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BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 01:03 PM
Feel free to add any input if you see better ways,,,,

I can just see the Offensive and Defensive coordinator in camp battling to rattle the other with something they think can't be matched.Everyone has a few little tweener/tweakers to match up.


QB Vince Young David Carr Dave Ragone
RB Dominique Davis Verand Morancy Brian Calhoun
TE/FB David Thomas ( Marcelles?Rivers) Robert Royal
WR Andra Johnson Senorice Moss Anthony Mix (6rd project)
WR Jerome Mathis Derek Armstrong Donovan Morgan


RT Andrew Whitworth Fred Wand
RG Milford Brown Bryan Pittman
C Todd Washington Drew Hodgdon
LG Chester Pitts Seth Wand
LT Todd Wade Tyson Walters

DE Aaron Kampman Moe Thompson
DT Travis Johnson
NT Seth Payne Robaire Smith
DE Kyle Van Bosch Jason Babin

OLB (Antwan Peak DE)Cato June Terna Nande
MLB Kalee Wong Deshawn Polk Aaron Harris
OLB (Shantee Orr DE) Marlin Greenwood Eric Ingram

CB Nate Clements DaMarcus Faggens
SS/LB Bernard Pollard C.C Brown Lewis Sanders
FS Chris Hope Glenn Earl Jason Bell
CB Dunta Robinson Philip Buchanon

I know you guys want to draft a whole line but with young players developing and coming into contract years I think we should give them a chance in the new system.The linemen in the draft look good but they will need time before we can depend on them.The 3 and 4 year Lineman should start to show this year if there ever going anywhere.Next year we will know more about what we need. As for the LBers we need to find out who can cover and where everyone will play.I will be working on them but,being a new team for me i've listened to a lot you've said.We may have better play out these guys with something up front to keep the linemen off them.As for the secondary,let them fight for a spot.As for the DL I think we should settle for a tackling machine at Value on one side and atleast one great Passrusher to get pressure the first year.We can turn Travis loose with a clog holding the middle.Robaire Smith will rotate with the other 2 DTs to keep them fresh.If this WR ain't there we can get a pass catching TE OR WR.We don't need to waste picks taking projects early..I really want to pick up atleast one vet 43 LBer so we can balance the weakness but if we can get by with our players its on to the future!

Xman
02-10-2006, 01:48 PM
I don't think we have enough cap room to sign those guys.

I do agree that we need to let most of our questionable guys play this year to figure out if they are worth keeping. This especially applies to our defense - which LBs, Ss, CBs, DEs can cut it. Then replace the ones that fail next year. We have enough holes to fix without duplicating unproven/marginal talent.

BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 02:22 PM
Yes,Having a new Coach he needs a chance to find the real problems.Most of the players are drafted in the rookie cap so the'll fit.Plus that's the way to go because its our future.I only grabed a hand full of FAs and 2 or 3 are mid level.I don't think were going to need all the LBers but with all the flexability we can hold them and have them ready when called upon.Who knows, maybe will keep Jonathan Wells but we need some speed in the Back field like a Barry Sanders...Players like Peak and Orr can give us the passrush as DEs in a nickel package.Plus we have the flexability to go right into a 34.We could have a great team!Plus it hold spots in the draft incase we do have enough LBs we can grab something that wasn't on the radar.I just seen very poor LB play last year.We do have talent on this team,now weither they have since or not is another story.

MorKnolle
02-10-2006, 03:07 PM
Feel free to add any input if you see better ways,,,,

QB Vince Young or David Carr Dave Ragone (FA WC QB)
RB Diminique Davis Verand Morancy Ahmad Green or Reggie Bush
TE/FB David Thomas Marcelles Wiley C/FB Tyson Walters
WR Andra Johnson Jabar Gaffney WR/TE Anthony Mix (6rd project)
WR Jerome Mathis Derek Armstrong Donovan Morgan

RT Andrew WhitworthTyson Walters
RG Zach Weigert Milford Brown
C (Atlanta C FA) Drew Hodgdon Steven McKinney
LG Fred Weary Draft LB or T/G or RB
LT Chester Pitts Tyson Walters

DE Aaron Kampman Moe Thompson
DT Travis Johnson Robaire Smith
NT Seth Payne
DE Kyle Van Bosch Jason Babin

OLB (Antwan Peak DE)Terna Nande Cato June
MLB Kalee Wong Deshawn Polk Aaron Harris
OLB (Shantee Orr DE) Marlin Greenwood Eric Ingram

CB Nate Clements DaMarcus Faggens
SS/LB Bernard Pollard C.C Brown Lewis Sanders
FS Lance Shultzer Glenn Earl Jason Bell
CB Dunta Robinson Philip Buchanon


No to Ahman Green, if he leaves Green Bay he'll be too expensive and he's hurt more than Domanick Davis is. Tyson Walter is in no way even close to being a FB, and Thomas and Rivers aren't really either (I assume you mean Marcellus Rivers and not Marcellus Wiley, Wiley is a 275 lb. DE that plays for the Jaguars). Johnson/Gaffney/Mathis/Mix/Armstrong is a decent group of WRs. Fred Weary shouldn't start for us, especially at LG, he'd be better at RG but still he isn't ready to be a starter, Wiegert (LG) and Brown (RG) would be a better starting duo. Tyson Walter should not be on the team next year, I don't know why they signed him to the practice squad at the end of last year and then the active roster, but he's terrible. VandenBosch will also be expensive and I don't really like as an option, and Kampman and Moe Thompson at the other DE? I would much rather have Peek and Babin as our two DEs, but we can do much better than these guys either way. Greenwood will start at OLB, Orr could definitely start at OLB, and Wong will be MLB unless we get a better MLB in the offseason, I don't see Cato June coming here and don't know who Terna Nande is. Clements would be a great pickup if we can get him, but he also will be fairly expensive, if he actually leaves Buffalo I'd make a run at him though. Pollard and Schulter don't give us much, if any, of an upgrade at S, so I wouldn't bother with getting them.

BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 03:13 PM
:redtowel: Hey Tyson Walters has played blocking FB/Blocking TE LT/RT/G/C We have plenty of time for Thomas to catch on as a pass catching FB Iin the seam.River's better be able to do something.Mix can be used as a pass catching TE TO UP the field..I don't really agree that Shultzer would not up grade but there is alway Hope,yes Chris Hope!

MorKnolle
02-10-2006, 03:19 PM
:redtowel: Hey Tyson Walters has played blocking FB/Blocking TE LT/RT/G/C We have plenty of time for Thomas to catch on as a pass catching FB Iin the seam.River's better be able to do something.Mix can be used as a pass catching TE TO UP the field..

Walter is 6-3, 310 lbs. that's not a FB.

BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 03:29 PM
As for placing the players,the coaches can do them how they will but with role players that can play multipule positions we can have fringe players to work with.Mix is a late round pick and has Gates type atribuites to his measures.In 6 he gives us mismatches and takes the physicality away from Johnson.:homer:

Tyson Walters}Neither was the guy that took over his position Marcus Spears 6'6" 300,,,its time to count snaps in Houston..Just for goal line and short yardage..We don't really need a FB!

I would not line our star TE up in the backfield unless is an important game but he's there learning and mise well extend his game.

BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 03:49 PM
I really don't see going into the season with Peak and Orr being every down 43 DEs..I wouldn't chance it but then its the staffs call.Some LBers can fight 330 ot a whole game.Then, most of them are headed to the hall,or already in.Tyson Walters is a Backup C also..A lot of teams build and can't afford the luxury of a flexible 49 man game roster.

BuffSoldier
02-10-2006, 04:14 PM
No, nope and heck no. No to green, no to David Thomas(the second coming of Billy Miller), and no to all the players that will cost us major cap room.First of all, all of those players do not want to be Texans, secondly that would put us over cap by like 20 million $. This must be a joke thread.:brickwall

BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 05:58 PM
Thats a Championship team right there:trophy:

stevo3883
02-10-2006, 06:01 PM
No, nope and heck no. No to green, no to David Thomas(the second coming of Billy Miller), and no to all the players that will cost us major cap room.First of all, all of those players do not want to be Texans, secondly that would put us over cap by like 20 million $. This must be a joke thread.:brickwall


david thomas is a good TE, was a good TE, always has been a good TE.

Billy Miller was a converted WR, and not a very good one at that.

BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 06:05 PM
Not only that but we could make living on David Thomas's Wheel route!:homer:


I seen him get cut low,come down with the ball in his hands,legs churning,as he rolled and powered toward the endzone:redtowel: looked like Jay Novack for a minute


We could trade a LBer to move down into round 1 with #33 and then trade that and a first next year to move down and land LT B'Brickshaw Ferguson.There may not be another like him for a while either...

BuffSoldier
02-10-2006, 07:20 PM
david thomas is a good TE, was a good TE, always has been a good TE.

Billy Miller was a converted WR, and not a very good one at that.

Big University of Texas fan here. I am a highschool senior and I might be going to UT next semester. I love David Thomas, he was my go to guy on NCAA '06, but he will be an h-back in the NFL.

By no means am I saying that he was anything but a great college TE, but he does not have the size, nor is he the type of blocker to be an every down TE at the NFL level.

Billy Miller- 6'3 253
David Thomas- 6'3 245

Billy Miller is faster and his hands are just as good, I have nothing against Miller, for a while he was the only ligit target that we had for David to throw at, but he couldnt block, and that is the problem with Thomas, he cant block.

He may be a good situational player, but he is not an every down TE, if he could block and was an inch taller he would be ranked just as high as Byrd.

BlueThunder
02-10-2006, 09:43 PM
Yes David Thomas isn't the biggest TE in the draft but if he can get his blocking down and show good at the combinehe could go as early as round 3 and even round 2.I've been breaking a lot of my own rules lately ,so sooner or later i'll mess up on a player.The way this team needs a TE they will most likely take Fasano early.If we don't get a chance to get a complete TE I would take Thomas and be glad I got me a good one.Thomas will have to play in a timing base offense.You did give me a reality check though..:homer:

Ya know,Thomas is 6'3" 245 listed and Byrd was just measured at the senior bowl at 6'2.5" 252..

Players I like I will take a chance on if theres no other better options.I'd draft him in the 4th.Maybe the third,Jason Witten only ran a 4.75/40 but he was 6'5 258..Hands and seperation is the most important to me.I'll make him a blocker.

I won't lie,if we drafted Vince I was going to take him at #65 that a lucky place for TEs.Shooooo don't tell anyone.

BlueThunder
02-11-2006, 02:25 PM
I did this for Gary Kubaik because I had the time and peace to do some hard thinking.Theres no sense in over paying linemen when the backups are doing just as good a job as the vets.If we have the money maybe we can go with Weigert, but everythings starting new, so everyones rookies as far as i'm concerned.This defense should be a top flight group and be ranked at the top in the league.Do this and put some hard work into coaching and theres no telling what this group can accomplish this season.

Lets go get one this year:trophy:

stevo3883
02-11-2006, 04:01 PM
By no means am I saying that he was anything but a great college TE, but he does not have the size, nor is he the type of blocker to be an every down TE at the NFL level.

Billy Miller- 6'3 253
David Thomas- 6'3 245

Billy Miller is faster and his hands are just as good, I have nothing against Miller, for a while he was the only ligit target that we had for David to throw at, but he couldnt block, and that is the problem with Thomas, he cant block.

He may be a good situational player, but he is not an every down TE, if he could block and was an inch taller he would be ranked just as high as Byrd.

I dont agree that millers hands were as good, and he didnt run as good of routes.

and david thomas can indeed block, every texas fan has seem him block just fine. its true he would be better suited used like cooley in wash, but comparing his blockign to millers is an insult to thomas.

miller was a mediocre wr in college, who became an even more mediocre te here.

imo thomas is better than byrd.. i dont see why people have byrd so much higher as he seems chubby and isnt as good a receiver.

BlueThunder
02-11-2006, 04:32 PM
I think Byrd is falling,he has injury concerns.Heres how I plan to get these players.A good OT prospect will fall to round 3 maybe Eric Winston with injuries and needing work still.I think we need to add a little weapon early for the offense.It was kinda flat last year and most of the FAs are defense.

#1 QB Vince Young
#33 WR Senorice Moss
#65 OT Andrew Whitworth
#66 TE David Thomas
#97 LB Terna Nande
#129 SS/LB Bernard Pollard
#160 DE Moe Thompson
#192 TE Anthony Mix
Trade a 3rd next year RB Brian Calhoun
or UDFA we may half to get in FA Avon Cason (burner 3drb)value
We can get 43 LBs as UDFA.Maybe we can trade someone for a 4th or 5th that we can push down.I just hope we have some LBs that can Captain the LBer because thats what worries me..

Texans86
02-11-2006, 04:33 PM
So who wants Joppru to come back next season and light it up with 14 TD's (just enough to take the record away from Gates). Oh yeah, this is the draft discussion, and Joppru has been all but forgotten. Maybe 4th time is the charm. Seriously, I feel bad for the guy. If he does come back, that's like another 2nd round pick this year, woohoo.

dat_boy_yec
02-11-2006, 07:01 PM
I think Byrd is falling,he has injury concerns.Heres how I plan to get these players.A good OT prospect will fall to round 3 maybe Eric Winston with injuries and needing work still.I think we need to add a little weapon early for the offense.It was kinda flat last year and most of the FAs are defense.

#1 QB Vince Young
#33 WR Senorice Moss
#65 OT Andrew Whitworth
#66 TE David Thomas
#97 LB Terna Nande
#129 SS/LB Bernard Pollard
#160 DE Moe Thompson
#192 TE Anthony Mix
Trade a 3rd next year RB Brian Calhoun
or UDFA we may half to get in FA Avon Cason (burner 3drb)value
We can get 43 LBs as UDFA.Maybe we can trade someone for a 4th or 5th that we can push down.I just hope we have some LBs that can Captain the LBer because thats what worries me..

This is just a suggestion, I don't think Moss would be going that high so if you were intent on getting him in the second you could trade down a few spots and pick up an extra pick in the third. You could pick up a good OG or a decent CB.

BlueThunder
02-12-2006, 02:33 AM
If Moss isn't there at 33 we may be able to move back 12 picks and get another WR,the best on the board after Moss.I like Gaffney and we could keep him but we need more big plays out of the offense.Plays over +20..Thing about Moss is he can return punts and give Mathis a breather every now and then so he can get more involved in the offense.The draft is thin at WR and if I couldn't get the one I want I8 would just get a sleeper later then to try to reach.

