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View Full Version : SAINTS HOLD ON while BUSH HOLDS OUT?


CloakNNNdagger
07-20-2006, 12:03 AM
Looks like Bush is indeed looking for a "better deal than what Houston gave Mario":


July 19, 2006
HOLD OUT LIKELY (http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060719/SPORTS/60719024)

New Orleans Saints top draft pick Reggie Bush will likely be a holdout when the team opens training camp in Jackson next week, a representative of the star running back told the Clarion-Ledger today.

Mike Ornstein, Bush's marketing agent, said Bush and the Saints "probably" won't agree to terms on a contract until after camp starts.

The Saints report to Millsaps College on July 27 and will start practice the following afternoon on the campus just north of downtown Jackson.

"Do we feel like he'll be there at the start?" Ornstein said in a telephone interview from his California office. "I'm not sure where we are right now. I'd say probably not, at this stage."

Bush, the Heisman Trophy winner out of Southern Cal, was the No. 2 overall pick in April's NFL draft. During the Saints' rookie mini-camp in May, Bush said he told his team of agents to do whatever they needed to make sure a deal was reached that would allow him to report to camp on time.

Saints general manager Mickey Loomis did not immediately respond to an interview request. The Saints have signed three of their eight 2006 draft picks in the past 10 days. But the team's top four picks remain unsigned a week before players report, which is not uncommon among NFL teams. Many deals, especially ones involving higher-round picks, typically get done weeks into training camp.

Apparently at issue is whether the Saints will offer Bush, who many rated as the top player in the draft, a better deal than what Houston gave Mario Williams when the Texans surprisingly chose the former North Carolina State defensive end first overall.

Williams has reportedly agreed to a six-year deal worth $54 million, with $26.5 million in guaranteed pay.

Ornstein is one of at least two lead members of a team that handles Bush's professional matters. Ornstein said he primarily negotiates the player's endorsement deals. Joel Segal, who will negotiate Bush's contract with the Saints, declined to comment when reached on his cell phone this afternoon.

Ornstein's comments come a day after the agent for former Texas quarterback Vince Young, the No. 3 overall pick, said he was heading to Nashville to get a deal done in time for Young to open camp with the Tennessee Titans late next week.

Ornstein said Bush is in Los Angeles, where he shot a commercial for Pepsi on Tuesday and has been working out on the USC campus.

"He's been training and getting himself ready," Ornstein said. "Reggie's going to be fine."

texan279
07-20-2006, 12:12 AM
Just makes us taking Mario that much sweeter. Cannot believe the guy wants more money than Williams.

:fireball: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v154/texan279/asdfas.jpg

swtbound07
07-20-2006, 12:50 AM
As much as a hate reggie....and believe me i do...THIS irks me to no end

New Orleans Saints top draft pick Reggie Bush will likely be a holdout when the team opens training camp in Jackson next week, a representative of the star running back told the Clarion-Ledger today.

Reggie IS NOT a holdout. By the very nature of the term, he CANT be a holdout. He has NEVER had a contract. He is unsigned, but not a holdout. Holdouts are people who have contracts and refuse to show up

texan279
07-20-2006, 12:56 AM
As much as a hate reggie....and believe me i do...THIS irks me to no end

New Orleans Saints top draft pick Reggie Bush will likely be a holdout when the team opens training camp in Jackson next week, a representative of the star running back told the Clarion-Ledger today.

Reggie IS NOT a holdout. By the very nature of the term, he CANT be a holdout. He has NEVER had a contract. He is unsigned, but not a holdout. Holdouts are people who have contracts and refuse to show up

Anyone who is in any kind of negotiation can be considered a hold out, you don't have to have any kind of contract signed to be considered a hold out.

Hold Out - To refuse to reach or satisfy an agreement. LINK (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/hold+out)

SF49erFaithful
07-20-2006, 01:10 AM
What makes me mad is that it seems like he can't accept the fact he wasn't taken #1 overall, so he wants to be paid like he was.

I say that is lame if he gets the money he wants, he deserves #2 $$$$$$

Coach C.
07-20-2006, 07:32 AM
Personally I think Bush should get as much as he can for the shortest amount of years he can spend in NO. No reason to want to stay in NO and hell I would need a huge bonus if I ever had to work there.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
07-20-2006, 07:34 AM
Tell me what IS 2nd pick money??????




LESS than 1st overall pick money.

cap1
07-20-2006, 07:48 AM
But more than 3rd pick money

CloakNNNdagger
07-20-2006, 08:07 AM
Anyone who is in any kind of negotiation can be considered a hold out, you don't have to have any kind of contract signed to be considered a hold out.

Hold Out - To refuse to reach or satisfy an agreement. LINK (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/hold+out)
**********

Exactly.......It's time to stop splitting hairs........when DRAFTED, his RIGHTS are held by the Saints in EXPECTATION of a NEGOTIATED consumating PLAYING CONTRACT. While the Saints hold his rights, he cannot negotiate with any other club and is EXPECTED to COMPLETE his contract........., but he is HOLDING OUT completing this process.

Huge
07-20-2006, 09:15 AM
Anyone who is in any kind of negotiation can be considered a hold out, you don't have to have any kind of contract signed to be considered a hold out.

Hold Out - To refuse to reach or satisfy an agreement.

**********

Exactly.......It's time to stop splitting hairs........when DRAFTED, his RIGHTS are held by the Saints in EXPECTATION of a NEGOTIATED consumating PLAYING CONTRACT. While the Saints hold his rights, he cannot negotiate with any other club and is EXPECTED to COMPLETE his contract........., but he is HOLDING OUT completing this process.
So if the Saints organization is also refusing to reach or satisfy an agreement (give Bush what he's asking for), aren't they every bit as guilty of being a "hold-out"?

It's a two-way street.

infantrycak
07-20-2006, 09:23 AM
So if the Saints organization is also refusing to reach or satisfy an agreement (give Bush what he's asking for), aren't they every bit as guilty of being a "hold-out"?

It's a two-way street.

Sure--then the question is if either side is being unreasonable in holding out.

Chicagotexan1
07-20-2006, 09:48 AM
This could almost as stupid as Rivers holdout of 04. Makes no sense at all. Reggie is not the only guy that feels he should have gone higher but didn't. You are not #1, so how can you get piad more? Oh wait, I bet he'll say "But I have a family to feed". More like ego to feed.

Texans_Chick
07-20-2006, 09:54 AM
So far he i a hold out along with about 30 other 1st round draft picks.. second of all training camp hasn't even started. and to all that says he should get 2nd pick money.. Tell me what IS 2nd pick money??????


Unlike most of those first round picks, he already has money coming out of his behind for all the endorsement contracts he has signed. He can monetarily afford to hold out, but in the big scheme of things, it would work out better for him not to try to take every nickle so that he doesn't miss camp reps, and because of image issues involved with not being satisfied with being a multi, multi-millionaire in a disaster zone.

If he wants to play well enough to be deserving of the hype, the best way of that happening is to get into camp pronto.

They are doing the negotiation dance. It will be interesting to see how serious it gets. :wiggle:

And as an aside, the Texans would have been poorly situated for doing that dance this year. There is enough change and learning going on without worrying if you can get your picks in camp.

Algebrat
07-20-2006, 10:17 AM
Unlike most of those first round picks, he already has money coming out of his behind for all the endorsement contracts he has signed. He can monetarily afford to hold out, but in the big scheme of things, it would work out better for him not to try to take every nickle so that he doesn't miss camp reps, and because of image issues involved with not being satisfied with being a multi, multi-millionaire in a disaster zone.

If he wants to play well enough to be deserving of the hype, the best way of that happening is to get into camp pronto.

They are doing the negotiation dance. It will be interesting to see how serious it gets. :wiggle:

And as an aside, the Texans would have been poorly situated for doing that dance this year. There is enough change and learning going on without worrying if you can get your picks in camp.

Good points all (as usual). This whole thread is a bit premature. Most of the first round picks aren't signed until a few days before camps begin. Does that mean they are ALL (almost) currently holding out? NO...

RB is doing what any other pick would/should do at this point. Give the impression that they want/deserve a bigger contract than they should. It will help at the bargaining table when they get to it.

Double Barrel
07-20-2006, 12:56 PM
RB is doing what any other pick would/should do at this point.

Except Mario Williams. :stirpot:

Mr. White
07-20-2006, 02:02 PM
It seems like he's probably too image-conscious to say anything that might make him seem selfish. I remember pre-draft interviews in which he talked only about being the #1 pick as opposed to being a Texan.

While he may have said things to make him not seem selfish, he hasn't done much to make him not seem selfish.

Having said that, I think that he could give one hell of a lift to NO and I hope that I'm wrong for the sake of NO fans.

TexansJunkE
07-20-2006, 02:20 PM
Hey Saint why are you curious why we think Reggie is selfish or not. Here's my opinion " I don't care about Reggie Bust one bit." Just see how he puts N.O. on the map, Like he said. Man, I'm glad we have Mario rahter than this character. Saying he wants to be on the field in TC and showing actions that he wants to be there are 2 different situations.

Mr. White
07-20-2006, 02:21 PM
Man are you serious?? So he's saying things that might not make him seem so selfish? He talked about being #1 pick instead of the Texans?????????? (maybe because he wasn't sure if he'd be a Texan) And have you seen or heard what he has done for New Orleans as for as contributions???

He has to do the charity circuit because he doesn't want Saints fans pissed at him when he holds out. Pre-emptive damage control.

You asked for opinions and I gave mine. We'll know just how selfish he is when he has to share a backfield with a proven veteran.

TD
07-20-2006, 02:25 PM
Who knows until Bush does or doesn't sign. Another problem is that Benson apparently wants out of town. What better way to help ensure poor attendance (and an excuse to leave) than not signing Bush? Something to think about.

IMO, the #1 picks will start to sign after Young does. My gut feeling is Bush will hold out. Whether it's him, Benson, or both I don't know.

swtbound07
07-20-2006, 02:33 PM
I go to this site cause i'm also a Texan fan. and seeing all the negative post about Reggie and other players... And then going to the saints site and NOT seeing them talking Neg. about other players makes me wonder why there's so much jeajoulsly about Reggie because you're front office didn,t pick him.

No. Im not jealous of Reggie Bush, and if you want to research, was ANTI-Bush for a longgggg time before the rose bowl, before the Bush Bowl, before any of that. I think he is the most overhyped, overrated, useless player to come out of the draft in quite some time. If I was a franchise I wouldn't touch him with a ten foot pole. He is a glorified scatback, and thats all he will ever be. He's Brian Westbrook with a lower ceiling. Its not jealousy, its pointing out idiocy. He wants to be paid like a #1 overall pick. He WASNT. Not because they couldn't sign him, but because we didn't WANT him. I wouldnt trade mario williams straight up for reggie bush, not in a million years. I wouldn't even give you David Carr for Reggie Bush, and i cant STAND him.

TexansJunkE
07-20-2006, 02:42 PM
I go to this site cause i'm also a Texan fan. and seeing all the negative post about Reggie and other players... And then going to the saints site and NOT seeing them talking Neg. about other players makes me wonder why there's so much jeajoulsly about Reggie because you're front office didn,t pick him.
Sorry my friend you mistake being annoyed with jealousy. After watching the Rose bowl it showed that Reggie Bust is something that ESPN has created. He was a great college football player, but being great in the college ranks does not mean you are great in the pro's. let's dee what he does in season before we talk about jealousy. Fair enough?

