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View Full Version : What happened to needing a dl and ol


jmlockett
01-11-2006, 04:38 PM
How do we know that drafting another weapon for our qb is a good idea. I like both top picks in the draft, they are both great players. However, when you build anything you have to have a solid foundation to hold everything up. Right? When you look at it this way our team's foundation wouldn't allow any great offense player to exceed in his career. If I was the one making choices here I would forgo both players and or get them and trade them for some really great big talented foundation guys. Guys that eat metal for breakfast. Guys that the other teams would think twice about saying anything about their momma during the game. Guys that we have to bring to the stadium in cages. Thats the type of offense and defense linemen we need.

Paragon Blue
01-11-2006, 04:48 PM
How do we know that drafting another weapon for our qb is a good idea. I like both top picks in the draft, they are both great players. However, when you build anything you have to have a solid foundation to hold everything up. Right? When you look at it this way our team's foundation wouldn't allow any great offense player to exceed in his career. If I was the one making choices here I would forgo both players and or get them and trade them for some really great big talented foundation guys. Guys that eat metal for breakfast. Guys that the other teams would think twice about saying anything about their momma during the game. Guys that we have to bring to the stadium in cages. Thats the type of offense and defense linemen we need.
The guys that we have up front can't be that bad. I think with some better coaches we will be alright!!

Mr. White
01-11-2006, 04:50 PM
Seems to me like a reasonable question. I posed it yesterday and it seemed like everyone was hanging out on the VY and RB threads. It hasn't been a secret since the team started that they needed help on the O-line (and the D-line, for that matter.) 4 years later, seems like the same song and dance.

jacquescas
01-11-2006, 04:53 PM
This is a strong Draft for O lineman and one or two will surely be around for our other first day picks.

Winston Justice, Jean Max-Giles, Devin Brown, Jeremy Trueblood could all be around for our second and 3rd round picks.

jacquescas
01-11-2006, 04:54 PM
If you think about it after the 1st pick we basically have 4 more first day picks, cause we have the 1st in the second, the 1st and 2nd in the 3rd and the 1st in the 4th that lets us have a day off and come in and scoop up anyone who fell off day one.

Those 4 picks could be devided between offensive and defensive line and fix the problem

utahmark
01-11-2006, 04:59 PM
The guys that we have up front can't be that bad. I think with some better coaches we will be alright!!

why cant they be "that bad". from what ive seen they are that bad.

those big guys up front can either make ave players look good or they can make good guys look less than ave. i think the latter in our case.

ComstockLode
01-11-2006, 05:09 PM
You know whats awesome, we now have 4 DTs with millions upon millions tied up in and no defensive ends. Thats awesome.

edo783
01-11-2006, 05:18 PM
For 4 years we have chased after the next shinny object like a Book Trout. It is time to fix the CORE of the team. It's the purple elefant in the room that every one knows is there and no one wants to address. Trade down and build the core and build the team the way it SHOULD have been in the first place. From the inside out. There are too many things that have to be fixed to just wait to the second round, we NEED more picks.

Time to do the un-sexy, hard to do, be an adult thing.

Mr. White
01-11-2006, 05:19 PM
What about the theory that they just didn't want to block for Carr? Seems kinda ridiculous to me, but I've heard it more than once. Anyone else heard it or have any thoughts?

Htown34s
01-11-2006, 05:23 PM
Well for one thing we'd be getting Hodgdon back from injury. He was a noticeable improvement from McKinney. We could take whichever OT falls out of the first round with our 2nd. Put him at RT while he gets used to the speed of the game.

I'd really like to get that monster Taitusi Lutui from USC with our 3rd pick. He may actually be able to play RT also. He is fairly quick for being 370 lbs (!!).

Another glaring hole we have is at CB. Faggins did OK, but he shouldn't be a starter.


You know whats awesome, we now have 4 DTs with millions upon millions tied up in and no defensive ends. Thats awesome.

