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View Full Version : Dump Palmer NOW!!!


BigDTexansFan
08-21-2004, 08:10 PM
He calls 2 running plays which don't work, so in 3rd and loooong (which anyone knows is a passing down)..he throws. I mean if he is no smarter than that maybe we need to let David call his own plays, you can't keep calling conservative football take some chances Palmer or let QB call his game we might lose but we sure won't lose games like we have trying to play it SAFE...he did that last week instead of going for end zone when we had ball on 6 he called running plays......I know I saw several times last season where Carr would come off field and talk on phone and then in frustration throw it down... :twocents:

TexSon
08-21-2004, 08:25 PM
It's the PRESEASON. :twocents:

Fiddy
08-21-2004, 08:29 PM
It's the PRESEASON. :twocents:Excatly, there was no game plan for this game. Calm down...

utahmark
08-21-2004, 08:47 PM
who cares its preseason. hes not trying to confuse anyone, he's evaluating players.

Huge
08-21-2004, 08:53 PM
Yep, it's preseason but it looks as if some are already in mid-season form. :rofl:

OzzO
08-21-2004, 09:14 PM
Ummm... maybe it's to see what Hollings and our O-line can do on a run play? Noticed there were no issues on the Dallas game. Welcome to preseason.

Dump i d i o t ic posts NOW!!!! (Gotta put the spaces in to get a point across.)

Hervoyel
08-21-2004, 09:16 PM
Damn that was quick. Not even halftime of the second preseason game and someone is already calling for Palmers head. Anyone around here know if that was a record or not?

Huge
08-21-2004, 09:27 PM
No kidding dude! Remind me of the games last season when we go 3rd and out for 3 series in a row and in 9 plays we don't attemp a pass > than 10 yards.
:headbang:

Palmer bashing is also in mis season form also. Who can blame them though... we seen this thing happen so many times.

Actually it was the Palmer bashers I was referring to.

swisher
08-21-2004, 09:33 PM
I thought this thread was someone being sarcastic.....wow. :thumbdown

DR#1
08-21-2004, 09:45 PM
in my opinion i don't think it's Palmer, but i'm not seeing anything from Tony Hollings

Fiddy
08-21-2004, 09:49 PM
in my opinion i don't think it's Palmer, but i'm not seeing anything from Tony HollingsHave you seen how bad the offensive line has looked?!?!?!?!? They are opening no holes for Hollings to run through...

OzzO
08-21-2004, 09:57 PM
Dang... so THAT'S where our playbook ended up before it was found!!!

Hervoyel
08-21-2004, 09:57 PM
Capers wanted consistency this week and I guess he got it. The team is consistently bad. It's no big deal at this point. The starters came in and were stuck in neutral the first couple of series. They seemed to be putting it together and getting on track just about the time they were done for the night.

Fiddy
08-21-2004, 09:57 PM
At least our offence and defence are on the same page.Too
bad the steeler read that page also.Yeah maybe the Steelers are reading Peek's playbook...

DR#1
08-21-2004, 09:57 PM
yea i just hope we learn from our mistakes and don't make the same ones during the regular season cuz this score looks bad, but we are also away

:boxing:

gwallaia
08-21-2004, 10:19 PM
Damn that was quick. Not even halftime of the second preseason game and someone is already calling for Palmers head. Anyone around here know if that was a record or not?

Sadly, it is not the record for this message board.

mulpwr
08-21-2004, 10:28 PM
I am sure he is a better offensive cordinator then he was a head coach.

texasguy346
08-21-2004, 10:37 PM
What? No love for Palmer? I say blame the waterboy. He didn't have that water & gatorade there fast enough for the players. How can they perform if they aren't properly hydrated? FIRE THE WATERBOY!!!!! :hehe:

mes311
08-21-2004, 10:38 PM
I didn't realize they had found that playbook.

Hervoyel
08-21-2004, 10:42 PM
Well, New England got the snot stomped out of them by the Bengals so we're in good company. For the record I'd like to say that IMO there are only two kinds of teams that dominate preseason games. One type is good plain and simple. They're so good and so deep that they're going to win more often than not whether it's preseason or the regular season. The other kind are your bad teams trying to build momentum. I'm not saying the Steelers fall into this catagory at all. If you take it that way you miss my point. I'm talking about the Texans here. The Texans aren't trying to win out in preseason. They're going about their business trying to work on their execution (didn't do very well tonight) and evaluate their players. They're looking at things and of course trying to win but the victory is secondary to the work and avoiding injury as much as possible. Patriots fans aren't coming unglued asking for the head of their offensive coordinator over a preseason game because they know it doesn't count and they know the teams coaches know it doesn't count.

