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Farough
01-13-2006, 02:08 PM
Anyone else think that if we can get Maurice Stovall out of Notre Dame in a later round that he would be a very good 2nd receiver opposite of Johnson. At 6'5" 220 lbs, he is a very big target and is a legitament deep threat, which we need more than just andre for that. Just a thought since no one is talking about taking a receiver in the draft.

YoungTexanFan
01-13-2006, 04:35 PM
Anyone else think that if we can get Maurice Stovall out of Notre Dame in a later round that he would be a very good 2nd receiver opposite of Johnson. At 6'5" 220 lbs, he is a very big target and is a legitament deep threat, which we need more than just andre for that. Just a thought since no one is talking about taking a receiver in the draft.

It's a novel idea, but reciever is not anywhere close to a top need. Mathis suits me as our #2 reciever, with armstrong/gaffeny in the slot.

Holden135
01-13-2006, 04:47 PM
I don't know if you noticed but Mathis was not very good this season as a wr. I know he didn't get on the field that much but when he did he didn't look all that good. He had the one 35 or so yard td reception and that was all that impressed me from the offensive side of the ball. I do like Stovall and would be trilled if we got him.

Farough
01-13-2006, 04:52 PM
It's a novel idea, but reciever is not anywhere close to a top need. Mathis suits me as our #2 reciever, with armstrong/gaffeny in the slot.
thats why i said one of our LATER round picks if hes still availible. And a number 2 receiver is a priority if we want to open up the passing game more.

Xman
01-13-2006, 05:21 PM
I think we need a strong #2 WR. This draft is weak so teams will be reaching for them. I would address it through FA.

[if we decide to trade down - I would trade #1 for #9 and Roy Williams]

1st choice: Moulds; he is a FA or has a huge bonus due meaning he will be cut. Buff will not resign him with their other WRs. I would sign him to a 2 or 3 year deal. If Mathis comes on, fine. Otherwise we look at adding another one within the next two years.

2nd choice: Randle El or Jurevicious (Gabriel if he is a FA)

3rd choice: RWayne, but on the cheap

YoungTexanFan
01-13-2006, 10:20 PM
I would actually be happy signing Charles Rogers. I believe he is a RFA who the lions don't expect to offer a contract to again.

tulexan
01-13-2006, 10:23 PM
We are getting one with the #1 pick

GoBlue
01-13-2006, 10:57 PM
I would actually be happy signing Charles Rogers. I believe he is a RFA who the lions don't expect to offer a contract to again.
Rodgers is Randy Moss with all the injuries and pot, and NONE of the talent. If CC picked him up I would really think he's crazy

GoBlue
01-13-2006, 11:00 PM
This year's draft is full of unproven or undersized WR's. With our most well established problems on the O-line and a decent depth of talent at guard and tackle I would much rather see us get a good lineman with the 2nd round pick.

J-Storm
01-14-2006, 06:37 AM
If we don't think our current crop of WR's behind AJ can get the job done then we really should be looking at FA I agree. I wouldn't mind Moulds (would he play for #2 type money though), Jurevicius (will Seattle keep him along with Engram and Jackson as a back up), Rogers (seems a bit of a headcase from what I've read) or Price (despite people thinking he was overhyped by his time in Buffalo).
All we need is a guy to take a bit of pressure off of AJ, they don't have to be TO, Randy (or Santana) Moss, or Marvin Harrison. All they have to do is suck in that extra defender and free up AJ 1-on-1 and be able to look like a slight threat IMO.
Throw a legitimate TE into the fray as well and we would be fine. Joppru (if fit), Pope or Thomas along with AJ and 1 of the above WR's (with Gaffney, Mathis or Armstrong in the slot) and you have a nice artillery to throw at opposing D's...

whiskeyrbl
01-14-2006, 07:16 AM
Our need at reciever can be lessened by signing Bush.He was used as a WR sometimes at USC.Think of your 4 WR set. Johnson/Mathis on the left,Bush/Gaffney on the right.A DB's nightmare.:drool:

YoungTexanFan
01-14-2006, 09:00 AM
Rodgers is Randy Moss with all the injuries and pot, and NONE of the talent. If CC picked him up I would really think he's crazy

He has plenty of talent and to say he doesnt is a flat out lie. He was picked ahead of AJ, and while he has not yet lived up to it, he by all means has the natural talent.

Plus, its not like we would have to shell out a big contract. This is one of those "change of scenery" that has an extremely high reward/low risk factor. He should come cheap, and you dont expect him to do too much.

YoungTexanFan
01-14-2006, 09:01 AM
Our need at reciever can be lessened by signing Bush.He was used as a WR sometimes at USC.Think of your 4 WR set. Johnson/Mathis on the left,Bush/Gaffney on the right.A DB's nightmare.:drool:

How would bush be an upgrade at reciever over what we already have? He's not taller, he's not faster, and he doesnt have better hands. A #2 RB/#4 reciever is not worth the top 5, regardless of talent.

texplayer2
01-14-2006, 09:30 AM
How would bush be an upgrade at reciever over what we already have? He's not taller, he's not faster, and he doesnt have better hands. A #2 RB/#4 reciever is not worth the top 5, regardless of talent.

