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Ibar_Harry
08-24-2006, 01:24 AM
This is from Lopez's H Chronicle article this evening:

That's the way it should be, but if you think a controversy of sorts is on the horizon, think again.

"(Rosenfels) has got starter ability," Kubiak said. "All the players gravitate toward him, and that's great. It's great for the team. It's great for David. It pushes David every day, and that's why we went and got him."

And the result, said Kubiak: "No buts. David's our starting quarterback. He has to hold up his end of the bargain. When there's a play he's got to make, he's got to make it."

What you have seen in preseason games from Rosenfels has been impressive. What Carr has done not just in games, but day in and day out with Kubiak, Calhoun and Rosenfels constantly pushing, has only further convinced Kubiak of what he thought last winter when evaluating Carr.

"Athletically, he's even more than I thought he was," Kubiak said. "David's an extremely good athlete. There's no doubt about that. It's just a matter of being a pro and playing like a pro back there down in and down out.

"I want to see him do some things this week that he didn't do last week. I want to see him continue to lead this team, for his teammates to believe in him, and for him to gain more confidence. Just grow and grow and grow."

It's not just Carr's reputation and future that are tied to this happy union of him, Kubiak and McNair. If you don't believe the coach and owner are invested as well, then you haven't been paying attention to the real world since, oh, the Paleolithic Era.

--------------------------------------------------

I believe Kubiak is telling us he sees a lot of Elway athleticly in Carr. Carr has not been thinking on his own for a long time, because of the rigidity of the previous staff. Its hard to adlib when you have been programmed not to think for yourself for 4 years. A couple of times he was allowed to call his plays he did well only to be smaked in the face because he was to successful. Carr was a better QB in some ways when he played the 1st game against Dallas. He has to unlearn all that has come since that time.

I'm looking for him to get better and better, and then to explode. He had confidence in that 1st game and now its lacking or questioned. If he gets a few wins under his belt watch out. He won't be a bust for lack of effort. Kubiak nows that, and quite frankly reading between the lines, is hoping that David has not been ruined. He understands more than ever what David has gone through. Kubiak is an extremely bright football mind. He knows the QB position like the back of his hand and he knows he has a diamond in the rough or perhaps even more valueable than that.

davidghall
08-24-2006, 01:39 AM
GREAT Post! However, I believe that if Carr were to have major struggles in the first half of the year, Kubiak would not hesitate to make a QB change. I think Carr is the man for this team. He has enough people around him now, and should have an above average year, and be MUCH improved next year. The great thing about Kubiak is that if Carr WERE to end up being a bust, I don't believe Kubiak would hesitate to make the change. From what I can tell, he's going to play the players that are performing, regardless of salary.

texan279
08-24-2006, 01:48 AM
This is from Lopez's H Chronicle article this evening:

That's the way it should be, but if you think a controversy of sorts is on the horizon, think again.

"(Rosenfels) has got starter ability," Kubiak said. "All the players gravitate toward him, and that's great. It's great for the team. It's great for David. It pushes David every day, and that's why we went and got him."

And the result, said Kubiak: "No buts. David's our starting quarterback. He has to hold up his end of the bargain. When there's a play he's got to make, he's got to make it."

What you have seen in preseason games from Rosenfels has been impressive. What Carr has done not just in games, but day in and day out with Kubiak, Calhoun and Rosenfels constantly pushing, has only further convinced Kubiak of what he thought last winter when evaluating Carr.

"Athletically, he's even more than I thought he was," Kubiak said. "David's an extremely good athlete. There's no doubt about that. It's just a matter of being a pro and playing like a pro back there down in and down out.

"I want to see him do some things this week that he didn't do last week. I want to see him continue to lead this team, for his teammates to believe in him, and for him to gain more confidence. Just grow and grow and grow."

It's not just Carr's reputation and future that are tied to this happy union of him, Kubiak and McNair. If you don't believe the coach and owner are invested as well, then you haven't been paying attention to the real world since, oh, the Paleolithic Era.

--------------------------------------------------

I believe Kubiak is telling us he sees a lot of Elway athleticly in Carr. Carr has not been thinking on his own for a long time, because of the rigidity of the previous staff. Its hard to adlib when you have been programmed not to think for yourself for 4 years. A couple of times he was allowed to call his plays he did well only to be smaked in the face because he was to successful. Carr was a better QB in some ways when he played the 1st game against Dallas. He has to unlearn all that has come since that time.

I'm looking for him to get better and better, and then to explode. He had confidence in that 1st game and now its lacking or questioned. If he gets a few wins under his belt watch out. He won't be a bust for lack of effort. Kubiak nows that, and quite frankly reading between the lines, is hoping that David has not been ruined. He understands more than ever what David has gone through. Kubiak is an extremely bright football mind. He knows the QB position like the back of his hand and he knows he has a diamond in the rough or perhaps even more valueable than that.

Thank you for posting this. Hopefully it will put and end to the 30 page Carr threads. I honestly believe that if Kubiak did not believe Carr was the best QB that someone else would be starting. Kubiak is here to make this team win games.

Ibar_Harry
08-24-2006, 01:53 AM
GREAT Post! However, I believe that if Carr were to have major struggles in the first half of the year, Kubiak would not hesitate to make a QB change. I think Carr is the man for this team. He has enough people around him now, and should have an above average year, and be MUCH improved next year. The great thing about Kubiak is that if Carr WERE to end up being a bust, I don't believe Kubiak would hesitate to make the change. From what I can tell, he's going to play the players that are performing, regardless of salary.

To put it another way, Carr has done and continues to do everything Kubiak asks him to do and more to get better. He is busting his a.s for the team. Kubiak knows it and he knows that many of David's problems are also a function of what the team is doing. You will hear Kubiak constantly say "David has to get better and the players have to get better to help David" or words more less to that effect. Again, he is simply saying that he is watching the tape and David should be reacting better in some cases, but part of the problem is the play of other players. David can not make up for every mistake other players make and likewise they can not make up for every mistake he makes. This is a team game and it requires everyone functioning at the same level at the same time to be as successful as they want to be.

They have their eyes set on at least the playoffs and if you don't think that I think you are in for a big surprise. Now, we can debate all night whether they can achieve that, but I will tell you that is their goal, if not higher. I keep saying this team is going to surprise you this year. It has to do with how this team is coming together. They are a TEAM this year.

davidghall
08-24-2006, 02:08 AM
Couldn't agree with you more. When the '04 team goes 7-9, how does this team not go 16-0?? No but seriously, I don't think 10-6 is out of the question. I know it's just preseason, but I think preseason play has become UNDERrated. These are still players that are fighting for spots and play games to win, not just to be out on the field. I see us having a slightly above average offense, a slightly above average defense, and an above average record at 9-7, 10-6. This coaching staff will not remind you of Jack Pardee or Dom Capers staring in total disbelief on the sideline. Kubiak is a very smart guy and i'm sure he will have the answers for just about anything the defense throws his way. Don't know too much about the DC Smith, but if Kubiak is ok with him, then so am I. Should be a fun year.

tsip
08-24-2006, 02:43 AM
This is from Lopez's H Chronicle article this evening:

That's the way it should be, but if you think a controversy of sorts is on the horizon, think again.