If we do switch to a 4-3, I imagine we'd have to trade one of our DT's. I think Robaire Smith would have the most value, but his contract could become an albatross.

geofb
01-11-2006, 05:25 PM
I'd be ok with trading the #1 to get multiple picks to strengthen the team. That or drafting Bush would both be good options. Just as long as we don't use the #1 to draft a certain hometown QB with no NFL-useful skills is all I ask.

Xman
01-11-2006, 05:27 PM
We hava a lot of cash tied up in the DL. I think we should draft a couple of DL in the 3rd round or later to groom to replace them in a couple of years. This is a good draft for DL and we should get good value.

This is the best draft for OL in decades. You figure in the trend for teams to draft need over BPA and we should be able to get at least 2 quality OL when we pick in the first 4 rounds (33,65,66,97).

I would go
#33 OT/TE/OG
If one of the three stud TEs or one of the top OTs drop, gotta take him.
If those are gone, a stud OG like Jean-Giles would be sweet.
#65 Tutui - if he is still there, you gotta take him. Might even trade up.
#66 BPA - We have a lot of needs - someone good will slip (cb/s/lb/dl/ol)
OTs we might get here:
Daryn Colledge 6-5, 296 Boise State
Andrew Whitworth 6-7, 330 LSU
Jabari Levey 6-5, 320 South Carolina
Jami Hightower 6-4, 365 Texas A&M
Zach Strief 6-7, 350 Northwestern
Jeremy Trueblood 6-8, 320 Boston College
#97 Still BPA - but I think we could get a solid C/OG here:
Kyle Young 6-5, 320 Fresno State
Mike Degory 6-5, 296 Florida
Nick Mangold 6-4, 300 Ohio State

TheOgre
01-11-2006, 05:31 PM
The top pick in the 4th round is often very valuable. Teams will come back that second day and see a player that dropped in the draft boards and want to trade up to that pick to get them. We might be able to drop a few slots and get an extra pick.

Double Barrel
01-11-2006, 05:34 PM
I'd cheer (and then LMAO) if the Texans made some kind of blockbuster deal with our pick. This has to be one of the most valuable no. 1 picks of all time.

Wolfman's Brother
01-11-2006, 05:36 PM
A great QB will make that offensive line look better. Carr puts himself and his line in bad posistions out there ending up sacked. very little pocket awarness. He has made them look worse than they are. Of course I agree that the line on both sides of the ball are WAY overpaid. Especially Wade!
They should look to pick up some true LB's especially an awesome MLB in Free Agency.

eriadoc
01-11-2006, 06:00 PM
For 4 years we have chased after the next shinny object like a Book Trout. It is time to fix the CORE of the team. It's the purple elefant in the room that every one knows is there and no one wants to address. Trade down and build the core and build the team the way it SHOULD have been in the first place. From the inside out. There are too many things that have to be fixed to just wait to the second round, we NEED more picks.

Time to do the un-sexy, hard to do, be an adult thing.

Amen. Some on here think that we can accomplish this in later rounds, but I contend we need a real left tackle to build around and those have not historically come past the first 20 picks of the draft.

Runner
01-11-2006, 06:36 PM
What about the theory that they just didn't want to block for Carr? Seems kinda ridiculous to me, but I've heard it more than once. Anyone else heard it or have any thoughts?

I think that is a coprophilous theory, much like the "Carr was trying to lose so the coaches would be fired" and "Players were throwing games to get the first pick" theories.

thunderkyss
01-11-2006, 06:56 PM
I still think we need to build the Offensive Line, and get some fear inspiring Defensive threats. But very few of the players on our team look like they are worth the money we are paying them. And we have the same bunch of guys looking to pick a few more.

Now, when these guys are saying without a doubt, we will pick Reggie Bush with our first pick..... enough is enough. If we're going to do something like that, if we're going to pick an offensive playmaker, get the best playmaker available.

dml923
01-11-2006, 07:00 PM
young can possibly delay the rush for a new o line becasue he is an exelent thrower on he run and can scramble. but a new o line would be the best move however a lot of the fans are counting on drafting a huge player

rmartin65
01-11-2006, 07:03 PM
Keep Carr, and work on the oline.

jmerog
01-11-2006, 08:30 PM
For 4 years we have chased after the next shinny object like a Book Trout. It is time to fix the CORE of the team. It's the purple elefant in the room that every one knows is there and no one wants to address. Trade down and build the core and build the team the way it SHOULD have been in the first place. From the inside out. There are too many things that have to be fixed to just wait to the second round, we NEED more picks.

