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View Full Version : Would you trade Travis Johnson & #66 pick for Derrick Johnson?


LBC_Justin
02-15-2006, 03:57 PM
Just curious how many people would trade Travis Johnson and the Texans #66 pick for the Chiefs Derrick Johnson?

Grid
02-15-2006, 04:00 PM
we need a "shaking head in disgust" emote.

ensign_lee
02-15-2006, 04:01 PM
We're stuck with what we've got now.

GO TJ.

LORK 88
02-15-2006, 04:36 PM
Why not see how he works out in the 4-3 as a DT before we pass judgement on him a 2nd time? Im going to say it right now, Look out for him next year, I have a feeling he'll do great as a 4-3 DT rather than a 3-4 DE. Put him next to Robaire Smith with Walker and/or Payne behind them and we're in some good shape. Now about those DEs . . .

Sarg01
02-15-2006, 04:38 PM
Not now that we're moving to a 4-3.

mancunian
02-15-2006, 04:55 PM
Just curious how many people would trade Travis Johnson and the Texans #66 pick for the Chiefs Derrick Johnson?

No - I think he'll really benefit by staying as a DT when we play 4 - 3. Though I am worried about the DE spots.

chuckm
02-15-2006, 04:56 PM
Can we trade DRob for QJammer while we're at it? :pigfly:

Kaiser Toro
02-15-2006, 05:01 PM
No thank you. I see where the value is for Texan fans, but I have no idea where the value in this trade is for the Texans.

TheOgre
02-15-2006, 05:04 PM
DT is a key element in the 4-3. I'd rather have a good DT than a good OLB. I might be in the minority on that opinion, but I stand by it.

thunderkyss
02-15-2006, 05:14 PM
I'm already trying to get the fans to warm up to the idea of drafting Vince, and not trading down. There's no way I'd get them to Draft Vince, and give away picks......

TexanSam
02-15-2006, 05:16 PM
Both are unproven at this point in their careers. If you asked TJ for DJ, then I might say yes, but we don't know how good Travis Johnson is going to be. He has been the lowest profile 1st rounder we've had in all 4 years, but I don't think that necessarily means he will be a bust. If he's still a low profile player 2 years from now, then I'll be worried.

hot pickle
02-15-2006, 05:21 PM
hey, with the 4-3 in houston now will TJ go DT or will he stay at DE

powerfuldragon
02-15-2006, 05:23 PM
i don't know, how fast is he?

texan279
02-15-2006, 05:24 PM
I voted no on this one...

Coach C.
02-15-2006, 05:26 PM
Get Over It People!!!!

Dunta_23
02-15-2006, 05:27 PM
Im almost positive he will go to DT, he has the size to be effective at tackle.... Line will probably look like this

J. Babin T.Johnson R.Smith Strongside DE(most likely FA/Draft)

TheOgre
02-15-2006, 05:29 PM
hey, with the 4-3 in houston now will TJ go DT or will he stay at DE

He will be a DT. Hopefully one of those guys that can stuff the run and get some semblance of a pass-rush from the inside. That is what he did in college.

ArlingtonTexan
02-15-2006, 05:33 PM
Just curious how many people would trade Travis Johnson and the Texans #66 pick for the Chiefs Derrick Johnson?

Actually, I will take this as would you do this trade again after the first season. Essentially, this is what the Texans tradedown last year amounts to. I think this question is better asked after the draft and best asked in 3 years.

Grid
02-15-2006, 05:36 PM
so far there are at least 16 people here who are UT fans parading as Texan fans.. I wonder what the final tally will be.

mancunian
02-15-2006, 05:43 PM
hey, with the 4-3 in houston now will TJ go DT or will he stay at DE

what about Walker isn't he more of a DT too? Or will he be gone (salary cap casualty - after last year I wouldn't be surprised.)

rocka21
02-15-2006, 06:06 PM
so far there are at least 16 people here who are UT fans parading as Texan fans.. I wonder what the final tally will be.



If you were a texan fan, you would want DJ and vince.


