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dat_boy_yec
04-02-2006, 05:21 PM
Have the results for the three cone deal and the rest of the workout come out yet?

TexansLucky13
04-02-2006, 05:22 PM
Some of these UT guys are ridiculous. What they all said "Didn't Matter" about VY pro day they are all using AGAINST Bush. Who the heck knows....:confused:

True. And I happen to know that (in response to the comment by the magnificent MONARCH) the dumbest schmuck at A&M is still smarter than VY. Don't make me get into this with you...

:howdy:

Gig'em

Errant Hothy
04-02-2006, 05:22 PM
I think I heard he was only running the 40, no 3 cone or long shuttle.

Dr. Toro
04-02-2006, 05:24 PM
If they're both products of their system. Which of the two are more likely to end up in a version of their system in pros? VY in a shotgun, or RB in any type (Much less a run oriented like ours will be)?

Whatever system they end up in will be designed to maximise their abilities. The VY/Bush debate is really about marginal utility. Think a more conceptual VORP (value over replacement player), weighted for salary. Denver has consistently acted under the premise that running backs shouldn't be pricey, to great success. You plug 'em in, run 'em into the ground, and flip 'em when they want a big pay day. The consensus among NFL executives, however, is that great QB's are worth every cent. For the most part the Dilfer/Johnson thesis has been dismissed, although Belichick might test it when Brady becomes an FA. Even if RB is the best running back prospect ever, he might not be worth $50+ million, especially with DD's handsome pay. Were Bush worth it, you'd think we'd get Tom Hagan on line 2 with "an offer we can't refuse".

JAXwithanX
04-02-2006, 05:24 PM
you know....the wonderlic isn't exactly an aptitude test....i mean....15 is still pretty bad no matter what....but lets face it....when it comes down to it....being smart is just a hopeful quality in a star player....its not a necessity....and yes....even at the QB position (although it does mean more than say....a DT)

dat_boy_yec
04-02-2006, 05:25 PM
I think I heard he was only running the 40, no 3 cone or long shuttle.
I thought the rest of the events would be held in private. I think that's why we haven't heard anything. I hope I would hate it if he didn't run the cones.

JAXwithanX
04-02-2006, 05:26 PM
I thought the rest of the events would be held in private. I think that's why we haven't heard anything. I hope I would hate it if he didn't run the cones.

yeah that would seriously piss me off....thats like....where the whole aura comes from....his cutting ability.

but then again it is understandable considering reggie bush probably knows that reggie bush looks so amazing at cutting because he has some of the sickest field vision ever....which unfortunately can't be measured.

Dr. Toro
04-02-2006, 05:39 PM
Too small to play RB?

Warrick Dunn 5-9 180 lbs
Tiki Barber 5-10 200 lbs

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/football/nfl/specials/preview/2005/08/02/nfl.workout.barber0808/

Here's an idea of what Barber did to get some durability. I'd feel better if Bush was getting under a 750 squat bar, than pumping up reps of 225. Yes, that is freakish upper body strength, but strong legs are so much more applicable.

TexansLucky13
04-02-2006, 05:42 PM
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/football/nfl/specials/preview/2005/08/02/nfl.workout.barber0808/

Here's an idea of what Barber did to get some durability. I'd feel better if Bush was getting under a 750 squat bar, than pumping up reps of 225. Yes, that is freakish upper body strength, but strong legs are so much more applicable.

I agree. Injuries plague the smaller RBs. He needs to get some bulk. I dont expect him to gain more than 10 pounds though... which will land him at 216 before gameday in August.

HeroTime
04-02-2006, 05:45 PM
http://www.dispatch.com/sports-story.php?story=dispatch/2006/02/26/20060226-E1-01.html

In 2001, Rivals.com claimed that about 40 high-school players had 40 times in the 4.3-second range. Compare that to how the San Diego Union-Tribune reported last year that timing officials had broken down videotape of sprinter Ben Johnson’s infamous steroidfueled 100-meter run of 9.79 seconds. They determined that Johnson ran the first 40 yards (converted from meters) in 4.38 seconds.

(Incidentally, Deion Sanders is the fastest-timed player in the history of the combine, recording a 4.29 in 1989.)

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/topicoftheweek29.htm


These times are based on electronic timing on a track as opposed to hand timing. Electronic times are more accurate and as of result the time will be higher. Electronic timing can add .05 to .15 to your 40. Also keep in mind track times will be a little faster than on a field.

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

Timing officials have since broken down that famed race into 10-meter increments, and Johnson was so preposterously fast that he went through 50 meters in 5.52 seconds and 60 meters in 6.37 -- both under the current world records at those distances. He went through 40 yards that day in 4.38 seconds.

He was running in spikes . . . on a warm afternoon perfectly suited for sprinting . . . with a slight tailwind . . . with years of training from arguably track's top coach, Charlie Francis . . . with Carl Lewis and six others of the fastest men on the planet chasing him . . . with 69,000 people roaring at Seoul's Olympic Stadium . . . with hundreds of millions of people watching on TV . . . with the ultimate prize in sports, an Olympic gold medal, at stake.

And, as we learned later, with muscles built with the assistance of the anabolic steroid stanazolol.

Four-point-three-eight seconds.

Then again, maybe Ben Johnson isn't the fastest 40-yard man in the world.

Maybe half the NFL is faster.

dirty steve
04-02-2006, 05:47 PM
Yeah. But he can't help our team. We have DD who rushed for 1000+ yards every season, and Jerome Mathis one of the best return man in NFL. Bush as a Wide Receiver? I saw few people saying that but that is ridiculous. If you look at him only as a wide receiver, he is definitely not worth 1st pick. And Reggie Bush will not lead our team to playoffs. RBs can't lead the team to playoffs. Neither can WR or a return man. Only QB can.

rushing for 100 yards isn't really all that great. averaged out, it is about 63 ypg.

i guess trent dilfer led the baltimore ravens to the playoffs when their defense was holding teams to 11-12 points a game.

hot pickle
04-02-2006, 05:50 PM
if we draft reggie will he most likely be number 25 cause hollings left?


Bush would look awful nice in a texans uni:redtowel:

JAXwithanX
04-02-2006, 05:50 PM
umm....something tells me ol' Ben Johnson hit a MPH half the NFL dreams about.....he wasn't training for the 40....he was training for a combination of acceleration and the ultimate top speed in a 100. ever watch a 100 race....comparably....everyone is usually pretty close within 40 yards....its that....ya know....10th gear that seperates.

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 05:51 PM
4.37....not blown away.

he can take his 40 inch vertical to the nba for all i care...still not impressed.

Are we supposed to be impressed that you are not?:brickwall

houstonhurricane
04-02-2006, 05:55 PM
It sounds as if Bush had an absolutely spectacular pro day - to also include his bench reps and vertical. He will undoubtedly be the first pick in the draft.

As for qb, if some of you guys think it is such a valuable position and that Carr is not the answer, then why aren't you talking up Leinart? After his super performance today, there is no doubt he is the top qb in the draft. Hmmm...

