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View Full Version : Another Carr Thread - Let's make it the last until the Season starts.


Avenged Sevenfold Texan
07-23-2006, 09:04 AM
Let's list who is a Carr supporter or basher and be done with it til the Season starts.

:ok:

Kaiser Toro
07-23-2006, 09:12 AM
I am a Texan fan first. Carr is our starting QB and second highest paid player on the team. We need him not to make any mistakes when he gets an opportunity to do his job and we need him to work us out of a jam every once in a while when other's miss their assignments.

Texan Asylum
07-23-2006, 09:21 AM
I am Pro-Texans...that will include everyone on the team till they're not with us anymore. I'm a homer to a fault, but that's me. I think, and hope, that Carr will turn into everyone's quarterback before season's end. :)

RTP2110
07-23-2006, 09:32 AM
Well here's the only problem. Even though there are plenty of Carr detractors on the boards, I don't think anyone is really rooting against him. Even though some people don't like Carr or have lost faith in him, I think they still want him to do well for the Texans. I'm sure they'd gladly eat any crow you can give them if Carr has a breakout season.

threetoedpete
07-23-2006, 09:36 AM
Well here's the only problem. Even though there are plenty of Carr detractors on the boards, I don't think anyone is really rooting against him. Even though some people don't like Carr or have lost faith in him, I think they still want him to do well for the Texans. I'm sure they'd gladly eat any crow you can give them if Carr has a breakout season.
Never underestimate the power of thr VY manlove Luke.

kikiscafe
07-23-2006, 09:44 AM
I am Pro-Texans...that will include everyone on the team till they're not with us anymore. I'm a homer to a fault, but that's me. I think, and hope, that Carr will turn into everyone's quarterback before season's end. :)

Totally agree. I just read John McClain article about Troy Aikman :

Troy on Norv (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/4065525.html)
When former Cowboys quarterback Troy Aikman joins the Pro Football Hall of Fame next month, he'll be presented by his former offensive coordinator, Norv Turner

"In all the years I played football, and for the 12 years I played for the Cowboys, Norv was a part of that for three years," Aikman said. "And yet I don't think there's any question that I wouldn't have become the player I was able to become. I certainly would not be getting inducted into the Hall of Fame if it weren't for his impact.

"He came in at a time when I was a young quarterback going into my third season, had struggled my first few years and needed some guidance, needed somebody to kind of show me how to do it, and put me in a system that allowed me to do the things that I could do. And he did that."

I hope Kubiak is the "Norv Turner" for David Car.

BigDTexansFan
07-23-2006, 09:48 AM
Never underestimate the power of thr VY manlove Luke.


AMEN!!!!!

we should start a pool to see when Bud The Crud trots VY into game because of Billy Volek interception/loss ETC.:redtowel:

Texan Asylum
07-23-2006, 09:57 AM
Totally agree. I just read John McClain article about Troy Aikman :

Troy on Norv (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/4065525.html)
When former Cowboys quarterback Troy Aikman joins the Pro Football Hall of Fame next month, he'll be presented by his former offensive coordinator, Norv Turner

"In all the years I played football, and for the 12 years I played for the Cowboys, Norv was a part of that for three years," Aikman said. "And yet I don't think there's any question that I wouldn't have become the player I was able to become. I certainly would not be getting inducted into the Hall of Fame if it weren't for his impact.

"He came in at a time when I was a young quarterback going into my third season, had struggled my first few years and needed some guidance, needed somebody to kind of show me how to do it, and put me in a system that allowed me to do the things that I could do. And he did that."

I hope Kubiak is the "Norv Turner" for David Car.

Bravo Kiki, thanks for the post.:) I especially like the part following...

Kubiak in charge
With new coach Gary Kubiak in charge of the Texans, players better beware.

"If a player doesn't fit what they're doing, they won't keep him around because he was a high pick or cost a lot of money to acquire," owner Bob McNair said.

Former offensive tackle Todd Wade is a good example. He got a $10 million signing bonus to come to the Texans from the Dolphins and was waived last week.

"He'll get signed by somebody, and he might play real well for them, but our coaches determined that he didn't fit our system and — boom — it was done," McNair said. "They (new coaches) don't worry about things like how high somebody was drafted or how much money they cost.

"Gary's philosophy is the best people play. If you don't have that philosophy, it undermines morale."

That should be an indicator that the current mindset of the Texans is one of WINNING.

Texans_Chick
07-23-2006, 10:05 AM
I voted "Go Carr!"

I'm a Texans fan first and want what's best for the team. Personally, I don't know if he is The Man or not, but given Kubiak willing to stake his career on him based on conversations and tape, I'm just looking forward to seeing how this works out.

I think his skill sets are a good match for the system Kubiak is putting in. I have the questions that a lot of people have, link (http://blogs.chron.com/fanblogtexans/2006/07/texans_2006_the_bad_news_and_t.html), but at this point they are questions.

I believe no quarterback would have thrived under the system and players we've had in place.

It's not a debate I'm terribly interested in getting in because: 1. He's the QB; 2. Draft is over and there are no viable alternatives; 3. So let's just sit back and watch and see if the experts are right.

There has been some horrible QB play and glimpses of what is possible. It will be interesting what our experiment of being patient ends up looking like.

I think for most people here, nothing would make them happier than Carr succeeding and the Texans succeeding along with him. Would be a great story.

Texans_Chick
07-23-2006, 10:10 AM
"Gary's philosophy is the best people play. If you don't have that philosophy, it undermines morale."

This is one of the reasons why Rod Smith thinks Gary Kubiak has hung the moon. He was undrafted, and has had a great career with Denver.

BigDTexansFan
07-23-2006, 10:14 AM
could be worse could have a 34 year old mobility challenged QB (I didn't say Bledsoe/Dallas):crutch:

PapaL
07-23-2006, 10:14 AM
10 out of 10 Texans fans vote "Go Carr". He should start blossoming this year.

The Pencil Neck
07-23-2006, 12:39 PM
As several other people have said, I'm a Texan fan. Carr is my QB and I'm rooting for him. He had a good season a couple of years ago and I think he's got all the tools he needs to be successful. I worry that the beating he's taken is going to get into his head and he'd damaged emotionally. I don't really understand the fans that are virulently anti-Carr. I've probably been more pro-Carr on this board than I normally would have been in reaction to the people who hate him.

But, really, the bottom line is that we brought in a new coaching staff and they've made the call that Carr can make it. It's a bit too early for me to start doubting the new coaching staff. They had every opportunity to ditch him and start fresh and chose not to. That may or may not have been a mistake but, as fans, isn't it our duty to root for him and cheer him on instead of bashing him and calling him the worst QB in the Superbowl era? (Which is in itself an ridiculous statement.)

Wolf
07-23-2006, 12:53 PM
I voted other..

I have no choice to vote other until I can see what Kubiak can do. I have stated in the past, I believe Carr has all the tools to make pretty much anythrow on the field. I just need to see if he believes it and that is Kubiaks job to get David "deprogrammed" and trust his teammates and his teammates trusting him. Once he does that, he will be looking downfield instead of looking at the rush. Right now his mindset (and David did say it) was look at 1st option, then DD ... I don't blame him due to the lack of pass blocking at times and other times the alarm went off in Carr's head that he needs to start running even when he had decent pass protection.

I believe in what I hear from the coaching staff , yet I am cautious, because I remember last season talking about how the defensive line was faster,thinner and getting after it and the offense looked better; yet when the season started, we weren't prepared for the train wreck that was going to happen.. I am still cautious on what is said with this new staff, yet I have some faith inside of me.. This is easiest the most talent we have had on the offensive side of the ball (coaching and players)

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 01:02 PM
Can't stand Carr, will spend this entire offseason lamenting his resigning...but as I've said before...Come that first Sunday, I don't care if Adolf Hitler straps on the uniform, he is a Texan and I will cheer for him...but this offseason Im airing out all my grievances against David...make no mistake, Im sure he will fail. I hope Im wrong, but Im pretty sure Im not.

PapaL
07-23-2006, 01:13 PM
Can't stand Carr, will spend this entire offseason lamenting his resigning...but as I've said before...Come that first Sunday, I don't care if Adolf Hitler straps on the uniform, he is a Texan and I will cheer for him...but this offseason Im airing out all my grievances against David...make no mistake, Im sure he will fail. I hope Im wrong, but Im pretty sure Im not.

Hopefully Adolf has something better to be doing on Sundays instead of QB'ing our Offense, lol. :challenge (Reminds me Hitler)

Tx'nFanLostInSkinCountry
07-23-2006, 01:36 PM
Voted Go Carr. we shall see how the season plays out.

thunderkyss
07-23-2006, 02:34 PM
I hope Carr get's the job done..... and doesn't look like a rookie.


I will root for him to succeed, but I'll probably start a thread everytime he screws up.......

Texan Asylum
07-23-2006, 03:50 PM
I voted "Go Carr!"
I am a fan of the Texans and have been discouraged at Carr's performance as well as the teams performance over the past few years.

Which brings me to my next point...
I am also disappointed with MY performance last night on the "Carr-Basher" Thread. I lashed out at gpshafer (I think that was his name) in a way that I'm disgusted with.

It was wholely inappropriate and I'd like to apologize to him.

I was shocked to find myself on a board that stated that I "Hated Carr." I don't hate anyone! I lashed out in "the flesh" and hope that you guys don't think less of me. I was angry and wanted to put him "in his place." Not right! Totally wrong! Not a Christian thing to have done...AT ALL!

Sorry to all!
Go Texans!
It's all good brother. We've all had to mend some fences in the past, I've gotten pretty good at mending fences here lately.

As for the vote...I voter "Go Carr" as well.

