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View Full Version : Mario or D'Brick at #4?


YoungTexanFan
01-23-2006, 08:07 PM
For this argument, we have traded down to #4, and BOTH Mario and D'Brick are on the board. Who do you draft and why one over the other?


I'm torn, so what is your opinion?

Bubbajwp
01-23-2006, 08:08 PM
Also torn but leaning towards MW.

Grid
01-23-2006, 08:09 PM
Mario

Mario is a truly elite prospect at his position. Additionally.. he would fill a roll on this team that is sorely in need of filling (since we are apparently switching to a 4-3)

I like Dbrick.i think he is a great talent.. but I do not rank him head and shoulders above some of the other OTs in this draft like Justice and Winston. I think we could pick up an OT of similar talent at #33 if we want to.


*EDIT* Mario has been called the best DE prospect since Julius Peppers.. and I would love to have Julius Peppers 2.0

D-ReK
01-23-2006, 08:10 PM
I vote Super Mario...

BuffSoldier
01-23-2006, 08:20 PM
Get the most athletic LT in years, put Babin and Peek back at their original positions of DE and be happy.

YoungTexanFan
01-23-2006, 08:39 PM
I brought this up even now because it seems that Fergueson is up to around 295 and is dominating top 15 DE's at the senior bolw. He does not appear to have lost any quickness and actually seems to fit into our new zone scheme with quicker linemen.
It has also been reported by a few sites, that he is showing a "mean streak" and the strength to seal the edge and be a valuable member in run blocking.


And then you have Mario, a physical freak who will not be seen again for a while. He also comes at a need position, but at one that we could address with a proven, yet young DE through FA. You will find neither of those qualities from LT in FA. (see victor riley as a top LT in FA for better illustration).

Also, for a list of top DE's and who they might end up with: head to the NFL discussion and find my FA D-linemen list. Also listed in that forum are LB's and DB's.

edo783
01-23-2006, 08:50 PM
DBrick, fits the coming scheme best and is the best pass blocker available. Showing some mean at the Senior Bowl.

big homey
01-23-2006, 09:02 PM
If we manage to pull John Abrahm out of the trade, then D'Brick of course.

If not, then D'Brick.:)

YodAa
01-23-2006, 09:04 PM
both are elite prospects and both could be very special players, but this poll is useless until we know what kind of D we'll be running

MikeMc
01-23-2006, 09:12 PM
See Grid's comments.

Well, considering that Kubiak is the coach, I doubt the 3-4 will be here to stay. I wonder if he will go with Mike Singletary as his DC!!!

JDizzle
01-23-2006, 09:15 PM
The chances of us getting quality lineman in the 2nd and 3rd rounds are much greater than getting a defensive stud like Williams in the same rounds. Williams is a beast. A defensive playmaker is also a huge need IMO, and in this case the talent fits the need at #4. Williams had 14 1/2 sacks this season, not record breaking, but he got 11 of those over the last 6 games of the season. Obviously I choose Mario Williams.

YodAa
01-23-2006, 09:17 PM
I'd go with Mario if it is a 4-3. Just look at Tampa. Average/Below average OTs, and stud DE in Rice and they always dominate on D and just won their division title. Plus with Williams I'd get to go to the stadium in all red with a huge poster that reads "Lets'y go!"

YoungTexanFan
01-23-2006, 09:49 PM
both are elite prospects and both could be very special players, but this poll is useless until we know what kind of D we'll be running

this poll was made under the general assumption of switching to a 4-3 next year.

Which trench is more important to you now?

Texans86
01-24-2006, 12:36 AM
Mario, too many tackles left in the draft, and Ferguson hasn't been rated high enough for a #4 pick. Basically, our trenches need help, and I think we win either way.

beerlover
01-24-2006, 12:42 AM
D'Brickashaw- franchise LT seems to be what the Texans need especially since this is the 4th pick which would mean that the Texans passed on Young and we all know Carr needs better protection & that makes it a no-brainer :brickwall

AustinJB
01-24-2006, 01:09 AM
D'Brickashaw- franchise LT seems to be what the Texans need especially since this is the 4th pick which would mean that the Texans passed on Young and we all know Carr needs better protection & that makes it a no-brainer :brickwall

I agree....if we're passing on VY AND Bush, we need to give Carr as much protection as possible.