TexansLucky13
04-02-2006, 05:57 PM
He got a 4.33 on the first 40. Thats 40 milliseconds behind Deion Sanders, the fastest recorded player to enter the NFL. That is impressive. Combined with excellent vision, non-hesitant poise and a cutting ability that is unparalled.... he makes for a well deserved 1st pick.

thunderkyss
04-02-2006, 05:59 PM
No doubt, Reggie has the potential to really make some noise. And, I would really like that kind of talent on our team. However........ I'd still rather we take Vince.

Kaiser Toro
04-02-2006, 06:00 PM
Were Bush worth it, you'd think we'd get Tom Hagan on line 2 with "an offer we can't refuse".

Tom has been out in Vegas dealing with the new business. Very profitable, high margins. I don't think he has the muscle to pull this deal off.

Mr.Scarface
04-02-2006, 06:05 PM
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/3765700.html


Bush just assured himself as the Texans' pick.

TexansLucky13
04-02-2006, 06:07 PM
Yeah. But he can't help our team. We have DD who rushed for 1000+ yards every season, and Jerome Mathis one of the best return man in NFL. Bush as a Wide Receiver? I saw few people saying that but that is ridiculous. If you look at him only as a wide receiver, he is definitely not worth 1st pick. And Reggie Bush will not lead our team to playoffs. RBs can't lead the team to playoffs. Neither can WR or a return man. Only QB can.

Thats an out-right crazy thing to say. Defense wins championships. There are few cases where a team had a poor defense and had a SB win. A good QB cant always be expected to delivery his team to the playoffs and beyond. P Man with the Colts is an example. He would never win a SB without a RB, and now that Edge is gone, who knows.

Tailgate
04-02-2006, 06:08 PM
Done.

TexanFan881
04-02-2006, 06:09 PM
I'm really excited to have him on our team :)

jmerog
04-02-2006, 06:10 PM
Geez!
Sign the man up!

TexansLucky13
04-02-2006, 06:10 PM
Next season we work out the kinks, get familiar with the new faces. After that, we will have our young Reggie breaking records as if he were the first man to play the game :superman:

jmerog
04-02-2006, 06:12 PM
Can you imagine how nasty he couls be in a screen pass situation? Dang.

Master Po
04-02-2006, 06:20 PM
At the risk of hijacking this enthralling donut thread...Reggie (5-11, 202) ran his 40 in 4.33. Had a 10-foot-9 long jump and a 40˝-inch vertical jump.

bad
04-02-2006, 06:23 PM
Can you imagine how nasty he couls be in a screen pass situation? Dang. I can imagine all sorts of nasty things happening to NFL defenses. Not everyone is aware of this, but Reggie Bush can throw a football pretty well and has no qualms about doing so.

I hope Kubiak has fun. I know I will.

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 06:30 PM
[QUOTE=bkimble]I don't understand the phenomenon with Reggie Bush. I think he is an excellent prospect but not the best collage prospect.

Maybe you know something that everyone else that analized the draft this year doesn't. Bush is at the top of everyone's draft board. Let me rephrase that.... EVERYBODY'S. I shudder to think who you might think is better. Dare I ask? :confused: :confused:

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 06:32 PM
I mean that he is a dime a dozen running back. He posted a average time for top running backs in the draft, he was lighter than most running backs in the past few drafts. I still do not see the hype, if he posted a 4.28 or 4.25 then heck yea I say that is something. At 5'10 202 4.35 is average for the top five running backs taken every year. He is solid for a wide reciever, but do the Texans need another reciever.


You should drop the "4 Texas" from your moniker.:brickwall

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 06:40 PM
[QUOTE=Crazy4Texas]Justin Fargas (6-1, 219, 4.32/40, 27/BP, 11’5"/LJ, 7%/BF) | USC
http://www.ffmastermind.com/2003/premium/madness/combineresults.html

Faster, bigger and is a backup in the NFL, oh and came from the same school and same system. Bush is a joke, all hype
HMMM took me 3 min to already find a guy faster![/QUOTE

Use another 3 min and see if you can come up with someone with a higher IQ that agrees with you.

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 06:56 PM
The news reorter who wrote that article for NFL.com is out of his mind. Electric timing is the standard for acurate timing across the world. If Bush ran a 4.33 then that is his time, not 4.23 or 4.43. I guess the guys in the olympics run a tenth of a second faster than what they time in at. What a dumb comment, very biased towards Reggie type of comment.

I agree. I am much more likely to believe you than a news reporter that makes his money and is held in high enough esteem to be hired by NFL.com. What is everyone thinking? And as far as bias is concerned.... he obviously has plenty, whereas you, on the other hand... have none. I'm glad you finally enlightened us to having a proper perspective. Thanks.

Huge1
04-02-2006, 07:03 PM
Has any of these RB haters on this board actually seen the kid play? The arguments made here against him are absolutely retarded. I am a native Texan and UT fan living in Arizona who was forced to watch EVERY single USC game played this last year (Pac-10 games dominate the tube on the West coast). I am a former D-1 linebacker who knows a "little" about football talent. IMO Bush and Mario Williams are the type of players who only come around every 10 to 15 years. I don't care about his size or if he ran a 5.33 (sarcasm), the kid is a born, phenomenol football player. When you have guys like L. Thomlinson (who IMO is the BEST back in all of football) saying that Bush is ALREADY a better back then himself.....how can you possibly argue with any of the "hype" that surrounds this kid. I'm tired of these armchair scouts who know jack **** about football acting like they are son of Mel Kiper.

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 07:12 PM
Has any of these RB haters on this board actually seen the kid play? The arguments made here against him are absolutely retarded. I am a native Texan and UT fan living in Arizona who was forced to watch EVERY single USC game played this last year (Pac-10 games dominate the tube on the West coast). I am a former D-1 linebacker who knows a "little" about football talent. IMO Bush and Mario Williams are the type of players who only come around every 10 to 15 years. I don't care about his size or if he ran a 5.33 (sarcasm), the kid is a born, phenomenol football player. When you have guys like L. Thomlinson (who IMO is the BEST back in all of football) saying that Bush is ALREADY a better back then himself.....how can you possibly argue with any of the "hype" that surrounds this kid. I'm tired of these armchair scouts who know jack **** about football acting like they are son of Mel Kiper.

Bless you Huge 1. I live on the west coast too, and see all the same games. You are absolutely right. And it's going to be a gas to watch the Texans next season. And all those Bush haters will be singing a different tune once they see him play. I'm ready to order my Battle Red # 5 jersey.

Daonly
04-02-2006, 07:15 PM
http://www.sparqtraining.com/


This company out of Portland did USC proday. They only do Usc's. They also do highschool and Nike Camps. I ask one of the guys how accurate the 40's are? they say they are very accurate.

