PDA

View Full Version : Reggie Bush agrees to a six year deal with the Saints


LikeABoss
07-29-2006, 10:53 PM
Per ESPN News and ESPN's homepage.

Oh yeah, I'm still around, just been in lurker status:cool:

GrandPa
07-29-2006, 10:55 PM
Let the Reggie and Mario games begin...

Koolaid Time
07-29-2006, 11:01 PM
Let the Reggie and Mario games begin...

6 years is a long time.....

His knees will be swiss cheese by season 3. The Saints OL will get him killed

Numbskull
07-29-2006, 11:09 PM
6 years is a long time.....

His knees will be swiss cheese by season 3. The Saints OL will get him killed

And his knees would be safer as a Texan? LOL. The only potential weakness on the Saints Oline is at RT and if I were Reggie, I'd consider myself lucky to have dodged playing behind that thing in Houston.

LikeABoss
07-29-2006, 11:09 PM
6 years is a long time.....

His knees will be swiss cheese by season 3. The Saints OL will get him killed

:tv:

I knew some Texans fans were gonna be pretty:mad:

But keep on praying my man, keep on praying....:cool:

And Tulexan's comments about Reggie Bush not wanting to play for the Saints is looking like pure jibberish right about now.

Errant Hothy
07-29-2006, 11:13 PM
..yeah but for how much?

texan279
07-29-2006, 11:15 PM
Just more motivation for Mario to prove he was worth the #1 pick...If I was Mario I would be flattered that the Texans wanted me locked up before the draft but irked at the money being thrown at Vince and Bush who were picked after me...

GuerillaBlack
07-29-2006, 11:16 PM
I think he knew that the Saints were movin to Los Angeles in two years...

Numbskull
07-29-2006, 11:17 PM
All of this speculation by these bitter boys has been a bunch of BS. They want to justify the pick of Williams even further than "we needed him more." They want to prove RB as a "headcase" that they were better off without anyway. The truth, the haters are all just bitter boys.

LikeABoss
07-29-2006, 11:17 PM
And CloakNNNdagger, your anti-Reggie Bush propaganda is falling on deaf ears now buddy:gathering:

Numbskull
07-29-2006, 11:18 PM
I think he knew that the Saints were movin to Los Angeles in two years...

Shouldn't there be an age limit here?

texan279
07-29-2006, 11:18 PM
And CloakNNNdagger, your anti-Reggie Bush propaganda is falling on deaf ears now buddy:gathering:

Just because the dude has signed a contract means nothing, it's what he does on the field this season.

GuerillaBlack
07-29-2006, 11:18 PM
Shouldn't there be an age limit here?

You say age limit, but your only 16. I turn 15 real soon

I wasn't being serious, sorry for your confusion. Good for him, and how much was the deal?

Numbskull
07-29-2006, 11:20 PM
And CloakNNNdagger, your anti-Reggie Bush propaganda is falling on deaf ears now buddy:gathering:

The guy is obsessed with Reggie Bush. The guy has 400 something posts and I'd be willing to bet that more than half of them are about RB.

Numbskull
07-29-2006, 11:22 PM
You say age limit, but your only 16. I turn 15 in one week.

I wasn't being serious, sorry for your confusion. Good for him, and how much was the deal?

You're looking at posts.. I'm 20, turning 21 in a month. I wasn't being entirely serious either. I was 13-14 when I joined the Saintsreport MBs.

tulexan
07-29-2006, 11:24 PM
:tv:

I knew some Texans fans were gonna be pretty:mad:

But keep on praying my man, keep on praying....:cool:

And Tulexan's comments about Reggie Bush not wanting to play for the Saints is looking like pure jibberish right about now.

I don't think it is pure jibberish. He really didn't have much of a choice but to sign. Sitting out for the year really wasn't an option if he wanted to maximize his earnings. I still think that he wouldn't have declared if he thought that he was going to go to the Saints. I hope he has a great season and will enjoy watching him at the Dome this season.

LikeABoss
07-29-2006, 11:24 PM
Just because the dude has signed a contract means nothing, it's what he does on the field this season.

Tell this to your fellow Texans fans regarding Mario, cause your preaching to the choir with this. This can be said about any rookie.

texan279
07-29-2006, 11:25 PM
Tell this to your fellow Texans fans regarding Mario, cause your preaching to the choir with this. This can said about any rookie.

Mario at least has been in camp where we could see something...

GuerillaBlack
07-29-2006, 11:27 PM
Tell this to your fellow Texans fans regarding Mario, cause your preaching to the choir with this. This can said about any rookie.

Mario has been in practice everyday, while Reggie does whatever he does in his million dollar condo in Downtown New Orleans.

LikeABoss
07-29-2006, 11:28 PM
I still think that he wouldn't have declared if he thought that he was going to go to the Saints.

:tv:

Man, your pure hatred for the Saints organization is kind of mind-boggling and sad:(

Numbskull
07-29-2006, 11:28 PM
I don't think it is pure jibberish. He really didn't have much of a choice but to sign. Sitting out for the year really wasn't an option if he wanted to maximize his earnings. I still think that he wouldn't have declared if he thought that he was going to go to the Saints. I hope he has a great season and will enjoy watching him at the Dome this season.

I don't think he would have declared either if he didn't think he would go to the Texans at #1. He wanted to go #1 and the Saints weren't the worst team last year.

LikeABoss
07-29-2006, 11:30 PM
Mario at least has been in camp where we could see something...

You're definately reaching with this, especially when training camp just started.

You're talking like the regular season is about to start next week or something:confused:

LikeABoss
07-29-2006, 11:32 PM
Mario has been in practice everyday, while Reggie does whatever he does in his million dollar condo in Downtown New Orleans.

:tv: :tv: :tv: :rofl:

I find that kind of funny.

Wolf
07-29-2006, 11:39 PM
The guy is obsessed with Reggie Bush. The guy has 400 something posts and I'd be willing to bet that more than half of them are about RB.
actuallly CND's doesn't have that many quotes about bush ( that i have seen)

GuerillaBlack
07-29-2006, 11:40 PM
Well I really think if he thought he would have to run behind that poor Houston off. line he would've stayed another year in college. but he figured the Texans would have first pick again next year so decided to come out and see if the Texans would drop the ball and pick a DE. well it worked and now he is going to be with the next AMERICAS TEAM!!!!!!!:bananasplit: :whip: :francis: :excited:

America has no team. The Saints would not be it, either. I hated that era when the Cowboys called themselves "America's Team."

Wolf
07-29-2006, 11:41 PM
Well I really think if he thought he would have to run behind that poor Houston off. line he would've stayed another year in college. but he figured the Texans would have first pick again next year so decided to come out and see if the Texans would drop the ball and pick a DE. well it worked and now he is going to be with the next AMERICAS TEAM!!!!!!!:bananasplit: :whip: :francis: :excited:

ok yeah

Numbskull
07-29-2006, 11:45 PM
Well I really think if he thought he would have to run behind that poor Houston off. line he would've stayed another year in college. but he figured the Texans would have first pick again next year so decided to come out and see if the Texans would drop the ball and pick a DE. well it worked and now he is going to be with the next AMERICAS TEAM!!!!!!!:bananasplit: :whip: :francis: :excited:

LOL...

cuppacoffee
07-29-2006, 11:46 PM
Per ESPN News and ESPN's homepage.

Oh yeah, I'm still around, just been in lurker status:cool:

Don't know about you but I am glad the "big three" have signed and now we can get down to training camps and ball games.

I think all the ragging back and forth was mostly relieving the boredom of no football..:ouch:

Most fans of the three teams are happy with the player they got. :highfive:

Can't please everyone.

Time will tell if anybody got the best of the deal or if we all got a perennial pro bowler.

:coffee:

tulexan
07-29-2006, 11:54 PM
:tv:

Man, your pure hatred for the Saints organization is kind of mind-boggling and sad:(

I don't hate the Saints. In fact I enjoy watching them play because I live in NOLA. But that doesn't mean that I can't be critical and realistic. There was a reason why Reggie and Pete Carroll were seeking a guarantee from McNair that he would be picked number one before he declared and I think the team picking number two was the reason. Does that mean that I am correct in my theory? No, but it is a realistic scenario.

texan279
07-30-2006, 12:03 AM
I don't hate the Saints. In fact I enjoy watching them play because I live in NOLA. But that doesn't mean that I can't be critical and realistic. There was a reason why Reggie and Pete Carroll were seeking a guarantee from McNair that he would be picked number one before he declared and I think the team picking number two was the reason. Does that mean that I am correct in my theory? No, but it is a realistic scenario.

The team picking number two may have played a part, but I think the main reason was the #1 money. Also you have to look at the Saint's history of failure, granted the Texan's have not had much success, but we haven't been in the league too long.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 12:09 AM
I don't hate the Saints. In fact I enjoy watching them play because I live in NOLA. But that doesn't mean that I can't be critical and realistic. There was a reason why Reggie and Pete Carroll were seeking a guarantee from McNair that he would be picked number one before he declared and I think the team picking number two was the reason. Does that mean that I am correct in my theory? No, but it is a realistic scenario.

I don't think that's realistic at all.

texan279
07-30-2006, 12:14 AM
I would think if he was "the best player" in this draft, why would he want a guarantee to be picked #1 before declaring? Only reason I can think of is money, or fear of having a poor senior season or injury in his senior season.

Ole Miss Texan
07-30-2006, 12:28 AM
"Financial terms of the contract, which will be signed on Sunday, were not yet available. But based on discussions with NFL sources throughout Saturday, as the two sides moved closer to the accord, it appears that Bush's contract will easily exceed the one signed earlier this week by Tennessee Titans quarterback Vince Young, and will come very close to the deal for top overall pick Mario Williams."-ESPN.COM

I am confused, Didn't Mario get somehing like $800k more guaranteed money but less overall than vince? Also, how can reggie easily exceed vince and get close to Mario...to me they don't seem that far apart.

Can someone clear this up for me?!

Ole Miss Texan
07-30-2006, 12:36 AM
Found this on profootbaltalk.com

Williams received $26.5 million in guaranteed money, and Young gets $25.74 million. The maximum value of Young's contract is $58 million, and the maximum value of Williams' is $62 million.

Our guess? Bush will get $26.2 million in guaranteed money and a maximum value of $60 million.

southtexan
07-30-2006, 12:39 AM
And his knees would be safer as a Texan? LOL. The only potential weakness on the Saints Oline is at RT and if I were Reggie, I'd consider myself lucky to have dodged playing behind that thing in Houston.
You've no idea how much it bothers me to tell you that I think might be right.

southtexan
07-30-2006, 12:43 AM
All of this speculation by these bitter boys has been a bunch of BS. They want to justify the pick of Williams even further than "we needed him more." They want to prove RB as a "headcase" that they were better off without anyway. The truth, the haters are all just bitter boys.
But let me tell you that you might be dead wrong on this subject, We need MW more that any RB. I'm going to quote Charley C....Barry Sanders won ONLY ONE playoff game.

Ole Miss Texan
07-30-2006, 12:45 AM
Not to knock Reggie or anything, I think he's a lot of fun to watch and hope we get some good highlights but...

How lucky are A) Carolina Panthers getting DeAngelo
and B)DeAngelo for getting picked by the Panthers...he's actually got a shot at the Super Bowl this year!

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 01:08 AM
Well I really think if he thought he would have to run behind that poor Houston off. line he would've stayed another year in college. but he figured the Texans would have first pick again next year so decided to come out and see if the Texans would drop the ball and pick a DE. well it worked and now he is going to be with the next AMERICAS TEAM!!!!!!!:bananasplit: :whip: :francis: :excited:

Okay Saints fan....Thats two comments from yall about how are line is so much worse than yours to run behind. I let the first one slide, because I was too lazy to pull it up, do some research and get educated.

2005 league rushing stats (http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-RUSHING/2005/regular?sort_col_1=7)

2004 league rushing stats (http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-RUSHING/2004/regular?sort_col_1=7)

For the past 2 seasons the Texans have been a better rushing team with a injury prone 4th round running back with no break away speed and a running back that was cut off the team backing him up, that till this date no one has picked up, playing in a system where the QB can't take more than three steps without getting planted, so theres really no consistent passing game. That speaks volumes for our run blocking.

We have a good run blocking team, pass blocking is a different story and we'll only get better now that Kubiak is here inserting the Broncos running scheme.

Yall couldn't beat us in rushing before you lost your probowl center and now your going to act like Bush is so much happier running behind your line......yeah, right. I'm sure the second he found out he was going to the Saints he was estatic.

Frankly I don't care about Bush....Great he signed a contract....making him possibly the highest paid RB in the league (most likely), wow hold on, almost a year to the day you signed another runningback to one of the largest in the league.

http://www.neworleansprofootball.com/072805mcallistercontract.html

Thats alot of money for just one position. Nice cap management, great way to build depth, you'll go far

Our front office knew that in this system we didn't need to pay a part time player getting paid QB money to be successful, hell our 4th round running back has lead to more success in the running game then your 50 million dollar man.

Runningbacks are a cheap position, and are a dime a dozen, and can be found in later rounds, especially in this system.

Back to the topic at hand...........Great Reggie signed a contract woo hoo!!!, so why are you here trolling our board. Your obviously happy about that...so why are you here, shouldn't you be celebrating with the fellow Saint fans.

Texan fans are happy with Mario, Saint fans are happy with Bush.......guess what......everybody WINS!!!

Now lets see who goes on to have a better career.

TexanSam
07-30-2006, 01:10 AM
LikeABoss, are you a former Texans fan who left because we didn't draft Reggie Bush? Or are you just a Saints fan trying to rub it in our faces? If it's the latter, then it's not working.

Section 620
07-30-2006, 01:16 AM
Okay Saints fan....Thats two comments from yall about how are line is so much worse than yours to run behind. I let the first one slide, because I was too lazy to pull it up, do some research and get educated.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-RUSHING/2005/regular?sort_col_1=7 (2005 league rushing stats)

http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-RUSHING/2004/regular?sort_col_1=7 (2004 league rushing stats)

For the past 2 seasons the Texans have been a better rushing team with a injury prone 4th round running back with no break away speed and a running back that was cut off the team backing him up, that till this date no one has picked up, playing in a system where the QB can't take more than three steps without getting planted, so theres really no consistent passing game. That speaks volumes for our run blocking.

We have a good run blocking team, pass blocking is a different story and we'll only get better now that Kubiak is here inserting the Broncos running scheme.

Yall couldn't beat us in rushing before you lost your probowl center and now your going to act like Bush is so much happier running behind your line......yeah, right. I'm sure the second he found out he was going to the Saints he was estatic.

Frankly I don't care about Bush....Great he signed a contract....making him possibly the highest paid RB in the league (most likely), wow hold on, almost a year to the day you signed another runningback to one of the largest in the league.

http://www.neworleansprofootball.com/072805mcallistercontract.html

Thats alot of money for just one position. Nice cap management, great way to build depth, you'll go far

Our front office knew that in this system we didn't need to pay a part time player QB money to be successful, hell our 4th round running back has lead to more success in the running game then your 50 million dollar man.

Runningbacks are a cheap position, and are a dime a dozen, and can be found in later rounds, especially in this system.

Back to the topic at hand...........Great Reggie signed a contract woo hoo!!!, so why are you here trolling our board. Your obviously happy about that...so why are you here, shouldn't you be celebrating with the fellow Saint fans.

Texan fans are happy with Mario, Saint fans are happy with Bush.......guess what......everybody WINS!!!

Now lets see who goes on to have a better career.
:tease:

YoungTexanFan
07-30-2006, 01:16 AM
Regardless of how bad our pass blocking is, we are consistantly in the top 15 in run-blocking which would be Reggie's main concern. This is before we added a pro-bowl center, two stud rookie OT's, Mike Sherman, and the Denver System. This is also before you lost Bently and had Brown at LT instead of RT.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 01:31 AM
Okay Saints fan....Thats two comments from yall about how are line is so much worse than yours to run behind. I let the first one slide, because I was too lazy to pull it up, do some research and get educated.

2005 league rushing stats (http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-RUSHING/2005/regular?sort_col_1=7)

2004 league rushing stats (http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/OFF-RUSHING/2004/regular?sort_col_1=7)

For the past 2 seasons the Texans have been a better rushing team with a injury prone 4th round running back with no break away speed and a running back that was cut off the team backing him up, that till this date no one has picked up, playing in a system where the QB can't take more than three steps without getting planted, so theres really no consistent passing game. That speaks volumes for our run blocking.

We have a good run blocking team, pass blocking is a different story and we'll only get better now that Kubiak is here inserting the Broncos running scheme.

Yall couldn't beat us in rushing before you lost your probowl center and now your going to act like Bush is so much happier running behind your line......yeah, right. I'm sure the second he found out he was going to the Saints he was estatic.

Frankly I don't care about Bush....Great he signed a contract....making him possibly the highest paid RB in the league (most likely), wow hold on, almost a year to the day you signed another runningback to one of the largest in the league.

http://www.neworleansprofootball.com/072805mcallistercontract.html

Thats alot of money for just one position. Nice cap management, great way to build depth, you'll go far

Our front office knew that in this system we didn't need to pay a part time player QB money to be successful, hell our 4th round running back has lead to more success in the running game then your 50 million dollar man.

Runningbacks are a cheap position, and are a dime a dozen, and can be found in later rounds, especially in this system.

Back to the topic at hand...........Great Reggie signed a contract woo hoo!!!, so why are you here trolling our board. Your obviously happy about that...so why are you here, shouldn't you be celebrating with the fellow Saint fans.

Texan fans are happy with Mario, Saint fans are happy with Bush.......guess what......everybody WINS!!!

Now lets see who goes on to have a better career.

While you were doing all this extensive research, did you stop and check to see who was running the ball for the Saints in 2005? Deuce went down in the 2nd game last year and we had Antowain Smith and Aaron Stecker running the rest of the way. Antowain had his best year since 2001. I'd definately take Davis over those two.

In 2004, Deuce was banged up, overweight, and ineffective. It didn't help that the team played from behind every game because the offense put up only 1 first quarter touchdown throughout the entire year. We were outscored in the first quarter something like 152-10.

But you're right. Everyone is happy now. No reason to hate...

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 01:38 AM
But let me tell you that you might be dead wrong on this subject, We need MW more that any RB. I'm going to quote Charley C....Barry Sanders won ONLY ONE playoff game.

No. I'm right. The people that are flaming RB here are bitter. I'm not saying MW was the wrong pick, I'm saying that the RB haters here are bitter boys.

LikeABoss
07-30-2006, 01:39 AM
LikeABoss, are you a former Texans fan who left because we didn't draft Reggie Bush? Or are you just a Saints fan trying to rub it in our faces? If it's the latter, then it's not working.

Oh, I'm still a Texans fan. I was just fed up with all the Saints bashing going on this board that I decided not to post much at all cause I felt there was no hope in trying to reason with people who have some kind of dedicated hatred towards us for lord knows what reason. And I know you've seen all the "Reggie Bush is not gonna sign with the Saints" propaganda on this board. There's no way you can sit up here and deny it. So yes, I am throwing it back in the faces of those who said we would not AND could not get this done, because I feel they deserve it. It's called Karma, it works and it's real.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 01:40 AM
While you were doing all this extensive research, did you stop and check to see who was running the ball for the Saints in 2005? Deuce went down in the 2nd game last year and we had Antwan Smith and Aaron Stecker running the rest of the way. Yeah, I'd definately take Davis over those two.

In 2004, Deuce was banged up, overweight, and ineffective. Also, the team played from behind every game because the offense put up only 1 first quarter touchdown throughout the entire year. We were outscored in the first quarter something like 152-10.

But you're right. Everyone is happy now. No reason to hate...

DD has been banged up every year.