P.S. he is the Desmond Howard of the 2000's.:shades:

tulexan
07-20-2006, 02:47 PM
I would say that the Saints are holding all of the bargaining chips right now. They already have a proven pro bowl back in Deuce McAlister, a capable starter in Michael Bennett, and the logic of a #2 pick getting less money than a #1 pick.

Benson is a cheap owner and will hold on to every penny that he can. If Reggie is unwilling to budge from getting a better contract than Mario Williams then he won't be playing in New Orleans any time soon.

infantrycak
07-20-2006, 02:54 PM
It wasn't deleted. It was merged into an existing thread which was already discussing the subject. This one will also be merged in a few minutes.

infantrycak
07-20-2006, 03:00 PM
Is there a way to tell when a post is merged??

Only if it is moved to a different forum and then merged with another thread. If it is merged within the same forum you will just have to look around in the threads--in this case the CnD thread about Bush potentially holding out.

Tyr
07-20-2006, 04:34 PM
show me or tell me why you think Reggie is being selfish... (hopefully this one won't be deleted.)

I rarely post but thought I would throw in my .02!

IMHO, and I could be way off base, I don't believe that the now perceived RB haters can be lumped as those wanting RB before the draft. I was personally on the fence between RB and Mario. Before the season ended, I was all about wanting RB and was thrilled when we got the first pick. I then started hearing tidbits about Mario and began to waiver a bit. As the draft was approaching, I leaned back towards RB looking at the excitement he good bring to a team. After the draft and getting over my initial anger, I began to realize that the Texans probably made the best choice for this team.

I think it is also important to see what was happening heading up to the draft. This board had an influx of new posters wanting RB or VY. The majority of those posters are now gone, what you have left are the true diehard fans that had legitimate posts/arguement towards players other than RB/VY. I truely feel those you are asking why they are suddenly jealous are many of the posters that looked a Mario, DBrick, etc, and jealousy is not a factor.

The other issue IMO was the hype machine. Here you had all the media riding RB's jock before college season ever ended. RB this, RB that, and on and on. Combine comes and suddenly the casual fan hears about Mario, but doesn't have anything other to go on and still wants RB. You now have RB stating is would be fine going to the Texans, would not be an issue signing before the draft, etc. Draft approaches and suddenly he isn't willing to sign and controversy hits. He now appears to be someone that talks a good game, but may be questionable behind the scenes.

The draft comes and goes and suddenly you have all these articles about Mario finding their way into the boards about his character, etc. You start seeing logical arguements as to why he could be a good fit, etc. You are now a week from TC and RB still isn't signed and even after being drafted #2, still stated a deal would get done. To add to it, he wants more than the #1 pick?

I don't buy the jealousy bit. I think many of the true fans (whether Texan fans or not) that have paid attention to everything that has happened since the draft, now have their doubts about RB's character. Texan fans were on the forefront of this draft unlike many other fans, so they/we have a lot of insight that other teams fans may not.

IMO, Texans got the better man and time will tell about the better player.

swtbound07
07-20-2006, 04:39 PM
I rarely post but thought I would throw in my .02!

IMHO, and I could be way off base, I don't believe that the now perceived RB haters can be lumped as those wanting RB before the draft. I was personally on the fence between RB and Mario. Before the season ended, I was all about wanting RB and was thrilled when we got the first pick. I then started hearing tidbits about Mario and began to waiver a bit. As the draft was approaching, I leaned back towards RB looking at the excitement he good bring to a team. After the draft and getting over my initial anger, I began to realize that the Texans probably made the best choice for this team.

I think it is also important to see what was happening heading up to the draft. This board had an influx of new posters wanting RB or VY. The majority of those posters are now gone, what you have left are the true diehard fans that had legitimate posts/arguement towards players other than RB/VY. I truely feel those you are asking why they are suddenly jealous are many of the posters that looked a Mario, DBrick, etc, and jealousy is not a factor.

The other issue IMO was the hype machine. Here you had all the media riding RB's jock before college season ever ended. RB this, RB that, and on and on. Combine comes and suddenly the casual fan hears about Mario, but doesn't have anything other to go on and still wants RB. You now have RB stating is would be fine going to the Texans, would not be an issue signing before the draft, etc. Draft approaches and suddenly he isn't willing to sign and controversy hits. He now appears to be someone that talks a good game, but may be questionable behind the scenes.

The draft comes and goes and suddenly you have all these articles about Mario finding their way into the boards about his character, etc. You start seeing logical arguements as to why he could be a good fit, etc. You are now a week from TC and RB still isn't signed and even after being drafted #2, still stated a deal would get done. To add to it, he wants more than the #1 pick?

I don't buy the jealousy bit. I think many of the true fans (whether Texan fans or not) that have paid attention to everything that has happened since the draft, now have their doubts about RB's character. Texan fans were on the forefront of this draft unlike many other fans, so they/we have a lot of insight that other teams fans may not.

IMO, Texans got the better man and time will tell about the better player.

very nice post tyr

Byshop
07-20-2006, 04:55 PM
Personally, his not being signed yet doesn't serprise me one bit. I'm so thankful we took Mario. So far Reggie has been nothing but one thing after another(IE..his parents getting into trouble with the house, him pulling a hamstring in OTA's, and now this) Now the drama will only continue...lol

Kubiac made the right decision, go with Mario. Our defence needed a stud on the line, not a better running back. Coaching and scheme will get the Texans all the ground yardage needed without paying out the wazzu for it.:twocents:

gwallaia
07-20-2006, 06:04 PM
Whoops!
Reggie is on the cover of SI this week. This does not bode well at all for the Saints.

TexansJunkE
07-20-2006, 07:19 PM
I rarely post but thought I would throw in my .02!

IMHO, and I could be way off base, I don't believe that the now perceived RB haters can be lumped as those wanting RB before the draft. I was personally on the fence between RB and Mario. Before the season ended, I was all about wanting RB and was thrilled when we got the first pick. I then started hearing tidbits about Mario and began to waiver a bit. As the draft was approaching, I leaned back towards RB looking at the excitement he good bring to a team. After the draft and getting over my initial anger, I began to realize that the Texans probably made the best choice for this team.

I think it is also important to see what was happening heading up to the draft. This board had an influx of new posters wanting RB or VY. The majority of those posters are now gone, what you have left are the true diehard fans that had legitimate posts/arguement towards players other than RB/VY. I truely feel those you are asking why they are suddenly jealous are many of the posters that looked a Mario, DBrick, etc, and jealousy is not a factor.

The other issue IMO was the hype machine. Here you had all the media riding RB's jock before college season ever ended. RB this, RB that, and on and on. Combine comes and suddenly the casual fan hears about Mario, but doesn't have anything other to go on and still wants RB. You now have RB stating is would be fine going to the Texans, would not be an issue signing before the draft, etc. Draft approaches and suddenly he isn't willing to sign and controversy hits. He now appears to be someone that talks a good game, but may be questionable behind the scenes.

The draft comes and goes and suddenly you have all these articles about Mario finding their way into the boards about his character, etc. You start seeing logical arguements as to why he could be a good fit, etc. You are now a week from TC and RB still isn't signed and even after being drafted #2, still stated a deal would get done. To add to it, he wants more than the #1 pick?

I don't buy the jealousy bit. I think many of the true fans (whether Texan fans or not) that have paid attention to everything that has happened since the draft, now have their doubts about RB's character. Texan fans were on the forefront of this draft unlike many other fans, so they/we have a lot of insight that other teams fans may not.

IMO, Texans got the better man and time will tell about the better player.

Well done my man!

Coach C.
07-20-2006, 07:37 PM
You look up my post and you know I was a Mario guy from the start, but I watch and know football so you can see talent. Bush has it in spades. If the kid is smart he will be in camp on time, hell first to report, because that will set the stage for him to take the starting job from Deuce. Deuce is hobbled right now and if Bush wants the job it is prime pancake plucking time, if ya know what I mean. One thing about Bush is he is not stupid, he will get a nice deal from the craptastic Saints and then if he does not hold out have the job by end of the first pre-season week.

thunderkyss
07-20-2006, 08:21 PM
I go to this site cause i'm also a Texan fan. and seeing all the negative post about Reggie and other players... And then going to the saints site and NOT seeing them talking Neg. about other players makes me wonder why there's so much jeajoulsly about Reggie because you're front office didn,t pick him.

which Saints site are you talking about?? I've been doing damage control on Saints Report for a while........ granted, lately I had to pull up old threads, but still....

We could have signed REggie... alot of people wanted to sign Reggie(not me)... one of the reason we believe we didn't, was because we thought he'd be difficult to sign........

This just further proves our point.

Me, I couldn't care less. My point, was that we don't need a high dollar running back....... we don't need any more fast recievers..... we don't need another offensive weapon.

When we average 30 points in '06, my point will be made.

Reggie can be rookie of the year for all I care, it won't matter, as we'll avg 30ppg any way.

sprtsfanatic
07-20-2006, 09:09 PM
According to KFFL.com reggie bush's agent states that reggie will most likely be a hold out for training camp due to contract issues....thank god the Texans went another route.

:fireball: :bowser:

TwinSisters
07-20-2006, 09:17 PM
According to KFFL.com reggie bush's agent states that reggie will most likely be a hold out for training camp due to contract issues....thank god the Texans went another route.

Unless he holds out, gets thrown back into the draft, we go 1-14, and then have to play Bush Bowl II vs Cleveland.

That could be a bad thing about him holding out.

Kaiser Toro
07-20-2006, 09:31 PM
With no malicious intent intended, fans here, who were Pro Bush, were by and large Texans fans and are still Texans fans.

As someone who spit venom at drafting Bush I hold zero ill will for those who preferred Bush. However, those who still retain Bush avatars get the stink eye.

The Texan's tent is wide at the moment and getting filled to capacity with mounting enthusiastic pressure.

TexanFan881
07-20-2006, 10:05 PM
If we would have picked Reggie Bush we would have signed him before the draft, so that would be a no issue. And we wouldn't have to be looking for a backup running back right now. What do you know, we would have been set right now. But we picked Mario...(not that that's horrible or anything I just prefer Bush)

TwinSisters
07-20-2006, 10:25 PM
With no malicious intent intended, fans here, who were Pro Bush, were by and large Texans fans and are still Texans fans.

As someone who spit venom at drafting Bush I hold zero ill will for those who preferred Bush. However, those who still retain Bush avatars get the stink eye.

The Texan's tent is wide at the moment and getting filled to capacity with mounting enthusiastic pressure.

ACADEMIC TIMEOUT:

Is it
A. Texans' fans as in possessed by the plural Texans
or
B. Texans fans as in an adjective denoting fans with a particular characteristic

This has bothered me for quite sometime, please help a brother out.

---

Okay now back to our regularly scheduled Reggie Bush coverage

Kaiser Toro
07-20-2006, 10:29 PM
ACADEMIC TIMEOUT:

Is it
A. Texans' fans as in possessed by the plural Texans
or
B. Texans fans as in an adjective denoting fans with a particular characteristic

This has bothered me for quite sometime, please help a brother out.

---

Okay now back to our regularly scheduled Reggie Bush coverage

Apostrophe needed, but not going to edit due to your insolence. :neener:

TwinSisters
07-20-2006, 10:37 PM
Apostrophe needed, but not going to edit due to your insolence. :neener:

I am serious though.. are you supposed to be using an apostrophe?

( seriously asking )

( see I used it twice... )

I don't care about the post. I wanna know the TRUTH!!!!