BlueThunder
02-13-2006, 12:12 PM
I'm not finished here i'm just getting started..I know the D'Brickshaw lovers are dancing.Its not finished by no means.I still have to see what the vfalue of the trade will be and Super Mario may be the target if the D'Brickshaw pick won't budge.I have to post this so I don't loose it surfing
Offense

QB David Carr Dave Ragone Tim Hasselbeck
TE Anthony Fanaso Marcelles Rivers Anthony Mix
RB Dominique Davis Verand Morancy Ederrin James
FB Rocky Cartwright Cedric Humes
WR Andra Johnson Jabar Gaffney WR/QB Reggie McNeil
WR Jerome Mathis Derek Armstrong

RT Todd Wade Jabar Levey2Tyson Walters
RG Zach Weigert Milford Brown Brain Pitts
C Justin Hartwig Todd Washington
LG Chester Pitts Fred Weary Drew Hodgdon
(LT Chester Pitts or G FA) Winston Justice1

DE Moe Thompson Jason Babin
DT Travis Johnson
NT Seth Payne Robaire Smith
DE(SUPER MARIO) Williams June= John Abraham

OLB Morlin Greenwood Antwan Peak
MLB Kalee Wong Deshaun Polk Aaron Harris
OLB Shantee Orr LB/SS Terna Nande

CB Nate Clements DeMarcus Faggens
SS C.C Brown SS/LB Bernard Pollard
FS FS Chris Hope Glenn Earl Jason Bell
CB Dunta Robinson Philip Buchanon

#5 LT/DE Mario Williams or Vince Young
#33 LT Winston Justice or DE Kiwi Mathias
#T37 TE Mercedes Lewis or Anthony Fasano
#65 LB Terna Nande
#66 QB/WR Ryan McNeil
#97 SS/LB Bernard Pollard
#T101 DE Moe Thompson or Jabar Levey
#129 RB Cedric Humes
#160 TE Anthony Mix
#190 LB Aaron Harris
And a second next year!
:coolb: .........................:trophy:

infantrycak
02-13-2006, 12:22 PM
Yeah, Todd Wade as a LT--recipe for success. What's the back up plan on that one?--resigning Victor Riley.

TheOgre
02-13-2006, 12:42 PM
Yeah, Todd Wade as a LT--recipe for success. What's the back up plan on that one?--resigning Victor Riley.

Perhaps bringing Marcus Spears back. Perhaps we can talk HOF Jackie Slater to come play for us.

TexanBacker93
02-13-2006, 01:50 PM
I don't think the Texans have a shot at signing Bentley, Clements, and Hope. They might be able to get one if they pay enough.

Winston Justice and Mario Williams both in the draft? How do they get two top 15 picks?

MorKnolle
02-13-2006, 02:29 PM
Blue, you change your mock and offseason plans more than Mel Kiper does. This one does look better than your past ones though.

1) Who is Ryan McNeil? Is that supposed to be Reggie McNeal?
2) Fasano at #37? That is a huge reach. Marcedes would be an ok pick but I'd rather see us go with an interior OLineman or CB.
3) I doubt Winston Justice makes it to #33, he should be the second OLineman taken and it won't be that late. Eric Winston might fall that far though.
4) Your 3rd round is really bad. Terna Nande at #65 is a waste of a pick. We don't need to reach that much on a guy like him, Schlegel or McIntosh in the 4th or 5th is fine. We need an interior OLineman in there somewhere. Reggie McNeal is a bigtime reach in the 3rd round, if that's what it takes to get him we don't need him. I wouldn't consider drafting him until the 5th at the very earliest. Mario at #4/5 is great, then we need OT, TE, and OG/C/CB in the 2nd and 3rd.
5) I don't think we need to draft two DEs if one of them is Mario, maybe it would be good for depth but we need to get a CB before we get a second DE. Humes that low would be a good option, and I doubt Anthony Mix falls that far, and if we already got a TE earlier I don't see much need for getting Mix.

Among the OLinemen you have, I would arrange them like this:
LT Chester Pitts/Winston Justice
LG Zach Wiegert
C Drew Hodgdon
RG Milford Brown/draft pick (you don't have us drafting an interior OL but we need to look for at least one)
RT Winston Justice/Chester Pitts

Your ideas are definitely getting better, within a couple weeks we'll have you with a legitimate plan for improving the team.

BlueThunder
02-13-2006, 03:22 PM
Terna Nande was playing DE because he has superstar talent.The guy would be a very solid 43 terror at LB.He has safety speed and makes plays.If he would have been drasfted last year at LB he would have been top 50.He's flying under the radar none the less.


It will all change but as for Reggie McNeil making the second day maybe but he will be fun to watch in training camp and preseason.We can use him as WR during the season to stretch the field with his speed.He's like Deion Branch the WR the Pats took 2 or 3 years ago.He may be faster.

This plan will change as I find better options its like an offseason Big Board for the Texans..

What are we going to do about Todd Wade tie4 him to the goal post and beat him with a rubber hose till he restructures his contract..At 7 million his azzzzz needs to play....

infantrycak
02-13-2006, 03:26 PM
This plan will change as I find better options its like an offseason Big Board for the Texans

That's fine, but there is no need for a new thread every time your plan changes. Just stick your new plan in this thread and it will pop back to the top.

BlueThunder
02-13-2006, 03:43 PM
It closed so I couldn't add to the first post in the front.Delete the other one not this this one.

BlueThunder
02-13-2006, 03:45 PM
You may as well delete this plan also ,,,,everyone has seen it already!

infantrycak
02-13-2006, 05:58 PM
It closed so I couldn't add to the first post in the front.Delete the other one not this this one.

It wasn't closed, although you may not have been able to edit your original post. Just add your new thoughts to this one.

BlueThunder
02-13-2006, 06:38 PM
its not the same because its a different topic!A totally different plan.Everyone is responding to front line thread..Where is the other post,i'm not finished.I think nits fun to make like a big board and let everyone help me tweak it till we have a master plan and the best shot at a Championship team.

Your messing with now!Did you change it back or what?

I see where you put it now.The first plan "I think" is the best plan for the team.It unloads a lot of cap and adds major compoinents to the team while getting younger.Then I don't have feelings for some of the other players because i'm new and am kinda looking from the outside in.

BlueThunder
02-13-2006, 07:19 PM
I think the whole problem with this team is when it was built you got a ton of scabb players and tried to develope them but then decide to fix them by reaching with a check book.I think this team is old enough on Offense to unload the high cap players and finish rebuilding thru the draft.

I would start to get those players out little by little,with drafted players.They seam too turn out better then the players picked up, that get the big check and retire on our roster...!

Going after quick fixes only compounds to the problem,it seldem fixes it.You can get good players off cap strapped team but most of the good ones are roll players.

YoungnotBush
02-13-2006, 08:02 PM
What does everyone think about this:

If the Texans pass on Vince and he goes to Tennessee, which is the most likely spot, that means the we have to play him twice a year AND beat him out every year for the division. Now, not only do we have to beat Peyton Manning twice a year, but also Vince. That doesn't sound to good for me.

Now think about this, because Tennessee wants Vince real bad.

For all you people that think Reggie is really the answer, then wouldn't the smart thing to do be to draft Vince and hold the Titans hostage, then trade him for the world to the titans.

New Orleans will still take Matt, because that is their biggest need. That means we could then draft Reggie at 3rd.

See I think Reggie will be around at 3. As long as we don't trade with anyone outside of 1-3, then we could get either one at 3, since Matt is pretty much a lock at 2.

Now I wouldn't care which one we got a the 3rd spot and we could still get something else also, which we need so desperately.

The 3rd spot is ideally where we wan't to pick, not only to save money on the pick, but also, because we could get something for trading down and if Reggie is there, then take Reggie, if Vince is there then take Vince. If the Titans did decide to take Reggie then we could still get Vince at the 3.

Everybody might be able to argue one or the other, but no one can argue with one and another pick or an up and coming DL or OL.

BlueThunder
02-13-2006, 09:34 PM
:redtowel: If we trade at 3 the Titans will take Young and someone will come up to get Bush most likely and will have Leinart,D'Brickshaw or Mario.Theres only one player in this draft i'd hate to face and thats Vince Young.He will be an instant starter because you can't contain him.I look at the team and want to get picks and make it better but the fastest way to put this team in the playoffs and at the top of the AFC is to draft our Hometown hero.Players will come just to play with this star.He will raise the whole team because they know if he gets a crease he's gone.He only had Pittman and Thomas and still made it happen.You draft him and we only need DEFENSE!

Go back and look how long it took McNabb to start winning.Soon as he hit the field they went to the top of the division.The Cowboys had the #1 ranked defense in the league and never stopped McNabb,,and he embarressed our defense hitting bombs with 38 on the board.If you move or pass,them green birds will swoop down and have another 10 years of winning.That would be the best case senrio for this team but if Carr starts losing and throwing the ball down because its someone elses fault then you'll be staked and honey'd!:redtowel:I'm not trying to be smart or anything but this time I know who the pick is and I ain't letting no spurt tell me different without going down for not taking him.First I watched Cuttingham,then I watched McNabb..If you can't beat them,join them!!!!!!!

Vince will be another Brett Farve and this time you guys may be on the wrong end of the giving and taking......Yaou guy want to trade down and get a bunch of picks,ok!Tell me who you want and will get all of them for ya.There ain't no doubt Carr has talent good arm and speed but he needs a rookie to come in and try to take his job.Maybe when he runs around the end and see day light he will go get his job...Carr need to take his azzz out of retirement and make a name for himself.He's getting ready to have a 1000 rushing QB that can't be stopped battling him!

TexanBacker93
02-13-2006, 10:26 PM
It took McNabb a couple of years to take over the division. He split time in his rookie year and they struggled. Until this year, though he's been a winner.

It's not a guarantee that Young will do the same things. I'd put more money on him being great than not, but it's still a gamble no matter how you slice it.

Young will not come in and tear up the league in his rookie year. Manning didn't do it and he is a far more accomplished college passer than Young. Athletic ability will only take you so far as a QB. Ask Akili Smith how it's working out for him now. Young is much better than Smith and is a better pro prospect, but it takes more than ability in the NFL. Young seems to have all the tools, but this team is not just a Vince Young away from winning a Super Bowl. They need help on the line. They need a DE that can get pressure on the QB. They need another CB that can cover.

BlueThunder
02-14-2006, 01:56 AM
Vince can start is rookie year!Hey if you don't want him,don't draft him.Do what you think is the smartest move.

dat_boy_yec
02-14-2006, 09:30 AM
Vince can start is rookie year!Hey if you don't want him,don't draft him.Do what you think is the smartest move.

Anybody can start their rookie year. The question would be if it's a wise decision. I'll put it to you like this, Carr started his rookie season because he beat out Banks for the job, but had the Texans gotten a better QB to mentor Carr or lead the team I would have preferred to see Carr sit for half a season or whatever while he really got the concepts of the offense they were trying to run. Whatever team Vince goes to I would hope he could sit for a little while, while he learns their system and gets to know his team mates. Sure he could start, but would that really be the smartest move.

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 09:34 AM
What does everyone think about this:

If the Texans pass on Vince and he goes to Tennessee, which is the most likely spot, that means the we have to play him twice a year AND beat him out every year for the division. Now, not only do we have to beat Peyton Manning twice a year, but also Vince. That doesn't sound to good for me.

Now think about this, because Tennessee wants Vince real bad.

For all you people that think Reggie is really the answer, then wouldn't the smart thing to do be to draft Vince and hold the Titans hostage, then trade him for the world to the titans.

New Orleans will still take Matt, because that is their biggest need. That means we could then draft Reggie at 3rd.

See I think Reggie will be around at 3. As long as we don't trade with anyone outside of 1-3, then we could get either one at 3, since Matt is pretty much a lock at 2.

Now I wouldn't care which one we got a the 3rd spot and we could still get something else also, which we need so desperately.

The 3rd spot is ideally where we wan't to pick, not only to save money on the pick, but also, because we could get something for trading down and if Reggie is there, then take Reggie, if Vince is there then take Vince. If the Titans did decide to take Reggie then we could still get Vince at the 3.

Everybody might be able to argue one or the other, but no one can argue with one and another pick or an up and coming DL or OL.

I'm pretty sure the Titans won't trade much of anything for Vince if we grab him at #1 with the intention of trading him. They will either draft D'Brick at #3 or trade down with someone looking for Bush, then keep McNair for a couple more years with Volek as his understudy/future QB. Other teams are not that in love with Vince that they are going to trade very much to get him.

:redtowel: If we trade at 3 the Titans will take Young and someone will come up to get Bush most likely and will have Leinart,D'Brickshaw or Mario.Theres only one player in this draft i'd hate to face and thats Vince Young.He will be an instant starter because you can't contain him.I look at the team and want to get picks and make it better but the fastest way to put this team in the playoffs and at the top of the AFC is to draft our Hometown hero.Players will come just to play with this star.He will raise the whole team because they know if he gets a crease he's gone.He only had Pittman and Thomas and still made it happen.You draft him and we only need DEFENSE!

Go back and look how long it took McNabb to start winning.Soon as he hit the field they went to the top of the division.The Cowboys had the #1 ranked defense in the league and never stopped McNabb,,and he embarressed our defense hitting bombs with 38 on the board.If you move or pass,them green birds will swoop down and have another 10 years of winning.That would be the best case senrio for this team but if Carr starts losing and throwing the ball down because its someone elses fault then you'll be staked and honey'd!:redtowel:I'm not trying to be smart or anything but this time I know who the pick is and I ain't letting no spurt tell me different without going down for not taking him.First I watched Cuttingham,then I watched McNabb..If you can't beat them,join them!!!!!!!

Vince will be another Brett Farve and this time you guys may be on the wrong end of the giving and taking......Yaou guy want to trade down and get a bunch of picks,ok!Tell me who you want and will get all of them for ya.There ain't no doubt Carr has talent good arm and speed but he needs a rookie to come in and try to take his job.Maybe when he runs around the end and see day light he will go get his job...Carr need to take his azzz out of retirement and make a name for himself.He's getting ready to have a 1000 rushing QB that can't be stopped battling him!

I see we've reverted back to the nonsensical posts.

Big B Texan Fan
02-14-2006, 09:52 AM
I see we've reverted back to the nonsensical posts.
And I see you still troll on other pepoles posts to get your point across that VY isn't the answer.

Face it. Just because some would find it hard to contain themselves and babble on with pro-VY rhetoric when displying their desire to have VY on the Home Team doesn't mean that he isn't gonna be the right pick.