Time to do the un-sexy, hard to do, be an adult thing.
YES! YES! YES! I couln't agree more. I have been saying the same thing to anyone who will listen (which is almost no one). Behind a growling,slobbering, brutish O-line, we can run the the ball with peewee herman if we have to for 5 at a time. An o-line gives Dave all day to throw and cures most of his ills and a few wins will cure the rest.

Imagine this: 1st down,20 YD line- four wide reciever set-Carr drops back to pass.he looks to his first read, Johnson, who is covered- then to the other side where Mathis (who has been practicing catches in the off season) is streaking down the sidelines streatching the defense to the breaking point. O-line is still providing impenatrable coverage so Dave has all day. They have a deep safety crossing to cover Mathis. Dave looks to his third read Mr. Automatic (armstrong), who is open because of all the coverage was focused on johnson, the flash (Mathis) and Gaffney. Armstrong catches the ball for a 23 YD gain.

1st down: 43 yd line, # WR set Johnson,Gaffney, Mathis-The ball is snapped.Carr drops back and goes through his reads and Does a play action pass to freeze the defense which is streatched all across the field, desperatly trying to cover both Mathis and johnson while still acounting for Gaffney. Dve hands the ball to DD. the o-line blows a hole ,which is easy because they are unnatural animals we traded our pick to get , and also because the defense is streatched across the field due to our studly recieving core.DD
hits the hole hard and goes the distance.

TOUCHDOWN!!!!

jmerog
01-11-2006, 08:39 PM
Everything starts at O-Line. Pass protection,run blocking,and intimidation.

GIMMESOME SNARLERS!!!:redtowel:

Erratic Assassin
01-11-2006, 09:05 PM
How do we know that drafting another weapon for our qb is a good idea. I like both top picks in the draft, they are both great players. However, when you build anything you have to have a solid foundation to hold everything up. Right?

The problem has been staring us in the face for 4 years. We KNOW that we cannot win with the world's worst offensive line no matter who our QB is and who our RB is. We've known it for years.

Yet every year we lose sight of what's important. We think there is a shortcut. We convince ourselves that a wide receiver will take pressure off the line, even though the play is over before the WR gets a chance to get open. We convince ourselves that a QB can win 2 games a year by himself, even though he can't even complete a pass, much less win a game lying on his back.

There are NO SHORTCUTS! You must build your foundation first, then build the rest afterward.

Fans are fickle. We get distracted too easily by the sexy pick. Reggie Bush went from the greatest pro prospect in 40 years (I'm not kidding) and overnight things changed so much that people are going to lose their minds if we DO draft him. Reminds me of the way people went nuts over Michael Vick.

Forget the hype and do things the right way.

utahmark
01-11-2006, 09:17 PM
every mock i have seen, that actually talks about the picks instead of just giving a name, says we should trade the pick.

dat_boy_yec
01-11-2006, 09:37 PM
For 4 years we have chased after the next shinny object like a Book Trout. It is time to fix the CORE of the team. It's the purple elefant in the room that every one knows is there and no one wants to address. Trade down and build the core and build the team the way it SHOULD have been in the first place. From the inside out. There are too many things that have to be fixed to just wait to the second round, we NEED more picks.

Time to do the un-sexy, hard to do, be an adult thing.

You mean Travis Johnson was a shiny object. I kinda thought Hall was shinier than Robinson. Can't wait for the second round. How can we ask a team to give us more picks this yr in the first rd. if they only have 1 pick in that round. If we trade down we HAVE to wait till the second rd. for any picks the team we trade down with could have given us.

zeplin
01-11-2006, 09:58 PM
Keep Carr, and work on the oline.