NoBullTexan
07-23-2006, 03:53 PM
Not too bad. Everybody except potstirrer pretty much gave David their support, and of course with a name like that how else could he have voted? Thing I don't like is the "I hate Carr". Why exactly? Was it because, on 99% of the sacks, he had less than 2 seconds, forget the 4 second norm, to get the ball off? Is it because the QB is the most visible person in an offense, and thus is given way too much credit when things go right, and way, way too much disrespect when things go wrong? Or that he had an offensive line that had been neglected by Capers and his drafting buddies for the whole time you could call the Texans a pro football team. And was it Carr's fault that Caper's was loyal to a fault to his coaches, especially the worlds worst offensive line coach, and offensive coordinator, Pendy? No, I think potstirrer just likes to think of himself in the limelight by stirring his smug little pot. Pitiful.

I voted GO CARR! And I will outright guarantee you, that with Kubiak for a HC, and Sherman as the offensive line coach, and assistant HC, David Carr will rock!!!

mancunian
07-23-2006, 03:56 PM
Let's list who is a Carr supporter or basher and be done with it til the Season starts.

:ok:

I voted Carr, the success of the team is intrinsically linked with his

Buffi2
07-23-2006, 03:56 PM
I voted for Carr - big surprise there.

There is one thing that is being overlooked. Let us not underestimate what resolve can do for a person whose career is on the line. DC isn't going to go down without a fight. He doesn't live in a cave and all of this negativity swarming about him has surely made an impact. I think we are all going to see a bigger and better David Carr. He will give this season everything he has and if it isn't enuf - so be it - but I, for one, think he is going to succeed.

We may not make the playoffs this year, but we will play some awesome football with heart. I would bet money on that..if I had any.:rolleyes:

GP
07-23-2006, 05:10 PM
I voted "Go Carr!"
I am a fan of the Texans and have been discouraged at Carr's performance as well as the teams performance over the past few years.

Which brings me to my next point...
I am also disappointed with MY performance last night on the "Carr-Basher" Thread. I lashed out at gpshafer (I think that was his name) in a way that I'm disgusted with.

It was wholely inappropriate and I'd like to apologize to him.

I was shocked to find myself on a board that stated that I "Hated Carr." I don't hate anyone! I lashed out in "the flesh" and hope that you guys don't think less of me. I was angry and wanted to put him "in his place." Not right! Totally wrong! Not a Christian thing to have done...AT ALL!

Sorry to all!
Go Texans!

No apologies needed. Thanks for the kind thoughts, though.

I, too, was at a place (during the first few weeks of 2005 season) where I was fed up with David Carr. And I, too, wanted to vent my frustrations. But then I got to see how the whole team was just imploding under the weight of an outmatched coaching staff...and I gained a whole new level of understanding for not just David Carr, but for the whole team of PLAYERS.

Now we have a coaching staff that appears to know what today's NFL is all about, and I think Carr will do a lot better.

But some fans are holding a serious grudge against the guy for a number of reasons, most of which involve the Texans NOT taking Vince Young...a guy whom the anti-Carr crowd is in serious love with. That's a whole 'nother subject in of itself...but the point is that I support the front office when they say that Carr was not the problem--The coaching staff was.

Go Texans!

GP
07-23-2006, 05:12 PM
I voted Carr, the success of the team is intrinsically linked with his

VERY well said.

M@DD Mike
07-23-2006, 05:34 PM
Coach Kubiak turned Plummer's game around and I know DC can be a lot better than him.

Brandon420tx
07-23-2006, 05:51 PM
but the point is that I support the front office when they say that Carr was not the problem--The coaching staff was.


Feel the same way, I will not bash anyone on the Texans for the next 2 years (Unless they make a bonehead play to deserve it or somehow Corey Bradford moseys his way back onto the team) Go Carr baby!

I think all of the players (Not just Carr) are having a "must prove themselves year" so lets support all of them (Yes, even P-buc)

:dance: :logo:

CajunTexan
07-23-2006, 06:44 PM
I voted "Go Carr!"
I am a fan of the Texans and have been discouraged at Carr's performance as well as the teams performance over the past few years.

Which brings me to my next point...
I am also disappointed with MY performance last night on the "Carr-Basher" Thread. I lashed out at gpshafer (I think that was his name) in a way that I'm disgusted with.

It was wholely inappropriate and I'd like to apologize to him.

I was shocked to find myself on a board that stated that I "Hated Carr." I don't hate anyone! I lashed out in "the flesh" and hope that you guys don't think less of me. I was angry and wanted to put him "in his place." Not right! Totally wrong! Not a Christian thing to have done...AT ALL!

Sorry to all!
Go Texans!

Nice, "Blue"...

I voted "go Carr." I think the 4 years of experience, good, bad and ugly, along with his physical tools, were the over riding factors in Kubiaks confidence in Carr.

Mark it down, Carr will excel in the Kubiak led offense.

TexanFan881
07-23-2006, 07:02 PM
I thought that that other Carr bashers thread should have a poll so this is good. I don't think it should be Go Carr or No Carr I think it should be Carr will succeed or Carr will fail. But anyways...

I have confidence in the new staff. I have confidence in Gary Kubiak. If Gary says that Carr has a lot of talent and he will be a good QB for us, then I'm going to take his word for it and not the word of a bunch of people not even close to the situation. If anyone knows it's Gary and he's worked with some good QBs so he knows what characteristics a good QB has. Carr is going to be a good one.

Go Carr! :texflag:

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 08:34 PM
Apparently I stand alone as the one NO.......oh well. I have faith in Sage Rosenfels...for whatever that counts for.

chuckm
07-23-2006, 08:59 PM
if you voted "No Carr" you don't belong on this message board ....

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 09:07 PM
if you voted "No Carr" you don't belong on this message board ....


Why is that exactly?

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:09 PM
Why is that exactly?


because like it or not, Vince Young or not, he's the Texans's starting QB ..... if you're rooting for him to fail then you need to move on

Kaiser Toro
07-23-2006, 09:15 PM
if you voted "No Carr" you don't belong on this message board ....

I must have missed that guideline when I registered for the board a couple of years ago.

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:16 PM
I must have missed that guideline when I registered for the board a couple of years ago.



If you're rooting for the QB of the Texans to fail, you're wasting your time ..... of course it is YOUR time .....

Kaiser Toro
07-23-2006, 09:19 PM
If you're rooting for the QB of the Texans to fail, you're wasting your time ..... of course it is YOUR time .....

Great, just wanted to get that cleared up. However, Spicoli would say it is OUR time.

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:20 PM
Great, just wanted to get that cleared up. However, Spicoli would say it is OUR time.


man I wish I had some pizza right now .....

CajunTexan
07-23-2006, 09:22 PM
man I wish I had some pizza right now .....

And "learning about History"....man how easily you guys digress.....

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:23 PM
And "learning about History"....man how easily you guys digress.....


digression is what keeps us sane .... at least what keeps ME sane

WiiBrawler
07-23-2006, 09:30 PM
I voted go Carr, I think what we have is good and is what David needs to suceed

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 09:30 PM
because like it or not, Vince Young or not, he's the Texans's starting QB ..... if you're rooting for him to fail then you need to move on

Depth Charts haven't been posted yet fellow...Im still hoping for Rosenfels to be the darkhorse. Im not rooting for him to fail, im EXPECTING it. There is a difference mind you. Im sick of watching sub-par performance. I can hear the excuses next year already ringing in my head

1) That was Carr's first year with a real QB coach and a new system...he will need time to be comfortable...but after 2007, if he STILL sucks, then we'll look at trying out some other folks at the spot.
2) The texans had a rough schedule...no QB would have done well in that situation
3) Carr had a hard time adjusting to the departure of his friend Dom Capers....he played poorly out of sadness
4) Carr looked amazing on that one drive against philly on opening day! you know, the one where the texans recovered a fumble at the Philly 10! He went 3-3 for 9 yards and a TD...that showed the brilliance of what david carr can do when you let him play his style of football
5) Carr is most comfortable playing at 75.39 degrees at kickoff, and the Reliant Stadium thermostat was set to 75.32.....he couldn't adjust in time.

Im sure there will be others, just as ridiculous as the drivel being spouted this offseason. Im not rooting for carr to fail as much as reminding everyone that it will happen. Sorry folks, my optimism is reserved for beyonce reading my fanmail.

CajunTexan
07-23-2006, 09:31 PM
digression is what keeps us sane .... at least what keeps ME sane

chuckm...how is this for digression...I am 1 year older than you...you have been a member of this board for 1 year longer than me...and I have only 10% of the total posts you have....how is that for digression....(could be wine indussed)

tsip
07-23-2006, 09:32 PM
actually, the results of this poll are sad because one side has been intimidated so much it is not voting, IMO--not a good day for Democracy!!...but the season is almost here !

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:33 PM
chuckm...how is this for digression...I am 1 year older than you...you have been a member of this board for 1 year longer than me...and I have only 10% of the total posts you have....how is that for digression....(could be wine indussed)



red or white? digression trumped

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:37 PM
Depth Charts haven't been posted yet fellow...Im still hoping for Rosenfels to be the darkhorse. Im not rooting for him to fail, im EXPECTING it. There is a difference mind you. Im sick of watching sub-par performance. I can hear the excuses next year already ringing in my head

1) That was Carr's first year with a real QB coach and a new system...he will need time to be comfortable...but after 2007, if he STILL sucks, then we'll look at trying out some other folks at the spot.
2) The texans had a rough schedule...no QB would have done well in that situation
3) Carr had a hard time adjusting to the departure of his friend Dom Capers....he played poorly out of sadness
4) Carr looked amazing on that one drive against philly on opening day! you know, the one where the texans recovered a fumble at the Philly 10! He went 3-3 for 9 yards and a TD...that showed the brilliance of what david carr can do when you let him play his style of football
5) Carr is most comfortable playing at 75.39 degrees at kickoff, and the Reliant Stadium thermostat was set to 75.32.....he couldn't adjust in time.

