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thetexanator
08-07-2004, 07:09 PM
babin looked really slow today. he looks really lost out there. he even runs kinda funny. im a big casserly fan, but i dont think he can survive another bennie joppru. especially for what we gave up to get this guy.

peek on the other hand looked really good. it was just a practice, however he did look like a bright spot for the D.

Fiddy
08-07-2004, 07:12 PM
I saw stuff on extra points and was listening to it on the radio, he didnt look slow and Vandemeer even said that he was fast for a guy his size.

Texansbacker
08-07-2004, 07:23 PM
babin looked really slow today. he looks really lost out there. he even runs kinda funny. im a big casserly fan, but i dont think he can survive another bennie joppru. especially for what we gave up to get this guy.

peek on the other hand looked really good. it was just a practice, however he did look like a bright spot for the D.


He runs a 4.6? That is not slow by any means and if he is undecisive in his decisions please remember he is still a rookie. It is my understanding that Babin got to Fiedler almost untouched on a speed rush today? Not enough? Patience. Comparing him to a player that has been unfortunately injured and may never realize his potential accordingly is not equivocal. Additionally, I don't think Charile's job is in jeapoardy.

I did not see them play however so I would be interested to learn of any other opinions that have seen more of Babin's play than I and speak to his speed of play.

edo783
08-07-2004, 07:24 PM
Interesting that the first post is a diss on an important Texans pick, particularly when that is opposit of what has been reported by the national media. MMMM interesting.

Blu
08-07-2004, 07:42 PM
If Mark Van said he was quik, the scouts say his quik... then when he gets about 5 - 10 sacks this season you can say he's quik too.lol

thetexanator
08-07-2004, 07:51 PM
mark vandermeer? hes the biggest homer on 610. yeah babin ran a 4.69 but i know what i saw. maybe it was his indecisiveness that contributed to it but lets not go by what extra points says and hold off your bashing till you see it for yourself.

keyfro
08-07-2004, 07:54 PM
babin wasn't slow today...he got fielder on the first couple of pass plays but they weren't supposed to touch the QB's...if he looked slow it's only because he's still learning how to play in coverage and not as a DE...give him time he'll look faster once the full uniform is put on and that sold out reliant stadium is yelling at him for a sack :headbang:

Blu
08-07-2004, 07:56 PM
mark vandermeer? hes the biggest homer on 610. yeah babin ran a 4.69 but i know what i saw. maybe it was his indecisiveness that contributed to it but lets not go by what extra points says and hold off your bashing till you see it for yourself.
I wasn't there to see if his misdirection you speak of. I still think he'll be a good pick up.

pittbull
08-07-2004, 08:01 PM
Although Babin has good speed for a guy his size, the problem seems to be his quickness, which are two different things. Peek has both, but Babin is Stronger. During today's scrimmage, you could see his pass rushing ability, but also his rookie mistakes of loosing track of the ball and biting on the play fakes. He's going to be ok, but for the opening of the season, he must be placed in the right position to make plays. Otherwise, let Mr. Peak do his thing! Me for one, never understood the Texans reasoning for giving up on Peek, unless the long term plan is to eventually move Wong inside with Sharper, and let Peek play havoc as a pass rushing linebacker. He could be one heck of a linebacker on the level of LaVar Arrington. Just let the guy make athletic plays and eventually he'll cause big plays! I think this is the best option, but we'll have to wait and see! :headbang:

SESupergenius
08-07-2004, 08:13 PM
nobody said they were giving up on Peek, in a 3-4 you have to draft a LB every year. It takes time for the LB in the 3-4 to progress, at least 2 years.

Mistril48
08-07-2004, 08:14 PM
Although Babin has good speed for a guy his size, the problem seems to be his quickness, which are two different things. Peek has both, but Babin is Stronger. During today's scrimmage, you could see his pass rushing ability, but also his rookie mistakes of loosing track of the ball and biting on the play fakes. He's going to be ok, but for the opening of the season, he must be placed in the right position to make plays. Otherwise, let Mr. Peak do his thing! Me for one, never understood the Texans reasoning for giving up on Peek, unless the long term plan is to eventually move Wong inside with Sharper, and let Peek play havoc as a pass rushing linebacker. He could be one heck of a linebacker on the level of LaVar Arrington. Just let the guy make athletic plays and eventually he'll cause big plays! I think this is the best option, but we'll have to wait and see! :headbang:
underline mine

I can't say that I agree with your observations. I was at the scrimmage and I thought Babin looked extremely fast and quick with his pass rush. A fair bit of the time, he was dropping in coverage and just settling in a zone.