SIMPLE AND TO THE POINT>

NEXT!!:homer:

Samer
01-11-2006, 10:30 PM
It's not hard to figure out. O-Line is what we need. Get Carr the protection and he will have the time to look around the field and to someone other than Johnson. Davis has been putting up good numbers despite not having the best blocking. Could you imagine him on a team like Indi, he would kill the league. I'm surprised that Carr played the way he did. The protection was so bad yet he still put up decent numbers. And what I like about Carr/Davis/Johnson, you don't hear them complaining. Give them some respect.

The Preacher
01-11-2006, 10:56 PM
Best thread in here in a while. :highfive:

jmlockett
01-11-2006, 11:15 PM
:) Thanks, for the high five preach

ronaldod1
01-11-2006, 11:45 PM
For 4 years we have chased after the next shinny object like a Book Trout. It is time to fix the CORE of the team. It's the purple elefant in the room that every one knows is there and no one wants to address. Trade down and build the core and build the team the way it SHOULD have been in the first place. From the inside out. There are too many things that have to be fixed to just wait to the second round, we NEED more picks.

Time to do the un-sexy, hard to do, be an adult thing.


Brilliant post. The fact of the matter is skill players are overhyped by the media because they are more marketable. Those skill players thrive in SYSTEMS, not on talent alone. Systems are best executed when the line of scrimmage is controlled. For a QB and an RB to execute with complete conviction, and for them to have no hesitation to throw a laser or hit a hole at full speed they must be able to trust that the opportunity (e.g. time in the pocket, open holes) will be there without exception. Lack of this trust created doubt which clouds the mind and leads to poor decisions etc. All those "football gurus" on here who claim Carr has no decision making skills do not understand this concept of relaxed confidence. It can only happen if the line of scrimmage is controlled.

Texans86
01-12-2006, 01:02 AM
As of when I write this post, working on OL and keeping Carr is in the lead, by a pretty good margin. I am so glad that people are using their heads and instead of doing what the media has told us to do. The game is won in the trenches. This fix the offensive line idea has been around as long as the Texans, this year I hope they finally realize it.

Keep Carr, fix the OL.

J-Storm
01-12-2006, 04:42 AM
Now, when these guys are saying without a doubt, we will pick Reggie Bush with our first pick..... enough is enough. If we're going to do something like that, if we're going to pick an offensive playmaker, get the best playmaker available.

See that's the problem. I don't want flashy guys and salary cap probs in the future like the Titans for instance. I want "W's" and not "L's" so I don't mind if we have guys getting us those "W's" who aren't flashy. It seems to work for the Patriots after all, I wouldn't say they have a stellar cast of flash players...

Samer
01-12-2006, 07:04 AM
See that's the problem. I don't want flashy guys and salary cap probs in the future like the Titans for instance. I want "W's" and not "L's" so I don't mind if we have guys getting us those "W's" who aren't flashy. It seems to work for the Patriots after all, I wouldn't say they have a stellar cast of flash players...


One of the smartest posts I've seen so far. We definately don't need flashy players to win. The Patriots are the perfect example. They don't have a big named TE, their receivers are all 2nd grade receivers and they don't have that game breaking "Double Coverage Needed" type receivers. On D, other than Seymour, Brushci and Harrison, they are alot of low key players. Also don't forget who their coach is

Runner
01-12-2006, 07:21 AM
What about the theory that they just didn't want to block for Carr? Seems kinda ridiculous to me, but I've heard it more than once. Anyone else heard it or have any thoughts?


I think that is a coprophilous theory, much like the "Carr was trying to lose so the coaches would be fired" and "Players were throwing games to get the first pick" theories.


Definition:
coprophilous - living or growing on excrement, as certain fungi.

I thought that was a funny way to get around using that two four-letter word term starting with "bull". I guess I swung and missed. :thud:

Spoda
01-12-2006, 09:03 AM
.

Imagine this: 1st down,20 YD line- four wide reciever set-Carr drops back to pass.he looks to his first read, Johnson, who is covered- then to the other side where Mathis (who has been practicing catches in the off season) is streaking down the sidelines streatching the defense to the breaking point. O-line is still providing impenatrable coverage so Dave has all day. They have a deep safety crossing to cover Mathis. Dave looks to his third read Mr. Automatic (armstrong), who is open because of all the coverage was focused on johnson, the flash (Mathis) and Gaffney. Armstrong catches the ball for a 23 YD gain.

