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View Full Version : Superbowl: maybe this is out of line, but...


powerfuldragon
02-06-2006, 10:35 AM
Maybe this is out of line, but it seemed to me that the superbowl was a fix. Roethlisberger got a sub-Carr QB rating, and still wins the game. He "scores a touchdown that even Ed Hochuli (sp?) would have called down at the 1 inch line. The refs called holding against casper the friendly ghost, who's apparently playing for Seattle. They even tried to call a fumble on Hasslebeck on a play that Hellen Keller could have called correctly in a blizzard...

Don't get me wrong, i was rooting for the 'stainless' Steelers, but the entire NFL was wearing black and gold glasses.

profan
02-06-2006, 10:41 AM
Well, i though it was a touchdown as the ball appeared to touch the white line while he was in the air. The fumble was reversed and Seattle got the ball with a first down. The flag on the holding was called before the pass was completed. So I don't see it on these plays. The only call I thought was pretty cheap was the "push off" that resulted in the touchdown being called back. He did put his hand out and touch the defender, but it was pretty weak. I think you let that go in a championship game. Best team won the game.

Jack Bauer
02-06-2006, 10:54 AM
Maybe this is out of line, but it seemed to me that the superbowl was a fix. Roethlisberger got a sub-Carr QB rating, and still wins the game. He "scores a touchdown that even Ed Hochuli (sp?) would have called down at the 1 inch line. The refs called holding against casper the friendly ghost, who's apparently playing for Seattle. They even tried to call a fumble on Hasslebeck on a play that Hellen Keller could have called correctly in a blizzard...

Don't get me wrong, i was rooting for the 'stainless' Steelers, but the entire NFL was wearing black and gold glasses.

I can definitely see how people might think this. I was a non-biased observer and it wouldn't take a lot to convince me that this game was fixed.

BigBull17
02-06-2006, 10:54 AM
If he doesnt fully extend his arm its a TD. The hold was due to the angle. It looked like he pulled the OLB down from behind, and at full speed thats a hard call to make. And Seatle did all it could to lose the game. Horrible clock management, worse play calling, 2 missed FG, the recurence of the dropitis they had last year, the dude who flapped off to Joey Porter playing scared. They choked, they were out coached, and they got outplayed. See you next year and congrats on the great season Seatle.

HoustonFrog
02-06-2006, 10:59 AM
Besides gambling I didn't have any care on who won but I agree that the game was horribly officiated and that it changed the outcome of the game. People can dispute all of these if they want but I think some are hard to

1) D. Jackson's TD that was overturned was ticky tack and should have not have been called. His arm was already extended when he barely touched him. They were both fighting for position. That is 7 points.

2) Rothlisberger--some said they saw the tip on the dive hit the line..I didn't see anything close. They might have gotten in on 4th down but who knows.

3) Two holding calls on punt returns that the announcers could not find

4) (The biggest series and group of bad calls). Hassle hits the TE to the 1. Holding brings it back. Both Michaels and Madden said it was horrible and if you watch the play again Pitt was offside. So instead of having it first and goal at the 1 you have it 2nd and long and you get a sack. Third down interception followed by a BS penalty for blocking below the waist on the the tackle. This leads directly to a the Steeler TD from Randal El/

5) The second D Jack TD before half. This one is a little more controversial but I couldn't believe they didn't at least replay it. If you watch it again it looks like his one foot is down and the other hits the pylon..TD.

So even if I give Steeler fan Roethlisberger and this last one with the pylon you still have two blatant calls that cost them 2 scores..the 2 scores they lost by. I'll never call a game a fix but these playoffs call to question the leagues refs. They need younger, full time guys. Having these cadavers, with the exception of Hulk Ed Hockely, who are insurance salesmen on the side are causing problems.

powerfuldragon
02-06-2006, 11:53 AM
2) Rothlisberger--some said they saw the tip on the dive hit the line..I didn't see anything close. They might have gotten in on 4th down but who knows.



i couldn't see it in HD.

BigBull17
02-06-2006, 11:53 AM
5) The second D Jack TD before half. This one is a little more controversial but I couldn't believe they didn't at least replay it. If you watch it again it looks like his one foot is down and the other hits the pylon..TD.

His foot never made contact with the pylon. That was very clear in the replay.

powerfuldragon
02-06-2006, 11:57 AM
His foot never made contact with the pylon. That was very clear in the replay.
this is true. he was out of bounds.

Double Barrel
02-06-2006, 12:15 PM
The officiating was horrible, but I chaulk it up to human error over a grand CON$spiracy.

The NFL has too much to lose to throw games. Their entire product rests on the fact that the public believes it it a legitimate product. Without that trust, pro football becomes a house of cards and would be no more valid than professional wrestling.

goodness
02-06-2006, 12:40 PM
His foot never made contact with the pylon. That was very clear in the replay.

Whatever. His left foot was obviously in and I saw his right foot kick the pylon. It's very clear that the pylon moves after the right foot kicks it. That's a touchdown.

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 12:41 PM
Man, the negativity on this MB is something else. I can't believe anyone in their right mind would honestly think the Superbowl was rigged. Just goes to show you how a losing season can influence your thinking process.
And no I'm not Dr Phil, but this is the silliest notion I've read here YET. Why do we even give any credence to these kind of posts anyway.:confused:

whiskeyrbl
02-06-2006, 12:42 PM
I too believe that,well maybe not fixed but that Pittsburgh was given some preferential calls.THe TD was tough because i don't believe there was enough to reverse the call.However the push off ,c'mon Irvin made a living doing the exact thing.And the holding call.I didn't see holding,neither did Madden.But Seattle is a small market team,and then you have the 'HISTORIC" Steeler franchise,and 80-90% Black& gold in the stands.I mean really do you think SI had a Seattle package of t-shirt,CD,and hat redy for comercial 5 minutes after the game?

SheTexan
02-06-2006, 12:44 PM
Man, the negativity on this MB is something else. I can't believe anyone in their right mind would honestly think the Superbowl was rigged. Just goes to show you how a losing season can influence your thinking process.
And no I'm not Dr Phil, but this is the silliest notion I've read here YET. Why do we even give any credence to these kind of posts anyway.:confused:

Obviously you did not watch the game!! The Hawks were done before they arrived in Detroit! JMO!! Very sad, but true!!

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 12:48 PM
Well obviously all this was done so Jerome B could go out in style. If that's the case than maybe he should run for President, cause with that much pull and influence, he'd be a shoe-in.:rolleyes:

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 12:50 PM
Obviously you did not watch the game!! The Hawks were done before they arrived in Detroit! JMO!! Very sad, but true!!

You honestly believe it was a pre-set game?!?

whiskeyrbl
02-06-2006, 12:50 PM
yea and to think Boxing is rigged?Or Wrestling is fake.C'mon people be realistic.IT's all about the $$$$$$$$$

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 12:52 PM
Wrestling's fake???

whiskeyrbl
02-06-2006, 12:56 PM
News to me too.But honestly you have to say the holding call was non-existant on aplay that put Seattle at the 1 1/2 yard line.Then the Irvin push off that reversed a TD.Don't remember to many other penalties maybe 5 more the whole game.And i believe they were illegal motions.

powerfuldragon
02-06-2006, 12:58 PM
Wrestling is fake.


why must you turn my thread in to a house of lies.

TheOgre
02-06-2006, 01:30 PM
I had money on Pittsburgh, and I am still outraged at the officiating in this game. Seattle was done in by the questionable officiating, the horrible play of their two kickers (Brown and Rouen), and the untimely drops by the receivers (including 3 early ones by "Big Mouth" Stevens). I actually think Hasselbeck had a good game, but was sabotaged by a combination of his teammates and the officials.

Kaiser Toro
02-06-2006, 01:45 PM
The flow of the game had Steelers written all over it. It was just a bad game, but that is the way the Steelers wanted it. Seattle was not good enough to overcome plays that did not go their way, plain and simple. If the coach is not man enough to shake the hand of his opponent after the game you can imagine how that team self destructed when adversity was smacking them in the face.

FirstTexansFan
02-06-2006, 02:11 PM
The officiating was horrible, but I chaulk it up to human error over a grand CON$spiracy.

The NFL has too much to lose to throw games. Their entire product rests on the fact that the public believes it it a legitimate product. Without that trust, pro football becomes a house of cards and would be no more valid than professional wrestling.

I agree with 99.999% of your postings, in this case I'm sorry to say I don't. The NFL had too much to lose yesterday if the Seahawks won the game. Based purely on merchandise sales. I've thought for years that teams like the Steelers, and the Cowboys get far too many calls in their favor. (Anyone remember that Mike Renfro catch in Three Rivers other than me? How about how many hits Earl Campbell took out of bounds, and no roughing call?) That was until I looked at the marketing side of the game. Fanbase for these teams far exceeds the rest of the teams in the NFL. Do you know how much money the NFL made yesterday by the Steelers (Oh the irony of a team name) winning this game? Yesterdays game cemented it for me, the fix is on, and the NFL is not interested in giving us that legitimate product we all deserve. If they were, they would have fulltime professional Referee's, instead of underpaid, easily influenced by outside prejudice, or even worse outside MOB money from bookies, high school teacher referees. They would have had a guy in the replay booth that had the HIGHEST turnover rate of calls on the field instead of the LOWEST percentage. Sad day for professional sports yesterday....the Steelers really deserved the win, but now it's a win that's tarnished.

BigBull17
02-06-2006, 02:18 PM
Whatever. His left foot was obviously in and I saw his right foot kick the pylon. It's very clear that the pylon moves after the right foot kicks it. That's a touchdown.

I didnt see it move at all. I watched closly to the replay and it look right to me.

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 02:33 PM
Yesterdays game cemented it for me, the fix is on, and the NFL is not interested in giving us that legitimate product we all deserve.

With that being said, then you might as well color VY an absolute first draft for the Texans. The NFL wouldn't have it any other way. He would turn this franchise into a money making avenue for the NFL. He's a hometown boy bringing in hometown fans with their hometown money just waiting to buy an illegitimate product.:rolleyes:
And I suppose all the owners and players are really good at keeping secrets for all these years.

Porky
02-06-2006, 02:44 PM
Yes, the officiting was terrible. As a whole, that was by far the worst officated set of playoff games I have ever seen. But a Steeler conspiracy? Come on people. You're smarter than that. What about the Jeramy Stevens catch and fumble that was somehow ruled an incomplete pass? That favored Seattle because Pitt would have had the ball on the TO. How does that fit in to your big conspiracy theory.

Kaiser Toro
02-06-2006, 02:53 PM
Hopefully Congress will demand hearings on the fix. :rolleyes:

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 03:01 PM
Perhaps so...Condy Rice was there so they can say the fix goes clean to the President. First the election...then the Iraq WMD's...then the final straw, the Superbowl.

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 03:03 PM
Hey Vinny, with all this crazy talk I suggest you take my name and use it for a new name for the Texan's MB. I already gave away an Avatar...might as well keep up the generosity.:)

swtbound07
02-06-2006, 03:18 PM
seriously....has there ever been ANY game without calls that are debatable? if the game was rigged, would the steelers have been unable to acquire a FIRST DOWN in an entire quarter? Darrell jackson pushed off in the end zone. he took his arm, he placed it on the defended, he extended it, and got seperation. if you dont want that called, dont do it in front of an official. Its in the rules. You live with the calls on the field. Seattle left a lot of points on the field-missed field goals, interceptions- that could have changed the tide of the game. The refs didnt do it, seattle did, and im sure they will tell you the same.

SheTexan
02-06-2006, 03:36 PM
..but the game wasn't rigged (that's just ridiculous).

Why is that ridiculous Vinny? Money talks in the world of sports. It's been going on for years, not just in football, but in every sport that brings in the big bucks. Do you really think all the power the BIG GUYS have in Vegas didn't play some kind of role in the outcome of that game yesterday? I truly want to know your opinion on this. CONVINCE ME PLEASE!! I would LOVE to feel good about plunking over thousands of bucks to renew my tickets, buy merchandise, kiss the butt of the NFL at every turn. I would love to end the season feeling good about the game of football, not depressed and confused as to whether the NFL is being honest or not. I went to bed last night wondering why in the hell I go through this every year. Sometimes I question my own sanity for putting up with this stuff year after year. I guess in the back of my mind, I don't want to believe they would FIX any game, or that a player would throw a game. I want to believe the TEXANS have as good of a chance of WINNING a SB as anyone else. After watching that game yesterday, I'm not sure about anything.

chuckm
02-06-2006, 03:53 PM
jeeeez if anything was rigged did you see that dying quail BenR threw to Herndon? That had "keep it close to the spread" written all over it .... but in all seriousness, there's no way any of these allegations are anything but message board fodder ...

Kaiser Toro
02-06-2006, 03:58 PM
One should not confuse lack of experience, nervousness, anxiety, blind spots due to position and bang bang calls with the game being fixed.

It was a bad closely played game that was witnessed by a hundred million dissatisfied fans. Ina nutshell it was not as fulfilling as the risotto.

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 03:59 PM
I think alot of Ben's problems came about due to the fact he was out hitting the parties the night before the game...according to Fox.

chuckm
02-06-2006, 04:07 PM
Ben played like a young QB and Hassleback like an old veteran. That's what I saw.

not quite sure what level of play equates to those descriptions but if by that you meant that BR played with energy but was inconsistent with flashes of brilliance and MH played well but had 2 or 3 very costly miscues, I'm with you

Texan Asylum
02-06-2006, 04:08 PM
I thought Seattle looked more composed in the beginning...but perhaps they were TOO composed.

gg no re
02-06-2006, 04:21 PM
Seattle lost because they didn't execute.

For starters, I believe Rouen punted from midfield about 50 times and he hit touchbacks all 50 times.

Huge
02-06-2006, 04:34 PM
Neither team deserved to win this game.

Pittsburgh because they had a ton of calls handed to them:
It wasn't offensive pass interference
Roethlisberger did not make it into the endzone
It wasn't holding when Seattle should've had 1st and goal at the 1
Hasselbeck did not block the blocker below the waist...he made a tackle
Roethlisberger did not call time-out before the play clock expired...should've been 3rd and 11

Seattle because they continued to shoot themselves in the foot:
Two missed FGs (they were long FG's but still...)
Incredibly stupid clock managment at the ends of the 1st half and game
Dropped passes...mainly Jerramy Stevens
Dumb mistakes (legitimate penalties...like Alexander's false start after one of Stevens' drops)
Simply didn't make the plays when it mattered.

Terrible game to watch. Copies should be sold as cures for insomnia.

HoustonFrog
02-06-2006, 04:46 PM
Along with the other calls that bothered me there was one more I just remembered that bothered me. Right after the bad holding call I believe it was first down still. Didn't they then go run, sack, interception. Well on the run by Alexander it was a textbook horsecollar call. Right by the back of the neck and no flag. If you are going to put in these new rules, use them. Didn't cost them the game but just another example.

Farough
02-06-2006, 05:30 PM
Neither team deserved to win this game.

Pittsburgh because they had a ton of calls handed to them:
It wasn't offensive pass interference
Roethlisberger did not make it into the endzone
It wasn't holding when Seattle should've had 1st and goal at the 1
Hasselbeck did not block the blocker below the waist...he made a tackle
Roethlisberger did not call time-out before the play clock expired...should've been 3rd and 11

Seattle because they continued to shoot themselves in the foot:
Two missed FGs (they were long FG's but still...)
Incredibly stupid clock managment at the ends of the 1st half and game
Dropped passes...mainly Jerramy Stevens
Dumb mistakes (legitimate penalties...like Alexander's false start after one of Stevens' drops)
Simply didn't make the plays when it mattered.

Terrible game to watch. Copies should be sold as cures for insomnia.

The one ref made the call on the field about the Ben TD.... and you had no way in hell on reversing that on the replay, because you need INDISPUTABLE EVIDENCE, which there wasnt. You cant overturn that after its called

powerfuldragon
02-06-2006, 06:15 PM
then he shouldn't call false TD's.

powerfuldragon
02-06-2006, 06:18 PM
Perhaps so...Condy Rice was there so they can say the fix goes clean to the President. First the election...then the Iraq WMD's...then the final straw, the Superbowl.


she was actually there as a show of confidence for the tight security.

Kaiser Toro
02-06-2006, 06:18 PM
then he shouldn't call false TD's.

What signal does the referee make when he calls a false TD? :)

powerfuldragon
02-06-2006, 06:20 PM
give the other team the one fingered salute.

TheOgre
02-06-2006, 06:24 PM
What about the Jeramy Stevens catch and fumble that was somehow ruled an incomplete pass? That favored Seattle because Pitt would have had the ball on the TO. How does that fit in to your big conspiracy theory.

Actually it would have been tight. That ball was headed for the sideline. I think it was 50/50 at best whether he would have gotten there before it went OOB's.

TheOgre
02-06-2006, 06:26 PM
For starters, I believe Rouen punted from midfield about 50 times and he hit touchbacks all 50 times.

Tom Rouen was Pittsburgh's MVP. No doubt about it.

Samer
02-06-2006, 06:37 PM
The Officiating was horrible the whole game, and the whole playoffs, but hey the refs do make mistakes, and in a game like this, they do get excited like the players do

Huge
02-06-2006, 08:06 PM
The one ref made the call on the field about the Ben TD.... and you had no way in hell on reversing that on the replay, because you need INDISPUTABLE EVIDENCE, which there wasnt. You cant overturn that after its called
Yeah, the one ref that made the call on the field was going to initially signal 4th down (see ref running to the spot with a clinched fist)...then changed it to a TD when he saw Ben laying the ball across the line after he was already down.

Now had the ref called him down (correctly), do you think there would've been evidence to overturn that call?

Didn't think so.

FirstTexansFan
02-06-2006, 08:34 PM
With that being said, then you might as well color VY an absolute first draft for the Texans. The NFL wouldn't have it any other way. He would turn this franchise into a money making avenue for the NFL. He's a hometown boy bringing in hometown fans with their hometown money just waiting to buy an illegitimate product.:rolleyes:
And I suppose all the owners and players are really good at keeping secrets for all these years.

Worst analogy ever, but nice try :) Address the points of the post, VY plugs have other places on the board LOL

Boxscore
02-06-2006, 09:02 PM
I have scanned through this long string and I don't see anyone mention the Hinz Ward dropped TD pass. That would make the game 27 - 24 if Seattle would have kicked two indoor field goals and also credited for the disallowed push off touchdown. That scenario would have also given the gamblers who took the Seahawks and the points the win. No wonder there is so much grumbling!

TheOgre
02-06-2006, 09:04 PM
I actually think they made the right call on Ben's run. When they froze the shot with him holding the ball over the line (about 1 to 2 inches) it seemed pretty clear to me. That said, there were so many other HORRIBLE (not even borderline) calls in this game, I feel like I just wasted a day watching a wrestling match (pre-determined). I'm almost positive that this game wasn't rigged, but it has actually seemed like a possibility after this postseason. I feel cheated as a fan and I actually had money on Pittsburgh.

Grid
02-06-2006, 09:17 PM
He "scores a touchdown that even Ed Hochuli (sp?) would have called down at the 1 inch line.

I watched that replay again in slow motion... the tip of the ball passed the line. Even if it didnt quite pass the line..it was close enough to be called inconclusive.. in which case the call on the field stands.

The Steelers didnt win the game on Big Ben's shoulders.. they won it by their defense.. which even though they didnt get great pressure on Hasselbeck.. their secondary was either AMAZING in pass coverage..or the seattle receivers couldnt figure out how to get open..or hasselbeck just wouldnt take a chance throwing the ball.

Whatever the case..Seattle lost because they didnt take advantage of their chances to make plays, and as a result..the Steelers defense held them to 10 points. The steelers offense on the other hand had just a few big plays..but it was enough to score 21 points.

SO.. yah..it was pretty fair I thought. Only play I saw that could have changed the game was the offensive pass interferance call on the Seattle touchdown early in the game. I thought it should have been a TD..but even that is questionable..there was a little push..I just didnt think it was enough to penalize.

gwallaia
02-06-2006, 09:56 PM
What signal does the referee make when he calls a false TD? :)

If you noticed, the line judge who finally made the call did not signal touchdown until after Rostlesberger picked the ball up and placed it across the goal line while he was lying on his stomach. The ref was running along the goal line with his arms down towards Rostleberger seemingly consfused and unsure, (that's the signal for a false TD perhaps). In my opinion, it was not a touchdown. But, with that said, I think Pittsburgh would have gone for it on 4th and 1 inch and would have scored anyway.

I totally forgot about Rostleberger calling time-out with zero on the play clock. The Steelers got all the calls yesterday. But oh well, at least I did not have any money on the game so its no skin off my nose.

gwallaia
02-06-2006, 10:07 PM
Here's a couple of interesting links regarding the officiating.

http://davesfootballblog.com/ (scroll down to the part about the bad calls raining down)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/columns/story?columnist=smith_michael&id=2320683

Huge
02-06-2006, 10:13 PM
In my opinion, it was not a touchdown. But, with that said, I think Pittsburgh would have gone for it on 4th and 1 inch and would have scored anyway.
The problem I have with that is if they were going to score anyway, why not score when it was 1st and goal from the 3 or 2nd and goal from the 1?

If it's such a given, shouldn't they have scored before the controversy?

And in that situation (behind by 3, mid-way through the 2nd), does Cowher go for it after getting stumped 3 plays in a row or does he kick the FG instead to tie the game?

gwallaia
02-06-2006, 10:18 PM
Here's another link about the officials. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=bayless/060205

Point duly taken Huge. But with 4th and inch, I believe Cowher would have Big Ben just stick it across.

gwallaia
02-06-2006, 10:23 PM
Here's some more, I've never seen this many stories about the officials after a game.

http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/sportsnation/polling?event_id=2011

http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/sportsnation/story?page=thepulse

jerek
02-06-2006, 10:38 PM
The officiating was horrible, but I chaulk it up to human error over a grand CON$spiracy.

The NFL has too much to lose to throw games. Their entire product rests on the fact that the public believes it it a legitimate product. Without that trust, pro football becomes a house of cards and would be no more valid than professional wrestling.

I second this opinion. The NFL has too much to lose to fix games. I am not saying that it is impossible that we wouldn't know about it, only that it is very unlikely, and it would redefine the league were it leaked out that some or all of the games were actually fixed.

Still, it was bad. No way Roethlisberger crossed any part of the line, and Darrell Jackson's PI was about as incidental as contact gets. Whether or not the refs were pulling for the Steelers or all of their bad calls just happened to fall in their favor, it was bad, and it cost Seattle most of their chance at the win.

Edit: As Vinny and others have pointed out, sure, the NFL is about money, but it would take a lot to keep a conspiracy of this order hidden, and all it takes is one greedy buffoon to blow the lid on the entire show. No way.

DFAN
02-06-2006, 11:03 PM
I actually think they made the right call on Ben's run. When they froze the shot with him holding the ball over the line (about 1 to 2 inches) it seemed pretty clear to me. That said, there were so many other HORRIBLE (not even borderline) calls in this game, I feel like I just wasted a day watching a wrestling match (pre-determined). I'm almost positive that this game wasn't rigged, but it has actually seemed like a possibility after this postseason. I feel cheated as a fan and I actually had money on Pittsburgh.


I can see someone saying that it wasnt conclusive enough to over turn although I disagree. I cant see or havent seen anyone say that it was clearly a TD.

No way it was clearly a TD. I have no idea what you saw.

TheOgre
02-06-2006, 11:05 PM
It really comes down to this. Why continue to let these CEO's officiate games when we could have full-time, professional referees? It just seems to me that you spend so much on every aspect of your product, why get cheap when it comes to the rule enforcers (refs)?

Shamrock
02-06-2006, 11:05 PM
Whatever. His left foot was obviously in and I saw his right foot kick the pylon. It's very clear that the pylon moves after the right foot kicks it. That's a touchdown.
Huh?

The WR never established possession with both feet down in the field of play or the end zone. Kicking the pylon does not count towards establishing possession. If the WR had both feet down then hit the pylon, then yes, it would be a TD.

Adding this play to the "conspiracy" theory only proves people are reaching to build a conclusion to their hypothesis.

There was only one bad ref call against Seattle, and that was the low block on Hasselbeck after the INT. Call it even though, as Seattle got away with a block in the back (against Roethlisberger) that wasn't called on their 76 yard INT return.

disaacks3
02-06-2006, 11:30 PM
1) D. Jackson's TD that was overturned was ticky tack and should have not have been called. His arm was already extended when he barely touched him. They were both fighting for position. That is 7 points.

He clearly CHANGED DIRECTION as a direct result of that contact. It's also against the rules. As to the REALLY bad argument that Irvin used to get away with it...he's a BIG reason the rule exists today.

2) Rothlisberger--some said they saw the tip on the dive hit the line..I didn't see anything close. They might have gotten in on 4th down but who knows.

Two parts, It was REALLY close no matter how you look at it. In that case, you can't overturn it. Secondly (as mentioned) there was always 4th down to try again.

3) Two holding calls on punt returns that the announcers could not find

At least one of them was clearly visible, but was quite a bit BEHIND the play; that makes it a stupid penalty(on the Seahawks player), not a conspiracy.

4) (The biggest series and group of bad calls). Hassle hits the TE to the 1. Holding brings it back. Both Michaels and Madden said it was horrible and if you watch the play again Pitt was offside. So instead of having it first and goal at the 1 you have it 2nd and long and you get a sack. Third down interception followed by a BS penalty for blocking below the waist on the the tackle. This leads directly to a the Steeler TD from Randal El/

The holding wasn't nearly as questionable at full speed and it's simply NOT a reversible call. I WILL grant BS on the "blocking" call on Hasselbeck, though it was after the pick, and didn't affect change-of-possession.

5) The second D Jack TD before half. This one is a little more controversial but I couldn't believe they didn't at least replay it. If you watch it again it looks like his one foot is down and the other hits the pylon..TD.

He very CLEARLY had one foot down and the other one was OUT. Even if the foot hit the pylon, it wouldn't be a TD. He has to have a LEGAL catch FIRST. If he fails to establish the catch, he CAN'T have a TD. This is NO different than a corner Endzone route where the receiver gets one foot down and the second hits a pylon on it's way out of bounds...NEITHER is a catch.

Not picking on you HF, you just had 'em all lumped together the cleanest...for which I give thanks.

If it was a conspiracy, there certainly were easier ways to accomplish it than this fiasco. MY beefs are mainly on officials taking too long to MAKE the call. This happened on the Seattle TD called back for the push off only AFTER the Pitt player complained...the play was OVER before the flag came out. The call was still legitimate, but poorly executed. The same is true on the BigBen TD...I still think the right call was made, but waiting until after Ben was down and had moved the ball BACK ACROSS the line makes it appear much MORE questionable.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
02-07-2006, 03:10 AM
http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/1850/stealer4vo.jpg


:heh:

FirstTexansFan
02-07-2006, 03:25 AM
ROFL! Good one man, best posting on the topic yet! :redtowel:

BigBull17
02-07-2006, 10:10 AM
Huh?

The WR never established possession with both feet down in the field of play or the end zone. Kicking the pylon does not count towards establishing possession. If the WR had both feet down then hit the pylon, then yes, it would be a TD.

Adding this play to the "conspiracy" theory only proves people are reaching to build a conclusion to their hypothesis.

There was only one bad ref call against Seattle, and that was the low block on Hasselbeck after the INT. Call it even though, as Seattle got away with a block in the back (against Roethlisberger) that wasn't called on their 76 yard INT return.

Kicking the pylon does establish possesion because the pylon is part of the field and is in play, however it didnt look like he touched it. And if Big Ben turns his back into the blocker, which he did, its not a block in the back.

Jack Bauer
02-07-2006, 10:20 AM
I watched that replay again in slow motion... the tip of the ball passed the line. Even if it didnt quite pass the line..it was close enough to be called inconclusive.. in which case the call on the field stands.

You couldn't see the tip of the ball because it was behind Ben's arm. As was stated previously, if the ref had stuck with his original call instead of changing it after Ben crossed the goal line (after being down), the play would have resulted in a 4th down at the one inch line. Now we all know what can happen with a rush at the goal line (see Steelers/Colts).

Jack Bauer
02-07-2006, 10:21 AM
I didnt see it move at all. I watched closly to the replay and it look right to me.

HUH? I went back to the play and the pylon is totally knock out of the ground. Now it seemed to me that his left foot knocked it out, but to say it didn't move at all??? :confused:

Scooter
02-07-2006, 10:53 AM
the only incredibly bad call i saw was the low block penalty on hasselbeck. other than that, they're all arguable.

roethlisberger's td run looked to me to be in. the fault here is the sideline ref running in making 2 calls. what happpens in most cases is that ref will run in and not make the call until he's sure (or atleast has made up his mind on the guess), which is what he should've done here.

the offensive pass interference is a good call. yes, it is a ticky tak foul, but it is a foul and the key is that it happened 2 feet infront of the ref. he didnt call this one late, watch him again, he went to throw the flag the first time and missed getting it out of his pocket.

there were 2 big holding calls and they looked about the same to me. the RT DOES have one hand inside the pads, but his body and the other hand is behind the defender and the RT rides him into the ground.

they got hasselbeck's fumble corrected, and it must've been dang near impossible to see farrior's fingertips touching in full speed. i'm not putting fault on this one because they would've let the play go and wait for the other team to challenge 9 out of 10 times.

there are a couple calls that seem to be missing in these arguements though that stand out to me. there were 2 catch & fumbles that would've gone to the steelers. one in the first quarter (stevens i think) where he catches, turns, makes his move and chris hope unloads on him. the second one i want to say was in the 3rd quarter but i was getting a little tipsy at that point and things are a bit foggy.


either way, i think everybody looked bad. the steelers had no offense & couldnt generate a pass rush. seattle couldnt stop the big play on defense & went to a pass only offense (with WAY too many drops), and the refs were questionable again (which seems to be the theme of this season ... worst officiating ever).

BigBull17
02-07-2006, 11:02 AM
HUH? I went back to the play and the pylon is totally knock out of the ground. Now it seemed to me that his left foot knocked it out, but to say it didn't move at all??? :confused:

I dont remember it moving on the replay. But that was 2 days ago and we had to drink every time the comentators said somthing stupid. John Madden, need I say more.

Texan Asylum
02-07-2006, 11:35 AM
Worst analogy ever, but nice try :) Address the points of the post I believe I addressed the context of the entire post in those few sentences. This would be a conspiracy to rival the JFK conspiracy in scope and size. I cannot fathum the possibility that anyone could suspect there was any kind of conspiracy going on. Just another BORING SB except for a few spots. And by the way...I would challenge you to find ONE post where I would be considered a PLUGGER for anything or anybody other than what's best for the team...and I'm open to anything that would turn around a 2-14 record. VY, or RB for that matter, might walk on water in some peoples eyes, but in my eyes they might be able to IF the water is frozen...and I don't believe football is the sport with THAT particular type of playing field. And for the record...that blue face with the rolling eyes ( :rolleyes: ) that I put on the post, it's a smiley for sarcasm. :)

Shamrock
02-07-2006, 11:38 AM
Kicking the pylon does establish possesion because the pylon is part of the field and is in play, however it didnt look like he touched it. And if Big Ben turns his back into the blocker, which he did, its not a block in the back.
It does not.

Kicking the pylon would only count towards a TD if possession is already established. A player still must get both feet (or one shoulder, knee, etc) down to establish possession.

sportschick215
02-07-2006, 12:08 PM
hahaha, that is great!! that was a very iffy call, i doubt it would have held up in regular season... the refs are only part time, they need committed full time refs to work these big games!!!! even in the college bowls the refs were awful!
But if you were drinking to celebrating, or drinking to drown your tears, or just up late debating the game... have you ever seriously thought about how cool it would be to have the monday after be a national holiday?
i mean, come on, 1.4 million people call out on the monday after the BIG GAME! check out www.savedaday.com <-- they are trying to petition to have the day after be a national holiday!!! SWEEEEET

FirstTexansFan
02-07-2006, 01:59 PM
I believe I addressed the context of the entire post in those few sentences. This would be a conspiracy to rival the JFK conspiracy in scope and size. I cannot fathum the possibility that anyone could suspect there was any kind of conspiracy going on. Just another BORING SB except for a few spots. And by the way...I would challenge you to find ONE post where I would be considered a PLUGGER for anything or anybody other than what's best for the team...and I'm open to anything that would turn around a 2-14 record. VY, or RB for that matter, might walk on water in some peoples eyes, but in my eyes they might be able to IF the water is frozen...and I don't believe football is the sport with THAT particular type of playing field. And for the record...that blue face with the rolling eyes ( :rolleyes: ) that I put on the post, it's a smiley for sarcasm. :)

I know you're correct, there have never been any conspiracies in Utopia. I'm sure soon we'll find those WMD's in Iraq too. And that whole Monica/Bill thing, no coverup at all. Oh, that's politics ya say, this is real life, sports have always been on the up and up. So sayeth Pete Rose, or those Black Sox back early in the 20th century. You're right, I must say in your utopia, there is no way this could happen. Thanks for enlightening me with your sarcasm :)

Texan Asylum
02-07-2006, 02:13 PM
I know you're correct, there have never been any conspiracies in Utopia.
I, for one, DO believe in alot of conspiracies. But one in sports isn't one I have even considered worth exercising a brain cell over. Is it a business...yes and lots of decisions on players and personel are based on the business aspect and not the sportsmanship side of it. Ask a coach to try a different gameplan to achieve a more apreciated outcome...sure, I'de buy into that as going along with the business line of thought. But to try to pull off something as monumental as running a fixed game such as the Superbowl in todays day and age...I find that hard to believe. I might have been raised in a cave for all I know but that still would be hard to pull off IMHO. And as for the WMD's, I believe Saddam is as shocked as everyone else is that they aren't accounted for either. And if he isn't, I'de be looking to Syria for the trail. IMO

FirstTexansFan
02-07-2006, 05:05 PM
Ok, I give, you win...finally a good analogy out of ya <grin> And for the record, I agree with 90% of your postings :)

FILO_girl
02-07-2006, 05:55 PM
Neither team deserved to win this game.

Pittsburgh because they had a ton of calls handed to them:
It wasn't offensive pass interference
Roethlisberger did not make it into the endzone
It wasn't holding when Seattle should've had 1st and goal at the 1
Hasselbeck did not block the blocker below the waist...he made a tackle
Roethlisberger did not call time-out before the play clock expired...should've been 3rd and 11

Seattle because they continued to shoot themselves in the foot:
Two missed FGs (they were long FG's but still...)
Incredibly stupid clock managment at the ends of the 1st half and game
Dropped passes...mainly Jerramy Stevens
Dumb mistakes (legitimate penalties...like Alexander's false start after one of Stevens' drops)
Simply didn't make the plays when it mattered.

Terrible game to watch. Copies should be sold as cures for insomnia.

Excellent post! It all boils down to this: The Steelers brought their A game, Seattle didn't. I was all for the Seahawks, but they were outplayed.

Case closed. :)

Jack Bauer
02-07-2006, 06:17 PM
The Steelers brought their A game

They did? I thought both teams played poorly. Pittsburgh did just enough (three plays) to win the game. And we all know Herm says this is why we play.

SESupergenius
02-07-2006, 06:41 PM
The Steelers won because the officials saw that Roethlisberger was white. MMmm hmmmmm.

powerfuldragon
02-07-2006, 07:42 PM
The Steelers won because the officials saw that Roethlisberger was white. MMmm hmmmmm.


OMFG truth.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
02-07-2006, 08:10 PM
http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/9396/asteriskbowlxl0dn.jpg

:whistle:

gg no re
02-07-2006, 08:48 PM
The Steelers won because the officials saw that Roethlisberger was white.I disagree strongly. I say the game was decided because the officials were prejudiced against QBs with receding hairlines. Possibly due to a disastrous experience with Trent Dilfer.

On another note, conspiracy theorists should take note of the fact that I called for the game to be decided before kickoff. :)

TD
02-07-2006, 08:53 PM
The Steelers brought their A game, Seattle didn't. I was all for the Seahawks

Grading on a bit of curve aren't we? :)

Both teams clearly played poorly. The only real difference outside the refs was the coaching.

Cowher's timely play calling and Holmgren's horrendous clock management were the real difference makers.

cuppacoffee
02-07-2006, 11:09 PM
My barbers daughter has a good friend whos uncle was one of the camera operators at the superbowl. One of the camera operators best friends said he heard the camera operator tell his bartender that two of the refs were talking to each other about the super bowl coin toss. When Seattle won the toss one of the refs remarked to the other that the Seahawks wouldn't win another call all day. :challenge

Makes sense to me...:wacko:

Anybody in their right mind should understand that Tags would rather hand over the :trophy: to Mr "longtime NFL football family" Rooney than to hand it to Mr "newcomer" Paul Allen.

:jk: ( I think? )

powerfuldragon
02-08-2006, 10:38 AM
well, i know a guy who knows a girl who's dating a guy who says he was the dude who paid off the seahawks.

BigBull17
02-08-2006, 10:53 AM
Well my friends cousins boyfriends bothers fiances' mothers uncle on her dads side said the NFL assassinated Kennedy because he used the CIA to discover that the Superbowl was rigged.

Texan Asylum
02-08-2006, 11:32 AM
I've got it from a dang good source that the ENTIRE Seahawks organization was behind the loss. They apparently threw the game cause they didn't want to be joked about cause they beat a measly # 6 seeded team going into the playoffs.:whistle:

powerfuldragon
02-08-2006, 12:46 PM
i heard that jesus himself told the seahawks if they threw the game, he'd give them magical applesauce.

Huge
02-08-2006, 01:18 PM
Excellent post! It all boils down to this: The Steelers brought their A game, Seattle didn't. I was all for the Seahawks, but they were outplayed.

Case closed. :)
If the Steelers brought their "A game", would it be too much to expect at least a first down before the 2nd quarter?

They stunk it up as well.

SESupergenius
02-08-2006, 05:30 PM
Ya, make no mistake about it, the QB did not "lead" them to a Super Bowl victory.