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View Full Version : Did I hear Clayton right?


Dr. Toro
04-28-2006, 02:06 PM
He said we were offering 8% more than Smith got... to Williams? Or to Bush? He said today we negotiated with Williams this afternoon, but I couldn't understand who he said we made that offer to.

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 02:07 PM
I am recording it on my TiVo, hang on & I will check

Errant Hothy
04-28-2006, 02:07 PM
He said that the 8% over offer was to Bush, but that Willimas might agree to take it to become the #1 pick in the draft; if it gets offered to him.

Hardcore Texan
04-28-2006, 02:08 PM
Wow.....talk about a cliffhanger....but please take your time.


Okay, I am stuck at work and this is peaking my interest, unlike that stack of papers next to me. :)

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 02:09 PM
From what I gathered it is for both of them...8% more than Alex SMith....For a DE? wow...

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 02:09 PM
Wow.....talk about a cliffhanger....but please take your time.


Okay, I am stuck at work and this is peaking my interest, unlike that stack of papers next to me. :)

That is why I work from home :)

Kaiser Toro
04-28-2006, 02:10 PM
From what I gathered it is for both of them...8% more than Alex SMith....For a DE? wow...

You mean for a RB wow.

killeentexan
04-28-2006, 02:13 PM
From what I gathered it is for both of them...8% more than Alex SMith....For a DE? wow...
Makes more sense to pay that to a DE then to a RB....franchise DE's are higher paid then RB's.......

Harrisment
04-28-2006, 02:17 PM
Did he say anything else....did they both turn it down? :confused:

Harrisment
04-28-2006, 02:17 PM
Makes more sense to pay that to a DE then to a RB....franchise DE's are higher paid then RB's.......

Sure, but it doesn't make sense to offer it to a DE that dissapeared in half of his games last year and wasn't even the best defensive player on his college team.

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 02:18 PM
Okay, let me rephrase it: 8% more...For Mario Williams...Wow. :stirpot:

whiskeyrbl
04-28-2006, 02:18 PM
Texans | Owner wants top pick signed before draft
Fri, 28 Apr 2006 09:00:30 -0700

John McClain, of the Houston Chronicle, reports Houston Texans owner Bob McNair wants the team's No. 1 overall pick to be signed before they make it official Saturday, April 29. McNair said North Carolina State DE Mario Williams is still in the picture and could end up being the top pick if he agrees to a deal before the draft. Meanwhile, Southern Cal RB Reggie Bush's agent, Joel Segal, has exchanged numerous proposals with the Texans chief negotiator, vice president of administration Dan Ferens.

GP
04-28-2006, 02:20 PM
Sure, but it doesn't make sense to offer it to a DE that dissapeared in half of his games last year and wasn't even the best defensive player on his college team.

DING! DING! DING!

We have a winner by 1st round knockout.

I'd rather pay that money to Bush than Williams.

real
04-28-2006, 02:22 PM
exactly, if the Texans pay that much money to Mario, and pass up Bush, thats craaaaaaaazy....I'd rather them trade down if they wanna go defense and grab A.J hawk, heck I'd rather we Get D'Brick over Mario

Porky
04-28-2006, 02:22 PM
Williams is too inconsistent. He will be a fine pro, and perhaps even an all-pro, but Bush has the whole package.

killeentexan
04-28-2006, 02:28 PM
Sure, but it doesn't make sense to offer it to a DE that dissapeared in half of his games last year and wasn't even the best defensive player on his college team.
We can all debate that til the cows come home....obviously our front office doesn't feel that way, nor does the leadership of the rest of the teams in the NFL. A lot of people are saying the same thing about Reggie......wasn't even in the game at crunchtime, his coach trusted another back on the team more then him, blah blah blah. There are positives (and negatives) about both players. I will trust to our front office (maybe foolishly) to make the pick they feel is the right one, and I will support that player, and our team completely. Personally I would want our pick to be Williams......but that's just me.

real
04-28-2006, 02:37 PM
We can all debate that til the cows come home....obviously our front office doesn't feel that way, nor does the leadership of the rest of the teams in the NFL. A lot of people are saying the same thing about Reggie......wasn't even in the game at crunchtime, his coach trusted another back on the team more then him, blah blah blah. There are positives (and negatives) about both players. I will trust to our front office (maybe foolishly) to make the pick they feel is the right one, and I will support that player, and our team completely. Personally I would want our pick to be Williams......but that's just me.