Porky
04-02-2006, 07:17 PM
Has any of these RB haters on this board actually seen the kid play? The arguments made here against him are absolutely retarded. I am a native Texan and UT fan living in Arizona who was forced to watch EVERY single USC game played this last year (Pac-10 games dominate the tube on the West coast). I am a former D-1 linebacker who knows a "little" about football talent. IMO Bush and Mario Williams are the type of players who only come around every 10 to 15 years. I don't care about his size or if he ran a 5.33 (sarcasm), the kid is a born, phenomenol football player. When you have guys like L. Thomlinson (who IMO is the BEST back in all of football) saying that Bush is ALREADY a better back then himself.....how can you possibly argue with any of the "hype" that surrounds this kid. I'm tired of these armchair scouts who know jack **** about football acting like they are son of Mel Kiper.

Good stuff. Thanks for sharing. And it's also funny seeing this guy arguing with Gil Brandt, one of the all time great personell experts who masterminded the great Cowboys teams of the 70's and 80's, who was with the boys longer than he has probably been alive, and knows more football in one molecule in his pinky toe than this Texas moron has in his entire body. And, it really doesn't take long to see he is just a tad biased. His avatar is horns, and has texas in his name, not Texans. You are the weakest link - goodbye. :redtowel:

Grid
04-02-2006, 07:19 PM
Has any of these RB haters on this board actually seen the kid play? The arguments made here against him are absolutely retarded. I am a native Texan and UT fan living in Arizona who was forced to watch EVERY single USC game played this last year (Pac-10 games dominate the tube on the West coast). I am a former D-1 linebacker who knows a "little" about football talent. IMO Bush and Mario Williams are the type of players who only come around every 10 to 15 years. I don't care about his size or if he ran a 5.33 (sarcasm), the kid is a born, phenomenol football player. When you have guys like L. Thomlinson (who IMO is the BEST back in all of football) saying that Bush is ALREADY a better back then himself.....how can you possibly argue with any of the "hype" that surrounds this kid. I'm tired of these armchair scouts who know jack **** about football acting like they are son of Mel Kiper.

:yahoo: :yahoo:

Great post.. im getting really psyched to have Bush coming here.

Id give you a positive rating for the post but an angry/biased mod took away my voting privilages for disagreeing that VY was god :stirpot:

Huge1
04-02-2006, 07:20 PM
Bless you Huge 1. I live on the west coast too, and see all the same games. You are absolutely right. And it's going to be a gas to watch the Texans next season. And all those Bush haters will be singing a different tune once they see him play. I'm ready to order my Battle Red # 5 jersey.

Can Bush have #5 on his jersey? Correct me if I'm wrong (I played college, not pro) but isn't it some NFL rule that states the running backs numbers have to start at #20 and end at #49? Help please.

swtbound07
04-02-2006, 07:21 PM
Bless you Huge 1. I live on the west coast too, and see all the same games. You are absolutely right. And it's going to be a gas to watch the Texans next season. And all those Bush haters will be singing a different tune once they see him play. I'm ready to order my Battle Red # 5 jersey.

I dont agree with many people, but i agree with one sentence..i've said it once, i'll say it again. IF, read...IF reggie is drafted, the second they announce his name i stop all the negativity instantly, i cheer for him because he is a texan. That goes for any player fortunate enough to wear our colors. For me the debate stops april 29th. I can say right now that reggie bush the PROSPECT will bust out in the nfl, and i think he will. When he dons battle red, steel blue, or liberty white, he becomes one of us, and i predict nothing but victory. That doesnt change my cerebral opinion, but i watch football with my heart. The texans are my heart.

Grid
04-02-2006, 07:22 PM
yep

1-9 Quarterbacks and Kickers
10-19 Quarterbacks, Receivers, and Kickers
20-49 Running Backs and Defensive Backs
50-59 Centers and Linebackers
60-79 Defensive Linemen and Offensive Linemen
80-89 Receivers and Tight Ends
90-99 Defensive Linemen and Linebackers

he could be #25, 35, or 45

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 07:24 PM
Can Bush have #5 on his jersey? Correct me if I'm wrong (I played college, not pro) but isn't it some NFL rule that states the running backs numbers have to start at #20 and end at #49? Help please.

I don't know. You may be right. Whatever Bush's number will be... order me one in Battle Red.:redtowel:

Huge1
04-02-2006, 07:27 PM
I say give him #34. Not because he is Earl reincarnated, but to add to the tradition of great #34's in ALL sports in H-town.

Mike Kerns
04-02-2006, 07:28 PM
I dont agree with many people, but i agree with one sentence..i've said it once, i'll say it again. IF, read...IF reggie is drafted, the second they announce his name i stop all the negativity instantly, i cheer for him because he is a texan. That goes for any player fortunate enough to wear our colors. For me the debate stops april 29th. I can say right now that reggie bush the PROSPECT will bust out in the nfl, and i think he will. When he dons battle red, steel blue, or liberty white, he becomes one of us, and i predict nothing but victory. That doesnt change my cerebral opinion, but i watch football with my heart. The texans are my heart.
Who are you & what have you done with the REAL Swtbound ?:stirpot:

Just kidding. Not like you are MONARCH or something who will probaly throw himself out of a 2nd story window at about 12:10 on April 29th.

dat_boy_yec
04-02-2006, 07:33 PM
Who are you & what have you done with the REAL Swtbound ?:stirpot:

Just kidding. Not like you are MONARCH or something who will probaly throw himself out of a 2nd story window at about 12:10 on April 29th.
lol, man that monarch is a character, I wonder what his posts will be like after the draft. Oh let me try.

Thou hast forsaken the native son.......YOU WILL BE SMOTTEN FOR THOU TREACHEROUS ACTIONS.....blah,blah,blah. LONG LIVE THE YOUNG KINGDOM....whereever that is

Monarch

Huge1
04-02-2006, 07:35 PM
lol, man that monarch is a character, I wonder what his posts will be like after the draft. Oh let me try.

Thou hast forsaken the native son.......YOU WILL BE SMOTTEN FOR THOU TREACHEROUS ACTIONS.....blah,blah,blah. LONG LIVE THE YOUNG KINGDOM....whereever that is

Monarch

Classic!

Mario Williams
04-02-2006, 07:36 PM
Give him #23... next Michael Jordan.

Huge1
04-02-2006, 07:37 PM
Give him #23... next Michael Jordan.

Nolan, Earl and Hakeem say no. lol

swtbound07
04-02-2006, 07:45 PM
Who are you & what have you done with the REAL Swtbound ?:stirpot:

Just kidding. Not like you are MONARCH or something who will probaly throw himself out of a 2nd story window at about 12:10 on April 29th.