Mismatches.Deception. The guy starts out in the backfield and ends up lined up outside or in the slot. Defense will have to compensate on the go. Most of the time you can read 2-3 wideouts immediately, he would hide his intended RB/WR designation. How do teams use Tackle eligible plays. That is how he is better and once in the secondary he has moves or he can definitely run over DB's better than a reciever. All that said I still think it would also be nice to have a traditional #2 reciever to keep pressure off AJ.

YoungTexanFan
01-14-2006, 10:04 AM
Mismatches.Deception. The guy starts out in the backfield and ends up lined up outside or in the slot. Defense will have to compensate on the go. Most of the time you can read 2-3 wideouts immediately, he would hide his intended RB/WR designation. How do teams use Tackle eligible plays. That is how he is better and once in the secondary he has moves or he can definitely run over DB's better than a reciever. All that said I still think it would also be nice to have a traditional #2 reciever to keep pressure off AJ.

I'll take AJ over Bush when trying to run someone over. I'll take a TE over bush. I'll take DD over bush. I'll take almost anyone over bush if the question is wether or not he will run over a defender.

YoungTexanFan
01-14-2006, 10:06 AM
Mismatches.Deception. The guy starts out in the backfield and ends up lined up outside or in the slot. Defense will have to compensate on the go. Most of the time you can read 2-3 wideouts immediately, he would hide his intended RB/WR designation. How do teams use Tackle eligible plays. That is how he is better and once in the secondary he has moves or he can definitely run over DB's better than a reciever. All that said I still think it would also be nice to have a traditional #2 reciever to keep pressure off AJ.


He'll be a small mismatch. Now say someone jams him at the line. Now lets say he is jamed and the 4 man rush preasures Carr. Now lets say, "I would rather have a RB who can run block than a RB who can run to the sidelines."

texplayer2
01-14-2006, 10:12 AM
He'll be a small mismatch. Now say someone jams him at the line. Now lets say he is jamed and the 4 man rush preasures Carr. Now lets say, "I would rather have a RB who can run block than a RB who can run to the sidelines."

They get up go back to the huddle and on the next play he doesn't get jamed the dump off pass goes for six. You are not going to win every battle, you want to be ahead at the end. And by the way he does block, but that isn't his most useful stance against a Defense.

alphajoker
01-14-2006, 10:24 AM
I don't know if you noticed but Mathis was not very good this season as a wr. I know he didn't get on the field that much but when he did he didn't look all that good. He had the one 35 or so yard td reception and that was all that impressed me from the offensive side of the ball. I do like Stovall and would be trilled if we got him.

I think Mathis has the potential(and speed) to be a solid WR. He may have not looked all that good this year but with a season under the belt, he could develop into a deep threat receiver come the following season. Also, WR's usually take three years to develop at the NFL level. We just need to be patient with him and IMO, he'll be just fine. The kid is already making a name for himself as a return specialist.

YoungTexanFan
01-14-2006, 10:28 AM
I think Mathis has the potential(and speed) to be a solid WR. He may have not looked all that good this year but with a season under the belt, he could develop into a deep threat receiver come the following season. Also, WR's usually take three years to develop at the NFL level. We just need to be patient with him and IMO, he'll be just fine. The kid is already making a name for himself as a return specialist.

Recievers actually take the least amount of time to develop than anyone. Recievers do natural stuff. There are only so many possible routes. It comes down to speed, hands, and route running. Recievers should adjust quickly. There are plenty of exceptions though.

texplayer2
01-14-2006, 10:32 AM
I think Mathis has the potential(and speed) to be a solid WR. He may have not looked all that good this year but with a season under the belt, he could develop into a deep threat receiver come the following season. Also, WR's usually take three years to develop at the NFL level. We just need to be patient with him and IMO, he'll be just fine. The kid is already making a name for himself as a return specialist.

I think the more reps he gets with Carr the better he will be. He has the speed, which is obvious on returns.

Xman
01-14-2006, 11:24 AM
Our need at reciever can be lessened by signing Bush.He was used as a WR sometimes at USC.Think of your 4 WR set. Johnson/Mathis on the left,Bush/Gaffney on the right.A DB's nightmare.:drool:

Draft Bush.
Sign a free agent WR (weak draft combined with other teams looking for WRs mean bad value for picks).

Think of this:
AJ and Moulds one one side. Mathis on the other (or Gaffney).
Bush lined up in the backfield behind a fullback (or we could leave in a TE with Bush as the single back - but we have a good blocking FB so use him) (or if we drafted Pope - AJ on one side, Noulds on the other with Pope on the line, Bush and a FB/DD in the backfield).