.

TOUCHDOWN!!!!

imagine if there was an actual NFL tight end roaming the middle...Rivers is a FA!! whatever will we do without him?:rolleyes:

Buffi2
01-12-2006, 09:54 AM
Thank you for this post! I was beginning to lose faith in Texan fans!
Build an offense and keep Carr. Without an offensive line, we are going nowhere fast. You can have an average QB and an average RB behind a stellar line and voila! Average becomes great! The time has come for the Texans to do the unpopular thing and draft mammoth linemen who live to block and tackle. It may not be the flashy, newsworthy thing to do, but it will win games. In the end, winning is what counts - not soundbites or the popular player of the day. One person does not a football team make and we need a few serious, scary, killer offensive and defensive players.

edo783
01-12-2006, 10:54 AM
DANG, maybe the MB/fanbase hasn't lost their collective minds after all! Good thread guys.

eriadoc
01-12-2006, 11:00 AM
Systems are best executed when the line of scrimmage is controlled. For a QB and an RB to execute with complete conviction, and for them to have no hesitation to throw a laser or hit a hole at full speed they must be able to trust that the opportunity (e.g. time in the pocket, open holes) will be there without exception. Lack of this trust created doubt which clouds the mind and leads to poor decisions etc. All those "football gurus" on here who claim Carr has no decision making skills do not understand this concept of relaxed confidence. It can only happen if the line of scrimmage is controlled.

I just wanted to say thank you for this post. So many on here love to talk about tangibles and intangibles, yet they overlook things like this. Great point.

Texans86
01-12-2006, 02:51 PM
I want to bump this poll back to the front page, hopefully more people will vote.

jmlockett
01-12-2006, 07:18 PM
thanks Texan 86 I would really like to see this poll on the front page so that way we could really get a strong voter response

big homey
01-12-2006, 07:28 PM
Man did I need this thread. I thought everyone had gone crazy.

jmlockett
01-12-2006, 08:09 PM
just to inform you I am planning on trying to keep this poll open until draft day. I would really like to try to get this out to the media and let the rest of the football community and the front office know what the fans really think.

Buffi2
01-12-2006, 08:16 PM
just to inform you I am planning on trying to keep this poll open until draft day. I would really like to try to get this out to the media and let the rest of the football community and the front office know what the fans really think.

Hooray!:yahoo: I really didn't want the world to think Texan fans had lost their collective football sense. As to the offensive line, ESPN has D'Brickashaw listed as the #2 most talented in the draft. I have moved from the undecided camp to the Ferguson camp.:)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft06/index

Zac
01-12-2006, 10:30 PM
This is the most important year for the Texans. The first 3 years were all gravy, just happy to have the NFL back in town. Now, this past year was miserable; the losing was insane.

Carr, Johnson, and Davis are a formidable combination. Davis needs less touches; he can't handle the pounding of a complete season.


The Texans have the top pick in each of the first 4 rounds. That means they get the opportunity to draft the best player per round. Or trade for multiple picks :redtowel: And what a draft to be at the top :yahoo:


The only O-Lineman position worth such a high pick or equivalent in trade is a franchise left tackle. Let's not forget that the O-Line depth can be attained with the second round pick and one of the 3rd round picks.


It is real important to build the Offensive line and the Defensive line. I'm ok with trading the pick, with a deal that blows your mind away. So, the top pick is going to have to worth this A LOT. Not parting with the 1st pick unless a deal is too good to pass up.:twocents:

Bobo
01-13-2006, 12:54 AM
How about the OL and the entire defense? I notice you didn't have that option in your poll. That's why we need a boatload of good picks. Chicago and teams like Baltimore and the NYG have all showed how far a good defense can take you, even when your offense is below par. If the defense would have gotten more takeaways this year and given the Texans more short fields to work with, then things would have been a lot different.

jmlockett
01-13-2006, 01:01 AM
I knew I forgot something

edo783
01-13-2006, 01:59 AM
Yup, defense needs a LOT of love also, but I suspect it will get a bit of a bandaid in this draft and more help in the 07 draft.