Lol....dont get me wrong, Im still going to argue vehemently for VY until zero hour, and Im still going to say a lot of people will owe me apologys for doubting me. But there is a time to throw down the gloves and retire...And for me, the debate ends, win or lose, at the draft. Be it Vince or reggie or suprise, then Im supporting. If i supported matt stevens, i can certainly do this.

tulexan
04-02-2006, 07:51 PM
Isn't Dunta #23?

dat_boy_yec
04-02-2006, 07:55 PM
Guess Morency is just gonna have to give up that 34 so we can continue the legacy of its greatness in houston. 34 should not be on the bench what the hell was Morrency thinking. J/K

platnumdelgado
04-02-2006, 08:12 PM
So it is a now guarenteed we get Bush at #1 after his workout 2day?

Wolf
04-02-2006, 08:13 PM
wow what a wild thread..

All I can say is Bush didn't hurt himself with this workout.. people can argue and pin for or against if this was impressive or not.. I say he did what he needed to do to be a top 5 pick.

What I am hoping is either a) we take him or b) his workout got some team hot to trot for him and wanting badly to make a deal because frankly N.O. with the Brees deal stole some of our bargaining power if we were to trade down. This helps our trade scenario IMO if we were to go that route.

If we take Bush #1 I'll be happy .. If we trade down and gain some picks and possibly get (I went blank) the TE Davis??? ..that guy had some speed and strength also

Tale Gator
04-02-2006, 08:27 PM
This guy ran a 4.3 40 yard dash and it was on a electronical timer, so that would mean he really ran a 4.25, Holy Crap(sorry) but that is crazy. Even more crazy is that he weighted in at 202 and put up 24 reps of 225lbs, that is amazing.

Electronic timers are very accurate, if an e-timer clocked him at 4.33 then he ran a 4.33.

The 24 reps really impressed me more than anything. :cool:

bad
04-02-2006, 08:32 PM
Electronic timers are very accurate, if an e-timer clocked him at 4.33 then he ran a 4.33.

The 24 reps really impressed me more than anything. :cool: The E-timers clocked him at 4.25 and 4.29

He ran on turf so they added .08 to his times.

As I've stated before, everyone who's seen the guy knows he's fast.

I agree the BP numbers are what stands out.

TexansFanatic
04-02-2006, 08:41 PM
What's the story on the sub 11 foot long jump? How is it Carl Lewis had a near 30 foot long jump? These must be completely different types of long jumps, eh?

bad
04-02-2006, 08:43 PM
What's the story on the sub 11 foot long jump? How is it Carl Lewis had a near 30 foot long jump? These must be completely different types of long jumps, eh?
Lewis had a running start.

tulexan
04-02-2006, 08:45 PM
The E-timers clocked him at 4.25 and 4.29

He ran on turf so they added .08 to his times.

As I've stated before, everyone who's seen the guy knows he's fast.

I agree the BP numbers are what stands out.

No the electronic timers had him at 4.33 and 4.37. The whole "deduct .08 seconds from the time" thing is because almost all other pro day events were done by hand timers which are about .08 seconds faster than electronic timers because the timers either start late or end early because it all depends on the reaction times of the human timer.

dat_boy_yec
04-02-2006, 08:49 PM
No the electronic timers had him at 4.33 and 4.37. The whole "deduct .08 seconds from the time" thing is because almost all other pro day events were done by hand timers which are about .08 seconds faster than electronic timers because the timers either start late or end early because it all depends on the reaction times of the human timer.

So then wouldn't the .08 distort the times even more with human timers considering they are already inaccurate. That may be true for those who stop to early but then how can that apply to someone who doesn't stop on time or like the article you pointed out said start with their index finger and not their thumb.

I think bad had it right otherwise why add the .08 if not to compensate for what is considered a fast track.

Hervoyel
04-02-2006, 08:54 PM
All of you enhance your calm. Shipleys or Krispy Kreme it makes no difference. They're all donuts and they all rule. Niether one is better. They're both excellent in different ways. If you live in a town where you've got both then you're living in heaven.

Of course if you live in a town where all you have is Dunkin' Donuts you're in hell and there's nothing the rest of us can do to help you. Sorry about that.

That's all I've got to say about that.

TreWardTxn
04-02-2006, 08:54 PM
Let me get my spiel on this whole situation in here; I don't see how anybody can argue against Bush's measureables, as far as his ability to pull away in the open field. However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue, he only carried the ball 20+ times his final year at USC. Since DD will be here, I'm not concerned about that. Although Bush's 24 reps of 225 is incredible (if the stat is real, haven't seen it listed on NFL.com) anyone who scouts talent will tell you that football is played with your legs (or base). Runners drag tacklers with their legs, not their chest.

That said, it is Bush's running style that causes me the most concern. Great backs fall forward and get the extra two yards, the difference between 3rd and 2, and a fresh set of downs. I have never heard anyone mention this quality for Bush in college, and I don't see any reason why it would start in the pros. Make no mistake, he would rather juke a guy his own size than run through him. His speed and agility made it possible for him to run through arm tackles in college, and he should continue that to some extent; but he also has a tendency to stop and look to cut across field when a defender is in his path, resulting in him going backward or not getting the extra yard. I think it is also fair to say that Bush will not have the kind of success with stopping, and cutting clear across field as he did in college, and hopefully he will break that habit. I think it was also observed that against a fast defense (Texas) Bush was a seconday weapon in the sense that White tired out the defense first with power running, allowing Reggie to beat everyone to the corner.
Basically, Bush is lightning in a bottle, but not instant offense; he will not be a short yardage back, or get the "tough" yards like top backs who wear out defenses do. If he can make up this lack of production in the running game with receiving (screens should be deadly) then maybe he will meet expectations (about 1500 yards), but will likely otherwise fall short ...

bad
04-02-2006, 08:56 PM
No the electronic timers had him at 4.33 and 4.37. The whole "deduct .08 seconds from the time" thing is because almost all other pro day events were done by hand timers which are about .08 seconds faster than electronic timers because the timers either start late or end early because it all depends on the reaction times of the human timer.
If I were any more confused right now I'd be a Titans fan.

First we have this:

They ran outdoors on AstroTurf, which was a fast surface. All 40-yard dash times were clocked electronically, which historically adds about .08 of a second to the actual time. For instance, if someone ran the 40 in 4.50 seconds, it really means he ran it in about 4.42 seconds.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9353513

And this:

There were 26 teams represented, with a total of 50 NFL people, including position coaches from the Browns and the Buccaneers. It's the start of a West Coast swing for scouts. The players ran outside on a wet grass field due to rain. The players were told that .05 would be subtracted from their times because of the poor conditions. Wind was not a factor.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#fresno

And in case you're still not confused, there's this.

Grizzled track coaches love to say that the "clock doesn't lie." Well, it does in football.
Say someone clocks a hand-timed 4.35 in an NFL workout.
The accepted standard to convert a hand-timed event to its automatically timed equivalent is to round up to the nearest tenth of a second -- in this case 4.4 -- and add .24 seconds. Now you're at 4.64.

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

Can we just say he's fast and leave it at that?

dat_boy_yec
04-02-2006, 09:00 PM
If I were any more confused right now I'd be a Titans fan.