Unless we're planning on drafting Mario, signing Ray Lewis and being like the Ravens of 2000 (where we don't need an offense).

Corrosion
01-24-2006, 02:19 AM
There are about 5 tackle prospects in this draft that could be as good or better than D-Brick ...... There are maybe Two Maybe Three top flight DE prospects . Its more likely that one of the tackle's will be on the board in the second than one of the DE's and quite possible that Daryn Colledge (OT from Boise St.) may be around in the third .

D'Brickashaw Ferguson (Virginia), Daryn Colledge (Boise St.) , Brad Butler (Virginia , plays opposite D-Brick) and Rashad Butler (Miami (FL)) would probably be the best fit for the zone blocking scheme out of the top ten or so prospects .

This is a tough call for me based on the fact that the Texans were 31st out of 32 teams in total defense last year (Only SF was worse statisticly and they beat the Texans in OT) .... But being 30th in total offense is just as bad .... leading the NFL in sacks allowed AGAIN with 68 .... the 31st team in this category was Minn. w/ 54 allowed. Quite a gap.

The Preacher
01-24-2006, 08:13 AM
Either would mean we picked up extra picks so I would be happy either way but would prefer brick since Carr needs time at some point in his career.

cadahnic
01-24-2006, 08:41 AM
Mario Williams is a beast, and he is built like it. D'Brick weighed in at 297 so he has gained weight by the Senior Bowl, but it is making him look very stiff and decreasing some lateral movement. D'Brick is still a great LT prospect and likely will be the first off the board, but Mario is that impact RE that if coached the right way to play at least to his potential will be a multiple Pro-Bowler

HoustonFrog
01-24-2006, 08:46 AM
Mario. I see the need with D'Brick but I don't see it with a #4 pick. The Texans need playmakers and if you are going to pass up on three top offensive playmakers you better get a guy on D who can reak havoc. Plugging in a #4 tackle with the same players as last year is a no win in my book. You have 4 of the top 66 picks and can get quality line depth in the other 3 picks and with Kubiak's(Denvers) track record, even later. Also, if we go to the zone blocking scheme that means lighter, faster guys that you can get later. Not a big, punishing guy. With the talent in this draft at the top and depth wise you can cover many needs without giving up a true playmaker at the top.

edo783
01-24-2006, 09:16 AM
Either would mean we picked up extra picks so I would be happy either way but would prefer brick since Carr needs time at some point in his career.

My thoughts also. Frankly, it's hard to lose with either one IMO, but just as important will be the extra picks.

Honoring Earl 34
01-24-2006, 09:37 AM
:yahoo: If you look at the first three rounds of the Bronco's draft since 2000 ... you'll find they have picked 7 DBs , 3 LBs , 3 DL , 3 Rbs , 2 WR and 1 OL .

This is just a look at how they think . You also have to think their was some need .

MikeMc
01-24-2006, 01:03 PM
I agree....if we're passing on VY AND Bush, we need to give Carr as much protection as possible.


So then, by drafting VY or RB, how does THAT help Carr not get sacked (other than if VY is the QB and Carr is on the bench..not getting sacked). The reason Bush was sitting most of the Rose Bowl was because he was not as good at blitz pickup as White.....and that was vs NCAA players, not NFL.

So then either way, you'd draft an OT in rd 2 (#33 pick overall). I say get Super Mario with the 1st rd pick, and still be able to get a solid OT in rd 2. I like Colledge (Boise St) or Trueblood (BC).

The good thing about DEN's style of blocking is that they like the smaller, more athletic OL, which typically drop in the draft based solely on lasck of size....... MONEY BALL style baby!

rmartin65
01-24-2006, 02:32 PM
Brick, I heard he's doin real good at the Senior Bowl.

YoungTexanFan
01-24-2006, 02:38 PM
The thing with him fitting in to our zone scheme is he already posesses the top quickness needed for the system and he EXCELLS at pass blocking. We lack pass blocking linemen.

Mario provides instant pass rush with the natural size to stop the run. He is a little more raw than some others, but is a tremendous prospect.

I believe D'brick weighed in at 297 at the Senior Bolw.

He has dominated Kiwi thus far, while showing a mean streak.

Who wins, D'brick vs Mario?

Glacier
01-24-2006, 04:05 PM
I say go with the LT.


Dallas drafted 2 DEs from NC and both weren't the hoss dominating players we hoped for. The were solid functional players...just not the type of players who could take over a game for you. not sure why NC produces good college DEs that don't end up dominating in the NFL as people believe they will.....

well....julius peppers is pretty good when healthy i suppose.

MikeMc
01-24-2006, 07:09 PM
Mario Williams is from NC State, not UNC. Peppers has been a solid DE for CAR, he went to UNC.

I think DAL problem was more coaching (Campos) than anything else.

beerlover
01-24-2006, 08:04 PM
Pro Bowl Tackles AFC- Willie Anderson, CIN Willie Roaf, KC Jonathan Ogden, BAL. NFC- Walter Jones, SEA Orlando Pace, STL Chris Samuels, WAS. all high draft picks. :cool:

Ferguson reminds me alot of Walter Jones (going to the Superbowl) while some say Mario reminds them of Julius Peppers (watching @ home). Of course taking a tackle in the 2nd does have its own merit too, take Marvel Smith of the Steelers taken in the 2nd rd. http://www.post-gazette.com/steelers/20030626steele0626p2.asp

ThaShark316
01-24-2006, 09:11 PM
Trade for #4 and Abraham, draft Williams and dare a QB to drop back 7 steps!

LBC_Justin
01-24-2006, 10:33 PM
For this argument, we have traded down to #4, and BOTH Mario and D'Brick are on the board. Who do you draft and why one over the other?


I'm torn, so what is your opinion?Man this is hard. Honestly I haven't even seen either of these guys play. (or if I did, I didn't pay attention to them)

But I am imagining choosing between Walter Jones and Julius Peppers.
If I had to choose between those two I would take Peppers. But I doubt Mario is as atheletic as Peppers, of couse I can't imagine anyone being as atheletic as Peppers.

But I don't know enough about these guys. Both guys seem awesome, I guess they is why they are going to go in the Top 10.

Grid
01-24-2006, 10:35 PM
Id say Williams is as athletic as Peppers. he ran a 4.75 40.. which is pretty amazing considering that he weighs 290 lbs.. and two of the DEs graded right below him are in the 260lb area and ran 4.75 40s as well.

He is definatly a physically gifted player.

LBC_Justin
01-24-2006, 10:37 PM
So then, by drafting VY or RB, how does THAT help Carr not get sacked (other than if VY is the QB and Carr is on the bench..not getting sacked). The reason Bush was sitting most of the Rose Bowl was because he was not as good at blitz pickup as White.....and that was vs NCAA players, not NFL.

So then either way, you'd draft an OT in rd 2 (#33 pick overall). I say get Super Mario with the 1st rd pick, and still be able to get a solid OT in rd 2. I like Colledge (Boise St) or Trueblood (BC).

The good thing about DEN's style of blocking is that they like the smaller, more athletic OL, which typically drop in the draft based solely on lasck of size....... MONEY BALL style baby!
Not sure where you got that info from but it is wrong. In the first part of the Rose Bowl he had some problems with his shoes. They eventually had to tape them on. Pete Carrol was nearly strung up by the locals for not having Bush in the game late, it was more a reflection of poor coaching, than Bush lacking anything. At least that is the Vibe and sentiment here in Southern California.

MikeMc
01-25-2006, 08:46 AM
Well, that was the knock on him via the ESPN gurus......that was the one explanation they gave regarding why RB was not in there during the more crucial times.

Why else to you leave the Heisman trophy winner on the bench? Especially after Leinart took a few too many hits.

BigBull17
01-25-2006, 09:28 AM
Trade for #4 and Abraham, draft Williams and dare a QB to drop back 7 steps!
I posted a similar scenario but it looks good every time I see it. If you can get good pressure with only 4 youu cant go wrong. Just my :twocents:

TheOgre
01-25-2006, 10:04 AM
Trade for #4 and Abraham, draft Williams and dare a QB to drop back 7 steps!