So because everyone else thinks he's so great that means....??? Like everyone hasn't been wrong b4. And about Petey not trusting reggie, where'd that get him...??? not very far...That was just bad coaching all the way around, he didn't even have him on the field...

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 02:41 PM
So because everyone else thinks he's so great that means....??? Like everyone hasn't been wrong b4. And about Petey not trusting reggie, where'd that get him...??? not very far...That was just bad coaching all the way around, he didn't even have him on the field...

Really, what did they want him to do? Tell the coach to shove it and go on the field anyways?

barzilla
04-28-2006, 02:42 PM
Texans | Owner wants top pick signed before draft
Fri, 28 Apr 2006 09:00:30 -0700

John McClain, of the Houston Chronicle, reports Houston Texans owner Bob McNair wants the team's No. 1 overall pick to be signed before they make it official Saturday, April 29. McNair said North Carolina State DE Mario Williams is still in the picture and could end up being the top pick if he agrees to a deal before the draft. Meanwhile, Southern Cal RB Reggie Bush's agent, Joel Segal, has exchanged numerous proposals with the Texans chief negotiator, vice president of administration Dan Ferens.
__________________


I don't care what anyone thinks about Williams. If Bush is number one on your board you take him. Period. This signability crap is ludicrous. You're talking about the next decade here. Take the best player dammit!

Errant Hothy
04-28-2006, 02:43 PM
Clayton is supposed to be coming backon soon with an update...but a nasty T Storm is killing my reception.

Let me know waht he says, please.



Wait is coming back...f'in storm. You Houstonians will get this later tonight, have fun.

threetoedpete
04-28-2006, 02:43 PM
Draft Brick !!!!

Errant Hothy
04-28-2006, 02:44 PM
ESPN host: "Oh David Carr; I feel for you brother."

LOL!

houstonhurricane
04-28-2006, 02:46 PM
I don't care what anyone thinks about Williams. If Bush is number one on your board you take him. Period. This signability crap is ludicrous. You're talking about the next decade here. Take the best player dammit!


So true. Bush is BY FAR the best player available in this draft. Williams seems like a great kid and wouldn't be a bad pick if we traded down a few spots.

If we ignorantly pass up on Bush in this draft, we will solidify our position as the dumbest front office in the league...

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 02:46 PM
ESPN host: "Oh David Carr; I feel for you brother."

LOL!
Trey Wingo is a nut...

Porky
04-28-2006, 02:48 PM
So true. Bush is BY FAR the best player available in this draft. Williams seems like a great kid and wouldn't be a bad pick if we traded down a few spots.

If we ignorantly pass up on Bush in this draft, we will solidify our position as the dumbest front office in the league...

If it is because Williams will sign before the draft, and Bush won't I totally agree. That has to be the dumbest reason I have ever heard to draft/not draft someone.

Errant Hothy
04-28-2006, 02:49 PM
Ohhh, the lovely Miss Rachel Nichols is in Houston for the Draft.

Errant Hothy
04-28-2006, 02:52 PM
Clayton says: Negotiations with Williams are very serious, and posasible legal trouble ofr Reggie Bush.

Dr. Toro
04-28-2006, 02:52 PM
Bottom line, if Reggie's drafted unsigned, he gets his number. That's the issue.

killeentexan
04-28-2006, 02:59 PM
So because everyone else thinks he's so great that means....??? Like everyone hasn't been wrong b4. And about Petey not trusting reggie, where'd that get him...??? not very far...That was just bad coaching all the way around, he didn't even have him on the field...
So by your own reasoning, if everyone has been wrong before, then everyone can be wrong about Reggie being can't miss, right?

And I'll take the coaches opinion of who should be in the game and who shouldn't be....after all "Petey" had seen him practice and play enough to make an informed decision, don't ya think? At least he had more info on Reggie then every fan out there who thinks he knows who gives his team the best chance to win.

