we dont take another d-lineman in the first round again.was hoping for peterson... but thats right in this system we dont need to use a high pick on rb...hate to say it but maybe we should trade andre johnson, this guy can be a great receiver but with carr here the guy is never gonna be able to take his game to superstar level. maybe we should just do him a favor and send him to a team with a legit qb.

:hmmm: remind me because my memory is fuzzy, who threw AJ the ball in 2004 when AJ made the probowl?

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 10:23 PM
:hmmm: remind me because my memory is fuzzy, who threw AJ the ball in 2004 when AJ made the probowl?

he was added as an alternate first off, and he got the nod mainly because he actually put up numbers even though Carr was his QB. The other players in the league realized that. How many screens did AJ turn into big plays that year? It sure wasnt cause of who threw it to him. He got to the PB that year for a variety of reasons, none of which was Carr.

doug

thunderkyss
08-28-2006, 10:26 PM
look guys after 5yrs. of david carr at the helm the only conclusion you can come to is that carr is garbage. enough excuses about the o-line, play calling its only been 5yrs hes gona get better..... give me a break.. lets look at reality and actually watch his play.

What kind of offense would you like to run........ seriously.

what kind of QB do you want.

I think most of our problem with Carr, is that we want him to be something he isn't. While I like a good running game, I also like the big game explosiveness of a StL-KurtWarner-Run&Shoot-WCO style offense. We've got the recievers for it, and the Runningback.... but we don't have the QB.

I'll take the Denver running game with their big play opportunities.... on paper, David looks like the right guy for that..

but on game day, since he seems to perform better with a no huddle, in a 2 minute situation..... we may need to run a Warren Moon style run & shoot. I can see David running that O.

but again, what is it that you would like to see

CaptainPatriot
08-28-2006, 10:27 PM
Here is Carr on 3rd down this preseason. He has passed 10 times and converted ZERO 3rd downs into 1st downs.

3-5-HOU40 (9:54) D.Carr pass short middle to E.Moulds to HST 44 for 4 yards (D.Johnson, P.Surtain).
3-23-HOU32 (13:48) D.Carr pass short left to W.Lundy to HST 45 for 13 yards (W.Witherspoon).
3-10-HOU29 (9:37) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to A.Johnson.
3-11-STL19 (3:24) D.Carr sacked at SL 28 for -9 yards (C.Chavous). FUMBLES (C.Chavous), touched at SL 28, RECOVERED by SL-C.Chavous at SL 30. C.Chavous to SL 41 for 11 yards (F.Weary). Play Challenged by HST and REVERSED. D.Carr pass incomplete short left to A.Johnson [C.Chavous].
3-7-HOU42 (13:52) D.Carr pass incomplete short right to A.Johnson.
3-7-HOU35 (4:44) D.Carr pass incomplete short left to A.Johnson (D.Groce).
3-4-50 (6:44) D.Carr sacked at 50 for 0 yards (K.Lang). FUMBLES (K.Lang), touched at DEN 48, ball out of bounds at HST 44.
3-4-HOU48 (3:22) D.Carr sacked at HST 41 for -7 yards (E.Ekuban).
3-8-DEN40 (1:13) D.Carr pass short middle to K.Walter to DEN 35 for 5 yards (DJ.Williams).
3-5-DEN11 (:12) D.Carr spiked the ball to stop the clock.


thats the stats I was looking for. It proves DC chokes when the pressure is on. like to see his career stats on 3rd ,4th down and 4th quarter.

Wolf
08-28-2006, 10:31 PM
he was added as an alternate first off, and he got the nod mainly because he actually put up numbers even though Carr was his QB. The other players in the league realized that. How many screens did AJ turn into big plays that year? It sure wasnt cause of who threw it to him. He got to the PB that year for a variety of reasons, none of which was Carr.

doug

wow,just wow

2004 Palmer and staff ran an offense that utilized AJ's size and speed, we got him the ball in slants and stuff, well for some reason the Texans made a Mike Tice-like statement, we will get AJ more involved and move him around and take advantage of mismatches..well I don't know where that philosophy went because AJ was catching balls that were comeback routes and hooks (not utilizing his speed and strength like in 2004)

Here is to 2004 like season for AJ.
:cowboy1:

Wolf
08-28-2006, 10:33 PM
thats the stats I was looking for. It proves DC chokes when the pressure is on. like to see his career stats on 3rd ,4th down and 4th quarter.


not to defend Carr,because I am in belief with any QB in the NFL, having a good TE helps on the 3rd down plays, this is the first season we have some legit TE's. I do expect the 3rd down percentage to improve this season and if it doesn't, we will be in for a long season.