Im sure there will be others, just as ridiculous as the drivel being spouted this offseason. Im not rooting for carr to fail as much as reminding everyone that it will happen. Sorry folks, my optimism is reserved for beyonce reading my fanmail.


whatever ...... when the Texans square off with the Eagles, I'll rooting for the Texans .....

CajunTexan
07-23-2006, 09:38 PM
red or white? digression trumped

red...better for the ole "ticker".....digression double trumped

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 09:39 PM
whatever ...... when the Texans square off with the Eagles, I'll rooting for the Texans .....

Im rooting for the TEXANS too! we are on the same side....we just disagree on what that side needs to do to win.

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:40 PM
red...better for the ole "ticker".....digression double trumped


not with seafood I hope ...... that might require some negative rep

CajunTexan
07-23-2006, 09:40 PM
Depth Charts haven't been posted yet fellow...Im still hoping for Rosenfels to be the darkhorse. Im not rooting for him to fail, im EXPECTING it. There is a difference mind you. Im sick of watching sub-par performance. I can hear the excuses next year already ringing in my head

1) That was Carr's first year with a real QB coach and a new system...he will need time to be comfortable...but after 2007, if he STILL sucks, then we'll look at trying out some other folks at the spot.
2) The texans had a rough schedule...no QB would have done well in that situation
3) Carr had a hard time adjusting to the departure of his friend Dom Capers....he played poorly out of sadness
4) Carr looked amazing on that one drive against philly on opening day! you know, the one where the texans recovered a fumble at the Philly 10! He went 3-3 for 9 yards and a TD...that showed the brilliance of what david carr can do when you let him play his style of football
5) Carr is most comfortable playing at 75.39 degrees at kickoff, and the Reliant Stadium thermostat was set to 75.32.....he couldn't adjust in time.

Im sure there will be others, just as ridiculous as the drivel being spouted this offseason. Im not rooting for carr to fail as much as reminding everyone that it will happen. Sorry folks, my optimism is reserved for beyonce reading my fanmail.

07...do you REALLY believe Sage is better option than Carr???!!! I am sure you are one of those that believed that Banks or Ragone was a better option last year????

By the way, what are Tony and "Little Dave" doing these days????

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 09:42 PM
07...do you REALLY believe Sage is better option than Carr???!!! I am sure you are one of those that believed that Banks or Ragone was a better option last year????

By the way, what are Tony and "Little Dave" doing these days????

Sir I don't think you could find a worse option than David Carr at this point. If you have Ryan Leaf's number at this point, feel free to give him a ring, cause I would rather watch that 100 times out of 100. I really believe Sage is the better option.

CajunTexan
07-23-2006, 09:42 PM
not with seafood I hope ...... that might require some negative rep

Of course not...burgers...on the grill....we do have some wine learnin' here in LA.....

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:43 PM
Of course not...burgers...on the grill....we do have some wine learnin' here in LA.....


rep posted .....

CajunTexan
07-23-2006, 09:45 PM
Sir I don't think you could find a worse option than David Carr at this point. If you have Ryan Leaf's number at this point, feel free to give him a ring, cause I would rather watch that 100 times out of 100. I really believe Sage is the better option.

I am sure Ryan is playing golf with your other favorite options, Tony and Dave.

07...do you realize how you are discrediting your view (to me at least, can't speak for the entire board) the deeper you go on with this????

chuckm
07-23-2006, 09:46 PM
Sir I don't think you could find a worse option than David Carr at this point. If you have Ryan Leaf's number at this point, feel free to give him a ring, cause I would rather watch that 100 times out of 100. I really believe Sage is the better option.


swt, you're consistent if nothing else ..... I trust you'll stick around to take your butt whipping if Kubiak can turn this around .... I'll be here either way .... peace

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 09:48 PM
I am sure Ryan is playing golf with your other favorite options, Tony and Dave.

07...do you realize how you are discrediting your view (to me at least, can't speak for the entire board) the deeper you go on with this????


Feel free to ask anybody who's been around this board awhile what they think about my views. You might not agree with me, but I doubt you'll find a person here who doesn't respect my consistency, and my ability to back up my positions and my ability to admit when I was wrong. I believe Dave Ragone is a St. Louis Ram, FWIW

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 09:49 PM
swt, you're consistent if nothing else ..... I trust you'll stick around to take your butt whipping if Kubiak can turn this around .... I'll be here either way .... peace

I'll be here Chuck...and I hope everyone who has been negatively beating my rep will comeback and give me some positive if Im proven correct.

thunderkyss
07-23-2006, 10:10 PM
because like it or not, Vince Young or not, he's the Texans's starting QB ..... if you're rooting for him to fail then you need to move on

Voting No Carr, should be just like no Victor Riley, no Todd Wade, no Gary Walker, or no Marcus Coleman....


was it okay for those people to be on this message board when those guys were on the team.

TexansLucky13
07-23-2006, 10:16 PM
we are on the same side....we just disagree on what that side needs to do to win.

I think I heard John Kerry say something of the same thing when they asked him about the War on Terror before the 2004 elections... :hmmm:

I am the polar opposite of Mr. SWTBound, and he knows it. We have swapped interesting posts time and time again with no result. I will defend David Carr until I am the last man standing. I saw the talent in him before and I won't let Dum Capers mishaps or any schmuck discredit his abilities.

Hopefully this is the very last Carr thread until we can start talking about gameday performance, 2006. I expect at least a dozen more before preseason, though.

SWTBound, you are a good debate partner. But we just can't seem to agree on anything! Shucks!

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 10:19 PM
I think I heard John Kerry say something of the same thing when they asked him about the War on Terror before the 2004 elections... :hmmm:

I am the polar opposite of Mr. SWTBound, and he knows it. We have swapped interesting posts time and time again with no result. I will defend David Carr until I am the last man standing. I saw the talent in him before and I won't let Dum Capers mishaps or any schmuck discredit his abilities.

Hopefully this is the very last Carr thread until we can start talking about gameday performance, 2006. I expect at least a dozen more before preseason, though.

SWTBound, you are a good debate partner. But we just can't seem to agree on anything! Shucks!


Likewise...you keep it civil and refrain from the "your not a true fan" drivel that gets spouted on here. And just for the record, Im not the one that starts all these David Carr threads...I just potstir and contribute

TexansLucky13
07-23-2006, 10:23 PM
Likewise...you keep it civil and refrain from the "your not a true fan" drivel that gets spouted on here. And just for the record, Im not the one that starts all these David Carr threads...I just potstir and contribute

You know i'm up for a good 'ol potstirrin' any day of the week! Makes for good conversation... at least when we aren't in the same room, hehe. :ouch:

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 10:30 PM
You know i'm up for a good 'ol potstirrin' any day of the week! Makes for good conversation... at least when we aren't in the same room, hehe. :ouch:

Yeah, I would hate to see you carried out on a stretcher:stirpot:

Koolaid Time
07-23-2006, 10:31 PM
Well here's the only problem. Even though there are plenty of Carr detractors on the boards, I don't think anyone is really rooting against him. Even though some people don't like Carr or have lost faith in him, I think they still want him to do well for the Texans. I'm sure they'd gladly eat any crow you can give them if Carr has a breakout season.

David Carr needs three things to succeed as the Texans Quarterback:

1. An offensive line that only gives up 30 sacks this season.
2. A good psychiatrist to help him get his head together.
3. Fans that will give him a chance past the second quarter of the first game of the season.

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 10:33 PM
David Carr needs three things to succeed as the Texans Quarterback:

1. An offensive line that only gives up 30 sacks this season.
2. A good psychiatrist to help him get his head together.
3. Fans that will give him a chance past the second quarter of the first game of the season.

You seriously just blamed the FANS??????? Donovan Mcnabb was booed from the DRAFT...they didn't even give him a snap in Philly, and he turned out just fine....we are 5 years deep into the Carr experiment and suddenly its our fault for not fully supporting him?? Ridiculous.

Hutch13
07-23-2006, 10:33 PM
im neutral on him. I think with the right weapons and a solid offensive line he can be a pretty good QB.

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 10:34 PM
An interesting side note...my opinion carries exactly 1.96% of the weight of this poll...i feel powerfull!

TexansLucky13
07-23-2006, 10:57 PM
Yeah, I would hate to see you carried out on a stretcher:stirpot:

Hehe... dream on, pal. :rolleyes:

An interesting side note...my opinion carries exactly 1.96% of the weight of this poll...i feel powerfull!

I know that makes you feel special. All 98.04% of us are happy to accommodate you!

Carr is roxor and you know it. Stop being silly! :loser

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 11:00 PM
Hehe... dream on, pal. :rolleyes:



I know that makes you feel special. All 98.04% of us are happy to accommodate you!

Carr is roxor and you know it. Stop being silly! :loser


I dont even know what that means sir....but if it means good QB then your wrong.

TexansLucky13
07-23-2006, 11:02 PM
I dont even know what that means sir....but if it means good QB then your wrong.

See folks? I try! :francis:

David rox your sox, twice!

thunderkyss
07-23-2006, 11:03 PM
You seriously just blamed the FANS??????? Donovan Mcnabb was booed from the DRAFT...they didn't even give him a snap in Philly, and he turned out just fine....we are 5 years deep into the Carr experiment and suddenly its our fault for not fully supporting him?? Ridiculous.


Donovan also never had a single 1000 yard reciever, till he got T.O.

His Offensive line is porous, if he wasn't athletic, he'd have been sacked at least 60 times a season.

And his team has only once(that I can remember) had a running back with over 1000 rushing yards..... (I could be way off on that one, but I never claimed to have a decent memory)....

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 11:09 PM
Donovan also never had a single 1000 yard reciever, till he got T.O.

His Offensive line is porous, if he wasn't athletic, he'd have been sacked at least 60 times a season.

And his team has only once(that I can remember) had a running back with over 1000 rushing yards..... (I could be way off on that one, but I never claimed to have a decent memory)....

If all these things are true, and he had a bad line and no weapons....and no rb, then how come he can put up stats like THIS in his first full year as a starter (2000)

Att Comp pct. yds td int
569 330 58 3365 21 13

Looks pretty good from where Im sitting....I don't know how the eagles did in 2000, but i know they finished 11-5 and won their division in 2001 when mcnabb was a 3rd year player with almost identical stats......so apparently it CAN be done! A QB can be successfull in bad circumstances...how very puzzling.

thunderkyss
07-23-2006, 11:28 PM
......so apparently it CAN be done! A QB can be successfull in bad circumstances...how very puzzling.

Now you see......... it all depends on what successfull means.... a lot of people in this MB will be happy with a SuperBowl winning Trent Dilfer kind of QB. a bus driver.

Now, I know we can win a SuperBowl like that..... and at this point, I doubt we'll see much more from David than that.

Personally, I'd like to see a field general, a leader, a guy who is in charge of the Offense, when they are on the field. Aikman....... Brady........ Peyton.....

swtbound07
07-23-2006, 11:30 PM
Now you see......... it all depends on what successfull means.... a lot of people in this MB will be happy with a SuperBowl winning Trent Dilfer kind of QB. a bus driver.

Now, I know we can win a SuperBowl like that..... and at this point, I doubt we'll see much more from David than that.

Personally, I'd like to see a field general, a leader, a guy who is in charge of the Offense, when they are on the field. Aikman....... Brady........ Peyton.....

All i want to see is W's in the W column and nothing in the L column. I'd love for us to have a franchise leading quarterback that can lead this team to victory..but I'll take a pittsburgh type team with a nasty defense and a solid running game to get me to the top as well...and I think we are more likely to see the latter than the former

Koolaid Time
07-23-2006, 11:38 PM
Now you see......... it all depends on what successfull means.... a lot of people in this MB will be happy with a SuperBowl winning Trent Dilfer kind of QB. a bus driver.

Now, I know we can win a SuperBowl like that..... and at this point, I doubt we'll see much more from David than that.

Personally, I'd like to see a field general, a leader, a guy who is in charge of the Offense, when they are on the field. Aikman....... Brady........ Peyton.....


Hey, remember Trent Dilfer needed Tony Banks to make it to the Super Bowl...

Aikman, Brady and P. Manning are very rare... for each of them there are 5 Elvis Grbac's....

TexansBull
07-24-2006, 12:26 AM
You know i'm just a homer, but this is how I see it. Everyone supports Carr and wants to see him win because thats what we want our team to do, so these Carr posts are just for our anticipation for the upcoming season.

All we can fault Carr with is being dumb. Really he's an idiot. What quarterback would go on year after year with all those sacks and not fear a career ending injury or paralysis? Dwight Freeney every year. Twice.The guy is supposed to be small at that position too. And then he signs a contract extension to get sacked even more. Example: Noone let Carr know that its your facial hair that real men grow out. Noone likes tree-hugging hippies.

Then theres the Dom effect. It was a no-win situation. The guy was a head coach at some other team, I think it was an expansion, and went with old players, and they all retired on him so he got canned. Then, as brilliant as he is, goes all young, and year after year gets rid of all the veteran leadership. I guess the third time around he think of mixing it up. But, I'm not going to mention the play calling.

Also in his fear of getting sacked, he does stupid things. Hopfully with Kubiak, he'll get out of that. I'm not good with stats, but what the average sack for a quarterback? Lets see Carr in that kinda system before we run him out of town.

Lets all just calm down and hope Carr pulls a Brett Farve. I am not saying he is going to be like Farve. I am saying that Farve got traded and won a Superbowl when given a good chance. Almost similar situiation with Aikman. He got a line, a great coach(who I was hoping would come here) and won a couple rings. Maybe Carr can do the same with Kubiaks system. We all agree, who are not in a Reggie Bush or Vince Young hangover, that Kubiak is getting a good system in place.

Man-love him or hate him, lets all thank Carr for not being like Payton who get sacked more than twice is calling out his teammates. He has handled his unique situation well. Lets just see him through his extension and see if he can be the real deal.

The worst case scenario is Bush and Young are winning superbowls while david and mario are released to other teams to win superbowls.. and we stay loosing. Atleast we would have the first draft pick.Knock on wood and God forbid that to happen.

The real question is, how many quarterbacks would have succeeded in the past system. I think Carr would has done as good as most given the situiation. What would have Harrington done in our system? OR Brees, or anyone else? Really, put any quarterback, past or present and what would they have done? Not much. All great and average qbs had a good system and team to help them win the big one.

But anyways this is too long. Heres the another question. Would you take Carr now, hoping he will start clicking, or take Warren Moon hoping he can win the big one after his meltdowns in the the playoffs? Someone should start a post on that.

The Pencil Neck
07-24-2006, 12:36 AM
Heres the another question. Would you take Carr now, hoping he will start clicking, or take Warren Moon hoping he can win the big one after his meltdowns in the the playoffs? Someone should start a post on that.

Carr, at this point in his career, or Moon at his best? Moon. That man could flat out play. He threw such a beautiful spiral. I hope Carr surpasses Moon one day but he's not there, yet. Not even in the neighborhood.

swtbound07
07-24-2006, 12:46 AM
You know i'm just a homer, but this is how I see it. Everyone supports Carr and wants to see him win because thats what we want our team to do, so these Carr posts are just for our anticipation for the upcoming season.

All we can fault Carr with is being dumb. Really he's an idiot. What quarterback would go on year after year with all those sacks and not fear a career ending injury or paralysis? Dwight Freeney every year. Twice.The guy is supposed to be small at that position too. And then he signs a contract extension to get sacked even more. Example: Noone let Carr know that its your facial hair that real men grow out. Noone likes tree-hugging hippies.

Then theres the Dom effect. It was a no-win situation. The guy was a head coach at some other team, I think it was an expansion, and went with old players, and they all retired on him so he got canned. Then, as brilliant as he is, goes all young, and year after year gets rid of all the veteran leadership. I guess the third time around he think of mixing it up. But, I'm not going to mention the play calling.

Also in his fear of getting sacked, he does stupid things. Hopfully with Kubiak, he'll get out of that. I'm not good with stats, but what the average sack for a quarterback? Lets see Carr in that kinda system before we run him out of town.

Lets all just calm down and hope Carr pulls a Brett Farve. I am not saying he is going to be like Farve. I am saying that Farve got traded and won a Superbowl when given a good chance. Almost similar situiation with Aikman. He got a line, a great coach(who I was hoping would come here) and won a couple rings. Maybe Carr can do the same with Kubiaks system. We all agree, who are not in a Reggie Bush or Vince Young hangover, that Kubiak is getting a good system in place.

Man-love him or hate him, lets all thank Carr for not being like Payton who get sacked more than twice is calling out his teammates. He has handled his unique situation well. Lets just see him through his extension and see if he can be the real deal.

The worst case scenario is Bush and Young are winning superbowls while david and mario are released to other teams to win superbowls.. and we stay loosing. Atleast we would have the first draft pick.Knock on wood and God forbid that to happen.

The real question is, how many quarterbacks would have succeeded in the past system. I think Carr would has done as good as most given the situiation. What would have Harrington done in our system? OR Brees, or anyone else? Really, put any quarterback, past or present and what would they have done? Not much. All great and average qbs had a good system and team to help them win the big one.

But anyways this is too long. Heres the another question. Would you take Carr now, hoping he will start clicking, or take Warren Moon hoping he can win the big one after his meltdowns in the the playoffs? Someone should start a post on that.

I'd prefer not if its all the same to you. I don't care who hypothetically wouldnt have suceeded in Carr's shoes..the point is that HE didn't, and needs to be held accountable for that. I think other qb's in fact COULD have done well. Donovan didn't have a lot in philidelphia, and he made probowls and superbowls.

Koolaid Time
07-24-2006, 12:47 AM
Carr, at this point in his career, or Moon at his best? Moon. That man could flat out play. He threw such a beautiful spiral. I hope Carr surpasses Moon one day but he's not there, yet. Not even in the neighborhood.


Carr cannot be compaired to Warren Moon.....

Carr doesn't beat his wife and sexually harrass Minnesota Vikings cheerleaders.....

:whip:

The Pencil Neck
07-24-2006, 12:58 AM
Carr cannot be compaired to Warren Moon.....

Carr doesn't beat his wife and sexually harrass Minnesota Vikings cheerleaders.....

:whip:

Why would Carr beat Warren Moon's wife and harass Vikings cheerleaders?

Texans86
07-24-2006, 01:10 AM
If all these things are true, and he had a bad line and no weapons....and no rb, then how come he can put up stats like THIS in his first full year as a starter (2000)

Att Comp pct. yds td int
569 330 58 3365 21 13

Looks pretty good from where Im sitting....I don't know how the eagles did in 2000, but i know they finished 11-5 and won their division in 2001 when mcnabb was a 3rd year player with almost identical stats......so apparently it CAN be done! A QB can be successfull in bad circumstances...how very puzzling.

Really? Is that all it takes to be good in your book. Actually, those stats look pretty mediocre, other thatn the decent +8 TD/INT ratio.

Carr's in 2004
Att Comp Pct Yards YPA Lg TD Int
466 285 61.2 3531 7.58 69 16 14

swtbound07
07-24-2006, 01:16 AM
Really? Is that all it takes to be good in your book. Actually, those stats look pretty mediocre, other thatn the decent +8 TD/INT ratio.

Carr's in 2004
Att Comp Pct Yards YPA Lg TD Int
466 285 61.2 3531 7.58 69 16 14

Ding ding ding! that td/int rate is where he shines....and it goes to +13 next year, where he is also 11-5 as a starter....THATS what impresses me

swtbound07
07-24-2006, 01:17 AM
I've dropped down to 1.72 percent of the poll! my power is waning!

Topher
07-24-2006, 01:22 AM
I just want to win!! Go Carr!

swtbound07
07-24-2006, 02:53 AM
I just want to win!! Go Carr!

welcome to the board...interesting first post. Succinct, yet nicely conveys the point. i like it!

TK_Gamer
07-24-2006, 07:09 AM
I've dropped down to 1.72 percent of the poll! my power is waning!

i voted go carr cuz i think he could be another ellway someday, but i admire you for actualy voting what you say, unlike some others who are hiding on the line or worse

powerfuldragon
07-24-2006, 08:24 AM
http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/search.php?searchid=179823

Because we needed another one.

ps. go david.

U4ikrob
07-24-2006, 08:30 AM
Totally agree. I just read John McClain article about Troy Aikman :

Troy on Norv (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/4065525.html)
[Turner]"He came in at a time when I was a young quarterback going into my third season, had struggled my first few years and needed some guidance, needed somebody to kind of show me how to do it, and put me in a system that allowed me to do the things that I could do. And he did that."

I hope Kubiak is the "Norv Turner" for David Car.


Yea - what he said
Pro Carr -- Go Texans! :fieldgoal

Kaiser Toro
07-24-2006, 09:01 AM
Will everybody please stop comparing Carr to anyone else. We only need to compare Carr to himself. All of you pro Carr folks need to set expectations properly and that begins with looking at Carr's first four years when he had time to throw and what he did positively when other's missed their assignments. He is not Elway, Favre or Plummer. He is David Carr, whatever that is supposed to yield.

TwinSisters
07-24-2006, 06:12 PM
Will everybody please stop comparing Carr to anyone else. We only need to compare Carr to himself. All of you pro Carr folks need to set expectations properly and that begins with looking at Carr's first four years when he had time to throw and what he did positively when other's missed their assignments. He is not Elway, Favre or Plummer. He is David Carr, whatever that is supposed to yield.

I voted No Carr. And no he shouldn't be stopped from being compared to Favre, Plummer, Elway, etc.

I want a winner in the pocket, not a loser.

I show you what a winner looks like:

"A guy broke through the line, hit him, pushed his head in the ground. He called the same play, let the guy come through and broke his nose with the football. I said, "That's my hero,' " says Bubba Smith about Johnny Unitas on ESPN Classic's SportsCentury series.

Notre Dame thought Johnny Unitas was too small. The Pittsburgh Steelers thought he wasn't intelligent enough.

The Baltimore Colts got it right. Unitas, 6 feet and a mere 145 pounds in high school, became a nowhere-to-somewhere story, a backup who kept getting opportunities to succeed at every level. Give me a chance, the crew-cut quarterback would say, and I'll show you. He went from semi-pro dirt fields to stardom in the NFL.

And he did it quickly.

"The most important thing of all about Unitas," said Weeb Ewbank, his Colts coach, "is that he had a real hunger. This was a kid who wanted success and didn't have it so long that he wasn't about to waste it when it came."

http://espn.go.com/classic/biography/s/Unitas_Johnny.html


A loser says, "there is nothing you can do about it."

0-208 ( not counting running out bounds )

This guy has had 60 ( 59 ) games to show the world what he is made of.

Peyton Manning and Brett Favre almost have more wins in one season then he had in four seasons. Both can match any performance of Carr's in ONE losing season that he could in 4 all together.

Favre managed to throw for 4 300+ yard games in a 4-12 year.
Kerry Collins? 4-12 Raiders a hurt Moss and throws down 3 300+ yard games.

Carr has thrown for 3 300+ yard games in his whole entire career.

One can say stats schmats... what does that mean? Nothing.

Well you better have some stats if you are not winning. You need to have one or the other and there happens to be none. You expect to see lower passing stats for teams that are winning and higher ones for those that are losing. But I don't see what I expected. I haven't seen what I expected.

It's dissappointing.

No.

A dissappointment first overall and then dissappointing for the dissappointment squared.

That earns a vote of no-confidence from my hand everytime.

Heroes that I can admire, not losers. Heroes that can earn their spot on the roster, not have it given to them because they can sell pink jerseys to bunch a little girls.
---

that said though.. when it's game time, I ride with the team. That's just a basic football principle. Go Sage! I hope you get your shot and prove all these detractors wrong. However if that cap hoggin backup ever does something to be worthy of your spot... well then GREAT! It would be nice to not have to log pages like the following in my personal diary:

July 22nd, In the Year of our Lord 2006

Dear Diary,

It was hot today. I had to drink a lot of water to stay upright. While at the cooler I ran into Bob and my favourite girl Jennifer. I sure like her. Bob I do not. Bob started idle converstion about weather. I said it was hot. He agreed. Bob asked me if I liked football. I said I did. Bob asked me who my team was. I said the Houston Texans. Bob said O you suffering bastard. Jennifer laughed and said the Texans are losers. I wanted to cry. Jennifer said she liked Brady. Bob said me too. I said thanks from the heart of my bottom. They left together. I did cry. Alone. I didn't have any tears yet though, because I didn't have any water reserves build up yet. It was a silent scream of a cry, like a poor lamb abandonded to the wolves by his guardian shepherd on a cold winter night. Damn you David Carr. Not only are you a loser, you made me a loser. You made the Texans losers. I tried to cry myself to sleep, but it was so *(&%(@#*^) hot I couldn't sleep. I guess I will read about how great Peyton Manning is until I pass out again. Not sure which book I will read though. He has like 50 of em. Still cannot sleep. Will attempt to use trusty time honoured method of counting excuses of why David Carr is not great to fall asleep.


July 23rd, In the Year of Our Lord 2006

Dear Diary,

It was hot today. I met Bob and Jennifer at the cooler again. Bob asked if I thought it was going to rain. I said no. Bob reminded me that the Texans suck and lose to the Colts every year. Jennifer said that doesn't happen to Brady. Bob agreed. I said now hold on a minute and whipped out my laptop, wall projector, laser pointer, fired up the blackberry and put on a presentation about all of the excuses David Carr couldn't beat Peyton Manning complete with power point slides, spreadsheets, and animations of a balls hitting the backs of the WR's heads. I had so much WIFI going that I microwaved Bob's coffee. He said thanks. I said no problem. I am not too sure how the presentation went over, but I am sure it had some potential. I guess I shall see tomorrow... yes tomorrow. Always tomorrow...

The Pencil Neck
07-24-2006, 07:15 PM
<snip>
Peyton Manning and Brett Favre almost have more wins in one season then he had in four seasons. Both can match any performance of Carr's in ONE losing season that he could in 4 all together.

Favre managed to throw for 4 300+ yard games in a 4-12 year.
Kerry Collins? 4-12 Raiders a hurt Moss and throws down 3 300+ yard games.

Carr has thrown for 3 300+ yard games in his whole entire career.


One of the things that you seem to be totally incapable of understanding is that it doesn't matter if your QB is a gawd or not, without a good team, you don't win. Period.

I don't care how good Johnny U was (and I saw him at the end of his career when he wasn't so hot) without guys to block for him and guys to catch his passes and guys to run the football for him and a defense to stop the other team's offense, he doesn't win. How many great players were on those great old Colt teams? Quite a few: Lenny Moore, Mike Curtis, Raymond Berry, Alan Ameche, Art Donovan, Jim Parker, etc. How many seasons did they miss the playoffs? Quite a few. Do you mean that even the great Johnny U didn't win the championship every year he played? And wasn't he the first NFL QB to lose a Superbowl to the AFL? How many Hall of Famers does Carr have on his team? Hmmm... mebbe not so much.

The thing about Peyton and Favre is that those guys were on teams and in systems where the co-ordinators tried to take advantage of their strengths and designed offenses around them. And on top of that, they had great TEAMS.

His first year, Peyton threw the ball 575 times. Carr only threw the ball 444 times his first year. Over their first 4 years in the league, Manning averaged 556 attempts per year and Carr averaged 407 attempts. And you know over those 4 years Carr was down a lot more than Manning was and should have thrown the ball a whole lot more.

The problem is that while Manning was in an offense that focused on his ability to throw the ball and concentrated on scoring points, Carr was in a system where the whole focus was to not get too far behind. Run, run, try to throw just far enough to get a first down. Carr doesn't have any control over that.

The same thing is true of Favre. Looking at his 2nd through 6th years in the league, he averaged 536 attempts per year. The GB gameplan was to throw the football.

No one can say what Carr would have done in a similar situation but I think it's a mistake to blame Carr for his coaching staff's mentality and philosophy. He had no control over that. What we don't really know is if (or how much) he's been damaged by the system he's been forced to run these past few years and by the number of hits he's taken. And we don't know if Kubiak & Co. can repair that damage. Obviously, Kubiak thinks he can fix it. We'll have to wait for the season to start to know for sure.

MorKnolle
07-24-2006, 11:29 PM
For comparison's sake:

1st season......GP..GS...Att...Comp...%..........Yds.. .TD..INT....Record
David Carr.......16..16...444....233..52.5%......2592... 9...15.......4-12
Steve McNair....4...2.....80.....41...51.3%.......569... .3....1........2-0
2nd Season
DC.................12..11...295...167...56.6%..... 2013...9..13.........3-8
SM..................9...4....143....88....61.5%... .1197...6...4..........2-2
3rd Season
DC.................16...16..466....285..61.2%..... 3531..16..14........7-9
SM.................16...16..415...216...52.0%..... 2665..14..13........8-8
4th Season
DC.................16...16...423...256...60.5%.... 2488...14..11......2-14
SM.................16...16...492...289..58.7%..... 3228..15..10.......8-8
5th Season
DC.................???
SM.................11...11...331...187...56.5%.... 2179..12...8........9-2
6th Season
DC.................???
SM.................16...15...396...248...62.6%.... 2847..15..13.......12-3
7th Season
DC.................???
SM.................15...15....431...264...61.3%... 3350..21..12.......7-8

It took Steve McNair until his 7th season (5th full season of starting) to match David Carr's 3rd season statistics (still didn't match passing yards, but finally surpassed Carr's QB rating). For that matter, Steve McNair has never had 3500 passing yards in a single season, which Carr accomplished in his 3rd year. Obviously Carr has not had the win-loss success that McNair enjoyed early on, but McNair also didn't start with an expansion team and I'm pretty sure everyone would say Fisher is a better coach than Capers, plus McNair has had 31 Pro Bowl teammates in his 11 seasons while Carr has had a total of 3 in 4 seasons, so it's quite safe to say McNair had a better team around him too.