"(Rosenfels) has got starter ability," Kubiak said. "All the players gravitate toward him, and that's great. It's great for the team. It's great for David. It pushes David every day, and that's why we went and got him."

And the result, said Kubiak: "No buts. David's our starting quarterback. He has to hold up his end of the bargain. When there's a play he's got to make, he's got to make it."

What you have seen in preseason games from Rosenfels has been impressive. What Carr has done not just in games, but day in and day out with Kubiak, Calhoun and Rosenfels constantly pushing, has only further convinced Kubiak of what he thought last winter when evaluating Carr.

"Athletically, he's even more than I thought he was," Kubiak said. "David's an extremely good athlete. There's no doubt about that. It's just a matter of being a pro and playing like a pro back there down in and down out.

"I want to see him do some things this week that he didn't do last week. I want to see him continue to lead this team, for his teammates to believe in him, and for him to gain more confidence. Just grow and grow and grow."

It's not just Carr's reputation and future that are tied to this happy union of him, Kubiak and McNair. If you don't believe the coach and owner are invested as well, then you haven't been paying attention to the real world since, oh, the Paleolithic Era.

--------------------------------------------------

I believe Kubiak is telling us he sees a lot of Elway athleticly in Carr. Carr has not been thinking on his own for a long time, because of the rigidity of the previous staff. Its hard to adlib when you have been programmed not to think for yourself for 4 years. A couple of times he was allowed to call his plays he did well only to be smaked in the face because he was to successful. Carr was a better QB in some ways when he played the 1st game against Dallas. He has to unlearn all that has come since that time.

I'm looking for him to get better and better, and then to explode. He had confidence in that 1st game and now its lacking or questioned. If he gets a few wins under his belt watch out. He won't be a bust for lack of effort. Kubiak nows that, and quite frankly reading between the lines, is hoping that David has not been ruined. He understands more than ever what David has gone through. Kubiak is an extremely bright football mind. He knows the QB position like the back of his hand and he knows he has a diamond in the rough or perhaps even more valueable than that.


Kubiak knows a lot more about Carr than he ever did before alright, and I find it 'telling'-while Kubiak thinks Carr is athletic-he never mentions any of his actual QB strengths. Why?

"It's just a matter of being a pro and playing like a pro back there down in and down out."

IMO, that quote says a 'ton,' as does the quote about his team mates believing in him. WOW, this Sunday Night game is gonna be interesting--NFL Network Sunday Game of the Week--kubiak and Shannahan...and Carr's time to 'shine.' :cool:

HJam72
08-24-2006, 02:45 AM
I'm going to make a wild guess right now and this is it:

At some point this year, Carr gets benched--not because he sucks, but because he is not improving quite as fast as his back-up. By the end of this year, Carr is back and ESPN can't shut up about his extroardinary comeback. 50 yd. passes on a rope and pin-point perfect. AHEAD of M. Vick on rushing by a QB. LEADERSHIP QUALITIES bragged about, etc., etc. I just got a feeling the light is starting to come on.

beerlover
08-24-2006, 03:08 AM
no bold predicitions from me regarding this topic, I'm taking a wait and see approach :spy:

I would however like to see the Texans aggressively stretch the field with some early deep balls & let David air it out some then come back to the underneath stuff. once he gains his confidence & gets those Broncos off his back maybe he will resemble Elway :cool:

Malloy
08-24-2006, 06:09 AM
Of course this is pure speculation from my side, but so are most of the stuff mentioned in these threads. The way I see it, Kubiak has more interests than "just" putting the strongest team on the field. One thing I've been thinking about is the hiring of Kubiak and the role of Carr on this team. It seems to me that Kubiak were hired for several reasons, one being his spoken goal of making Carr great. If Kubiak benches Carr, it would not only show the world that Carr is not up to the task (no, I'm not saying that it will be permanantly!), but it would also prove that Kubiak himself made a mistake and misjudged the situation and Carr.

In my book, for Kubiak to bench Carr, would also mean admitting that he either 1: misjudged the talent (one of the things that landed him the job) or 2: Did not have the coaching abilities to turn Carr around.

Remember, this is just pure speculation, but a valid line of thought.

WILLIEG
08-24-2006, 07:01 AM
I'm not going to gauge our team's level of success on how many "W" we walk away with this year. As long as Carr makes quicker descions, stops staring down his potential targets, and doesn't create sacks for himself then I would be very happy. If he is really learning and growing as a QB, he will continue to make less mistakes and that would show everyone who doubts his abilities to lead this team. The two things I like most about Carr is the size of his heart and the strength of his arm arm. Hopefully he can grow and learn how to put all these intangibles together this year and make for one hell of a QB very soon!

Vinny
08-24-2006, 07:44 AM
Links with cut n paste articles please...Ibar, you are a long timer. Links or deletions...you make the call.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
08-24-2006, 08:10 AM
http://chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/lopez/4134627.html

Honoring Earl 34
08-24-2006, 08:28 AM
The article tells me that Carr still has a ways to go . A dog will hunt or it won't ... the pooch has to come with certain traits . I still see Carr doing things he did last year , ruff ruff .

HJam72
08-24-2006, 08:32 AM
Well, he's also still watching his tail-back whiff on blocks, so that may be a big part of it. We'll see how he does with Morency, who will hopefully block for him like he did for Rosenfels. I think Carr is performing supremely better in practice than in games and, hopefully, that is something that can be corrected, whether it's his fault, others, or, more likely, both.

Honoring Earl 34
08-24-2006, 08:38 AM
Well, he's also still watching his tail-back whiff on blocks, so that may be a big part of it. We'll see how he does with Morency, who will hopefully block for him like he did for Rosenfels. I think Carr is performing supremely better in practice than in games and, hopefully, that is something that can be corrected, whether it's his fault, others, or, more likely, both.
This was my translation of the article please don't run in to defend Carr .

HJam72
08-24-2006, 08:47 AM
This was my translation of the article please don't run in to defend Carr .

You can translate all you want and I can add to the conversation all I want. If you don't want to ever be even slightly disagreed with (and it was very slight) then don't post on public message boards. I defend Carr some and I put him down some. It all depends on the context, what's going on, and what people are saying.

To everyone else:

David Carr is the starting QB on this team, whether he should be or not and whether it will continue or not. Don't think you are the only one around who should be allowed to type his name in a sentence. If you don't want to hear about David Carr, and yes I know it gets old sometimes, then go do something else.

Honoring Earl 34
08-24-2006, 08:59 AM
The article was the topic not Carr's the starter . I think at some point Kubiak is going to blow his stack ... maybe in Dever .