I don't think we are looking at drafting whoever we can sign at the cost of hurting the team...the way i see it, and I could be wrong, is that the front office has Reggie and Mario rated pretty much dead even as the BAP. That being the case, signability come into play.

MikeMc
04-28-2006, 03:01 PM
When will any of you please watch the film for yourselves, maybe understand NC St scheme, and know that it wasn't that Mario was "taking plays off". He was doing what his coach said.

But I'll bet Mario was in on more plays than RB! Yes, trade down to # 4, draft AJ Hawk....that'd be dumb! It is either Mario or Bush. No trades will happen....unless it is draft and trade (via NYG - SD).

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 03:04 PM
Not getting a good feeling. Looks to me like you Mario guys are going to win this one. That, or Casserly is fooling even the experts now...:rolleyes:

real
04-28-2006, 03:11 PM
So by your own reasoning, if everyone has been wrong before, then everyone can be wrong about Reggie being can't miss, right?

Exactly thats why I have never used that as an argument... There are no sure players ever, a player is not even "sure" from season to season, let alone making the jump from college to pro...

And I'll take the coaches opinion of who should be in the game and who shouldn't be....after all "Petey" had seen him practice and play enough to make an informed decision, don't ya think? At least he had more info on Reggie then every fan out there who thinks he knows who gives his team the best chance to win.

Well if you'd have gone with petey that day you'd have lost...And obviously he didn't know enough to get a first on that play, so I guess all those practices he watched didn't give him enough insight...

I don't think we are looking at drafting whoever we can sign at the cost of hurting the team...the way i see it, and I could be wrong, is that the front office has Reggie and Mario rated pretty much dead even as the BAP. That being the case, signability come into play

So you really think they have Mario rated as high as Bush??? Wow, congrats to the Houston Texans front office... They have really fooled alot of people, they have really put up one heck of a smoke screen:superman:

Porky
04-28-2006, 03:18 PM
I am getting this uneasy feeling. I still think it's Bush, but I am beginning to wonder if signability really is going to be the deciding factor. If that is the case, that just seals it for me - Bob Mcnair will officially be a worse owner than Bud Adams. :crying:

dwilt72
04-28-2006, 03:24 PM
I don't care what anyone thinks about Williams. If Bush is number one on your board you take him. Period. This signability crap is ludicrous. You're talking about the next decade here. Take the best player dammit!

AMEN!

david0205
04-28-2006, 03:24 PM
Not getting a good feeling. Looks to me like you Mario guys are going to win this one. That, or Casserly is fooling even the experts now...:rolleyes:

GO Ahead, simply go ahead and sign William a little bit cheaper. Save a couple of millions over 7 years....when wwe continue to suck ***** and the fans completely stop going to the games, you will then be begging that you had Bush. For the love of whatever you want to include, please dont make a mistake and not take Bush based on signing ability. Go Mr.Casserly...I think you averaged about 25,000 fans last year...in 3 years, we will have less than 20,000 show up. Oh i forgot Mr. Casserly...you will probably be one of the worst teams in the league and you will again have a chance at top 5 pick next year....oh, and Stupid ***** Casserly will be there to screw up another draft. The best player hands down in this draft is Bush. DD is great...but Bush is way too dynamic to pass up...please please...dont be a dumb*****. Quit playing leverage games and Take Bush!!!

texanfan2002114
04-28-2006, 03:27 PM
I'm not worried. I think the Texans are working Bush to lower his number.

Errant Hothy
04-28-2006, 03:28 PM
Two of the "experts" on ESPN said that Cass is just trying to get some leverage on Reggie, neither think that the Texans will sign Mario.

Don't give up yet.

Kaiser Toro
04-28-2006, 03:28 PM
So what happens if we take Wiliams and Bush does not go at #1? Does the greatest ever tag look a little limp? People seem to gloss over the stated fact that there are a number fo teams that have Williams rated at #1.

real
04-28-2006, 03:29 PM
So what happens if we take Wiliams and Bush does not go at #1? Does the greatest ever tag look a little limp? People seem to gloss over the stated fact that there are a number fo teams that have Williams rated at #1.
Thats because they have no shot at Reggie because were going to take him...

