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Nighthawk
03-12-2006, 07:16 PM
I've been hammering the Texans for a while, but today it struck me: maybe they know what they're doing.

Look at it this way: in FA maybe they are making small but significant improvements. Weaver is, by all accounts a solid player. Sage Rosenfels, well, I don't know. He's reasonably tall. The fullback looks like a solid, serious guy. THe other people they're looking at--the center, the tight end, Givens -- they're all solid players. Not spectacular, but maybe significantly better than what we're use to.

So maybe that's the FA idea--incremental improvements over a wide range of positions.

And yes, they're overpaying. And yes, I'd rather they go after top guys, even if it meant they only had a couple three years left in the tank. But maybe what they're doing isn't so bad, and we'll come out in the composite significantly improved? Doesn't that seem like a possibility?

I mean, I hate to be rah rah, but I'm just sayin' :monkey:

dat_boy_yec
03-12-2006, 07:18 PM
I've been hammering the Texans for a while, but today it struck me: maybe they know what they're doing.

Look at it this way: in FA maybe they are making small but significant improvements. Weaver is, by all accounts a solid player. Sage Rosenfels, well, I don't know. He's reasonably tall. The fullback looks like a solid, serious guy. THe other people they're looking at--the center, the tight end, Givens -- they're all solid players. Not spectacular, but maybe significantly better than what we're use to.

So maybe that's the FA idea--incremental improvements over a wide range of positions.

And yes, they're overpaying. And yes, I'd rather they go after top guys, even if it meant they only had a couple three years left in the tank. But maybe what they're doing isn't so bad, and we'll come out in the composite significantly improved? Doesn't that seem like a possibility?

I mean, I hate to be rah rah, but I'm just sayin' :monkey:

Who are you and what did you do to nighthawk?:spy:

Runner
03-12-2006, 07:19 PM
I wouldn't discount this point of view. I've been thinking the same way. A couple of average players in key spots would be significant upgrades for us. Therefore I think Weaver was probably a good pick-up. In addition, I think an average pass blocking center would help us out immensely.




Who are you and what did you do to nighthawk?:spy:

Funny.

big homey
03-12-2006, 07:25 PM
Nonsense! Casserly is an ***** and this FO is going to ruin this franchise for eternity!

But seriously, I think the moves they've made so far have been good - Weaver is a solid run-stopper, which nobody should be complaining about when you reflect on our run defense last year. Cook is a special teams guy, bolstering what was our strong point last year. Rosenfels is, well, better than Banks at least.

We may overpay somewhat, but at least the FO is showing they're willing to push out the big chips to try and improve the team. That might go a way toward attracting some other FA's who know we aren't cheapskates in Houston. Just being optimistic.

BradK10
03-12-2006, 07:30 PM
nighthawk you're speaking in logic, people here don't understand that

travfrancis
03-12-2006, 07:32 PM
Sage Rosenfels, well, I don't know. He's reasonably tall.

hahaha

Marcus
03-12-2006, 07:33 PM
WTF?? I can't believe it. A glass-half-full type of thread on this message board? I think I'm going to faint.

Buffi2
03-12-2006, 07:47 PM
WTF?? I can't believe it. A glass-half-full type of thread on this message board? I think I'm going to faint.

I think it makes for a rather pleasant change. :ok:

This board has been negative for so long - perhaps we are in a rut, so to speak. Surely the powers that be aren't leaving Casserly out there hangin' about to make his own decisions. :brickwall Seriously, someone with a brain just has to be telling Cass what to do, although I'm not real sure about Rosenfels, I'm not a QB coach either. Seeing the big bucks James and El Randel went for - maybe they figure a bunch of average guys beat one or two "stars" as we need so many players at this time. That makes sense to me.

I think instead of arrogance as someone else posted, I shall think of these little FA decisions as faith in their coaching ability. I do know that for the first time in all of my put togethers, I'm going to be interested in the pre-season games.

Go Texans!

edo783
03-12-2006, 07:55 PM
I like this. Positives. Being negative can get to be a habit and not really good for the digestion either.

aj.
03-12-2006, 08:04 PM
Hey ... it's your choice. Eat Tums or live in a delusional, out of touch with reality world that Jags and Titans fans live in...

bATXle red
03-12-2006, 08:10 PM
who knows till we see these guys in a texans uniform...

BeerFan
03-12-2006, 08:29 PM
you know, the Patriots don't sign stars either. Neither do the Broncos. Please don't tell me Plummer was a star, because he wasn't. Champ Bailey is a star, but he was acquired through trade. I'm sure fans of these teams weren't pleased with their type of acquisitions at first either.

so quit whining. all people do on this board is complain about Reggie Bush, or Casserly, or Young, or Capers, or Carr, or Pendry, or the O-Line. its getting quite old.

see beyond the allure of stars and understand what the FO is trying to do here. You don't need to fill the roster with pro-bowlers to win games. Look at the Yankees. Look at the Knicks. the teams that do this are not the teams that win.

i'd take smart moves over glitzy moves any day.