First we have this:

They ran outdoors on AstroTurf, which was a fast surface. All 40-yard dash times were clocked electronically, which historically adds about .08 of a second to the actual time. For instance, if someone ran the 40 in 4.50 seconds, it really means he ran it in about 4.42 seconds.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9353513

And this:

There were 26 teams represented, with a total of 50 NFL people, including position coaches from the Browns and the Buccaneers. It's the start of a West Coast swing for scouts. The players ran outside on a wet grass field due to rain. The players were told that .05 would be subtracted from their times because of the poor conditions. Wind was not a factor.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#fresno

And in case you're still not confused, there's this.

Grizzled track coaches love to say that the "clock doesn't lie." Well, it does in football.
Say someone clocks a hand-timed 4.35 in an NFL workout.
The accepted standard to convert a hand-timed event to its automatically timed equivalent is to round up to the nearest tenth of a second -- in this case 4.4 -- and add .24 seconds. Now you're at 4.64.

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

Can we just say he's fast and leave it at that?

They were different tracks so the deductions varied......I think.

newbiefan
04-02-2006, 09:05 PM
As I understand it, and I might be wrong, the e-timers clocked him at 4.25 and 4.29. For official times, they add or subtract time for the surface run on and/or wind factor (ie. wet grass vs. astroturf). In this case, they added .08 seconds, making official times 4.33 and 4.37. The whole .08 seconds for hand timing is irrelevant, but that argument would only make his numbers faster.

Basically, he's fast, but we all knew that. Anyone get any info on his running back drills and wide receiver skills?

Carr Bombed
04-02-2006, 09:11 PM
Okay I just got off work and checked out this thread and I have to point out one of the biggest flip floppers.

First of all this fellow poster says:

Crazy4Texas past statement (http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=20599)

If Reggie comes out under 200 lbs people are going to have to get realistic about him being a NFL RB.

Truth about Sunday, if both of Reggie (gale sayers) Bush 40's are not below 4.4 I truly feel it is going to hurt his draft status.

also further down in the same post

I hope Reggie runs under 4.4 because he has had more time to prepair than any other RB in this draft. If he is able to run 4.35 at 205 to 210 I say he is worthy of #1 pick, if he has to drop down to 190-195 to run 4.35 then he has no chance at RB but could be a good #2 reciever for some team.

Now granted, he wasn't at your bench mark 205 pounds, but does 4 pounds really make a difference whether or not to pass on a player, hell I had the flu last weak and lost 7 pounds, this is absolutely ridiculous, but wait it goes on.

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308206#post308206

The Truth will come out Sunday! If he comes in under 205 there is going to be trouble. What the guy runs in the 40 at 195 and 205 will not be the same! Clinton Portis was a small back in Denver, and they traded his behind! I don't think Kubiak wants to take that route again. Bush has to be 205 or heaver and under 4.4. If he does, he earns that top pick, if he does not I say trade down!

Again if your willing to dismiss a player over a measly four pounds I don't know what to say, I've lost 4 pounds in the course of one day. Again Bush lived up to your standard and ran Well under 4.4.

Don't worry Texan fans it goes on:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=307329#post307329


One thing is for sure, If The RB does not do well, ESPN will deff. not mention it. He should run mid 4.4 and ESPN will make it sound like he broke the speed barrier! I hope he runs in the 4.3 range, he has had more time to prep than any onther player in this years draft and to give a poor performance with the time he has had to prep would be very bad for the guy.

Wow in this post there was no magical 205 pound standard in your post, in fact he met a exceeded all you expectations and still you don't think he had a impressive pro day. I don't know what to say.

In every post you never expected RB to run better than a 4.3 and said you'll be content with that type of performance. You even went as far to say he would justify being the #1 pick if he ran a 4.3 (but of course thats only if he weighed a extra 4 pounds :rolleyes: )

On a side note I find it absolutely hillarious that in some of your posts you try to make a point that we should compare Reggie Bush's 40 time to WRs and DB, because your not comfortable with his weight.

But wait thats exactly what you did with VINCE YOUNG:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308183#post308183

First off, NFL.com has it written that Matt is said to not be running the 40, my guess is because he has 5.0 speed but should that mattter if his arm is extremely accurate and very strong shoot he had better stats his Senior Year than his Jnr Year when he won the hiesman. Regardless, the media wont attack him like they did Young when he was choosing to opt. out of running the 40.

Bush is working out as a reciever ??? I though he was a Running Back??? If Reggie comes out under 200 lbs people are going to have to get realistic about him being a NFL RB.

Truth about Sunday, if both of Reggie (gale sayers) Bush 40's are not below 4.4 I truly feel it is going to hurt his draft status. Ladaninon Tomlinson, the closest comparison to reggie Bush, ran a 4.38 at 5'10 221 lbs thats 20 lbs more than Reggie Bush. Check the facts yourself and while your there look at the recievers and inspect Chad (riverdance) Johnsons stats http://espn.go.com/melkiper/s/2001/0227/1113401.html
If you look at this web site you will also see LT's numbers and you will also see that Vince Young and WR Chad Johnson have something in common they both posted 4.58 40 yrd dash. I guess that should bring some perspective to people questioning Vince Young's 40 being a slow time unless you people think that Chad Johnson is slow. I hope Reggie runs under 4.4 because he has had more time to prepair than any other RB in this draft. If he is able to run 4.35 at 205 to 210 I say he is worthy of #1 pick, if he has to drop down to 190-195 to run 4.35 then he has no chance at RB but could be a good #2 reciever for some team.

T.J. Duckett is the closest comparison as a power back like Lyndale White, T.J. at 250 ran times of 4.45 in the 40 and had a v-jump of 37 with 25 reps at 225. I will set a standard of T.J.'s marks for White. Check my numbers http://www.nfl.com/draft/2002/individual_workouts.html
Oh while on this page check David Carrs number in the 40 4.79 plus evaluate that the year of of Carrs draft and you will see Carr was #1 QB out of probably the most terrible bunch of QB talent to ever come out of a NFL draft at QB! Just the facts!

I hope Reggie comes through, but if he flops, I think we should trade down.

Johnny Utah
04-02-2006, 09:21 PM
Okay I just got off work and checked out this thread and I have to point out one of the biggest flip floppers.

First of all this fellow poster says:

Crazy4Texas past statement (http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=20599)



also further down in the same post



Now granted, he wasn't at your bench mark 205 pounds, but does 4 pounds really make a difference whether or not to pass on a player, hell I had the flu last weak and lost 7 pounds, this is absolutely ridiculous, but wait it goes on.

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308206#post308206



Again if your willing to dismiss a player over a measly four pounds. Having said that yet again Bush lived up to your standard and ran Well under 4.4.

Don't worry Texan fans it goes on:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=307329#post307329




Wow in this post there was no magical 205 pound standard in your post, in fact he met a exceeded all you expectations and still you don't think he had a impressive pro day. I don't know what to say.