Antwan Smith is still running in the league, Jonathan Wells is not

We're not exactly killing it on the scoreboard either in the first quarter.

tomatoes.....tomotoes

potatoes....pototoes

it is what it is

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 01:45 AM
Oh, I'm still a Texans fan. I was just fed up with all the Saints bashing going on this board that I decided not to post much at all cause I felt there was no hope in trying to reason with people who have some kind of dedicated hatred towards us for lord knows what reason. And I know you've seen all the "Reggie Bush is not gonna sign with the Saints" propaganda on this board. There's no way you can sit up here and deny it. So yes, I am throwing it back in the faces of those who said we would not AND could not get this done, because I feel they deserve it. It's called Karma, it works and it's real.

I have never said one ill word towards Bush....

Frankly I could care less and really thought the contract holdout was over blown, there are still like 10 first round picks holding out that you don't hear crap about.

I just don't see the reasoning of people trolling a board, because their boy signed.

Saint fans, if your happy Bush signed....good for you....great, I'm happy for you and hope Bush has a great career, he seems like a decent guy.

We just choose a different route, now lets sit back and see how it plays out.

This could turn out to be like the Vick/LT trade and work out for both teams.

At this point everybodies happy, so lets leave it at that.

houstonhurricane
07-30-2006, 01:45 AM
I actually think RB signing is absolutely fantastic. Good for the Saints and their fans. Also, the signing should keep quiet all of those football "wizards" on this board who were predicting a long RB holdout - nice call guys.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 01:49 AM
Oh yeah Karma is not for real, if it was I would be a rich man living the high life by now

Damn Karma owes me alot:brickwall For heavens sake...I'm a Texans fan



.......But then again your a Saints and Texans fan so Karma might owe you a little more at this time.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 01:52 AM
but sometimes i think how nice it would be to see them Fai................ oh nevermind i won't bring myself down that low..


:um: .....Have you been living in a different country for the past 4 years

LikeABoss
07-30-2006, 01:53 AM
I just don't see the reasoning of people trolling a board, because their boy signed.

Saint fans, if your happy Bush signed....good for you....great, I'm happy for you and hope Bush has a great career, he seems like a decent guy.

We just choose a different route, now lets sit back and see how it plays out.



Are you serious???

You're trying to spin this by saying that I'm trying to attack ya'll when the shoe has been on the other foot this entire time?

Did you not see all the dedicated threads and negative posts about this matter on this board since the draft?

Wow, unbelievable...

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 02:00 AM
Are you serious???

You're trying to spin this by saying that I'm trying to attack ya'll when the shoe has been on the other foot this entire time?

Did you not see all the dedicated threads and negative posts about this matter since the draft?

Wow, unbelievable...

First of all I'm not trying to spin anything, I'm not a politician

Second, when have I said you were trying to attack me...........

I saw the posts and you will not see a post of mine in any of them, I thought it was stupid and premature, but just as stupid as I thought it was, this bickering is just as stupid.

Again...

Texan fans are yall happy that Mario is a Texan....................


Saint fans are yall happy that Reggie Bush is a Saint...............

I'm starting to feel like Dr. Phil.

Lets get real

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 02:05 AM
All the bush haters are now going to try to change their tune. They wanted Reggie to hold out so bad and now their gonna act like it wasn't that important to them.

Oh yeah I'm changing my tune:whistle:

Like I said before, I never said one bad thing about Reggie, go ahead look up my post history.

But hey I'll just let you label me as a Bush hater if that'll make you happy :ok:

texan279
07-30-2006, 02:07 AM
I don't think it was fear of having a bad season. He was good in highschool and college. Not like Mary "o" williams. He was really only good last year>:tease: :)

Better check your stats again, Bush had one good season in college, his senior season, which was the only season he rushed for over 1000 yards. Williams had more than 56 tackles a season all 3 of his college seasons, more than 13 tackles for a loss a season, and at least 5 sacks a season, including 14.5 sacks his senior season. Doesn't matter really, can't compare a RB against a DE.

Hookem Horns
07-30-2006, 02:17 AM
Just because some of us think Bush is overrated doesn't make us haters. Bottomline, if Bush was all that he and ESPN thinks he is, why was he on the sideline when the game was on the line in the Rose Bowl? I have been asking this question for months, especially when I was on this board defending my position of NOT taking Leon .. errrr Reggie Bush.

As much as I hate to say it, the Titans got the 2 best players from the Rose Bowl. It would have been nice to see the Saints not signing Brees and drafting VY. I could pull for Vince on the Saints since I have always liked the Saints but now I have to hate the guy.

BTW Saints fans, mark this down. Your best back is not and will not be RB. It is Deuce McAllister. I would take Deuce over RB anyday.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 02:18 AM
BTW Saints fans, mark this down. Your best back is not and will not be RB. It is Deuce McAllister. I would take Deuce over RB anyday.

Well eventually they're going to have to decide which one is the best because they're not going to be able to afford to pay both 50 million+

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 02:30 AM
Hey Saints fan, do you think this mean your team will deal Bennett now?

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 02:34 AM
Since you know what their salary cap and finances are. why don't you ellaborate on it. (just wondering)!!! and let us know..

Just going off of the salary cap era, no team ever carries two backs making 50 million+

Eventually the Saints will look for a cheaper solution, thats just the way it is in today's NFL.

A couple of seasons from now they'll likely try to move McAllister, especially if he doesn't return to form.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 02:36 AM
I really hope not. unless we get a great deal for him. he is only costing us $750,000 this year and would be a good backup if one of our RB's goes down

true, I know he was being rumored to being shopped earlier in the offseason

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 02:49 AM
YEA a couple seasons from now. how bout lets talk about the upcoming season.? in a couple seasons the Texans are gonna be wishing they had addressed the QB and RB positions this year. (not being sarcastic)... They would be smart to try to get Bennett. or another good backup for DD

We didn't need a new QB and we don't need a 50 million dollar RB, thats money that going to go to AJ when it comes time to extend his contract.

I wouldn't mind having Bennett, but am comfortable with the bodies we have in camp, we have some darkhorse rookies that should provid adequate depth.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 03:04 AM
Just because some of us think Bush is overrated doesn't make us haters. Bottomline, if Bush was all that he and ESPN thinks he is, why was he on the sideline when the game was on the line in the Rose Bowl? I have been asking this question for months, especially when I was on this board defending my position of NOT taking Leon .. errrr Reggie Bush.

As much as I hate to say it, the Titans got the 2 best players from the Rose Bowl. It would have been nice to see the Saints not signing Brees and drafting VY. I could pull for Vince on the Saints since I have always liked the Saints but now I have to hate the guy.

BTW Saints fans, mark this down. Your best back is not and will not be RB. It is Deuce McAllister. I would take Deuce over RB anyday.

All of this Leon crap... exactly what I'm talking about... bitter boys...

Reggie Bush was not on the field because they were killing Texas with Lendale and he was USC's "go to" guy in short yardage situations. The thing is, they didn't make it... so, what you should be asking is... "Is Carroll stupid? Why not have the Heisman winner back there on biggest play of the game? They've been riding RB all year, why not when it counts most?" The decision was not RB's and he wasn't the one who came up short. Its not his call.

Lendale White is going to be a "never was" in this league. Ever hear of a running back with a poor work ethic going to the hall or even a pro bowl? Possibly one of the stupidest guys in the entire draft, next to Wroten (from my own LSU), who cost himself huge on draft day by being an idiot.

Also, we love Deuce down here in New Orleans. For the majority of his career he's been a great football player and an even better person. He's one of the classiest guys in the NFL. Still, Deuce has alot to prove this year. He's coming off a terrible injury and even before it, he was looking really sluggish since Haslett asked him to gain weight. In 2004 and in his limited time last year, he looked slow and ineffective. He has been a shadow of the player we saw in 2002 and 2003. So far, so good though. From what we've seen from him in camp, he looks to have slimmed down to his 2003 weight and his knee is holding up. Right now, I'm not sure who will be the better back. I just know that Reggie adds an entirely new explosiveness to our offense. I'm happy to have them both.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 03:06 AM
We didn't need a new QB

I disagree. Also think yall needed to work on that OLine more than anything in the 1st round.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:15 AM
Go look up AJ's stats for 3 years and see how much money he is worth. The Texans should look to pay out good money to some playmaker on offense. not spend it on AJ..

Are you serious...you just lost all credibility with that answer.

I have looked at AJ's stats over the past three years and its remarkable what he's done in a offense that doesn't have time to throw downfield with no #2 to take heat off of him. He has one down year where he struggled with injuries and a offense that changed O coordinators during the season.

Bush will never be the player that AJ is.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:17 AM
I disagree. Also think yall needed to work on that OLine more than anything in the 1st round.

We did work on the Oline, we picked up a tackle that was projected to be a top ten pick before his knee injury and Chris Spencer who has loads of potential. We also signed Mike Flannigan, brought in a very successful ex head coach to coach the oline and changed schemes.

Your team really needs to work on their Oline.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:21 AM
I'm going to sleep

This is a waste of time

:wacko: AJ not worth a contract extension...........

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:24 AM
ps yall type too damn slow

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 03:25 AM
Bush will never be the player that AJ is.

LOL at that!!

Seriously though. You could have the Colts WRs and Peyton Manning at Q and your offensive still would rank in the bottom half of the league if something doesn't happen to that offensive line. The majority of football games are won and lost in the trenches.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:33 AM
LOL at that!!

Keep on laughing, Bush can't even run inside and pick up the tough yards, and isn't a every down back. He didn't do it in college and won't in the pros, thats why he was on the sideline. Lendale White banged out the tough yards, not Bush

AJ is already a probowler and a proven player.

Don't worry Bush will reach the probowl just on hype alone, like Vick

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 03:38 AM
We did work on the Oline, we picked up a tackle that was projected to be a top ten pick before his knee injury and Chris Spencer who has loads of potential. We also signed Mike Flannigan, brought in a very successful ex head coach to coach the oline and changed schemes.

Your team really needs to work on their Oline.

A 3rd round tackle and a 4th round guard. Flannigan ain't bad. Kubiak was a great running game coordinator, not familiar with his success of keeping the QB clean (although he can't be worse than anyone yall had previously).

Still, not exactly the talent overhall that I'd have been looking for....

As for the Saints Oline....

LT... Jammal Brown... Very solid.. Great rookie campaign.
LG... Montrae Holland.. Very solid... Great run blocker and is in the shape of his career.
C... Jeff Faine.. He's not LeCharles, but he's not a bad player either.. Solid as long as he doesn't get injured...
RG... Jermane Mayberry.. He's lost a step, but still a good starter..
RT... Jamar Nesbitt/Jon Stinchcomb/Zach Strief... this is where is could get really ugly...

So... yeah.. I agree, we need a little work on our OLine.. Anyways, we had the 2nd worst record in the league last year... can't fill all the holes in one year alone...

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:41 AM
Damn i lost All credibility with that.? well i'm not trying to put down the Texans because they are my AFC team. and if you think AJ's stats are remarkable then you really need to look at other recievers stats. Aj's stats are well below the top recievers in the league. out of three years he's had one 1,000 yards in a season with only six touchdowns. (starting all 16 games) the other 16 game season he had 976 yards and only 4 TD's.... and last year in 13 games he had only 688 yards and 2 TD's...calculate that and it would be 846 yards if he played all 16 games last season.
I'm not trying to dog you 're team just stating the facts..

He had only 976 yards his rookie season, wow, he basically had a 1000 yard rookie year, how many WRs do that, get real

His second season he had a probowl season, playing in predictable offense.

You talk about all the top receivers in the league, thats a joke, stick those top receivers in our offense the past three years playing oppisite of Corey Badford and receiving passes from a QB thats breaking records in sacks.

Imagine him on the Colts roster receiving passes from Manning and playing next to receivers like Harrison, He would put Reggie Wayne to shame and be a top 2 receiver in the game

Last year AJ was hurt, can't blame him for that.

So yeah, what you said was laughable.

This year he'll actually play in a real offense, not a mickey mouse ran offense, next to a real #2 receiver Eric Moulds.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 03:42 AM
Keep on laughing, Bush can't even run inside and pick up the tough yards, and isn't a every down back. He didn't do it in college and won't in the pros, thats why he was on the sideline. Lendale White banged out the tough yards, not Bush

You'll eat those words eventually..

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 03:47 AM
This year he'll actually play in a real offense, not a mickey mouse ran offense, next to a real #2 receiver Eric Moulds.

Don't yall still have that piss poor OLine and David Carr?

LOL, j/k.... I'm sure he's great and everything, but c'mon... he still couldn't hold Joe Horn's jockstrap at this point in his career and you're putting him in the same sentence w/ Marvin Harrison.... Seriously, Donte' Stallworth has comparable stats and you don't see anyone in New Orleans putting him up on a pedistal.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:52 AM
hey numbskull chech this pro bowl recievers stats.. +--------------------------+-------------------------+
| Rushing | Receiving |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+
| Year TM | G | Att Yards Y/A TD | Rec Yards Y/R TD |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+
| 2003 hou | 16 | 5 -10 -2.0 0 | 66 976 14.8 4 |
| 2004 hou | 16 | 4 12 3.0 0 | 79 1142 14.5 6 |
| 2005 hou | 13 | 6 10 1.7 0 | 63 688 10.9 2 |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+
| TOTAL | 45 | 15 12 0.8 0 | 208 2806 13.5 12 |
+----------+-----+--------------------------+-------------------------+

Your an idiot, go pull up all the top receivers stats in this league..AJ's start in his career is better than almost all of them and he didn't have luxury of playing next to a Jerry Rice of Bruce Smith, or hell, anybody thats a NFL caliber receiver.

Again to say AJ doesn't deserve a contract extension really shows a lack of your football knowledge.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:53 AM
I see where you're coming from. but also if you let david carr sit back behind the colts line he could do wonders. and if Duece McAllister could run in between the tackles of the chiefs then he would be a 2,000 yard back. and so on, and on, and on.

and so on and so on,

so to say a player doesn't deserve a contract extension because he plays on a bad team makes absolutely ZERO sense.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 03:58 AM
Don't yall still have that piss poor OLine and David Carr?

LOL, j/k.... I'm sure he's great and everything, but c'mon... he still couldn't hold Joe Horn's jockstrap at this point in his career and you're putting him in the same sentence w/ Marvin Harrison.... Seriously, Donte' Stallworth has comparable stats and you don't see anyone in New Orleans putting him up on a pedistal.

it took Horn 4 years to amass the total yardage that AJ put up in his worst season as a pro, which wasn't that bad.

I'm not putting AJ on a pedistal, I'm just saying when the time comes he will get his money, because he's worth it.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:00 AM
I got one for you....Its well documented how I feel about David Carr.

you can quote me on this

"Reggie Bush will never be the player David Carr is in the NFL. He is overhyped, overrated, would have been a terrible draft choice, IS in fact a terrible draft choice for new orleans, will be out of the nfl in 3 years, will haunt the saints salary cap for years to come, and will be mentioned in the same sentence with Kijana Carter from here to eternity. If you support the saints, like the saints, like reggie bush, or disagree with me, feel free to not respond. I don't care that you think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread. He is not as valuable as Andre Johnson. He is not as valuable as Travis Johnson. There were 7 rounds worth of players I would have passed Reggie Bush for, and a slew of UDFA. You couldn't pay me to play Reggie Bush. The Saints gave in to ESPN peer pressure and spent 50 million dollars on a roster that currently had duece mcallister, antowain smith, and michael bennett on it. You have a deplorable owner, and apparently a general manager who studied under the tutelage of Charlie Casserly. Julius Peppers, Derrick Brooks, and John Abraham are just some of the many players who will be ripping your new, expensive little toy's head off come september. Congratulations on getting him into camp without him making you rename the stadium after him. Before you start making the tired arguement that Im bitter we passed on him, do a little research. I've been anti-reggie for going on about 10 months now. I don't want him, and I jumped out of my chair in delight when I found out we didn't get him. Now please, can we get back to watching REAL football players instead of this bum?"

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:00 AM
I'm not putting AJ on a pedistal, I'm just saying when the time comes he will get his money, because he's worth it.

BS, you said that Bush will never be the quality player the AJ is... IE.. putting him on a pedistal...

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:02 AM
I got one for you....Its well documented how I feel about David Carr.

you can quote me on this

"Reggie Bush will never be the player David Carr is in the NFL. He is overhyped, overrated, would have been a terrible draft choice, IS in fact a terrible draft choice for new orleans, will be out of the nfl in 3 years, will haunt the saints salary cap for years to come, and will be mentioned in the same sentence with Kijana Carter from here to eternity. If you support the saints, like the saints, like reggie bush, or disagree with me, feel free to not respond. I don't care that you think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread. He is not as valuable as Andre Johnson. He is not as valuable as Travis Johnson. There were 7 rounds worth of players I would have passed Reggie Bush for, and a slew of UDFA. You couldn't pay me to play Reggie Bush. The Saints gave in to ESPN peer pressure and spent 50 million dollars on a roster that currently had duece mcallister, antowain smith, and michael bennett on it. You have a deplorable owner, and apparently a general manager who studied under the tutelage of Charlie Casserly. Julius Peppers, Derrick Brooks, and John Abraham are just some of the many players who will be ripping your new, expensive little toy's head off come september. Congratulations on getting him into camp without him making you rename the stadium after him. Before you start making the tired arguement that Im bitter we passed on him, do a little research. I've been anti-reggie for going on about 10 months now. I don't want him, and I jumped out of my chair in delight when I found out we didn't get him. Now please, can we get back to watching REAL football players instead of this bum?"

LMAO!! that was great...

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 04:02 AM
BS, you said that Bush will never be the quality player the AJ is... IE.. putting him on a pedistal...

Its not putting him on a pedistal

I'm saying he won't be the player AJ is, because I honestly feel, he won't be the player AJ will.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:03 AM
LMAO!! Honestly, I get it... that was great...


wasn't joking at all...that was pure truth coming from swtbound07. Reggie Bush is terrible. I back what I said 100%

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:05 AM
wasn't joking at all...that was pure truth coming from swtbound07. Reggie Bush is terrible. I back what I said 100%

You're funny.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:06 AM
You're funny.


You're delusional...makes us about even doesn't it?

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 04:08 AM
you seem to be trying to put words in my mouth when did i say he didn't need an extension?

Are you serious

Go look up AJ's stats for 3 years and see how much money he is worth. The Texans should look to pay out good money to some playmaker on offense. not spend it on AJ

This is pointless I really have to go to bed know, its been fun:fib

but its 4:11am where I'm at.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:10 AM
You're delusional...makes us about even doesn't it?

:)

Overthetop arguments w/ stupid/gullible people making them look stupid for wasting time in arguing w/ such silly statements.. although... you might be right about the owner part...

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:12 AM
:)

Overthetop arguments w/ stupid/gullible people making them look stupid for wasting time in arguing w/ such silly statements..


over the top? Hardly. I went easy on reggie because i didn't want to launch a diatribe....this message board doesn't have enough server space for me to describe how terrible he is. I could do my doctorate on it. You aren't arguing with me because you can't. You should just change the "h" on the back of that #5 jersey i know you custom ordered off nfl.com to a "t" and call it a night

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:15 AM
over the top? Hardly. I went easy on reggie because i didn't want to launch a diatribe....this message board doesn't have enough server space for me to describe how terrible he is. I could do my doctorate on it. You aren't arguing with me because you can't. You should just change the "h" on the back of that #5 jersey i know you custom ordered off nfl.com to a "t" and call it a night

Please enlighten me... LOL, I'd love to hear it... should be a hoot...:shades:

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:18 AM
Please enlighten me... LOL, I'd love to hear it... should be a hoot...:shades:

Sir, it would take all the electricity in the world and some intervention from god to enlighten you, but I'll see if I can't open your eyes to the misery that is reggie bush in the nfl. We'll start with a nice, base set of facts, and expound from there.