Lay it on me. Knock me out!

TexanFan881
07-20-2006, 10:43 PM
ACADEMIC TIMEOUT:

Is it
A. Texans' fans as in possessed by the plural Texans
or
B. Texans fans as in an adjective denoting fans with a particular characteristic

This has bothered me for quite sometime, please help a brother out.

It's A :shades:

TwinSisters
07-20-2006, 10:46 PM
It's A :shades:

So B is illegal holding then?

TexanFan881
07-20-2006, 10:49 PM
So B is illegal holding then?

lol yup :ouch:

Texan Asylum
07-20-2006, 10:55 PM
You guys are classic!lol: :thumbup

Mr. White
07-20-2006, 10:55 PM
The apostophe implies ownership. As fans we aren't owned by the Texans....maybe some of us are that are:

a. playing fantasy football from our mom's house
b. in our 30's (or older)

Since both of these conditions don't apply to me and most of us, I'd prefer to think of us as Texans fans.

TexanFan881
07-20-2006, 10:57 PM
wow I'm so confused now :confused: :brickwall I should have just sat on the bench :hide: :)

I think you're right now Battle Red.

TwinSisters
07-20-2006, 11:08 PM
The apostophe implies ownership. As fans we aren't owned by the Texans....maybe some of us are that are:

a. playing fantasy football from our mom's house
b. in our 30's (or older)

Since both of these conditions don't apply to me and most of us, I'd prefer to think of us as Texans fans.

:hmmm:

SoOooo... If Reggie Bush says, "I would like to thank my fans!" ( or Bob McNair in the case of the Texans ), what does that really mean then?

That you are really not his fans if you don't use the apostrophe?

Kaiser Toro
07-20-2006, 11:12 PM
The apostophe implies ownership. As fans we aren't owned by the Texans....maybe some of us are that are:

a. playing fantasy football from our mom's house
b. in our 30's (or older)

Since both of these conditions don't apply to me and most of us, I'd prefer to think of us as Texans fans.

I have a T-shirt that says, "Property of the Houston Texans." Others, like myself, would then be Texans' fans.

TexanFan881
07-20-2006, 11:13 PM
:hmmm:

SoOooo... If Reggie Bush says, "I would like to thank my fans!" ( or Bob McNair in the case of the Texans ), what does that really mean then?

That you are really not his fans if you don't use the apostrophe?

That quote is right. Like Red Bull said there's no possesion. If the quote was "I would like to thank my fans' commitment of the Texans." The fans show possesion of commitment. I think that's right this time lol

TwinSisters
07-20-2006, 11:26 PM
That quote is right. Like Red Bull said there's no possesion. If the quote was "I would like to thank my fans' commitment of the Texans." The fans show possesion of commitment. I think that's right this time lol

Okay so you not going to overturn your original call then?

If you are
Property of the Texans
The Houston Texans call you "our fans".
then you must use the apostrophe correct?

TexanFan881
07-20-2006, 11:36 PM
Okay so you not going to overturn your original call then?

If you are
Property of the Texans
The Houston Texans call you "our fans".
then you must use the apostrophe correct?

In a sentence this is where you would use a apostrophe:
blah blah blah ____ _______ blah blah blah
.....................noun possesion.....................

Our fans is a statement and there is no possesion after fans so there would be no apostraphe.

TwinSisters
07-21-2006, 12:16 AM
In a sentence this is where you would use a apostrophe:
blah blah blah ____ _______ blah blah blah
.....................noun possesion.....................

Our fans is a statement and there is no possesion after fans so there would be no apostraphe.

alright.

As Houston Texans' fans, you should be grateful that you didn't draft Bush.

Noun - Texans
Possession - fans

The fan is in possession of the Houston Texans

You wouldn't say
Here's the Houston Texans helmets.
You would say
Here's the Houston Texans' helmets.
so
Here's a Houston Texans' fan trying to figure out if he is a Houston Texan's fan or a Houston Texans fan.

See what I mean?

bah screw it!
---

Man I sure am miffed we didn't draft Bush.

eheh

TexanFan881
07-21-2006, 12:19 AM
alright.

As Houston Texans' fans, you should be grateful that you didn't draft Bush.

Noun - Texans
Possession - fans

The fan is in possession of the Houston Texans

You wouldn't say
Here's the Houston Texans helmets.
You would say
Here's the Houston Texans' helmets.
so
Here's a Houston Texans' fan trying to figure out if he is a Houston Texan's fan or a Houston Texans fan.

See what I mean?

bah screw it!
---

Man I sure am miffed we didn't draft Bush.

eheh

There you go. You got it :thumbup Or there's other rules but that looks and sounds right. I'll find out in two years when I finish High School :tease:

----

But yes I'm in the we screwed ourselves by not taking Bush camp. I've seen enough highlights to say he's going to be something special.

TwinSisters
07-21-2006, 12:40 AM
There you go. You got it :thumbup Or there's other rules but that looks and sounds right. I'll find out in two years when I finish High School :tease:

----

But yes I'm in the we screwed ourselves by not taking Bush camp. I've seen enough highlights to say he's going to be something special.


No sir, I have already been through the U ( no wait I am still at the U .. O god I turned into Otter!! ) and we just skipped that battle to take on the more important issues like commas and chatspeak. Even the guardians of the English language in England have stayed away from the dreaded fan debate. See look
http://www.apostrophe.fsnet.co.uk/index.htm

Apostrophe Protection Society doesn't even address sports.

look up something called attributive usage
Adjectival (also known as attributive) usage vs possessive usage is probably the thing that divides us the most here [on the APS].

There must be a ruling on this... we must have rules... o yes o yes.. rules and definitive rules for the rules. It's the law.

ensign_lee
07-21-2006, 04:53 AM
I vote no apostrophe. Apostrophe implies ownership, which is not present here.

Think about this in terms of our soccer team. 1864 or something? Would you say that fans of that team are the 1864's fans? No.

Same goes with Texans fans. NO APOSTROPHE!:tease:

Texans_Chick
07-21-2006, 08:06 AM
I vote adjectival usage. I just like the way it looks better.

Even though I am so possessed by the Texans you would need an exorcist to free me.

You could complicate this whole converation by asking whether you drop the "s" at the end of Texans when pairing it with fan.

I am a Texan fan.

The Texas Longhorns. Longhorn fans bleed orange.

The College Station Aggies. Aggie fans love helping the sheep over the fence.

The Houston Rockets. Rocket fans were happy when Van Gundy cut the combover. At least this one was.

The Houston Astros. Astro fans would like to see something called run support.

This usage is easier to say out loud.

Mr. White
07-21-2006, 08:32 AM
I vote adjectival usage. I just like the way it looks better.

Even though I am so possessed by the Texans you would need an exorcist to free me.

You could complicate this whole converation by asking whether you drop the "s" at the end of Texans when pairing it with fan.

I am a Texan fan.

The Texas Longhorns. Longhorn fans bleed orange.

The College Station Aggies. Aggie fans love helping the sheep over the fence.

The Houston Rockets. Rocket fans were happy when Van Gundy cut the combover. At least this one was.

The Houston Astros. Astro fans would like to see something called run support.

This usage is easier to say out loud.


Now would be a good time for somebody to pound a gavel and declare "fan law." :party:

edo783
07-21-2006, 08:37 AM
Geeezzzz, just what I wanted. I come to a football MB and an english and punctuation class breaks out. I guess some people are easly entertained on the off season by such. Me, I just want some football.

Titan "Tack" Fan
07-21-2006, 08:38 AM
I thought it was summer guys.......:bguitar:

TEXANRED
07-21-2006, 09:21 AM
The College Station Aggies. Aggie fans love helping the sheep over the fence.



HEY!!!!!!!!!!!!:)
Sheep need lovin too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Double Barrel
07-21-2006, 12:36 PM
"The crux of the biscuit is the apostrophe." - Frank Zappa :howdy:

Porky
07-21-2006, 01:31 PM
Geeezzzz, just what I wanted. I come to a football MB and an english and punctuation class breaks out. I guess some people are easly entertained on the off season by such. Me, I just want some football.

Sometime things are backwards. I once went to an English class, and a message board broke out. :tease:

Texans34Life
07-22-2006, 12:41 AM
Update on that whiny Bush:

Saints | Bush contemplating not signing?
Fri, 21 Jul 2006 21:33:34 -0700

Jason Cole, of Yahoo Sports, reports there has been some talk of New Orleans Saints rookie RB Reggie Bush not signing in time for training camp. Now, a league source said Bush is toying with the idea of sitting out the entire season and going back in the NFL Draft in 2007 if he doesn't get his price. "No player has ever had the kind of leverage that Reggie Bush has right now," the source said. "The Saints made it clear what they were willing to do before and now we'll see if they're going to get there." Two sources said that talks between the Saints and agent Joel Segal have been nearly non-existent. Wednesday, July 19, Mike Ornstein, who is Bush's marketing agent, told the Clarion-Ledger of Jackson, Miss., that he didn't think Bush would be signed in time for camp. Ornstein is not allowed to negotiate contracts, but he is acutely aware of all of Bush's business matters. Bush supposedly has more than $5 million in the bank from multiple endorsement deals Ornstein has negotiated since Bush left the University of Southern California. Bush could probably sit out 2006 and still be a high pick next year.

Hutch13
07-22-2006, 12:52 AM
Update on that whiny Bush:

Saints | Bush contemplating not signing?
Fri, 21 Jul 2006 21:33:34 -0700

Jason Cole, of Yahoo Sports, reports there has been some talk of New Orleans Saints rookie RB Reggie Bush not signing in time for training camp. Now, a league source said Bush is toying with the idea of sitting out the entire season and going back in the NFL Draft in 2007 if he doesn't get his price. "No player has ever had the kind of leverage that Reggie Bush has right now," the source said. "The Saints made it clear what they were willing to do before and now we'll see if they're going to get there." Two sources said that talks between the Saints and agent Joel Segal have been nearly non-existent. Wednesday, July 19, Mike Ornstein, who is Bush's marketing agent, told the Clarion-Ledger of Jackson, Miss., that he didn't think Bush would be signed in time for camp. Ornstein is not allowed to negotiate contracts, but he is acutely aware of all of Bush's business matters. Bush supposedly has more than $5 million in the bank from multiple endorsement deals Ornstein has negotiated since Bush left the University of Southern California. Bush could probably sit out 2006 and still be a high pick next year.


Wow! um wow. This is interesting, but it could really hurt Bushs rep even more especially since the whole katrina thing.

TwinSisters
07-22-2006, 02:01 AM
Wow! um wow. This is interesting, but it could really hurt Bushs rep even more especially since the whole katrina thing.

:fortune:

Bush Bowl II

Sunday December 31st in the year of our Lord 2006
Houston, Texas.

at 3:11, Kris Brown shanks another late 4th quarter field goal and the Texans beat out the Cleveland Browns for the 2007 number one over all draft spot.

April 8th, after Easter celebrations the Fanzone is invaded by the 20,000 Catholics that insist Rick Smith is going to select Brady Quinn.

April 9th, the California Student Body Left counters with a 22,000 man rebuttal about how David Carr just needs to adjust to the new system, new lineman, and insist that Reggie Bush must be taken this time around so that he can finally reach his potential.

May 1st, the Texans pass over Bush twice for stand out DT Bob Womerjeik from Cottageville CC, South Carolina. GM Rick Smith press release states that it is obviously a football decision, "The guy is a monster and has good character... I mean he got 3 sacks in one game against Folly Beach U last season. I've never seen anything like it in my one year has GM in the NFL."