I'd prefer to draft Ferguson or Hawk in that scenario. I still think that Peek and/or Babin could be a passing down DE (see Robert Mathis of the Colts). If that is the case, why not just get a mainly run-stopping LDE on 1st and 2nd and have Abraham play RDE every down?

Trap_Star
01-25-2006, 07:40 PM
Man this is hard. Honestly I haven't even seen either of these guys play. (or if I did, I didn't pay attention to them)

But I am imagining choosing between Walter Jones and Julius Peppers.
If I had to choose between those two I would take Peppers. But I doubt Mario is as atheletic as Peppers, of couse I can't imagine anyone being as atheletic as Peppers.

But I don't know enough about these guys. Both guys seem awesome, I guess they is why they are going to go in the Top 10.

i think peppers is extremly talented, but he goes up against mainly RT's, i would of loved to see him go against walter jones in the entire nfc championship game. there is a big difference between playing a RT as opposed to playing a LT.....:twocents:

YoungTexanFan
01-25-2006, 07:47 PM
i think peppers is extremly talented, but he goes up against mainly RT's, i would of loved to see him go against walter jones in the entire nfc championship game. there is a big difference between playing a RT as opposed to playing a LT.....:twocents:

He would get it done against most guys. I would like to see him go vs. D'brick.

Also, what does that say about Manny Lawson?

Xman
01-25-2006, 08:15 PM
Neither. Trade down again.

If we start dealing down, then do it right. If we deal down with the NYJ, I assume we have their #1 next year and their #2 this year. I would try to add #1s next year, but it is hard to predict those deals. I would also look for picks down through the top of the 2nd round ( the top of the 2nd round looks like gold to me this year - and they come with the bonus of cheaper 2nd round salaries).

Options:
#4 + #66 to Oak or SF for their 1st and 2nd round picks. (SF would move up for D'Brick and Oak would move uo for Mario)
#4 for #8 and 2nd rounder;
possibly followed by #8 to Denv for #22 and #29
or for #16 and a 2nd,
or for #12 and a 3rd (or a 2nd next year)
#4 for a #1 in 2007 and a lower 1st from ?.
(try to include a 3rd rounder for 2nd rounder switch also)

I think we can get value picks to fill our needs anywhere in the first 2 rounds. So, just try for the best deals and try to get #1s for next year (because if we deal down, we will be drooling over APeterson).

LORK 88
01-25-2006, 08:44 PM
Look at what round alot of the great OTs have been picked at, and look at what round alot of the great DEs have been picked at. Truth is, its alot harder to find a great OT after the 1st round than it is a DE. With that said, I gotta say D'BRICKISHAW FERGUSON.

pv1999
01-26-2006, 06:22 AM
He will make one heck of a blocking tight end.

MikeMc
01-26-2006, 02:12 PM
Look at what round alot of the great OTs have been picked at, and look at what round alot of the great DEs have been picked at. Truth is, its alot harder to find a great OT after the 1st round than it is a DE. With that said, I gotta say D'BRICKISHAW FERGUSON.

Dude, now you sound just like Cass!!!! What is it that he always says when getting rid of picks (err...trading up)...only 40% of players from rounds 4 through 7 make NFL rosters.......Rds 2 & 3 60% make rosters...... blah blah blah. Stats suck when used to prove YOUR agenda.

With FB players, it is all a case-by-case basis. You cannot say X DE was drafted in the 7th rd and is a HOF player, whereas Y DE was drafted #1 and is a bust! Thereby, by that logic, the Texans should only draft DEs in the 7th rd, thus giving them a team full of HOF DEs!!

I think it has several variables:

1) Player's talent level
2) Player's work ethic
3) Player's football knowledge (from coaching in HS & NCAA)
4) Player's ability to handle making a lot of money AND still working hard (see #2)
5) The NFL Coach he will be playing for
6) The position coach that will be coaching the player

Those are 6 variables that I think make or break a player. All teams should know #5 and #6 and a most will know #1 while a few will know #3. #2 and #4 go hand in hand, and Most teams will not know these until they draft the player, therefore these two are the most heavily weighted factors that can make or break a player.