Marcus
08-24-2006, 09:33 AM
The article was the topic not Carr's the starter . I think at some point Kubiak is going to blow his stack ... maybe in Dever .
I can see him blowing his stack, but not Denver. You have to remember this is a homecoming of sorts . . he'll be on his best behavior, no matter how it turns out.

I think he'll blow it later on, though. If Kubiak thinks of himself a patient man, Carr will test it. And another thing . . during the regular season games, if their is any interaction whatosever between Kubiak and Carr, the network will show it. I have my suspicions that the local 13 crew purposely steered away from any sort of exchange between them during last 2 preseason games.

As for Kubiak . . . I can see him getting into some hot water himself during the course of the season, regarding commenting about the players. I know he's a very refreshing change compared to the stiff rehearsed answers that Capers always gave us. But this is his first rodeo. I'm not sure he knows where the limits are.

HOU-TEX
08-24-2006, 10:24 AM
Thank you for posting this. Hopefully it will put and end to the 30 page Carr threads. I honestly believe that if Kubiak did not believe Carr was the best QB that someone else would be starting. Kubiak is here to make this team win games.

No, I think this thread will be one of those infamous Carr threads.:brickwall

RiotCommander
08-24-2006, 10:51 AM
Well if we don't get it done this year with Carr most likely we will get our shot at Quinn in the draft. These Mock draft boards always change constantly. Who would have thought Matt was going to drop to #10, I thought he was the most ready to play in the league right away. Strange that he has to ride the pine, but the Cards do have a chance at the playoffs. Sounds odd saying that.

U4ikrob
08-24-2006, 12:06 PM
I can see him blowing his stack, but not Denver. You have to remember this is a homecoming of sorts . . he'll be on his best behavior, no matter how it turns out.

I think he'll blow it later on, though. If Kubiak thinks of himself a patient man, Carr will test it. And another thing . . during the regular season games, if their is any interaction whatosever between Kubiak and Carr, the network will show it. I have my suspicions that the local 13 crew purposely steered away from any sort of exchange between them during last 2 preseason games.

As for Kubiak . . . I can see him getting into some hot water himself during the course of the season, regarding commenting about the players. I know he's a very refreshing change compared to the stiff rehearsed answers that Capers always gave us. But this is his first rodeo. I'm not sure he knows where the limits are.

Kubiak wants the best out of all his players and esp Carr. Weve all heard about Kubiaks getting on some players in practice and in particular Carr

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/4101013.html


IMO it's because he knows he's going to win or lose based on how well he can get David to play - bottom line.

IMO dont see Kubiak holding back on that approach later on as he set the tone early and got rid of the kid gloves approach w/David in order to try and shock him out of the old way of thinking nad let him know right up front what and how much he expects of him if he intends on being the starting QB of this team. IMHO dont think it will lead to Kubes blowing up on the sidelines all the time as he seems more of a players kind of coach and would be sensitive to that and how it might effect players on gameday. But right now especcially during Pre-Season - This is the time to eliminate mistakes and make Real Players out of some guys on this team.

http://blogs.chron.com/nfl/2006/08/carr_gets_earful_from_kubiak.html#comments

As for this being his first Rodeo - Thats true, but I dont see that as a huge hinderance in his ability to coach, just maybe how he reacts as your alluding to here. We all know he's spent years calling plays and working with the offense as he will here - but he didnt have the french fry lights on him then. Now with it being his show, it will be a little bit of a learning curve in his sideline/postgame stuff, but he's got a great NFL pedigree, staff and phone a friend network to help him get good information on the choices to make. If there is a big problem IMO think he will talk with Mike & Mike to get their takes. He's said more than once him and Shanahan still talk almost daily.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/4129861.html

Then the other Mike as in Sherman has soemthign to add too. Kubes and Sherman go way back and we all know he has quite a bit of HC experience to pull on too thus why he's the Asst head coach. I'm sure Coach K will lean on Mike & Mike anytime he can while at the same time trying to establish his own personality as a coach. I think Coach K knows how he wants to get things done while pulling on the collective experience around him to find the best way to get the team to win games - bottom line.

threetoedpete
08-24-2006, 12:12 PM
Well if we don't get it done this year with Carr most likely we will get our shot at Quinn in the draft. These Mock draft boards always change constantly. Who would have thought Matt was going to drop to #10, I thought he was the most ready to play in the league right away. Strange that he has to ride the pine, but the Cards do have a chance at the playoffs. Sounds odd saying that.

Well I'm no Einstien but there were several of us on the college boards who called that one. And it was by the grace of Floyd & Bud that VY didn't slide right along with him. Some of us also said that Cutler would be the best of the three....we'll see.

With our DB prblems this year, spending draft capitol on another developemental QB is a terrifing thought to me. Kinda llike granning slipping you the toungue.
Give the guy some grace...208 maulings should give DC a little more time from everyone.. Let it play out. It's not so much "do the guys trust him" , as Dose DC trust that pocket. I see hope.

thunderkyss
08-24-2006, 12:18 PM
Well if we don't get it done this year with Carr most likely we will get our shot at Quinn in the draft. These Mock draft boards always change constantly. Who would have thought Matt was going to drop to #10, I thought he was the most ready to play in the league right away. Strange that he has to ride the pine, but the Cards do have a chance at the playoffs. Sounds odd saying that.


I never heard this most ready to play stuff, when regarding a QB, until this year. When you draft a QB, it's for the future... not next week. QBs usually go on upside potential, and intangibles.

& if we are drafting high again next year, would we even consider a QB?? We've got Sage, and Porter...... Kubiak thinks Sage can start. The team "gravitates" towards him, and the fans are starting to like him.......

So unless both Carr & Sage stink it up.... I can't imagine us looking for a QB in '07.

I seriously doubt Kubiak has a contingency plan for picking in the top 10, much less the top 5.

real
08-24-2006, 12:20 PM
Kyss nice avatar...I thought I saw him blink for a second...

tsip
08-24-2006, 12:24 PM
"As for Kubiak . . . I can see him getting into some hot water himself during the course of the season, regarding commenting about the players. I know he's a very refreshing change compared to the stiff rehearsed answers that Capers always gave us. But this is his first rodeo. I'm not sure he knows where the limits are.'

IMO, this is an excellent point! "Airing out dirty laundry' is public is usually not a very good idea because of its A) demoralizing effect B) loss of respect from several sources C) erosion of spirit.

In Carr's situation, I think Kubiak is pulling out his last 'straw' in an effort to get through to Carr to perform to his potential on the field--transfer his 'practice' results to the 'game.' Certainly, he expected his initial efforts of support 'everywhere' and $8 million bonus to solve the problem, but it has not. However, the 'dual-headed' tactic he's using now could haunt Kubiak in the future. On the one hand, Carr is the 'man' but-on the other-his results on the field are unacceptable.

Most notably, this 'calling out' tactic has seemed to work with TJ, as-in a few short weeks-his 'play' has gone from bottom of the depth chart to starter who is producing. The by-product of TJ's scenario is he is no longer on the 'front page' of the newspaper in a negative way.