They just happen to play for UT.

TheOgre
02-15-2006, 06:08 PM
what about Walker isn't he more of a DT too? Or will he be gone (salary cap casualty - after last year I wouldn't be surprised.)

It costs us more on this season's cap to cut him than to keep him. I think he might get cut AFTER this season, but not before it.

Payne and Smith are clearly DT's. Walker and TJ are guys that are DT's that might be able to play LDE in a pinch. I wouldn't be surprised to see one of them as our 1st and 2nd down LDE and get replaced by Peek on passing downs. This isn't ideal, but it may be the only option if we don't sign/draft a top DE.

travfrancis
02-15-2006, 06:43 PM
eh, either should be nice in the 4-3, although if we run a broncos style 4-3, i'd rather have DJ because he is similar to what the broncos have at LB.

YoungTexanFan
02-15-2006, 07:00 PM
I'm already trying to get the fans to warm up to the idea of drafting Vince, and not trading down. There's no way I'd get them to Draft Vince, and give away picks......


Your right Charley. :spy:

tiger06
02-15-2006, 07:04 PM
no way. we're going to a 4-3, and I think TJ will strive as a DT.

stevo3883
02-15-2006, 07:14 PM
no way. we're going to a 4-3, and I think TJ will strive as a DT.


DJ is a 4-3 LB, cass said we didn't draft him because he didn't fit our 3-4.

seems like a big mistake now. DJ was clearly the higher rated player.

ComstockLode
02-15-2006, 07:58 PM
This is a silly question.

And honestly I dont think the chiefs would do it.

Sarg01
02-15-2006, 08:27 PM
so far there are at least 16 people here who are UT fans parading as Texan fans.. I wonder what the final tally will be.


Be nice. The question isn't really if you think it's a trade worth doing. It's a question of reversing the trade from last years draft.

Texans dropped from #13 (passing on Derrick Johnson) to #16 (Saints pick, getting this years #66 in exchange) and took Travis Johnson.

I truly believe that had this trade not been made that the Texans would have been no worse than 6-10 this year. In my opinion, it was THE biggest mistake of the offseason.

HOWEVER, now that we are moving to a 4-3 (due to going 2-14 and firing our 3-4 coach) and have already taken our lumps, there's no reason to back out. TJ was the best 4-3 DT in that draft class, without question. He just had no place in a 3-4.

FYI, I went to A&M.

Sarg01
02-15-2006, 08:32 PM
DJ is a 4-3 LB, cass said we didn't draft him because he didn't fit our 3-4.

seems like a big mistake now. DJ was clearly the higher rated player.

Cass was lying to cover that he blew it. He thought we could get DJ at #16. They were pumping their fists and dancing around the Texans Draft War Room cam when pick #13 came up. And they went totally dead when Carolina picked Thomas Davis (since everyone paying attention knew the Chiefs were drooling over Thomas Davis and that DJ was their #2 choice)

TJ was far more 4-3 specific than DJ. NFLDraftCountdown describes Brodrick Bunkley as "maybe even a better prospect than Travis Johnson". The guy is a great DT, he would have started over our ancient guys if he fit our system.

Hookem Horns
02-15-2006, 08:48 PM
so far there are at least 16 people here who are UT fans parading as Texan fans.. I wonder what the final tally will be.

?? I am a Texas fan in college and a Texans fan in the NFL. I wouldn't think that would be too unusual considering the Texans play in Texas. But hey, if we are breaking it down like that, I bet there are even MORE Astros fans here parading as Texans fans. :spy:

BTW, I wouldn't make the trade. You would be giving up an extra pick and neither player has proven anything in the NFL.

Texan_Kev
02-15-2006, 09:25 PM
No way. TJ will be one of the bright spots in this defense now that we are moving to a 4-3. He should slide in nicely to replace Walker when the time comes.

LBC_Justin
02-15-2006, 09:35 PM
Actually, I will take this as would you do this trade again after the first season. Essentially, this is what the Texans tradedown last year amounts to. I think this question is better asked after the draft and best asked in 3 years.Exactly but I didn't want to word it that way.