Apparently at least one Texans fan does not know how to properly appreciate an NFL preseason game.

I like to see the Texans look good. I like to see them win. I'd rather see them work out the kinks in preseason and lose bad but squeak by someone two months from now than see them win all four of their preseason games but still stink it up in the regular season when everyone else starts trying.

Porky
08-21-2004, 10:48 PM
It's nice to see that they were in mid-season form tonight. Oh, not the players. The knee jerk ***** fans. Someone get me a doctor. I'm about to pass out from a bad case of *****ic post reading. :thumbdown

RTP2110
08-22-2004, 04:12 PM
What kind of results do you expect in the preseason? The results don't count, theres no gameplan, and no scouting. My thought on the 1st two series is that goal #1 was test the o-line's zone blocking and to see how guys react to the play going to thier side. If it were regular the season they would not have ran on 2nd & 16. It's the preseason and the main focus is execution so they use this time to continue and work on run blocking. If it brings up 3rd & long who cares, it's just the pre-season. That's what it's all about.

TexanExile
08-22-2004, 08:09 PM
He never had a chance as a head coach. Two years is not enough as an expansion head coach. Butch Davis is going to find himself back in the college ranks after this year.

He better stay clear of Miami if that's true--there's still some people around here trying to pull that knife he left between their shoulderblades!

Erratic Assassin
08-23-2004, 12:20 AM
Have you seen how bad the offensive line has looked?!?!?!?!? They are opening no holes for Hollings to run through...

Not only that but the defense was there to greet him in the backfield the second he received the handoff.

We did not control the line of scrimmage. Either one of them.

Ibar_Harry
08-23-2004, 04:00 AM
I was out of town again so I didn't see the game. However, did David try to throw any long balls. If he didn't then I quess that's where I would question the coaching staff. You would think this is certainly the time to try that kind of pass at least for practice. It might even cause people to think about the pass even if we don't throw it in the reqular season. Caper's blind spot, if he has one, is the run. The only true back with any possibilities is Davis. From the reports I quess we have to say what happened to the defensive line? Did Mr. Smith show up? Did Wiegert play?

Erratic Assassin
08-23-2004, 08:33 AM
What kind of results do you expect in the preseason? The results don't count.

You're right about that but I don't think it's too much to ask your first team to not get dominated.

Our offensive line was getting pushed around and our defensive line wasn't putting any pressure on Pittsburgh. It's not the end of the world, but our first team should not be playing like a first year expansion team.

Hervoyel
08-23-2004, 10:01 AM
Creepy that you should say that EA. I've been making copies of tapes of the 2002 season for the past week or two and converting them to DVD and the Pittsburgh game looked more like 2002 than anything else. Except in the Pittsburgh game the defense didn't show up either. It looked like the 2002 offense combined with the injury riddled 2003 defense. Worst of both worlds. They're going to have a week of pure evil practices I bet.

texasguy346
08-23-2004, 10:02 AM
I was out of town again so I didn't see the game. However, did David try to throw any long balls. If he didn't then I quess that's where I would question the coaching staff. You would think this is certainly the time to try that kind of pass at least for practice. It might even cause people to think about the pass even if we don't throw it in the reqular season. Caper's blind spot, if he has one, is the run. The only true back with any possibilities is Davis. From the reports I quess we have to say what happened to the defensive line? Did Mr. Smith show up? Did Wiegert play?

Carr didn't really throw the deep ball, but then again he didn't have much time to with the play of the O-Line. He connected with AJ for a 10 yd pass that AJ turned up field for like 15 or 20 more yards. The first team offense started to look good on the only scoring drive for the Texans. They got to finish off the drive with a field goal early in the 2nd quarter. Weigert did play, and that made the terrible O-Line play even more surprising. The D-Line looked horrible too. So I wouldn't say that Mr. Smith, Mr. Walker, or Mr. Deloach showed up at all. The coaches had Peek and Babin on the outsides, and Sharper and Wong on the inside for this game. The front 7 as a whole didn't play well, and that contributed to the secondary getting torched. I think it was said best when someone compared this game to the horrible one against the Bengals. It wasn't pretty.