Cook - may become the starting fullback. there's no reason for signing him otherwise.

Rosenfels - come on! its a backup quarterback. we know Carr is going to take every snap anyway, so don't worry about what this guy can and can't do. He's no Marino, but he could easily be a Detmer. role players are important too.

Weaver - did you notice us stop the run last year? neither did i. this is an improvement. he's also a better pass rusher than whatever fat turds we managed to be playing at end. this leaves Babin and Peek on the other side, which could possibly become an effective platoon, so to speak.

aj.
03-12-2006, 08:32 PM
i'd take smart moves over glitzy moves any day.

.

Me too. Lets name them. I'll start.

....

uh


...

let me get back with you on this .. :rolleyes:

Grid
03-12-2006, 08:39 PM
last season I made the "mistake" of being positive about our acquisitions and not judging until I saw enough of them on the field to say one way or the other.

You could say that I was mistaken last year, seeing as we had a terrible season, but I dont think I was.

I think you really cant just remain negative about every move we make. Yah you might not agree with it.. yah we would all like to see our FO pull off some miracle and sign 3 probowlers for 10 year contracts at $6.50 an hour... but it doesnt work like that, not always, and you cant really expect huge changes and immediate improvement in every phase of the game.

Look at the Browns. Yah..they have made some nice signings.. but do you really think that the Browns have fixed their team now? They havent solved all their problems, despite all the money they have spent. I am sure it has entertained their fans, but personally, I am more entertained by wins than by having notable players on my team. Ask the Patriots about that. Look at the Redskins.. they have sold the farm repeatedly to get big names in Free Agency.. has it helped them? sure..they even made it to the playoffs last season.... the playoffs... not the superbowl. Despite having established players.. great coaches.. probowlers.. and a huge fanbase and being the #1 most profitable team in the NFL... and all of their trades and huge signings got them the privilege of sniffing the superbowl, not playing in it.

By contrast.. look at the Patriots..the Colts.. the Seahawks..the Steelers... what have they done? have they been big players in FA? have they sold the farm? Only on their own talent.

All we have done during the FA periods, every year, is get solid players that we think can make a difference for us. Have we had to pay them more than they are worth? yes.. due to the "risk" involved with coming to an expansion team that is struggling to find itself..we have been forced to overpay a bit. I dont see it as a big deal.. we arent in cap hell.. and we arent likely to be in cap hell any time soon.

I want to see us get Gaffney and Peek back.. that is the kind of home grown talent we need to hold onto. Other than that.. I am not worried about this FA period.

Ive gone off on a tangent. The point is.. you cant base your opinions on this team on how familiar the names of our FA signings are. We have a new coaching staff.. we have a bright future with alot of young talented players.. and that is enough. LeCharles Bentley may have helped us get our offense straight.. but his contribution would have been miniscule compared to the impact that a new staff and a very qualified Oline coach will have.

Try not to pull your hair out people.. we arent killing ourselves..we arent digging ourselves a hole.. we already made our key acquisitions in our coaching staff... now we are just making solid signings to fill some needs..so that we can go into the draft and have the freedom to take the best players available to us.

ledzeppelin229
03-12-2006, 08:47 PM
Sage Rosenfels, well, I don't know. He's reasonably tall.

I'm close to 6'2, and with cleats maybe a little bit over. Can I play for the minimum? Just practice with the team, build some muscle. Maybe I can get a free trip to Europe in a year or two once I'm physically ready. I'm pretty accurate too for someone that never played football, and you can't teach that...

Honestly, I don't have a problem with the players they picked up, but the price they paid. The argument about the Patriots not signing big name guys isn't valid because they didn't tap out the Scrooge McDuck cashpile for their signings.

stevo3883
03-12-2006, 08:54 PM
I have no problem with getting Weaver.

but paying him pro-bowl money is ridiculous. Hes a smaller, weaker, less athletic Travis Johnson in my eyes.

mexican_texan
03-12-2006, 09:01 PM
Allow me to take you into a time machine into a time when we thought Buchanon would be a shutdown corner and the Texans, Lions, Packers, Jets, Saints, and Cardinals were actually contenders for the playoffs. Back when Destiny's Child was still together.

Mike Shanahan was ridiculed by anyone who pretends to know anything about football. He traded a good RB and acquired all the Browns' D-linemen. Then, he signed Ron Dayne, drafted Maurice Clarett and allowed Jake Plummer to be the only QB on the roster capable of "leading" a team. Then the regular season came...and did it come. The Broncos had a great season and ended up losing in the playoffs to the eventual Superbowl champions. Do you know who else helped significantly? Gary Kubiak. Neither of us here are GMs, so don't critique the moves of a guy that has actually carried the Lombardi Trophy.