Mike Kerns
04-28-2006, 03:30 PM
Houston football teams exist to break our hearts...

OK, thats a little extreme.:crying:

dwilt72
04-28-2006, 03:30 PM
GO Ahead, simply go ahead and sign William a little bit cheaper. Save a couple of millions over 7 years....when wwe continue to suck ***** and the fans completely stop going to the games, you will then be begging that you had Bush. For the love of whatever you want to include, please dont make a mistake and not take Bush based on signing ability. Go Mr.Casserly...I think you averaged about 25,000 fans last year...in 3 years, we will have less than 20,000 show up. Oh i forgot Mr. Casserly...you will probably be one of the worst teams in the league and you will again have a chance at top 5 pick next year....oh, and Stupid ***** Casserly will be there to screw up another draft. The best player hands down in this draft is Bush. DD is great...but Bush is way too dynamic to pass up...please please...dont be a dumb*****. Quit playing leverage games and Take Bush!!!

Hopefully CC won't be here much longer.

kcwilson
04-28-2006, 03:31 PM
Seriously, the best negotiation play you have is when you can play one another next to each other.

They know Reggie could hold out for mad cash... so if they float the perception that Williams is signable at 8% more than Smith, then Reggie must realize that this is an improvement over last year's #1. That money ought to get it done and by offering it to Williams, then Reggie feels the fear and pressure to come in at that price range or fall to #2 and get none of that.

Reggie's team will quickly realize that with Williams in the picture, he should take the better offer now, instead of calling the Texans bluff and potentially lose millions by sliding to #2.

I wouldn't be surprised to hear that he is signed at the 8% higher than Smith number that is being bantered.

**ADDED**

I say keep using leverage to that we can get the best deal that we can up until draft time. Get Reggie lower, for the sake of salary cap. The trick is pressuring Reggie to sign as low as possible.

texanfan2002114
04-28-2006, 03:33 PM
Hopefully CC won't be here much longer.


Sports Radio 610 just said about 5 minutes ago that there are reports out there that the Texans will let CC go after that draft and someone from Denver and one other guy are the leading guys to replace CC. Sorry for not knowing the guys names.

Mr. White
04-28-2006, 03:34 PM
Casserly is setting the ultimate smokescreen. We are merely pawns in the man's masterplan. He is setting the stage to make his ultimate acquisition as we speak.


http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e60/coreyvice/a-ferguson1.jpg


What is a sack anyway?

Honoring Earl 34
04-28-2006, 03:34 PM
:money: Is what this is all about . I can't help but to think that the Texans know Reggie makes more money on the side as the #1 pick in the draft than the 2nd or 3rd pick .

Reggie loses money buy not signing a fair deal . You have got to believe Segal is not that dumb and the ink will be drying after dinner .

Harrisment
04-28-2006, 03:35 PM
The thing is, there is no way Reggie will get more money from any other team, since the 2nd pick always gets less money than the first, etc..it's in his best interest to agree to a contract ahead of time if that is what the Texans are saying will seal the deal to make him #1.

Kaiser Toro
04-28-2006, 03:35 PM
Thats because they have no shot at Reggie because were going to take him...

My brother can beat up your brother. :neener:

Silly stuff on this board when all come to the table to debate and do not have the facts nor do they get the big picture.

infantrycak
04-28-2006, 03:36 PM
People seem to gloss over the stated fact that there are a number fo teams that have Williams rated at #1.

Depends on what you mean by #1. Do they have him rated as #1 bpa or #1 on their draft board? My impression is the latter where folks take the bpa board and remove players based on reverse need, i.e. according to CC, take the QB's off the board or in this case let's say take RB's off the board. That could be teams like the Cardinals, Seahawks, Chargers, etc.

dwilt72
04-28-2006, 03:37 PM
Sports Radio 610 just said about 5 minutes ago that there are reports out there that the Texans will let CC go after that draft and someone from Denver and one other guy are the leading guys to replace CC. Sorry for not knowing the guys names.

According to a post on another thread...