The Pencil Neck
08-28-2006, 11:07 PM
look guys after 5yrs. of david carr at the helm the only conclusion you can come to is that carr is garbage.

Obviously, that's not the only conclusion you can come to. Lots of us are looking at the same things you are and coming to a totally different conclusion.

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 11:32 PM
What kind of offense would you like to run........ seriously.

what kind of QB do you want.

but on game day, since he seems to perform better with a no huddle, in a 2 minute situation..... we may need to run a Warren Moon style run & shoot. I can see David running that O.

but again, what is it that you would like to see

Thunder, all I want to see is some wins. I don't care if we run the freaking wishbone or veer offense, I just want some wins.

As for Carr running a Moon run&shoot style offense, he isn't nearly enough cerebral to do that. Moon always seemed to choke when the money was on the line but that dude could read a defense very well and was a very smart quarterback. Carr has trouble making reads and struggles delivering the football to his RB much less 5 wideouts like Moon did.

BTW Congrats to Moon on getting into the Hall Of Fame. Statistically deserving for sure but even more so as being a pioneer for African-American's at the Quarterback position in the NFL.

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 11:34 PM
not to defend Carr,because I am in belief with any QB in the NFL, having a good TE helps on the 3rd down plays, this is the first season we have some legit TE's. I do expect the 3rd down percentage to improve this season and if it doesn't, we will be in for a long season.

Good point on the whole TE aspect. Still kinda an excuse but at least one that is legit and valid. We have never had a good TE but havent seen Carr do much to Putzier in this preseason....here is to hoping that change.

CajunTexan
08-28-2006, 11:36 PM
Carr has sucked, is sucking, and will continue to suck. There is a reason Al Saunders isnt our head coach. He knew what a pile of garbage Carr was, is, and will be...and that is why he is making more $ as asst. headcoach and off. coordinator of the Redskins than Kubes is as Texans HC.
As for 'we look better'. I agree with that and it looks like we got a heart transplant for our team, but this albatross of Carr has got to go before we can be a legitimate NFL franchise. The Carr experiment is over and is an abject failure....for some reason I bet if Carr was an African-American half of you would be calling for him to be dropped like a rock.....not surprising that yall are all probably McKKKLane Astro fans as well.....

btw if any of you are watching Carson Palmer play QB, you would see what a real QB looks like even after surgery, not a lot of work in preseason, and LOADS of pressure. This kumbaya (sic) schtick that yall pull out for Carr is just embarassing as a fellow fan. You may not like my opinion but I just want what is best for our team...and that would be to drop the hammer on Carr and turn page on that chapter. Of course 2-14 was a year ago and you must have forgotten how bad it was...well if Carr looks like he has his entire career expect more of the same in teh future with him at the helm.

doug from teh woodlands

p.s. keep the negative rep flowing. i call it like i see it and just because I dont drink the koolaid doesnt make me any less of a fan than half you homers.

doug

You can run but you can't hide...I wish you would quit changing your header, it keeps throwing off my ignore list. I think this will be your third incarnation.

Do you read this trash before you click the submit reply icon? I really can not see how you can call yourself a fan of this team.

"There is much anger in him, like his father"

Go read Kubiaks "Monday Presser" and his thoughts on Carr's performance. I guess you and all the other "Haters" will stereotype Kubiak as a "Carr Homer/Apologist" now.

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 11:39 PM
Obviously, that's not the only conclusion you can come to. Lots of us are looking at the same things you are and coming to a totally different conclusion.

It's the Cougar in you. You are used to supporting subpar football programs so I am not surprised you draw a different conclusion than some of us, geez the Texans must seem like the Steel Curtain-era Steelers to you when compared to Cougar High.

doug ftw

Second Honeymoon
08-28-2006, 11:44 PM
You can run but you can't hide...I wish you would quit changing your header, it keeps throwing off my ignore list. I think this will be your third incarnation.