IMO, dealing with a persons 'mindset' is treading in 'dangerous water' because there is virtually no 'gray' area in the out come--either success or failure. This situation is tough on everyone, from the Owner to the Fans, and especially on Kubiak and Carr. Now, a good solid game would go a long way to 'ease' the tension.

Personally, if I were Kubiak, I would take away a 'lttle' of Carr's decision making and call plays that 'force' the issue a little bit--call plays to specifically throw the ball down field. I know-the entire premise of Kubiak's system is for the QB to read/decide'react at that moment based upon what the QB sees but--for whatever reason--it's not working for Carr. As other posters have 'expressed,' a little success may be the 'turning point' for David.

We all-in one way or another-have a lot invested in David. Here's hoping his success is 'just around the corner.':)

Vinny
08-24-2006, 12:26 PM
I don't see it as calling anyone out. He just isn't lying and hiding what he views as the truth. Capers used the Uncle Vito spin technique of never saying a bad thing about uncle Vito...no matter how long his wife has a black eye.

Texans_Chick
08-24-2006, 12:34 PM
I don't see it as calling anyone out. He just isn't lying and hiding what he views as the truth. Capers used the Uncle Vito spin technique of never saying a bad thing about uncle Vito...no matter how long his wife has a black eye.

Agreed.

I think Kubiak can say what he means because he is not all hardazz. He comes across as honest and open and a real person not a robot, and part of honest and open is saying what you mean even if is a little painful.

Today's blog post is about this concept:

Link: Gary Kubiak tells it like it is (sorta) (http://blogs.chron.com/fanblogtexans/2006/08/gary_kubiak_tells_it_like_it_i_1.html)

He tells his players what he means and when asked by the media he does the same. It is an interesting dance, but as long as there is encouragement along with the criticism, it ends up working out. It's called coaching.

thunderkyss
08-24-2006, 12:37 PM
Kyss nice avatar...I thought I saw him blink for a second...

OTs better not blink.......... or they'll find themselves on the wrong end of a butt whupp'n....

:redtowel:

Kaiser Toro
08-24-2006, 12:38 PM
Kubiak has a system that everyone is buying into and the results are showing. If he pumps someone up that is in competition with another fan's hero, shame on the fan for taking it personal. The guy knows his stuff and motivating players to get them ready to play when called upon is a terrific soft skill for great leaders.

This organization will be fine if Carr winds up being only a footnote in our history. In the interim I am thouroughly enjoying the results of the Kubia era to date.

U4ikrob
08-24-2006, 12:53 PM
This Carr/Kubiak stuff reminds me of the recent Don Shula /Wide Receiver 'Catch the ball' commercial I see running on ESPN about the receiver and catching the ball. At one point Shula acting as the coach says soemthing like 'I can see the potential you have, and I need to see more out of you or something to that effect"

I bring it up because it really reminds me of the whole approach by Kubiak of letting David know whats expected of him, seeing his potential and pushing him to get there.

MYDAUGHTER'STEXANS
08-24-2006, 12:58 PM
This is from Lopez's H Chronicle article this evening:

That's the way it should be, but if you think a controversy of sorts is on the horizon, think again.

"(Rosenfels) has got starter ability," Kubiak said. "All the players gravitate toward him, and that's great. It's great for the team. It's great for David. It pushes David every day, and that's why we went and got him."

And the result, said Kubiak: "No buts. David's our starting quarterback. He has to hold up his end of the bargain. When there's a play he's got to make, he's got to make it."

What you have seen in preseason games from Rosenfels has been impressive. What Carr has done not just in games, but day in and day out with Kubiak, Calhoun and Rosenfels constantly pushing, has only further convinced Kubiak of what he thought last winter when evaluating Carr.

"Athletically, he's even more than I thought he was," Kubiak said. "David's an extremely good athlete. There's no doubt about that. It's just a matter of being a pro and playing like a pro back there down in and down out.

"I want to see him do some things this week that he didn't do last week. I want to see him continue to lead this team, for his teammates to believe in him, and for him to gain more confidence. Just grow and grow and grow."

It's not just Carr's reputation and future that are tied to this happy union of him, Kubiak and McNair. If you don't believe the coach and owner are invested as well, then you haven't been paying attention to the real world since, oh, the Paleolithic Era.

--------------------------------------------------

I believe Kubiak is telling us he sees a lot of Elway athleticly in Carr. Carr has not been thinking on his own for a long time, because of the rigidity of the previous staff. Its hard to adlib when you have been programmed not to think for yourself for 4 years. A couple of times he was allowed to call his plays he did well only to be smaked in the face because he was to successful. Carr was a better QB in some ways when he played the 1st game against Dallas. He has to unlearn all that has come since that time.

I'm looking for him to get better and better, and then to explode. He had confidence in that 1st game and now its lacking or questioned. If he gets a few wins under his belt watch out. He won't be a bust for lack of effort. Kubiak nows that, and quite frankly reading between the lines, is hoping that David has not been ruined. He understands more than ever what David has gone through. Kubiak is an extremely bright football mind. He knows the QB position like the back of his hand and he knows he has a diamond in the rough or perhaps even more valueable than that.

GREAT POST BRAVO :redtowel: :redtowel: :redtowel: :redtowel:

Marcus
08-24-2006, 01:37 PM
Well, as someone else alluded to . . . we seem to have two David Carrs.

We have 'practice' David Carr . . . calm, collected, throwing passes accurately, both long and short.

And we have the 'game' David Carr . . . who is intimidated enough by the defensive pressure to where he acts scared anytime a pass play is called . . . he hurries his throws, he dumps it off too quickly, he runs with it too soon . . . and more than anything else . . . he gets field 'tunnel' vision. He can't find the open receiver when the primary is covered.

He acts scared because he is scared. I know, I know why he is that way. . . the 200 something sacks, the poor coaching staff, the bad OL, and on, and on, and on, ad infinitum, ad nauseum, blah, blah, whatever. I agree it's only human to be a little jumpy after all that abuse.

But David Carr can't think about the past anymore. He needs to take the handoff, drop back, plant his feet, find the open receiver, and stay right there, and knowing full well that some big DL is fixing to knock his head off . . and calmly deliver the ball to that open receiver . . . and take the hit. It's called . . . playing like a pro.

Has Carr played like a pro so far this season? Not in my opinion, he hasn't . . . and apparently, not in Kubiak's opinion either.

Am I optimistic that Kubiak can get David to quit being so scared? idonno:


__

OzzO
08-24-2006, 01:42 PM
merge the threads? (http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=26895)

tsip
08-24-2006, 01:45 PM
merge the threads? (http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=26895)


Why? This thread has 'nothing' to do with Sage,,,

J-Man
08-24-2006, 01:45 PM
I have wondered this quite a bit but what do we think a 5th year Carr would look like as a pro if he had been under a coach like Kubiak since he was a rookie? I bet he would be a top 10 QB with a chance to crack into the very elite level at some point.