The two leading candidates, sources say, are Falcons vice president of player personnel Ronnie Hill and Broncos director of pro scouting Rick Smith.

real
04-28-2006, 03:44 PM
My brother can beat up your brother. :neener:

Silly stuff on this board when all come to the table to debate and do not have the facts nor do they get the big picture.
And you do get the big picture??? Am I to be led to believe that you somehow get the big picture, while the rest of us who want reggie don't ? If you were so keen on "the big picture" Why weren't you wearing your I LUV MARIO shirt 3 months ago...

texanfan2002114
04-28-2006, 03:45 PM
According to a post on another thread...

The two leading candidates, sources say, are Falcons vice president of player personnel Ronnie Hill and Broncos director of pro scouting Rick Smith.


Thanks dwilt

Kaiser Toro
04-28-2006, 03:48 PM
Depends on what you mean by #1. Do they have him rated as #1 bpa or #1 on their draft board? My impression is the latter where folks take the bpa board and remove players based on reverse need, i.e. according to CC, take the QB's off the board or in this case let's say take RB's off the board. That could be teams like the Cardinals, Seahawks, Chargers, etc.

If you want to get even more granular then each team needs to go beyond what the scouting department, personnel department and coaching staff think about those labels of BPA and #1 on the draft board by bringing in their financial arm. Let's face it most of react to scouting department lingo, but do not take the time to look at the financial impact nor the current personnel on the team.

As many have stated Bush and Williams are not real immediate needs for the Texans. Ferguson, Hawk and Huff in my opinion better suit what we need immediatley. But at the top there is a consensus from the scouting and personnel people that there are two surefire players and we are appropriately focised on them until the phone rings for a trade.

Kaiser Toro
04-28-2006, 03:50 PM
And you do get the big picture??? Am I to be led to believe that you somehow get the big picture, while the rest of us who want reggie don't ? If you were so keen on "the big picture" Why weren't you wearing your I LUV MARIO shirt 3 months ago...

Because I have always been in the trade down camp and I have done my own needs analysis. However, I have been steadfast in promoting the notion that if we stay in the #1 slot that there should be two prospects that we should be looking at in order to leverage the right contract.

real
04-28-2006, 03:58 PM
So what happens if we take Wiliams and Bush does not go at #1? Does the greatest ever tag look a little limp? People seem to gloss over the stated fact that there are a number fo teams that have Williams rated at #1.


So the teams that have Mario at number 1 are the ones you speak of with this great insight as to how this whole football thing works ??? Im just trying to figure out who you are trying to say gets "the big picture" and who you "think" doesn't...

TreWardTxn
04-28-2006, 04:29 PM
The thing is, there is no way Reggie will get more money from any other team, since the 2nd pick always gets less money than the first, etc..it's in his best interest to agree to a contract ahead of time if that is what the Texans are saying will seal the deal to make him #1.

From what I've heard, it's in his best interest to call the Texans bluff that they will take Williams, not sign a contract before the draft, and look to be picked #1 anyway. That way he will have to get top dollar being the #1, and the longer the holdout, the worse for the team. So that big contract should be in order soon after...

MikeMc
04-28-2006, 04:44 PM
Yes, Dan Reeves will be the new GM! Why else do you think he is still here? Cass will go to the NFL Office (why??) and will be on his way to being commish.

dwilt72
04-28-2006, 04:53 PM
I heard Reeves was no longer working for the team.

Errant Hothy
04-28-2006, 05:04 PM
He's not, last I heard was that he had a radio show on Sirius.

Kaiser Toro
04-29-2006, 02:30 AM
So the teams that have Mario at number 1 are the ones you speak of with this great insight as to how this whole football thing works ??? Im just trying to figure out who you are trying to say gets "the big picture" and who you "think" doesn't...

There are no teams any longer that can covet Williams because the Texans have decided who they will select. I am sorry I did not answer your question earlier, but I think that you can deduce it for yourself.

Kaiser Toro
04-29-2006, 09:38 AM
So what happens if we take Wiliams and Bush does not go at #1? Does the greatest ever tag look a little limp? People seem to gloss over the stated fact that there are a number fo teams that have Williams rated at #1.

Anyone care to venture where Bush goes?