Personally there is no way I would trade TJ & the #66 for DJ (based on what we know right now.). DJ played decent but after seeing him play for a season you can see how he slipped in the draft and he certainly wasn't a "no brainer" at #13. Heck, I can name FIVE rookie Linebackers that looked better or at least as good as DJ. (I am a HUGE Texas fan but I have to admit several rookie LBs had played really well this year. Several that were even drafted in the 2nd round. I would love to have DJ but not for a #13 or a #16 pick)

TJ is doing just fine. He plays a position that is not easy to measure and he plays a position that takes time to develop.

Plus I think the #66 in this years draft is worth a lot more than last year.

Kaiser Toro
02-15-2006, 09:40 PM
Be nice. The question isn't really if you think it's a trade worth doing. It's a question of reversing the trade from last years draft.

Texans dropped from #13 (passing on Derrick Johnson) to #16 (Saints pick, getting this years #66 in exchange) and took Travis Johnson.

I truly believe that had this trade not been made that the Texans would have been no worse than 6-10 this year. In my opinion, it was THE biggest mistake of the offseason.

HOWEVER, now that we are moving to a 4-3 (due to going 2-14 and firing our 3-4 coach) and have already taken our lumps, there's no reason to back out. TJ was the best 4-3 DT in that draft class, without question. He just had no place in a 3-4.

FYI, I went to A&M.

Just so I have this straight, you are saying that Derrick Johnson alone would have made us 4 wins better last year?

Sarg01
02-15-2006, 09:59 PM
Just so I have this straight, you are saying that Derrick Johnson alone would have made us 4 wins better last year?

Yes. That is what I am saying. Losing Jamie Sharper and Aaron Glenn took us from 7-9 to 2-14. Both our run and pass defense got worse, so I see the Sharper attrition as the bigger problem. I think DJ played very well for KC. Not superstar well, but very well. I think he certainly outperformed Morlon Greenwood. I believe having him in at LB would have forced the O-line of the opposition teams to account for him and thus Babin and Peek would have gotten more pressure.

Remember, we lost 5 games in the last two minutes, so it doesn't take much to flip 4 of them.

It's one reason I'm such a big fan of Hawk. I believe a single playmaking LB would be huge. It wouldn't win us a Super Bowl or get us to the playoffs, but it could easily get us one extra stop per game.

Wolf
02-15-2006, 10:17 PM
DJ was lost (and I believe people knew it but didn't actually believe it) when Greenwood was signed.


A better poll IMO would be would you rather have drafted DJ and not p/u Greenwood.

Yet we were sold on the idea of the Texans going younger and faster.. well DJ is younger ... faster??? :hmmm:

:stirpot:

Kaiser Toro
02-15-2006, 10:18 PM
Yes. That is what I am saying. Losing Jamie Sharper and Aaron Glenn took us from 7-9 to 2-14. Both our run and pass defense got worse, so I see the Sharper attrition as the bigger problem. I think DJ played very well for KC. Not superstar well, but very well. I think he certainly outperformed Morlon Greenwood. I believe having him in at LB would have forced the O-line of the opposition teams to account for him and thus Babin and Peek would have gotten more pressure.

Remember, we lost 5 games in the last two minutes, so it doesn't take much to flip 4 of them.

It's one reason I'm such a big fan of Hawk. I believe a single playmaking LB would be huge. It wouldn't win us a Super Bowl or get us to the playoffs, but it could easily get us one extra stop per game.

I do not understand your justification, but you do seem to think that DJ would have made us four games better in a year that he did not play like a superstar. Just do not get it. Moreover, Greenwood had a better statistical year last year playing for a very bad defensive team that was on the field a lot due to an awful offense.

Grid
02-15-2006, 10:24 PM
The reason that this is exposing Texas fans is because:

Derrick Johnson in 2005:

95 tackles
2 sacks
5 passes defensed

Morlon Greenwood

112 tackles
2 sacks
6 passes defensed


You would trade picks, and a young DT which we havent even BEGUN to fully evaluate... for a player that hasnt shown himself to be any better than Morlon Greenwood? And why?...because he is from UT.

its stupid. Derrick Johnson didnt DO anything last season.. if you want a player from last year's draft.. we should be talking about why we didnt take..

Luis Castillo, DE:
49 tackles, 3.5 sacks

Heath Miller, TE:
39 receptions, 6 TDs

Odell Thurman, LB:
98 tackles, 1.5 sacks, 5 INTs



But instead people are obssessing over some average player that DIDNT WOW anyone.. simply because he came from TU.

Sarg01
02-15-2006, 10:42 PM
The reason that this is exposing Texas fans is because:

Derrick Johnson in 2005:

95 tackles
2 sacks
5 passes defensed

Morlon Greenwood

112 tackles
2 sacks
6 passes defensed


Stats don't tell the whole story. Greenwood got lots of tackles ... 4 yards upfield. If the other team is picking up 4-5 yards each rush, we're never going to stop them.



its stupid. Derrick Johnson didnt DO anything last season.. if you want a player from last year's draft.. we should be talking about why we didnt take..

Luis Castillo, DE:
49 tackles, 3.5 sacks



I wanted to draft Castillo, too, but he went much higher than people expected.


Odell Thurman, LB:
98 tackles, 1.5 sacks, 5 INTs


Thurman had a bad attitude knock. It didn't end up manifesting himself, but I can see why a team would pass for that reason alone.


But instead people are obssessing over some average player that DIDNT WOW anyone.. simply because he came from TU.

TJ didn't WOW anyone either. In fact, he hardly played. If you must play the stats game, how do TJs stats compare to DJs? 1 sack (DJ had 2) and 26 tackles (DJ had 95) and 0 turnovers (DJ had 2). By your logic that Greenwood is better than DJ, clearly TJ's a scrub.

Of course he isn't in reality, because in reality, stats don't tell the whole story.

Kaiser Toro
02-15-2006, 10:48 PM
TJ didn't WOW anyone either. In fact, he hardly played. If you must play the stats game, how do TJs stats compare to DJs? 1 sack (DJ had 2) and 26 tackles (DJ had 95) and 0 turnovers (DJ had 2). By your logic that Greenwood is better than DJ, clearly TJ's a scrub.

Of course he isn't in reality, because in reality, stats don't tell the whole story.

I tried to reply to this, but the only thing I could muster in a neutral non offensive way was - :brickwall

Sarg01
02-15-2006, 10:53 PM
I do not understand your justification, but you do seem to think that DJ would have made us four games better in a year that he did not play like a superstar. Just do not get it. Moreover, Greenwood had a better statistical year last year playing for a very bad defensive team that was on the field a lot due to an awful offense.

Greenwood's stats are EXACTLY why I think it's justified. Greenwood was our top "playmaker" statistically. In other words, his performance was the key performance on more plays than any other defender. This is not surprising, since the 3-4 funnels plays to the ILBs.

As you noted, we were a very bad defense ... because the guy who had the responsibility of making the plays most often was a very bad (NFL-wise) defender. A better player would have given up less yardage. Less yardage = reliably more stops. More stops means shaving a few points off the other team's score. Shave off one touchdown a game and we're 8-8. I thought that was a bit too strong a statement, so I said 6-10.

Sarg01
02-15-2006, 10:57 PM
I tried to reply to this, but the only thing I could muster in a neutral non offensive way was - :brickwall

I know you can't compare LBs to DLine. Or a situational pass-rusher for an every down player. I was just using the logic a previous poster had used to illustrate why it was fallacious.

In fact, if you look back earlier in the thread, you'd see where I noted that I WOULDN'T make this trade. However, that doesn't justify the poster bashing everyone who votes "yes" as a non-Texan fan.

Texas
02-15-2006, 11:06 PM
I'd probably keep TJ for another year and actually give him a chance to do somethin on the line in the 4-3...DJ is good but with the 4-3 ima give TJ a chance.

Grid
02-16-2006, 12:54 AM
I know you can't compare LBs to DLine. Or a situational pass-rusher for an every down player. I was just using the logic a previous poster had used to illustrate why it was fallacious.

In fact, if you look back earlier in the thread, you'd see where I noted that I WOULDN'T make this trade. However, that doesn't justify the poster bashing everyone who votes "yes" as a non-Texan fan.

Well this board is full of so many Tsips right now that its easier to just group everyone with a bad idea in with them..than trying to single out which ones are Tsips and which ones are just unintelligent :)

The reason I didnt bring TJs stats into it is because:

1) he wasnt a starter

2) he wasnt bad enough to warrant this kind of trade. He didnt "WOW" anyone..as you said.. but he didnt put up a Matt Stevens kind of performance either. If he had gone in there and totally sucked.. then I could understand people talking about trading him(I still wouldnt agree..but id understand), but he didnt... he still has plenty of upside. So.. since there is no good excuse to think about trading him.. then you have to ask yourself, why are people posting whether or not they would trade him AND a 3rd rounder for Derrick Johnson? ill tell ya why... cause they are Texas fans..not Texan fans. A trade of this type is entirely off-the-wall. neither player proved anything last season.. so why should we give up a pick to exchange them? I was merely pointing out the statistical proof that Derrick Johnson is not some player that we should be pining over.. not unless you have your burnt orange glasses on.

TexanBacker93
02-16-2006, 01:11 AM
I think TJ will really shine this season. He was out of place in a 3-4 and fits in great as a DT in the new 4-3. I'd hope he starts with Robaire with Walker and Payne on the bench if they aren't cap casualties. Bring in someone like Mario Williams on the strongside and either Babin, Peek or John Abraham if that could work and this could be a very good D-Line. DJ is a good linebacker, but at this time I think TJ is going to be better for them.

stevo3883
02-16-2006, 01:11 AM
The reason that this is exposing Texas fans is because:

Derrick Johnson in 2005:

95 tackles
2 sacks
5 passes defensed

Morlon Greenwood

112 tackles
2 sacks
6 passes defensed


You would trade picks, and a young DT which we havent even BEGUN to fully evaluate... for a player that hasnt shown himself to be any better than Morlon Greenwood? And why?...because he is from UT.

its stupid. Derrick Johnson didnt DO anything last season.. if you want a player from last year's draft.. we should be talking about why we didnt take..

Luis Castillo, DE:
49 tackles, 3.5 sacks

Heath Miller, TE:
39 receptions, 6 TDs

Odell Thurman, LB:
98 tackles, 1.5 sacks, 5 INTs



But instead people are obssessing over some average player that DIDNT WOW anyone.. simply because he came from TU.


dude can you not make 1 post without acting like there is some kind of super conspiracy by longhorns to rule the world?

we wanted DJ because he was a 2x AA and was the highest rated pure LB in the draft. we got a DT that had like 30 tackles his senior year in college, and couldnt see the field on the worst team in the league. we wanted DJ because he was rated higher than TJ by everyone, and it felt like a miracle he fell to us


DJ had a pretty good season considering the circumstances. he started off very very well and tapered off towards the end, but dont act like he sucked this year because he did not.

and DJ is an olb in a 4-3, he hsouldnt have as many tackles as a ilb in a 3-4 like greenwood.


so please, drop the "tu" "tsips" garbage for at least 1 second and try to talk without whining about your aggie hatred for ut.

pv1999
02-16-2006, 01:16 AM
The TexasXes Haterpalooza is in full effect. Look, UTexas has recruited the top talent for about 8 years now. Of course they are going to produce more NFL Players than other schools like aTm, TT, TCU, etc. There are some Orangebloods on the board but some people may be like me and just want to see our Hometown guys get the chance to play at home.
Stop hatin' on da'horns, call your alumni chapter and tell them to petition your coach to get him somethin' t'fight with or stop scheduling the Horns.