June 23rd, the Cleveland Browns gloating over their fortunes in getting the best player in football for the past 50 years, sell out their season tickets for the first time since Jim Brown played.

August 10th, Reggie Bush states that he will hold out until the 2008 draft because the NFL will still not allow him to wear number 5. Reggie's agents make sure that it is known that it breaks Reggie's heart not to be able to play in Cleveland. It's just business and the NFL started it.

April 27th, 2008 New York City: the Los Angeles Trojans select Reggie Bush as the first player to be taken in their newly awarded franchise. Bush being able to wear number 5 was part of the charter agreement. In fact, the number 5 is passed as a registered trademark in California legislature. Any team visiting L.A. with a player using the number 5 must be changed out or be fined 5,000 dollars for each day they are in the State with a number 5 on their roster.

Sep 14th, 2008 The NFL enters a new era of 5 slash 05 for all players that wanted to be number 5 but didn't get to. Reggie Bush single-handedly changes the game of football.

:fortune:

TK_Gamer
07-22-2006, 04:20 AM
:fortune:

Bush Bowl II

Sunday December 31st in the year of our Lord 2006
Houston, Texas.

at 3:11, Kris Brown shanks another late 4th quarter field goal and the Texans beat out the Cleveland Browns for the 2007 number one over all draft spot.

April 8th, after Easter celebrations the Fanzone is invaded by the 20,000 Catholics that insist Rick Smith is going to select Brady Quinn.

April 9th, the California Student Body Left counters with a 22,000 man rebuttal about how David Carr just needs to adjust to the new system, new lineman, and insist that Reggie Bush must be taken this time around so that he can finally reach his potential.

May 1st, the Texans pass over Bush twice for stand out DT Bob Womerjeik from Cottageville CC, South Carolina. GM Rick Smith press release states that it is obviously a football decision, "The guy is a monster and has good character... I mean he got 3 sacks in one game against Folly Beach U last season. I've never seen anything like it in my one year has GM in the NFL."

June 23rd, the Cleveland Browns gloating over their fortunes in getting the best player in football for the past 50 years, sell out their season tickets for the first time since Jim Brown played.

August 10th, Reggie Bush states that he will hold out until the 2008 draft because the NFL will still not allow him to wear number 5. Reggie's agents make sure that it is known that it breaks Reggie's heart not to be able to play in Cleveland. It's just business and the NFL started it.

April 27th, 2008 New York City: the Los Angeles Trojans select Reggie Bush as the first player to be taken in their newly awarded franchise. Bush being able to wear number 5 was part of the charter agreement. In fact, the number 5 is passed as a registered trademark in California legislature. Any team visiting L.A. with a player using the number 5 must be changed out or be fined 5,000 dollars for each day they are in the State with a number 5 on their roster.

Sep 14th, 2008 The NFL enters a new era of 5 slash 05 for all players that wanted to be number 5 but didn't get to. Reggie Bush single-handedly changes the game of football.

:fortune:
Wow, thats some serious issues:francis:

CloakNNNdagger
07-22-2006, 08:00 AM
Sport Illustrated just about this time must be feeling a little like maybe they should have left their cover to more appropriately be hung, not at the news stands but on the New Orleans Post Office walls. Hijacking, or should I say "Bushwacking" as I referred to it in the title of one of the original threads is exactly what is going on.

If the Saints fans wake up, they will see how he set all this up with the "charity" angle to gain support for his arrogant greed. Again I see the charitable donations write offs and business write offs for PR expenses as no out of pocket to him. With already $5 million dollars in endorsements in his pocket, in asking for a contract greater than or at least equal to Mario's, who will have actually paid for this "charity" to New Orleans?................that's right, the Saints' villainized Benson...........all in the Grand Plan of a selfish little BOY. Go ahead and take your toys and go home..............but take it to the bank, you will not take as much to the bank next year.........because no one will be taking you at #1 OR #2. With all the baggage that you will be carrying with you, and the fact that you will not be actively "hitting with the boys" in college OR the NFL for 1 whole year, and possibly RUSTING in front of the TV watching real football players while you figure how to spend your $5million.........you may find that you'll be lucky to be picked by #10 in 2007.
In the end you will have "screwed" a city and their excited fans........or maybe not..........maybe they will be better for it.

Koolaid Time
07-22-2006, 08:19 AM
Just makes us taking Mario that much sweeter. Cannot believe the guy wants more money than Williams.

:fireball: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v154/texan279/asdfas.jpg

From Yahoo Sports:

No. 2 overall pick and Heisman Trophy-winning running back Reggie Bush not only appears headed for a holdout with the New Orleans Saints, a league source said Bush is toying with the idea of sitting out the entire season and going back in the draft in 2007 if he doesn't get his price.

"No player has ever had the kind of leverage that Reggie Bush has right now," the source said. "The Saints made it clear what they were willing to do before and now we'll see if they're going to get there."

It seems unlikely the Saints will do that in time for Bush to report to training camp with the team on Thursday in Jackson, Miss. Two sources said that talks between the Saints and agent Joel Segal have been nearly non-existent.


Go ahead Reggie..... stay out...:stirpot:

Kaiser Toro
07-22-2006, 08:21 AM
If there is a football God, please do not let us take Brady Quinn or Reggie Bush.

jerek
07-22-2006, 12:30 PM
If there is a football God, please do not let us take Brady Quinn or Reggie Bush.

Enough said. Can anybody read this and still want Reggie on our team? ... I don't want or need a soap opera for the next however many years he'd last here before we finally threw him out of town on his greedy ear. I was happy when we passed on Reggie the first time and now it looks like pure genius. He's being offered plenty enough (cough Latrell Sprewell cough) and he needs to stop reading his own press clippings and show and demonstrate that he wants to play football, and is in the NFL for something more than the exorbitant pay.

TexanFan881
07-22-2006, 12:35 PM
Enough said. Can anybody read this and still want Reggie on our team? ... I don't want or need a soap opera for the next however many years he'd last here before we finally threw him out of town on his greedy ear. I was happy when we passed on Reggie the first time and now it looks like pure genius. He's being offered plenty enough (cough Latrell Sprewell cough) and he needs to stop reading his own press clippings and show and demonstrate that he wants to play football, and is in the NFL for something more than the exorbitant pay.

I can. We would've reached an agreement with Reggie before the draft and this wouldn't be a problem. But I do admit that he should not be so uncoeperative (sp?). Still, Reggie is going to be a better NFL player, and I'd still rather have him on our team.

MorKnolle
07-22-2006, 12:44 PM
I can. We would've reached an agreement with Reggie before the draft and this wouldn't be a problem. But I do admit that he should not be so uncoeperative (sp?). Still, Reggie is going to be a better NFL player, and I'd still rather have him on our team.

This absolutely can't be certain at this point, especially given the fact that he will be a backup RB for a bad NFL team this year and will be behind everyone else in picking up the new offense as he holds out, assuming he even gets signed.

jerek
07-22-2006, 03:07 PM
I can. We would've reached an agreement with Reggie before the draft and this wouldn't be a problem. But I do admit that he should not be so uncoeperative (sp?). Still, Reggie is going to be a better NFL player, and I'd still rather have him on our team.

Sure, we would have an agreement with Bush before we drafted him. And then he has a good year, or a decent year, or a whatever year, and thinks he should be renegotiated, or receive a bigger bonus, or touch the ball more. Or whatever. My point is, I don't know what the Saints have really offered him -- maybe they really are lowballing him -- but he is already entering this season with more endorsement money than any other NFL rookie and possibly soon to be NFL player. IIRC he has publicly stated that he "deserves to be paid #1 money" and there have been nonstop rumors that he wants more than Mario, when the NFL first round draft has for years been characterized by rookie pay according to draft slot. Him haggling over a few million when he's already in line to receive mid eight figures from NFL salary alone is IMO pure greed and indicative of a larger character issue that can and presumably will interfere with a cohesive locker room and winning.

No one's denying a player's right to pursue what he feels is fair value, but IMO he is asking for more than fair value at this point, and some of the things he and his representation have slipped to the media (or at least reported as saying) are crossing the line that separates individual interests from team chemistry.

edo783
07-22-2006, 03:26 PM
I can. We would've reached an agreement with Reggie before the draft and this wouldn't be a problem.

That's the point. No we wouldn't have been reaching agreement based on how his team was acting, and then you wind up in the situation NO finds themselves in except then he is the number 1 pick and then would really jack up his demands. IMO, we dodged a real bullet when we didn't take him. Is he a talent, you bet he is. Has he got an overinflated sense of self...you better believe it. Who ever gets him had better be prepared for him having his hand out for more money everytime you turn around. I suspect that he is going to turn into a 3 ring circus as damaging as TO is.

CloakNNNdagger
07-22-2006, 10:40 PM
Speculation is from pillar to post. But one thing's for sure, if greed is what most are thinking is driving this mess with Bush, then the greater potential for losses that may force him back to the table (if those few brain cells start functioning again) easily also smacks of the same.......ie., greed
***********************

From PFT
POSTED 9:38 p.m. EDT, July 22, 2006

"AMATEUR HOUR" IN BUSH CAMP

Reaction from league insiders is pouring in to PFT world headquarters regarding Jason Cole's report that Saints tailback Reggie Bush is contemplating the possibility of sitting out the 2006 entire season and re-entering the draft, if he doesn't get an offer from the team to his liking.

And the reaction is not positive.

Said one league insider with experience negotiating high-level deals, "[It] sounds like amateur hour. If you are gonna hold out, you don't talk about it. You just do it."

Added the source: "It's not the best way to create leverage. If he goes back into the draft, is he guaranteed to be the first pick? If he can't [be the No. 1 overall pick] off a Heisman campaign, then he certainly isn't going to do it sitting out the year. Plus, the endorsement companies are really gonna love him if he doesn't play."

Endorsements are a key component of this equation. Although Cole's item on Yahoo! Sports notes that Bush already has pocketed $5 million in off-field money, a source with experience negotiating such contracts for NFL players says that the deals routinely require that the guy must, you know, play football in order to get and/or keep the money.

The move also entails high stakes -- and high costs -- for agent Joel Segal. "It would kill his recruiting," said the source who provided the "amateur hour" quote. "Wherever he goes people would ask him about it, and all parents would think, 'Why is he in my house when he should be working on Reggie's deal?'

"Plus, Segal wants to get paid," said the source. "If he waits a year he could get fired, and then he loses everything."

The source's prediction? "A holdout won't last more than five-to-ten days max, if at all."


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

REGGIE HAS A MORTGAGE

Another fact that Team Bush needs to keep in mind if contemplating a season-long holdout, which could risk all of part of that $5 million in marketing money, is the impact of this maneuver on his ability to pay the rent.
link (http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm)

TexanFan881
07-22-2006, 10:57 PM
I think the Saints have more control in this than Reggie does. I think Reggie is smart enough to know that he could get no money and screw up his career if he doesn't work something out. He might be greedy but he's not stupid.

CloakNNNdagger
07-23-2006, 08:08 AM
I think the Saints have more control in this than Reggie does. I think Reggie is smart enough to know that he could get no money and screw up his career if he doesn't work something out. He might be greedy but he's not stupid.

There had to be some element of "stupidity" involved not to have anticipated the resulting course of events.