I am very pleased with the vibe coming from camp, the media, and the direct words of the coaches and players. I defiently get the impression that our HC says what he means and means what he says, definetly a bonus in todays NFL.

santo
08-24-2006, 01:45 PM
He acts scared because he is scared. I know, I know why he is that way. . . the 200 something sacks, the poor coaching staff, the bad OL, and on, and on, and on, ad infinitum, ad nauseum, blah, blah, whatever. I agree it's only human to be a little jumpy after all that abuse.
.........

Am I optimistic that Kubiak can get David to quit being so scared? idonno:


__

Actually, you are not the only one that thinks Kubiak can turn things around. Kubiak also says it himself:


(on QB David Carr (http://houstontexans.com/team/roster_detail.php?PRKey=12)) “That’s tough when you go through a season when you get beat up a lot as a quarterback, that’s something you have to battle through. I went through kind of a little bit of the same situation with (Brian) Griese in Denver. We struggled a little bit in trying to settle him down. He did and I expect David to do the same thing.


http://houstontexans.com/news/detail.php?PRKey=2781&section=N%20Latest%20News

OzzO
08-24-2006, 01:51 PM
Why? This thread has 'nothing' to do with Sage,,,

same article - different path - same general discussion

Marcus
08-24-2006, 01:54 PM
(on QB David Carr) “That’s tough when you go through a season when you get beat up a lot as a quarterback, that’s something you have to battle through. I went through kind of a little bit of the same situation with (Brian) Griese in Denver. We struggled a little bit in trying to settle him down. He did and I expect David to do the same thing.
That's interesting. At least he has something to fall back on as a guideline. But I'm liking Kubiak more and more as the days go by. If he thinks he can settle him down, then I think he can, too.

Tale Gator
08-24-2006, 02:42 PM
No buts. David's our starting quarterback. He has to hold up his end of the bargain. When there's a play he's got to make, he's got to make it."
____________

This honestly doesn't sound so great for Carr -- the statement indicates that DC continues to not make important plays that he should. Kubiak will have a short leash with David if he continues this style of play. Kubs did not come Houston to develop a QB he came here to win -- NOW.

NFLforher
08-24-2006, 02:44 PM
Of course this is pure speculation from my side, but so are most of the stuff mentioned in these threads. The way I see it, Kubiak has more interests than "just" putting the strongest team on the field. One thing I've been thinking about is the hiring of Kubiak and the role of Carr on this team. It seems to me that Kubiak were hired for several reasons, one being his spoken goal of making Carr great. If Kubiak benches Carr, it would not only show the world that Carr is not up to the task (no, I'm not saying that it will be permanantly!), but it would also prove that Kubiak himself made a mistake and misjudged the situation and Carr.

In my book, for Kubiak to bench Carr, would also mean admitting that he either 1: misjudged the talent (one of the things that landed him the job) or 2: Did not have the coaching abilities to turn Carr around.

Remember, this is just pure speculation, but a valid line of thought.



Yes, but Kubiaks's job is to win games, with or without Carr.

tsip
08-24-2006, 05:38 PM
"Did not have the coaching abilities to turn Carr around."

IMO, this is not necessatily a true statement. All Kubiak can do is give Carr the tools/training/support he needs to succeed, he can not play the game on the field for David. The 'ball' is in Carr's corner and it is up to him to use all his training and learning/wisdom to make it work. Certainly, pro football (as well as every other 'facet' of life) is littered with 'can't misses' that did not make it for one reason or another. Will Carr be one? If not, fantastic. If so, it won't be Kubiak's fault. IMO, it comes down to how 'BAD' Carr wants 'IT'......:challenge

CaptainPatriot
08-24-2006, 10:12 PM
Kub has fallen for the fool’s gold (Athletic QB). Athleticism doesn’t not make a good NFL QB. A QB that can read Defenses does. I`m sure DC bust his a** in practice and all. Remember the old saying there are practice players then there are GAME TIME players. DC falls in the category of practice player. The last 2 Preseason Games he has not looked good. IE: that 4th down fumble he got lucky on that 1. Running into a blocker for a sack and not throwing crisp accurate passes. Kub brought in Sage to push DC. Doesn’t look like it is working. IE: Look at the performance of Bledsoe on Monday! You can tell he is being pushed by Romo. Where is DC`s performance like that? Also notice Kub never mentioned DC`s problem of reading Defenses. I keep hearing about how athletic DC is. When are we going to hear “wow that DC sure can read Defenses. I remember when he use to look at 1 WR and if he was covered DC would tuck the ball and run”. Keep hearing Week in and Week out DC is getting better. DC is still the same QB from last yr. Long as DC is in there it will be a long season once again. :challenge

wicked_wayz
08-24-2006, 10:17 PM
Kub has fallen for the fool’s gold (Athletic QB). Athleticism doesn’t not make a good NFL QB. A QB that can read Defenses does. I`m sure DC bust his a** in practice and all. Remember the old saying there are practice players then there are GAME TIME players. DC falls in the category of practice player. The last 2 Preseason Games he has not looked good. IE: that 4th down fumble he got lucky on that 1. Running into a blocker for a sack and not throwing crisp accurate passes. Kub brought in Sage to push DC. Doesn’t look like it is working. IE: Look at the performance of Bledsoe on Monday! You can tell he is being pushed by Romo. Where is DC`s performance like that? Also notice Kub never mentioned DC`s problem of reading Defenses. I keep hearing about how athletic DC is. When are we going to hear “wow that DC sure can read Defenses. I remember when he use to look at 1 WR and if he was covered DC would tuck the ball and run”. Keep hearing Week in and Week out DC is getting better. DC is still the same QB from last yr. Long as DC is in there it will be a long season once again. :challenge

i have faith in what kub sees in carr......if kub says hes the man for the job, then carrs the man....

Vinny
08-24-2006, 10:17 PM
"Did not have the coaching abilities to turn Carr around."

IMO, this is not necessatily a true statement. All Kubiak can do is give Carr the tools/training/support he needs to succeed, he can not play the game on the field for David. The 'ball' is in Carr's corner and it is up to him to use all his training and learning/wisdom to make it work. Certainly, pro football (as well as every other 'facet' of life) is littered with 'can't misses' that did not make it for one reason or another. Will Carr be one? If not, fantastic. If so, it won't be Kubiak's fault. IMO, it comes down to how 'BAD' Carr wants 'IT'......:challenge
I agree...players are what they are. Plumber, Griesie and Maddox will never be Elway no matter how much coaching they get from Kubiak. Coaching can enhance someones potential, but at the end of the day the players are what they are....all of them have flaws. Some of them are more fatal than others.