In every post you never expected RB to run better than a 4.3 and said you'll be content with that type of performance. You even went as far to say he would justify being the #1 pick if he ran a 4.3 (but of course thats only if he weighed a extra 4 pounds :rolleyes: )

lol. Well done Carr Bomb.

Dr. Toro
04-02-2006, 09:23 PM
Pasquarelli says scouts had him at 4.37 and 4.41.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft06/news/story?id=2394532

tulexan
04-02-2006, 09:33 PM
Pasquarelli says scouts had him at 4.37 and 4.41.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft06/news/story?id=2394532



see this article

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

I'll trust an electronically timed run over a hand timed run any day.

newbiefan
04-02-2006, 09:36 PM
I'll trust an electronically timed run over a hand timed run any day.


word

TexansLucky13
04-02-2006, 09:38 PM
I'll trust an electronically timed run over a hand timed run any day.

true dat!

DoCt3rJ
04-02-2006, 10:12 PM
For all of you people sayin Bush is a system guy, only put up big numbers cause of his school right? Who in a USC uniform put up bigger numbers? Anyone know Clinton Portis.. about the same size....same speed...not as strong though, he was in Denver, putting up big numbers in a big system. He goes to Washington, horrible o-line, still does good, and last year, better oline, did alot better, and is still a great rb. I think Bush is a better version of Portis.. that's just my opinion.

DoCt3rJ
04-02-2006, 10:14 PM
Oh and did I add... Portis was in the same system that Bush will be in if he comes to the Texans? ............. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.. and wait, Portis was a second round pick. Nobody expected 1500+ first 2 seasons.. come on.

Tejaspro
04-02-2006, 10:38 PM
However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue,

That said, it is Bush's running style that causes me the most concern. Great backs fall forward and get the extra two yards, the difference between 3rd and 2, and a fresh set of downs.

I think it is also fair to say that Bush will not have the kind of success with stopping, and cutting clear across field as he did in college, and hopefully he will break that habit. I

If he can make up this lack of production in the running game with receiving (screens should be deadly) then maybe he will meet expectations (about 1500 yards), but will likely otherwise fall short ...

TreWardTxn === Just some thoughts...

Did you ever see Barry Sanders play? First, you had to catch him, as he was also a great cutback runner with speed. And, I don't recall anyone ever being concerned with his weight.

Bush is a natural cutback runner. He is not a power back. He doesn't need to drag players an extra 2 yards. I don't know how much you have seen him play. But watching him seems to make concerns melt away. I just don't think you want to try to drive your Ferrari through a chain link fence to see how far you can drag the fencing. You can use your truck for that. But your truck isn't going to win the race.

As far as losing ground to make more yards.... maybe you didn't see Mathis (with his speed) do the same thing on kick offs and outrun these same pros. In fact, he used that same ploy more than once to make it down the field. And I hope Bush doesn't "break that habit".

Reggie Bush has made a career of overcoming doubters expectations. Hopefully, he will continue that in the NFL. If so, we will all be happy campers.

jacquescas
04-02-2006, 11:26 PM
can we just agree that Bush is an oversized Warrick Dunn with better hands...

i think thats the closest comparison to any NFL player. he is just 2 inches taller and 22 pounds heavier.

tulexan
04-03-2006, 12:07 AM
ESPN is about to show highlights of Reggie's workout if anyone is interested.

I will try to post a review of it.

phan1
04-03-2006, 12:13 AM
If I were any more confused right now I'd be a Titans fan.

First we have this:

They ran outdoors on AstroTurf, which was a fast surface. All 40-yard dash times were clocked electronically, which historically adds about .08 of a second to the actual time. For instance, if someone ran the 40 in 4.50 seconds, it really means he ran it in about 4.42 seconds.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9353513

And this:

There were 26 teams represented, with a total of 50 NFL people, including position coaches from the Browns and the Buccaneers. It's the start of a West Coast swing for scouts. The players ran outside on a wet grass field due to rain. The players were told that .05 would be subtracted from their times because of the poor conditions. Wind was not a factor.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#fresno

And in case you're still not confused, there's this.

Grizzled track coaches love to say that the "clock doesn't lie." Well, it does in football.
Say someone clocks a hand-timed 4.35 in an NFL workout.
The accepted standard to convert a hand-timed event to its automatically timed equivalent is to round up to the nearest tenth of a second -- in this case 4.4 -- and add .24 seconds. Now you're at 4.64.

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

Can we just say he's fast and leave it at that?


I like that. This 40-time is getting really confusing. And to actually think RB ran the 40 in the 4.25 range is crazy. That's a groundbreaking NFL combine time and writers would be talking all day long about it. I'm pretty sure scouts really don't believe RB ran a 40 in 4.25 legitamitely. Either way, he's fast, and this was a time we all expected out of him. He didn't do anything to hurt his draft status today. Putting 5 more pounds to his frame would have been nice, but to protect his draft status, his 40 time couldn't be compromised at all.

texman8
04-03-2006, 12:15 AM
can we just agree that Bush is an oversized Warrick Dunn with better hands...

i think thats the closest comparison to any NFL player. he is just 2 inches taller and 22 pounds heavier.

http://www.sportingnews.com/archives/sanders/stats.html

Who knows? Barry never had a great OL in front of him. Check out his size, weight...

Ibar_Harry
04-03-2006, 12:35 AM
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.

whiskeyrbl
04-03-2006, 12:36 AM
can we just agree that Bush is an oversized Warrick Dunn with better hands...

i think thats the closest comparison to any NFL player. he is just 2 inches taller and 22 pounds heavier.
Tony Dorsett was 5'11 197lbs.

Frank_The_Tank
04-03-2006, 12:42 AM
Tony Dorset was never hit by Ray Lewis LOL

whiskeyrbl
04-03-2006, 12:48 AM
LOS ANGELES -- Scheduled to be the guest of honor at Petco Park on Monday, Reggie Bush strongly hinted that the first pitch of the San Diego Padres' 2006 season will be a curveball.


AP Photo/Ric Francis
Reggie Bush's 40-yard sprint was timed at about 4.37 seconds.

An interesting choice by the Southern California tailback and Heisman Trophy winner, since he delivered nothing but fastballs during the Trojans' "pro day" workouts Sunday afternoon, a session in which Bush clearly cemented his status as the first overall selection by the Houston Texans in the April 29 draft.


Working in front of about 150 scouts and personnel officials, a group that included four head coaches and several general managers, Bush was surgically proficient in every drill in which he participated. He posted an eye-opening 40˝-inch vertical jump, performed a very solid 24 repetitions on the standard 225-pound bench press, and was clocked in the 40-yard sprint in 4.37-4.41 seconds, according to a few scouts. The electronic times for Bush were a little quicker, in the 4.33-4.37 range.


In the on-field drills, Bush demonstrated burst out of the backfield. And while there weren't as many balls directed to him as he had hoped during Matt Leinart's throwing session, he caught the ball well.


The Courtship of Reggie Bush
LOS ANGELES -- The wooing of Reggie Bush by the Houston Texans, already an ardent courtship by the franchise which owns the top overall selection in the draft, will progress to the next level later this week.