Texans86
01-13-2006, 02:13 AM
Yup, defense needs a LOT of love also, but I suspect it will get a bit of a bandaid in this draft and more help in the 07 draft.

Nope, the defense is going to be like the OL. We know we need it, and we're gonna draft another franchise RB/QB. That especially works if we draft Reggie/Vince this year.

michaelm
01-13-2006, 02:13 AM
I think that is a coprophilous theory...

Good thing my Firefox browser has a quick search function for dictionary.com... :yahoo:

michaelm
01-13-2006, 02:24 AM
Does anyone believe that we can take Bush and still improve the line?
I mean, at the moment it looks like Bush is the pick. Considering this, is it possible that we can make even a single FA move, draft one or two OL and see some improvement?
At the moment, it looks like Kubiak is the pick for HC. Do you think it's possible that his system could account for some improvement? I do.
It's not that big of a reach for me to think this line could improve to being average to half decent with one or two player additions and a HC like Kubiak.
I believe that there are rumors that he may bring his current OL coach with him as OC. That seems like a pretty good thing to me.

J-Storm
01-13-2006, 05:28 AM
Carr, Johnson, and Davis are a formidable combination. Davis needs less touches; he can't handle the pounding of a complete season.

Why the FO hasn't seen this and spelled DD a lot more is beyond my comprehension. We have DD, Wells and Morency (haven't seen Hollings but I'm hearing on this board that he is just dead weight so we won't count him) in our backfield so all the coaching staff have to do is learn how to use these 3 effectively to our advantage...

Now this is the only reason I'm not in the Reggie Bush camp. Sure he may carry the ball 10-15 times and get 5-10 catches a game. But is that really worth the overall #1 pick? Why can't we just add another lower round RB and use the money we would use on Reggie Bush in FA or on O-line and D-line draft picks???

jmlockett
01-13-2006, 06:57 PM
If we get the ol coach then we are on our way to sitting up our team.

HJam72
01-13-2006, 08:15 PM
Why the FO hasn't seen this and spelled DD a lot more is beyond my comprehension. We have DD, Wells and Morency (haven't seen Hollings but I'm hearing on this board that he is just dead weight so we won't count him) in our backfield so all the coaching staff have to do is learn how to use these 3 effectively to our advantage...

Now this is the only reason I'm not in the Reggie Bush camp. Sure he may carry the ball 10-15 times and get 5-10 catches a game. But is that really worth the overall #1 pick? Why can't we just add another lower round RB and use the money we would use on Reggie Bush in FA or on O-line and D-line draft picks???

Because Houston has gone nuts and Bush and Young are so hyped it's unreal, especially Young in Texas.

What you talking 'bout? We got a good 0-line, punk.

Yeah, it's the best in the NFL. :wacko:

Now that's how you bump a thread! :ok:

Texans86
01-14-2006, 01:13 AM
I feel like I should bump this up to the front daily just so it doesn't get lost in the back pages.

Spoda
01-14-2006, 08:21 AM
i think we'll be ok on defense....i mean if we draft vince young he will cast a spell on the other teams offense while he cures cancer...and if we draft reggie i have been told on this board he can bench 400lbs..well hell if he's only gonna carry the ball 15 times, stick him in at LB too..imagine his speed with that bench pressing ability....edge weighs what? 230? bush can just pick him up and throw him down!!!!



trade the pick we have too many holes

jmlockett
01-14-2006, 09:56 AM
Being involved in exotic animals I would gladly donate the cages for some real offensive line animals

HardKnockTexan
01-14-2006, 02:02 PM
I just dont see how people still want to draft a Left Tackle in the first round with the job that Pitts did against some of the best pass rushing defensive ends in the league. Before the team moved Pitts back to LT I was all about getting Ferguson in round 1. After watching Pitts basically dominate his competition I feel a lot better about going a different rout with our first pick. Our interior line is what needs the most attention IMO and that can hopefully be addressed in free agency and latter rounds of the draft.

bigTEXan8
01-14-2006, 02:07 PM
Well, with Pitts at LT and wanting to draft an LT, I think the question we need to answer is, 'Was Pitts a better LG or a better LT?'