I can't say I agree that the Texans have given up on Peek. He played a ton today (with Wong having a baby). I think the Texans like Peek and Babin, as well as Wong, Sharper and Foreman. I think we're lucky to have the quality, young OLBs and a veteran in the mix. I think we'll see all five playing a lot in different packages if everyone is healthy.

Fiddy
08-07-2004, 08:14 PM
Peek is the long term answer at ROLB, it is going to be Babin and Peek on the outsides for a long time after Wong accepts a lesser role or leaves...

ccdude730
08-07-2004, 08:22 PM
Peek is the long term answer at ROLB, it is going to be Babin and Peek on the outsides for a long time after Wong accepts a lesser role or leaves...

or pushes foreman for his position

Fiddy
08-07-2004, 08:34 PM
or pushes foreman for his positionWong doesnt want to play inside, he came here to rush the passer from the outside. But if he knows he is going to lose playing time to Peek on the outside he may move inside...

aj.
08-07-2004, 09:15 PM
Wong may have no choice but to move inside if Peek continues on the tear he's on right now. Peek is playing like he's possessed. He's everywhere. Our LB talent is improving.

I'm not sure what the thread starter is talking about because I was at the scrimmage and thought that Babin looked fine. He has a good burst and he appears to be a helluva lot quicker than Wong, especially in lateral pursuit. I have yet to see Babin drop in coverage though. Every once in a while last year you would see Kailee chasing a TE down the middle. Babin's problem is going to be hanging tough on run support. That was Kailee's strength over there.

It was nice to see Kenny Wright running around out there today.

texansfan88
08-07-2004, 09:47 PM
I HAVE AN IDEA! why dont we stop criticizing a rookie that is playing his first time in reliant and start looking at the positives. he's going to be fine, but most of you will be too impatient to realize that, and thats sad

texasguy346
08-07-2004, 10:12 PM
I think everyone is putting the cart before the horse with the whole Babin thing. For those of you who think he's slow or not quick enough, keep in mind it's a scrimmage, and although you get a better look at a player than at practice, it's still far from an actual game situation. He's still learning the systerm, and he'll naturally have growing pains like any rookie. As for those of you who think he's the savior of the pass rush, its again too soon to tell. Veterans that he beat on the pass rush may not be giving it their all if they're assured a roster spot, and 3rd stringers aren't likely to be anymore experienced than Babin. Add to it that they likely aren't talented enough to make the active roster, and he'll be subject to much more talented players when the regular season begins. I understand that everyone is excited to see how it plays out, but its simply too early to tell much of anything about a rookie. We haven't even played a preseason game yet, and people are already questioning roster spots. Have faith in the coach staff, and understand that they'll act according to the best interest of the team. Babin is 'penciled' in as a starter, and there is a reason its not in ink. If he needs more time then I'm sure Dom will put Peek in until he feels Babin is ready. All that being said I definately feel that having too much depth is never a problem, and with two young & talented LBs we have much to be thankful for as fans. BTW Something like thirty four thousand fans showed up for the scrimmage, and I heard on SportsCenter that 14 thousand showed up for the Rams/Bears scrimmage. I think Houston has the best and most devoted fans in the league.

DFAN
08-08-2004, 07:09 PM
Vandemeer even said that he was fast for a guy his size.


End of story. IF Vandemeer said it, it has to be true.

Between John, Lance and Vandemeer I don't know which one is the biggest Texans homer. I would go with Vandemeer with John and Lance running a close 2nd.

texansfan88
08-08-2004, 09:01 PM
HAHAHAHA YOUR QUARTERBACK LAST YEAR WAS SMOKING CRACK! HAHAHAHA, get off the board

cuppacoffee
08-08-2004, 09:18 PM
End of story. IF Vandemeer said it, it has to be true.

Between John, Lance and Vandemeer I don't know which one is the biggest Texans homer. I would go with Vandemeer with John and Lance running a close 2nd.

Strange place to find Texan homers. On a Houston radio station and a Houston Texans message board. :rolleyes:

beerlover
08-08-2004, 09:20 PM
HAHAHAHA YOUR QUARTERBACK LAST YEAR WAS SMOKING CRACK! HAHAHAHA, get off the board

remember what you said from another thread only minutes ago-

"im not really too overly concerned because it is just football afterall..."

I think this is bad for the Texans simply because a strong Cowboy team only makes it that much sweeter to defeat. As far as Babin's speed is concerned all I can say is I would not want to make him mad and have him run after me. For a man his size his speed is above average to say the least :tiptoe:

clandestin
08-08-2004, 10:25 PM
Babin was one of the guys I kept my binoculars on throughout the scrimmage. While he definitely looked more comfortable going forward on a pass rush then he did backpedaling into coverage, I think that he showed good athleticism, quickness, and potential throughout the scrimmage.

On the pass rush...

He showed off some effective hand-combat style pass rushing skills, and did a nice job of fighting his way through blocks as opposed to speed rushing around them--which can leave olbs vulnerable to the run. His quickness was evident and he looked comfortable in taking on the right tackle's attempts to contain him. He doesn't have peek's lightning quickness and agility, but he seems to play much stronger at the point of attack. He does need to work on his ball tracking and run/pass recognition skills as he appeared unsure on a few plays, but I liked the pursuit skills that he showed off--definitely a high motor guy.

I didn't see babin play from a stance as he'll likely do on 3rd downs, so nothing to note there.

In coverage...

I was surprised by how much he has picked up at this point, but my expectations were pretty low. He covered his zone adequately, but did appear indecisive at times. Particularly when he hit his zone and found noone to lock on to, you could see him struggle with deciding where to go next. On one such play he decided to drop further back to help with a deeper receiver, this opened a hole for a another receiver coming across the field on a short in from the other side, had he stayed put he would have been in a great spot to put a hit on the guy as he caught the ball.

He needs to improve his back-pedaling and change of direction skills in coverage, and he'll never be mistaken for a DB, but I think he can become an adequate zone coverage guy. He didn't get many receivers initially running routes into his zone so I didn't get a look at how well he locked on to a man in coverage.

Overall I came away pretty optimistic about what I had seen. He's still got a lot to learn, and I don't expect him to put it all together until next season at best. In the meantime I think he'll do a nice job in run support and on the pass rush by midseason this year. Once he gets faster making his reads, I expect to see his aggressiveness return and result in some big plays.

flawedout
08-09-2004, 11:22 AM
mark vandermeer? hes the biggest homer on 610. yeah babin ran a 4.69 but i know what i saw. maybe it was his indecisiveness that contributed to it but lets not go by what extra points says and hold off your bashing till you see it for yourself.

ok yea lets just cut the whole team because they are not good enough for you, damn. cant you be alittle patience the guy is a rookie busting his *** trying to learn a new position by week 1 and you are going to sit on here and talk bad about him, lets just get rid of coleman, lord, babin, all of them because they cant learn a new position in a week, come on man "lets not go by what extra points says" here's a thought lets not go by what you say either. you cant possibity understand the game because if you did, you know it takes some time to learn new positions and new plays, babin is getting alot better every day. and you should hold off the bashing until the middle of the season, when babin is sacking everyone and coleman has 5 picks. you are more likely one the same people that talk bad about DD too,

texman8
08-09-2004, 11:45 AM
Amen! bud

SBTexans08
08-09-2004, 11:49 AM
Babin is anything but slow...don't know what the original poster was talking about. :crazy:

edo783
08-09-2004, 02:53 PM
Frankly my Trolldar has went off on this guy. Seems to want to just stir the pot by making outrageouse statements.

DoCt3rJ
08-09-2004, 11:51 PM
I don't think were gonna see much from Babin this year. Give him untill next year to show his stuff, look at Peek. He wasn't WOW last year, he wasen't consistent, but he showed promise, now look at him this off-season. He did good at the Miami scrimmage, and is doing really good in camp. Im sure the same will happen with Babin.

Htown34s
08-10-2004, 11:34 AM
im a big casserly fan, but i dont think he can survive another bennie joppru.

Trying to bash Casserly by comparing Joppru's unfortunate injury to what you perceive as Babin running funny is extremely myopic.

You don't have to be a complete homer, but at least be fair in your criticisms.