Doug
08-23-2004, 10:19 AM
I'm just going to throw something out here but it's just my opinion. First off I think everyone needs to take a deep breath and calm down (except for the people that aren't worked up). I won't get a chance to watch the game till I get home from work today (Thank god for the nfl network!). What I've heard from my friends in Houston is that the Texans came out stinking it up a bit but got rolling just before the first team got taken out. Now if this had been a reg season game, the first team would've been in the whole game which in any other case could've accomplished making up for the previous mistakes. There is no scouting, game plan, etc. This is the preseason. These are the mistakes you're supposed to make now to learn from for future reference. There's not a doubt in my mind, had this been a reg season game our boys possibly would've bounced back and either won the game or made it an extremely close loss. I think it was a darn good learning experience for our rookies. You can't place too much emphasis on the preseason. After all, when it comes down to it the preseason is a series of PRACTICE GAMES. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but an instance is the Arizona Cardinals. I think they went 4-0 in preseason last year and look at their reg season record. I personally feel at this point and time you need to look at your mistakes, correct them and move on. It's definitely not a time for pointing fingers halfway into preseason (especially us as fans) when we take a loss regadless of how badly. Let's be positive people!!!!!!! :soapbox:

texasguy346
08-23-2004, 10:56 AM
I think most people have calmed down from the loss by now, but from what I've read on the board the main complaint was the lack of effort and intensity the Texans showed on Saturday. You'll see it too when you watch the game. Most people aren't concerned with the loss itself, but moreso the way we played. I think AJ pointed out in another post that Capers was furious with the team, and rightly so. Would he have been even more upset with the team had it been a regular season game? I think it goes without saying he would (and yet I said it anyway). The starters didn't play the whole game for the Steelers either, and they didn't gameplan for us either. It was essientially domination on both sides of the ball. It's a reason for concern, but it's not a reason to panic. I'm sure when we face Denver we will see a team closer ressembling what we saw against Dallas than we did against Pittsburgh. We will have the benefit of gameplanning like a regular season game, and the starters will see 3 quarters of work. It should give us a better idea of where the team is at, but also the outcome of the game isn't as telling as the way we play throughout the game.

Doug
08-23-2004, 12:30 PM
I think most people have calmed down from the loss by now, but from what I've read on the board the main complaint was the lack of effort and intensity the Texans showed on Saturday. You'll see it too when you watch the game. Most people aren't concerned with the loss itself, but moreso the way we played. I think AJ pointed out in another post that Capers was furious with the team, and rightly so. Would he have been even more upset with the team had it been a regular season game? I think it goes without saying he would (and yet I said it anyway). The starters didn't play the whole game for the Steelers either, and they didn't gameplan for us either. It was essientially domination on both sides of the ball. It's a reason for concern, but it's not a reason to panic. I'm sure when we face Denver we will see a team closer ressembling what we saw against Dallas than we did against Pittsburgh. We will have the benefit of gameplanning like a regular season game, and the starters will see 3 quarters of work. It should give us a better idea of where the team is at, but also the outcome of the game isn't as telling as the way we play throughout the game.
You completely missed the point of that whole post.

Vinny
08-23-2004, 02:29 PM
Pittsburgh is traditionally one of the great defenses against the run...so I understand why we tried to see what we have against it. I'm not of the mind that you should get tricky in the pre-season. I am very pleased that we took on the Steelers strength straight-up. We know where we stand now even if it wasn't real flattering. Sometimes you need to get a better feel with how your players stack up to a solid run unit by running base plays and you see what you have physically, man on man, against one of the better run stopping units in the league. Right now we are not as good as Pittsburgh in the trenches or when you compare their front-7 to our front-7. Getting all tricky and finessing our way around their strength would not give us the data we need to get better.

Lucky
08-23-2004, 02:41 PM
...Right now we are not as good as Pittsburgh in the trenches or when you compare their front-7 to our front-7.
Considering that the Steelers were without a starting guard and were dead last in the NFL in '03 in rushing ypc, it doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling. I realize that the starting front 3 sat after 2 series, but I thought our reserves could at least compete. Guess I was wrong.

Vinny
08-23-2004, 02:46 PM
I thought we would do a better job defensively against their running game myself, but if you look at who was the worst run defense in the NFL last year it can't be too big a surprise to people not from Houston. It is hard to even isolate individual players who broke down because it was a full scale meltdown in my eyes.

As far as us running on them, I'm not as bummed about the showing. Not many teams will do too well running on Pittsburgh this season. Most of my disappointment centers on the defense's lack of physical play against a smash mouth team with an old back and without their best players.

Fiddy
08-23-2004, 04:18 PM
I thought we would do a better job defensively against their running game myself, but if you look at who was the worst run defense in the NFL last year it can't be too big a surprise to people not from Houston. . .Didnt see it posted, but on Inside the Game on ABC 13 Casserly said that the starting D-line played 2 series and gave up a total of about 25 yards on 7 attempts...

infantrycak
08-23-2004, 06:47 PM
The running play in the first two series were:

1st series
Bettis 2 yds.
Bettis 2 yds.
Bettis 5 yds.