Do you read this trash before you click the submit reply icon? I really can not see how you can call yourself a fan of this team.

"There is much anger in him, like his father"

Go read Kubiaks "Monday Presser" and his thoughts on Carr's performance. I guess you and all the other "Haters" will stereotype Kubiak as a "Carr Homer" now.

Why am I not surprised your cajun? Don't you have a possum to fry up for dinner or something?

As for Kubes, what do you expect him to say? He claimed he can fix the jalopy so I don't think he is going to admit he was wrong Week 3 of Carr....it's just that for some us this is Week 79 of 'Life With Carr'.......

CajunTexan
08-28-2006, 11:48 PM
Why am I not surprised your cajun? Don't you have a possum to fry up for dinner or something?
As for Kubes, what do you expect him to say? He claimed he can fix the jalopy so I don't think he is going to admit he was wrong Week 3 of Carr....it's just that for some us this is Week 79 of 'Life With Carr'.......

Damn, that is clever. Thanks for validating the post. (You have had enough "Jack and coke" tonight, put it down and go to bed before you're banned again)

I expect Kubiak to do what he has been doing since he has arrived, telling it like it is. If and when he has seen enough, that will be good for me.

Texans86
08-28-2006, 11:55 PM
As for Kubes, what do you expect him to say? He claimed he can fix the jalopy so I don't think he is going to admit he was wrong Week 3 of Carr....it's just that for some us this is Week 79 of 'Life With Carr'.......


It's hard to have a complete overhaul on Carr in only 6 months. What we know so far, he starts off slow. If Kubiak can get Carr to start off a game like he is in the third or fourth series, watch out for this team.

jerek
08-29-2006, 12:01 AM
What kind of offense would you like to run........ seriously.

what kind of QB do you want.

I think most of our problem with Carr, is that we want him to be something he isn't. While I like a good running game, I also like the big game explosiveness of a StL-KurtWarner-Run&Shoot-WCO style offense. We've got the recievers for it, and the Runningback.... but we don't have the QB.

I'll take the Denver running game with their big play opportunities.... on paper, David looks like the right guy for that..

but on game day, since he seems to perform better with a no huddle, in a 2 minute situation..... we may need to run a Warren Moon style run & shoot. I can see David running that O.

but again, what is it that you would like to see

JMO that Carr always plays better when we run an aggressive O. It will take a little time still to work the Pendry out of him but I think we're starting to see what he's capable of.

WILLIEG
08-29-2006, 12:15 AM
Like I've said in countless other threads, the problem starts up front on both offense as well as defense. Our O-linehas been the achilles heel of the organization ever since the birth of the Texans. Carr can and will never be able to throw deep routes and sit in the pocket like Palmer did tonight, because he has no trust in his O-line. And should he, hell no! They are improving much more than any year prior to this year, but will still make mistakes and leaving Carr on his ***. Until either Wand or Spencer step up their game in hte pass protection department there will be no real progress Carr will be able to make as the season goes but and the franchise finally relizes it's time for a dominant LT that can do it all. The whole package in pass protectioon AND run game. Don't get me wrong I believe Sherman can make Wand a better LT, but at his best he might only be a servicable back up. And As much as I like that kid Spencer, he does ahve the footwork it takes to be a top/dominant LT. He's strong as hell though in nthe upper body and would probably be better suited at the guard postion. Whenever Plummer headed over to Denver he had an O-line that was in place to protect him and they used the bootlegs or rollouts to broaden his game and give it a different dimension. Where Carr is use bootlegs and rollouts primarily to save his life, because our O-line is still the weakest link on the team.

infantrycak
08-29-2006, 12:36 AM
There is a reason Al Saunders isnt our head coach.

Yes there is--because McNair didn't want him as the head coach. You have repeated this numerous times with zero support. The only public statements out there are that every coach, that would include your precious Al, said they could win with Carr. Fine they may all have been lying, bad judgment, whatever, but he is in the same group.

Bamaborn-Texasbred
08-29-2006, 10:03 AM
The offense is starting to 'click'. Carr could look better, and I hope he will. I'm behind him 100%. I don't know how long his rope is going to be, but I think the Kubiak and Sherman offense is either going to vindicate Carr or bury him.

socalfan
08-30-2006, 01:33 AM
I want to know when he is going to realize he has to get rid of the ball. Is he that bad at finding his receivers and deciding if they will be open? Good Grief he holds on to the ball way too long, and when he does he doesn't know what to do with the damn thing.

thunderkyss
08-30-2006, 07:57 AM
I want to know when he is going to realize he has to get rid of the ball. Is he that bad at finding his receivers and deciding if they will be open? Good Grief he holds on to the ball way too long, and when he does he doesn't know what to do with the damn thing.


Personally, I think David has come a long way. He's still making some mistakes we'd rather not see him make, but from game to game, I believe he is making strides.

In KansasCity, I noticed David isn't running scared........ he's running, he's moving, but he's trying to make plays, and you gotta love him for that. He didn't leave the pocket early, he didn't succomb to any sacks, and he didn't "give up" on any play.

In StL, I noticed David kept his eyes downfield, even though the pocket was collapsing around him. He didn't see the defenders around him, but kept his attention where it should be.

In Denver, I noticed the Happy feet were gone (from David, I noticed Plummer still had happy feet, but Babin & Demeco were ringing his bell, so go figure). I think he's been showing improvement in his demeanor since the KC game. He's not as anxious at the start of the game........... he still has some calming down to do, don't get me wrong, but he is definitely getting better.

So far, his biggest weakness, IMHO, is that his internal clock seems to be wound a little tight. He's rushed a few throws. Now this, to me, doesn't contradict what I said earlier. His Composure, his "poise" is vastly improved. He's not playing scared. But sometimes, he is feeling and reacting to pressure that isn't their.

The KC game, the throw to Aj who was triple covered.

The StL game, the throw to the DB standing in front of Aj.

The Denver game, the throw to Owen Daniels in the first quarter. Owen never really got off his block, and as soon as he turned to try to run his pattern, the ball was in his helmet.

I don't fault David for the INT, where he tried to rifle the ball to Wali. That was a great play by M.Myers(96)...... who'd have thunk he was that fast. I don't think that was necessarily a Bad decision.

Like I said, I think it's his internal clock....... I could be wrong. But we need to find out what is going on inside his head, and fix it.

His other problem......... he doesn't seem to trust his recievers. So far though, they haven't given him reason to.

CaptainPatriot
08-30-2006, 07:14 PM
not to defend Carr,because I am in belief with any QB in the NFL, having a good TE helps on the 3rd down plays, this is the first season we have some legit TE's. I do expect the 3rd down percentage to improve this season and if it doesn't, we will be in for a long season.





YEP, I'll give you this it is going to be a long season! DC had 3 games now to look for his (NEW) TE's. I don't understand how all of a sudden the skies are going to open up and DC is going to look for his TE's on 3rd down when the season starts. When he has a clock ticking in his head knowing he is about to be sacked at the site of the 1st D man to come next to him. Then panics and rolls out of the pocket out of control where he goes out of bounds or fumbles the football. Instead of stepping up into the pocket or moving laterally away from the pressure while still looking down field. Look at Palmer and Brady they are oblivious to the pass rush. Head always looking down field looking left to right scanning the whole field. I see Brady get hit a lot in the pocket during a game. But he waits till the last second for the WR or TE to get that little opening just as a Blitzing LB sticks him in the chest! I dont see that in DC.
All those previous sacks have him gun shy! Next time on 3rd down if the Camera has a close up of DC.Look at his eyes. Looks like a Deer in Head Lights. The D sees it also. D knows when they see fear in a QBs eyes! Why do you think D's Blitz DC like crazy?

Bobo
08-30-2006, 07:16 PM
I tell you what, if this was a complete game, we win this sucker. Our Offense was picking up speed and was clicking starting right before the half and it carried on into the 3rd..............Our Defense was salty all night.

Carr looked very good and was throwing the ball with accuracy and with smart possition of the football.You have to remeber that this is a new system for this guy and the team, he looked a little unsure the last 2 games, BUT last night it looked like it started to fire and started to click in Carr.AND this was against Denvers 1st D:cool: . At the beginning when they were doing bad, the sideline lady ask kubiak about the start of the football game and he said that, "We did not give him good calls to work with". And that ball had some hot sauce on it last night. Going trough his progressions nicely as well.

Vernond Morency looked awsome, would you guys agree? Did you see the Reggie Bushness come out:shades: when he was heading toward the sideline? But really I thought he played well.

Oline played well accept for one wiegert play:crying: , but all together they played as a group.Spencer is our new starting LT, the guy is a beast and we need to get his name out there.

Owen Daniels looked good catching that ball from Carr rolling out. And thank you for jumping on the ball Owen.

E-Weeeeeez-E-Eric Moulds..........Love how this guy plays and is taking to his roll without complaining. Did very well..............EXCEPT on the deep ball, did it look like he started off the ball for about 6 yards jogging? It did to me, and just like Starling Sharpe said "You will never know how well that ball was thrown, cause it looked like Moulds lost a step."

Defense did a great job a great job considering who we were playing and how tough there Offense was and is.

All around rest all our starters next week, cause we got it clicking down here and I am pumped about our season, I think we are going to be a surprise, a big surprise this year.

:tease: Are we watching the same Texans team? Maybe you are watching their big brothers, the Broncos. But the Texans I saw continue the three-and-out/turnover doldrums.

CaptainPatriot
08-30-2006, 07:28 PM
Man you are ruthless with Carr. He by far was not spectacular last night (either was Andre Johnson), but he was decent. He actually threw to TE's and settled down a bit. We had some really good long drives that led to scores (no TD's however) I'm not panicking on Carr as I know it will take a little time for him to click with this type of offense (notice he Kubiak didn't really rip him for the slow start).


I don't understand. How DC needs more time to click. When Sage is clicking already with 2nd and 3rd string. The long drives you are talking about. Is 1 of them with 2 minutes in the half and the Bronco D was in prevent? And the other when the 2nd string D came in on DC's last drive? DC had his chance on the 1st drive on 3rd down. Look what happened? He panicked fumbling out of bounds. KUB should ripped him for that! Did DC have a 1st down before the last 2 minutes of the half?

hollywood_texan
08-30-2006, 07:34 PM
Next time on 3rd down if the Camera has a close up of DC.Look at his eyes. Looks like a Deer in Head Lights. The D sees it also. D knows when they see fear in a QBs eyes! Why do you think D's Blitz DC like crazy?

I don't think there is a defensive coordinator in the league that is concerned about Carr burning them with the deep ball. Which contributes to the blitzing issue, defensive coordinators are going to bring the heat because the odds are in their favor they will not get burned for doing so.

tsip
08-30-2006, 08:41 PM
...just sit back and relax and enjoy the games--we'll know soon enough if DC is the 'man.' How many games did Capers get last year before all the:homer: 's disappeared from the boards (some still have not come back)? Time will settle this arguement...

The Pencil Neck
08-30-2006, 09:46 PM
It's the Cougar in you. You are used to supporting subpar football programs so I am not surprised you draw a different conclusion than some of us, geez the Texans must seem like the Steel Curtain-era Steelers to you when compared to Cougar High.

doug ftw

All of these things are cyclical. No one stays on top forever. We were up there near the top for a long time. I remember my Cougars down 40-20 to the Horns going into the 4th quarter, scoring 40 and winning 60-40. That was a great freaking game. :)

We got killed because of recruiting violations and we haven't recovered, yet. We might never recover. But I'm not giving up home.

Porky
08-30-2006, 09:54 PM
Lance Z from SR 610 sent an email tonight, and it pretty much agrees with my take, and I thought I would share it:

David Carr is scaring me. I know he has the tools to be a good NFL QB but I just don't see Carr display the mindset of a good NFL QB. Carr is clearly rushing to get rid of the ball and he just doesn't do a great job of buying himself time by moving around in the pocket while keeping his eyes on his WRs. When Carr is sensing pressure, he has a tendency to dump down to RBs/FBs or just take off. If Carr is going to make in the NFL, he's going to have to develop more poise and he has to start to look down the field more than he has over the last year and a half.

HJam72
08-30-2006, 10:06 PM
...just sit back and relax and enjoy the games--we'll know soon enough if DC is the 'man.' How many games did Capers get last year before all the:homer: 's disappeared from the boards (some still have not come back)? Time will settle this arguement...

I'm telling you Capers will be back and he will succeed!!!!!!!!111111 :wacko:

infantrycak
08-31-2006, 12:28 AM
Did DC have a 1st down before the last 2 minutes of the half?

Yes, came on the 2nd play the Texans had--shows how closely you were watching.

Roughnecks
08-31-2006, 01:38 AM
Thats strange a Saints fan talking about another team not making the playoffs thats like calling the kettle black. Look let us worry about Carr you worry about your Saints D, wait I mean your team because we all know who will be picking first in next years draft and it's not the Texans. Can I get a amen from the bobbleheads.

tsip
08-31-2006, 02:31 AM
Yes, came on the 2nd play the Texans had--shows how closely you were watching.

...so you knew that w/o looking back at a recording!!...good memory

thunderkyss
08-31-2006, 08:38 AM
Lance Z from SR 610 sent an email tonight, and it pretty much agrees with my take, and I thought I would share it:

David Carr is scaring me. I know he has the tools to be a good NFL QB but I just don't see Carr display the mindset of a good NFL QB. Carr is clearly rushing to get rid of the ball and he just doesn't do a great job of buying himself time by moving around in the pocket while keeping his eyes on his WRs. When Carr is sensing pressure, he has a tendency to dump down to RBs/FBs or just take off. If Carr is going to make in the NFL, he's going to have to develop more poise and he has to start to look down the field more than he has over the last year and a half.

I can undedrsrtand this point of view.... & I doubt there is anyone who seriously disagrees with the premise.

I've stated in my reviews of the game, where David is improving, and they are in many of the areas you are stating he needs improvement. The question, is how much improvement in those areas should we expect at this time.

He is looking downfield....... look at the sack from the StL game, and the roughing the passer call on the first play of that game...... David was looking where he needed to be looking, downfield.

ON every snap of the preseason, David has been looking for his recievers, and not looking for which OLman is getting beat the worst, something he had to do last year. He's rushed 2 throws that I count, and has only made 3 stupid throws........ and none of them, I think, were because he was scared...... like he was last year.

He is leaving the pocket when he gets in trouble, that much is true. I'd like to see him start to use the protection he is given, but for all the things he has improved on, I'm content in allowing more time for him to develope a pocket presence.

I'll admit, I wasn't always a Carr Hater. I was very impressed with him his first two years. One of the things I noticed during that time, was that he wasn't scared, even with all the sacks & hits he was taking. He's a tough kid. & when I say he is tough, I don't mean Timex tough... I think Leftwich is tough also, but he's pretty fragile at the same time.

When I say tough, I mean that you knock him down, and he pops up and says, "thankyou sir may I have another". I don't think it was till the end of 2004 that David realized he can't keep taking that kind of beating, and no one else was going to do anything about it. IMHO, that's when he started to play scared.

I think it's just a matter of time, before Carr will understand how to use the pocket, and how to beat the blitz........ So far, it appears that Kubiak has built a team that allows David to learn those things.

I believe he is playing better than he did last year....... I believe he has shown improvement in several areas from game to game.... I have no reason to believe he won't continue to get better in those other areas that we all know he needs to get better in.

thunderkyss
08-31-2006, 08:46 AM
Yep in 5 years ,he's really come a long way HUH!!!? I think you like to post all these Dreams so you can come back and feel good about DC when you read them...
Just remember one thing BROUSSARDSAINT says, and that DC sucks and you will not make it to the playoffs with him as you're QB..(stop finding Excuse after Excuse why DC was intercepted or did something wrong.)

it only took you guys six years to make a decision on Aaron Brooks.........

I agree with you 100%, that 5 years is a long time. I agree that most QBs don't get 5 years.... & I agree the Saints are going to finish at the bottom of the NFC South.

But those decisions were made without my input. & I can't do anything about that.

Looking Forward, David has improved from one game to the next. I don't see any reason to believe he won't continue to improve. He still has the talent, and the atlethicism to be a really good QB. Right now, it's a head game, and that is supposedly Kubiak's specialty. We'll see.

infantrycak
08-31-2006, 09:17 AM
...so you knew that w/o looking back at a recording!!...good memory

Actually I did--it happens so rarely that we get 9 yds on the 1st play of the game and then a 1st on the 2nd that it stuck.