Now pay attention, because I am about to use things called STATS. These are made up of numbers which are integral to the game we call football. I am going to start working on my post now, but i'll go ahead and post this so you know to wait.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:33 AM
Sir, it would take all the electricity in the world and some intervention from god to enlighten you, but I'll see if I can't open your eyes to the misery that is reggie bush in the nfl. We'll start with a nice, base set of facts, and expound from there.

Now pay attention, because I am about to use things called STATS. These are made up of numbers which are integral to the game we call football. I am going to start working on my post now, but i'll go ahead and post this so you know to wait.

LMAO, this is gonna be great... might take you a few days, so I'll take a nap... btw... don't call me Sir... you're 20, I'm 20.. sir...

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:40 AM
Reggie Bush is overrated, and i'll tell you why.

Point one
Reggie Bush is heralded as a dual threat player, someone who can return kicks, return punts, line up as a wideout, and play running back.

Lets examine the claim that reggie bush can line up as an nfl wideout. I don't believe he can, and here is why. In reggie Bush's senior season, he was frequently used by pete carroll as a wideout, as he was a threat to "break one at any time."

As a reciever, Bush managed not one, but TWO, yes count them folks, TWO touchdown receptions. Not only that, in playing in 13 games, he managed to record 37 receptions. 37 receptions in 13 games means that as dangerous as reggie is, he is only catching that football LESS THAN THREE times a game. Once every 6.5 games reggie bush will take a reception to the endzone. Defensive coordinators must be trembling.

Reggie bush took these 37 receptions and managed to record a STUNNING 12.9 yard per reception average, ranking him below Steve Smith, Dwayne Jarrett, Lendale White, Patrick Turner, and some guy named Greig Carlson ON HIS OWN TEAM. Fear not, because he slightly edged out David Kirtman (12.8) in YPC.
The USC trojans threw the ball 481 times in 2005, and reggie snared 37 of them.

Now, Reggie is not going to touch the ball alot, i dont know if you realize this.

The 2005 USC trojans ran 525 running plays, and 481 passing plays, for a total of 1,006 plays from scrimmage. Reggie Bush touched the ball 237 times, or 23 percent of the time. as a frame of reference, its not a considerable amount more than lendale white (211 touches, or 21 percent of the time). Not going to get a lot of mileage out of that investment.

Reggie Carried the ball about 15 times a game in 2005. 15 carries. Show me ONE back in the NFL that is successfull averaging 15 carries a game. Please. Just one. I'd like real statistics.

Reggie Bush is an electrifying punt and kick returner!!! No. He isn't.

Kick return stats for you
Reggie Bush
28 returns, 493 yards, 17.6 average, with a long return of 30

on USC's OWN TEAM
Desmond Reed
5 returns, 194 yards, 38.8 average, with a long of 51.

Who is the electrifying returner again?? Sure, reggie can return kicks for you...but why would you want him to? He's not breaking them


Punt Returns.
I will have to give you this, Reggie Bush Broke A punt return. ONE. Once, the stars alligned and Reggie did his job. But first, the stats.

Reggie returned 18 punts in 13 games. Thats slightly more than one a game
he averaged 9.9 yards a return. 10 yards.

179 total punt return yards for mr. reggie bush, or if you are keeping track 13.8 yards of punt returning per game.

He did manage to return ONE punt for a touchdown, an 84 yard run in fact.

So you get 10 yards a punt return, and 18 a kick return?

This you paid 50+ million dollars for?
3 catches a game?
ONE special teams touchdown?

Congratulations sir, you basically drafted a low budget desmond howard.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:45 AM
Reggie Bush is overrated, and i'll tell you why.

Point one
Reggie Bush is heralded as a dual threat player, someone who can return kicks, return punts, line up as a wideout, and play running back.

Lets examine the claim that reggie bush can line up as an nfl wideout. I don't believe he can, and here is why. In reggie Bush's senior season, he was frequently used by pete carroll as a wideout, as he was a threat to "break one at any time."

As a reciever, Bush managed not one, but TWO, yes count them folks, TWO touchdown receptions. Not only that, in playing in 13 games, he managed to record 37 receptions. 37 receptions in 13 games means that as dangerous as reggie is, he is only catching that football LESS THAN THREE times a game. Once every 6.5 games reggie bush will take a reception to the endzone. Defensive coordinators must be trembling.

Reggie bush took these 37 receptions and managed to record a STUNNING 12.9 yard per reception average, ranking him below Steve Smith, Dwayne Jarrett, Lendale White, Patrick Turner, and some guy named Greig Carlson ON HIS OWN TEAM. Fear not, because he slightly edged out David Kirtman (12.8) in YPC.
The USC trojans threw the ball 481 times in 2005, and reggie snared 37 of them.

Now, Reggie is not going to touch the ball alot, i dont know if you realize this.

The 2005 USC trojans ran 525 running plays, and 481 passing plays, for a total of 1,006 plays from scrimmage. Reggie Bush touched the ball 237 times, or 23 percent of the time. as a frame of reference, its not a considerable amount more than lendale white (211 touches, or 21 percent of the time). Not going to get a lot of mileage out of that investment.

Reggie Carried the ball about 15 times a game in 2005. 15 carries. Show me ONE back in the NFL that is successfull averaging 15 carries a game. Please. Just one. I'd like real statistics.

Reggie Bush is an electrifying punt and kick returner!!! No. He isn't.

Kick return stats for you
Reggie Bush
28 returns, 493 yards, 17.6 average, with a long return of 30

on USC's OWN TEAM
Desmond Reed
5 returns, 194 yards, 38.8 average, with a long of 51.

Who is the electrifying returner again?? Sure, reggie can return kicks for you...but why would you want him to? He's not breaking them


Punt Returns.
I will have to give you this, Reggie Bush Broke A punt return. ONE. Once, the stars alligned and Reggie did his job. But first, the stats.

Reggie returned 18 punts in 13 games. Thats slightly more than one a game
he averaged 9.9 yards a return. 10 yards.

179 total punt return yards for mr. reggie bush, or if you are keeping track 13.8 yards of punt returning per game.

He did manage to return ONE punt for a touchdown, an 84 yard run in fact.

So you get 10 yards a punt return, and 18 a kick return?

This you paid 50+ million dollars for?
3 catches a game?
ONE special teams touchdown?

Congratulations sir, you basically drafted a low budget desmond howard.

You're hilarious.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:48 AM
You're hilarious.

No response? I expected none...not much to say. I put my money (and statistics) where my mouth is....You should go away now and stay far far from this thread until you have something more to bring to the table then to compliment my sense of humor.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 04:54 AM
MAN stop being so jealous of Reggie(GOD) and start hopeing Mary"o" does good for you're team....


jealous? of that piece of garbage excuse for a prospect? hardly. Blind followers always hate it when you throw numbers and facts into a conversation. It spoils their sunday worship.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 04:57 AM
No response? I expected none...not much to say. I put my money (and statistics) where my mouth is....You should go away now and stay far far from this thread until you have something more to bring to the table then to compliment my sense of humor.

Well.. sorry... you're being a little outragous.... I'd agree with you on the KR and PR bit though... I don't really see him as all he's hyped up to be on the special teams end... still... you're talking staight stats and you don't even mention his running ability... his explosiveness... or skill sets and potential at the WR position.. he has deep ball potential coming out of the backfield... not many rbs in the history of the NFL have that ability... the only guy I can think of that truly was a greater threat all over the field is Marshall Faulk... change the game in an instant... in one play... you're talking about stats.... I'm talking about ability, explosiveness, and game changing ability... I don't think he was utilized enough at USC in the first place... you're making a point for me... he's someone you have to account for all over the field and a nightmare to matchup with.... He's one of biggest reasons why USC won all those games the past 2-3 years...

Also... RB never had a senior year...

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 05:02 AM
Well.. sorry... you're being a little outragous.... I'd agree with you on the KR and PR bit though... I don't really see him as all he's hyped up to be on the special teams end... still... you're talking staight stats and you don't even mention his running ability... his explosiveness... or skill sets and potential at the WR position.. he has deep ball potential coming out of the backfield... not many rbs in the history of the NFL have that ability... the only guy I can think of that truly was a greater threat all over the field is Marshall Faulk... change the game in an instant... in one play... you're talking about stats.... I'm talking about ability, explosiveness, and game changing ability... I don't think he was utilized enough at USC in the first place... you're making a point for me... he's someone you have to account for all over the field and a nightmare to matchup with.... He's one of biggest reasons why USC won all those games the past 2-3 years...

Also... RB never had a senior year...


I don't mention these things because you can't prove these things and I don't believe he has those things. Deep ball potential??? Did you not see the part about 2 tds receiving??? Several running backs in the nfl are good recievers and good runners, thats nothing new, most notably being brian westbrook, warrick dunn, and tiki barber. He doesn't change the game in an instant. He's actually statistically not even very good at the game. Im not being outrageous, your being blind to numbers. You don't care about stats????? There isn't another measure of what he has done except for stats. You see him juke a couple of folks against fresno state and suddenly he is barry sanders incarnate? you are the one being ludicrous. game changing ability? Please. You have no point, your not making a coherent arguement, and your premise is ridiculous. ESPN fell in love with reggie bush and hyped him for all they could. Texas stopped him, the texans saw through it and passed him, and new orleans succumbed to peer pressure and drafted him. Overrated Bust of the century. Sir.

Numbskull
07-30-2006, 05:04 AM
I don't mention these things because you can't prove these things and I don't believe he has those things. Deep ball potential??? Did you not see the part about 2 tds receiving??? Several running backs in the nfl are good recievers and good runners, thats nothing new, most notably being brian westbrook, warrick dunn, and tiki barber. He doesn't change the game in an instant. He's actually statistically not even very good at the game. Im not being outrageous, your being blind to numbers. You don't care about stats????? There isn't another measure of what he has done except for stats. You see him juke a couple of folks against fresno state and suddenly he is barry sanders incarnate? you are the one being ludicrous. game changing ability? Please. You have no point, your not making a coherent arguement, and your premise is ridiculous. ESPN fell in love with reggie bush and hyped him for all they could. Texas stopped him, the texans saw through it and passed him, and new orleans succumbed to peer pressure and drafted him. Overrated Bust of the century. Sir.

LOL, you're a crazy cat....

Mysteryhunt
07-30-2006, 06:17 AM
saints did ok at #2 with him methinks. though going for a rb that high just does terrible things to the cap, glad we passed.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 09:53 AM
A 3rd round tackle and a 4th round guard. Flannigan ain't bad. Kubiak was a great running game coordinator, not familiar with his success of keeping the QB clean (although he can't be worse than anyone yall had previously).

Still, not exactly the talent overhall that I'd have been looking for....

As for the Saints Oline....

LT... Jammal Brown... Very solid.. Great rookie campaign.
LG... Montrae Holland.. Very solid... Great run blocker and is in the shape of his career.
C... Jeff Faine.. He's not LeCharles, but he's not a bad player either.. Solid as long as he doesn't get injured...
RG... Jermane Mayberry.. He's lost a step, but still a good starter..
RT... Jamar Nesbitt/Jon Stinchcomb/Zach Strief... this is where is could get really ugly...

So... yeah.. I agree, we need a little work on our OLine.. Anyways, we had the 2nd worst record in the league last year... can't fill all the holes in one year alone...

Did you fill any holes? Last time I checked you lost a lot more than you added and you used your top pick on a player you didn't need. You should have taken AJ Hawk in the first, not Reggie Bush. You also added a QB that is coming off of a major injury and may or may not be a system QB that benefited from having the best RB and the best TE in the league.

In fact, besides Bush and Brees, who did you add?

Maybe next year you can draft Adrian Peterson and have the best one two three punch running attack in the league.

Zac
07-30-2006, 11:03 AM
WOW!!! This is like reading a soap opera. Kudos to all parties involved.


Let's let reality sink in. Bush is ELECTRIFYING. He can run up and down the field. And he has done it in high school and in college. People say that college is so much better than high school. Bush dominated at both places. He electrified the Texans fans into chanting Reggie Bush's name at the end of the season, hoping for a loss. Reggie Bush was hyped by ESPN, but he was GOOD.

Now, we all know that the NFL is faster and better than college. In the Rose bowl, even though people were not impressed with Reggies number, he did get almost 90 yards. Keep in mind that the Texas Defense was probably equivalent to an NFL defense.

The think that bothered me and a lot of people who wanted Reggie was his size. Because playing 16 games of tremendous pounding by 250 lbs linebackers and 290 lbs. defensive ends with olympic speed and olympic strenght is going to wear on Reggie Bush. I guesss Reggie and Deuce as a team can be like Reggie and White. But, wow 60 million of Reggie and 50 million for Deuce is A LOT OF MONEY :pigfly: CAN REGGIE BUSH'S BODY TAKE THE POUNDING??????????


MARIO WILLIAMS ON THE OTHER HAND. "A Freak" 6'7" 290lbs-300lbs. of speed and power. All he needs to work on his his technique.

There is a reason that Quarterbacks and Defensive Ends are the highest paid players in football. They are the ones that historically have affected the game more with their play. Look at the NFL!!! The best defensive ends and Quarterbacks are found at the top of the draft, with noteable exceptions like Brady being taken later.


But based on the contracts both guys received, their teams are expecting them both to contribute big time for victories.


Now can they get the guys around them to get the job done, and win a SUPER BOWL.

southtexan
07-30-2006, 11:08 AM
I Agree they are bitter and they want to see Reggie fail so their Front Office won't look so bad. They should worry about Mario being a dominate force and being able to stop peyton manning. (their biggest nemises) But instead most (not all) of these fans are obsessed with the SAINTS.
I come to this MB cause i'm a Texan fan also. but sometimes i think how nice it would be to see them Fai................ oh nevermind i won't bring myself down that low..
We (TEXANS) could have selected Reggie Bush but we didn't, he might be a great player for all I know and that's good for the Saints, our front office went defense and in my opinion that's the way to go.

LikeABoss
07-30-2006, 11:42 AM
Here's an update on the contract...

..yeah but for how much?

Bush, the running back from USC who was chosen second overall in the April draft, agreed to an estimated six-year, $51 million deal with the Saints soon after the team finished their second day of training camp at Millsaps College in Jackson Saturday evening. It's likely that Bush will fly from Los Angeles, where he has been monitoring negotiations, to the Mississippi capital Sunday and practice for the first time with the Saints on Monday at 8:50 a.m. CT.

The deal became inevitable Saturday morning. That's when the Saints and agent Joel Segal got exact terms of the six-year, $48 million contract signed by the third pick in the draft, quarterback Vince Young, with Tennessee. The deal included not-likely-to-be-earned incentives that pushed the deal to $57.79 million. But the main figure in the deal was the guaranteed money -- $25.74 million. Rookie contracts in the NFL have been focused solely on guaranteed money, and the $25.74 million figure gave the Saints a low boundary to work with. The first pick in the draft, Houston defensive end Mario Williams from North Carolina State, got $26.5 million in guaranteed money.

"Once Young's deal got done and we found out exactly what it was,'' said a Saints source, "we could slot Reggie between the two contracts. Then it was easy.''

New Orleans offered an estimated $26.2 million in guaranteed money, which led to the deal getting done. It's not certain that $26.2 is the exact guaranteed figure, but it's close ... close enough for the two sides to reach agreement in principle Saturday night.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/peter_king/07/29/saints.bush.contract/index.html


1. Hou - Mario Williams got six years $54 million, with potential earnings that can reach up to $64 million with incentives, which includes $26.5 million in guarantees.

2. N.O. - Bush got six years $51 million, with potential earnings that can reach up to $60 million with incentives, which includes $26.2 million in guarantees.

3. Tenn - Vince Young got six years $48 million, with potential earnings that can reach up to $58 million with incentives, which include $25.7 million in guarantees.

With all this being said, Mario Williams is still the highest paid player in this draft, and we did NOT break the league's slotting system by giving into the Bush camp demands of giving Reggie $1 more than Mario. I personally think everyone came out as winners in this draft, and I think we all should be happy with our picks. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and can "speculate" all they want on who they feel will bust out, but I rather let the play on the football be the determining factor to that:cool:

tulexan
07-30-2006, 11:43 AM
WOW!!! This is like reading a soap opera. Kudos to all parties involved.


Let's let reality sink in. Bush is ELECTRIFYING. He can run up and down the field. And he has done it in high school and in college. People say that college is so much better than high school. Bush dominated at both places. He electrified the Texans fans into chanting Reggie Bush's name at the end of the season, hoping for a loss. Reggie Bush was hyped by ESPN, but he was GOOD.

Now, we all know that the NFL is faster and better than college. In the Rose bowl, even though people were not impressed with Reggies number, he did get almost 90 yards. Keep in mind that the Texas Defense was probably equivalent to an NFL defense.

The think that bothered me and a lot of people who wanted Reggie was his size. Because playing 16 games of tremendous pounding by 250 lbs linebackers and 290 lbs. defensive ends with olympic speed and olympic strenght is going to wear on Reggie Bush. I guesss Reggie and Deuce as a team can be like Reggie and White. But, wow 60 million of Reggie and 50 million for Deuce is A LOT OF MONEY :pigfly: CAN REGGIE BUSH'S BODY TAKE THE POUNDING??????????


MARIO WILLIAMS ON THE OTHER HAND. "A Freak" 6'7" 290lbs-300lbs. of speed and power. All he needs to work on his his technique.

There is a reason that Quarterbacks and Defensive Ends are the highest paid players in football. They are the ones that historically have affected the game more with their play. Look at the NFL!!! The best defensive ends and Quarterbacks are found at the top of the draft, with noteable exceptions like Brady being taken later.


But based on the contracts both guys received, their teams are expecting them both to contribute big time for victories.


Now can they get the guys around them to get the job done, and win a SUPER BOWL.

Texas had a good defense but it was not an NFL defense.

CloakNNNdagger
07-30-2006, 11:59 AM
And CloakNNNdagger, your anti-Reggie Bush propaganda is falling on deaf ears now buddy:gathering:



The guy is obsessed with Reggie Bush. The guy has 400 something posts and I'd be willing to bet that more than half of them are about RB.





Since I’ve been “called out” by name:

Obsessed? What Board is this?..............Hmmmm, that’s what I thought. It’s the Texans board. I’m not on the Saints boards trying to defend the Mario pick..............I or any other Texan fan does not “need” to defend that choice. We do find it invigorating to entertain varying opinions. Many questions come up on this board that cannot be answered with facts alone no matter how many “supporting stats” are presented. When it’s all said and done, most conclusions here are drawn through OPINION. If you are not willing to hear varying and many times “contrary” opinions, then invest in a mirror in front of which you can see and hear what you want. This approach also has the added benefit of being less likely to lead to resorting to insults.

Of the 170 posts in my own thread “SAINTS HOLD ON while BUSH HOLDS OUT?” 17 posts were my total input, with some additional scattered posts found in other threads concerning the subject.


I related my OPINION that Bush would hold out...................He did, although not as long as I thought he might. :


But Bush and his agent are basking in their own "self" generated and press mediated and heretofore unproven and likely inflated value................thus, just expect a nice holdout With that said, a no-brainer tells me that a Mario on the field from day one is as "priceless" as a no Bush on the field is "worthless.


I have presented links that reported that Bush might consider “sitting out.” Outside of one very obviously tongue-in-cheek post, I NEVER personally stated that I thought that Bush would sit out the year.:


Reggie's decided not to sign with the Saints because he heard that a recent "unexpected vacancy" has become available with a high profile CFL team. Segal intends to structure his contract with "likely to be attained" lucrative incentives ...........including the team and its assets when he attains his 3,000 yard rushing season. Meanwhile, Reggie was measured for and has ordered a custom Stetson 10 gallon hat.......Ironically, it'll end up way way too tight for his 10 gallon head.........he evidently does not understanding that a 10 gallon hat doesn't mean 10 gallon displacement.