But then again, this is Charlie Casserly.

stevo3883
03-12-2006, 09:08 PM
Allow me to take you into a time machine into a time when we thought Buchanon would be a shutdown corner and the Texans, Lions, Packers, Jets, Saints, and Cardinals were actually contenders for the playoffs. Back when Destiny's Child was still together.

Mike Shanahan was ridiculed by anyone who pretends to know anything about football. He traded a good RB and acquired all the Browns' D-linemen. Then, he signed Ron Dayne, drafted Maurice Clarett and allowed Jake Plummer to be the only QB on the roster capable of "leading" a team. Then the regular season came...and did it come. The Broncos had a great season and ended up losing in the playoffs to the eventual Superbowl champions. Do you know who else helped significantly? Gary Kubiak. Neither of us here are GMs, so don't critique the moves of a guy that has actually carried the Lombardi Trophy.

But then again, this is Charlie Casserly.


if only we played flag-football, with girls, on a tennis court, Buchanon WOULD be a shutdown corner!

mexican_texan
03-12-2006, 09:11 PM
if only we played flag-football, with girls, on a tennis court, Buchanon WOULD be a shutdown corner!
Check the archives...even I thought he was going to team up with D-rob for double-digit picks...:crying: ...we all grew from that.

Now, the only thing he can shut down is his computer..

swtbound07
03-12-2006, 09:12 PM
this is why i feel compelled to speak

CMP ATT YDS CMP% YPA LNG TD INT SACK RAT SALARY
54 109 776 49.5 7.12 77 6 6 3 68.4 1,540,900

Att Comp Pct Yards YPA Lg TD Int Tkld 20+ 40+ Rate SALARY
2356 1278 54.2 15315 6.50 85 77 73 227/1432 191 43 72.4 1,053,943

Att Comp Pct Yards YPA Lg TD Int Tkld 20+ 40+ Rate SALARY
40 20 50.0 135 3.38 24 0 1 8/39 1 0 47.4 605,000


qb #1 is our recently acquired sage rosenfels....our brilliant free agent signing, requisite with multi million dollar signing bonus. the man has thrown 109 passes IN HIS CAREER.

qb #2 is our established veteran backup, Tony Banks, who has won games in a texans uniform

qb #3 is Nfl europe Mvp dave ragone, who has only been given 2 career starts, and was drafted in the 3rd round to fill exactly the role we just handed to sage-y.

Front office gets faith for what now?

BradK10
03-12-2006, 09:24 PM
Now, the only thing he can shut down is his computer..

ha ha ha, holy crap that's funy

bdiddy
03-12-2006, 10:09 PM
[QUOTE=Runner]I wouldn't discount this point of view. I've been thinking the same way. A couple of average players in key spots would be significant upgrades for us. Therefore I think Weaver was probably a good pick-up. In addition, I think an average pass blocking center would help us out immensely.

Weaver is not average. He is a top 5 DE against the run, which is what is was brought here for. From what I have heard, as McClain mentioned in his article, Weaver will play SDE and then switch to DT w/ Travis Johnson on passing situations with Babin and Peek at the ends. Babin and Peek will compete and/or rotate at the weakside DE position.

Runner
03-12-2006, 10:17 PM
Weaver is not average. He is a top 5 DE against the run, which is what is was brought here for. From what I have heard, as McClain mentioned in his article, Weaver will play SDE and then switch to DT w/ Travis Johnson on passing situations with Babin and Peek at the ends. Babin and Peek will compete and/or rotate at the weakside DE position.

It seems I implied he was average to make my point. I agree he is above average even if he's not a super star or elite or whatever term is in vogue. My point is you don't have to be the best player available at a position to improve the Texans. So if Weaver is rated as average or better he's a good addition at that position, IMO.

I look at Weaver's run defense skills and think they might be important to tightening up our defense, espeically given the fact that we had some very embarrassing games last year where we were run over badly. Sacks are important, but they aren't the end-all for defensive lineman.

stevo3883
03-12-2006, 10:30 PM
[QUOTE=Runner]

Weaver is not average. He is a top 5 DE against the run, which is what is was brought here for. From what I have heard, as McClain mentioned in his article, Weaver will play SDE and then switch to DT w/ Travis Johnson on passing situations with Babin and Peek at the ends. Babin and Peek will compete and/or rotate at the weakside DE position.

a top 5 run stuffing DE doesnt register 30 tackles in an entire season.

texanskan
03-12-2006, 10:34 PM
I like what we are doing and I think we will get Givens.

As far as overpaying thats what you do in FA you overpay. That's why the draft is so important.