ESPN.com has learned that the Southern California tailback and Heisman Trophy winner will meet with Texans officials, including owner Bob McNair, in Houston on Thursday. As part of a full day of activities, Bush's agent, Joel Segal, will huddle with Dan Ferens, who handles the Texans' contract negotiations.


Because they hold the top pick in the April 29 draft, the Texans may commence contract negotiations at any point and may, in fact, speak with more than one player. It is not known if the Texans will initiate talks with Segal on Thursday, but it will not be surprising if the two sides use the meeting to get some sort of feel for each other's financial expectations.


Sources confirmed the Texans will meet Friday with quarterback Vince Young. Unlike Bush, the University of Texas star will perform on-field drills for the Texans staff.


The Texans, who aren't likely to trade the first pick, prefer to have the No. 1 choice under contract, or at least with a contract agreement, before the draft begins.


Bush will not do any on-field drills on Thursday. Instead, the day will be more of a get-acquainted visit, in which Bush will meet with coaches and team officials. That process has already begun, as Bush dined on Saturday night with Texans officials at a Beverly Hills steak house.

-- Len Pasquarelli


"Probably not the absolute perfect day that everybody wants to have at one of these things," Bush told ESPN.com after the nearly four hours of drills. "But I felt good. I feel like I came in here today as the No. 1 guy, and I think I'm leaving the same way. So, in that sense, it's pretty satisfying. Now I can kick back and go to the beach for a few days. For me, well, I think I'm walking out of here a winner for the day."


Probably not the biggest winner, though, since Bush's draft status wasn't going to change at all based on Sunday's audition. Unless, of course, he fell on his face in every drill.





Not as tight as LenDale White, the other half of the USC tailback tandem, and the man who holds the school record for touchdowns. Still nursing a sore hamstring he said he sustained at the combine sessions in Indianapolis nearly six weeks ago, White looked soft and performed only in the bench press drill, where he eked out just 15 lifts. He rarely removed his track suit and, when he did, White looked soft. He weighed in at 244 pounds, six pounds heavier than he was at the combine.


White didn't seem concerned about not being able to work out. "I'm the only true big back in the first round, and people who want the physical runner are going to have to look at me," he said.


Several personnel directors emphasized, though, that time is running out on White, who has yet to be timed in the 40.


"At some point, and real soon, he's got to take off that warm-up suit and run," said one of the head coaches on hand. "No one has a 40-time on him and that's not good."

Len Pasquarelli is a senior NFL writer for ESPN.com.




Adjust Font Size:

infantrycak
04-03-2006, 12:49 AM
Tony Dorset was never hit by Ray Lewis LOL

Don't play that game--Dorsett was hit by guys like Jack Lambert.

whiskeyrbl
04-03-2006, 12:54 AM
Don't play that game--Dorsett was hit by guys like Jack Lambert.

Don't forget "The Assassin" Jack Tatum, Hell he KO'ed EARL

stevo3883
04-03-2006, 12:56 AM
Don't play that game--Dorsett was hit by guys like Jack Lambert.


pfft he's like 60 years old! Ray Ray would destroy him!

whiskeyrbl
04-03-2006, 12:57 AM
Not in his prime my friend

clandestin
04-03-2006, 12:59 AM
However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue...

It can't be a fact if it hasn't happened yet.

I'm not a spelling/grammar police sort of guy, but can I just say that the amount of misinformation and the number of blatantly false statements in this thread is appalling to me.

A few notes for any youngsters who may be reading the board:

1. Don't believe everything you read on the internet (or copy and paste into a message board). Learning how to tell the difference between good and bad information is a valuable skill.

2. If you don't know something, don't pretend that you do in order to win an arguement. That sort of attitude just discourages you from learning more about the subject.

3. Believe it or not: someday you'll get so old that you think a long-winded rant may actually do some good...

Frank_The_Tank
04-03-2006, 01:26 AM
Don't play that game--Dorsett was hit by guys like Jack Lambert.

Yea, great comeback :ok: LOL Dosett was great 30 years ago, its to bad Bush did not come out back in 1977 LOL

ledzeppelin229
04-03-2006, 01:33 AM
I feel sorry for the UT fans that are represented by you. Honestly, I asked you in another thread but I'm not sure if I ever got an answer (I could have missed it?), but what will you do if Vince isn't drafted? Will you change teams?

cap1
04-03-2006, 02:42 AM
Okay I just got off work and checked out this thread and I have to point out one of the biggest flip floppers.

First of all this fellow poster says:

Crazy4Texas past statement (http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=20599)



also further down in the same post



Now granted, he wasn't at your bench mark 205 pounds, but does 4 pounds really make a difference whether or not to pass on a player, hell I had the flu last weak and lost 7 pounds, this is absolutely ridiculous, but wait it goes on.

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308206#post308206



Again if your willing to dismiss a player over a measly four pounds I don't know what to say, I've lost 4 pounds in the course of one day. Again Bush lived up to your standard and ran Well under 4.4.

Don't worry Texan fans it goes on:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=307329#post307329




Wow in this post there was no magical 205 pound standard in your post, in fact he met a exceeded all you expectations and still you don't think he had a impressive pro day. I don't know what to say.

In every post you never expected RB to run better than a 4.3 and said you'll be content with that type of performance. You even went as far to say he would justify being the #1 pick if he ran a 4.3 (but of course thats only if he weighed a extra 4 pounds :rolleyes: )

On a side note I find it absolutely hillarious that in some of your posts you try to make a point that we should compare Reggie Bush's 40 time to WRs and DB, because your not comfortable with his weight.

But wait thats exactly what you did with VINCE YOUNG:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308183#post308183

Carr_Bomb,

You are the man. This is the best post I have ever seen about a Troll.

Tale Gator
04-03-2006, 06:16 AM
http://i2.tinypic.com/swzhx0.jpg

Wow, Bush is a Tron fan -- I for one did not know that. :shocked

TreWardTxn
04-03-2006, 08:02 AM
However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue,

That said, it is Bush's running style that causes me the most concern. Great backs fall forward and get the extra two yards, the difference between 3rd and 2, and a fresh set of downs.

I think it is also fair to say that Bush will not have the kind of success with stopping, and cutting clear across field as he did in college, and hopefully he will break that habit. I

If he can make up this lack of production in the running game with receiving (screens should be deadly) then maybe he will meet expectations (about 1500 yards), but will likely otherwise fall short ...

TreWardTxn === Just some thoughts...

Did you ever see Barry Sanders play? First, you had to catch him, as he was also a great cutback runner with speed. And, I don't recall anyone ever being concerned with his weight.

Bush is a natural cutback runner. He is not a power back. He doesn't need to drag players an extra 2 yards. I don't know how much you have seen him play. But watching him seems to make concerns melt away. I just don't think you want to try to drive your Ferrari through a chain link fence to see how far you can drag the fencing. You can use your truck for that. But your truck isn't going to win the race.