HardKnockTexan
01-14-2006, 02:32 PM
Well, with Pitts at LT and wanting to draft an LT, I think the question we need to answer is, 'Was Pitts a better LG or a better LT?'

good question and honestly, I dont know the answer. I do know that our line functioned much better with Pitts at LT. Pitts recieved more attention when playing at LT which could be a reason why it seemed like he played better there. All truth be told, he probablly did just as solid a job at guard as he did at tackle.

edo783
01-14-2006, 02:48 PM
Well, with Pitts at LT and wanting to draft an LT, I think the question we need to answer is, 'Was Pitts a better LG or a better LT?'

AND, did he look better at LT, because we ran a 3 step drop offense and that shortend the time he had to hold his guy out? IMO, I suspect he is probably an "OK" Lt and MAYBE could be a very good RT, but who knows. Get a good rookie LT prospect, have him play RT (unless he can outright win the LT job) for the first year and then hopefully he will be ready to play LT and Pitts could be moved to RT. Pitts might wind up staying at LT, who knows.

jmlockett
01-15-2006, 10:27 AM
lets keep the votes going people :stirpot:

Runner
01-15-2006, 10:40 AM
good question and honestly, I dont know the answer. I do know that our line functioned much better with Pitts at LT. Pitts recieved more attention when playing at LT which could be a reason why it seemed like he played better there. All truth be told, he probablly did just as solid a job at guard as he did at tackle.

The coaches did put in schemes to help him out at LT. They started more double teaming the game Pitts took over the tackle position. Note that this does not make Pitts a bad player. Most teams with pro-quality coaches will double team when that is necessary to give their team an advantage - such as double teaming Freeney rather than hanging the LT out to dry. We didn't do any double teaming last year - it was all one-on-one pass blocking with the LT vs. DE.

If the coaches had used the same schemes last year I think many people would have been happy with the LG/LT combination of Pitts/Wand. Including Chester and Seth. It would have improved our pass blocking and they were already our best run blockers.

bigTEXan8
01-15-2006, 11:06 AM
We didn't do any double teaming last year - it was all one-on-one pass blocking with the LT vs. DE.

Correct me if I'm wrong though, didn't we give up fewer sacks in 2004 than we did in 2005?

Runner
01-15-2006, 11:20 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong though, didn't we give up fewer sacks in 2004 than we did in 2005?

Yes. We had 40% more sacks this year in a more restricted offense. As hard as it is for some people to swallow, replacing Wand was a mistake. Remember, last year was his first year starting. He would have been improved this year.

If we had implemented some better schemes on top of of being better last year we probably would have equaled or bettered the totals from two years ago; we had better atheletes at the start of the season. However, the new-at-the-time offensive line coach chose not to implement these schemes.

In my opinion.

jmlockett
01-16-2006, 09:28 PM
:stirpot: Kubiak is going to be a great head coach I just hope that he just builds the team from the foundation up

jmlockett
01-17-2006, 04:22 PM
lets keep this up front so that we can get a really good response:stirpot:

jmerog
01-17-2006, 04:48 PM
Being involved in exotic animals I would gladly donate the cages for some real offensive line animals
Gimmesome snarlers! I would love to see some man-eating tackles foaming at the mouth protecting david and intimidating defenses. I want men who need rabies shots. We need Players that will cause defenses to volunteer to carry thier helmets.

Ok Ok you get the point. Mean Mean slobberin beasts.

edo783
01-17-2006, 06:20 PM
Gimmesome snarlers! I would love to see some man-eating tackles foaming at the mouth protecting david and intimidating defenses. I want men who need rabies shots. We need Players that will cause defenses to volunteer to carry thier helmets.

Ok Ok you get the point. Mean Mean slobberin beasts.

