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View Full Version : Reviewing the Texans Disastrous 2005 Draft


nunusguy
07-10-2006, 10:19 AM
IMO, last years Draft looks worse and worse as time goes by !
We had 4 first day picks (including 2 third rounders), and the net of those
picks is TJ, P-Burnt, and Morency.
There's already been enough said about TJ and P-Burnt. But now Morency apparent value in Kubiaks offense is also becoming dubious.
So much for our 4 first day picks !
And even last years rookie pro bowler Mathis is looking like a one year wonder. With his bike injury and reported attitude problems, his future with the Texans and in the NFL is looking more uncertain all the time.
Hodgdon probably will be no more than an adaquate NFL reserve player, but he's only a 5th rounder so not a big invetment.
C.C. Brown is looking like the top pick of the Texans 2005 Draft. I dunno, but
when your 6th rounder may turn out to be the top pick of your whole draft, that pretty much says it all.

AFD1717
07-10-2006, 10:28 AM
I guess I hadn't fully recognized how terrible that draft was. The only thing we can cling to at this point is that our scrubs that we picked do have ability. Guys with ability do occasionally put things together after being in the league a few years and they start playing like they are capable of playing. Unfortunately for us, most of those guys have the lightbulb turn on after being cut by the team that drafted them. Let's hope TJ stops reading his college stats, Morency turns in his tap shoes for some track spikes, and Buc grows a pair.

Runner
07-10-2006, 10:31 AM
Ugh. I've never really looked at last year's draft as a whole.

I would consider that no player should be evaluated only by his play last year with the Texans, and remain hopeful for improvement.

I still hope Buchanon can turn into a decent cover corner; if he does his hitting will be less an issue. I think Mathis will remain a special teams contributor. His long kick-off returns can generate an instant spark for the team, and his mere presence on the field makes the game more exciting for the fans - he gets our attention when he has the ball. Even if Hodgdon and Brown end up being back-ups for most of their careers, that is OK for their draft placement I guess.

HJam72
07-10-2006, 10:39 AM
They were badly coached, first year rookies (except for Buchannon, of course) and the whole team, with the one exception of Mathis, played below their ability last year. Maybe it's not as bad as it looks right now. If we can definitely establish that the whole team was very badly coached last year, then maybe there is hope for a lot of things that we can't see right now.

Yeah, it does look bad, though, I must admit.

DocBar
07-10-2006, 10:52 AM
As I posted on another thread, I think we had addition by subtraction when we gave G-stunk his walking papers. HE had a bad attitude and poor work ethic that seemed to filter down to the younger guys. I'm still holding out hope for TJ. Remember the 3 year rule when grading drafts.
:homer:

wrestler4life
07-10-2006, 10:53 AM
I think that the coaches just realized how bad the team was and said "we better coach these guys just not to look REAL bad. Give 'em just enough instruction so that we are in most games for a half or so".

SESupergenius
07-10-2006, 10:56 AM
The debacle started well before the draft with the release of 2 high quality starters and no replacements were drafted for those positions. There were a couple of decent CB's on the board to at least attempt to replace Glenns spot; Fabian Washington, Marlin Jackson. We should have even replaced Sharper with Lofa Tatupu since we had never drafted an ILB in our existance. This is hindsight of course, but many players should have been taken instead of a DT considering at the time we already had 3 starters, 2 with big contracts.

wrestler4life
07-10-2006, 11:01 AM
Was Travis Johnson the BPA when they drafted him?

SESupergenius
07-10-2006, 11:07 AM
He wasn't even the best player at his position at the time

DocBar
07-10-2006, 11:08 AM
He wasn't even the best player at his position at the time
Sure was a lotta love for him last year about this time. :confused:

phan1
07-10-2006, 11:27 AM
I am surprised to here of Morency's having trouble running in this offense, and it's pretty dissapointing considering he is very physically talented. I really hope he can make a turnaround. Last year, he was undisputed number 2. Right now it sounds like he's number 3 or 4.

Kaiser Toro
07-10-2006, 11:28 AM
I would not call it a disaster at this moment. Let's wait until we some real coaching take hold and then come back and label if needed.