As far as losing ground to make more yards.... maybe you didn't see Mathis (with his speed) do the same thing on kick offs and outrun these same pros. In fact, he used that same ploy more than once to make it down the field. And I hope Bush doesn't "break that habit".

Reggie Bush has made a career of overcoming doubters expectations. Hopefully, he will continue that in the NFL. If so, we will all be happy campers.

Yes I've seen Barry Sanders play, which is why I know Bush is nothing like Barry. First of, Barry had the lowest center of gravity of any running back ever, Reggie runs upright. He was 5'8'' and still weighed a good 200 when he entered the league. One of his thighs was the size of Bush's torso, he was a much harder player to tackle once he was contacted. Bush is not Barry. Bush doesn't even run like Portis, who has more mass for his frame, and is a much more patient runner who picks his way through cracks rather than looking for a hole to blow through or run around the corner.

Please don't compare running plays to punt returns, they are completley different plays and is the one area where cutting across the field can work occassionaly if good blocks are made; which is why if Bush is drafted, I wouldn't want to see our $60 M investment returning punts, but it is the most NFL ready part of his game.

As for your Ferrari-truck metaphor...that is my point exactly, if the finish line for the race your're in is behind a fence, then what good is gonna do you to have the Ferrari? You need something to do the heavy work, and unless Bush can add this element to his game, he will disappoint. Even guys like Faulk (who Bush has been compared to) were much more physical runners and regularly broke tackles from LBs and S.

TreWardTxn
04-03-2006, 08:09 AM
It can't be a fact if it hasn't happened yet.

I'm not a spelling/grammar police sort of guy, but can I just say that the amount of misinformation and the number of blatantly false statements in this thread is appalling to me.



You're correct; Reggie Bush's weight (and lack of carries) are pertinent issues. It seems quite certain that it will continue to be so, because even more stout rookie RBs have had problems with this in years past. Sorry for the shortcut...

SESupergenius
04-03-2006, 08:10 AM
Any back that can boast 24 reps at 225 and run a sub 4.4 is pretty special. He is a very solid all around athlete, that can block if need be, something that DD does not do very well. There is no Vince Young in the equation for us folks, sorry to burn you orange.

footballguy69
04-03-2006, 08:43 AM
I am ready to take him with the #1 pick. With a 4.33 forty and his excellent bench press showing, I am convinced he is the guy to be a playmaker. No longer will a running back of ours get caught from behind. Any thoughts? :ok:

JAXwithanX
04-03-2006, 05:36 PM
i really don't think his bench presses equate to the field near as much as the other drills he chose not to perform would have. but i don't blame him for not doing them....he can do all that in the personal workouts. but like i said....i was the first to point out how incredible that bench press number was for his size. only a few people at that size have ever came close to that number in the combine.....and well of course crazy4texas apparently.

bkimble
04-03-2006, 08:06 PM
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.


You got it. I was thinking the same thing. Actually, I was wondering why the Texans were bring in both Vince and Reggie for personal visits? He's why IMO. Maybe they are playing one against the other? If you watch Bush and Vince carefully you will see two very competitive and successful young men. I believe their competitive spirits are playing right into the Texans' plans. Let me be clear, I am 100 percent for Vince, and I think he is best player in college football period, but here's what I think is going on. Again IMO, I believe the Texans has decided to go with Bush with the first pick in this years' draft, however, if they can't get him to agree to a contract before the draft than they are going to draft Vince Young. Because Vince likely would take less money. I can see it playing out like this, they know that Vince would love to stay in Houston and about 50 percent of theirs fan base would love for them to draft him. On draft day, It would go something like this, Kubes would said that after Vince came in for his one-one personal workout, I fell in love with this guy's ability and his upside and that's why we drafted him. Another thing that's clear to me is that the Texans has told Bush's people that Reggie is their guy, why else would this guy be saying that he 99.9 percent sure that he'd be the top pick? So, I hope Reggie has smart people around him because he's going to need them.

:superman:

Kaiser Toro
04-03-2006, 08:11 PM
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.

I do not laugh as this is what I would be doing if I were Ferens as well. He does have leverage and should be using it.

tulexan
04-03-2006, 08:20 PM
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.


I don't think this is the case at all. There is no justification for taking Vince Young with the #1 pick. You don't base your decision on where the player is from, which is pretty much the only reason why the Texans would take him. The only reason why they are even aknowledging him is to save face with the Longhorn fans.

If the Texans were interested in replacing Carr then we would be bringing in Cutler and Leinart as well.

Reggie will leave on Thursday as our pick and most likely with at least the basic parameters of a contract in place.

Casserly basically said yesterday after the pro day yesterday that he and Kubiak have seen enough with Bush to make their decision.

Vince will be brought in on Friday to save face and so they can look like they are covering all bases before making their decision.

TexansLucky13
04-03-2006, 08:20 PM
Haha. It's a moot point to mention who Reggie has been compared to. He has been compared to any RB who weighs less than 220 pounds and has had seasons of 1000+ yards. He definitely needs to add a lil bulk to him... but if he puts on 20 or more pounds he wont be able to show off his cutting ability... its easier to get brought down when your waist is an inch larger on either side. Hehehe.

dalemurphy
04-03-2006, 08:26 PM
I don't think this is the case at all. There is no justification for taking Vince Young with the #1 pick. You don't base your decision on where the player is from, which is pretty much the only reason why the Texans would take him. The only reason why they are even aknowledging him is to save face with the Longhorn fans.

If the Texans were interested in replacing Carr then we would be bringing in Cutler and Leinart as well.

Reggie will leave on Thursday as our pick and most likely with at least the basic parameters of a contract in place.

Casserly basically said yesterday after the pro day yesterday that he and Kubiak have seen enough with Bush to make their decision.

Vince will be brought in on Friday to save face and so they can look like they are covering all bases before making their decision.


I think bringing Vince here is also an effort to scare Oakland and Arizona into talking trade. I agree, though, that it's unlikely to happen. And certainly, we are not drafting him with the first pick.

caspian
04-04-2006, 12:15 AM
ESPN USC pro day article (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft06/news/story?id=2394532)

"Working in front of about 150 scouts and personnel officials, a group that included four head coaches and several general managers, Bush was surgically proficient in every drill in which he participated. He posted an eye-opening 40½-inch vertical jump, performed a very solid 24 repetitions on the standard 225-pound bench press, and was clocked in the 40-yard sprint in 4.37-4.41 seconds, according to a few scouts. The electronic times for Bush were a little quicker, in the 4.33-4.37 range.

In the on-field drills, Bush demonstrated burst out of the backfield. And while there weren't as many balls directed to him as he had hoped during Matt Leinart's throwing session, he caught the ball well."

I highly recommend watching the video footage.

HOOK'EM
04-10-2006, 12:40 AM
Ive been out a while,(my wife having our first baby and another Texan fan) could someone give me an update on how Bush did? what he ran?..............