TwinSisters
07-25-2006, 03:25 AM
One of the things that you seem to be totally incapable of understanding is that it doesn't matter if your QB is a gawd or not, without a good team, you don't win. Period.

That would be correct. I don't comprehend how anyone could be satisified with a QB that hasn't done a whole lot to win in the first place.

Not only is Carr not Unitas. He is not Montana. He is not Bradshaw ( insert long list of NFL QBs worth a damn and sprinkle it with Jaworski's and other guys that even I have a hard time knowing who they are or can even picture their image...like Bill Kenney. Totally blank right now )

So he is not like all of these NFL QBs and more importantly he is not like them in that they have all accomplished something to warrant being a starting franchise QB. Not very impressive, along with me 'seeing' him bumble around. Never mind the stats.

So he is not better then Manning, not better then Brady, not better then Favre, ( insert about 10 more current NFL QBs ) ...and to top it all off Peyton's little BROTHER has accomplished more then him in almost everyway.

Yet Carr is going to start for the 5th year.

The thing you don't understand is how bad Carr really has been. I don't care what the excuses are... the results are the worst. Now I imagine I will have to adress this again in the other thread, so I will stop right here and come back if it looks like I didn't.
-----

The thing about Peyton and Favre is that those guys were on teams and in systems where the co-ordinators tried to take advantage of their strengths and designed offenses around them. And on top of that, they had great TEAMS.
--

The lame duck great team theory or the expansion team theory are both flawed or not applicable. It's not like Carr has to conqueror the world by himself, but when you put him into comparative analysis with other QBs... he cannot compare to any of them. The ones who had similiar mediocre stats, were winning games. The ones who were not winning games, had at least SOMETHING that was in the top ten in the league. IE look at Favre from last year 4-12.

I did find some flaws with my analysis earlier today, but the end story I imagine is still going to be pretty close to what I initially found. I am going to clean that bad boy up sometime this week so it is easier to understand. I was just typing on the fly as I was crunching the columns, so it got a little sloppy in presentation.

BUT first the expansion team excuse:

I do not accept it on the basis of; what is different between a team that goes 1-15 and ones that go 2-14 or 7-9 etc? The expansion team excuse is an excuse. There is not a difference to warrant 4 years of nothing.

The great team excuse:

So the Texans are the only franchise in history with bad players and bad coaches 4 years running? Maybe there are not a lot of them, but then of them you would expect at least one other franchise to keep a QB that is both losing and not making any individual accomplishments? There are none in 45 years of NFL play.
---

....years and by the number of hits he's taken. And we don't know if Kubiak & Co. can repair that damage. Obviously, Kubiak thinks he can fix it. We'll have to wait for the season to start to know for sure.
----

I will make a very important distinction here for myself ( not talking for everybody and obviously not expecting everyone to adhere to my own style )

What I am looking at is what he has done. NOT what he is going to do. I was spurred into looking at it because Montana has said he has done nothing ( and also the need for a new Carr thread ). I looked to see if Joe was right... and I doubt even Joe knows how right he was.

To address some the points made in the block above... That's more of the reason to bring up Unitas. Favre and Unitas have an attitude to take charge if or when what the coach is doing is not winning the game. Carr lacks this ingredient. I personally don't like it and I think it is a characteristic of a loser. I don't like chumps leading my team. That's my VOTE. No to chumps and pansies that say there is nothing that I can do about it and YES to champs that say give me a chance and I will show you the way to do it.

swtbound07
07-25-2006, 03:28 AM
That would be correct. I don't comprehend how anyone could be satisified with a QB that hasn't done a whole lot to win in the first place.

Not only is Carr not Unitas. He is not Montana. He is not Bradshaw ( insert long list of NFL QBs worth a damn and sprinkle it with Jaworski's and other guys that even I have a hard time knowing who they are or can even picture their image...like Bill Kenney. Totally blank right now )

So he is not like all of these NFL QBs and more importantly he is not like them in that they have all accomplished something to warrant being a starting franchise QB. Not very impressive, along with me 'seeing' him bumble around. Never mind the stats.

So he is not better then Manning, not better then Brady, not better then Favre, ( insert about 10 more current NFL QBs ) ...and to top it all off Peyton's little BROTHER has accomplished more then him in almost everyway.

Yet Carr is going to start for the 5th year.

The thing you don't understand is how bad Carr really has been. I don't care what the excuses are... the results are the worst. Now I imagine I will have to adress this again in the other thread, so I will stop right here and come back if it looks like I didn't.
-----

The thing about Peyton and Favre is that those guys were on teams and in systems where the co-ordinators tried to take advantage of their strengths and designed offenses around them. And on top of that, they had great TEAMS.
--

The lame duck great team theory or the expansion team theory are both flawed or not applicable. It's not like Carr has to conqueror the world by himself, but when you put him into comparative analysis with other QBs... he cannot compare to any of them. The ones who had similiar mediocre stats, were winning games. The ones who were not winning games, had at least SOMETHING that was in the top ten in the league. IE look at Favre from last year 4-12.

I did find some flaws with my analysis earlier today, but the end story I imagine is still going to be pretty close to what I initially found. I am going to clean that bad boy up sometime this week so it is easier to understand. I was just typing on the fly as I was crunching the columns, so it got a little sloppy in presentation.

BUT first the expansion team excuse:

I do not accept it on the basis of; what is different between a team that goes 1-15 and ones that go 2-14 or 7-9 etc? The expansion team excuse is an excuse. There is not a difference to warrant 4 years of nothing.

The great team excuse:

So the Texans are the only franchise in history with bad players and bad coaches 4 years running? Maybe there are not a lot of them, but then of them you would expect at least one other franchise to keep a QB that is both losing and not making any individual accomplishments? There are none in 45 years of NFL play.
---

....years and by the number of hits he's taken. And we don't know if Kubiak & Co. can repair that damage. Obviously, Kubiak thinks he can fix it. We'll have to wait for the season to start to know for sure.
----

I will make a very important distinction here for myself ( not talking for everybody and obviously not expecting everyone to adhere to my own style )

What I am looking at is what he has done. NOT what he is going to do. I was spurred into looking at it because Montana has said he has done nothing ( and also the need for a new Carr thread ). I looked to see if Joe was right... and I doubt even Joe knows how right he was.

To address some the points made in the block above... That's more of the reason to bring up Unitas. Favre and Unitas have an attitude to take charge if or when what the coach is doing is not winning the game. Carr lacks this ingredient. I personally don't like it and I think it is a characteristic of a loser. I don't like chumps leading my team. That's my VOTE. No to chumps and pansies that say there is nothing that I can do about it and YES to champs that say give me a chance and I will show you the way to do it.


Its a strange feeling to have someone else on my side in this debate.

TwinSisters
07-25-2006, 03:35 AM
For comparison's sake:

1st season......GP..GS...Att...Comp...%..........Yds.. .TD..INT....Record
David Carr.......16..16...444....233..52.5%......2592... 9...15.......4-12
Steve McNair....4...2.....80.....41...51.3%.......569... .3....1........2-0
2nd Season
DC.................12..11...295...167...56.6%..... 2013...9..13.........3-8
SM..................9...4....143....88....61.5%... .1197...6...4..........2-2
3rd Season
DC.................16...16..466....285..61.2%..... 3531..16..14........7-9
SM.................16...16..415...216...52.0%..... 2665..14..13........8-8
4th Season
DC.................16...16...423...256...60.5%.... 2488...14..11......2-14
SM.................16...16...492...289..58.7%..... 3228..15..10.......8-8
5th Season
DC.................???
SM.................11...11...331...187...56.5%.... 2179..12...8........9-2
6th Season
DC.................???
SM.................16...15...396...248...62.6%.... 2847..15..13.......12-3
7th Season
DC.................???
SM.................15...15....431...264...61.3%... 3350..21..12.......7-8

It took Steve McNair until his 7th season (5th full season of starting) to match David Carr's 3rd season statistics (still didn't match passing yards, but finally surpassed Carr's QB rating). For that matter, Steve McNair has never had 3500 passing yards in a single season, which Carr accomplished in his 3rd year. Obviously Carr has not had the win-loss success that McNair enjoyed early on, but McNair also didn't start with an expansion team and I'm pretty sure everyone would say Fisher is a better coach than Capers, plus McNair has had 31 Pro Bowl teammates in his 11 seasons while Carr has had a total of 3 in 4 seasons, so it's quite safe to say McNair had a better team around him too.

When you do comparative analysis one of the things that you are most interested in is how the player did in the season against the players that also played in the same season. That is why you look at the rankings of the individuals

McNair ranked 9th in rushing TDs in his first season as a full-time starter.
It's not about placing in the rushing TD stat itself. It's just that he DID something in a major category that was better then everyone else or was in the top 10 of the NFL.

In his second season as a full-time starter he ranked in yards, attempts, completions, etc and a bunch of other stuff.

The point being is that Carr cannot say this. He is always mediocre. McNair can say he did something to deserve starting the third season and the fourth season and so forth up to getting in a Pro-Bowl and co-MvP and all the other stuff.

TwinSisters
07-25-2006, 03:38 AM
Its a strange feeling to have someone else on my side in this debate.

O yes we are... in the winning department also. I mean there are some little details that are different, but essentially the same.

You might be doing it just to piss people off, but I am not happy man. I am not happy. I AM NOT HAPPY.

I waited to vent until after the draft to avoid all the aggie traffic, but man the more I look at this team the more pissed off I get. NOT HAPPIER. I find more mistakes, not fewer, the deeper I go.

EDIT:

Let me add this. I was sold on and bought into the idea that we drafted a QB to be the face of our franchise. The embodiment of Houston football. A slinging killer. A winner. A champion. Not Mister decent season that falls around 15th in the NFL.

It's not that he has to be better then Manning, Favre, Brady, Etc insert 10 other QBs... it's that he just has be able to compete with them and HE CAN'T. He has not done it. He has squandered it.

Topher
07-25-2006, 04:09 AM
welcome to the board...interesting first post. Succinct, yet nicely conveys the point. i like it!




Thanks!!! I never really have much to say. :logo: :logo:

TK_Gamer
07-25-2006, 04:13 AM
Originally Posted by TwinSisters
That would be correct. I don't comprehend how anyone could be satisified with a QB that hasn't done a whole lot to win in the first place.

Not only is Carr not Unitas. He is not Montana. He is not Bradshaw ( insert long list of NFL QBs worth a damn and sprinkle it with Jaworski's and other guys that even I have a hard time knowing who they are or can even picture their image...like Bill Kenney. Totally blank right now )

So he is not like all of these NFL QBs and more importantly he is not like them in that they have all accomplished something to warrant being a starting franchise QB. Not very impressive, along with me 'seeing' him bumble around. Never mind the stats.

So he is not better then Manning, not better then Brady, not better then Favre, ( insert about 10 more current NFL QBs ) ...and to top it all off Peyton's little BROTHER has accomplished more then him in almost everyway.

Yet Carr is going to start for the 5th year.










Carr is getting another chance because most of the football world, coaches(including Kubiak), sports writers, analysts, all see his potential and see the limiting factors that stifled his development. Kubiak sees it an probably staked his HC career on this belief. I tend to agree. but you must know more than all those other people.

TwinSisters
07-25-2006, 04:38 AM
Carr is getting another chance because most of the football world, coaches(including Kubiak), sports writers, analysts, all see his potential and see the limiting factors that stifled his development. Kubiak sees it an probably staked his HC career on this belief. I tend to agree. but you must know more than all those other people.

No they don't.

well let's see how much they know.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/9232134

Ah about as much as a playmate bunny.

mancunian
07-25-2006, 02:27 PM
Feel free to ask anybody who's been around this board awhile what they think about my views. You might not agree with me, but I doubt you'll find a person here who doesn't respect my consistency, and my ability to back up my positions and my ability to admit when I was wrong. I believe Dave Ragone is a St. Louis Ram, FWIW

sure is. Claimed by Bengals off waivers who then traded him to St Louis.
Now why couldn't we have done that?

mancunian
07-25-2006, 02:33 PM
I'll take a pittsburgh type team with a nasty defense and a solid running game to get me to the top as well...and I think we are more likely to see the latter than the former

Isn't that how football is supposed to be played. I'm a run first kinda guy and yeah I know its a cliche but "Defence Wins Championships".

All Carr has to do is not make mistakes and not lose us games.

I'm a supporter but I'll only take so much. We've had the excuses its now time for DC to show what he can do. We have fixed the oline (I hope) and if he still cant cut it then I'll be the first to admit I got it wrong.

real
07-25-2006, 02:37 PM
Carr is getting another chance because most of the football world, coaches(including Kubiak), sports writers, analysts, all see his potential and see the limiting factors that stifled his development. Kubiak sees it an probably staked his HC career on this belief. I tend to agree. but you must know more than all those other people.

And since sport writers, analyst...and sally from up the street all think Carr has the goods....It must be true!!!!...Joy....

MorKnolle
07-25-2006, 03:32 PM
When you do comparative analysis one of the things that you are most interested in is how the player did in the season against the players that also played in the same season. That is why you look at the rankings of the individuals

McNair ranked 9th in rushing TDs in his first season as a full-time starter.
It's not about placing in the rushing TD stat itself. It's just that he DID something in a major category that was better then everyone else or was in the top 10 of the NFL.

In his second season as a full-time starter he ranked in yards, attempts, completions, etc and a bunch of other stuff.

The point being is that Carr cannot say this. He is always mediocre. McNair can say he did something to deserve starting the third season and the fourth season and so forth up to getting in a Pro-Bowl and co-MvP and all the other stuff.

Steve McNair had one significant stat that he was ranked in during his first 5 seasons as a starter, 10th in passing yards in his 2nd year (1998). I refuse to acknowledge passing attempts and even completions as significant stats because those are based much more on your style of offense than your personal abilities, especially passing attempts. Carr ranked 12th in passing yards in 2004, his 3rd season as a starter, and in doing so ourperformed Steve McNair's top-10 passing yard season in every respect (61.2% completions vs. 58.7%, 3531 yards vs. 3228 yards, 83.5 QB rating vs. 80.1). Carr being ranked 12th in the league in passing yards rather than 10th but outperforming McNair otherwise does not IMO show that Steve McNair is the superior QB in this case.

bayoudreamn
07-25-2006, 06:21 PM
Depth Charts haven't been posted yet fellow...Im still hoping for Rosenfels to be the darkhorse. Im not rooting for him to fail, im EXPECTING it. There is a difference mind you. Im sick of watching sub-par performance. I can hear the excuses next year already ringing in my head

1) That was Carr's first year with a real QB coach and a new system...he will need time to be comfortable...but after 2007, if he STILL sucks, then we'll look at trying out some other folks at the spot.
2) The texans had a rough schedule...no QB would have done well in that situation
3) Carr had a hard time adjusting to the departure of his friend Dom Capers....he played poorly out of sadness
4) Carr looked amazing on that one drive against philly on opening day! you know, the one where the texans recovered a fumble at the Philly 10! He went 3-3 for 9 yards and a TD...that showed the brilliance of what david carr can do when you let him play his style of football
5) Carr is most comfortable playing at 75.39 degrees at kickoff, and the Reliant Stadium thermostat was set to 75.32.....he couldn't adjust in time.

Im sure there will be others, just as ridiculous as the drivel being spouted this offseason. Im not rooting for carr to fail as much as reminding everyone that it will happen. Sorry folks, my optimism is reserved for beyonce reading my fanmail.

You like betting against the odds, don't you?

Carr will be fine....and so will the Texans.

swtbound07
07-25-2006, 06:25 PM
You like betting against the odds, don't you?

Carr will be fine....and so will the Texans.

Actually I like betting WITH the odds.....Im not the one coming off a 2-14 season talking .500 potential...the optimism in this place is boundless.

bayoudreamn
07-25-2006, 06:43 PM
Actually I like betting WITH the odds.....Im not the one coming off a 2-14 season talking .500 potential...the optimism in this place is boundless.

Whatever makes you happy, or sad...whichever it is you like.

TwinSisters
07-25-2006, 08:25 PM
Steve McNair had one significant stat that he was ranked in during his first 5 seasons as a starter, 10th in passing yards in his 2nd year (1998). I refuse to acknowledge passing attempts and even completions as significant stats because those are based much more on your style of offense than your personal abilities, especially passing attempts.

Well I imagine had he attempted to throw the ball 208 times instead of ploughing record setting rows of futility in the grass with his head... he would have had something there.

Had he been able to make the third down throw, he would had the chance to make more attempts... but then he failed there too.

Had he been able to run for a TD, since he cannot make the attempt to throw the ball, that would have been great... but he failed there too.

To date a failure. A record setting failure.

rafterticket
07-25-2006, 09:48 PM
To date a failure. A record setting failure.

More of the same @*^%.

Am I on the the same thread where someone asked what does Carr have that could give some hope that he can be better this season?

How about a tight end? How about a complete receiver corps? What about an offensive minded coaching staff? How about the fact that with those weapons, Domanick Davis might be given the chance to complete an entire season without being injured? DD could possibly have an Emmitt Smith/Thurman Thomas sized career from this point on with all of the above!

These things can only make David Carr and the rest of the team better, but you guys want to hate, hate, hate.

I am more optimistic about this team than I have been before. It makes me sick to continue to read this stuff from you guys. You want us to lose so badly? Gee.....you guys obviously can't WAIT to be proven right. Let's drink a brewskie to 4-12! Real fans.

If I am right, just do me a favor. Jump on the bandwagon, and I'll never call you on it.

swtbound07
07-25-2006, 10:04 PM
More of the same @*^%.

Am I on the the same thread where someone asked what does Carr have that could give some hope that he can be better this season?

How about a tight end? How about a complete receiver corps? What about an offensive minded coaching staff? How about the fact that with those weapons, Domanick Davis might be given the chance to complete an entire season without being injured? DD could possibly have an Emmitt Smith/Thurman Thomas sized career from this point on with all of the above!

These things can only make David Carr and the rest of the team better, but you guys want to hate, hate, hate.

I am more optimistic about this team than I have been before. It makes me sick to continue to read this stuff from you guys. You want us to lose so badly? Gee.....you guys obviously can't WAIT to be proven right. Let's drink a brewskie to 4-12! Real fans.

If I am right, just do me a favor. Jump on the bandwagon, and I'll never call you on it.

Im sure you were really optimistic and swell last season too! what with coming off our best season ever, Carr having more time and experience to get comfortable, the offensive line having more time to gel, the additions of pbuc and travis to our defense...we would have to be great right??! WELL you know how that ended up. For the record, im NOT hoping to be right. I dont WANT us to fail. I just refuse to give this team the benefit of optimism anymore.

tsip
07-25-2006, 10:20 PM
I just refuse to give this team the benefit of optimism anymore.
__________________


...just guessing, but I think we figured that out 10 threads and a 100 posts ago--when the horse is dead, it's time to quit beating it and move on before credibility becomes an issue

swtbound07
07-25-2006, 10:26 PM
I just refuse to give this team the benefit of optimism anymore.
__________________


...just guessing, but I think we figured that out 10 threads and a 100 posts ago--when the horse is dead, it's time to quit beating it and move on before credibility becomes an issue


Im not worried about my credibility. Again, I don't start these threads, I merely respond to them, and if you think your tired of me now, you have a long summer ahead of you...Im not going anywhere, and neither is my message.

