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View Full Version : Don't get mad at me, but do you think...


thunderkyss
01-20-2006, 05:15 PM
...David Carr would restructgure his contract, and take less money?? I mean, do you think he deserves a $5-$8 million bonus?? Do you think he'd get an $8million bonus to sign with another team?? $5million?? $3million??


I'm not hating, I'm not bashing, I'm just asking.

Grid
01-20-2006, 05:27 PM
Id like it if he would.

But considering that we kept him under a bad coaching staff for 4 years.. never improved his oline.. ruined the beggining of his career and got him sacked 200+ times... asking him to take less money would be a good way to force him out the door...seems to me. That would just be wrong :)

Though...like I said.. would be nice if he would.

texanmojo
01-20-2006, 05:29 PM
Do I think he 'deserves' 8 mil? Heck no. Its like rewarding him for playing poorly. Bonuses are typically based on performance. He hasn't performed(yes I know about his O-Line)...but he is at least partially responsible for his level of play.

I don't mind if he stays, but I hope he does restructure his deal(even though I know he won't).

profan
01-20-2006, 05:32 PM
after four years of getting pounded, bad coaching, bad line, etc. in no way would i expect him to restructure his contract. It's not his fault that we don't know what kind of qb we have. If i were david carr i would have already had my bags packed. After last season they assured him the oline would be improved and it turned out to be worse.

Overalls
01-20-2006, 05:39 PM
I have no problem with the 5 mil. two year deal.

YodAa
01-20-2006, 07:06 PM
Normally if you asked any other player to restructure after a performance like Carrs they probably would but asking him to restructurefor less money so he can keep playing on a team that wins know games and lets him get his *** beat 7-8 times a game than he'd rather take that same amount of "less money" and go play with another team where he'll probably win more games and get hit much less.

SESupergenius
01-20-2006, 07:22 PM
If I was Carr I'd ask for MORE money. Quality QB's don't grow on trees, and if you wanted Capers fired then there is no way you want Carr canned as well because you are saying that the problems on this team was both Capers AND Carr. Our offensive system was terrible and our defensive system was run by someone that had a record of bad defenses. So yes, Dom was the head coach and accordingly took the fall for all of these problems. But now you are saying Carr was not good. I hate to inform you, but NOBODY was good on this team last year. That is why we are getting a new coach and a new system. Let these players play in a new system and THEN let them fall where they lay.

dat_boy_yec
01-20-2006, 10:12 PM
If he did re-structure I would have no problem with the money, but I would try to make it more cap-friendly and re-allocate that money to incentives that he would obviously make. I don't know too much about the financial affairs but I think this would not be too much to ask of him.

awtysst
01-20-2006, 10:18 PM
...David Carr would restructgure his contract, and take less money?? I mean, do you think he deserves a $5-$8 million bonus?? Do you think he'd get an $8million bonus to sign with another team?? $5million?? $3million??


I'm not hating, I'm not bashing, I'm just asking.


I could say something here, but it is likely a very unpopular opinion, so i will keep my mouth shut.

thunderkyss
01-20-2006, 10:26 PM
Casserly has a job right now, with the Houston Texans.

It wasn't a matter of talent.

On the line, both sides, at RBx3, at WRx3

But David Carr would hold the ball, and run out of bounds. I've never played a down in the NFL, But I know that is an unearned sack......... So maybe i forgot once...... I can see that........ but it happened more than once.

I have seen Good QBs on Bad teams, this doesn't remind me of those times.

I agree the coaching was pretty bad, and I'm not blaming any of the players for what we've seen. But I still don't think Carr is helping. Not $8million dollars helping.

vtech9
01-20-2006, 11:57 PM
But David Carr would hold the ball, and run out of bounds. I've never played a down in the NFL, But I know that is an unearned sack......... So maybe i forgot once...... I can see that........ but it happened more than once.

I have seen Good QBs on Bad teams, this doesn't remind me of those times.

I agree the coaching was pretty bad, and I'm not blaming any of the players for what we've seen. But I still don't think Carr is helping. Not $8million dollars helping.
AMEN, BROTHER

texan279
01-21-2006, 01:11 AM
Was Archie Manning considered a good QB?

MorKnolle
01-21-2006, 08:13 AM
Carr hasn't performed up to expectations, but at the same time the team has failed to give him any kind of good team to play with. I don't think the team has any plans to try to get him to renegotiate though and Carr isn't going to give up the money on his own so I don't see it happening.

ccdude730
01-21-2006, 08:17 AM
personally, yes i think his contract is high and we are taking a big hit on the books this season...but when he was promised protection last offseason, find someone with the cojones to ask him to restructure because i sure wouldnt talk to him about it.

Spoda
01-21-2006, 08:27 AM
my hope is that next season..david drops back...hears that stupid buzzer go off in his head..(worst idea ever) tucks the ball and panics for the sideline...then he realizes...there was no passrush!! after that he will be able to stand in there and show us why he was the #1 pick and is worth the cash...all of this is assuming we fix the festering boil of an offensive line we have been ignoring for 4 years....





trade down for defense and O-line!!

bckey
01-21-2006, 08:32 AM
I could say something here, but it is likely a very unpopular opinion, so i will keep my mouth shut.

What he said.

MorKnolle
01-21-2006, 09:27 AM
Another thought on it, the Texans built this into David's rookie contract, and when you make and sign a contract with someone you honor that contract. If you don't want him on the team anymore, fine don't pick up his option and let him go elsewhere, but if you do want him to stay you pay him the bonus that you worked into his contract and don't try to weasel your way around it. I still say the team is about 75% responsible for his lack of production, 1) for not giving him some kind of talent on offense to play with (obviously A.J. is a great talent and Domanick is good, but they can't do it alone and without an OLine, 2) for giving him lousy coaching to help him progress during the season and offseason, and 3) for lousy coaching and playcalling during games and putting him in a position to fail.

bigTEXan8
01-21-2006, 10:37 AM
Personally, I would just ask once if Carr would like to restructure his contract. If he says no, I'd figure out how to get more money somewhere else. This organization has screwed Carr over for the past four years. He's a better man than most for even coming back to this team.

By the way, SESupergenious, your avatar looks like he's giving everyone the finger. I know he's spinning the ball, and it's cool and all, it's just funny to me. The juvenile deliquent in me. Ha!!

DH1
01-21-2006, 02:58 PM
Here me out for a second.... We trade David Carr for Ricky Williams, draft VY with the first pick, then trade DD to the Jets or Ari for a couple of late picks or a lineman or two.

With VY and Williams, we would add a new excitement for fans to tune in for. The first year it would be an 80/20 split for Williams being the main excitement factor in the game, but the next couple of years it would transition into VY bringing the whole package.

I think we would sellout the stadium for a few years. The crowds would definitely boost the players, and teams would hate to play us.

With the extra revenue, we could afford to pay for the talent for the Texans to become the Dynasty other teams dream about becoming!!!

Texans86
01-21-2006, 09:57 PM
Here me out for a second.... We trade David Carr for Ricky Williams, draft VY with the first pick, then trade DD to the Jets or Ari for a couple of late picks or a lineman or two.

With VY and Williams, we would add a new excitement for fans to tune in for. The first year it would be an 80/20 split for Williams being the main excitement factor in the game, but the next couple of years it would transition into VY bringing the whole package.

I think we would sellout the stadium for a few years. The crowds would definitely boost the players, and teams would hate to play us.

With the extra revenue, we could afford to pay for the talent for the Texans to become the Dynasty other teams dream about becoming!!!

I'd prefer winning to selling out games, but thats just my opinion. You didn't mention winning in your post. Also, it's cool to sell out for a couple years, but if you don't win, you are where we are right now, looking for something else to spark fans interest. Finally, selling out the seats does not directly help us pay for more talent on the field, the salary cap still defines how much you can pay players. Basically, you can have an University of Texas backfield for a lot of money that fans would appreciate for a season or two, but caps hits would start to hurt us quickly.

zeplin
01-21-2006, 10:49 PM
Isn't David Carr a restricted free agent this year. As a restrictedfree agent can't we shop him for his fair market value and then structure his deal around his newly established market Price. I am not sure how the process totally works but I thinkit's close.:homer:

vtech9
01-21-2006, 11:00 PM
Isn't David Carr a restricted free agent this year. As a restrictedfree agent can't we shop him for his fair market value and then structure his deal around his newly established market Price. I am not sure how the process totally works but I thinkit's close.:homer:


From KFFL.com

Texans | Carr expensive any way you look at it
Sat, 21 Jan 2006 18:00:17 -0800

Jason Cole, of the Miami Herald, reports Houston Texans QB David Carr has two options in his contract, The first option is that the Texans can pay him a $5.5 million bonus Feb. 19 and then pay him base salaries of $5 million this year and $5.25 million in 2007. That's $15.75 million for two years. The second option is that Carr gets an $8 million bonus Feb. 19 and base salaries of $5.25 million this year, $5.25 million in 2007 and $6 million in 2008. That's $24.5 million for three years. The Texans could also not pick up either option and simply designate Carr as the team's franchise player. That move only decreases his value because it means that a team acquiring Carr would have him on only a one-year deal. If Carr is not offered one of the two options, and is not tagged, he will become an UFA.

dat_boy_yec
01-21-2006, 11:29 PM
I would hope they picked up the two yr. option and then once he demonstrated what he's worth make a new contract or let him go.

infantrycak
01-22-2006, 09:32 AM
Isn't David Carr a restricted free agent this year. As a restrictedfree agent can't we shop him for his fair market value and then structure his deal around his newly established market Price. I am not sure how the process totally works but I thinkit's close.:homer:

With some funky exceptions potentially coming up if a new CBA isn't signed, restricted free agent status is solely for players with less than 4 accrued seasons in the NFL. DC has 4 accrued seasons at this point and has already met the performance standards to void the last 3 years of his contract so unless the Texans get him to sign a new contract, franchise/transition tag him or exercise one of the buyback options he will be an UFA.

thunderkyss
01-22-2006, 01:13 PM
How much would he cost us if we sign him as our franchise player??

thunderkyss
01-22-2006, 01:26 PM
Basically, you can have an University of Texas backfield for a lot of money that fans would appreciate for a season or two, but caps hits would start to hurt us quickly.

Ricky Williams would cost us next to nothing. He's done hurt his big payday contract chances for a couple of years, and he knows it. We should be able to get his contriutions to the team at an extreme value for our team. Worse Case scenario, we can fill his contract with stat driven incentives....... IF he's going to cost us, he'll have to earn it.

Now, this may sound odd, but I think Ricky Williams would be an upgrade at RB, but I don't think Reggie Bush is... Ricky is a running back who can carry the load, and can be productive on a bad team... Just like DD can, but we don't know how productive DD will be on a better team, where we know RW can put up ProBowl/MVP/HOF numbers with the right team. The only negative on Ricky, is that he might play, he might not.... Which makes him as much a gamble as Reggie Bush....... My knock on Reggie, is that he isn't a RB, he isn't a WR, and you don't take players like that #1 overall.... He could just as easily be a bust, as every other college player in the draft, but he could be a bust at WR, and RB then we've effectively spent a #1 overall to draft Desmond Howard/Dante Hall........ while I am a Desmond Howard fan, I wouldn't pick him #1 overall.

infantrycak
01-22-2006, 02:40 PM
How much would he cost us if we sign him as our franchise player??

Don't know the 2006 numbers yet and factors like whether Culpepper gets a new contract could affect it. For a ball park, the 2005 QB franchise amount was $8.1 mil basically.

DH1
01-22-2006, 04:51 PM
I'd prefer winning to selling out games, but thats just my opinion. You didn't mention winning in your post. Also, it's cool to sell out for a couple years, but if you don't win, you are where we are right now, looking for something else to spark fans interest. Finally, selling out the seats does not directly help us pay for more talent on the field, the salary cap still defines how much you can pay players. Basically, you can have an University of Texas backfield for a lot of money that fans would appreciate for a season or two, but caps hits would start to hurt us quickly.


If VY and Ricky in the same backfield, then I think it would give us a running attack similar to Atlanta's with Vick in that defenses would have to respect the VY bootleg. It would hold defenses a little longer helping our line out. We need help on our line obviously, but until its solidified, the dual threat will help tremendously.

As far as cap room, there are ways around it. Ricky wouldn't cost that much, he is only making the minimum now. I think he would be real happy getting 1.5 mil a year, he needs the money. He will still be good for another 3-4 years.

I'm not sure but I don't think Signing Bonuses count against the cap, do they?? I'm sure they can make it happen.

Your right! It's all about winning, I think this would be the best scenario to get the team in the playoffs in two years. As long as we get an Oline.

thunderkyss
01-22-2006, 09:50 PM
Atlanta ain't got nothing like Ricky Williams........

And Vick ain't no Vince.....


But Your point is on the money.