SESupergenius
07-10-2006, 12:18 PM
Sure was a lotta love for him last year about this time. :confused:
ummm, not everyone was given him love last year. http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=12061

D-Vizzl
07-10-2006, 12:32 PM
As I posted on another thread, I think we had addition by subtraction when we gave G-stunk his walking papers. HE had a bad attitude and poor work ethic that seemed to filter down to the younger guys. I'm still holding out hope for TJ. Remember the 3 year rule when grading drafts.
:homer:

When you filter out bad Apples whom are all about themselves that brings a frsh attitude. TJ is a monster ball hawk if he is given the reigns, but even back at Florida State he had "listening adjustment" problems (but who didn't)
when he realizes that the new coaches are not playing games and the only way to dig yourself out that hole is to bring it everyday then

"TOOT TOOT":hides: the bandwagoners came come back out and ride that train!!

the wonger need food
07-10-2006, 12:43 PM
ummm, not everyone was given him love last year. http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=12061

How did I know it would be one of my posts. The defense desperately needed a playmaking LB last season and instead chose a TJ. Based on the early results this appears to be another huge mistake by the previous regime.

nunusguy
07-10-2006, 12:46 PM
Just another thing or two here least everyone think I'm totally negative, which I'm not, far from it.
The main guys & most prominent picks from last years Draft (TJ, P-Burnt, Morency, & Mathis), have such big question marks hanging over them and have been so deeply discounted, we now have a very low expectation of the group collectively producing and contributing to the team. Which means there is probably a decent chance that atleast one or two of them can now
exceed our expectations, perhaps even excel and realize the potential that we origionally thought they had.
And as someone said, its probably too early to judge the 2005 group, and even more premature to judge this years Draft. But if you had to make these
early calls, I would say that if last years our worst Draft, at the same time IMO this year is our best Draft.

JohnGalt
07-10-2006, 01:01 PM
I not a big fan of evaluating drafts until about two or three years later after everyone has had a chance to grow up into the NFL. It can't be that common for a rookie to make a major contribution. Many of the leagues most solid players took a few years to figure it out.

I think an interesting analysis would be to compare the percentage of team drafted starters to winning percentage. I'll bet they tie together.

DocBar
07-10-2006, 01:05 PM
I not a big fan of evaluating drafts until about two or three years later after everyone has had a chance to grow up into the NFL. It can't be that common for a rookie to make a major contribution. Many of the leagues most solid players took a few years to figure it out.

I think an interesting analysis would be to compare the percentage of team drafted starters to winning percentage. I'll bet they tie together.
I believe that most of Pttsburhgs, New Englands and Indy's starters are draftees. They can usually lose the big name price tags and keep right on trucking. Washington, da Raiders and couple of other teams keep trying to fix things with those big name price tags. Pretty clear to me. Denver and Green Bay usually do OK with a good mix.

the wonger need food
07-10-2006, 01:42 PM
I think an interesting analysis would be to compare the percentage of team drafted starters to winning percentage. I'll bet they tie together.

You are absolutely correct. I did a breakdown of this sometime last year but cannot find the post. If I remember correctly, Pittsburgh and New England had the largest number of draftees starting for them.

TEXANRED
07-10-2006, 01:52 PM
As I posted on another thread, I think we had addition by subtraction when we gave G-stunk his walking papers. HE had a bad attitude and poor work ethic that seemed to filter down to the younger guys. I'm still holding out hope for TJ. Remember the 3 year rule when grading drafts.
:homer:
I didn't like the TJ pick then and don't like it now. Would have been nice to have had CJ, but then we would not have gotten the first two picks in the third to solidify our O-line without it. Still could have picked somthing other than a DT. Why do I see Charles Hill when I talk about TJ?

None of our 05 draft may even be on this team after the third year.

The only true bright spot is that we didn't give up two ones for Pace. We got quality in the third and got Mario Williams.

Hulk75
07-10-2006, 01:57 PM
IMO, last years Draft looks worse and worse as time goes by !
We had 4 first day picks (including 2 third rounders), and the net of those
picks is TJ, P-Burnt, and Morency.
There's already been enough said about TJ and P-Burnt. But now Morency apparent value in Kubiaks offense is also becoming dubious.
So much for our 4 first day picks !
And even last years rookie pro bowler Mathis is looking like a one year wonder. With his bike injury and reported attitude problems, his future with the Texans and in the NFL is looking more uncertain all the time.
Hodgdon probably will be no more than an adaquate NFL reserve player, but he's only a 5th rounder so not a big invetment.
C.C. Brown is looking like the top pick of the Texans 2005 Draft. I dunno, but
when your 6th rounder may turn out to be the top pick of your whole draft, that pretty much says it all.
Acctually it might show you how much harder CC Brown works then Travis and P-Buc.............?
6TH RD guy, maybe he thinks he has more to prove, When guys get money(NOT SAYING TJ PB ARE DOING THIS) they get a little complacent. BUT a little bird tells me Buc has been working his Butt off, staying late and getting there early.

I think Travis and Buc were a shock to me a couple years ago, but lets wait and see how a pass rush helps out our Secondary and lets see how Travis does going back to a 4-3(cause it is a big difference).

Vernond not worried about him.

TwinSisters
07-10-2006, 02:02 PM
You are absolutely correct. I did a breakdown of this sometime last year but cannot find the post. If I remember correctly, Pittsburgh and New England had the largest number of draftees starting for them.

That's correct

Pittsburgh- Kevin Colbert
New England- Scott Pioli
Indianapolis- Polian Family
Bengals- Brown family

Texans - Charles Casserly

hollywood_texan
07-10-2006, 03:17 PM
I think it is little too early to say the 2005 draft was a disaster, but it is definitely heading into that direction.

As for the Buchanon trade had how he stunk it up last year, I think the most improved player this year will be Buchanon. I believe Kubiak and Smith will put this guy in a position so that he can play to his strengths.

A more physical line holding the line of scrimmage and getting to the quarterback will be very helpful for Buchanon's play. In addition, I think he will be fielding a lot of punts and will break a few and provide some serious momentum shifts in several games. That will get him so high end exposure.d

As for the other guys, I believe they will play better and therefore the 2005 draft will not be labeled a disaster, but people will look back and look at how it could have been better.

Vambo, the Marble Eye
07-10-2006, 04:02 PM
[QUOTE=nunusguy]IMO, last years Draft looks worse and worse as time goes by !QUOTE]

I am having a hard time not sharing this feeling... but this season will complete the evaluation;


P-buch has got to do it this year or toast
TJ has to do something more than get in fights (with nobody of merit) during training season
Morency has to show he can even make the team.

HOOK'EM
07-10-2006, 04:08 PM
.............should have kept our pick in 05' & took Derrick Johnson.:twocents:

Runner
07-10-2006, 04:16 PM
.............should have kept our pick in 05' & took Derrick Johnson.

I recently heard an interesting anecdote about this - I don't know if it's true but the person (who will remain nameless) who told me usually has solid info. For what little that makes it worth:

I heard that the linebacker coach at the time said, "If you pick Derrick Johnson, I quit".


I've never been a big participant in the DJ/TJ debate, but in hindsight maybe they should have taken him up on that.

Hulk75
07-10-2006, 04:19 PM
I recently heard an interesting anecdote about this - I don't know if it's true but the person (who will remain nameless) who told me usually has solid info. For what little that makes it worth:

I heard that the linebacker coach at the time said, "If you pick Derrick Johnson, I quit".

I've never been a big participant in the DJ/TJ debate, but in hindsight maybe they should have taken him up on that.
yea.........thats funny.

Texans Horror
07-10-2006, 04:31 PM
I recently heard an interesting anecdote about this - I don't know if it's true but the person (who will remain nameless) who told me usually has solid info. For what little that makes it worth:

I heard that the linebacker coach at the time said, "If you pick Derrick Johnson, I quit".


I've never been a big participant in the DJ/TJ debate, but in hindsight maybe they should have taken him up on that.

Or maybe the linebackers coach saw something he didn't like in DJ. From what I've heard, DJ didn't exactly light up the boards in KC the way people had hoped. Of course, fans wanted him to have an instant impact, the sort of thing Houston fans are expecting from Mario. There is a lesson there. How will Houston react when Mario, though playing well, isn't the greatest show on turf?