Addendum from PFT (http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm):

POSTED 5:30 a.m. EDT; UPDATED 6:30 a.m. EDT, July 23, 2006

REGGIE PAID CASH FOR CONDO

A source with knowledge of the transaction involving Reggie Bush and the prior owner of a condo that was sold to Bush for $1.8 million tells us that Bush paid cash.

It's a riverfront property only blocks from the Superdome, and the condo is nearly 4,000 square feet in size. The monthly condo fees for the building are more than $2,500.

The property was listed at $2.2 million, and we're told that there are plenty of newer and less expensive condos being built in the area, so it likely will be difficult for Bush to get his money (and/or any appreciation) out of the property when the time comes to sell it.

Also, with $1.8 million in after-tax dollars of his $5 million in pre-tax endorsement money already gone, it could be that he can't afford to sit out the season as a negotiating tactic with the Saints.

CloakNNNdagger
07-23-2006, 11:10 AM
For those of you who in this case have called Benson (Saints owner) a "cheap skate," try to remember how badly he was "burned" with Ricky Williams. Ditka forced his hand in giving Willaims an 8-year contract potentially worth $68 million (remember this was in 1999 dollars)...........and having him trade all of his 1999 draft picks (and the 1st and 3rd picks in the 2000 draft.......9 picks in all) to get Williams, the first time one player was the only draft pick of an NFL team. All of this, just to move from the 12th pick of the 1999 draft to the 5th.
Bud definitely be referred to as "Cheap." Benson, at least in this case may better be characterized as "Gun-shy"..........or maybe even "Wise."

Tulip
07-23-2006, 12:31 PM
For those of you who in this case have called Benson (Saints owner) a "cheap skate," try to remember how badly he was "burned" with Ricky Williams. Ditka forced his hand in giving Willaims an 8-year contract potentially worth $68 million (remember this was in 1999 dollars)...........and having him trade all of his 1999 draft picks (and the 1st and 3rd picks in the 2000 draft.......9 picks in all) to get Williams, the first time one player was the only draft pick of an NFL team. All of this, just to move from the 12th pick of the 1999 draft to the 5th.
Bud definitely be referred to as "Cheap." Benson, at least in this case may better be characterized as "Gun-shy"..........or maybe even "Wise."

If I remember correctly, the Ricky Williams contract was filled with impossible-to-reach incentives that made his then agent Master P reviled for getting his client one of the worst contracts in NFL history. He was a very attractive trade prospect, and Miami was happy to get a heck of a deal when they took over Ricky's cheap contract. I don't remember the Saints getting burned at all with that contract.

NoBullTexan
07-23-2006, 05:14 PM
HOLDOUT: One that withholds agreement or consent upon which progress is contingent.

It is amazing how we, as fans, tend to rationalize what our teams have done, or in this case, not done.

The Saints fan would have us believe that Reggie Bush is not acting selfish. The fact is Reggie Bush has a disconcerting habit of acting like a choir boy in front of cameras, and for the press, but behind closed doors, he is acting like a problem child. Is it just his ego, or is it something deeper, something about New Orleans being a small market to begin with, trying to come back from a natural disaster, #2, and that Benson is a penny pincher? The fact is until Bush DOES sign, this will be on people's minds.

There was another reason the Texans took Mario over Reggie. Mario will play the full game; Reggie (with his matchstick legs) will only get 17-18 carries a game. And, since they have so much money invested in him, the Saints will not want him returning kicks.

CloakNNNdagger
07-23-2006, 07:34 PM
HOLDOUT: One that withholds agreement or consent upon which progress is contingent.

It is amazing how we, as fans, tend to rationalize what our teams have done, or in this case, not done.

The Saints fan would have us believe that Reggie Bush is not acting selfish. The fact is Reggie Bush has a disconcerting habit of acting like a choir boy in front of cameras, and for the press, but behind closed doors, he is acting like a problem child. Is it just his ego, or is it something deeper, something about New Orleans being a small market to begin with, trying to come back from a natural disaster, #2, and that Benson is a penny pincher? The fact is until Bush DOES sign, this will be on people's minds.

There was another reason the Texans took Mario over Reggie. Mario will play the full game; Reggie (with his matchstick legs) will only get 17-18 carries a game. And, since they have so much money invested in him, the Saints will not want him returning kicks.

And I'm also getting tired of his projecting of philanthropist. As discussed on ESPN Radio 790 yesterday, his major donations and police fleet of Hummers were incorporated into his endorsement deals. No problem taking credit.........Generous with others' money...........And by the way, there was a call in segment where most of the Saints fans were catching on to Bush's apparent generosity was probably planned organized by he and his agent strictly for leverage purposes from the beginning..........especially after there was so much emphasis by hs agent in interviews challenging anyone to name any other draftee that had ever donated to a city.......prior to getting his money. Hmmm, could that possibly hinted of things to come?

Koolaid Time
07-23-2006, 11:06 PM
And I'm also getting tired of his projecting of philanthropist. As discussed on ESPN Radio 790 yesterday, his major donations and police fleet of Hummers were incorporated into his endorsement deals. No problem taking credit.........Generous with others' money...........And by the way, there was a call in segment where most of the Saints fans were catching on to Bush's apparent generosity was probably planned organized by he and his agent strictly for leverage purposes from the beginning..........especially after there was so much emphasis by hs agent in interviews challenging anyone to name any other draftee that had ever donated to a city.......prior to getting his money. Hmmm, could that possibly hinted of things to come?


Reggie should have "donated" a small fleet of boats. My wife is an engineer and she says in their present condition the New Orleans levees will be lucky if they can withstand a catagory 2 storm this year...

CloakNNNdagger
07-24-2006, 05:55 PM
Reggie should have "donated" a small fleet of boats. My wife is an engineer and she says in their present condition the New Orleans levees will be lucky if they can withstand a catagory 2 storm this year...

You all might want to read this article from the Times Picayune to better understand where the money has really come from and how well OCHESTRATED this whole donation thing has been. http://www.realgmfootball.com/src_wiretap_archives/2307/20060630/bush_does_charity_work_in_new_orleans_before_signi ng_contract/

powerfuldragon
07-24-2006, 06:49 PM
If there is a football God, please do not let us take Brady Quinn or Reggie Bush.
agreed. We do NOT want another top five pick.

CloakNNNdagger
07-24-2006, 08:04 PM
Reggie's decided not to sign with the Saints because he heard that a recent "unexpected vacancy" has become available with a high profile CFL team. Segal intends to structure his contract with "likely to be attained" lucrative incentives ...........including the team and its assets when he attains his 3,000 yard rushing season. Meanwhile, Reggie was measured for and has ordered a custom Stetson 10 gallon hat.......Ironically, it'll end up way way too tight for his 10 gallon head.........he evidently does not understanding that a 10 gallon hat doesn't mean 10 gallon displacement.

zwz404
07-25-2006, 12:49 AM
I have to laugh at all you anti-Bushers.
V Young hasn't signed either.
And what about anything he has supposely done for charity?
I guess VY is Jesus Christ and Bush is Satan.

If you don't think Bush will be that good, you may be right. Only Time
will tell. Who knew Ryan Leaf would suck and Brady would be great?
But, I worry about a DE who didn't get any sacks against the
better ACC teams. And OFF holding in the NFL is joke. They might as
well drop the penality.

But, to compare Bush's character using a different yardstick than the one
used for VY just isn't fair.
When VY didn't win the Heisman, he was a poor loser.
When UT beat USC, Bush was a gracious loser.
And who is threating to tear us up when we meet later in the year?
I've been rooting for VY the last 3 years, but I was disappointed at
his immaturity.
And given the way VY throws, I hope he is starting when they come
to play here. It might be the 1st home game we win.

Dime
07-25-2006, 02:22 AM
Reggie should have "donated" a small fleet of boats. My wife is an engineer and she says in their present condition the New Orleans levees will be lucky if they can withstand a catagory 2 storm this year...

I am a former meteorlogist and I can tell you two things about this.

First, New Orleans WAS NOT hit by a hurricane last year. In addition, New Orleans levies were not breached by storm sturge either. Fact, two barges broke away from thier morings and impacted the levies causing them to fail. Not the hurricane.

Secondly, New Orleans is built on a lake bed. It has been sinking approx 1 to 6 inches a year. The levies were built to the specifications to withstand winds to at max, a Cat 3 storm. The pumps, however, which pump out rain water out of New Orleans are projected to flood at a cat 3 storm. No pumps working, no water leaves the city.

We had predicted if a Cat 3 or greater storm hits New Orleans, then the levies would not have a chance. Lucky to date, New Orleans hasnt had a Cat 3 (or a Cat 1 for that matter) been hit head on. It will happen one day, but when it happens, it will only make things worse. Personally, I am nervous if it happens within the next few years. If it does, considerable thought might go into how viable it will be to rebuild a city with a ever growing worsening sitution.

swtbound07
07-25-2006, 02:24 AM
I am a former meteorlogist and I can tell you two things about this.

First, New Orleans WAS NOT hit by a hurricane last year. In addition, New Orleans levies were not breached by storm sturge either. Fact, two barges broke away from thier morings and impacted the levies causing them to fail. Not the hurricane.

Secondly, New Orleans is built on a lake bed. It has been sinking approx 1 to 6 inches a year. The levies were built to the specifications to withstand winds to at max, a Cat 3 storm. The pumps, however, which pump out rain water out of New Orleans are projected to flood at a cat 3 storm. No pumps working, no water leaves the city.

We had predicted if a Cat 3 or greater storm hits New Orleans, then the levies would not have a chance. Lucky to date, New Orleans hasnt had a Cat 3 (or a Cat 1 for that matter) been hit head on. It will happen one day, but when it happens, it will only make things worse. Personally, I am nervous if it happens within the next few years. If it does, considerable thought might go into how viable it will be to rebuild a city with a ever growing worsening sitution.

WHAT???? I think you better go tell that to a lot of television stations, radio stations, newspapers, refugees, and rescue workers....because THIS part of america seems to be under the impression that new orleans was in fact hit by a hurricane.

Dime
07-25-2006, 07:14 AM
WHAT???? I think you better go tell that to a lot of television stations, radio stations, newspapers, refugees, and rescue workers....because THIS part of america seems to be under the impression that new orleans was in fact hit by a hurricane.

No... it is just the excuse they are using to sell newspapers, etc. If JQ public knew that two companies whose barges broke loose caused all of this, those companies would be in ruin and the outrage would be even worse. No insurance company would be able to fend off the amounts seen in New Orleans. The media was the one who blamed it on Katrina. No one saw any reason to correct them. Oh, one other thing here. If this damage occurred due to less than Tropical Storm winds (which it did, it was well away from the eye wall, what would it be like being hit head on - political nightmare).

BTW.. if you get a chance to see the early helicopter footage of the levies failing, check out the footage of the barge that was setting inside the levy walls. Once it hit and broke the levies, one of the barges parked itself right beside the break point inside the wall.

For the record, the hurricane (category 3) turned east on approach to New Orleans and the eye wall landed well east of New Orleans. The wind speed registered under the maximum for the TS(in New Orleans), and the storm surge I believe was around the 10 foot range (if that seems like alot, it isnt.. alot of cat 3 storm surges go 20-30 or more ft.)

Kaiser Toro
07-25-2006, 08:47 AM
When VY didn't win the Heisman, he was a poor loser.
When UT beat USC, Bush was a gracious loser.

So you are comparing an individual popularity contest to a champisonhisp game that is decided on the field? Seems fair and balanced.