Now I LIKE that idea! :ok:

jmlockett
01-17-2006, 11:22 PM
What would be even better is some defense players that would make the offense snarlers look puny:sumo:

adrianshrev
01-18-2006, 01:30 AM
What would be even better is some defense players that would make the offense snarlers look puny:sumo:
if we fix the offensive line and get one or two defensive players the defense will be better by just getting more rest the offense will start controlling the clock/ball and allow the defense the time to rest and make adjustments between opponents possessions...this is all in theory i hope it continues to work that way it did for indy this year except for the playoffs.

jmlockett
01-18-2006, 11:08 PM
pot stirring:stirpot:

Hey mods please help me keep this post on the front page so that we can get a good poll.

LCOOL
01-18-2006, 11:43 PM
pot stirring:stirpot:

Hey mods please help me keep this post on the front page so that we can get a good poll.
Has anyone talked about getting DL and OL from free agency?

jdog
01-19-2006, 12:25 PM
Have you guys seen Texans Chick's post in the draft forum? It's really good. We need to trade the first pick and add as many good value players to the roster as possible.

http://faculty.fuqua.duke.edu/%7Ecadem/bio/massey%20&%20thaler%20-%20loser%27s%20curse.pdf

HoustonFrog
01-19-2006, 12:32 PM
The way I see it is all depends on Kubiak and the blocking scheme. If we do the exact Denver scheme then getting a huge LT won't be the answer. Denver uses smaller, quicker guys and usually gets them later in the draft. So you can still take Bush and have 3 picks left in the top 66. Take OL and TE(maybe safety, depending on who is there) in those three picks. Then you still have 3 more picks where you can get some D-lineman or Dbs. You try and fill in the rest with FAs. You give Carr this year to try and prove himself with the new system and go from there.

Spoda
01-19-2006, 12:43 PM
no...no!!......NO!!!!! someone just posted that brick will not fit our scheme...sigh...are you people not tired of passing on the peppers' and DJ's of the world because of scheme? also i believe foster..who was a first round pick i might add..is a giant hog...crazy talk...we have had the same weakness since day 1..the line..let's just fix it once and for all...i keep hearing lets wait and gamble that some undersized guy will be money!!! well what if he's not?? then next year if we draft vince this year everyone will cry about not having a line..again...unless vince is truly magical and vince can vince all over the vince ...but you know a vince in the vince is worth as much as a vince in the vince...the early vince gets the vince...lets take this one vince at a vince...............we need help not vince....i'm not saying take brick..although it would be nice..i like the 2 williams' and hawk...but we have got to get one of these studs..i believe brick WILL protect the blind side for a long...long time

jdog
01-19-2006, 01:49 PM
Bush is a great athlete, and I know we have those other three picks. However, we could have four more picks out of this deal which would help our team more.

jmlockett
01-22-2006, 11:26 AM
Has anyone talked about getting DL and OL from free agency?
things are looking up for the defense with that great news

Erratic Assassin
01-22-2006, 11:49 AM
I'd be ok with trading the #1 to get multiple picks to strengthen the team.

Under normal circumstances I think that would be the best plan.

Problem is Casserly would bundle up those extra picks and trade them away for a bag of magic beans (Babin, etc.). So you really get no extra picks.

cap1
01-22-2006, 12:02 PM
This is a good thread.

I personally agree. I would be estatic to trade back to the 4-6 range and pick up Ferguson or which ever is the best tackle in the draft. Then pick the next best OG or C with the first pick in the 2nd round. Add that to hopefully signing Bentley as a FA and the Line will be set for years to come. :twocents:

cap1
01-22-2006, 12:04 PM
Problem is Casserly would bundle up those extra picks and trade them away for a bag of magic beans (Babin, etc.). So you really get no extra picks.


I understand how you feel about this, but hopefully with McNair and Reeves there it won't happen. Speaking of Babin, what happens to him if we switch to a 4-3?

jmlockett
01-25-2006, 10:42 PM
babin may become cannon fotter

jmlockett
01-28-2006, 07:10 PM
here's an idea......

Pick up both top picks, and hold them until the draft is done. Now get what ever we can in the draft, being sure that we draft as if we don't care if we have them or not. When the draft is over blow out both picks to the highest bidder for something we need after we see what we were able to get. I am not an expert on the draft. However I think that this might be a crafty way of doing things:stirpot: