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View Full Version : Rebuffed by Cardinals, Texans keep searching


Kaiser Toro
01-27-2006, 04:13 AM
great news :yahoo:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3616539.html

The Arizona Cardinals denied permission Thursday for the Texans to interview linebackers coach Frank Bush to become the team's co-defensive coordinator.

Two of the NFL's most respected defensive coordinators, Jerry Gray (Buffalo) and Jim Bates (Green Bay), are still available.

Jack Bauer
01-27-2006, 05:11 AM
great news :yahoo:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3616539.html

The Arizona Cardinals denied permission Thursday for the Texans to interview linebackers coach Frank Bush to become the team's co-defensive coordinator.

Two of the NFL's most respected defensive coordinators, Jerry Gray (Buffalo) and Jim Bates (Green Bay), are still available.

I'm not going to rejoice over Kubiak NOT being able to get the guys he wants.

TexansCM
01-27-2006, 07:48 AM
Many fans want the big name coordinators such as Gray, Bates and Sherman. What happens when the Texans, bottom of the league in many categories, start playing well under these guys. We will be looking for new coordinators in 1-3 years when the big names look for a head coaching gig.

swisher
01-27-2006, 07:55 AM
Many fans want the big name coordinators such as Gray, Bates and Sherman. What happens when the Texans, bottom of the league in many categories, start playing well under these guys. We will be looking for new coordinators in 1-3 years when the big names look for a head coaching gig.


And that's a bad thing?

LCOOL
01-27-2006, 07:56 AM
And that's a bad thing?
What about Mike Tice?

Kaiser Toro
01-27-2006, 08:47 AM
I want to see Mike Sherman in here, that would be big.

Double dog ditto.

Runner
01-27-2006, 08:47 AM
Many fans want the big name coordinators such as Gray, Bates and Sherman. What happens when the Texans, bottom of the league in many categories, start playing well under these guys. We will be looking for new coordinators in 1-3 years when the big names look for a head coaching gig.

And that's a bad thing?

It seems all silver clouds have a dark lining.

Porky
01-27-2006, 08:55 AM
Many fans want the big name coordinators such as Gray, Bates and Sherman. What happens when the Texans, bottom of the league in many categories, start playing well under these guys. We will be looking for new coordinators in 1-3 years when the big names look for a head coaching gig.

Ya, you're right. It's much better to have lousy assistants so the Texans will be bad and nobody will want to hire them. That sounds like a plan. :redtowel:

edo783
01-27-2006, 09:08 AM
I have concerns with bringing in a HC that was fired. Could have attitute problems (not real likely), could work internally to undermine the new coach so they can ride in to the resque (See pendry with Palmer), may not be willing to follow the plan etc. Also, there are likely problems bring in a guy who tried out for you position and you now ask him to work for you. All issues that can come into the fray. I like the idea that Kubes is bring in a younger set of coaches. I think they will relate well with the young players and they will be aggresive and players would much rather play aggressively rather than the passive crud we have been playing, so that would bring up enthusiasim (something that went south on us IMO). Saying all that, there is a LOT to be said for having a couple of guys with top level experience to help guide the young coaches to develope into HC type material. I think Sherman is a guy that could work in that kind of inviroment, not sure how Bates and Grey would feel about it.

Honoring Earl 34
01-27-2006, 09:27 AM
:redtowel: It seems Kubiak had his own ideas about a duel DC position , it just did'nt work out . As long as Gray or Bates don't feel snubbed then we should get one of them .

I've heard the Texans were really impressed with Gray as a head coaching canidate , so maybe he likes things here also . If not then get Bates . If you can't get Bates or Gray then what ?

When Bum was the Coach of the Oilers , he assembled the best coaching staff Houston's ever scene . Three coaches off the top of my head went on to be HCs ( Joe Bugel , Ritchie Pettibone , Wade Phillips ) .

bigTEXan8
01-27-2006, 09:44 AM
I have concerns with bringing in a HC that was fired. Could have attitute problems (not real likely), could work internally to undermine the new coach so they can ride in to the resque (See pendry with Palmer), may not be willing to follow the plan etc. Also, there are likely problems bring in a guy who tried out for you position and you now ask him to work for you. All issues that can come into the fray. I like the idea that Kubes is bring in a younger set of coaches. I think they will relate well with the young players and they will be aggresive and players would much rather play aggressively rather than the passive crud we have been playing, so that would bring up enthusiasim (something that went south on us IMO). Saying all that, there is a LOT to be said for having a couple of guys with top level experience to help guide the young coaches to develope into HC type material. I think Sherman is a guy that could work in that kind of inviroment, not sure how Bates and Grey would feel about it.

Someone like Sherman got screwed out of GB. Because Brett Favre couldn't stop throwing INTs, Sherman got shafted. I think Sherman could be great for this team.

FILO_girl
01-27-2006, 10:05 AM
I want to see Mike Sherman in here, that would be big.

Oh heck yea! Anyone heard anything else on Sherman coming here?:yahoo:

Glacier
01-27-2006, 10:32 AM
im not a big fan of bringing in the star powered coordinators.

you want to build a team that will have consistency and continuity.

if your coordinators are the flavor of the month, other teams will just pick them off in a year or two.

better to have 1 head honcho calling the shots (kubiak) and a few younger or under appreciated guys here doing his will and working FOR him, rather than guys who have their own agendas and are out in a year or two for another coaching job.

Grid
01-27-2006, 11:11 AM
Normally I would agree Glacier but the DC position for us is a different circumstance imo.

We need someone who can fix and run this defense.. pretty much by himself. Kubiak is an offensive guru..I trust him completely with the offense but when it comes to defense, id rather he didnt mess with it TOO much.

For that reason.. I want an experienced and accomplished coach at DC.

TheOgre
01-27-2006, 11:17 AM
Can you imagine Mike Sherman and Jerry Gray on our staff? That would be great.

edo783
01-27-2006, 11:26 AM
Can you imagine Mike Sherman and Jerry Gray on our staff? That would be great.

That would be very PREMO indeed.

Grid
01-27-2006, 11:31 AM
I dont really think we need Sherman. Personally..I want Kubiak running his offense.. not someone else running it, or changing it.

Kaiser Toro
01-27-2006, 11:38 AM
I dont really think we need Sherman. Personally..I want Kubiak running his offense.. not someone else running it, or changing it.

Yes but if Sherman comes in as Assistant HC, with a focus on the Oline, this well help in that synergy between the QB and Oline that is desperately needed. Audibles have always been a a challenge for us.

tulexan
01-27-2006, 11:40 AM
Audibles? Didn't we only have 1?

Kaiser Toro
01-27-2006, 11:41 AM
Audibles? Didn't we only have 1?

Precisely.

Malloy
01-27-2006, 11:45 AM
Audibles? Didn't we only have 1?


aka THE audible :)

bigTEXan8
01-27-2006, 11:57 AM
aka THE audible :)

Wait, was it "run left" or "run right". I can never remember.

tulexan
01-27-2006, 12:04 PM
Run Left. I thought it was funny how when Carr would audible, you would actually see defenders pointing that they are going to run to the left.

TexansCM
01-27-2006, 12:28 PM
Ya, you're right. It's much better to have lousy assistants so the Texans will be bad and nobody will want to hire them. That sounds like a plan. :redtowel:

I believe I was misunderstood. I would love to have Sherman, Bates or Gray, but the Texans are more than likely not going to the SuperBowl next year. Improvement with good coaches is great, but changing a defensive system every 2 years is not the best plan. Look at Denver for example. When Shanahan hired Kubiak, he was an up and coming coach, not a coach on everyones list when there is a head coaching vacancy.

SBTexans08
01-27-2006, 12:56 PM
im not a big fan of bringing in the star powered coordinators.

you want to build a team that will have consistency and continuity.

if your coordinators are the flavor of the month, other teams will just pick them off in a year or two.

With this logic....then you don't want the best players in the draft cause if you do get the best picks....then they'll translate into high dollar players because of their play and eventually....if all your players are that good....you'll eventually have to get rid of some.


Listen....the point is to have a staff and team that can win. If they are the flavor....then so be it. You win....that's ultimately the goal. Who isn't trying to win? Everyone is....so bringing in coordinators that will eventually get HC jobs is fine....bring the winning here to Houston. :ok:

4Texans
01-27-2006, 01:03 PM
I'm still pulling for Gray to get the job. I've admired him since he played at UT and with the Oilers. Even back then everyone was saying what a fine coach he would be some day. I don't care is he is the flavor of the month. I think he would be a great shot in the arm for our defence, and do wonders for the young DB's we have.

Hervoyel
01-27-2006, 01:08 PM
Ya, you're right. It's much better to have lousy assistants so the Texans will be bad and nobody will want to hire them. That sounds like a plan. :redtowel:


I thought we already tried that plan. It didn't work out too well.

4Texans
01-27-2006, 01:29 PM
I thought we already tried that plan. It didn't work out too well.

Good one!!!!!:thumbup

Jack Bauer
01-27-2006, 01:52 PM
I don't think those in favor of the lesser known coaches are getting their point across. What I am hearing is that they would rather bring in a coach who is going to do a great job, but is younger and a little less experienced than the coaches who are probably one off-season away from HC. This is going to be at LEAST a 2 year project and replacing a coordinator after year 1 is going to set us back. The younger, relatively unknown coaches could be just as good or better than the well known coaches still available. If Kubiak thinks they could be better, why not give him the opportunity to select his own guy?

Just a thought. I would be happy with Bates or Gray myself, but I am not opposed to a relative unknown if Kubiak has the confidence in him.

dtran04
01-27-2006, 02:00 PM
Ask this question: IF you were Gray, would you come work for someone that beat you for the same job you wanted? I think the only way it can happen is if it is a last resort for him.

Glacier
01-27-2006, 02:16 PM
With this logic....then you don't want the best players in the draft cause if you do get the best picks....then they'll translate into high dollar players because of their play and eventually....if all your players are that good....you'll eventually have to get rid of some.


Listen....the point is to have a staff and team that can win. If they are the flavor....then so be it. You win....that's ultimately the goal. Who isn't trying to win? Everyone is....so bringing in coordinators that will eventually get HC jobs is fine....bring the winning here to Houston. :ok:


no with this logic, i am saying that Kubiak needs to coach his coaches to do what he wants them to do like Bilichick, Parcells do and Jimmy Johnson did. Too many cocks in the roost=lack of singular direction.

Who better to tell a defensive coordinator how your defense will be attacked than an offensive guru? I would hope that by the time a guy gets a shot at being a head coach, he has a complete understanding of the game, as I believe, Kubiak has. All I'm saying is, just because a coordinator is highly hyped doesn't mean he is the best choice for the franchise, which, is what I want to see....an awesome coaching staff empowering players and putting them in a position to be successful, not a bunch of hired guns who will be out next year when the next batch of head coaches gets fired.

michaelm
01-27-2006, 05:20 PM
im not a big fan of bringing in the star powered coordinators.

you want to build a team that will have consistency and continuity.

if your coordinators are the flavor of the month, other teams will just pick them off in a year or two.

better to have 1 head honcho calling the shots (kubiak) and a few younger or under appreciated guys here doing his will and working FOR him, rather than guys who have their own agendas and are out in a year or two for another coaching job.

My own slant on this is why not bring in the star powered guys and try and put your younger/under appreciated guys under them so they can learn from them? Then, when your bigger name guys bolt for new jobs, you still have your younger guys, but hopefully they are better and more experienced now...

A Texan
01-28-2006, 12:07 AM
Kubiak's inability to hire Bush presents a problem for him since as far as I know all the other coaches he has hired or tried to hire are white. Not having any black coaches of course would of course be frowned upon by the black players as well as the black community. Why doesn't he hire Gray? Well, head coaches whether at the high school, college, or pro level tend to hire coaches that they have worked with before, that they know they will be comfortable with. As far as I know Kubiak has never worked with Gray before.

HardKnockTexan
01-28-2006, 12:14 AM
Having big name coordinators is great. The more attention my Texans get the better but Kubiak not getting the staff in here that he wants most definentally hurts more than helps.

HardKnockTexan
01-28-2006, 12:17 AM
Hearing a couple of players give interviews, most seem to be on the same train of thought when it comes to the minority coaches; Yes, there should be more minorities coaching but winning is what matters most and the color of the coaches skin doesnt make him play either stronger or weaker for that coach.

As a white male I might not be seeing the whole picture but from what a gathered from a few different interviews most players just want to play and win. Personally, I could care less what color anyone on my team is just as long as they get us to the superbowl someday soon.

LBblitz
01-28-2006, 02:09 AM
Hearing a couple of players give interviews, most seem to be on the same train of thought when it comes to the minority coaches; Yes, there should be more minorities coaching but winning is what matters most and the color of the coaches skin doesnt make him play either stronger or weaker for that coach.

As a white male I might not be seeing the whole picture but from what a gathered from a few different interviews most players just want to play and win. Personally, I could care less what color anyone on my team is just as long as they get us to the superbowl someday soon.
I agree completely. I just dont understand why anything and everything can be related to racism. I could care less if all the players/coaches are the same race or each one has a different ethnic background, it is not gonna keep me from cheering the texans on. I am not saying to hire just one race, Im saying just hire winners.

cuppacoffee
01-28-2006, 08:52 AM
I thought we already tried that plan. It didn't work out too well.

You gotta be kidding? It got us the #1 pick in the draft again. :rolleyes:

Bobo
01-28-2006, 03:33 PM
I'm not going to rejoice over Kubiak NOT being able to get the guys he wants.

Seeing that Kubiak has never had any experience as an NFL head coach, perhaps you should be happy.