Texanfan4ever
08-24-2006, 10:18 PM
Kub has fallen for the fool’s gold (Athletic QB). Athleticism doesn’t not make a good NFL QB. A QB that can read Defenses does. I`m sure DC bust his a** in practice and all. Remember the old saying there are practice players then there are GAME TIME players. DC falls in the category of practice player. The last 2 Preseason Games he has not looked good. IE: that 4th down fumble he got lucky on that 1. Running into a blocker for a sack and not throwing crisp accurate passes. Kub brought in Sage to push DC. Doesn’t look like it is working. IE: Look at the performance of Bledsoe on Monday! You can tell he is being pushed by Romo. Where is DC`s performance like that? Also notice Kub never mentioned DC`s problem of reading Defenses. I keep hearing about how athletic DC is. When are we going to hear “wow that DC sure can read Defenses. I remember when he use to look at 1 WR and if he was covered DC would tuck the ball and run”. Keep hearing Week in and Week out DC is getting better. DC is still the same QB from last yr. Long as DC is in there it will be a long season once again. :challenge

Go home and take a nap, you will feel better when you wake up.

kingh99
08-24-2006, 10:41 PM
See I'll never trust Carr to be the man as long as he continues to choke under pressure. People say he's never had a chance to succeed because of the line. Guess what, other teams are scheming to come at him with everything and rattle him into freezing and taking the sack. This progresses after he throws into coverage badly and gets scared. It's the game plan because it works. He grips the ball too tightly when the defense blitzes and that's all they do against him. It's that bad.

See how he sidearm shuttles those dump off passes? Rattled. His body language was terrible last game. I admit it wasn't bad first game but who wants a QB that has to roll out to look good. He continues to look so hurried and indecisive in the pocket. Any kind of sustained pressure and he's in big trouble.

Divebomb
08-24-2006, 11:08 PM
Carr is going to make winning that much easier. What happened last week with St. Louis. They brought the House every play. What happened last year week in week out, teams across the league brought the house? Drive three for the Texans, 4 screen passes two runs up the middle and a field goal. Drive 5 they backed off the rushing and we went back to the normal play calling and we ran it in for that TD. With Carr in it is an advantage because we get more Blitzing. More blitzing means more screens, we gain control of the game by running screens and forcing defensive coordinators to back off on the blitzing. Then we come back to Andre and Moulds and cause the D to start blitzing again. The offense gains the leverage and manipulates the defense. D-Coordinators will have to learn the hard way that Kubiak and these Texans are not Capper and crew.

wolf123
08-24-2006, 11:23 PM
Kub has fallen for the fool’s gold (Athletic QB). Athleticism doesn’t not make a good NFL QB. A QB that can read Defenses does. I`m sure DC bust his a** in practice and all. Remember the old saying there are practice players then there are GAME TIME players. DC falls in the category of practice player. The last 2 Preseason Games he has not looked good. IE: that 4th down fumble he got lucky on that 1. Running into a blocker for a sack and not throwing crisp accurate passes. Kub brought in Sage to push DC. Doesn’t look like it is working. IE: Look at the performance of Bledsoe on Monday! You can tell he is being pushed by Romo. Where is DC`s performance like that? Also notice Kub never mentioned DC`s problem of reading Defenses. I keep hearing about how athletic DC is. When are we going to hear “wow that DC sure can read Defenses. I remember when he use to look at 1 WR and if he was covered DC would tuck the ball and run”. Keep hearing Week in and Week out DC is getting better. DC is still the same QB from last yr. Long as DC is in there it will be a long season once again. :challenge

You know, it's funny you bring Carr's athleticism up as his only positive and that Sage is that much better of a QB, cuz in ESPN's profile of Sage -

Comment:
Rosenfels has adequate agility, he shows adequate pocket presence and he is capable of buying some second chances. He has adequate quickness, he moves well for his size and he is a threat to run when the opportunity presents itself. However, Rosenfels is a better athlete than he is a football player and he needs to do a better job of protecting the football. He has an unorthodox sidearm delivery, he lacks a quick release and his throwing motion isn't fundamentally sound. Rosenfels' footwork is inconsistent and he frequently takes too long to get set up.

Another thing that analysts ripped on Sage for was his lack of an arm. I don't have a quote, but all I heard during the offseason was that he was a 4th string QB for Miami with good accuracy on the short yardage, but lacked the armstrength for the longball.

Give Carr more than two stinkin' preseason games (playing only a couple quarters) to get used to having protection for more than .5 seconds. There are reasons why Mike Golic said Carr could be a top 5 QB. Have faith, my friend. Hardship builds character/knowledge, so Carr should have a lot of that by now. Let's allow him to show it. Go Texans!!:redtowel:

thunderkyss
08-24-2006, 11:34 PM
Kub has fallen for the fool’s gold (Athletic QB). Athleticism doesn’t not make a good NFL QB. A QB that can read Defenses does.

He's one of the few QBs to throw for over 4000 yards in a single NCAA season. And he didn't do it with his athletisicm...... that was a bonus that we found out about in the last 4 years.

I understand it's college......... but the point was that he didn't do it with his athletisicm....


I`m sure DC bust his a** in practice and all. Remember the old saying there are practice players then there are GAME TIME players. DC falls in the category of practice player.

you really believe this..... don't you??

The last 2 Preseason Games he has not looked good. IE: that 4th down fumble he got lucky on that 1.

True

Running into a blocker for a sack

Your bias is starting to show.

and not throwing crisp accurate passes.

I guess this is a subjective thing.... but I don't recall David making a decision to throw a pass where he had to be accurate....... I'm going to watch that StL game again tonight. I'll look.

Kub brought in Sage to push DC.
Surely I thought you could see through that...... Sage wasn't brought in to push Carr....... Sage is our insurance policy..... he's not competing with Carr for the Starting job.... it's David's job to lose. But when/if he does lose it, we're gonna kick some booty.
Doesn’t look like it is working. IE: Look at the performance of Bledsoe on Monday! You can tell he is being pushed by Romo.

Bill Parcells is thinking SuperBowl...... there's no way Romo was going to start over Drew......... no way. Bledsoe did what he did, because that's what he does....... he's a gamer, a ProBowler, and a SuperBowl QB.

playing on a 9-7 football team with shoddy protection..... including Larry Allen, Keyshawn Johnson, Terry Glenn & Jason Witten.
2005 Dallas Cowboys
GP-GS-Attempts-Comp-Perc-Yards-avg--Long-TD-Int--Sck/yrds--Rating
1- 16--499------300---60.1-3639--7.29-71---23--17--49/295---83.7

Understand this is years after recieving coaching from some of the brightest minds in football...... Parcells, Weiss etc...

David Carr on a 7-9 football team with shoddy protection..... no Larry Allen, no Keyshawn Johnson, no Terry Glenn, and no Jason Witten.
2004 Houston Texans
GP-GS-Attempts-Comp-Perc-Yards-avg---Long-TD-Int--Sck/yrds--Rating
16-16-466-------285--61.2--3531--7.58--69---16-14--49/301----83.5

This is his third season in the NFL..... with some of the worse coaching ever seen in any country, in any sport....... ever...