At that point, we are a threat to run or pass. If Bush goes in motion, who goes with him? If it is LB or a S, then it is a severe mismatch!

Xman
01-14-2006, 11:29 AM
Draft Bush.
Sign a free agent WR (weak draft combined with other teams looking for WRs mean bad value for picks).

Think of this:
AJ and Moulds one one side. Mathis on the other (or Gaffney).
Bush lined up in the backfield behind a fullback (or we could leave in a TE with Bush as the single back - but we have a good blocking FB so use him) (or if we drafted Pope - AJ on one side, Noulds on the other with Pope on the line, Bush and a FB/DD in the backfield).

At that point, we are a threat to run or pass. If Bush goes in motion, who goes with him? If it is LB or a S, then it is a severe mismatch!

I forgot to list what makes it so scary: SPEED.
AJ/MAthis/Bush - all sub 4.3

YoungTexanFan
01-14-2006, 11:09 PM
I forgot to list what makes it so scary: SPEED.
AJ/MAthis/Bush - all sub 4.3

AJ was above 4.3, Bush has yet to be timed this year.

Xman
01-15-2006, 01:32 AM
AJ was above 4.3, Bush has yet to be timed this year.

Bush's last listed time was 4.28

and, if AJ is over 4.3, its not by much

fballer99
01-15-2006, 01:38 AM
Bush's last listed time was 4.28

and, if AJ is over 4.3, its not by much
Very true, AJ was one of the fastest in the NFL combine I am told. The texans actually have alot of the fastest guys in the NFL: I have heard Mathis, AJ, and Robinson are 3 of the fastest guys in the NFL.

Big B Texan Fan
01-15-2006, 01:43 AM
Very true, AJ was one of the fastest in the NFL combine I am told. The texans actually have alot of the fastest guys in the NFL: I have heard Mathis, AJ, and Robinson are 3 of the fastest guys in the NFL.
Mathis for sure and he will prove it at the fastest man comp at the pro bowl

As for the other two D Rob was second to Deangelo Hall as far as 1st rd CB's go. I think (not for sure though) Ricardo Colocough (GB) ran a point or two faster.

As for AJ I'm not too sure, He seemd faster in his 1st two years than he did this past season. I sure I'm imagining things.

MorKnolle
01-15-2006, 08:25 AM
Mathis for sure and he will prove it at the fastest man comp at the pro bowl

As for the other two D Rob was second to Deangelo Hall as far as 1st rd CB's go. I think (not for sure though) Ricardo Colocough (GB) ran a point or two faster.

As for AJ I'm not too sure, He seemd faster in his 1st two years than he did this past season. I sure I'm imagining things.

After AJ got hurt, I'm not sure he fully recovered his speed the rest of the year. Remember at the 2004 Pro Bowl though he got 2nd in the fastest man contest, barely getting beat out by Allen Rossum, so Andre does have some serious speed too.

TheOgre
01-15-2006, 09:33 AM
This team has a lot of holes to fill and not enough picks and money to do it in one off-season. I think TE is a MUCH bigger priority in this offseason than WR2. It is clear to me that Armstrong and Gaffney are no better than #3 receivers. Mathis has potential to be our #3 guy, but I'd also like to bring in a low salary FA guy with potential. Perhaps we can wait until after June 1 and grab one of those salary dump guys.

IMO, here are the biggest needs:

1. The majority of the starting O-line. Pitts seems like the only long-term keeper. We are probably stuck with Wade with his huge contract. I could see as many as three new starters this season. We could use our 2nd rounder on one, sign another one via FA, and find a third one from either the draft, trade, or FA. Remember we are looking for a different type of linemen for Kubiak's system.
2. TE - The lack of a TE just kills our offense. The TE is a huge part of that Denver style of offense. It would help us combat these cover 2 defenses we keep seeing too. This is a good year to get one in the 2nd or 3rd round.
3. DLE - We could use a stud here, but, at the very least, we need a run-stuffing strong-side end that will play 1st and 2nd down for us. The team might try to use Walker or TJ for this purpose and bring in Peek on passing downs. Long-term this is a big need.
4. MLB - Wong and Greenwood are under contract and look like our OLB's. We really need a stud MLB, but we probably will have to wait until 2007 or later to get a good one. Look for us to re-sign one of our current FA LB's to give us our 3rd starter (Orr?).
5. Both Safeties - CC Brown is a functional starter that is more geared to be a versatile backup for both positions. Glenn Earl is slow and has major issues in coverage. He might be an okay SS backup, but shouldn't start. We need to find a potential starter for at least one (and probably both) safety positions. I think we should spend a 3rd or 4th rounder on one in the draft and perhaps sign a good FA one.
6. WR2 - a need that we probably won't sufficiently address in this offseason.