In fact, I posted a piece of OPINION that was meant to demonstrate the futility of that choice should he make it.:


Sport Illustrated just about this time must be feeling a little like maybe they should have left their cover to more appropriately be hung, not at the news stands but on the New Orleans Post Office walls. Hijacking, or should I say "Bushwacking" as I referred to it in the title of one of the original threads is exactly what is going on.

If the Saints fans wake up, they will see how he set all this up with the "charity" angle to gain support for his arrogant greed. Again I see the charitable donations write offs and business write offs for PR expenses as no out of pocket to him. With already $5 million dollars in endorsements in his pocket, in asking for a contract greater than or at least equal to Mario's, who will have actually paid for this "charity" to New Orleans?................that's right, the Saints' villainized Benson...........all in the Grand Plan of a selfish little BOY. Go ahead and take your toys and go home..............but take it to the bank, you will not take as much to the bank next year.........because no one will be taking you at #1 OR #2. With all the baggage that you will be carrying with you, and the fact that you will not be actively "hitting with the boys" in college OR the NFL for 1 whole year, and possibly RUSTING in front of the TV watching real football players while you figure how to spend your $5million.........you may find that you'll be lucky to be picked by #10 in 2007.

In the end you will have "screwed" a city and their excited fans........or maybe not..........maybe they will be better for it.


So I’ll leave you with these last comments. It is MY OPINION that: 1) Bush is a talent which has been way over-hyped with little chance of living up to the hype. 2) He has a selfish aura surrounding him. 3) He will not be able to be used in the NFL the way he was in college. 4) He bears a significant chance of injury/reinjury if he is used the way he was in college, especially if and when he attempts to run between the tackles. 5) Bush’s “productive” career will not be as dramatic nor last as long as Mario’s. 6) The Texans got the better “team player”/leader, and certainly one that best filled our needs.

Having related my thoughts and feelings above, I will not be propagating further discussion over my “obsession.”

GuerillaBlack
07-30-2006, 12:48 PM
MAN stop being so jealous of Reggie(GOD) and start hopeing Mary"o" does good for you're team....

Mary"O" is the mother og Reggie(GOD). Thank you.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 01:32 PM
BTW how is you're Boys toenails???? Has she learned to clean them???


Are you sure you want to go there? Didn't Reggie have a hammy injury in the rookie camp? That could be pretty serious for a speed back.

Wolf
07-30-2006, 01:44 PM
congrats on getting Bush signed.


I am middle of the road on RB. What turns me off on RB and it isn't Reggie's fault, it is more of because of the hype. I just don't believe (until I see it) that he is the greatest RB (according to hype) to come out of college.The comparisons to Sayers,Sanders etc to me are not justified yet. Maybe it is that on a scale of runningbacks... Bo Jackson was the best I have seen and maybe it is that i am a fan of Adrian Peterson over Reggie Bush.

Should be a fun season. I am hoping to both players playing well (Bush and Mario)..Will be interesting to see how Sean Payton uses Reggie being you do have Horn,Stallworth,McCallister,Bennett etc, etc...just makes me wonder if their is going to be enough footballs to go around to make everyone happy

on a spin, I don't know if Texan fans are really jealous of the pick of Bush, I wonder if N.O. fans would have rather had mario (rumor was N.O. wanted him instead),because that was more of a need.

chuckm
07-30-2006, 01:51 PM
finally ..... now hopefully we can put this to rest for awhile ....

houstonhurricane
07-30-2006, 02:14 PM
Just because some of us think Bush is overrated doesn't make us haters. Bottomline, if Bush was all that he and ESPN thinks he is, why was he on the sideline when the game was on the line in the Rose Bowl? I have been asking this question for months, especially when I was on this board defending my position of NOT taking Leon .. errrr Reggie Bush.

As much as I hate to say it, the Titans got the 2 best players from the Rose Bowl. It would have been nice to see the Saints not signing Brees and drafting VY. I could pull for Vince on the Saints since I have always liked the Saints but now I have to hate the guy.

BTW Saints fans, mark this down. Your best back is not and will not be RB. It is Deuce McAllister. I would take Deuce over RB anyday.

I am simply dumbfounded by the lack of football knowledge that is sometimes spewed on this board...Lendale White will be a better back than RB at the NFL level?

And as for the other poster who stated that RB was some sort of "one year wonder," why don't you look at VY in that light?

Wolf
07-30-2006, 02:25 PM
how about this, Deangelo Williams will be a better back than RB ;)

houstonhurricane
07-30-2006, 02:48 PM
how about this, Deangelo Williams will be a better back than RB ;)

Now that COULD happen...he is jumping into a great team and no doubt that D. Foster will be hurt at some point in the season. I really wish we could have pulled off our efforts to nab Williams in the latter part of the first round.

Hookem Horns
07-30-2006, 02:49 PM
I am simply dumbfounded by the lack of football knowledge that is sometimes spewed on this board...Lendale White will be a better back than RB at the NFL level?

And as for the other poster who stated that RB was some sort of "one year wonder," why don't you look at VY in that light?

I am dumbfounded on how many people either don't read or can't read what other people post, then respond to what they thought they read. I said Lendale White was one of the 2 best players in the Rose Bowl, I didn't even comment on his NFL abilities.

I don't know how good White will be in the NFL. If Bush is lucky he will turn into another Eric Metcalf type of player and have a decent career coming out of the backfield on 3rd downs and returning punts.

NoBullTexan
07-30-2006, 03:52 PM
I don't think any of us Texan fans hate the Saints. We kinda feel sorry for them, and you, having Katrina devastate ya'll like that. But on the matter of Reggie, I wouldn't be gloating if I were you, rather I would be grateful that the Texans let him get to ya'll. Heavens knows ya'll need all the help you can get now.

Nawzer
07-30-2006, 04:02 PM
Good luck to Reggie Bush. It's been a few months since the draft and I've sort of moved on. I hope both Mario Williams and Reggie Bush will have stellar NFL careers.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 05:41 PM
Reggie Bush is overrated, and i'll tell you why.

Point one
Reggie Bush is heralded as a dual threat player, someone who can return kicks, return punts, line up as a wideout, and play running back.

Lets examine the claim that reggie bush can line up as an nfl wideout. I don't believe he can, and here is why. In reggie Bush's senior season, he was frequently used by pete carroll as a wideout, as he was a threat to "break one at any time."

As a reciever, Bush managed not one, but TWO, yes count them folks, TWO touchdown receptions. Not only that, in playing in 13 games, he managed to record 37 receptions. 37 receptions in 13 games means that as dangerous as reggie is, he is only catching that football LESS THAN THREE times a game. Once every 6.5 games reggie bush will take a reception to the endzone. Defensive coordinators must be trembling.

Reggie bush took these 37 receptions and managed to record a STUNNING 12.9 yard per reception average, ranking him below Steve Smith, Dwayne Jarrett, Lendale White, Patrick Turner, and some guy named Greig Carlson ON HIS OWN TEAM. Fear not, because he slightly edged out David Kirtman (12.8) in YPC.
The USC trojans threw the ball 481 times in 2005, and reggie snared 37 of them.

Now, Reggie is not going to touch the ball alot, i dont know if you realize this.

The 2005 USC trojans ran 525 running plays, and 481 passing plays, for a total of 1,006 plays from scrimmage. Reggie Bush touched the ball 237 times, or 23 percent of the time. as a frame of reference, its not a considerable amount more than lendale white (211 touches, or 21 percent of the time). Not going to get a lot of mileage out of that investment.

Reggie Carried the ball about 15 times a game in 2005. 15 carries. Show me ONE back in the NFL that is successfull averaging 15 carries a game. Please. Just one. I'd like real statistics.

Reggie Bush is an electrifying punt and kick returner!!! No. He isn't.

Kick return stats for you
Reggie Bush
28 returns, 493 yards, 17.6 average, with a long return of 30

on USC's OWN TEAM
Desmond Reed
5 returns, 194 yards, 38.8 average, with a long of 51.

Who is the electrifying returner again?? Sure, reggie can return kicks for you...but why would you want him to? He's not breaking them


Punt Returns.
I will have to give you this, Reggie Bush Broke A punt return. ONE. Once, the stars alligned and Reggie did his job. But first, the stats.

Reggie returned 18 punts in 13 games. Thats slightly more than one a game
he averaged 9.9 yards a return. 10 yards.

179 total punt return yards for mr. reggie bush, or if you are keeping track 13.8 yards of punt returning per game.

He did manage to return ONE punt for a touchdown, an 84 yard run in fact.

So you get 10 yards a punt return, and 18 a kick return?

This you paid 50+ million dollars for?
3 catches a game?
ONE special teams touchdown?

Congratulations sir, you basically drafted a low budget desmond howard.


Just bumping this to the next page...because im quite proud of it.

Wolf
07-30-2006, 06:08 PM
I don't recall much Saint talk before the Bush thing or maybe I didn't pay attention..

IMO .. the Saint talk is just an extension of USC talk with Bush being the primary focal point.

I can't speak for most or any of the Texan fans here, but we (or atleast I) get tired of the Reggie Bush is the best thing on the planet and if that wasn't enough there are the Bush is Great and Vince is a bust or Vince is great and Bush will be a bust..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v253/Mr.Robotron/merry_go_round.gif

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 06:13 PM
I don't recall much Saint talk before the Bush thing or maybe I didn't pay attention..

IMO .. the Saint talk is just an extension of USC talk with Bush being the primary focal point.

I can't speak for most or any of the Texan fans here, but we (or atleast I) get tired of the Reggie Bush is the best thing on the planet and if that wasn't enough there are the Bush is Great and Vince is a bust or Vince is great and Bush will be a bust..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v253/Mr.Robotron/merry_go_round.gif


He's right....do you think any of us would be talking about new orleans if not for reggie bush? myself personally can't stop pointing out his flaws...he is the equivalent of a car crash...i just can't turn away from something that horrible.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 08:00 PM
It's either hate or jealously. When i come here to read Texans news, i see all these negative posts about the Saints. Of all the football related post on this board about 1 in 4 are Saints related. The Saints are not the Texans rival. they are not even in the same conference. but yet there are so many posts about the Saints. Seems like y'all would be worrying about and trying to down you're rivals. I have been coming here only for about a month but have NEVER heard or seen the words "Colts" on this board..

Please don't flatter yourself, your team is not that important.

The Board is just reflecting the sentiment of other boards

http://forums.titansonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17408

http://forum.colts.com/showthread.php?t=8881

http://forums.denverbroncos.com/showthread.php?t=65992

http://boards.giants.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=100272

This is just 4 random message boards I went to...and gee whiz, they are all talking about Bush, but yet your still here harassing us

The only reason why this thread has gone as long as it has is because of the constant trolling

Get over it.......

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 08:51 PM
He's right....do you think any of us would be talking about new orleans if not for reggie bush? myself personally can't stop pointing out his flaws...he is the equivalent of a car crash...i just can't turn away from something that horrible.


so.. can you give me names of players in the past ten years who have come out of college to be great in the nfl? How did they do in college.. how did they do in HS? I realize you feel this may be redundant, however, the point is.. that reggie bush excelled at every level he played at. Im not saying he will do so at the pro level for that is yet to be seen. Ive seen players be decent in college and go on to rock at the pro level.

How about the fact that Mario was only good during the last half of his final year? Where was he before? What makes everyone think he will continue to keep up the level of play that he did at the final stages of his college career?



If you feel your opinion on RB is the all mighty word.. why arent you an NFL analyst/scout/etc. ? RB has been ranked highly for the physical skills he possesses and the ability to juke/make people miss/ his quickness/and overall speed. He was not the feature back at SC, but the combination of him and LenDale was potent. The Saints will attempt to use him in similar ways. Is SC the same as an NFL team? Obviously.. no.. no college team is. But he excelled at that level.. as well as HS.. and now he will try to do the same at the Pro level..

When so many people talk about one guy's talents.. and you view them knowing he is something special... its hard not to listen to them.


bottom line.. his physical talents and potential are awesome.. thats about all you can ask for from a rookie coming out of college.


Either way.. I wish him and Mario the best and a long healthy career. Only time will tell who made the right decision.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 09:00 PM
so.. can you give me names of players in the past ten years who have come out of college to be great in the nfl? How did they do in college.. how did they do in HS? I realize you feel this may be redundant, however, the point is.. that reggie bush excelled at every level he played at. Im not saying he will do so at the pro level for that is yet to be seen. Ive seen players be decent in college and go on to rock at the pro level.

How about the fact that Mario was only good during the last half of his final year? Where was he before? What makes everyone think he will continue to keep up the level of play that he did at the final stages of his college career?



If you feel your opinion on RB is the all mighty word.. why arent you an NFL analyst/scout/etc. ? RB has been ranked highly for the physical skills he possesses and the ability to juke/make people miss/ his quickness/and overall speed. He was not the feature back at SC, but the combination of him and LenDale was potent. The Saints will attempt to use him in similar ways. Is SC the same as an NFL team? Obviously.. no.. no college team is. But he excelled at that level.. as well as HS.. and now he will try to do the same at the Pro level..

When so many people talk about one guy's talents.. and you view them knowing he is something special... its hard not to listen to them.


bottom line.. his physical talents and potential are awesome.. thats about all you can ask for from a rookie coming out of college.


Either way.. I wish him and Mario the best and a long healthy career. Only time will tell who made the right decision.


Yes...I can furnish you quite a list...Ladanian Tomlinson would be on it, as would michael vick and warrick dunn. i dont see your point in that sentence.

To your second point: I wasn't talking about mario. I walked into a reggie bush lovefest and tried to disperse it. You want to talk mario, take it up with me on another thread.

As to your seemingly sarcastic question "why am i not a scout...etc."
Im 20. Im in college getting a degree in sports management and administration so I can become a scout. Im actually good friends with a scout, and talk of players and prospects with him often.

His career at USC wasn't that impressive, as I broke down earlier in the thread. Putting up a lot of college rushing yards doesn't mean jack...just go ask guys named carter, biakabatuka, or dayne what college reps mean for you...jack.

Reggie bush is NOTHING special. He is a waste of money in new orleans and would have been a waste of money in a texans uniform. The saints will be wishing he had held out and re-entered the draft in no time at all.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 09:11 PM
exactly.. and how did those players do in college and at the HS level? Did they dominate as Bush did? I mean.. as much as he did?

congrats on trying to become a scout.. but at this point.. you are still not one. (but honestly, I do wish you the best)


You are absolutely right.. and as I said.. time will tell. However.. were carter, biakabatuka, or dayne as highly touted in college as Bush? No.. they were ranked high.. but not like Bush. Im not saying nfl analysts are perfect on everything.. but they do earn their money doing this. Also, its not only the analysts saying he IS special.. its players, coaches, analysts, and what not. He's been pumped up alot.. but as we all know.. only time will tell. I for one would love to see the next great RB in the league emerge somewhere.. and I think Bush has the physical (and possible overall) talent to become that guy.

Lets just get this season under way.. damn off-season last way too long

tulexan
07-30-2006, 09:14 PM
I'm sick of hearing about how Reggie excelled in High School. Every great college player at big schools dominated in High School. If they didn't, they wouldn't have been a highly recruited player.

Can you give me a list of NFL players who sucked in High School or college? Probably not

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 09:21 PM
exactly.. and how did those players do in college and at the HS level? Did they dominate as Bush did? I mean.. as much as he did?

congrats on trying to become a scout.. but at this point.. you are still not one. (but honestly, I do wish you the best)


You are absolutely right.. and as I said.. time will tell. However.. were carter, biakabatuka, or dayne as highly touted in college as Bush? No.. they were ranked high.. but not like Bush. Im not saying nfl analysts are perfect on everything.. but they do earn their money doing this. Also, its not only the analysts saying he IS special.. its players, coaches, analysts, and what not. He's been pumped up alot.. but as we all know.. only time will tell. I for one would love to see the next great RB in the league emerge somewhere.. and I think Bush has the physical (and possible overall) talent to become that guy.

Lets just get this season under way.. damn off-season last way too long


Mike Vick dominated at warwick high, and warrick dunn holds florida state rushing records. the nfl is COMPRISED of players that excelled at every level. Mediocre NCAA players dont make nfl rosters.....well, except for reggie.

So he is highly touted???? So espn decided he was "next" and put him on a magazine cover and started showing usc games? So freaking what. Michelle Wie was touted as "next" 4 years ago and has yet to win a professional TOURNAMENT. Not a major mind you, a tournament. ESPN touting someone highly doesn't mean jack. ESPN is wrong about the time....that same hype machine said leinart would be a consenus number one in whatever draft he chose to enter, that vince young was the consensus third best out of the big 3 qbs, that aaron rodgers was a lock for the top 10, etc. etc. ad nauseum. I could write a book on espn analysts saying stupid things. And as i pointed out endlessly, reggie did NOT "dominate" at USC. Second best back on his team, and a terrible kick returner, a lousy reciever, and a pretty bad punt returner.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 09:22 PM
honestly.. I mean seriously.. are you saying that Reggie Bush has nothing special? Do you not watch his highlights? Do you not understand what players/coaches/and anlysts are saying about him?Again.. Im not saying he is god.. but he CAN be something special... only time will tell.

And about the HS comment.. its merely to show how he DOMINATED at that level.. as he did in college (for being the #2 RB). We will see what happens at the next level...

geauxsaints
07-30-2006, 09:23 PM
I would never post to this site, but swtbound's stupidity has forced my hand. Is there any way that your "stats" for RB could be any more selective? How about let's just look at his RUSHING stats...seeing that he is a RUNNING back. And oh by the way, he did play at USC two years before last year. Let's see....well, just so you can see for yourself I'll give you this link (of which you ignored all that you could of RB's real stats). http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=145158

Here we go: his 16 rushing TDs last year were an average of 31.9 yds (to go with your oft mentioned 2 receiving), an 8.7 yards per rush avg. (not too shabby), 1740 rushing yards last year (while sharing time with Lendale and the most potent offense in NCAA), He also had 7 receiving TD's the year before along with 4 his freshman year (I guess ya conveniently skipped those), let's see....his avg. yards per rush were 6.4 and 5.8 the two years before this one...as his touches went up, so did his average. Coincidence? Here's a good stat that noone talks about either; in his three years and 433 carries in his college career he had 0 fumbles. Not fumbles LOST...ZERO fumbles. Ok...well I hear swtbound thinking "but he didn't play against any good defenses..waaahhh" In USC's 5 games against AP ranked opponents in 2005, he averaged 198.8 rushing yards (10.0 per carry), with 10 rushing TDs, and 302.2 all-purpose yards. Here's another site for ya...if you wanna throw stats around...don't pick and choose what suits you. WHO DAT?!?!?!?!

http://www.reggiebushjr.com/statistics.htm

tulexan
07-30-2006, 09:28 PM
He had a fumble in the National Championship game

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 09:30 PM
I would never post to this site, but swtbound's stupidity has forced my hand. Is there any way that your "stats" for RB could be any more selective? How about let's just look at his RUSHING stats...seeing that he is a RUNNING back. And oh by the way, he did play at USC two years before last year. Let's see....well, just so you can see for yourself I'll give you this link (of which you ignored all that you could of RB's real stats). http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/player/profile?playerId=145158

Here we go: his 16 rushing TDs last year were an average of 31.9 yds (to go with your oft mentioned 2 receiving), an 8.7 yards per rush avg. (not too shabby), 1740 rushing yards last year (while sharing time with Lendale and the most potent offense in NCAA), He also had 7 receiving TD's the year before along with 4 his freshman year (I guess ya conveniently skipped those), let's see....his avg. yards per rush were 6.4 and 5.8 the two years before this one...as his touches went up, so did his average. Coincidence? Here's a good stat that noone talks about either; in his three years and 433 carries in his college career he had 0 fumbles. Not fumbles LOST...ZERO fumbles. Ok...well I hear swtbound thinking "but he didn't play against any good defenses..waaahhh" In USC's 5 games against AP ranked opponents in 2005, he averaged 198.8 rushing yards (10.0 per carry), with 10 rushing TDs, and 302.2 all-purpose yards. Here's another site for ya...if you wanna throw stats around...don't pick and choose what suits you. WHO DAT?!?!?!?!

http://www.reggiebushjr.com/statistics.htm


I did address his rushing when i asked the question "show me an nfl running back that is successfull that averages 15 carries a game." That has been ignored throughout this thread. I could care less about years previous to this one, i didn't put any stats because THIS was supposedly his heisman year and he is so great etc. College defenses as an individual are pretty pointless, because none of them are like the pros...im not taking his stats in any one game and saying they reflect, just taking the entire body of work of his 2005 season...which was frankly less than impressive. All purpose yards are a crap stat......used to shield the fact that reggie is a TERRIBLE return man. Lousy averages, lousy touchdown ratios, lousy everything. He doesn't touch the ball much, and doesn't do much with it when he does. And as to the claim im not addressing his rushing ability, correct me if im wrong...he wasnt drafted to be a "running back" he was drafted to be an "offensive playmaker" and play several different positions.....and im saying he's not very good at those other positions...if he was drafted to be a "running back" then thats foolish, he wasn't even close to the best running back in college.

jerek
07-30-2006, 09:30 PM
Predictable, and yet sadly incredible ... our own Texans training camp news threads are pulling half the hits and replies that the Reggie-Bush-friggin-signs-his-contract thread does. Judging by readership and posts alone, you would think the question of Reggie's (and Vince's, for that matter) NFL career(s) rank right up there with deity and human suffering as humanity's great mysteries.

Call me when Bush jukes the entire Saints defense out of their shorts and proceeds to rush for 2,500 yards this season or solves for world peace.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 09:31 PM
Mike Vick dominated at warwick high, and warrick dunn holds florida state rushing records. the nfl is COMPRISED of players that excelled at every level. Mediocre NCAA players dont make nfl rosters.....well, except for reggie.

So he is highly touted???? So espn decided he was "next" and put him on a magazine cover and started showing usc games? So freaking what. Michelle Wie was touted as "next" 4 years ago and has yet to win a professional TOURNAMENT. Not a major mind you, a tournament. ESPN touting someone highly doesn't mean jack. ESPN is wrong about the time....that same hype machine said leinart would be a consenus number one in whatever draft he chose to enter, that vince young was the consensus third best out of the big 3 qbs, that aaron rodgers was a lock for the top 10, etc. etc. ad nauseum. I could write a book on espn analysts saying stupid things. And as i pointed out endlessly, reggie did NOT "dominate" at USC. Second best back on his team, and a terrible kick returner, a lousy reciever, and a pretty bad punt returner.



Michelle Wie is what.. 15.. 16? She is better at her age now than Tiger was at that level! Go look up the stats.. its true. Bottom line.. Im hearing butthurt from you.. which is understandable. Reggie CAN be something special. How do you feel SC would have done without him? Im not saying bad.. but he certainly added something big to their offensive scheme. Something that opposing defenses couldnt handle. He kept defenses guessing.. gave the offense somethign extra.. which is exactly what the saints will do. (in theory)

The nfl is comprised of players who excel at every level? Might wanna check your sources.. Why were some of todays highest players selected at later rounds? There is a reason people are saying that he is the best thing to come out for the past decade...

Anywazzz.. Its time to drink.. be back tonight or tomorrow.. I really do enjoy this argument.. not flamin... jus discussion.

CloakNNNdagger
07-30-2006, 09:33 PM
Bush, the running back from USC who was chosen second overall in the April draft, agreed to an estimated six-year, $51 million deal with the Saints soon after the team finished their second day of training camp at Millsaps College in Jackson Saturday evening.

New Orleans offered an estimated $26.2 million in guaranteed money, which led to the deal getting done. It's not certain that $26.2 is the exact guaranteed figure, but it's close ... close enough for the two sides to reach agreement in principle Saturday night.

My guess is the preliminary number of $51 million is not inclusive of incentives, and represent only the base.

The rest of the Sport Illustrated Peer King story (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/peter_king/07/29/saints.bush.contract/index.html)

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 09:38 PM
Michelle Wie is what.. 15.. 16? She is better at her age now than Tiger was at that level! Go look up the stats.. its true. Bottom line.. Im hearing butthurt from you.. which is understandable. Reggie CAN be something special. How do you feel SC would have done without him? Im not saying bad.. but he certainly added something big to their offensive scheme. Something that opposing defenses couldnt handle. He kept defenses guessing.. gave the offense somethign extra.. which is exactly what the saints will do. (in theory)

The nfl is comprised of players who excel at every level? Might wanna check your sources.. Why were some of todays highest players selected at later rounds? There is a reason people are saying that he is the best thing to come out for the past decade...

Anywazzz.. Its time to drink.. be back tonight or tomorrow.. I really do enjoy this argument.. not flamin... jus discussion.

Reggie CANT be something special...I'd bet the world on that. Michelle wie...call me when she wins something. ANYTHING. The john deere classic for gods'sake.....

People are on an eternal quest for the next great thing...the next jordan, the next ruth, the next barry sanders. thats why people are calling him the best prospect in a decade. A couple of years ago people were calling Robert Gallery a surefire lock franchise left tackle. He evoked images of all the greats, and was a....#2 overall pick. He couldnt even WIN the starting Left tackle job in oakland.

And by the way, opposing defenses COULD handle reggie....and he will be handled in the nfl.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 09:43 PM
What is the point of this thread, are Saint fans really that insecure that they feel they have to troll a board like we're the only board debating if Reggie is going to be as successful in the league as he was in college. Who are yall trying to convince us are yourselfs.

If your happy with the player you drafted then you should be at peace and content. How many Texan fans do yall have trolling at whatever board yall post at these days, pimping Mario Williams. Probably zero, do you know why, because we are happy, content, and at peace with the pick and we don't have a complex where we feel we have to change people's opinions across the internet.

This is one of the lamest things I have ever seen. There has been just as many people here questioning how Vince is going to do in the NFL, do I see any Titan trolls.....wait...wait....NNNOOOOO and they're a divisional rival, yall don't even play in our conference. Quite the little man syndrome going on in NO

gwallaia
07-30-2006, 09:46 PM
I'm sick of hearing about how Reggie excelled in High School. Every great college player at big schools dominated in High School. If they didn't, they wouldn't have been a highly recruited player.

Can you give me a list of NFL players who sucked in High School or college? Probably not

Here's one.

Chester Pitts never played football in High School.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 09:47 PM
Michelle Wie is what.. 15.. 16? She is better at her age now than Tiger was at that level!

WRONG again....Tiger was just or more of a prospect than Michelle Wie, (there was a reason why he was on the Ed Sullivan at like the age of 4 or 5) he just chose a different route. He chose to hone his skills and master his craft and learned how to win on the amateur level before he went pro.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 09:51 PM
has yet to be seen.. thats why I keep saying that we shall see.. but the talent he has shown has ben impressive.. hell.. what if he is the next Tomlinson.. or Vick.. (I do find it strange you edited your previous post).


Why cant he be the next great thing? Im honestly curious?


I understand people could stop him.. HE.. is not one man.. HE.. is part of a team. And when people stopped HIM.. they failed to stop his team... Now consider his team.. Brees/Deuce/Horn/Stalworth.. I'd throw in Hilton - who came up big time at the end of last season.. but not many know him and he needs to prove himself..

Teams could stop him.. and what did the rest of their team do? Went on to win or at least play in championships.. thats the big picture here. And no.. I dont like SC.. in fact, I hate them..

Bottom line.. he adds a new dimension.. However.. as we both agree.. only time will tell if he makes a difference.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 09:54 PM
What is the point of this thread, are Saint fans really that insecure that they feel they have to troll a board like we're the only board debating if Reggie is going to be as successful in the league as he was in college. Who are yall trying to convince us are yourselfs.

If your happy with the player you drafted then you should be at peace and content. How many Texan fans do yall have trolling at whatever board yall post at these days, pimping Mario Williams. Probably zero, do you know why, because we are happy, content, and at peace with the pick and we don't have a complex where we feel we have to change people's opinions across the internet.

This is one of the lamest things I have ever seen. There has been just as many people here questioning how Vince is going to do in the NFL, do I see any Titan trolls.....wait...wait....NNNOOOOO and they're a divisional rival, yall don't even play in our conference. Quite the little man syndrome going on in NO


honestly.. I agree.. but!.. as far as a strictly football aspect goes.. this is a good argument. Based on talent.. its not a who got who discusion (at least for me) .. its a "is reggie all that?" .. and in my own opinion.. yeah.. he certain looks like it and can be.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 09:55 PM
has yet to be seen.. thats why I keep saying that we shall see.. but the talent he has shown has ben impressive.. hell.. what if he is the next Tomlinson.. or Vick.. (I do find it strange you edited your previous post).


Why cant he be the next great thing? Im honestly curious?


I understand people could stop him.. HE.. is not one man.. HE.. is part of a team. And when people stopped HIM.. they failed to stop his team... Now consider his team.. Brees/Deuce/Horn/Stalworth.. I'd throw in Hilton - who came up big time at the end of last season.. but not many know him and he needs to prove himself..

Teams could stop him.. and what did the rest of their team do? Went on to win or at least play in championships.. thats the big picture here. And no.. I dont like SC.. in fact, I hate them..

Bottom line.. he adds a new dimension.. However.. as we both agree.. only time will tell if he makes a difference.


I dont agree. i don't need time to tell me he is a bust. He has already closed that door in my book. By the way, The mods can back me up on this....i haven't edited ANY of my posts in this thread in any way.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 09:56 PM
WRONG again....Tiger was just or more of a prospect than Michelle Wie, (there was a reason why he was on the Ed Sullivan at like the age of 4 or 5) he just chose a different route. He chose to hone his skills and master his craft and learned how to win on the amateur level before he went pro.


so.. you agree Wie progressed to that point faster than Tiger did? Not sure what your trying to say here.. "he chose a different route".. just sounds like an excuse.. She may end up better.. she may not.. but at that point in "Their life" .. who was better? She was...and is.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 09:57 PM
I think they are a little nervous thinking about Reggie going against the Bucs, Panthers, and Falcons 6 times every season. Plus have you seen their schedule? I thought our schedule was bad, but theirs is horrendous.
09/10 at Cleveland 12:00 PM CT
09/17 at Green Bay 12:00 PM CT
09/25 Atlanta 7:30 PM CT
10/01 at Carolina 12:00 PM CT
10/08 Tampa Bay 12:00 PM CT
10/15 Philadelphia 12:00 PM CT
BYE
10/29 Baltimore 12:00 PM CT
11/05 at Tampa Bay 12:00 PM CT
11/12 at Pittsburgh 12:00 PM CT
11/19 Cincinnati 12:00 PM CT
11/26 at Atlanta 12:00 PM CT
12/03 San Francisco 12:00 PM CT
12/10 at Dallas 12:00 PM CT
12/17 Washington 12:00 PM CT
12/24 at N.Y. Giants 12:00 PM CT
12/31 Carolina 12:00 PM CT

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:00 PM
I dont agree. i don't need time to tell me he is a bust. He has already closed that door in my book. By the way, The mods can back me up on this....i haven't edited ANY of my posts in this thread in any way.

I guess Im wondering how you have "powers" to tell he is a bust while people who get paid to do so cant? Everyone is stupid but you?

and ok.. if you say you didnt.. then Im good with that. I mustve misread.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:01 PM
I think they are a little nervous thinking about Reggie going against the Bucs, Panthers, and Falcons 6 times every season. Plus have you seen their schedule? I thought our schedule was bad, but theirs is horrendous.
09/10 at Cleveland 12:00 PM CT
09/17 at Green Bay 12:00 PM CT
09/25 Atlanta 7:30 PM CT
10/01 at Carolina 12:00 PM CT
10/08 Tampa Bay 12:00 PM CT
10/15 Philadelphia 12:00 PM CT
BYE
10/29 Baltimore 12:00 PM CT
11/05 at Tampa Bay 12:00 PM CT
11/12 at Pittsburgh 12:00 PM CT
11/19 Cincinnati 12:00 PM CT
11/26 at Atlanta 12:00 PM CT
12/03 San Francisco 12:00 PM CT
12/10 at Dallas 12:00 PM CT
12/17 Washington 12:00 PM CT
12/24 at N.Y. Giants 12:00 PM CT
12/31 Carolina 12:00 PM CT



aye.. saints should be nervous.. thats pretty bad.

Wolf
07-30-2006, 10:03 PM
has yet to be seen.. thats why I keep saying that we shall see.. but the talent he has shown has ben impressive.. hell.. what if he is the next Tomlinson.. or Vick.. (I do find it strange you edited your previous post).


Why cant he be the next great thing? Im honestly curious?


I understand people could stop him.. HE.. is not one man.. HE.. is part of a team. And when people stopped HIM.. they failed to stop his team... Now consider his team.. Brees/Deuce/Horn/Stalworth.. I'd throw in Hilton - who came up big time at the end of last season.. but not many know him and he needs to prove himself..

Teams could stop him.. and what did the rest of their team do? Went on to win or at least play in championships.. thats the big picture here. And no.. I dont like SC.. in fact, I hate them..

Bottom line.. he adds a new dimension.. However.. as we both agree.. only time will tell if he makes a difference.

I agree with that.. I just wonder if there is going to be enough footballs to go around to make the players happy.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 10:06 PM
so.. you agree Wie progressed to that point faster than Tiger did? Not sure what your trying to say here.. "he chose a different route".. just sounds like an excuse.. She may end up better.. she may not.. but at that point in "Their life" .. who was better? She was...and is.

I don't think that is true. Remember, Michelle Wie is excelling against women, Tiger didn't play in the LPGA. He won the Junior World Championships 6 times, the US Junior Amateur 3 years in a row and then the US Amateur 3 years in a row after that. All she has won so far was the Womens Amateur Public Links tournament.

Tiger had accomplished a lot more at the age of 17 compared to Michelle Wie.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 10:06 PM
I guess Im wondering how you have "powers" to tell he is a bust while people who get paid to do so cant? Everyone is stupid but you?

and ok.. if you say you didnt.. then Im good with that. I mustve misread.


if you just remove that question mark from that bolded sentence then you'll reach the point i've been trying to make for a while now.....

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:07 PM
I agree with that.. I just wonder if there is going to be enough footballs to go around to make the players happy.


and there may not be.. but man.. can we get this season started already?!


Im curious however.. (and not saying nothin bout nothin).. how are the Texans lookin this year? What are the expectations in the fans eyes? (serious inquiry(sp?) )

TwinSisters
07-30-2006, 10:07 PM
Anywazzz.. Its time to drink.. be back tonight or tomorrow.. I really do enjoy this argument.. not flamin... jus discussion.

Drinkin' and discussin' and dispersin' and Saints... that's enough to draw me in.

( on a Sunday too )

I think we need to go back and review that lateral

But first to interject: Injury rate that seems to be higher for players on artificial turf.

Factor or non-factor?

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:09 PM
I don't think that is true. Remember, Michelle Wie is excelling against women, Tiger didn't play in the LPGA. He won the Junior World Championships 6 times, the US Junior Amateur 3 years in a row and then the US Amateur 3 years in a row after that. All she has won so far was the Womens Amateur Public Links tournament.

Tiger had accomplished a lot more at the age of 17 compared to Michelle Wie.


you need to look at overall.. her numbers were better (from what ive seen.. may be wrong).. not individual tourneys.. Woman vs man.. wie vs tiger.. the girl rocked.. (I think.. but honestly.. please excuse me.. been drinkin alil.. )

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 10:10 PM
you need to look at overall.. her numbers were better (from what ive seen.. may be wrong).. not individual tourneys.. Woman vs man.. wie vs tiger.. the girl rocked.. (I think.. but honestly.. please excuse me.. been drinkin alil.. )

CALL ME WHEN SHE WINS SOMETHING!!!!!!!!!!!!

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:11 PM
Drinkin' and discussin' and dispersin' and Saints... that's enough to draw me in.

( on a Sunday too )

I think we need to go back and review that lateral

But first to interject: Injury rate that seems to be higher for players on artificial turf.

Factor or non-factor?


Im sayin factor.. maybe just my opinion.. but man.. that turf hurts..


but man.. that A. Brooks lateral..lol. hence - hes out. Good or bad? Do the raiders inprove with Brooks?

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:12 PM
CALL ME WHEN SHE WINS SOMETHING!!!!!!!!!!!!
so.. you need to me call you when peyton manning wins too? ;)

TwinSisters
07-30-2006, 10:13 PM
I guess Im wondering how you have "powers" to tell he is a bust while people who get paid to do so cant? Everyone is stupid but you?

and ok.. if you say you didnt.. then Im good with that. I mustve misread.

Look. Your premise is flawed.

First you say that swtbound07 is not worthy to be a scout.

Casserly passed on Bush.

Second you say that Casserly is a dufus for passing on Bush.

Casserly is paid.
Casserly which is a scout passed on Bush.
A paid scout passed on Bush.

Therefore we must conclude that your argument is Ditka-us-like.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 10:15 PM
you need to look at overall.. her numbers were better (from what ive seen.. may be wrong).. not individual tourneys.. Woman vs man.. wie vs tiger.. the girl rocked.. (I think.. but honestly.. please excuse me.. been drinkin alil.. )

I don't see it. One was dominant and won a lot (Tiger) and the other was competitive, but only won a single tournament (Wie). Tiger developed an ice in his veins mentality because of his success, Wie has developed a gag reflex when coming close to winning tournaments or making a cut in a PGA event.

Wolf
07-30-2006, 10:17 PM
and there may not be.. but man.. can we get this season started already?!


Im curious however.. (and not saying nothin bout nothin).. how are the Texans lookin this year? What are the expectations in the fans eyes? (serious inquiry(sp?) )


going to be tough learning all new shemes.. I expect us to be back to the 2004 form (about 7 wins) .. we have upgraded (at least on paper) the talent around Carr.. Injuries are going to happen and as long as we keep our stars (drob/aj) healthy I think we will be ok.. we still need some upgrades on defense (mainly secondary/LB crew) and offensively the OL is the key

Carr has the tools to make everythrow, we just need Kubiak to get into his head to make sure he makes the right reads..

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:24 PM
Look. Your premise is flawed.

First you say that swtbound07 is not worthy to be a scout.

Casserly passed on Bush.

Second you say that Casserly is a dufus for passing on Bush.

Casserly is paid.
Casserly which is a scout passed on Bush.
A paid scout passed on Bush.

Therefore we must conclude that your argument is Ditka-us-like.

honestly.. Im not familiar with all the scouts.. please (seriously) familiarize me with him.. cause.. I know most teams in the nfl had reggie ranked #1. There are 32 teams afterall..

and please dont talk about ditka.. .. gives me chills =)

and tulexan.. still waitin on stats.. Wie was better..


Wolf.. thanks for the update.. how do you feel you guys will finish?


- my point.. is dont discount RB yet.. he may very well be a bust.. HOWEVER.. at this point.. all lights a go go go and he may be the next great. And I tend to listen to guys that get paid for what they do instead of some guy off an nfl MB.


My main point is.. Just because MOST people say he has amazing talent.. and because the Texans didnt draft him.. dont knock him and find flaws.

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 10:25 PM
so.. you agree Wie progressed to that point faster than Tiger did? Not sure what your trying to say here.. "he chose a different route".. just sounds like an excuse.. She may end up better.. she may not.. but at that point in "Their life" .. who was better? She was...and is.

"He chose a different route" is not a excuse, it means HE CHOSE A DIFFERENT ROUTE. He could have played PGA tournaments when he was in High School, but CHOSE to got to college and rack up Amateur championships BEFORE he went pro.

Arguably the best golfer ever (Bobby Jones) never went pro.

Just because Tiger chose to stay at the amateur ranks and Wie did not (which she should have), doesn't make Tiger any less of a golfer. Wie doesn't even come close to Tiger.

swtbound07
07-30-2006, 10:27 PM
honestly.. Im not familiar with all the scouts.. please (seriously) familiarize me with him.. cause.. I know most teams in the nfl had reggie ranked #1. There are 32 teams afterall..

and please dont talk about ditka.. .. gives me chills =)

and tulexan.. still waitin on stats.. Wie was better..


Wolf.. thanks for the update.. how do you feel you guys will finish?


- my point.. is dont discount RB yet.. he may very well be a bust.. HOWEVER.. at this point.. all lights a go go go and he may be the next great. And I tend to listen to guys that get paid for what they do instead of some guy off an nfl MB.


My main point is.. Just because MOST people say he has amazing talent.. and because the Texans didnt draft him.. dont knock him and find flaws.

I was knocking him BEFORE they didn't draft him....and im not finding flaws, just pointing them out to passers-by. He has 0% chance of being the next great.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:28 PM
"He chose a different route" is not a excuse, it means HE CHOSE A DIFFERENT ROUTE. He could have played PGA tournaments when he was in High School, but CHOSE to got to college and rack up Amateur championships BEFORE he went pro.

Arguably the best golfer ever (Bobby Jones) never went pro.

Just because Tiger chose to stay at the amateur ranks and Wie did not (which she should have), doesn't make Tiger any less of a golfer. Wie doesn't even come close to Tiger.


I think your wrong.. give it time..

shes been awesome for her age and at the competition level she is at..

and when did this turn into the Houston Texans Golf site? =P

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 10:29 PM
Wie has a unatural long drive for a girl or women, her short game sucks.

Tournaments are won and lost on a players short game, ask Sergio Garcia

There are a ton of players that can drive the ball a mile, but can't cut it on the pro circut.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:30 PM
I was knocking him BEFORE they didn't draft him....and im not finding flaws, just pointing them out to passers-by. He has 0% chance of being the next great.



well.I think ( or would like to think) that many if not most Texans fans would disagree with you.. hell.. I know most (maybe many) NFL fans disagree with you

he does have a chance.. but hey.. thats why I love football.. gotta love to disagree..

gwallaia
07-30-2006, 10:30 PM
Speaking of Reggie Bush, how about his teammate Matt?

With first-round draft choice Matt Leinart scheduled to be throwing to Arizona Cardinals receivers on Monday, the initial day of training camp practice, the agent for the former Southern California quarterback instead threw in the towel on contract negotiations.

At least for now.........
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2534837

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 10:31 PM
I think your wrong.. give it time..

shes been awesome for her age and at the competition level she is at..

and when did this turn into the Houston Texans Golf site? =P

Golf happens to be a hobby of mine.

Thats why I know that Tiger was just as big as a prospect as Wie.

Pro golfers were fearing the day that young man would decide to go pro and for good reason.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:32 PM
Wie has a unatural long drive for a girl or women, her short game sucks.

Tournaments are won and lost on a players short game, ask Sergio Garcia

There are a ton of players that can drive the ball a mile, but can't cut it on the pro circut.


absolutely right.. only time will tell.. (hmm.. I seem to be saying the same thing over and over)

cept.. at this point... Wie looks awesome.. she just needs to learn and step up.


thanks for the informative posts CB.. seriously =)

tulexan
07-30-2006, 10:33 PM
I think your wrong.. give it time..

shes been awesome for her age and at the competition level she is at..

and when did this turn into the Houston Texans Golf site? =P

I don't know how you can compare the two of them because one is a man and one is a woman. The PGA is much more competitive than the LPGA and that would be like comparing Michael Jordan to Cheryl Miller. Both are/were legends in their respective sports, but Jordan would dominate Miller in one on one.

No matter how good Wie gets, she will never be as good as Tiger.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:34 PM
Speaking of Reggie Bush, how about his teammate Matt?

With first-round draft choice Matt Leinart scheduled to be throwing to Arizona Cardinals receivers on Monday, the initial day of training camp practice, the agent for the former Southern California quarterback instead threw in the towel on contract negotiations.

At least for now.........
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2534837



good question.. Im not sure of him. Hell.. I hate SC.. but man did they prove some stuff. I think he will be good. However, Im not sure he will find playin time unless Warner goes down...

how do you guys think the cards will do overall?

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:38 PM
I don't know how you can compare the two of them because one is a man and one is a woman. The PGA is much more competitive than the LPGA and that would be like comparing Michael Jordan to Cheryl Miller. Both are/were legends in their respective sports, but Jordan would dominate Miller in one on one.

No matter how good Wie gets, she will never be as good as Tiger.

I dunno... how about tennis a few years back.. (quite a few)


Billy jean vs Bobby Riggs? The best male tennis player vs the best female? She beat him.. great match.. but she came out on top..

and I think Wie can compete.. give her alil more time.

gwallaia
07-30-2006, 10:39 PM
I think the Cards will be vastly improved. The receiving corps will have one more year of working and gelling together and the addition of Edgrerrin James will help the receivers immensely.

I think the Cards will bring Leinart along slowly. I will go on the record and say that Leinart will ultimately be the best of the "3" Qb's in this draft.

Wolf
07-30-2006, 10:43 PM
SNQ...I think we made strides to catch up with the colts but esp with Faggins injury.. our secondary still needs another player or 2 IMO.. unless PBuc plays really well (It is his contract year).. tough to match up with the Colts and their passing attack.

However..if the offense comes together that will be a good thing meaning it will keep our defense off of the field.. I think our DL can be as good as any in the league (at least on paper) ...not sure when it comes to LB (feel Ryans is going to be good)

I think it will be a dog fight for 2nd in the division with the Jags.. Unless things change, we play the Jags pretty well..

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:43 PM
I think the Cards will be vastly improved. The receiving corps will have one more year of working and gelling together and the addition of Edgrerrin James will help the receivers immensely.

I think the Cards will bring Leinart along slowly. I will go on the record and say that Leinart will ultimately be the best of the "3" Qb's in this draft.

not denyin ya there..

he might be.

Cards o-line scares me as does. The D - well.. we shall see.. but man does that offense have potential! As long as the Niners end up last.. rock on!

TwinSisters
07-30-2006, 10:44 PM
Im sayin factor.. maybe just my opinion.. but man.. that turf hurts..
but man.. that A. Brooks lateral..lol. hence - hes out. Good or bad? Do the raiders inprove with Brooks?

I agree. Possible negative factor in that it increases the chances of injury.

The NFLPA releases reports on it every so now and then.

It's a good read for you... but to summarize: the old artificial turf caused a lot of injuries because it didn't cushion hits well. The NEW artificial turf added cushion that causes extra injury due to the cushion ( like ACL, muscle strain, etc. ). This of course is disputed right now by turf making companies. TO be fair, there may not be a connection between increase in injury and turf does not cause extra injury by itself.

HOWEVER... there have been plenty of soccer studies that show switching between the two, grass and turf, does increase the chance of injury because of the adjustment to the different surfaces.

So the second question would be: has Bush ever played on artificial turf?

How many games will he switch between the two... and does he rely on misdirection and change of direction? Because if he does... that might mean he will be using those knees a lot more then the normal RB. Coupled with the turf changes... that might increase your chances of injury over a normal back.

what do you think?

I would be worried. Who's rebuilding that turf in the Superdome? I am sure Benson is hiring the best available right?

tulexan
07-30-2006, 10:46 PM
I dunno... how about tennis a few years back.. (quite a few)


Billy jean vs Bobby Riggs? The best male tennis player vs the best female? She beat him.. great match.. but she came out on top..

and I think Wie can compete.. give her alil more time.


Bobby Riggs was 55 when he played her. That would be like McEnroe playing against Serena Williams.

If she beat Rod Laver that would be something different.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:47 PM
SNQ...I think we made strides to catch up with the colts but esp with Faggins injury.. our secondary still needs another player or 2 IMO.. unless PBuc plays really well (It is his contract year).. tough to match up with the Colts and their passing attack.

However..if the offense comes together that will be a good thing meaning it will keep our defense off of the field.. I think our DL can be as good as any in the league (at least on paper) ...not sure when it comes to LB (feel Ryans is going to be good)

I think it will be a dog fight for 2nd in the division with the Jags.. Unless things change, we play the Jags pretty well..


honestly.. on paper.. I love how your offense looks.. (however I dont know much about your line)...


but davis/carr/johnson/ - thats good enough for me... Im sure you guys have made more changes.. I just cant think of em.. been drinkin =)

tulexan
07-30-2006, 10:51 PM
We also finally have a legit TE with Putzier

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:53 PM
Bobby Riggs was 55 when he played her. That would be like McEnroe playing against Serena Williams.

If she beat Rod Laver that would be something different.


either way.. (and you are mostly right abotu the age diff).. he challenged her.. and lost.

Men SHOULD be more physically fit to beat women at sports.. its how we are made. However... Im not going to rule anyone out simply because of their sex...


we've made leaps and bounds in the past to improve on nearly every part of our physical sciences. I wouldnt be surprised.. and sooner or later.. it just may happen. (maybe with Wie...)

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 10:54 PM
We also finally have a legit TE with Putzier


really didnt know you guys grabbed him.. I think thats great.. =)


So.. over all... how do you, as texan fans, feel you will finish this season? Honest curiosity.. I havent kept up much

tulexan
07-30-2006, 10:59 PM
I don't want to get my hopes up too much because we have a brutal schedule, but I think there is a reasonable chance that we could win somewhere between 6-8 games.

Wolf
07-30-2006, 11:00 PM
To me TE is a QB's best friend and we never really have had a legit 2 way TE and that hurts.. maybe we can break the cover 2 defense that teams regularly put on us..
http://www.texansbullpen.com/06photogallery/Preseason/2006-05-18-PlayerPractice/Photos/DSC_0117.JPG

and we are hoping this guy anchors our defense

I think we will get about 6 wins atleast.. I think we will start out slow due to toughness of schedule and with learning of the new system

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 11:15 PM
To me TE is a QB's best friend and we never really have had a legit 2 way TE and that hurts.. maybe we can break the cover 2 defense that teams regularly put on us..
http://www.texansbullpen.com/06photogallery/Preseason/2006-05-18-PlayerPractice/Photos/DSC_0117.JPG

and we are hoping this guy anchors our defense

I think we will get about 6 wins atleast.. I think we will start out slow due to toughness of schedule and with learning of the new system

Im kinda hopin the same Wolf.. seeing as our Qb has been known for hittin his TE in SD..

tulexan
07-30-2006, 11:18 PM
Im kinda hopin the same Wolf.. seeing as our Qb has been known for hittin his TE in SD..

There is a big difference between Antonio Gates and any TE on the Saints roster. I still have a suspicion that Gates made Brees who he is. I guess we will find out in a few weeks.

jerek
07-30-2006, 11:20 PM
I will go on the record and say that Leinart will ultimately be the best of the "3" Qb's in this draft.

Agreed, if for no other reason but he has the vastly superior supporting cast right now and is the most "NFL-ready" as of today.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 11:26 PM
There is a big difference between Antonio Gates and any TE on the Saints roster. I still have a suspicion that Gates made Brees who he is. I guess we will find out in a few weeks.


well.. you could be ritght.. however.. Hilton came on strong last season.. and thats with brooks. Keep an eye on him and IF you need a fantasy TE this year.. he may be worth a shot... (merely speculation at this point)

B ut I agree.. the to proven TE's for the past few years dont have Saints written all over em

tulexan
07-30-2006, 11:29 PM
Hilton was pretty good, but he isn't even in Gates' league. Gates is almost uncoverable with his size and athleticism.

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 11:31 PM
Agreed, if for no other reason but he has the vastly superior supporting cast right now and is the most "NFL-ready" as of today.


well. for the sake of argument...

"USC didnt go against hard opponents.. the didnt face the best." What happens when this college Qb meets an NFL defense?

(posted strictly to get more responses here) =)

Carr Bombed
07-30-2006, 11:31 PM
Hilton was pretty good, but he isn't even in Gates' league. Gates is almost uncoverable with his size and athleticism.

and thats what makes it a shame that a rookie can come into the league and instantly become the highest paid TE in the league, these rookie contracts are getting outragous

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 11:31 PM
Hilton was pretty good, but he isn't even in Gates' league. Gates is almost uncoverable with his size and athleticism.


Like Vernon? I stil find it hard to believe he earns more than gates and the rest.. =\

Hookem Horns
07-30-2006, 11:32 PM
well.I think ( or would like to think) that many if not most Texans fans would disagree with you.. hell.. I know most (maybe many) NFL fans disagree with you

he does have a chance.. but hey.. thats why I love football.. gotta love to disagree..

I agree with him and was vocal about it before the draft. I always felt that RB would be a commodity player that we couldn't afford. Seeing how the Horns shut him down was discouraging. I expected a lot more from him in the Rose Bowl. Also, it was obvious that Carroll wasn't too confident in him by leaving him on the bench for most of the 4th Qtr, and no I do not think Carroll is stupid or a bad coach.

We have seen Reggie Bush in the NFL before, his name was Eric Metcalf. Nice player to have but not worthy of a top pick. Like Metcalf, he will bring excitement every time he touches the ball but he is not going to carry a team like some think.

http://www.geocities.com/jamdawg1/browns/images/rivals/metcalf.jpg

tulexan
07-30-2006, 11:34 PM
I don't know why they can't have it set up like the NBA. NBA rookies are still making pretty good money, but they aren't making more than all star veterans who are on their second contract. Can you imagine how big of a contract LeBron would have received if the NBA rookie contracts were set up like the NFL rookie contracts?

tulexan
07-30-2006, 11:36 PM
Like Vernon? I stil find it hard to believe he earns more than gates and the rest.. =\

I think Vernon Davis is going to be the OROY. I don't see how anyone can cover someone as big and fast as him. He isn't as tall as Gates or some of the other TE's, but he is as fast or faster than Reggie Bush and he out weighs him by 50 lbs.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 11:40 PM
I agree with him and was vocal about it before the draft. I always felt that RB would be a commodity player that we couldn't afford. Seeing how the Horns shut him down was discouraging. I expected a lot more from him in the Rose Bowl. Also, it was obvious that Carroll wasn't too confident in him by leaving him on the bench for most of the 4th Qtr, and no I do not think Carroll is stupid or a bad coach.

We have seen Reggie Bush in the NFL before, his name was Eric Metcalf. Nice player to have but not worthy of a top pick. Like Metcalf, he will bring excitement every time he touches the ball but he is not going to carry a team like some think.

http://www.geocities.com/jamdawg1/browns/images/rivals/metcalf.jpg



Don't forget him too...

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/b/b7/200px-011_1003-2833A.jpg

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 11:43 PM
I think Vernon Davis is going to be the OROY. I don't see how anyone can cover someone as big and fast as him. He isn't as tall as Gates or some of the other TE's, but he is as fast or faster than Reggie Bush and he out weighs him by 50 lbs.

ok.. and you are going off of ? his size and speed? or his college numbers too? Thats my points.. Reggie looks like the real deal.. but we wont know until the season gets underway. He isnt great in sizre but WOW.. his moves are amazing.. Im sorry.. but fans and enemy alike have to agree..

Hell.. Ive hated the Trojans for years.. but man.. I sure love to hate watchin him...

A TE cant carry you to glory.. (aimed at the niners)

Steersnqueers
07-30-2006, 11:50 PM
Don't forget him too...

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/b/b7/200px-011_1003-2833A.jpg


Expectations of Bush are "wow.. look what hes brought to the table"..
however.. as far as OROY goes. I think Davis has a GREAT shot.. hell.. his QB wont have many other choices.. and hes been a stud at the position in college. The rest of his pffense sucks. And he has no defense.. " Im thinkin Davis could grab that title easy.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 11:54 PM
ok.. and you are going off of ? his size and speed? or his college numbers too? Thats my points.. Reggie looks like the real deal.. but we wont know until the season gets underway. He isnt great in sizre but WOW.. his moves are amazing.. Im sorry.. but fans and enemy alike have to agree..

Hell.. Ive hated the Trojans for years.. but man.. I sure love to hate watchin him...

A TE cant carry you to glory.. (aimed at the niners)

Good question. The difference is that Davis is bigger and faster than almost all LB's, FS's, SS's, and CB's in the league. Reggie is not. Reggie has more power than many will admit, but he isn't going to run over many cornerbacks let alone linebackers or safeties. You can rely on pure athleticism in HS and college, but there are too many good athletes in the NFL to solely rely on it in the pros. He is fast and has great moves, but he will have to learn to make one cut and move up field (like Morency has to). If he doesn't, he is going to get hurt. Reggie will be a good player in the NFL. I don't think he is going to be a bust like some other people here. I think he is either going to be great or he is going to be a Warrick Dunn type back. I hope he is great because I'm planning on going to some Saints games this fall, but like all rookies, we will have to wait and see.

Hookem Horns
07-31-2006, 12:01 AM
Don't forget him too...

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/b/b7/200px-011_1003-2833A.jpg

Or this guy ...

http://www.cantstopthebleeding.com/img/meggett1213.jpg

MorKnolle
07-31-2006, 12:03 AM
ok.. and you are going off of ? his size and speed? or his college numbers too? Thats my points.. Reggie looks like the real deal.. but we wont know until the season gets underway. He isnt great in sizre but WOW.. his moves are amazing.. Im sorry.. but fans and enemy alike have to agree..

Hell.. Ive hated the Trojans for years.. but man.. I sure love to hate watchin him...

A TE cant carry you to glory.. (aimed at the niners)

Bush and Davis are both amazing athletes, but I don't think either will win OROY, more because of the teams/situations they're in than their personal talent. Davis will definitely be one of if not Alex Smith's main target, but I still don't think their offense is developed enough to be real effective, and I think opposing defenses will start to key in on him if he starts off strong. Similarly, Bush will share a lot of carries with Deuce McAllister and maybe Michael Bennett, plus the Saints don't have a real good offense either (their OLine especially). My current pick for OROY is DeAngelo Williams with Laurence Maroney as a close 2nd. Both play for good teams that have very solid allround offenses, so they won't be the main option (will reduce their touches but will also keep opposing defenses from focusing on them), plus both teams will likely have a lot of leads at the end of games so they'll be looking to run out the clock. Both are currently slated as backups but will still get a good amount of carries and both are behind a player that have a history of injury problems (moreso Foster than Dillon), so if history has anything to say DeAngelo and Laurence could both find themselves in the starting role for a significant amount of the season.

tulexan
07-31-2006, 12:08 AM
Reggie does have more of the build of Watters and Meggett compared to Faulk and Sanders. Look at his lower body compared to his upper body. Faulk and Sanders were solid head to toe. Reggie is solid head to waist.

tulexan
07-31-2006, 12:13 AM
Bush and Davis are both amazing athletes, but I don't think either will win OROY, more because of the teams/situations they're in than their personal talent. Davis will definitely be one of if not Alex Smith's main target, but I still don't think their offense is developed enough to be real effective, and I think opposing defenses will start to key in on him if he starts off strong. Similarly, Bush will share a lot of carries with Deuce McAllister and maybe Michael Bennett, plus the Saints don't have a real good offense either (their OLine especially). My current pick for OROY is DeAngelo Williams with Laurence Maroney as a close 2nd. Both play for good teams that have very solid allround offenses, so they won't be the main option (will reduce their touches but will also keep opposing defenses from focusing on them), plus both teams will likely have a lot of leads at the end of games so they'll be looking to run out the clock. Both are currently slated as backups but will still get a good amount of carries and both are behind a player that have a history of injury problems (moreso Foster than Dillon), so if history has anything to say DeAngelo and Laurence could both find themselves in the starting role for a significant amount of the season.

I like DeAngelo too. Foster will probably get hurt early too so he should get a lot of carries. I was really hoping we would manage to get DeAngelo some how in the draft, but oh well. I like DeMeco.

Hookem Horns
07-31-2006, 12:16 AM
Reggie does have more of the build of Watters and Meggett compared to Faulk and Sanders. Look at his lower body compared to his upper body. Faulk and Sanders were solid head to toe. Reggie is solid head to waist.

Watters. I was trying to figure out who that Seahawk was. If you would have shown him in an Eagles or Niners uniform I would have known right off.

tulexan
07-31-2006, 12:24 AM
http://amarillo.com/images/headlines/122799/chiefs.jpg
Ricky Watters

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/img/10-05/1023bush.jpg
Reggie Bush


Pretty close

TwinSisters
07-31-2006, 12:24 AM
honestly.. Im not familiar with all the scouts.. please (seriously) familiarize me with him.. cause.. I know most teams in the nfl had reggie ranked #1. There are 32 teams afterall..

and please dont talk about ditka.. .. gives me chills =)

and tulexan.. still waitin on stats.. Wie was better..


Wolf.. thanks for the update.. how do you feel you guys will finish?


- my point.. is dont discount RB yet.. he may very well be a bust.. HOWEVER.. at this point.. all lights a go go go and he may be the next great. And I tend to listen to guys that get paid for what they do instead of some guy off an nfl MB.


My main point is.. Just because MOST people say he has amazing talent.. and because the Texans didnt draft him.. dont knock him and find flaws.


Noooo nooo no backin out now! It's crawdad munchin' time. You oughta know what that's about. I do. I've done a little stretch of time in Shreveport and Mississippi. ( visitor's only )

On Casserly... I actually know few bits about him too. BUT... you won't get to hear it, because it upsets the Church of Carr that we so humbly abide in. Though it doesn't matter too much here, because it has nothing to do with the argument.

If one set of scouts passed on him, you cannot say all scouts. And therefore you cannot discount swtbound07's ruling on the premise that he is not a scout.

Now we can get to the meaty part.. ( bolded up top )

You don't have to listen to a guy on the board. I will learn you a reason to think for yourself. Consider it a thanks in return for all the fish and ditchbugs I was awarded during my lengthy stay in the Pelican State.

You don't wanna talk about Ditka.. we can discuss' Mora then. Remember that year they were going around talking about the Super Bowl and this was the season to be jolly and making up Super Bowl songs and so forth? Maybe? Maybe not?

It never happened because half their starting squad was out with injury or playing with injury by mid-season. ( keep that in mind as we progress )

here's an argument to think he will not make the big splash
- Bush is not a power runner.
- Bush needs to make people miss to get his yards.
- Bush will need to cut, stop, and change direction regularly.
- Soccer players cut, stop, and change direction regularly.
- Bush will play on artificial turf.
- Bush will play on grass.
- Soccer players have more injuries when they switch between the surfaces

Will Bush defy the odds and be able to switch between the surfaces and avoid the increased chance of injury?

or Will Bush most likely play with a lot of injury thus not be playing 100% at all times?

Don't be thinking Barry Sanders. He had power too. He was a guy that could carry the ball 30 times a game.

The weak part of this rebuttal is:
-I don't watch a lot of soccer. I've seen like ... 5 minutes of it or something like that. So you know I just figure it is all the same with the movement of the players.
-Football is not soccer. True, but it sure does look like those guys that have to cut a lot or change direction quickly get hurt more then others.
-Soccer injury rates depend on weather, field condition, temp, etc. To this I say we are not writing a freakin research document to charter the American Sports Science and Health Foundation... it's a beer chat discussion.


Outside of those bits... I think you will have a good reason to not be so confident that Bush will spell instant success. Doing so without pointing out his flaws or draft status I might add.

If not.

Then I rest on the fact that Lou Gossett Jr. is from Brooklyn and your opening premise is from a chick flick. Thus condemning your following points as not relevant to the game of football.

And yes by knowing that it is a chick flick I must rest... but only by admission at the end of my case, not before it was stated.

Thank you.

Steersnqueers
07-31-2006, 01:03 AM
Noooo nooo no backin out now! It's crawdad munchin' time. You oughta know what that's about. I do. I've done a little stretch of time in Shreveport and Mississippi. ( visitor's only )

On Casserly... I actually know few bits about him too. BUT... you won't get to hear it, because it upsets the Church of Carr that we so humbly abide in. Though it doesn't matter too much here, because it has nothing to do with the argument.

If one set of scouts passed on him, you cannot say all scouts. And therefore you cannot discount swtbound07's ruling on the premise that he is not a scout.

Now we can get to the meaty part.. ( bolded up top )

You don't have to listen to a guy on the board. I will learn you a reason to think for yourself. Consider it a thanks in return for all the fish and ditchbugs I was awarded during my lengthy stay in the Pelican State.

You don't wanna talk about Ditka.. we can discuss' Mora then. Remember that year they were going around talking about the Super Bowl and this was the season to be jolly and making up Super Bowl songs and so forth? Maybe? Maybe not?

It never happened because half their starting squad was out with injury or playing with injury by mid-season. ( keep that in mind as we progress )

here's an argument to think he will not make the big splash
- Bush is not a power runner.
- Bush needs to make people miss to get his yards.
- Bush will need to cut, stop, and change direction regularly.
- Soccer players cut, stop, and change direction regularly.
- Bush will play on artificial turf.
- Bush will play on grass.
- Soccer players have more injuries when they switch between the surfaces

Will Bush defy the odds and be able to switch between the surfaces and avoid the increased chance of injury?

or Will Bush most likely play with a lot of injury thus not be playing 100% at all times?

Don't be thinking Barry Sanders. He had power too. He was a guy that could carry the ball 30 times a game.

The weak part of this rebuttal is:
-I don't watch a lot of soccer. I've seen like ... 5 minutes of it or something like that. So you know I just figure it is all the same with the movement of the players.
-Football is not soccer. True, but it sure does look like those guys that have to cut a lot or change direction quickly get hurt more then others.
-Soccer injury rates depend on weather, field condition, temp, etc. To this I say we are not writing a freakin research document to charter the American Sports Science and Health Foundation... it's a beer chat discussion.


Outside of those bits... I think you will have a good reason to not be so confident that Bush will spell instant success. Doing so without pointing out his flaws or draft status I might add.

If not.

Then I rest on the fact that Lou Gossett Jr. is from Brooklyn and your opening premise is from a chick flick. Thus condemning your following points as not relevant to the game of football.

And yes by knowing that it is a chick flick I must rest... but only by admission at the end of my case, not before it was stated.

Thank you.


Nah.. not crawlin out.. bare with me though.. been drinkin a ton =)..


He is NOT a scout.. bottom line - care to prove me different?


here's an argument to think he will not make the big splash
- Bush is not a power runner. Maybe not.. but we will see?
- Bush needs to make people miss to get his yards. He does.. year after year

- Bush will need to cut, stop, and change direction regularly. He does.. obviously
- Soccer players cut, stop, and change direction regularly. So does Bush...
- Bush will play on artificial turf.
- Bush will play on grass.
- Soccer players have more injuries when they switch between the surfaces.. this isnt soccer.. this is a real sport. And now give me the list where FB (football) greats have gone between Turf and Grass... thank you.


obviously.. I dont want to talk abotu ditka or mora.. they both were detrimental to the saints organization. You want me to acknoledge them> Sure... they were part of us..in the past.. but they Are Not Us!. Bottom line.


My point is.. The texans.. (for the most part.. but not all).. wanted Bush.. and now they Knock him. Look.. mistakes happen.. and maybe teams do what they do to find what they need most. Your a fan.. dont try to be a pro - unless your gettin paid for it.. Either way.. good luck to mario and bush.. lets see who made the right pick overall.

swtbound07
07-31-2006, 01:26 AM
Nah.. not crawlin out.. bare with me though.. been drinkin a ton =)..


He is NOT a scout.. bottom line - care to prove me different?


here's an argument to think he will not make the big splash
- Bush is not a power runner. Maybe not.. but we will see?
- Bush needs to make people miss to get his yards. He does.. year after year

- Bush will need to cut, stop, and change direction regularly. He does.. obviously
- Soccer players cut, stop, and change direction regularly. So does Bush...
- Bush will play on artificial turf.
- Bush will play on grass.
- Soccer players have more injuries when they switch between the surfaces.. this isnt soccer.. this is a real sport. And now give me the list where FB (football) greats have gone between Turf and Grass... thank you.


obviously.. I dont want to talk abotu ditka or mora.. they both were detrimental to the saints organization. You want me to acknoledge them> Sure... they were part of us..in the past.. but they Are Not Us!. Bottom line.


My point is.. The texans.. (for the most part.. but not all).. wanted Bush.. and now they Knock him. Look.. mistakes happen.. and maybe teams do what they do to find what they need most. Your a fan.. dont try to be a pro - unless your gettin paid for it.. Either way.. good luck to mario and bush.. lets see who made the right pick overall.


And you are a sheeple, leaning on "experts" to do your research and filmwatch for you. Everyone on a football message board has at one time or another evaluated a player...and i'll be first in line for crow if im EVER wrong on anything...will you be dropping by the texans board at the end of next season to admit reggie busted?

swtbound07
07-31-2006, 01:58 AM
Man!!:shades: if you had to EAT CROW on things you said. you would be to Obese to even sit in front of you computer and reach the key board.


Like what? If I've said something you can prove wrong, feel free to step to the plate...but I went round on this last night and nobody gave me anything of merit in return...i was repeatedly told i was "funny". Im right a HECK of a lot more than I am ever wrong.

Steersnqueers
07-31-2006, 02:25 AM
And you are a sheeple, leaning on "experts" to do your research and filmwatch for you. Everyone on a football message board has at one time or another evaluated a player...and i'll be first in line for crow if im EVER wrong on anything...will you be dropping by the texans board at the end of next season to admit reggie busted?


look.. you should take this as an example and something to learn from.. and until then.. sit back/listen to peoople who know, and realize you are just another POS that knows more than you.. and make a difference. Until you can prove otherwise.. shut it. Your just anohter person who feels/ he or she is right. Good luck either way...


I think this is what makes a great football player.. give your best.. and whatever follows .. well.. follows..

swtbound07
07-31-2006, 02:57 AM
Well swtbound07 I did try to find something on ALL you're post pertaining to RB and can say that i REALLY couldn't find anything that you said would make you eat Crow. so i guess it's me that's gonna be ****tin'''' Crow for the next few days. Sorry about me thinking you were like so many other posters that know everything.
P.S I still don't Like you. and I think Reggie(GOD) Will do better than Mary"0"


Gee...the same two voices telling me i dont know football/scouting and reggie is great. Is there a "not suprised" smiley face?

P.S. I've never liked you.

P.P.S. You don't have to like me, just respect me.

P.P.P.S. Calling Mario Williams Mary-O is quite mature and clever...did you think of that all by yourself, or did the rest of the saints message board collaborate and help you on it?

Numbskull
07-31-2006, 03:20 AM
Gee...the same two voices telling me i dont know football/scouting and reggie is great. Is there a "not suprised" smiley face?

P.S. I've never liked you.

P.P.S. You don't have to like me, just respect me.

P.P.P.S. Calling Mario Williams Mary-O is quite mature and clever...did you think of that all by yourself, or did the rest of the saints message board collaborate and help you on it?


How can anyone respect your opinions? They are all laughable.

swtbound07
07-31-2006, 03:40 AM
How can anyone respect your opinions? They are all laughable.

my opinions are no more laughable than yours....i provide stats for mine at least.

HJam72
07-31-2006, 03:47 AM
You know it's bad when you're arguing with numbskulls, steers, 'n' queers.

PS-Not that there's anything wrong with being a numbskull or a steer. :rolleyes:

swtbound07
07-31-2006, 03:54 AM
Hey man this is the ONLY bad thread i found on our board. thought you might enjoy it..http://saintsreport.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=212543&perpage=12&pagenumber=1

Thats fantastic...im getting called insane on 2 message boards now....if any of your friends want to come over and take a shot at me with some numbers, i'll be glad to shut them up...

not that i think this will do any good, but a reminder

1) I NEVER wanted bush. Period. At no time in his high school, college, or post college career
2) To the person who said i must be unemployed: I do website design and post on message boards while my files upload. Im on a computer a lot..but I do have a job.
3) Im not jealous of your players, your franchise, or the fact that your city was blessed with a giant hurricane so it got to play a home game in new york.
4) You can call us bottom feeders of the league if you like, thats what a 2-14 record will get you, but it must be hard to find a target to throw stones at from the #2 pick.....
5) Reggie is terrible. Statistically, on film, and in person, he is a lousy football player. I feel sorry for deuce mcallister.

swtbound07
07-31-2006, 04:03 AM
Reggie Bush is overrated, and i'll tell you why.

Point one
Reggie Bush is heralded as a dual threat player, someone who can return kicks, return punts, line up as a wideout, and play running back.

Lets examine the claim that reggie bush can line up as an nfl wideout. I don't believe he can, and here is why. In reggie Bush's senior season, he was frequently used by pete carroll as a wideout, as he was a threat to "break one at any time."

As a reciever, Bush managed not one, but TWO, yes count them folks, TWO touchdown receptions. Not only that, in playing in 13 games, he managed to record 37 receptions. 37 receptions in 13 games means that as dangerous as reggie is, he is only catching that football LESS THAN THREE times a game. Once every 6.5 games reggie bush will take a reception to the endzone. Defensive coordinators must be trembling.

Reggie bush took these 37 receptions and managed to record a STUNNING 12.9 yard per reception average, ranking him below Steve Smith, Dwayne Jarrett, Lendale White, Patrick Turner, and some guy named Greig Carlson ON HIS OWN TEAM. Fear not, because he slightly edged out David Kirtman (12.8) in YPC.
The USC trojans threw the ball 481 times in 2005, and reggie snared 37 of them.

Now, Reggie is not going to touch the ball alot, i dont know if you realize this.

The 2005 USC trojans ran 525 running plays, and 481 passing plays, for a total of 1,006 plays from scrimmage. Reggie Bush touched the ball 237 times, or 23 percent of the time. as a frame of reference, its not a considerable amount more than lendale white (211 touches, or 21 percent of the time). Not going to get a lot of mileage out of that investment.

Reggie Carried the ball about 15 times a game in 2005. 15 carries. Show me ONE back in the NFL that is successfull averaging 15 carries a game. Please. Just one. I'd like real statistics.

Reggie Bush is an electrifying punt and kick returner!!! No. He isn't.

Kick return stats for you
Reggie Bush
28 returns, 493 yards, 17.6 average, with a long return of 30

on USC's OWN TEAM
Desmond Reed
5 returns, 194 yards, 38.8 average, with a long of 51.

Who is the electrifying returner again?? Sure, reggie can return kicks for you...but why would you want him to? He's not breaking them


Punt Returns.
I will have to give you this, Reggie Bush Broke A punt return. ONE. Once, the stars alligned and Reggie did his job. But first, the stats.

Reggie returned 18 punts in 13 games. Thats slightly more than one a game
he averaged 9.9 yards a return. 10 yards.

179 total punt return yards for mr. reggie bush, or if you are keeping track 13.8 yards of punt returning per game.

He did manage to return ONE punt for a touchdown, an 84 yard run in fact.

So you get 10 yards a punt return, and 18 a kick return?

This you paid 50+ million dollars for?
3 catches a game?
ONE special teams touchdown?

Congratulations sir, you basically drafted a low budget desmond howard.


i already did this once. He's terrible. You and your numbskull friend are just

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d131/swtbound07/troll.jpg

Wolf
07-31-2006, 07:26 AM
I don't know how stats can be argued right now on how aer person will do at the NFL level.. RB,VY or even Mario Williams haven't played a down against NFL competion. some rise to the challenge and become solid(DD) and some don't (K.Carter).

I was against us getting RB or VY in the draft..(I wanted a trade down), yet I am suprised with players are either going to be great or a bust. and no inbetween at the NFL Level

houstonhurricane
07-31-2006, 08:37 AM
I am dumbfounded on how many people either don't read or can't read what other people post, then respond to what they thought they read. I said Lendale White was one of the 2 best players in the Rose Bowl, I didn't even comment on his NFL abilities.

I don't know how good White will be in the NFL. If Bush is lucky he will turn into another Eric Metcalf type of player and have a decent career coming out of the backfield on 3rd downs and returning punts.

Well then, what does that have to do with RB or any other player's signings? Eric Metcalf? Goodness, you are clueless... Aren't you the guy who already has VY in the Hall of Fame?

CloakNNNdagger
07-31-2006, 08:55 AM
A long time ago [05-23-2006 from thread “Reggie Bush--Last Man Standing”] I posted how Bush would be losing financially due to income taxation differences between New Orleans and Houston. So now I’ll point out that BUSH and team SEGAL in their hard-nosed negotiations not only did NOT obtain a contract with numbers as good or better than Mario but, contra to on-the-surface popular reporting, they did not even end up with one as good as Young’s.

This is based on the fact that Texas has no state income tax.......neither does Tennessee (except for dividend and interest income). Louisiana, on the other hand, for incomes over $25,000 taxes at a rate of 6%.

Taking this into account, if we are to make “apples to apples” comparisons to Vince’s and Mario’s contracts, the following adjustments must be made right off the top.:

Lost guaranteed money ------- $26,000,000 X 0.06 = 1,572,000
Actual guaranteed money------ $26,000,000 - 1,572,000 = 24,628,000

Lost base money-------------- $51,000,000 X 0.06 = 3,060,000
Actual base money------------ $51,000,000 - 3,060,000 = 47,940,000

Lost potential
“total package”----- Not known at this time
Actual potential
“Total package”----- Not known at this time


Ironically, Bush’s final contract has seen him lose monies due to the fact that the Texans’ #1 pick was Mario....and NOT him. Furthermore, “bragging rights” over being the “top dog” with the “top dog” contract of the 2006 NFL draft (which apparently was so important to Bush), has not only been eclipsed by Mario, but also Young. Fact: OUR Mario IS #1.

Now it’s time for these modern day gladiators to prove themselves on the field..............LET THE GAMES BEGIN!!!!!!!

Titan "Tack" Fan
07-31-2006, 09:30 AM
well.. you could be ritght.. however.. Hilton came on strong last season.. and thats with brooks. Keep an eye on him and IF you need a fantasy TE this year.. he may be worth a shot... (merely speculation at this point)

B ut I agree.. the to proven TE's for the past few years dont have Saints written all over em


I love Hilton, the guy is 6'8 for cryin' out loud

TwinSisters
07-31-2006, 03:54 PM
Nah.. not crawlin out.. bare with me though.. been drinkin a ton =)..

He is NOT a scout.. bottom line - care to prove me different?

My point is.. The texans.. (for the most part.. but not all).. wanted Bush.. and now they Knock him. Look.. mistakes happen.. and maybe teams do what they do to find what they need most. Your a fan.. dont try to be a pro - unless your gettin paid for it.. Either way.. good luck to mario and bush.. lets see who made the right pick overall.

eheh yeah I just rolled out myself. Crap I gotta go. I am going to come back to this later.

But before I go this minute, you have to punt on the scout argument. No bones about it. One, paid scouts passed on him. And two, if that is not enough all you have to do is pull up the Draft History and find like 75% failure rate in the first round ( just using any number right now... but you can find several first rounders taken ahead of legit starters in later rounds ).

PLUS there is that 2nd round curse thing that was going for so many years. Although that is not a reasonable premise for an argument... just throwing it out there for discussing.

As far as expert analyst go:
This is the way this argument always begins and ends.
-Go to a car specialist and the specialist is usually right like 99% of the time and is dead on the rest of the way.
-Go to a football specialist and they are as erratic as three democrats, a lawyer, and a blind barber tied up in a fight about the truth, taxes, and what to cut.
http://www.nfl.com/features/tmq/021406
-Easterbrook slamming just about everyone.

So since I can just flip a coin and come up with equal or better results, we have to discount being called an expert as a deciding source.

I will get back to this turf thing a bit later. I know the soccer link is weak, but it is the only one that is conclusive scientifically speaking.

Numbskull
07-31-2006, 06:27 PM
http://www.mothcontrol.com/sc/No5short.wmv

The Dude Abides
07-31-2006, 07:03 PM
don't know if this has been posted...
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2535597
Although Bush was selected second overall, he was considered by many teams worthy of the top overall pick. But the Houston Texans (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=hou) went instead with Mario Williams (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=7750), an imposing defensive end out of Maryland, and signed him to a deal also worth as much as $62 million if incentive benchmarks are net, with about $26.5 million guaranteed.

Awesome ESPN, awesome.

CloakNNNdagger
07-31-2006, 08:25 PM
REVISED NUMBERS from last post:

A long time ago I posted how Bush would be losing financially due to income taxation differences between New Orleans and Houston. So now I’ll point out that BUSH and team SEGAL in their hard-nosed negotiations not only did NOT obtain a contract with numbers as good or better than Mario but, contra to on-the-surface popular reporting, they did not even end up with one as good as Young’s.

This is based on the fact that Texas has no state income tax.......neither does Tennessee (except for dividend and interest income). Louisiana, on the other hand, for incomes over $25,000 taxes at a rate of 6%.

Taking this into account, if we are to make “apples to apples” comparisons to Vince’s and Mario’s contracts, the following adjustments must be made right of the top.:

Lost guaranteed money -- $26,300,000 X 0.06 = $ 1,578,000
Actual guaranteed money- $26,000,000 - $1,572,000 = $24,628,000

Lost base money----------$51,000,000 X 0.06 = $ 3,060,000
Actual base money--------$51,000,000 - $3,060,000 = $47,940,000

Lost potential
“total package”---- $62,000,000 X 0.06 = $ 3,720,000
Actual potential
“Total package”---- $62,000,000 - $3,060,000= $58,940,000


Add to the above the fact that each of his spending dollars will be worth less:
Sales tax: 6.25% - Houston;
9.00% - New Orleans [difference of +2.75%]
[For example, Bush would have already lost at least 2.75% in the acquisition of his home-------an additional $50,000]




Ironically, Bush’s final contract has seen him lose monies due to the fact that the Texans’ #1 pick was Mario....and NOT him. Furthermore, “bragging rights” over being the “top dog” with the “top dog” contract of the 2006 NFL draft (which apparently was so important to Bush), has not only been eclipsed by Mario, but also Young. Fact: OUR Mario IS #1.

Now it’s time for these modern day gladiators to prove themselves on the field..............LET THE GAMES BEGIN!!!!!!!

GuerillaBlack
07-31-2006, 10:04 PM
Man you are Really OBSESSED with Reggie Bush aren't you...

And you sure as hell are obsessed with the Texans, huh?

Carr Bombed
07-31-2006, 10:16 PM
The only one thats obsessed with Bush here is you.

Your obsession has lead you to join the messageboard of another team thats not even in your division, let only your conference and make a total fool out of yourself.

Every team in this league has threads about Reggie, I've already pulled some of them up, when you said that 1 out of every 4 threads is about the Saints. Which btw is the most rediculous thing I've ever read on this board. So why don't you go troll the rest of the league, because the league is talking about your boo. Go defend your man elsewhere, I swear I've never seen such a man crush.

People here could really give a flying flip about Reggie, we'll face him once every 4 years. Like I said before the only reason why this thread has gone this long is because of your trolling.

tulexan
07-31-2006, 10:17 PM
I don't know why they keep on bringing up how Reggie was considered the best prospect. I don't remember there being such a big deal about Alex Smith being picked #1 over Braylon Edwards and other top prospects.

Numbskull
07-31-2006, 11:13 PM
I don't know why they keep on bringing up how Reggie was considered the best prospect. I don't remember there being such a big deal about Alex Smith being picked #1 over Braylon Edwards and other top prospects.

Its because yall won the Reggie Bush Sweepstakes and then did the unthinkable! :yahoo:

http://www.reggiebushsweepstakes.com/

tulexan
07-31-2006, 11:54 PM
That website is great. I remember it during the regular season.

CloakNNNdagger
07-31-2006, 11:56 PM
BroussardSaint ------- 91 of 155 posts pro-BUSH or anti-MARIO

Numbskull ------------ 43 of 44 posts pro-BUSH or anti-MARIO

Numbskull
08-01-2006, 12:24 AM
BroussardSaint ------- 91 of 155 posts pro-BUSH or anti-MARIO

Numbskull ------------ 43 of 44 posts pro-BUSH or anti-MARIO


WRONG!! I have 3x more posts that have nothing to do with Mario or Bush... Ha... nice stat collection btw... seems you have alot of time on your hands.... also... I haven't been "anti-Mario" about anything...

GuerillaBlack
08-01-2006, 12:29 AM
WRONG!! I have 3x more posts that have nothing to do with Mario or Bush... Ha... nice stat collection btw... seems you have alot of time on your hands.... also... I haven't been "anti-Mario" about anything...

He didn't say you were being "anti-Mario."

Numbskull
08-01-2006, 02:01 AM
He didn't say you were being "anti-Mario."

If not an age-limit, how about a policy that bars people that cannot read?

infantrycak
08-01-2006, 08:42 AM
If not an age-limit, how about a policy that bars people that cannot read?

There might be some merit to that idea.

Numbskull ------------ 43 of 44 posts pro-BUSH or anti-MARIO

CloakNNNdagger
08-01-2006, 08:51 AM
Numbskull ------------ 43 of 44 posts pro-BUSH or anti-MARIO

Link to Chronicle of Numbskull posts.......make your own conclusion (http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/search.php?searchid=183781)

CloakNNNdagger: 51 of 366 posts "relating to" Bush

HJam72
08-01-2006, 08:58 AM
Cloak, that link isn't working. You might wanna check on it or something.

HJam72: 2400 of 2460 posts not related to anything in the rest of the thread (or sanity in some cases). :)

CloakNNNdagger
08-01-2006, 09:28 AM
Cloak, that link isn't working. You might wanna check on it or something.

HJam72: 2400 of 2460 posts not related to anything in the rest of the thread (or sanity in some cases). :)


Sorry 'bout that.....I just checked it and it works for me. May be your computer settings? Here is the actual address see if you can directly input it into your address bar and let me know ( I had to separate the www. from the rest of the address or it would again turn into a direct link, so close the space between www. and houstontexans before placing into the address bar): www. houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/search.php?searchid=183781

Dime
08-01-2006, 09:52 AM
Over 1k post of not caring about this thread :redtowel:

TwinSisters
08-01-2006, 12:04 PM
- Soccer players have more injuries when they switch between the surfaces.. this isnt soccer.. this is a real sport. And now give me the list where FB (football) greats have gone between Turf and Grass... thank you.


http://www.podiatrytoday.com/article/774#

That should help you out a little. I mean this is just ONE doctor from back in 2002. There is certainly a debate about how relevant the new fields are to the different injury rates.

There are just as many saying we don't know yet because of the new surfaces emerging... just like the one Louisiana is going to use this year.

I looked at Bush a little closer and it looks like he has ran on both surfaces. ( grass and the exact same type that is at the Superdome, Momentum turf )

anyway here's some greats:
"Some former players have said that artificial turf is responsible for shortening their careers, due either to severe injuries caused by the turf or due to the quicker wearing down of the body over a period of time when playing on turf. And some of the game's greatest stars, such as Gayle Sayers, Billy Sims and Jack Lambert, attribute career-ending injuries to artificial turf." - Nader

and then there is the other Barry Sanders that ran on turf
BUT there is a catch.
http://www.collegefootballnews.com/Top_100_Players/Top_100_Players_16_Barry_Sanders.htm

Sanders wasn't blazing fast in a sprinter's sense, but his quickness was jaw-dropping using his short stature to go unnoticed as he skipped in and out of tacklers. At 200 pounds, he was strong enough to break anyone who tried to arm tackle him and even though he was only 5'8" tall, he had two of the most powerful legs in the history of college football."

That's not Reggie Bush... I don't think he has the legs for it. Barry had some strong legs and a lot of power.

Marshall Faulk played a lot of years on turf... he has done well, but he's not going out healthy. Faulk even looks bigger then Bush.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2443876&campaign=rss&source=NFLHeadlines
Look at him.

He just looks like a guy that is going to collect a lot of turf toe and sauna time. Like a guy that is going to have to cut and change direction more then a normal running back. A guy that will get hurt quicker too, because of that.

Naturally I could be wrong... but that's not what it is about. I have reason to be thinking Bush might not make it ( other then being a bitter boy ).

Take a look at that:
http://www.photofile.com/Photos/Photos_Of_The_Day/06_04_04/Marcus%20Allen.jpg
That's who he looks like... and guess what he says:

"That (stuff) shouldn't be anywhere," says running back Marcus Allen, referring to artificial turf. "It's like a faulty car. Sooner or later, it gets you." He should know. He suffered a blown-out knee while trying to make a cut at the Astrodome over two years ago with no player tackling him."

That's the old turf though... but still makes me think he might not make it.

GuerillaBlack
08-01-2006, 12:54 PM
If not an age-limit, how about a policy that bars people that cannot read?

I think your the one who needs to learn how to read.

Numbskull ------------ 43 of 44 posts pro-BUSH or anti-MARIO

KKHouston
08-01-2006, 02:02 PM
All of this speculation by these bitter boys has been a bunch of BS. They want to justify the pick of Williams even further than "we needed him more." They want to prove RB as a "headcase" that they were better off without anyway. The truth, the haters are all just bitter boys.

This is the most ridiculous, childish post I've read in a long time.

FACT: Reggie is not the back you think he is. Simply go back to his history, and check his stats. USC plays in a notoriously weak defensive conference.

FACT: If Reggie were all that and a bag of chips, why did he have such a poor showing against the Longhorns? Seems to me my go-to guy would get playing time. Lendale White was the man in that game.

FACT: Reggie has questionable character. Not for taking the Booster's house, but for denying he did it. Classic "Not me" defense.

FACT: He's not an every down back. The Saints ARE weak, and have been for years. One player won't turn the team around. Especially Reggie.

The Saints will be moving soon.

Not hating on Mr. Bush, but he's not going to be all you need. Not with the Owner, and fans, you have.

KKHouston
08-02-2006, 12:31 PM
i love how a Texan fan calls the Saints "weak"

enjoy picking first again next year.

Actually, I'm a Broncos Fan, first. A Texans' fan second.

C'mon... you can't be serious. You have the all-time worst team in the NFL, and have since 1967. That's a lot of pressure you're putting on Mr. Bush... player or not. We're pulling for you. It's time for you to go home, now.

Bye bye!

Numbskull
08-03-2006, 12:25 AM
I think your the one who needs to learn how to read.

Since you are young and naive to what he is doing, I'll give you a quick lesson.

He implied that I am "anti-Mario" because of my affection for Mr. Bush. He did not come right out and say it, he implied it. He's basically called me an "anti-Mario" troll, when all I have done is defended the character of Mr. Bush

Watch:

GuerillaBlack - 30 of 34 posts pro-France or anti-American.

See, I am framing that being for pro-France is inherently anti-American. You might have traveled to France before and loved it, but that doesn't make you anti-American. So what do you do when I say that? Object that you are not anti-American of course because I am framing you in a negative light.

Hookem Horns
08-03-2006, 12:39 AM
Please continue this thread here ...

http://saintsreport.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=48

Numbskull
08-03-2006, 02:01 AM
This is the most ridiculous, childish post I've read in a long time.

The Saints will be moving soon.

Not hating on Mr. Bush, but he's not going to be all you need. Not with the Owner, and fans, you have.

This post is pure drivel. The hatred for Reggie Bush here comes from a cross section of your fanbase which is still bitter over his agent's hardball line when it came to negotiate a contract back in April.

Also, introducing your slanted opinions as "FACTS" is as lame as it gets. By leading off each opinion with "FACT", you are basically highlighting to me that you are completely full of your own crap.

Here are my thoughts on your so-called "FACTS":

FACT: Reggie is not the back you think he is. Simply go back to his history, and check his stats. USC plays in a notoriously weak defensive conference.

Oh. So it is a fact that he isn't the back that I think he is and he is the back you think he is. Right. I've checked his stats. I've seen him play since his freshman year. He's improved each year he has played and is coming off the most individually dominant season of college football that I have ever seen. Weak defenses? This has already been explored. LT played a schedule which is half as tough as the one Reggie faced last year, but that didn't stop him did it? When he played, he dominated (period)

FACT: If Reggie were all that and a bag of chips, why did he have such a poor showing against the Longhorns? Seems to me my go-to guy would get playing time. Lendale White was the man in that game.

This is another one of your dull slanted opinions. When Shaq is dominating a team and scoring almost at will and you are leading, do you think Phil Jackson says "Shaq is killing them and we're winning, but man I need to get Kobe the ball so he can get some shots" ? Heck no. He keeps feeding the big man until they show him that they can stop him. Lendale was having a career game against the Longhorns and dominating, so why take him out? I could possibly see your point of "why wasn't he in" if Lendale wasn't walking all over their defense.

Also, Reggie Bush did not have a poor showing. He did make one mind-numbing mental error which cost his team, but the lateral was an abberation in his game; he's no Aaron Brooks.

The Longhorns did not shut him down either in the least. His final line read:

13 Carries: 82 Yards: 6.3 Yard Average: 1 TD
6 Receptions: 93 Yards: 15.8 Yard Average

How is 175 all-purpose yards being shut down? I guess that Reggie must be in a whole different class if you call that being shut down.

FACT: Reggie has questionable character. Not for taking the Booster's house, but for denying he did it. Classic "Not me" defense.

So what he should do is say "I'm Guilty" and then throw his former team under the bus like a cheating ex-girlfriend? Did he do it? Probably. Is there anything criminal about it. No. It underminds the idea of college athletics, but its not like he has a history of domestic abuse or has a history of DWI. He has been well spoken and humble, and since he was drafted by NO has shown also to be incredibly charitable. So his parents got free housing (scumbag).. BFD....

FACT: He's not an every down back. The Saints ARE weak, and have been for years. One player won't turn the team around. Especially Reggie.

You are a very casual fan if you don't think he can handle the load as a #1 back. He doesn't have to anyway at this point in his career, so I don't know why that is even up for discussion.

You are correct that one player will not turn a team around by himself, but the inertia created by adding a star player of Reggie's calibur can. The only reason I could think that you'd say "Especially Reggie" is that you among the faction of bitter Texan fans I was talking about earlier.

---------------------------

I hate to say it, but I'd be a fool to not recognize that the Saints are a prime candidate for relocation. So far though, we've done our best to kill that candicy by selling the most season tickets in our team's entire 40 year history. I don't think thats bad for a city a year removed from the greatest natural disaster in U.S. history.

Its OK. I would not expect you to have any empathy for the region's and my own insecurities about our team's longterm viability in New Orleans, as you would have no idea what its like to have to think of your own childhood team moving. Wait....

Numbskull
08-03-2006, 02:06 AM
Please continue this thread here ...

http://saintsreport.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=48

Why even bother posting? If you do not want to be part of the discussion, then ignore the thread. Go troll somewhere else.

swtbound07
08-03-2006, 02:48 AM
Why even bother posting? If you do not want to be part of the discussion, then ignore the thread. Go troll somewhere else.


You hear that? The Reggie Bush troll says please stop trolling....funny guy, this one.

I said my piece on Reggie the other night, and truthfully thought I was rid of you. But for the (hopefully) LAST TIME!

1) I NEVER WANTED REGGIE. All this talk about bitterness about not having him is complete BS...I have a history of not wanting him before the draft, and if you want to research it then go ahead. Find me posting and saying I WANT REGGIE at ANY time and then we can talk....go ahead....we have a search feature..i will wait.......

2) I did the numbers for you to prove that Reggie isn't all that great. Until somebody takes me down off those numbers, then i've backed up my claims.

Numbskull
08-03-2006, 03:29 AM
"Reggie Bush will never be the player David Carr is in the NFL. He is overhyped, overrated, would have been a terrible draft choice, IS in fact a terrible draft choice for new orleans, will be out of the nfl in 3 years, will haunt the saints salary cap for years to come, and will be mentioned in the same sentence with Kijana Carter from here to eternity. If you support the saints, like the saints, like reggie bush, or disagree with me, feel free to not respond. I don't care that you think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread. He is not as valuable as Andre Johnson. He is not as valuable as Travis Johnson. There were 7 rounds worth of players I would have passed Reggie Bush for, and a slew of UDFA. You couldn't pay me to play Reggie Bush. The Saints gave in to ESPN peer pressure and spent 50 million dollars on a roster that currently had duece mcallister, antowain smith, and michael bennett on it. You have a deplorable owner, and apparently a general manager who studied under the tutelage of Charlie Casserly. Julius Peppers, Derrick Brooks, and John Abraham are just some of the many players who will be ripping your new, expensive little toy's head off come september. Congratulations on getting him into camp without him making you rename the stadium after him. Before you start making the tired arguement that Im bitter we passed on him, do a little research. I've been anti-reggie for going on about 10 months now. I don't want him, and I jumped out of my chair in delight when I found out we didn't get him. Now please, can we get back to watching REAL football players instead of this bum?"

Until you strike out this post as an attempt to be humorous and absurd, I don't really feel like I have to argue with you. This post is so ridiculous and absurd that I don't need to argue with you about your "proven" point. You have proven yourself a fool in my eyes if you actually believe all this drivel and I don't get into arguments with fools. It would be a pointless waste of my time.

swtbound07
08-03-2006, 03:53 AM
Until you strike out this post as an attempt to be humorous and absurd, I don't really feel like I have to argue with you. This post is so ridiculous and absurd that I don't need to argue with you about your "proven" point. You have proven yourself a fool in my eyes if you actually believe all this drivel and I don't get into arguments with fools. It would be a pointless waste of my time.

Sir that post was dead serious...and i think if you set up a poll about who the bigger fool is in this arguement, I would come out WELL ahead. You don't argue with me because you cant, not because you choose not to.

HoustonFan
08-03-2006, 08:02 AM
'Bout damn time they got that deal done. Hindsight is always 20/20 - worried about DD right about now. But then again no one knows what the future holds. Another one of the RBs (or both) for the Texans could step up, big time which is ALWAYS good.

Hoping that Bush steps it up for NO. I see D. Brees and Buch having the lind of success D. Brees and LT were having in San Diego.

infantrycak
08-03-2006, 08:27 AM
This thread has far outlived any utility. Rather than editing out the misbehavior, I am going to close the thread and let it be an example of how not to behave to visiting fans. We do not tolerate all the insults being thrown back and forth (swt--I know you were responding, but you know better--pm a mod instead next time). Normally fans of other teams are more than welcome here but this trollish obsession with defending perceived slights to Reggie Bush is out of hand and serves no purpose. You Saints/Bush fans can stick around, but only if you lose the insults and tone down telling everyone else what they think about Bush.