Where is DC`s performance like that? Also notice Kub never mentioned DC`s problem of reading Defenses. I keep hearing about how athletic DC is. When are we going to hear “wow that DC sure can read Defenses. I remember when he use to look at 1 WR and if he was covered DC would tuck the ball and run”. Keep hearing Week in and Week out DC is getting better. DC is still the same QB from last yr. Long as DC is in there it will be a long season once again. :challenge

yeah...... that about sums that up.

So things we need to be watching......

David going through his progression...... any one thinking he is doing well in this category is a homer.... I agree with you on that one.

But I haven't seen the 1 look tuck and run Carr lately, you gotta give us that...

& it's going to be a long season........ bring your popcorn...

thunderkyss
08-24-2006, 11:39 PM
Carr is going to make winning that much easier. What happened last week with St. Louis. They brought the House every play. What happened last year week in week out, teams across the league brought the house? Drive three for the Texans, 4 screen passes two runs up the middle and a field goal. Drive 5 they backed off the rushing and we went back to the normal play calling and we ran it in for that TD. With Carr in it is an advantage because we get more Blitzing. More blitzing means more screens, we gain control of the game by running screens and forcing defensive coordinators to back off on the blitzing. Then we come back to Andre and Moulds and cause the D to start blitzing again. The offense gains the leverage and manipulates the defense. D-Coordinators will have to learn the hard way that Kubiak and these Texans are not Capper and crew.

Forget about screens to beat the blitz..... Putz ain't going to make those kinds of runs to often...... it would be nice if he does.. but David needs to hit AJ on the slant... if he beats the blitz with AJ, Moulds, or Owen racing down the middle of the field, teams will come in to the game with no blitzes in their gameplan.

infantrycak
08-24-2006, 11:45 PM
Forget about screens to beat the blitz..... Putz ain't going to make those kinds of runs to often...... it would be nice if he does.. but David needs to hit AJ on the slant... if he beats the blitz with AJ, Moulds, or Owen racing down the middle of the field, teams will come in to the game with no blitzes in their gameplan.

Too simplistic. The screen is a key play in beating a blitz. Hitting the WR's is also a key ingredient but the screen should not be dismissed at all. No Putzier won't go for 20 every time, but blitz on 1st with the TE going for 8 is a bad, bad sign for the D as well.

thunderkyss
08-24-2006, 11:47 PM
Too simplistic. The screen is a key play in beating a blitz. Hitting the WR's is also a key ingredient but the screen should not be dismissed at all. No Putzier won't go for 20 every time, but blitz on 1st with the TE going for 8 is a bad, bad sign for the D as well.
I agree... but to put the fear of God in them, you got to hit them for 6 points..... that will stop them from even thinking about blitzing except in the most extreme conditions.

GoTexans
08-24-2006, 11:56 PM
I'll wait till Sunday to make my final verdict.

Carr against the second best AFC team last season. At least the entire first half.

tsip
08-25-2006, 12:05 AM
Carr is going to make winning that much easier. What happened last week with St. Louis. They brought the House every play. What happened last year week in week out, teams across the league brought the house? Drive three for the Texans, 4 screen passes two runs up the middle and a field goal. Drive 5 they backed off the rushing and we went back to the normal play calling and we ran it in for that TD. With Carr in it is an advantage because we get more Blitzing. More blitzing means more screens, we gain control of the game by running screens and forcing defensive coordinators to back off on the blitzing. Then we come back to Andre and Moulds and cause the D to start blitzing again. The offense gains the leverage and manipulates the defense. D-Coordinators will have to learn the hard way that Kubiak and these Texans are not Capper and crew.


...sounds good, but this has never happened--is it going to start, now? That would be great because Carr has never beaten the blitz or any pressure, for that matter.

Divebomb
08-25-2006, 01:18 AM
...sounds good, but this has never happened--is it going to start, now? That would be great because Carr has never beaten the blitz or any pressure, for that matter.



Look at drive #1 from last week. The O looked like poop because St. Louis remembers that David Carr Chokes under pressure. They brought the house, Carr freaked out, Spencer jumped offsides LOL, they freaked out. Series two it looks as if Kubiak wants to see if Carr can deliver from the pocked with the all out Blitz but Carr choked. Drive 3 Kubiak says I've had enough of this ****, 4 sceens and two quick runs up the middle and we are putting points on the board. St. Louis backed off, Kubiak started getting the ball to the Andre and we are running the ball in from the 4. 1st team is done and Carr beats the blitz with screen passes and the second team takes the field. Kubiak is trying to get Carr going, Carr needs to step up and make some plays for sure but if the League is going to blitz every down like last year and Carr can not deliver that slant pass then we set up the screen and get a TE to the Probowl.

CaptainPatriot
08-25-2006, 09:08 PM
Carr is going to make winning that much easier. What happened last week with St. Louis. They brought the House every play. What happened last year week in week out, teams across the league brought the house? Drive three for the Texans, 4 screen passes two runs up the middle and a field goal. Drive 5 they backed off the rushing and we went back to the normal play calling and we ran it in for that TD. With Carr in it is an advantage because we get more Blitzing. More blitzing means more screens, we gain control of the game by running screens and forcing defensive coordinators to back off on the blitzing. Then we come back to Andre and Moulds and cause the D to start blitzing again. The offense gains the leverage and manipulates the defense. D-Coordinators will have to learn the hard way that Kubiak and these Texans are not Capper and crew.


To be honest teams are using vanilla Defenses with a basic blitz package. They aren't going to show their best blitz packages in preseason. They don’t want opponents having film of them so early. If Carr has problem with blitzes now he is in trouble come regular season.

texan279
08-25-2006, 09:10 PM
To be honest teams are using vanilla Defenses with a basic blitz package. They aren't going to show their best blitz packages in preseason. They don’t want opponents having film of them so early. If Carr has problem with blitzes now he is in trouble come regular season.

Well when Lundy was in the game with Carr, he couldn't block the blitz to save his life from what I remember. When Morency was in he did a much better job of picking up the blitz.

CaptainPatriot
08-25-2006, 09:54 PM
He's one of the few QBs to throw for over 4000 yards in a single NCAA season. And he didn't do it with his athletisicm...... that was a bonus that we found out about in the last 4 years.

I understand it's college......... but the point was that he didn't do it with his athletisicm....


you really believe this..... don't you??

True

Your bias is starting to show.

I guess this is a subjective thing.... but I don't recall David making a decision to throw a pass where he had to be accurate....... I'm going to watch that StL game again tonight. I'll look.

Surely I thought you could see through that...... Sage wasn't brought in to push Carr....... Sage is our insurance policy..... he's not competing with Carr for the Starting job.... it's David's job to lose. But when/if he does lose it, we're gonna kick some booty.

Bill Parcells is thinking SuperBowl...... there's no way Romo was going to start over Drew......... no way. Bledsoe did what he did, because that's what he does....... he's a gamer, a ProBowler, and a SuperBowl QB.

playing on a 9-7 football team with shoddy protection..... including Larry Allen, Keyshawn Johnson, Terry Glenn & Jason Witten.
2005 Dallas Cowboys
GP-GS-Attempts-Comp-Perc-Yards-avg--Long-TD-Int--Sck/yrds--Rating
1- 16--499------300---60.1-3639--7.29-71---23--17--49/295---83.7

Understand this is years after recieving coaching from some of the brightest minds in football...... Parcells, Weiss etc...

David Carr on a 7-9 football team with shoddy protection..... no Larry Allen, no Keyshawn Johnson, no Terry Glenn, and no Jason Witten.
2004 Houston Texans
GP-GS-Attempts-Comp-Perc-Yards-avg---Long-TD-Int--Sck/yrds--Rating
16-16-466-------285--61.2--3531--7.58--69---16-14--49/301----83.5

This is his third season in the NFL..... with some of the worse coaching ever seen in any country, in any sport....... ever...



yeah...... that about sums that up.

So things we need to be watching......

David going through his progression...... any one thinking he is doing well in this category is a homer.... I agree with you on that one.

But I haven't seen the 1 look tuck and run Carr lately, you gotta give us that...

& it's going to be a long season........ bring your popcorn...




I have to admit I like your thoroughness. :thumbup I wonder what DC’s stats are in 4th Quarters of close games and 3rd down stats of his games? Stats are deceiving IE: Take Peyton Manning huge Stat numbers but when it comes to a close game in the playoffs with a dominating D he disappears. That AFC Championship Game couple yrs ago. They only scored 3 points! But against Denver he lit them up for 4 TD passes!

bayoudreamn
08-25-2006, 10:44 PM
To be honest teams are using vanilla Defenses with a basic blitz package. They aren't going to show their best blitz packages in preseason. They don’t want opponents having film of them so early. If Carr has problem with blitzes now he is in trouble come regular season.

Teams don't show their offenses OR defenses. What kind of argument are you trying to make?

CaptainPatriot
08-27-2006, 10:43 AM
Teams don't show their offenses OR defenses. What kind of argument are you trying to make?


That DC should be dominating in the passing game in preseason and he isn't. If he can't find his TE's now what makes you think he will in the regular season? DC looks so mechanical out there and he is forcing passes against a basic D. But when I look at Sage he is more fluid. Go back and look at the Rams game. He passed to B.Joppru over the middle. He layed the ball up and over the LB and down into the hands of B.Joppru in stride for a big gain. Also the TD pass Sage threw to D.Lewis down the left side. Sage rolled out left opened his hips and threw across his body on the run and layed a perfect pass to D.Lewis in stride for 44 yd TD. It seems when DC throws the ball he has to throw it hard all the time.

Lucky
08-27-2006, 10:57 AM
To be honest teams are using vanilla Defenses with a basic blitz package.
Dude, the Rams ran a double safety blitz. Basic, my Fortran.

Do the Texans need to get better versus the blitz? Yes, and they did against the Rams as the game progressed. Did Haslett and the Rams hold anything back? Um, I think the kitchen sink remained on the sideline.

The Pencil Neck
08-27-2006, 02:21 PM
Dude, the Rams ran a double safety blitz. Basic, my Fortran.

Do the Texans need to get better versus the blitz? Yes, and they did against the Rams as the game progressed. Did Haslett and the Rams hold anything back? Um, I think the kitchen sink remained on the sideline.

No. The kitchen sink went into the game. They just hadn't attached the drain or the garbage disposal. But I definitely saw the kitchen sink in there.

CaptainPatriot
08-27-2006, 02:32 PM
Dude, the Rams ran a double safety blitz. Basic, my Fortran.

Do the Texans need to get better versus the blitz? Yes, and they did against the Rams as the game progressed. Did Haslett and the Rams hold anything back? Um, I think the kitchen sink remained on the sideline.


there are exceptions ,how many times did they do that?

Lucky
08-27-2006, 03:39 PM
there are exceptions ,how many times did they do that?
I just pointed out one. The onus is pretty much on you to prove that it was the exception. Go back and look at the tape and tell me I'm wrong. Maybe you should define what a basic blitz is first? Two safeties coming free up the middle? No biggie.

Somewhere, I posted that the Rams blitzed the Texans 9 times last Saturday. The Texans completed only 1 pass on the intial 5 blitzes. And went 4-4 after. 2 of 2 by Carr and 2 of 2 by Sage. I'm not placing all of the blame on Lundy, but the 4-4 performance against the blitz was with Morency in the game at RB.

thunderkyss
08-27-2006, 07:17 PM
I just pointed out one. The onus is pretty much on you to prove that it was the exception. Go back and look at the tape and tell me I'm wrong. Maybe you should define what a basic blitz is first? Two safeties coming free up the middle? No biggie.

Somewhere, I posted that the Rams blitzed the Texans 9 times last Saturday. The Texans completed only 1 pass on the intial 5 blitzes. And went 4-4 after. 2 of 2 by Carr and 2 of 2 by Sage. I'm not placing all of the blame on Lundy, but the 4-4 performance against the blitz was with Morency in the game at RB.

There was one blitz, with a DE split way wide..... on a TE lined up in the slot. & only 2 DLinemen in front of our OL... Spencer did his job, and picked up the DE lined up on the TE split wide........

But Pitts...... I don't know what he was thinking. He helped the center with one of the two Lineman in front of them. & so did the right gaurd......

The RT was "handling" the other LIneman..... it was ridiculous...... a safety & corner came in clean...... David had to run to the right, which took our RT out of position...... the lineman released, and started chasing David........ David did the right thing, and threw it away...... I think.

But I ain't never seen a defensive package like that, I didn't know what they were up to.

afcman
08-27-2006, 09:35 PM
for his teammates to believe in him

Bingo! One of the things I've been seeing the last 2 yrs. Or not as the case may be.

CaptainPatriot
08-28-2006, 09:23 AM
I just pointed out one. The onus is pretty much on you to prove that it was the exception. Go back and look at the tape and tell me I'm wrong. Maybe you should define what a basic blitz is first? Two safeties coming free up the middle? No biggie.

Somewhere, I posted that the Rams blitzed the Texans 9 times last Saturday. The Texans completed only 1 pass on the intial 5 blitzes. And went 4-4 after. 2 of 2 by Carr and 2 of 2 by Sage. I'm not placing all of the blame on Lundy, but the 4-4 performance against the blitz was with Morency in the game at RB.

I have to take it all back! :hides: You are right Teams are blitzing like crazy! I watched the PATS vs. Wash. and they blitz the HELL out of Brady. They had Safeties lining up as Mike LB’s! But Brady just picked the Blitzes apart. I think he threw 10 pass or more to his TE’s in the 1st half! His TD pass to Watson he made it look so easy. Brady waited for the blitz to come and just lobbed the ball over the Blitzing LB to Watson where the LB vacated. It reminded me of what Magic and Bird use to do to NBA double teams.