TwinSisters
07-25-2006, 11:40 PM
More of the same @*^%.

Am I on the the same thread where someone asked what does Carr have that could give some hope that he can be better this season?

How about a tight end? How about a complete receiver corps? What about an offensive minded coaching staff? How about the fact that with those weapons, Domanick Davis might be given the chance to complete an entire season without being injured? DD could possibly have an Emmitt Smith/Thurman Thomas sized career from this point on with all of the above!

These things can only make David Carr and the rest of the team better, but you guys want to hate, hate, hate.

I am more optimistic about this team than I have been before. It makes me sick to continue to read this stuff from you guys. You want us to lose so badly? Gee.....you guys obviously can't WAIT to be proven right. Let's drink a brewskie to 4-12! Real fans.

If I am right, just do me a favor. Jump on the bandwagon, and I'll never call you on it.


Well if there weren't like 30 other QBs that could throw the ball like a champ without an offensive line, no TEs, no running backs, and only one WR... you would be saying something.

I could give a flying hoot about being proven right... I know I am already right. I am not talking about what he can do, I am talking about what he has done. And I am absolutely right in that it is nothing.
---

But you know after talking about it a little bit... I do feel a little bit better now. I am still angry though. My dog was like, " Don't kick me. Go write about it instead." I was like, " You know what dog? Okay. I will do just that."

So kick up a chair and rip off 1,000 words for me and my dog to read about how much Carr has done to deserve to be the 5th year starting QB for the Houston Texans. Being number 46 on People's 50 most sexiest men alive list or in the top ten of Outsports.com's best hair in the NFL have already been counted. Also being the only QB in the history of the NFL to have his jersey sold in both battle red and cute pink have been noted. But that's only three accomplishments certainly you can top that.

Besides that if you listened carefully to what Dave says, he needed a change in the system and criticism is what drives him. So if you really want to be a team member and help out the squad, I would start laying into him like November cyclone. Because the old system of kissing his pink backside and rewarding his failure with millions of dollars along with all this hippie "everyone does good that participates" ribbons have resulted in 4 straight losing seasons. It's time for a change.

So hop on the wagon partner! No BYOB here and there's plenty to go around ...and it's free and cold.

P.S. Yes that's right.. I said 'Free' and 'COLD' and bountiful

P.P.S. I am also starting a pot to get a billboard up and an ad in the Chronicle to start Sage ( our greatest QB that hasn't proven that he is a bust in 4 straight years yet ). If you wanna help, just email Dick Justice. I think I would call you a 'true' fan then. Hell, then we could call each other good buddy and stuff like that... you know TENFOUR good buddy, Carr let us down. Maybe we could like get together and work on some new slogans over a few cold ones too... I will start:

Put down the hookah pipe Dave, start Sage we say.
or
Goodbye Liberty White and Pink Dave Day, Hello Battle Red Sage Day! Hooray Hooray!

:logo: for Sage

:grouphug: for Dave

P.P.P.S Not that I have a buckets of confidence boiling over for Sage, but man if I wanna win that shows you how much I have in a Carr full of excuses.

Battle Red Flash
07-26-2006, 11:08 AM
if you voted "No Carr" you don't belong on this message board ....

- A little harsh.
I understand your point, but what if a fan loves 21 of the Texans starters, but really dislikes Carr? They are o.k. in my book.
I just wish people would not boo Carr at the home games unless he REALLY messes up. But as fans, we only have two ways to express ourselves.
Clap, or Boo.

Kaiser Toro
07-26-2006, 11:10 AM
But as fans, we only have two ways to express ourselves.
Clap, or Boo.

I will be using the kazoo this year to express myself. :fireball:

rafterticket
07-26-2006, 11:14 AM
So kick up a chair and rip off 1,000 words for me and my dog to read about how much Carr has done to deserve to be the 5th year starting QB for the Houston Texans.

So hop on the wagon partner! No BYOB here and there's plenty to go around ...and it's free and cold.

1000 words? I don't think so. I have better things to do with my time. Here is the only reason I am staying loyal to DC - 'cause Kubes says so. That is all I need from the only coach that has given us a happy offseason. Ever. I only want us to win.

swtbound, I get your point, and it is well said, and a good reply.

Back to you TwinSisters. I can only come up with three things that would make your obvious hostility to DC rational:

1) You are going bald.
2) You hate charity.
3) You went to high school with David Carr, and he stole your girlfriend and intended, Melanie, and took her away to Fresno State and married her.

Other than that, I can't make sense of it. Your language suggests your dislike goes WAY beyond the football field.

The Pencil Neck
07-26-2006, 12:00 PM
I voted Yes Carr because I think he can be successful in this system this year. Not because he "deserves a chance" but because I honestly think he can be successful. This is the NFL, it's not about deserving squat. You've got to prove to the powers that be that you can do it.

I think it's fine if someone doesn't think Carr's the guy or that he'll ever be successful to say so. They're still Texan fans and that's all that really, REALLY counts.

But... prior to coming to this board, I never really considered myself pro or anti Carr. I think there are a lot of players that don't make it in the NFL just because they're in the wrong place at the wrong time and Carr has had some bad circumstances. But I'm really shocked by the people who just out and out HATE Carr. I've felt compelled to defend him against accusations that I feel are totally unfounded. I can't understand hating anyone that much unless you know them personally and that's really what this is about, hate. I just can't comprehend that.

Back in the late 80's/early 90's, I lived in Phoenix and my wife and I used to go to Suns games. We were Suns fans (Rockets, first; Suns, second.) I really disliked Danny Ainge when he was a Celtic and I was really let down when he came to the Suns. But as soon as he was a Sun, he was a guy on my team and I was rooting for him.

I don't understand virulently hating a guy on your own team unless he has done something to you, personally, or has shown himself to be of really bad character. Even if the guy doesn't perform as well as you'd like, that's no reason to "hate" him. And twisting yourself into knots to find statistics and come up with reasons why you think the guy is crap and to support pointless arguments, that's just not sane. Just say, "I don't think Carr is the guy" and be done with it.

real
07-26-2006, 12:12 PM
I agree with you pencil....There is no reason to "hate" a guy because of poor playing...BUT I can understand someones disgust with a player that is on "their" team that had virtually regressed over the past season...Fans turning on players in not a foreign concept...especially when said player has played like crap...In fact if Carr has another dismal season your tune might sound a little "Carr Basherish"...

Ryan
07-26-2006, 01:41 PM
Go Carr!!!!!!!

TwinSisters
07-26-2006, 02:07 PM
Other than that, I can't make sense of it. Your language suggests your dislike goes WAY beyond the football field.

Look. Keep your head in the game.

There is no reason to be talking about his wife ( or kids ).

If you want to know, he met his wife at church camp. I am not going to entertain this line any further. Himself and his football are the subject. Don't dishonour another man's wife without his or her permission.

Kurt Warner & Rodney Peete are okay. Their wives take up the radio shows and open it up. To my knowledge Carr's wife has not really taken on such a role. If she has ... well then game on. But if she hasn't then move on to something else.

Like if you want to talk about me.

It's flattering. I think I like it.

rafterticket
07-26-2006, 03:25 PM
[QUOTE=TwinSisters]Don't dishonour another man's wife without his or her permission.[QUOTE]

Wow. I am so sorry to have violated your obvious noble sensibilities. I'm sure other people have made note of your almost Emily Post-like behavior, but an undignified, brutish sort like myself could never understand a man of your complexities.

I was looking for some reason for this obvious personal hatred of David Carr. You, good sir, remain an enigma.

I bid thee good morrow, my lord.

Battle Red Flash
07-26-2006, 03:43 PM
I will be using the kazoo this year to express myself. :fireball:

Kazoo? I am very happy to not be sitting in front of you. :)

Titan "Tack" Fan
07-26-2006, 03:44 PM
I drew the duck blue because i've never seen a blue duck before and well, i wanted to see a blue duck.

Brandon420tx
08-13-2006, 03:06 PM
Why did you revive this?

:locked: --- in my mind.

rmartin65
08-13-2006, 03:06 PM
Wow, 91% for Carr right now. I voted for him because it sounds like he did pretty good for a new system.

Napa Auto Parts
08-13-2006, 03:40 PM
i voted for David carr i still remember fresno state and i hope he can do that in the NFL.:confused:

WILLIEG
08-13-2006, 04:44 PM
The only problem that Carr still has is the fact that he is still locking into one target and staring them down. I really hope here pretty soon that GK will correct this continuing mistake of Carr's and he will be goin ghtrough his reads or progressions. You really can't blam Carr for this type of mistake though, because if you wre always getting put on your back year after year then you probably wouldn't have all the faith in the world in your O-line as well. Bad habits are sometimes hard to break, but I believe the more faith he has in his O-line with protecting him better, then he will come out of this shell that his old O-line created for him.

The Pencil Neck
08-13-2006, 05:19 PM
The only problem that Carr still has is the fact that he is still locking into one target and staring them down. I really hope here pretty soon that GK will correct this continuing mistake of Carr's and he will be goin ghtrough his reads or progressions.

I thought he did better at not locking on last night. From what I've heard, Kubiak is positioning himself in a place where he can watch DC's eyes during practice and then gets on him if he locks on. I think it's working.

WILLIEG
08-13-2006, 05:25 PM
I thought he did better at not locking on last night. From what I've heard, Kubiak is positioning himself in a place where he can watch DC's eyes during practice and then gets on him if he locks on. I think it's working.
Well he might be doing a better job than last year, but I was at the game last night and saw Carr still locking into his potential targets. Hopefully he can get better at not doing that as the season progresses. It's still early and I have faith in GK noticing the same thing and working with Carr to prevent this from happening as much in the season.