2nd series
Staley 1 yd.
Bettis 4 yds
Bettis 3 yds
Bettis 2 yds

Then the wheels fell off

3rd series
Bettis 14 yds
Bettis 10 yds
Bettis 5 yds
Bettis 1 yd--TD

Panther5407
08-23-2004, 08:18 PM
Both my dad and I arnt that fond of Palmer. He's done some of the same type of calling last year too.

El Tejano
08-23-2004, 11:48 PM
Hmmm, I wonder if maybe we noticed how we went base I formation on 3rd and long so that people wont see much of our 3rd down offense this year thus not allowing them to stop us on 3rd down and improve that stat in the regular season. I don't know call me crazy!

People, the only trophy to win in the regular season for us was the Govenors boot and it is already sitting pretty at Reliant so please be patient with the play calling in the pre season. :rolleyes:

H-TownRules
08-23-2004, 11:58 PM
Hey, I am fine with Palmer calling the plays, except for the inopportune draw plays. He seems to have a knack for calling a draw play at just the wrong time (I've observed this throughout both seasons) It's gotten to the point that when my family is together watching a game, we joke about the dreaded draw play which feeds off of 3rd and 7-10 yds. Can anybody tell me if we've had any success with these that i just haven't caught or why Palmer keeps calling them? I'd rather see more Reverses ran.

phan1
08-24-2004, 03:08 AM
He calls 2 running plays which don't work, so in 3rd and loooong (which anyone knows is a passing down)..he throws. I mean if he is no smarter than that maybe we need to let David call his own plays, you can't keep calling conservative football take some chances Palmer or let QB call his game we might lose but we sure won't lose games like we have trying to play it SAFE...he did that last week instead of going for end zone when we had ball on 6 he called running plays......I know I saw several times last season where Carr would come off field and talk on phone and then in frustration throw it down... :twocents:

Ummmm... I don't get it. So if your first 2 running plays get stopped cold, you want him to run the ball again on 3rd and long? :rolleyes: And as for last week, our running plays would have gotten us the TD if not for stupid penalties and fumbles. Plus, this is an evaluation period. No one is going to go deep into their playbook in the preseason. All he wants to see is if we can run the ball consistently and if we can throw worth a damn. Right now, I'm not really worried about our offense. We've been able to move the ball better than we have ever been able to, and I don't expect our Caper's D to put up such a pathetic display like it did in Pittsburg when the season starts. The Pittsburg game sucked, but I didn't take it too seriously.

The only thing I really worried about was our O-line, which we've been hyping up alot the past few weeks. You would have thought our O-line would be in the top third of the league the way people have been hyping it up lately.

Also, isn't Palmer responsible for bringing up and teaching some of the best QBs in the league? I think we're pretty lucky to have him actually. However, if he plays too conservative like he did last season (which was understandable for a 2nd year team), than I'm going to raise a few eyebrows.

aj.
08-24-2004, 07:19 AM
For the most part, the Palmer playcalling thing is a myth. It's an easy scapegoat for vultures waiting to pick on an unsuccessful drive or 3rd down call. Run run pass has been debunked over and over by people who take the time watch the game closely or present gamebook data following a game. What some people tend to fixate on are plays that are unsucessful (run and pass - although there seems to be a lower tolerance for throwing a low percentage bomb 60 yards downfield than a trap or draw on 3rd and 5 for some reason - I guess it's the Madden generation) and what we never hear about are the plays that are successful (those are expected, of course). Execution has always been more of a problem with this team than play calling.

Tedc
08-24-2004, 07:59 AM
I normally don't post in these knee jerk threads for obvious reasons but I feel compelled to do so today for some strange reason.

If you paid attention last year, our defense was shattered with injuries. There were second and third string guys playing in place of the starters. When that happens, the coaches will make an effort to give them a spell...try to limit thier time on the field. This is where the consevative play comes in. Capers had the offense play conservatively to protect the extremely depth deprived defense.

Ball control keeps the defense off the field when properly executed.

AJ is right about the breakdowns. The Texans had a pretty balanced attack last year given the situation they were in. A lot of you guys only pay attention to the negatives. It isn't always the coach that is to blame. The coach doesn't execute the plays.

How come I don't hear a big uproar about the defense this week?

Probably because most of you realize that it was the lack of execution that created such a poor performance not bad game planning.