FirstTexansFan
02-16-2006, 02:14 AM
dude can you not make 1 post without acting like there is some kind of super conspiracy by longhorns to rule the world?

I think it's simple to see. All you need to do is look at sign up dates to determine those that have come flocking and fawning over the slight chance the Texans take VY. All I need to do is reference the postings made by the majority of you tsippers last year when we had the slight chance to choose DJ, and the wailing and gnashing of teeth that followed when we didn't. I've seen those conspiracy postings ya refer to also. What was it again? Oh I remember, the Texans have an issue drafting players from tu. Like propaganda, I've seen the topics that hide the intent of the posting, all in a vain attempt to rehash the same subject matter. If we draft VY, I'll be in the stands cheering for his success the same as I do now for the Texan players. And I don't hate texas u, it's more a disdain for the type of stuff I've seen their so called fans pull here. I say good luck to all of ya, and if we draft the guy, anyone that bails as a fan isn't a fan at all, and the same applies if we don't draft him :)

stevo3883
02-16-2006, 02:31 AM
first texan fan, there is a board just for people like you.

its www.texags.com

you make more pro aggie posts than texan posts, shouldnt you go back home? they need you in college station, i hear the corp lost its poop shoveler.

HardKnockTexan
02-16-2006, 02:59 AM
With us going to the 4-3 I voted to keep TJ. Like many others on this board I was crushed when we didnt take DJ last year but neither of them showed much their rookie season and I believe both have the potential to be very productive players. Walker and Payne each only have a few seasons left and our linebacker corps is fairly young. I have faith that TJ will at the very least be able to field 25 snaps a game for us.

FirstTexansFan
02-16-2006, 03:08 AM
I'd say I make more posts that make fun of tsippers than most..that doesn't make me pro-Ag, it makes me one of many that find the inane postings of minions so full of bias we can do nothing but laugh at the entire group :) I'm a Texans fan first and foremost. I'm sure once you're able to come down from your orange kool-aid high, you'll grasp the concept of what being a Texans fan is, as opposed to just blindly pulling for a guy that once quarterbacked your college team :) Unlike you, I'll still be here posting after the draft, irregardless of the Texans pick. You'll be where? I know www.bevosports.com, they won't make fun of you there :)

AustinJB
02-16-2006, 04:40 AM
I voted no....only b/c we already have TJ and I think the #66 is too valuable to trade away at this point.

Do I wish we had DJ instead of TJ? A thousand time yes...but we don't. If we wanted him, we should have taken him last year when we had the chance...instead of passing on him b/c he had a few questions but taking a player that had a LOT MORE questions.

texman8
02-16-2006, 06:22 AM
Why would Chiefs want to trade DJ, anyway?

ArlingtonTexan
02-16-2006, 09:12 AM
I tried to reply to this, but the only thing I could muster in a neutral non offensive way was - :brickwall

I feel you. As a non-mod, I would be say what need to be said, take the PM and/or one or two day shut down from Vinny and move on with my life.

Vinny
02-16-2006, 09:19 AM
All world NFL linebacker Derrick Brooks 62.0 tackles and one sack his rookie season.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/3160

Warren Sapp 16.0 Tackles and 3 sacks as a rookie.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/4214

Moral to this story? Don't be a knee jerk.

Texans_Chick
02-16-2006, 09:44 AM
dude can you not make 1 post without acting like there is some kind of super conspiracy by longhorns to rule the world?
.....
so please, drop the "tu" "tsips" garbage for at least 1 second and try to talk without whining about your aggie hatred for ut.


LOL. People tend to see what they want to see. That applies to everyone, but some folks are more one note and negative than others. IMO, it is usually compensation for not really having anything of value to say.

As for TJ v. DJ, I was fine with the pick either way so I think the thought of a trade is silly talk. I think TJ's football skills on the field have already been discussed in this thread, but I will add (rank speculation alert) that he is the kind of guy I could see becoming a leader on this team. He is a big personality, has an easy smile, displays a bit of swagger and confidence but is not overbearing or unrealistic about stuff, and I am thinking that as he gets more comfortable with the NFL game, he could become one of our team leaders on defense.

But that might just be wishful thinking on my part and deducing too much from the times I've seen him interacting with teammates. :texflag:

bayshorebevo
02-16-2006, 09:56 AM
grid quote:

"Well this board is full of so many Tsips right now that its easier to just group everyone with a bad idea in with them..than trying to single out which ones are Tsips and which ones are just unintelligent"


are you either an aggie or a sooner? just wondering.

whiskeyrbl
02-16-2006, 10:24 AM
I voted no primarily because we are going to 4-3,and he is our youngest DT. Not to mention we took him in the first round,correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't he the top DL prospect in last years draft? I think we may already have our version in DJ with Shantee Orr.Unless it was a fluke this dude looks like he could be a beast in the pass rush.

Vinny
02-16-2006, 10:27 AM
grid quote:

"Well this board is full of so many Tsips right now that its easier to just group everyone with a bad idea in with them..than trying to single out which ones are Tsips and which ones are just unintelligent"


you are so full of hatred for any mention of ut (tsip is an aggie condemnation). you never miss any opening to knock texas. are you an aggie or a sooner? nothing wrong with either, but you are blinded by hate.He gives "Gig em" rep comments...so I'll let you guess.

Meloy
02-16-2006, 10:51 AM
All world NFL linebacker Derrick Brooks 62.0 tackles and one sack his rookie season.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/3160

Warren Sapp 16.0 Tackles and 3 sacks as a rookie.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/4214

Moral to this story? Don't be a knee jerk.
Vinny, there you go again messing everyones "dreams/fantasies" up with pure facts or logic. Tsk Tsk! On 610 this morning DC Richard Smith left me with the feeling he sees potential in T Johnson. Also mentioned Robaire Smith was not used to his potential. It will be interesting to see how the line does this year with new direction.

Kaiser Toro
02-16-2006, 10:53 AM
Vinny, there you go again messing everyones "dreams/fantasies" up with pure facts or logic. Tsk Tsk! On 610 this morning DC Richard Smith left me with the feeling he sees potential in T Johnson. Also mentioned Robaire Smith was not used to his potential. It will be interesting to see how the line does this year with new direction.

Thanks for the relay. I like what Richard Smith said about Robaire.

Htown34s
02-16-2006, 11:37 AM
Uh-oh LBC_Justin, you committed one of the biggest sins on this board: showing any sort of positive opinion on a player from UT.

This board has to have the biggest group of UT haters out there. My opinion of many posters on this board has gone down the tube because of their hatred for anything UT.

Frills
02-16-2006, 11:39 AM
Uh-oh LBC_Justin, you committed one of the biggest sins on this board: showing any sort of positive opinion on a player from UT.

This board has to have the biggest group of UT haters out there. My opinion of many posters on this board has gone down the tube because of their hatred for anything UT.


This board is the opposite of what you think, if anything the board colors should be puke orange

Grid
02-16-2006, 11:43 AM
Ive never met a longhorn outside of this board that I didnt like. The Tsips on this forum have earned my disdain.

He gives "Gig em" rep comments...so I'll let you guess.

huh?

but some folks are more one note and negative than others. IMO, it is usually compensation for not really having anything of value to say.

My posts have been more than "ut sucks".. ive explained my point of view. And anyone who accuses me of negativity hasnt read my posts :).. im insufferably upbeat about the Texans.

Vinny
02-16-2006, 11:46 AM
Both sides of this silly College rivalry ruins this message board. I wish you guys would consider everyone else. Just try to give it a rest.

Grid
02-16-2006, 11:52 AM
While I agree with that Vinny... the "college rivalry" has nothing to do with it. As I said..ive never met a Longhorn outside of this board that I didnt like.

If it was USC fans supporting Lienart coming here reciting all the arguement we hear about VY, and refusing to think of him as less than god-like, and bashing Carr in EVERY thread..even the ones that dont involve him.... they would get just as tiring and annoying as the UT fans are proving to be.

the "college rivalry" has nothing to do with it.

travfrancis
02-16-2006, 11:55 AM
Grid your stat comparison does absolutely nothing for your argument, greenwood was a ilb in the 3-4 last year while DJ was an olb in the 4-3

3-4 ilbs have a lot more tackle opportunities than 4-3 olbs.

there is not a person on this board that would take greenwood over DJ, except maybe you.

as for who is the better player between DJ and TJ, its way too early to tell.

whiskeyrbl
02-16-2006, 11:56 AM
Uh-oh LBC_Justin, you committed one of the biggest sins on this board: showing any sort of positive opinion on a player from UT.

This board has to have the biggest group of UT haters out there. My opinion of many posters on this board has gone down the tube because of their hatred for anything UT.
UT haters ? I've been a UT fan for 35 of my 41 years,I just don't see how people like you think just because they are from UT they are a great fit for this team.College and Pro are apples and Oranges,here we discuss the best for our PRO team,maybe your views will be best served on a college MB.:stirpot:

Vinny
02-16-2006, 12:00 PM
the "college rivalry" has nothing to do with it.Quite a bit of it does...so quit it. That is plainer English I guess.

Grid
02-16-2006, 12:02 PM
Grid your stat comparison does absolutely nothing for your argument, greenwood was a ilb in the 3-4 last year while DJ was an olb in the 4-3

3-4 ilbs have a lot more tackle opportunities than 4-3 olbs.

there is not a person on this board that would take greenwood over DJ, except maybe you.

as for who is the better player between DJ and TJ, its way too early to tell.

1. Id take DJ over Greenwood. My stat comparison was to point out just how little DJ did last season.. and the easiest way to do that was to compare his stats to Greenwood... because people here are unhappy with Greenwood's performance.

2. Greenwood played 4-3 OLB at Miami :).. what does that prove? nothing..heh.. but his last year Miami he did have similar stats to Johnson..minus the 2 sacks. He was nowhere near as good his First season though.

3. We are in complete agreement on the fact that it is too early to tell who is better between DJ and TJ... so im wondering why you are so militant towards me :)...maybe cause its the hip thing to do these days :yahoo:

Grid
02-16-2006, 12:04 PM
no.. i just explained to you how it doesnt have anything to do with it.. at least not on my part. So quit accusing me of petty rivalries.

Htown34s
02-16-2006, 12:16 PM
I just don't see how people like you think just because they are from UT they are a great fit for this team.

You're off base here. I have never been that sort of poster, and I expect the same from others.

I love UT, but I'm often more critical of the teams I like. I was a big DJ fan, but understood and excepted the reasons why we passed on him in the draft last year. I can't think of many UT players I wish we would be on our team. I was a fan of Vasher, but he had a bad workout so even I thought he was in over his head (apples and oranges).

There are a lot of people who explode any time they see something positive posted about someone from UT (and other universities also, but UT far more often IMO). I wish it would stop.

whiskeyrbl
02-16-2006, 12:25 PM
You're off base here. I have never been that sort of poster, and I expect the same from others.

I love UT, but I'm often more critical of the teams I like. I was a big DJ fan, but understood and excepted the reasons why we passed on him in the draft last year. I can't think of many UT players I wish we would be on our team. I was a fan of Vasher, but he had a bad workout so even I thought he was in over his head (apples and oranges).

There are a lot of people who explode any time they see something positive posted about someone from UT (and other universities also, but UT far more often IMO). I wish it would stop.
If i was off base then i'll apologize for that,i like you see some bashing of UT players but that i think is fallout of the VY craze.I just want what is best for this team even if means we get a great player from BF egypt as long as he helps.Personaly i wanted DJ last year also but understood the pick,this year i hope they seriously consider Griffen,very versatile player with alot of intangibles and could help immensly IMO in the secondary,but thats why i'm here and not in the WAR ROOM.Leave it to the Pros that get paid to make those tough decisions.