Runner
03-13-2006, 08:18 AM
WTF?? I can't believe it. A glass-half-full type of thread on this message board? I think I'm going to faint.

It'll be nice if we can get a couple of early wins next season to curb the weltschmerz on this board.

Sportsfan
03-13-2006, 08:23 AM
Look at the Patriots and the success they've had without a lot of 'big names'.

Texans Horror
03-13-2006, 08:33 AM
It'll be nice if we can get a couple of early wins next season to curb the weltschmerz on this board.

Some German-based words. Right on! Let me add this:

At times, the Message Board has seemed to take on a kind of schaudenfreude where they want to watch players fail.

Kaiser Toro
03-13-2006, 09:14 AM
After coming out of the gates with emotion rather than rational thought to our current foray into Free Agency I thought it would be good to frame my thoughts under the current landscape rather than past actions of the franchise.

Firstly, the CBA has attached approximately 8 million more dollars to what the cap was projected to be. This gives teams more to spend and gives players and their agents more wiggle room to up requests on their services. There has not been an uptick, at least I have not seen it, the amount of players that they can have on their roster. This means that you have to or are able to pay more for players, that is the nature of the agreement that the owners and players agreed upon. In a nutshell the dollar value that we sign players today is more than what we perceived their value would have been last year.

Secondly, we do not know what Kubiak, Reeves and Cass think about the current talent level of each player under contract and how they fit into the new scheme. They are really the only ones that are privy to that at the moment.

Lastly, change is good given our history and we have seen plenty in the last couple of months and will continue to see more in the coming months. I liked it when we signed Kubiak and wanted to see him place his stamp on this team. He is doing that. It pains me the way it is going down, but I signed up for it and need to see how it shakes out as there has been no way to measure a result until our new Texans hit the field.

Maybe a homer rant, but I do not want to poo-poo on somehting that is immeasurable at the moment, since expectations were low for short term results even before free agency.

Runner
03-13-2006, 09:19 AM
Firstly...

Secondly...

Lastly...



Also, we don't know which free agents we may have contacted and been told "don't bother". That may be the reason we haven't appeared to pursue someone's favorite free agent.

Frills
03-13-2006, 09:22 AM
Lets go out spend a ton of cash on guys now when we're 3 years away from a push to the Super Bowl...if we're lucky we can cut them the year after and rebuild again.

Forget getting any young guys, thats not how you build a team.


Banks was awesome, he went for 1 TD and 2 INTs vs the Juggernaut 49'ers...

Bring Back Banks!!!

:sarcasm:

TigerV1
03-13-2006, 10:21 AM
I'm curious to know how many people will change their tune if the Texans come out and win next year. Until proven otherwise, I am going to trust the Kubiak regime....even if Casserly is still the GM.

As far as over paying FAs, when did the Texans become a team that people wanted to play for? If we want to get FAs to come to a team that most recently was 2-14, we are going to have to over pay.

So far, I like what we've done.

SA Fan
03-13-2006, 01:46 PM
I seem to rememeber something in particular in one of the links someone sent out about Kubiak when his hire was still speculation.
The link was a Q&A with Kubiak at the beginning of a previous season (2004?) and one of the Q's was bemoaning about how the team had moved away from using a short pass to the FB. Kubiak answred by acknowledging the move but stated a deire to use that play again in the future.

and Moran Norris isn't much of a catching FB is he?
:cool:

Texas
03-13-2006, 01:50 PM
Again. I agree with this thread. At least were doing something right this year.

el toro
03-13-2006, 02:20 PM
Um, the Texans scored huge in free agency with the signing of Kubiak. Something to think about.

Championship teams in any sport are built around a scheme and with any number of solid role players. My guess is that the team is looking to build a potent, well-balanced offense with sufficient blocking to give the QB time to actually do a progression and make some plays. The Texans have had some of the raw talent, but now they have a coach who knows what it takes to build a top offense and win. They also have a shot at adding a major talent like Bush to their offense.

Patience seems to be in short supply in this forum.

mexican_texan
03-13-2006, 02:24 PM
Patience seems to be in short supply in this forum.
What do you expect? 2-14 for the youngest team in the league.

About FA signings: Some teams (i.e. Yankees, Real Madrid) get big names, but don't always have many wins. Other teams have only a couple, if any, big names and many role players and win.

whiskeyrbl
03-13-2006, 02:26 PM
[QUOTE=bdiddy]

a top 5 run stuffing DE doesnt register 30 tackles in an entire season.

It does if your plugging a hole the RB can't get thru and one of your teammates records the tackle.

edo783
03-13-2006, 03:44 PM
[quote=stevo3883]

It does if your plugging a hole the RB can't get thru and one of your teammates records the tackle.

He was also out for part of the season (10 games? 6 games?) with a dislocated toe.