My only question is do you want the best player on your team being gracious while they were not even on the field for the most important play of the year? I think not. Athletics does not build character, it reveals it.

tulexan
07-25-2006, 09:05 AM
No... it is just the excuse they are using to sell newspapers, etc. If JQ public knew that two companies whose barges broke loose caused all of this, those companies would be in ruin and the outrage would be even worse. No insurance company would be able to fend off the amounts seen in New Orleans. The media was the one who blamed it on Katrina. No one saw any reason to correct them. Oh, one other thing here. If this damage occurred due to less than Tropical Storm winds (which it did, it was well away from the eye wall, what would it be like being hit head on - political nightmare).

BTW.. if you get a chance to see the early helicopter footage of the levies failing, check out the footage of the barge that was setting inside the levy walls. Once it hit and broke the levies, one of the barges parked itself right beside the break point inside the wall.

For the record, the hurricane (category 3) turned east on approach to New Orleans and the eye wall landed well east of New Orleans. The wind speed registered under the maximum for the TS(in New Orleans), and the storm surge I believe was around the 10 foot range (if that seems like alot, it isnt.. alot of cat 3 storm surges go 20-30 or more ft.)

I don't even know how to respond to this. The levees failed because the Army Corps of Engineers only drove the pilings of the levees about 20 or so feet deep, which was still loose sediment, when they should have been about 100 feet deep. Yes, there was a barge that was loose that caused a lot of damage, but one barge can't cause damage to an entire levee system.

El Tejano
07-25-2006, 09:27 AM
I think this goes to show that Bush was just not wanting to sign when we wanted him to before the draft.

tulexan
07-25-2006, 09:42 AM
I think this goes to show that Bush was just not wanting to sign when we wanted him to before the draft.

I disagree. I think he would have been signed by now if we drafted him. I think our problem with him were character related and that Kubiak and staff believed that Mario was a better fit for the Texans in the long run.

Titan "Tack" Fan
07-25-2006, 09:42 AM
I am a former meteorlogist and I can tell you two things about this.

First, New Orleans WAS NOT hit by a hurricane last year. In addition, New Orleans levies were not breached by storm sturge either. Fact, two barges broke away from thier morings and impacted the levies causing them to fail. Not the hurricane.

Secondly, New Orleans is built on a lake bed. It has been sinking approx 1 to 6 inches a year. The levies were built to the specifications to withstand winds to at max, a Cat 3 storm. The pumps, however, which pump out rain water out of New Orleans are projected to flood at a cat 3 storm. No pumps working, no water leaves the city.

We had predicted if a Cat 3 or greater storm hits New Orleans, then the levies would not have a chance. Lucky to date, New Orleans hasnt had a Cat 3 (or a Cat 1 for that matter) been hit head on. It will happen one day, but when it happens, it will only make things worse. Personally, I am nervous if it happens within the next few years. If it does, considerable thought might go into how viable it will be to rebuild a city with a ever growing worsening sitution.

A meteorologist who can't spell "levees" right?

The hurricane caused the levees to fail dude, you're dead wrong. I lived in southern Louisiana during the hurricane and was taking an Oceanography class at LSU and we studied the hurricane. Nice try though. New Orleans was destroyed by a HURRICANE with FLOODING caused by the hurricane. You sound like a moron saying that a hurricane didn't cause the damage in New Orleans.

texan279
07-25-2006, 10:12 AM
Cold Pizza just reported that before the draft that New Orleans guaranteed Bush #1 pick money.

powerfuldragon
07-25-2006, 10:31 AM
If JQ public knew that two companies whose barges broke loose caused all of this, those companies would be in ruin and the outrage would be even worse.

One of them must've been Halliburton. Amirite? :D

cuppacoffee
07-25-2006, 11:46 AM
Not taking sides here. I was pro-Bush before the draft, but I thought I would share this line from everyones? favorite rumor site.

"Saints G.M. Mickey Loomis says that talks with RB Reggie Bush are "proceeding on a normal course." (So is the war in Iraq.)

The site does get in a few good 'digs' once in a while. They are really dogging the Bengals.

Rumor Mill (http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm)

:coffee:

tulexan
07-25-2006, 01:48 PM
So you're saying that less that T/S winds caused the roof of the SuperDome to fly off??? and all the wind damage to buildings??

No the barges caused the damage to the roof of the Superdome and 90 percent of the houses in SELA.

Haven't you been listening?

Titan "Tack" Fan
07-25-2006, 01:52 PM
No the barges caused the damage to the roof of the Superdome and 90 percent of the houses in SELA.

Haven't you been listening?

Yeah I know my friends house in Slidell was affected by the barges, not the hurricane :sarcasm:

HOU-TEX
07-25-2006, 02:21 PM
I am a former meteorlogist and I can tell you two things about this.

First, New Orleans WAS NOT hit by a hurricane last year. In addition, New Orleans levies were not breached by storm sturge either. Fact, two barges broke away from thier morings and impacted the levies causing them to fail. Not the hurricane.

Secondly, New Orleans is built on a lake bed. It has been sinking approx 1 to 6 inches a year. The levies were built to the specifications to withstand winds to at max, a Cat 3 storm. The pumps, however, which pump out rain water out of New Orleans are projected to flood at a cat 3 storm. No pumps working, no water leaves the city.

We had predicted if a Cat 3 or greater storm hits New Orleans, then the levies would not have a chance. Lucky to date, New Orleans hasnt had a Cat 3 (or a Cat 1 for that matter) been hit head on. It will happen one day, but when it happens, it will only make things worse. Personally, I am nervous if it happens within the next few years. If it does, considerable thought might go into how viable it will be to rebuild a city with a ever growing worsening sitution.

Weren't the levees supposed to be upgraded years ago? With the Mayer of NO and the Gov of La.,I'm not surprised at all by what happened. They're morons! I like NOs alot but they ruined it. You didn't see Mississippi whining as much as La and they took the brunt of the storm. Idiotic state officials and an idiot for an NFL team owner. I feel sorry for SOME of the people of NO.:brickwall

Bearfan Blue and Orange
07-25-2006, 02:33 PM
Reggie Bush may sit out for this season. He already has about $5 Million in endorsements already.

I am so glad Texans are not having to deal with that!!!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AtQ7eYGOF5tmo_CfsXqFQBE5nYcB?slug=jc-bush072106&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

NoBullTexan
07-25-2006, 02:38 PM
I told you so!

Bobo
07-25-2006, 02:40 PM
Reggie Bush may sit out for this season. He already has about $5 Million in endorsements already.

I am so glad Texans are not having to deal with that!!!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AtQ7eYGOF5tmo_CfsXqFQBE5nYcB?slug=jc-bush072106&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

Several days old. Most analysts believe it's just posturing and he will ultimately sign.

cincyTEXAN
07-25-2006, 02:41 PM
just heard the same thing...... oh so sweet.

El Tejano
07-25-2006, 02:48 PM
Bobby Mcnair knows a business man when he sees one.

Dime
07-25-2006, 06:07 PM
A meteorologist who can't spell "levees" right?

The hurricane caused the levees to fail dude, you're dead wrong. I lived in southern Louisiana during the hurricane and was taking an Oceanography class at LSU and we studied the hurricane. Nice try though. New Orleans was destroyed by a HURRICANE with FLOODING caused by the hurricane. You sound like a moron saying that a hurricane didn't cause the damage in New Orleans.

You are quite bright for a Titan fan... No common sense, but quite bright for them. Lets see.. Lets check the tape on where the eye made landfall... You dont have a clue what your talking about. Try 4 years in OU for the Meteorology program and 6 years Military service as a Meteoroloist.. And you think you know more by going to LSU... ROFL. Do research before you talk. Oh.. and read what I said... Winds did cause damage, but the storm surge did not break the levees.

Dime
07-25-2006, 06:15 PM
So you're saying that less that T/S winds caused the roof of the SuperDome to fly off??? and all the wind damage to buildings??

You are right.. I called a few of my buds down in NO and they did receive gusts up to 110mph with about 80 mph average. That means it was a low cat 1 winds (some good gusts though, but we use average wind speed for rating them).

Dime
07-25-2006, 06:22 PM
Weren't the levees supposed to be upgraded years ago? With the Mayer of NO and the Gov of La.,I'm not surprised at all by what happened. They're morons! I like NOs alot but they ruined it. You didn't see Mississippi whining as much as La and they took the brunt of the storm. Idiotic state officials and an idiot for an NFL team owner. I feel sorry for SOME of the people of NO.:brickwall


Yes... as someone stated earlier, they were built poorly. One gets me is that my major about 7-8 years back was sent to a meeting with FEMA in California. Thier discussion, 3 items. What ifs.. the three that made the top list. #3 Another terror attack on New York (btw, discussed this because of the first WTC attack), #2 Hurricane Cat 4 or greater to NO. It was very freaky remembering the conversations.

Dime
07-25-2006, 06:24 PM
Reggie Bush may sit out for this season. He already has about $5 Million in endorsements already.

I am so glad Texans are not having to deal with that!!!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AtQ7eYGOF5tmo_CfsXqFQBE5nYcB?slug=jc-bush072106&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

I dont see how he can do this. I understand the logic he is trying to make, but I dont believe it. There is NO way he will make his money goal if he sits out. It will majorly hurt him, and anyone he trys to sign on with later?

TwinSisters
07-25-2006, 07:13 PM
One of them must've been Halliburton. Amirite

WHOA! Really? Wait until I tell the President about this. He will fix it. He can fix anything. He's a decider.

Brandon420tx
07-25-2006, 09:30 PM
Yes... as someone stated earlier, they were built poorly. One gets me is that my major about 7-8 years back was sent to a meeting with FEMA in California. Thier discussion, 3 items. What ifs.. the three that made the top list. #3 Another terror attack on New York (btw, discussed this because of the first WTC attack), #2 Hurricane Cat 4 or greater to NO. It was very freaky remembering the conversations.

Wasn't one of them a major earthquake to the California area, splitting the fault line cleanly in 2?

Anguyen
07-25-2006, 11:36 PM
So far he i a hold out along with about 30 other 1st round draft picks.. second of all training camp hasn't even started. and to all that says he should get 2nd pick money.. Tell me what IS 2nd pick money??????
Ronnie Brown was 2nd pick last year contract 5 years $35m. Bush should get 5 year $45M IMO

CloakNNNdagger
07-26-2006, 09:14 AM
At least there are some people outside of New Orleans that appreciate the potential "damage" done to so many by a "personal" decision made by one person..........and not too impressed that that person try to squeeze out that extra 3 or 4 million dollars to an already lucrative situation.

http://www.timesenterprise.com/sports/local_story_206234851.html?keyword=secondarystory

Titan "Tack" Fan
07-26-2006, 09:16 AM
You are quite bright for a Titan fan... No common sense, but quite bright for them. Lets see.. Lets check the tape on where the eye made landfall... You dont have a clue what your talking about. Try 4 years in OU for the Meteorology program and 6 years Military service as a Meteoroloist.. And you think you know more by going to LSU... ROFL. Do research before you talk. Oh.. and read what I said... Winds did cause damage, but the storm surge did not break the levees.

LSU has one of the best oceanography departments in the country. FYI.

tulexan
07-26-2006, 09:21 AM
You are quite bright for a Titan fan... No common sense, but quite bright for them. Lets see.. Lets check the tape on where the eye made landfall... You dont have a clue what your talking about. Try 4 years in OU for the Meteorology program and 6 years Military service as a Meteoroloist.. And you think you know more by going to LSU... ROFL. Do research before you talk. Oh.. and read what I said... Winds did cause damage, but the storm surge did not break the levees.

How did a barge that got loose around the Industrial canal affect the 17th Street canal several miles away?

D-Vizzl
07-26-2006, 09:37 AM
:fortune:

Bush Bowl II

Sunday December 31st in the year of our Lord 2006
Houston, Texas.

at 3:11, Kris Brown shanks another late 4th quarter field goal and the Texans beat out the Cleveland Browns for the 2007 number one over all draft spot.

April 8th, after Easter celebrations the Fanzone is invaded by the 20,000 Catholics that insist Rick Smith is going to select Brady Quinn.

April 9th, the California Student Body Left counters with a 22,000 man rebuttal about how David Carr just needs to adjust to the new system, new lineman, and insist that Reggie Bush must be taken this time around so that he can finally reach his potential.

May 1st, the Texans pass over Bush twice for stand out DT Bob Womerjeik from Cottageville CC, South Carolina. GM Rick Smith press release states that it is obviously a football decision, "The guy is a monster and has good character... I mean he got 3 sacks in one game against Folly Beach U last season. I've never seen anything like it in my one year has GM in the NFL."

June 23rd, the Cleveland Browns gloating over their fortunes in getting the best player in football for the past 50 years, sell out their season tickets for the first time since Jim Brown played.

August 10th, Reggie Bush states that he will hold out until the 2008 draft because the NFL will still not allow him to wear number 5. Reggie's agents make sure that it is known that it breaks Reggie's heart not to be able to play in Cleveland. It's just business and the NFL started it.

April 27th, 2008 New York City: the Los Angeles Trojans select Reggie Bush as the first player to be taken in their newly awarded franchise. Bush being able to wear number 5 was part of the charter agreement. In fact, the number 5 is passed as a registered trademark in California legislature. Any team visiting L.A. with a player using the number 5 must be changed out or be fined 5,000 dollars for each day they are in the State with a number 5 on their roster.

Sep 14th, 2008 The NFL enters a new era of 5 slash 05 for all players that wanted to be number 5 but didn't get to. Reggie Bush single-handedly changes the game of football.

:fortune:

Maybe when L.A takes him he refuses to sign unless he receives "already in the league eight year money".:ok:

D-Vizzl
07-26-2006, 09:45 AM
Ronnie Brown was 2nd pick last year contract 5 years $35m. Bush should get 5 year $45M IMO

Reggie Bush is definitely being a prima donna but at the same time if anyone has draft day coverage watch for when Tom Benson gets interviewed, he opens up his mouth and the words that he may soon regret come out. "Reggie Bush may have been the second pick, but we will negotiate with him as if he were the first" his words. Stand for something or fall for anything!!

HOU-TEX
07-26-2006, 10:05 AM
What are the Saints offering him? Is it way below what it should be? you don't know and I don't know so till then it is stupid to try to say his holdout is no warrented. If it's way to low then it's the saints fault. if it's about where it should be then Reggie's fault. Right!!

How does one know "where it should be"? Is there a guide somewhere? Either way you look at it, NO is not the place for Bush to be. I doubt he'll get what he wants due to the organizations demise.

infantrycak
07-26-2006, 10:19 AM
How does one know "where it should be"? Is there a guide somewhere? Either way you look at it, NO is not the place for Bush to be. I doubt he'll get what he wants due to the organizations demise.

In general the ball park is determined by looking at the same draft slot last year and increasing that by approximately the % increase in the salary cap this season.

CloakNNNdagger
07-26-2006, 11:52 AM
What are the Saints offering him? Is it way below what it should be? you don't know and I don't know so till then it is stupid to try to say his holdout is no warrented. If it's way to low then it's the saints fault. if it's about where it should be then Reggie's fault. Right!!

Independent of the Saints' unknown offer, we do know that the Bush camp expects Mario's #1 pic money or more......an imperically unreasonable expectation no matter what face anyone tries to put on it.

CloakNNNdagger
07-26-2006, 12:40 PM
Commentary from CBS Sportsline: Bush Pushes Luck (http://www.sportsline.com/columns/story/9572355)

This was a fan's response to the above article:

To all of the fans who agree with Bush holding out, lets play a little role reversal. Go to work tomorrow and demand more money from YOUR boss. When he says you're NOT getting it, tell him you're not coming to work until you do. See how quickly your ass is on the unemployment line with your thumb up your ass. Why should it be any different for athletes who make millions? Hey Reggie and all of the other greedy MF'ers out there, what makes you better than any of the other working men in this world?

real
07-26-2006, 12:50 PM
Hey Reggie and all of the other greedy MF'ers out there, what makes you better than any of the other working men in this world?

LEVERAGE...The difference between R.B and ...well...the average person...is that Reggie Bush can demand more money, get fired...1) and still be Rich 2) have a new, better job offer from 31 employers....

My Message to Reggie: Get ya paper playa

tulexan
07-26-2006, 01:08 PM
I think that he will eventually sign, but it's not going to be anytime soon. If he is convinced that he was the best talent in the draft and should be paid accordingly, he is going to wait until he gets his money. I think he will most likely sign before the season starts, but will probably miss a pre-season game or two.

Mr. White
07-26-2006, 01:08 PM
I think we all saw what this guy was about in the Rose Bowl when he made his ill-advised lateral to the Texas D.

He thought his superior talent and the hype surrounding it would overcome physics.

He'll never say it out loud, but IMO, he really does think he's "Jesus in cleats." There isn't enough money in New Orleans to sign him.

Ryan
07-26-2006, 01:26 PM
I dont see how he can do this. I understand the logic he is trying to make, but I dont believe it. There is NO way he will make his money goal if he sits out. It will majorly hurt him, and anyone he trys to sign on with later?

i dont think if the texans got him they wouldnt be in this mess....bc if he is the first voerall pick he has to get first overall pick money

Mr. White
07-26-2006, 01:32 PM
Not trying to be a smart @$$ or anything but prove to me where he is trying to be Jesus in cleats.? where is you 're backup other than you're fellow Texan fans that want him to fail so you're front office will look like they made the right pick in Mario?? I'll read any links with Quotes or any other proof you have to back up what you said..

I really don't have any reason for wanting to see him fail. After the fumble in the Rose Bowl, I just didn't want the guy playing for Houston. I thought the fumble showed something negative about his character.

He's mastered the art of public relations, so I don't think he'll ever say anything to the media that'll make him look bad. He'll never say he's "Jesus in cleats", but it would stand to reason that he believes his own hype.

El Tejano
07-26-2006, 02:05 PM
The difference between Reggie and us is you can spend 90 mil on Reggie and the return will be 200 Mil +. If I hold out with my employer he can hire someone to do my job for 10,000 less than what I make and the chances of that person doing a better job are alot better than the chances of another RB doing Reggie's job.

He will go back in the draft and go to the new LA team. LA needs someone to fill the seats and in Cali that is exactly what Reggie will do.

CloakNNNdagger
07-26-2006, 03:22 PM
Reggie Bush is definitely being a prima donna but at the same time if anyone has draft day coverage watch for when Tom Benson gets interviewed, he opens up his mouth and the words that he may soon regret come out. "Reggie Bush may have been the second pick, but we will negotiate with him as if he were the first" his words. Stand for something or fall for anything!!

One "small correction"........what was said was "Reggie Bush may have been the second pick, but we will treat him as if her were the first."........big difference, as they HAVE TREATED HIM like THE KING.

link (http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060720/SPORTS02/607200380/1063/sports02)

"We're confident the Saints will live up to what they stated at the beginning, that Reggie would be treated like the top pick," Ornstein said. "He's been at every camp, at every workout, out in the community. The Saints sold 15,000 season tickets the week after he was drafted. His impact has been huge."

This is only one of many sources which the media have on several occasions precisely quoted Bush's own mouthpiece, Orenstein. Had Benson included the words "negotiate with him......." those words would no doubt been captilized, underlined and bolded in 10 foot letters.......and Segal et. al would be going for the throat without mercy. But that was NOT said and the Busch camp is trying to encourage this misinterpretation to the man on the street , who they know will likely equate the two phrases.

Anguyen
07-26-2006, 06:17 PM
i dont think if the texans got him they wouldnt be in this mess....bc if he is the first voerall pick he has to get first overall pick money
It doesn't matter who pick him that team will have trouble signing. If he willing to take #1 money he could have it done with the Texans.

hollywood_texan
07-26-2006, 06:58 PM
I don't see how Reggie sitting out one year will actually make him more money.

He might sign a bigger contract the next year, but he will lose out on $6 to $8million he could have made the first year.

Therefore, if he doesn't play this year, his contract next year has to be the amount he wanted this year, plus inflation, and then he has to make up for the money he lost in the year he didn't play.

There is an opportunity cost factor that must be evaluated.

Reggie will sign right before the season or shortly thereafter. Unless, he really doesn't want to play in New Orleans.

Dime
07-26-2006, 11:05 PM
Wasn't one of them a major earthquake to the California area, splitting the fault line cleanly in 2? Umm that was close to number one. The number one was a 9.0 or greater earthquake in califonia.

TwinSisters
07-27-2006, 01:53 AM
I don't see how Reggie sitting out one year will actually make him more money.

He might sign a bigger contract the next year, but he will lose out on $6 to $8million he could have made the first year.

Therefore, if he doesn't play this year, his contract next year has to be the amount he wanted this year, plus inflation, and then he has to make up for the money he lost in the year he didn't play.

There is an opportunity cost factor that must be evaluated.

Reggie will sign right before the season or shortly thereafter. Unless, he really doesn't want to play in New Orleans.

Well thinking about it... you could sign this year and play for the Saints and earn less then a few million from local endorsements. OR hold out and get picked up by somebody like the Jets, Raiders, 49ers in a market that you can easily make 10-20 million a year on local endorsements alone.

Going back into the draft would not hurt him. Houston is not going to touch him. Even if his rights get traded, Houston is still not going to trade for him and most likely the New York teams would. Barber is aging. Martin is almost done. Even Boston could use him.

Barber 10 years
Martin 12 years
Dillon 10 years

The smart money is in getting to one of those larger national markets.

He started out with the LA market in his fold.
He cracked the Southern states by being available to the Texans and then drafted by the Saints.
Get picked up by a Northeast team and you have shopped 3/5ths of the Nation.

All he has to do is make it look like the Saints don't want to give him what he deserves. Public opinion is in his favour in this regard... and that's what generates his money in the first place.

A somewhat not-so-secret-secret ( but we will call it that, because it is so often overlooked that it is just as unknown as a secret ), a player and an agent looks at the bottom line. When a player can make up for millions of dollars in a large national market, he doesn't have to demand as much in salary cap space.

Leading the nation in all-purpose yards as a Saint, is not even worth half of what you get for doing the same thing in a Giants' uniform.
---

I do think he will sign in New Orleans though. Just pointing out how much money he loses by signing with them. If he says no... then there will be other teams that want him. His rep will be polished by the press of the team that could get him.

I saw NFL Network say something about it would hurt him like Ki-jana Carter... no @#*&$@ way. Reggie's hype is like two cubed the power of Ki-Jana Carter's.

TwinSisters
07-27-2006, 02:08 AM
good read i found. http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/9572349/1

I will help you out a little BroussardSaint

if the source is not named and it uses lines like an NFC Manager said this and that. Well what does that say?

Cheap crap and Prisco is a fraud.

Quarterback Kelly Stouffer should be a lesson to all those thinking of sitting out. He was drafted by the Arizona Cardinals in 1988, didn't like his contract offer and sat out the season. The Cardinals traded his rights to Seattle. He played sparingly and was out of football in 1993.

O-KAY little camper. Time for bed now * pat pat *

Kelly Stoufer is not even &%$&#^$ close to Bush. Schefter at least used Ki-Jana Carter for comparison. Jeez. That's pretty bad when your basic journalism skills cannot even measure up to Adam Schefter.

CloakNNNdagger
07-27-2006, 06:38 AM
The press is squeezing the situation for all its worth.:

Bush could make Texans fans live the torture again
(http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=111959)

TwinSisters
07-27-2006, 07:58 AM
"With the first pick in the 2007 National Football League Draft, the Houston Texans select Brady Quinn, quarterback from Notre Dame."

So, who's picking second next year?

It's not that hard to figure out.

---

The thing about all the Bo Jackson, John Elway, and Dave Winfield comparisons being tossed around is that all of them could play multiple sports. I am not sure Reggie could play basketball or baseball.

cuppacoffee
07-27-2006, 08:29 AM
Quote:
"With the first pick in the 2007 National Football League Draft, the Houston Texans select Brady Quinn, quarterback from Notre Dame."

I have defended Carr against the bashers, but damn, this would be hard to pass on.

My biggest fear?....the evil empire to the north will find a way to get another domer on their team. I fear the Weis/Parcells connection will doom many of my Irish to the dark side... :crying:

On the bright side...The Tacks will probably have the first pick in the draft next year and will be forced to pass/trade the rights to Quinn. :yahoo:


:coffee:

nunusguy
07-27-2006, 09:02 AM
Quote:
"With the first pick in the 2007 National Football League Draft, the Houston Texans select Brady Quinn, quarterback from Notre Dame."
I have defended Carr against the bashers, but damn, this would be hard to pass on.

One of the issues I hope to be resolved this year is the ambiguity factor about DC, therefor when the '07 college Draft rolls around you should be with
the anti Carr crowd or most of them should be supportive as you now are.

Hutch13
07-27-2006, 09:07 AM
It's not that hard to figure out.

---

The thing about all the Bo Jackson, John Elway, and Dave Winfield comparisons being tossed around is that all of them could play multiple sports. I am not sure Reggie could play basketball or baseball.


Hes probably a better batter than adam everett. The astros should sign him if he sits out a year :tease:

TwinSisters
07-27-2006, 09:08 AM
I have defended Carr against the bashers, but damn, this would be hard to pass on.

On the bright side...The Tacks will probably have the first pick in the draft next year and will be forced to pass/trade the rights to Quinn. :yahoo:


:coffee:

Yeah... Ugh-uh * slowly nodding head *

The Irish are primed to take the National Title and right now he has Heisman written all over him ( title or no title ).

TwinSisters
07-27-2006, 09:10 AM
Hes probably a better batter than adam everett. The astros should sign him if he sits out a year :tease:

Yeah or somebody signs him up to just sell tickets like Jordan.

* cymbal *

badump.

cuppacoffee
07-27-2006, 01:30 PM
One of the issues I hope to be resolved this year is the ambiguity factor about DC, therefor when the '07 college Draft rolls around you should be with the anti Carr crowd or most of them should be supportive as you now are.

There is no doubt that Carr will have to step it up this season. I have given him the benefit of the doubt up to this point due to the 'apparent' lack of decent coaching.

You have hit the nail on the head here.

I feel that many of us Texans fans will change our opinion of Carr, one way or another, this year.

:coffee:

El Tejano
07-27-2006, 02:02 PM
I don't see how Reggie sitting out one year will actually make him more money.

He might sign a bigger contract the next year, but he will lose out on $6 to $8million he could have made the first year.

Therefore, if he doesn't play this year, his contract next year has to be the amount he wanted this year, plus inflation, and then he has to make up for the money he lost in the year he didn't play.

There is an opportunity cost factor that must be evaluated.

Reggie will sign right before the season or shortly thereafter. Unless, he really doesn't want to play in New Orleans.

The marketability in NO was low before Katrina. It should be lower now. If he goes to another team he can get the 1st pick money and make up the rest in endorsements in his new highly marketable team.

tulexan
07-27-2006, 02:11 PM
The marketability in NO was low before Katrina. It should be lower now. If he goes to another team he can get the 1st pick money and make up the rest in endorsements in his new highly marketable team.

If he sits out a year, nobody is going to pay him 1st pick money because he won't be the first pick. He most likely won't even be the best running back in the draft if Adrian Peterson declares.

There is a little thing called the time value of money which means that a dollar today is worth more than a dollar next year.

Runner
07-27-2006, 02:59 PM
He will go back in the draft and go to the new LA team. LA needs someone to fill the seats and in Cali that is exactly what Reggie will do.

I seriously doubt Reggie sits out an entire year. That being said....

Wouldn't it be ironic if the Saints were the team in the City of the Angels next year?

HOU-TEX
07-27-2006, 04:16 PM
I seriously doubt Reggie sits out an entire year. That being said....

Wouldn't it be ironic if the Saints were the team in the City of the Angels next year?

Either way, I feel bad for the people of NO for just having to deal with Benson and the Bush deal.

Brandon420tx
07-28-2006, 06:25 PM
I don't know if this has been posted before but
http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/NO/9574800

JACKSON, Miss. (July 27, 2006) -- Reggie Bush missed a reporting deadline for the New Orleans Saints ' training camp Thursday evening.

Hookem Horns
07-28-2006, 10:55 PM
If he sits out a year, nobody is going to pay him 1st pick money because he won't be the first pick. He most likely won't even be the best running back in the draft if Adrian Peterson declares.



Reggie Bust isn't even the best RB on the team that drafted him. I will take Deuce McCallister over Bush. McCallister is an every down back and not some gimmick player.

Texans_Chick
07-28-2006, 11:35 PM
I don't know if this has been posted before but
http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/NO/9574800

JACKSON, Miss. (July 27, 2006) -- Reggie Bush missed a reporting deadline for the New Orleans Saints ' training camp Thursday evening.

Interesting article:

Meanwhile, the era of new coach Sean Payton began quietly, with team officials denying access to any players or coaches as they arrived on campus -- a departure from years past, when arriving players spoke freely.

Saints officials informed media that no video or photos could be shot of any players and that no interviews would be granted until after practice Friday afternoon.

No pictures?????? In training camp??????

I would die if the Texans did that.

YoungTexanFan
07-29-2006, 12:03 AM
If he sits out a year, nobody is going to pay him 1st pick money because he won't be the first pick. He most likely won't even be the best running back in the draft if Adrian Peterson declares.

There is a little thing called the time value of money which means that a dollar today is worth more than a dollar next year.

Peterson, Lynch, MICHAEL Bush, Ball from Maryland

They could all go ahead of him, and this is before we have surprise players like we do every year. No way he goes top 5 if he sits out a year.

zwz404
07-30-2006, 12:37 PM
So you are comparing an individual popularity contest to a champisonhisp game that is decided on the field? Seems fair and balanced.

My only question is do you want the best player on your team being gracious while they were not even on the field for the most important play of the year? I think not. Athletics does not build character, it reveals it.



Oh come on. Do you really think R Bush on the sideline had anything
to do with character?
It proved what I always thought, P. Carroll is an overrated coach.
Where you the only one in the stadium, who didn't know White would
get the ball, when Bush was on the sideline?
P. Carroll not giving the ball to Bush or letting Leihart throw on the most important play of the season was just plain stupid. That was the same as Young handing off on the 1st 4th down play UT had in the game. Results, no 1st down for either team. But, I was happy Carroll had his head up his rear.
Sorry, but that has nothing to do with character.
And lets face it, UT's defense didn't stop R. Bush, P. Carroll did.

I agree the Heisman is a popularity contest, but a persons reaction to
the results say everything about your character.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 12:42 PM
Oh come on. Do you really think R Bush on the sideline had anything
to do with character?
It proved what I always thought, P. Carroll is an overrated coach.
Where you the only one in the stadium, who didn't know White would
get the ball, when Bush was on the sideline?
P. Carroll not giving the ball to Bush or letting Leihart throw on the most important play of the season was just plain stupid. That was the same as Young handing off on the 1st 4th down play UT had in the game. Results, no 1st down for either team. But, I was happy Carroll had his head up his rear.
Sorry, but that has nothing to do with character.
And lets face it, UT's defense didn't stop R. Bush, P. Carroll did.

I agree the Heisman is a popularity contest, but a persons reaction to
the results say everything about your character.

I have to agree. The whole "Reggie on the sidelines" thing was overblown and showed that Carroll was an arrogant overrated coach. Carroll was completely outcoached in that game and Reggie being on the sidelines was a great example of it. I've read numerous quotes from Longhorn players saying that they were glad that Reggie was on the sidelines because they knew exactly what was going to be called.

thunderkyss
07-30-2006, 06:16 PM
I have to agree. The whole "Reggie on the sidelines" thing was overblown and showed that Carroll was an arrogant overrated coach. Carroll was completely outcoached in that game and Reggie being on the sidelines was a great example of it. I've read numerous quotes from Longhorn players saying that they were glad that Reggie was on the sidelines because they knew exactly what was going to be called.


So sorry......... USC faced 4th and short twice in the Championship game. REggie was on the sideline both times....... they picked it up the first time, didn't the second........

Pete Carroll overated?? with out him, USC would not have been looking for a threePeat.

tulexan
07-30-2006, 06:21 PM
So sorry......... USC faced 4th and short twice in the Championship game. REggie was on the sideline both times....... they picked it up the first time, didn't the second........

Pete Carroll overated?? with out him, USC would not have been looking for a threePeat.


Pete Carroll is a great recruiter, but I question his X's and O's ability. His teams were loaded with talent and in almost every game, could get by with just being a stacked team.

CloakNNNdagger
07-30-2006, 06:44 PM
FYI

Interview with Saints GM (http://www.thenewsstar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060730/SPORTS/60730004/1006) concerning the Bush negotiations.

Brandon420tx
08-01-2006, 10:17 PM
What are you talking about? The crow was eaten on the first day of the Saints Training Camp, you know, when Bush didn't report on time, ask your owner how it tastes. (End defensive rant)

The good thing, he is in camp now, lets hope he can revive the Saints and breathe life into that organization.

infantrycak
08-01-2006, 10:26 PM
maybe if you all would stop spewing so much nonsense, you wouldn't put yourselves in the position to be severely disappointed with your errand assumptions.

Personally I find errand assumptions very useful--I assume I will need to go get something for my wife once or twice a week, need to go get beer once or twice a week and assume New Orleans will need to go get a RB every one or two years. I have rarely been errant in those errand assumptions.

Carr Bombed
08-01-2006, 10:36 PM
yeah, 'ok'

maybe if you all would stop spewing so much nonsense, you wouldn't put yourselves in the position to be severely disappointed with your errand assumptions.

you could take the high road and focus on your own team, but your negativity to try to be cute and clever is gonna cause you to learn a personal life lesson, the hard way.

"if you can't say something nice, don't say nothing at all"

:twocents:

What are you talking about?

stop spewing what nonsense, take what high road, please fill me in, because the only person I see spewing nonsense is you (trolling our board). The only person I see not taking the "high road" and focusing on "your" team, is...........again you trolling our board. You are such a hypocrite......go home. NO has already worn out their welcome here in more ways than one.