And just because you call people out and dissect their posts and say that their posts are "nonsensical" doesn't make Bush or trade down look any better either. Nor does it help when you post the short novels that you do to get your point across. Most of us just pass your posts by when it breaches 75+ words. That includes the people who agree with you.

Coach C.
02-14-2006, 09:56 AM
wow big b got a bit of a problem with my boy Mork huh. Ahh well you guys can sort that out.

Blue not sure were you are going with this particular plan, would like to see you update it(IN THIS THREAD PLEASE) to see if you understand the team needs a bit better since you have been on the boards. Also, could you have us sign Chris Hope and LeCharles Bentley in your update.

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 10:01 AM
And I see you still troll on other pepoles posts to get your point across that VY isn't the answer.

Face it. Just because some would find it hard to contain themselves and babble on with pro-VY rhetoric when displying their desire to have VY on the Home Team doesn't mean that he isn't gonna be the right pick.

And just because you call people out and dissect their posts and say that their posts are "nonsensical" doesn't make Bush or trade down look any better either. Nor does it help when you post the short novels that you do to get your point across. Most of us just pass your posts by when it breaches 75+ words. That includes the people who agree with you.

What about the following post has a shred of substance in it? I don't have any kind of problem when people provide intelligible, reasonable arguments for Vince and I will offer my opinion of such, but when this kind of post is made I will call them nonsensical. I said the same thing a couple months ago when people would make similar praise posts about Reggie Bush without any kind of relevant substance, but you probably weren't complaining about those then. If you don't have the patience to read thru 75+ word posts then don't, I don't expect most people to concentrate thru all of that. I myself don't generally read extra long posts like that unless the person posting it has proven themselves in the past to be worth my time of reading thru all of it and seeing their thoughts on the subject or unless the subject is of particular interest to me, so if you don't want to read my long posts don't, it won't bother me at all. I try to thoroughly explain myself and my views in those, and anyone that wants to read thru them and gain a better understanding of where I'm coming from on my opinions is more than welcome to do it, anyone that doesn't want to spend the time to do it obvioulsy doesn't have to, it makes no difference to me.

:redtowel: If we trade at 3 the Titans will take Young and someone will come up to get Bush most likely and will have Leinart,D'Brickshaw or Mario.Theres only one player in this draft i'd hate to face and thats Vince Young.He will be an instant starter because you can't contain him.I look at the team and want to get picks and make it better but the fastest way to put this team in the playoffs and at the top of the AFC is to draft our Hometown hero.Players will come just to play with this star.He will raise the whole team because they know if he gets a crease he's gone.He only had Pittman and Thomas and still made it happen.You draft him and we only need DEFENSE!

Go back and look how long it took McNabb to start winning.Soon as he hit the field they went to the top of the division.The Cowboys had the #1 ranked defense in the league and never stopped McNabb,,and he embarressed our defense hitting bombs with 38 on the board.If you move or pass,them green birds will swoop down and have another 10 years of winning.That would be the best case senrio for this team but if Carr starts losing and throwing the ball down because its someone elses fault then you'll be staked and honey'd!:redtowel:I'm not trying to be smart or anything but this time I know who the pick is and I ain't letting no spurt tell me different without going down for not taking him.First I watched Cuttingham,then I watched McNabb..If you can't beat them,join them!!!!!!!

Vince will be another Brett Farve and this time you guys may be on the wrong end of the giving and taking......Yaou guy want to trade down and get a bunch of picks,ok!Tell me who you want and will get all of them for ya.There ain't no doubt Carr has talent good arm and speed but he needs a rookie to come in and try to take his job.Maybe when he runs around the end and see day light he will go get his job...Carr need to take his azzz out of retirement and make a name for himself.He's getting ready to have a 1000 rushing QB that can't be stopped battling him!

Big B Texan Fan
02-14-2006, 10:08 AM
wow big b got a bit of a problem with my boy Mork huh. Ahh well you guys can sort that out.
Actually I enjoy Morknolles posts but they get a bit radundant when he goes on and on for 1000 words. And he qoutes some mystery scout, and he's the world champion at post dissecting. We all do it but it appears (maybe I'm exaggerating) that he's looking for it and when he gets a good one he pounces. The only bad thing is that he hates the VY blah blah but when he attaches it to a post of his he forces us to read it twice so he makes a bad post (from someone else) worse. Almost seems as though he's actually Casserly and he's defending his stance against VY in order to keep his job.
Happy V-Day MorKnolle

Big B Texan Fan
02-14-2006, 10:17 AM
If you don't have the patience to read thru 75+ word posts then don't, I don't expect most people to concentrate thru all of that. I myself don't generally read extra long posts like that unless the person posting it has proven themselves in the past to be worth my time of reading thru all of it and seeing their thoughts on the subject or unless the subject is of particular interest to me, so if you don't want to read my long posts don't, it won't bother me at all. I try to thoroughly explain myself and my views in those, and anyone that wants to read thru them and gain a better understanding of where I'm coming from on my opinions is more than welcome to do it, anyone that doesn't want to spend the time to do it obvioulsy doesn't have to, it makes no difference to me.
That right there is what I'm talking about. You said the same thing, "don't read it then", like 3 times in that paragraph. Jeez.

You see, sometimes I give posts with statistical backings and strong explanations and then sometimes I just rant. This should be a place where one can come and do so, I just don't like seeing the bullying that goes on when you drop some psuedo educated, re-re-re-repaeted posts that might yank someone the wrong way and they leave the MB's. Lighten up.

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 10:33 AM
That right there is what I'm talking about. You said the same thing, "don't read it then", like 3 times in that paragraph. Jeez.

You see, sometimes I give posts with statistical backings and strong explanations and then sometimes I just rant. This should be a place where one can come and do so, I just don't like seeing the bullying that goes on when you drop some psuedo educated, re-re-re-repaeted posts that might yank someone the wrong way and they leave the MB's. Lighten up.

I'm not trying to yank someone's posts. As I said, if someone with a differing view posts a somewhat reasonable post then I have no problem whatsoever with it, I will offer my view on the subject and try to start some kind of intelligent dialogue back and forth so hopefully we can both benefit from each other's differing opinions. When I'm talking directly about what someone said, I will quote that piece of their post so people more easily identify what I'm talking about. In the case of the post I called nonsensical, there is nothing in that post that can be construed as being rational or intelligent thinking, it's just a blind "Vince is so great, bla bla" post so there is not much hope of springing intelligent dialogue from that. If that is all a person is bringing to the message boards then I don't personally care that much if they leave, if they are bringing some kind of intelligent opinion that they can back up with some sort of relevant rational argument then that is fine and I totally encourage people to do so. In BlueThunder's particular case, he started off his first posts with that kind of Vince drivel but he had started putting together some great posts more recently (albeit I don't agree with many of his opinions, but he was creating intelligent thought on here nonetheless), then he came back with a couple more of those posts, hence my comment coming out the way it did.

BlueThunder
02-14-2006, 12:16 PM
I don't think Chris Hope will be much of a problem.The Steelers like to turn there roster,or give the apearence that the players have no value.Then they try to get them to come back cheaper

LeCharles Bentley may be a different story.He will mostlikely be Franchised and while other teams are pursueing him the sensable C will be swooped up.LeCharles Bentley was already rumored to want to go back home and play for Cleveland.I'm not sure if the rumor is true or a detour for other teams,but I don't see getting in a bidding with all the teams that need a center.We have to spread the money out to chjange the offense defense and be successful.

Everyone seize VY shouldn't start but I think he can take the starting job.Quincy Carter (which I had no part in drafting)did come in his first year in a new offense beat out Banks and go 500 his rookie year.QC finished his career 16 and 17 as a starter and changed offenses every year he played.I'm not saying Vince will come in and get this team to the Superbowl his fiurst year but he has way more talent the QC did.Playmakers find ways to make plays when they need to and Vince will be one of the best.

As for drifting back into that black hole,I just want to make sure everyone really realizes the consequences of passing this guy.I just don't see a very pretty picture at the end of tunnel if he's not a Texan.I have tried to look at it optimiststicly but the reality always comes back full force.

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 12:20 PM
I don't think Chris Hope will be much of a problem,the Steelers like to turn there roster or give the apearence that they have no value to try to get them to come back cheap.


LeCharles Bentley may be a different story.He will mostlikely be Franchised and while other teams are pursueing him the sensable C will be swooped up.LeCharles Bentley was already rumored to want to go back home and play for Cleveland.I'm not sure if the rumor is true or a detour for other teams,but I don't see getting in a bidding with all the teams that need a center.We have to spread the money out to chjange the offense defense and be successful.

Everyone seize VY shouldn't start but I think he can take the starting job.Quincy Carter (which I had no part in drafting)did come in his first year in a new offense beat out Banks and go 500 his rookie year.QC finished his career 16 and 17 as a starter and changed offenses every year he played.I'm not saying Vince will come in and get this team to the Superbowl his fiurst year but he has way more talent the QC did.Playmakers find ways to make plays when they need to and Vince will be one of the best.

I don't really know much about Pope so I'll leave that to Coach. As for Bentley, the Saints said they would not franchise him last I heard and that they would let him test the free agent market, so I think that pretty much guarantees he's leaving New Orleans, whether he comes to Houston or not remains to be seen. I hope we pursue him early and hard enough to get him to come here.

BlueThunder
02-14-2006, 12:40 PM
I'm not finished here i'm just getting started..I know the D'Brickshaw lovers are dancing.Its not finished by no means.I still have to see what the vfalue of the trade will be and Super Mario may be the target if the D'Brickshaw pick won't budge.I have to post this so I don't loose it surfing
Offense

QB David Carr Dave Ragone Tim Hasselbeck
TE Anthony Fanaso Marcelles Rivers Anthony Mix
RB Dominique Davis Verand Morancy Ederrin James
FB Rocky Cartwright Cedric Humes
WR Andra Johnson Jabar Gaffney WR/QB Reggie McNeil
WR Jerome Mathis Derek Armstrong

RT Todd Wade Jabar Levey2Tyson Walters
RG Zach Weigert Milford Brown Brain Pitts
C Justin Hartwig Todd Washington
LG Chester Pitts Fred Weary Drew Hodgdon
(LT Chester Pitts or G FA) Winston Justice1

DE Moe Thompson Jason Babin
DT Travis Johnson
NT Seth Payne Robaire Smith
DE(SUPER MARIO) Williams June= John Abraham

OLB Morlin Greenwood Antwan Peak
MLB Kalee Wong Deshaun Polk Aaron Harris
OLB Shantee Orr LB/SS Terna Nande

CB Nate Clements DeMarcus Faggens
SS C.C Brown SS/LB Bernard Pollard
FS FS Chris Hope Glenn Earl Jason Bell
CB Dunta Robinson Philip Buchanon

#5 LT/DE Mario Williams or Vince Young
#33 LT Winston Justice or DE Kiwi Mathias
#T37 TE Mercedes Lewis or Anthony Fasano
#65 LB Terna Nande
#66 QB/WR Ryan McNeil
#97 SS/LB Bernard Pollard
#T101 DE Moe Thompson or Jabar Levey
#129 RB Cedric Humes
#160 TE Anthony Mix
#190 LB Aaron Harris
And a second next year!
:coolb: .........................:trophy:

About the only moves I see that would be best is unload Zach Wiegert and replace him with Brown or Pittman for cap reasons.They keep Fred Weary as the other guard for reasons also.Its much easier to replace the QB then to replace the team.

RT Todd Wade(Draft)
G Milford Brown
C Justin Hartwig
G Fred Weary
LT Chester Pitts

whiskeyrbl
02-14-2006, 12:59 PM
I'm not finished here i'm just getting started..I know the D'Brickshaw lovers are dancing.Its not finished by no means.I still have to see what the vfalue of the trade will be and Super Mario may be the target if the D'Brickshaw pick won't budge.I have to post this so I don't loose it surfing
Offense

QB David Carr Dave Ragone Tim Hasselbeck
TE Anthony Fanaso Marcelles Rivers Anthony Mix
RB Dominique Davis Verand Morancy Ederrin James
FB Rocky Cartwright Cedric Humes
WR Andra Johnson Jabar Gaffney WR/QB Reggie McNeil
WR Jerome Mathis Derek Armstrong

RT Todd Wade Jabar Levey2Tyson Walters
RG Zach Weigert Milford Brown Brain Pitts
C Justin Hartwig Todd Washington
LG Chester Pitts Fred Weary Drew Hodgdon
(LT Chester Pitts or G FA) Winston Justice1

DE Moe Thompson Jason Babin
DT Travis Johnson
NT Seth Payne Robaire Smith
DE(SUPER MARIO) Williams June= John Abraham

OLB Morlin Greenwood Antwan Peak
MLB Kalee Wong Deshaun Polk Aaron Harris
OLB Shantee Orr LB/SS Terna Nande

CB Nate Clements DeMarcus Faggens
SS C.C Brown SS/LB Bernard Pollard
FS FS Chris Hope Glenn Earl Jason Bell
CB Dunta Robinson Philip Buchanon

#5 LT/DE Mario Williams or Vince Young
#33 LT Winston Justice or DE Kiwi Mathias
#T37 TE Mercedes Lewis or Anthony Fasano
#65 LB Terna Nande
#66 QB/WR Ryan McNeil
#97 SS/LB Bernard Pollard
#T101 DE Moe Thompson or Jabar Levey
#129 RB Cedric Humes
#160 TE Anthony Mix
#190 LB Aaron Harris
And a second next year!
:coolb: .........................:trophy:
What about this Draft if we trade with Jets for 1st and 2nd this year and1st and 3rd next year:
#4: D'brick (LT)
#33 N.Mangold (C)
#36 J.Joseph CB (SC)
#65 V.Adejanu DE (INDIANA)
#66 Setterstrom OG (MINN)
#97 C.Humes RB (Virg. Tech)
#129 S.Green WR (LSU)
#161 R.Harper S (Ala)
#193 Bieneman TE (Wash.St.)

infantrycak
02-14-2006, 01:22 PM
About the only moves I see that would be best is unload Zach Wiegert and replace him with Brown or Pittman for cap reasons.

Pittman is a long snapper and is nominally a TE. He has no place in an OL discussion.

BlueThunder
02-14-2006, 01:25 PM
I think that draft would have to many OL in it.Why draft OL if your never going to give them a chance to develope.We would have to release all the young linemen we have to make room.Plus the TE sounds to have been the achilles heel of the offense.I think they should quit reaching and get a quality TE on the first day.The only reason i'm going LB is because were starting a new system and 34 LBers sometimes have trouble with coverages.If team find that weakness they will attack it till you stop it.

whiskeyrbl
02-14-2006, 01:28 PM
I think that draft would have to many OL in it.Why draft OL if your never going to give them a chance to develope.We would have to release all the young linemen we have to make room.Plus the TE sounds to have been the achilles heel of the offense.I think they should quit reaching and get a quality TE.
Yea replace mediocre players with ones that are better and you don't have to release them it's something they call DEPTH!!!!!

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 01:29 PM
What about this Draft if we trade with Jets for 1st and 2nd this year and1st and 3rd next year:
#4: D'brick (LT)
#33 N.Mangold (C)
#36 J.Joseph CB (SC)
#65 V.Adejanu DE (INDIANA)
#66 Setterstrom OG (MINN)
#97 C.Humes RB (Virg. Tech)
#129 S.Green WR (LSU)
#161 R.Harper S (Ala)
#193 Bieneman TE (Wash.St.)

That would not be a bad plan at all and I'd be happy if we get something like that, but I'd still rather switch it around like this:
#4 Mario Williams, DE
#33 Eric Winston, OT
#36 Nick Mangold, C
#65 best CB/WR available
#66 T.J. Williams, TE
#97 best DB available (CB if we go WR at #65, S if we go CB at #65)
#129 Rocky McIntosh/Anthony Schlegel, LB
#161 best WR/DB/LB/DE/OL for added depth (combo player like Reggie McNeal would be nice if he lasts).
#193 best WR/DB/LB/DE/OL

whiskeyrbl
02-14-2006, 01:29 PM
Go to scouting.com and look at the reports on the individuals i stated for drafting i think you will see why.

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 01:32 PM
Go to scouting.com and look at the reports on the individuals i stated for drafting i think you will see why.

Go to where? Type out the full link, I'd be interested to see any additional info/data on all these guys.

whiskeyrbl
02-14-2006, 01:40 PM
Go to where? Type out the full link, I'd be interested to see any additional info/data on all these guys.
www.nfldraftcountdown.com

BlueThunder
02-14-2006, 02:33 PM
Feel free to add any input if you see better ways,,,,

I can just see the Offensive and Defensive coordinator in camp battling to rattle the other with something they think can't be matched.Everyone has a few little tweener/tweakers to match up.


QB Vince Young David Carr Dave Ragone
RB Dominique Davis Verand Morancy Brian Calhoun
TE/FB David Thomas ( Marcelles?Rivers) Robert Royal
WR Andra Johnson Senorice Moss Anthony Mix (6rd project)
WR Jerome Mathis Derek Armstrong Donovan Morgan


RT Andrew Whitworth Fred Wand
RG Milford Brown Bryan Pittman
C Todd Washington Drew Hodgdon
LG Chester Pitts Seth Wand
LT Todd Wade Tyson Walters

DE Aaron Kampman Moe Thompson
DT Travis Johnson
NT Seth Payne Robaire Smith
DE Kyle Van Bosch Jason Babin

OLB (Antwan Peak DE)Cato June Terna Nande
MLB Kalee Wong Deshawn Polk Aaron Harris
OLB (Shantee Orr DE) Marlin Greenwood Eric Ingram

CB Nate Clements DaMarcus Faggens
SS/LB Bernard Pollard C.C Brown Lewis Sanders
FS Chris Hope Glenn Earl Jason Bell
CB Dunta Robinson Philip Buchanon

I know you guys want to draft a whole line but with young players developing and coming into contract years I think we should give them a chance in the new system.The linemen in the draft look good but they will need time before we can depend on them.The 3 and 4 year Lineman should start to show this year if there ever going anywhere.Next year we will know more about what we need. As for the LBers we need to find out who can cover and where everyone will play.I will be working on them but,being a new team for me i've listened to a lot you've said.We may have better play out these guys with something up front to keep the linemen off them.As for the secondary,let them fight for a spot.As for the DL I think we should settle for a tackling machine at Value on one side and atleast one great Passrusher to get pressure the first year.We can turn Travis loose with a clog holding the middle.Robaire Smith will rotate with the other 2 DTs to keep them fresh.If this WR ain't there we can get a pass catching TE OR WR.We don't need to waste picks taking projects early..I really want to pick up atleast one vet 43 LBer so we can balance the weakness but if we can get by with our players its on to the future!

PRESEASON STARTING SECOND TEAM
Offense

QB Vince Young
RB Brian Calhoun
FB Rocky Cartwright
TE David Thomas
WR Jerome Mathis
WR Senorice Moss
RT Todd Wade
RG Milford Brown
C Brian Pittman
LG Drew Hodgdon
LT Andrew Whitworth

Defense

DE Moe Thompson
DT Robaire Smith
NT John Jolly
DE Jason Babin
WLB Terna Nande
MLB Aaron Harris
SLB Clint Ingram
CB DeMarcus Faggens
SS Bernard Pollard
FS Glenn Earl
CB Philip Buchanon
Nickel Jason Bell

Coach C.
02-14-2006, 02:33 PM
whiskey I think the difference is do you want D improved more or offense improved more. Personally I want our D to be ready, because offense is nothing but a couple of players away. We have relatively the same offense from the year we went 7-9 the offense is not that bad, problem is we have no defenses identity. What Mario Williams, Jonathan Joseph/Demario Minter, Rocky McIntosh, and Athlete X does is give us a young nucleus to team with our current defenders that are tough and mean. We need to get to that if we are going to succeed in a division as tough as ours. I like your thoughts you have us getting some guys that I like alot, and I have been to that site dont agree with everything he says and I think Beerlover has said enough about that guy, but I would not be mad at your draft, I just think in your draft we are not getting that identity shift that this team needs.

Coach C.
02-14-2006, 02:35 PM
Blue Tyson Walters just does not seem like the guy that is gonna end up making our team. If we bring in Winston/Justice/Scott/Ferguson and Eslinger/Mangold/Setterstrom then he is definately on his way out. Either way at least you put Chris Hope on there and I like that Peek and Babin are better than Aaron Kampman so dont really like that. Also the LBs are kinda off, but you can figure that one out. And just a last note his name is Morlon Greenwood not Marlin.

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 02:40 PM
Pittman is also not a C, he is a TE/long snapper. Drew Hodgdon would be our backup C if he's not starting.

infantrycak
02-14-2006, 02:43 PM
Pittman is also not a C, he is a TE/long snapper. Drew Hodgdon would be our backup C if he's not starting.

I guess being told that once wasn't enough.

whiskeyrbl
02-14-2006, 02:48 PM
whiskey I think the difference is do you want D improved more or offense improved more. Personally I want our D to be ready, because offense is nothing but a couple of players away. We have relatively the same offense from the year we went 7-9 the offense is not that bad, problem is we have no defenses identity. What Mario Williams, Jonathan Joseph/Demario Minter, Rocky McIntosh, and Athlete X does is give us a young nucleus to team with our current defenders that are tough and mean. We need to get to that if we are going to succeed in a division as tough as ours. I like your thoughts you have us getting some guys that I like alot, and I have been to that site dont agree with everything he says and I think Beerlover has said enough about that guy, but I would not be mad at your draft, I just think in your draft we are not getting that identity shift that this team needs.
Actually i want both but i can agree D is probably more important right now,I could see taking Mario instead of D'brick,LB's I would look seiously at FA at Julian Peterson,Akin Ayodele,or Wil Weatherspoon.I like Joseph at CB,2 ballhawking,lay your *** out CB's would be awesome.Have you looked at Harper S (ala) and Adeyanju (Indiana) DE,i think they would be good p/u's late.

BlueThunder
02-14-2006, 03:25 PM
You guys best get busy all I have left is the 3rd team..:superman:

YoungnotBush
02-14-2006, 10:40 PM
The only way I would agree to passing on Vince, is a trade down scenario. It is hard to go wrong when trading down as long is the value is right.

I just don't think we should trade out of the top 3, considering the value drops off as far as franchise player goes. Four for D'brick isn't a bad trade if it came with alot of other things, but D'brick isn't anything to go build a team around, and neither is very much after him.

So basically I wanted to discuss some possible trades with NO and Tenn. I don't think the Texans can go wrong with any of the 3 players.

TexanBacker93
02-14-2006, 10:52 PM
The only way I would agree to passing on Vince, is a trade down scenario. It is hard to go wrong when trading down as long is the value is right.

I just don't think we should trade out of the top 3, considering the value drops off as far as franchise player goes. Four for D'brick isn't a bad trade if it came with alot of other things, but D'brick isn't anything to go build a team around, and neither is very much after him.

So basically I wanted to discuss some possible trades with NO and Tenn. I don't think the Texans can go wrong with any of the 3 players.

I think there are 5 tier 1 players that you can add to the franchise and improve. Williams and Ferguson will have impacts like the big 3.

New Orleans has no incentive to trade up. They want a QB and either Young or Leinart or both will be there. What could trading up get them? Tennessee might if they were very locked in on one player, but I imagine they are content with getting Young or Leinart depending on who falls past New Orleans. If the Texans take Young and the Saints take Leinart they'll have the ability to trade down with someone that wants Bush. The Jets and Packers are the best options for a trade.

whiskeyrbl
02-14-2006, 10:56 PM
I think there are 5 tier 1 players that you can add to the franchise and improve. Williams and Ferguson will have impacts like the big 3.

New Orleans has no incentive to trade up. They want a QB and either Young or Leinart or both will be there. What could trading up get them? Tennessee might if they were very locked in on one player, but I imagine they are content with getting Young or Leinart depending on who falls past New Orleans. If the Texans take Young and the Saints take Leinart they'll have the ability to trade down with someone that wants Bush. The Jets and Packers are the best options for a trade.
I had heard that Tennesse would likely go after D'Brick and not Young because Young does not fit in the Norm Chow style Offense,if that was the case we might be able to trade with them so they could get Lienart if he is more Chow's flavor. HMMMMMM gets more interesting everyday

MorKnolle
02-14-2006, 11:15 PM
The only way I would agree to passing on Vince, is a trade down scenario. It is hard to go wrong when trading down as long is the value is right.

I just don't think we should trade out of the top 3, considering the value drops off as far as franchise player goes. Four for D'brick isn't a bad trade if it came with alot of other things, but D'brick isn't anything to go build a team around, and neither is very much after him.

So basically I wanted to discuss some possible trades with NO and Tenn. I don't think the Texans can go wrong with any of the 3 players.

The Saints definitely will not trade up at all. Why would they be interested in that? They are guaranteed one of the top two QBs in this draft (likely guaranteed Leinart since the Texans don't want him), so they aren't about to give away more stuff in order to move up, draft the same guy and pay him more money. The Titans likely aren't going to trade up either. They are 95% sure the Texans aren't drafting Vince or Leinart, so they can sit at #3 and grab either one that falls, or if both are somehow gone then they can grab D'Brick since their OLine needs some help too. They have no incentive for trading picks or playes away to move up and take the same guy they'll get at #3 and paying that much more money for him, especially with the cap problems they already have. If anything they will try to trade down to acquire more/later picks to fill holes and spend less money.

TexanBacker is right, there are more than just the three guys as top-tier players. Reggie Bush, Matt Leinart, Vince Young, and Mario Williams can definitely be considered in that top group, D'Brickashaw Ferguson and A.J. Hawk could maybe be added but I'm a little more hesitant on them. You want to make sure you stay in the top 4-5 picks to get one of these guys as there is a decent drop off in talent past them (there is plenty of talent and this is a very deep draft, but these guys are clearly above everyone else, especially these top 4). My #1 guy that I hope we get in this whole draft is Mario Williams, #2 would be Reggie Bush, so to me I would accept any kind of reasonable deal to move down to #4/5. I am not willing to get ripped off on it, but I'm not going to require two 1sts, a 2nd, a 3rd and something more to get there since he is my top guy I want. It will be interesting to see how the combine, pro days, and workouts end up and what the Texans draft board looks like by April 29th.

michaelm
02-15-2006, 01:02 AM
That would not be a bad plan at all and I'd be happy if we get something like that, but I'd still rather switch it around like this:
#4 Mario Williams, DE
#33 Eric Winston, OT
#36 Nick Mangold, C



This sounds good if Mangold is around at #36. Even if he's not, Mario/Winston sounds better than DBrick/Mangold as in the post you were responding to.
I really haven't been a trade down guy, but I must admit that the idea is growing on me. Maybe it's just becoming better educated on the subject...

#4 Mario Williams,DE
#33 Eric Winston, OT
#36 Senorice Moss, WR - or Best TE Available
would work for me if Moss is on the board @#36. I don't know what TE to target @ #36 though...
Another thing... I'm not for drafting an RB at all if we pass on Reggie, unlike a previous post.

BlueThunder
02-15-2006, 03:04 AM
I still think Morlon Greenwood is the MLB.....



--Kyle Van Bosch--Seth Payne--Travis Johnson--Aaron Kampman---

------Shantee Orr-----Morlon Greenwood----Antwan Peak--------

------------Lance Shultzer----------C.C Brown ---------

------Dunta Robinson----------------------Nate Clements



,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,He knows every position in the 43 defense!

MorKnolle
02-15-2006, 09:36 AM
This sounds good if Mangold is around at #36. Even if he's not, Mario/Winston sounds better than DBrick/Mangold as in the post you were responding to.
I really haven't been a trade down guy, but I must admit that the idea is growing on me. Maybe it's just becoming better educated on the subject...

#4 Mario Williams,DE
#33 Eric Winston, OT
#36 Senorice Moss, WR - or Best TE Available
would work for me if Moss is on the board @#36. I don't know what TE to target @ #36 though...
Another thing... I'm not for drafting an RB at all if we pass on Reggie, unlike a previous post.

Moss would be an interesting addition at #36 if he lasts that far. I think Mangold will still be there at #36 as interior linemen aren't usually taken in the 1st, and I would prefer to hold off on getting a TE until the 3rd round. In the 3rd, we can still get Klopfenstein, David Thomas, Tim Day, or my rising prospect in T.J. Williams, and Byrd or Fasano could end up falling that far too.

BlueThunder
06-27-2006, 03:26 PM
Heres to all you guys question on if I would servive not getting Vince Young?

I'm still here and plan to see this go straight to the top..

11 and 5 with Southern title....LETS GO GET IT!****:trophy:****

Theres a lot of changes and ajustments coming from what has been done,,plus I never got to finish this draft from 2/15 and being a new fan..

DAVID CARR will find himself 4308 Yards Passing

threetoedpete
06-27-2006, 05:22 PM
Glad you are still with us BT. I know it's slow, but please let this dungy pellet float back to the bottom of the bowl where it belongs, thanks.I just waisted five minutes rereading it. :fireball: