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View Full Version : John McClain flip-flopping on VY-Carr-Reggie controversy !


nunusguy
01-11-2006, 06:25 AM
"After this season, Carr's marketability isn't all that high, anyway."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3579159.html
************************************************
Remember just a short time ago when McClain was chanting "Reggie ! Reggie !", whenever he came on 610, and saying other things like
NFL teams would be standing in line to sign Carr if the Texans didn't pick up
his option. Well we know after the Rose Bowl he now says "Reggie Who" ?
Now he's saying Carr has no marketetabilty. That just shot the hell out of his
credibility with me. What a shame, just another "journalist" flipping on a issue to sell papers.
And I thought he went to Baylor - sounds more like someone from that school on 290
about 190 NW of Houston.

rittenhouserobz
01-11-2006, 06:34 AM
Are you kidding? He is ESPN material all the way. :rolleyes:

LCOOL
01-11-2006, 07:16 AM
"After this season, Carr's marketability isn't all that high, anyway."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3579159.html
************************************************
Remember just a short time ago when McClain was chanting "Reggie ! Reggie !", whenever he came on 610, and saying other things like
NFL teams would be standing in line to sign Carr if the Texans didn't pick up
his option. Well we know after the Rose Bowl he now says "Reggie Who" ?
Now he's saying Carr has no marketetabilty. That just shot the hell out of his
credibility with me. What a shame, just another "journalist" flipping on a issue to sell papers.
And I thought he went to Baylor - sounds more like someone from that school on 290
about 190 NW of Houston.
John Mclaine is John Kerry in disguise!

royce1054
01-11-2006, 07:18 AM
this is why i dont believe him or justice and was trying to get others not to listen to them.... trust me we trade down it will get us some better talent for Kubiak and Reeves.

tsip
01-11-2006, 07:31 AM
"After this season, Carr's marketability isn't all that high, anyway."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3579159.html
************************************************
Remember just a short time ago when McClain was chanting "Reggie ! Reggie !", whenever he came on 610, and saying other things like
NFL teams would be standing in line to sign Carr if the Texans didn't pick up
his option. Well we know after the Rose Bowl he now says "Reggie Who" ?
Now he's saying Carr has no marketetabilty. That just shot the hell out of his
credibility with me. What a shame, just another "journalist" flipping on a issue to sell papers.
And I thought he went to Baylor - sounds more like someone from that school on 290
about 190 NW of Houston.


http://www.usnews.com/usnews/edu/college/rankings/brief/natudoc/tier1/t1natudoc_brief.php

Here's a link to America's Best Colleges 2006, with UT-Austin ahead of Baylor and-of course-we all know about the Baylor Bear football team--when was their last winning season?:yahoo:

Kaiser Toro
01-11-2006, 07:49 AM
Thanks for the link nunu. Not much here all sides have not heard before on this board.

Couple of things to keep in mind: Reggie Bush has until Sunday to declare and we need a Head Coach named. We may know each of these Sunday night, then it turns to DC's contract.

Marcus
01-11-2006, 08:10 AM
This is supposed to be a surprise?

This is what I can't stand about those Chronic sportswriters, McClain, Justice or Lopez, any of the three. They are nothing but bandwagon hacks who flop around more than a caught redfish on the Galveston T-head.

You just watch, you mark my fricken word. A month from now, after the VY euphoria perfect storm blows through, and as more and more fans start to have 2nd thoughts about who they should take . . . watch them start to have 2nd thoughts, too.

:challenge

HoustonFrog
01-11-2006, 08:57 AM
I don't trust he or Justice but one reason could just be from sources. If you talk to NFL guys during the season and then later some of them might not see the market for Carr, thus he reports it. I think alot of people, posters here particularly, were looking at Bush because VY was pretty much going back for his senior year. Now they are scouting him. Actually I heard McClain say the opposite yesterday about Carr and he said if we kept him and he performed well this year we could get a #1 for him the next year(if we took VY). Justice is just a Skip Bayless wannabe, sad.

BeerTastesLikeVictory
01-11-2006, 08:59 AM
Everyone forgot about one thing:

Gary Kubiak - Aggie
Vince Young - Longhorn

IT WOULD NEVER WORK

I am a graduate of Cougar high, so I am impartial.

Vinny
01-11-2006, 09:01 AM
I don't trust he or Justice but one reason could just be from sources. That's the problem with McClain...someone has to give him his opinion. He isn't a real astute observer of the game, so if he gets poor information he doesn't have enough insight and conviction to use his own head...he just goes with what he hears...and really, that's pretty smart of him in lieu of his innate lack of feel for the game. This kind of a journalist will tend to flip positions often. He knows a ton of people and has good stories from the past…that’s the only think I get from reading John. I take everything he says with a grain...or two.

djkennedy101
01-11-2006, 09:03 AM
Everyone forgot about one thing:

Gary Kubiak - Aggie
Vince Young - Longhorn

IT WOULD NEVER WORK

I am a graduate of Cougar high, so I am impartial.

Ha Ha......LOL.....good point...until the money is dangled in front of them

Vinny
01-11-2006, 09:04 AM
You guys can at least make a small effort to stay on topic...it's tough when every single thread turns into the same thread.

LCOOL
01-11-2006, 09:14 AM
"After this season, Carr's marketability isn't all that high, anyway."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3579159.html
************************************************
Remember just a short time ago when McClain was chanting "Reggie ! Reggie !", whenever he came on 610, and saying other things like
NFL teams would be standing in line to sign Carr if the Texans didn't pick up
his option. Well we know after the Rose Bowl he now says "Reggie Who" ?
Now he's saying Carr has no marketetabilty. That just shot the hell out of his
credibility with me. What a shame, just another "journalist" flipping on a issue to sell papers.
And I thought he went to Baylor - sounds more like someone from that school on 290
about 190 NW of Houston.
Heres a quote from Mclaine:
Keep Carr
While Young would be learning what it takes to play quarterback in the NFL without becoming the most sacked quarterback in the league, Carr would be auditioning for other teams that would be interested in acquiring him in 2007.

The worst thing the Texans could do would be to draft Young and trade Carr.

After this season, Carr's marketability isn't all that high, anyway.

With Kubiak coaching him, Carr's play might improve dramatically and enhance his trade value.

In Kubiak's first season, the Texans would improve faster with Carr and Bush.

But having Young watching and learning as a rookie as McNair, Palmer and Rivers did who wouldn't be eagerly anticipating his first season as a starter in 2007?

Some fans think the Texans would take a step back with Young. A step back from what? A 2-14 record?

The bottom line is this: When the worst you can do is Reggie Bush, how can you lose?

John McClain covers the Texans and the NFL for the Chronicle. john.mcclain@chron.com

Does Mclaine get his flip-flopping advice from Johnn Kerry?

eriadoc
01-11-2006, 09:31 AM
I don't put much stock in anything this city's journalists print anymore. McClain hit upon something here though (when you throw darts, eventually you'll hit something) - IF we are going to use the #1 pick and not trade down for a stud left tackle (which I advocate), then I'd prefer to see a scenario in which they draft Young and keep Carr. Play Carr for a year or two under a good coaching staff and improved line play, then make your decision based upon your evaluations at that point. I am an advocate of keeping Carr, but as I've said many times, it is less about Carr than it is about fixing the foundation (the lines) of this team before we make a decision about skill positions.

geofb
01-11-2006, 09:36 AM
McClain is the worst. Can't stand him. He talks as though he knows everything but knows little.

2 quick things on McClain. Remember the opening weekend game between the Ravens and Colts? McClain gave a long winded explanation as to why the Ravens were a great team and they were going to hand the Colts their head on a platter in that opening game. Oh well.

Also, has anyone noticed that McClain picks every game against the spread and then tallys up how he did on a season to date basis in the Chronicle? When you are picking against the spread, it is difficult to deviate very far from 50% over the course of a season. If you can average 55% over a season that is good, 60% would be fantastic. Have you seen Mr. Know It All McClain's results? I forget what the exact numbers were but it was way less than 50%. It might have been less than 40%. Flipping a coin for every game should get you real close to 50% over a season (plus or minus a little). His results are astoundingly awful for someone who seems to think they know everything about the NFL. It should be listed in the paper in the next day or two when he picks the upcoming weekends playoff game. Look at his % against the spread if you want a good laugh. It is very difficult to do as poorly as he has done over the course of a season at picking games.

exclude
01-11-2006, 10:19 AM
Yes, Mcclain is a homer, but so is Justice.

So is Rich Lord on 610, who called Vince "God" on radio. All of these guys have flipped from the pre-Rose Bowl game position of taking Bush.

I mean lets face it, most of us, (excluding me, look at my sig) have flipped from our position after that game as well as every new poster who now calls himself a Texan fan on this MB.

I mean the fortunes of 4 people(White, Young, Bush, Lienart) have changed since that game.

My point: most of us have flip-flopped. Some of us just have a bigger a forum to tell people.

swisher
01-11-2006, 10:20 AM
Doesn't really bother me, I change my mind about Bush vs Young on a daily basis now.

And these guys are paid for opinions about sports. I think you're allowed to change your mind. It's not like he's saying he's for abortion one day and then against it the other. We're talking about college prospects here...

tulexan
01-11-2006, 10:20 AM
Yeah I couldn't believe that Rich Lord called Vince Young God yesterday.

texanfan2002114
01-11-2006, 10:40 AM
Yes, Mcclain is a homer, but so is Justice.

So is Rich Lord on 610, who called Vince "God" on radio. All of these guys have flipped from the pre-Rose Bowl game position of taking Bush.

I mean lets face it, most of us, (excluding me, look at my sig) have flipped from our position after that game as well as every new poster who now calls himself a Texan fan on this MB.

I mean the fortunes of 4 people(White, Young, Bush, Lienart) have changed since that game.

My point: most of us have flip-flopped. Some of us just have a bigger a forum to tell people.


Rich Lord loved Vince before the Rose Bowl. He has always said if Vince came out this year the Texans should draft him but he also did say that he thought Vince would stay in school. Now that Vince is coming out, he is just making sure veryone knows his feelings.

beerlover
01-11-2006, 10:51 AM
I would add that McClain is an aquired taste some of it ages well while some goes sour, oxidized or even pungent (oh sorry was I drifting off subject :rolleyes: ).

McClain has creds & is a good sounding board with a broad range of sources plus he is a :homer:

Htown34s
01-11-2006, 10:59 AM
"After this season, Carr's marketability isn't all that high, anyway."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3579159.html
************************************************
Remember just a short time ago when McClain was chanting "Reggie ! Reggie !", whenever he came on 610, and saying other things like NFL teams would be standing in line to sign Carr if the Texans didn't pick up
his option.

I think McClain is talking about Carr's marketability in a trade. Carr definately has marketability as a free agent.

To me, this is actually one of McClain's better articles. I'm no fan of his at all, but here are some things I liked from this story:

Vince Young and Gary Kubiak generated almost as much buzz around the Broncos' practice facility Tuesday as Denver's divisional playoff game against New England on Saturday.

Since McClain is in Denver following Kubiak all week, I would guess this is true. Kubiak I understand, but I find it interesting the VY was generating talk all the way up in Denver.

You might have to visit Pluto to get away from the Young-to-the-Texans controversy that is spreading like a gigantic mushroom cloud.

I bet everyone on this board would agree.


Owner Bob McNair will make the decision on the top pick after getting input from his staff.

Didn't know this for sure. Glad to know its not dependant on Casserly.

Besides, passing up Bush could cause a family feud in the McNair house. Cal and Cary McNair are graduates of the University of Texas.

I think he means passing up VY here. But I didn't know both of McNair's children were Longhorns. Interesting.


Once the Texans complete the scouting process, if they have Young rated ahead of or equal to Bush, they should draft Young and keep David Carr. As the Oilers did with Steve McNair, the Bengals did with Carson Palmer and the Chargers did with Philip Rivers, make it clear to the fans and media that Young is going to watch and learn as a rookie.

I agree 100%. You can not start VY as a rookie. We need another QB, so why not Carr. If he stinks then you were right in taking VY. If he becomes a Pro-Bowler then you are in a very good position. I'd rather have a lot of cap money tied up in 2 QB's that you could still trade than 2 RB's who may be untradeable.

royce1054
01-11-2006, 11:05 AM
I have to say last season i believed him and went with his hype. Although most of the players he talked about were GONE by the time we drafted. The WR went to Minnesota and LB went to Dallas. Remember who here thought we would pass on DJ or TJ. WHO HERE THOUGHT WE WOULD TAKE TRAVIS JOHNSON. I remember people here saying WR, LB, OT.... Knowone said DL except i think i heard Lork say it one time. I believe it was Lork. Now everyone this year is either saying Bush, Young or Trade down. We know it will be one of these 3 descions. Now that Kubiak is coming in and if he switches to the 43 i dont see how we cannot trade down. We would have 7 holes or positions open if we do that. There is no room to take a RB or QB. Now if we make the deal with the Jets for Abraham i would think he would have to sign a 2-3 year deal with us for us to make that deal. If we get an Abraham remember we still have walker. Then we not that people are saying we have upgraded our D-line we have still have a hole at LB, CB, and FS on our D. Then on our O we have a hole at RT, OG, C, TE. Moreknolle has stated there is 2 very good possible FA signings at TE we could pick up. Teyo Johnson and Randy McMicheal. Now if we sign one of those thats fills 1 our 7 holes and we still have 6 holes we need starting quality at. Now if we get a Bentley or a Hutchinson that is to be seen but many teams will be fighting over them and to think we are going to sign them seems kinda farfetched to me. So say we do decide to go 43 then we would pretty much either have to go CB or LB in the 1st round. Then in the 2nd its either CB/LB or OL. Pbuc to me has shown he is not a #2 CB. If we want a starting quality CB then we will have to look in the top 2 rounds. Now i have said this in another thread if we dont get a #2 CB in FA we have to get 1. I dont know a 3rd round CB can cover an NFL #2 WR. Lets say we draft a CB in 2nd round... now we havent even addressed our offense yet. Does anyone else see this here or is just me.

tulexan
01-11-2006, 11:06 AM
This is the quote that I liked the most in the article.

For those of you who are adamant the Texans should use the first pick on Young because he's a Houston native who won a national championship for the Longhorns, here's something to consider: Championship teams aren't built on what the fans want.

And another one.

If the Texans draft Bush, who is regarded as one of the best prospects in history, all those fans who threatened to cancel their season tickets will renew because he has take-your-breath-away ability.


Emotions are high right now, but they will cool and reason will reign supreme in the decision making process.

Bobo
01-11-2006, 11:12 AM
this is why i dont believe him or justice and was trying to get others not to listen to them.... trust me we trade down it will get us some better talent for Kubiak and Reeves.

Eliminate the word "Kubiak" from this post and I agree 100%.

blockhead83
01-11-2006, 11:23 AM
I somewhat agree with his article today, Bush or Young would both make excellent choices IMO. What'll be interesting is if Bush doesn't declare, then the options dwindle to Young or trade down.

Tulip
01-11-2006, 10:44 PM
McClain has been all over the map lately, but this is a good article. He sounds solid and reasonable again, which is something he's been lacking ever since the Chronicle took him off of national coverage and put him on the beat.

bdiddy
01-11-2006, 11:00 PM
I just do not get the philosophy of we cannot trade Carr now because it would be a huge salary cap hit, yet, we can trade him a year from now when his value goes up. Will it still not be a huge hit a year from now? If you are rebuilding around VY you are starting over from stratch. Trade Carr get what you can.

By the way I would much rather have Bush. Why? Because I am objective and no longer living in the insanity that is currently Houston.

U4ikrob
01-12-2006, 10:35 AM
I agree 100%. You can not start VY as a rookie. We need another QB, so why not Carr. If he stinks then you were right in taking VY. If he becomes a Pro-Bowler then you are in a very good position. I'd rather have a lot of cap money tied up in 2 QB's that you could still trade than 2 RB's who may be untradeable.

Nice article - some good and some not so good points - McClain has been all over the board this year and most ofthe time wrong IMO. I disagree with this above PoV for a couple of reasons. The Chargers were set at 2 of the big 3 positions with LT & Boldin and then they had the draft - Choose Manning and then traded and got Rivers because they felt Brees was underachieving and needed a better starting QB. OF course now there in a position of where the Backup QB makes almost as much money as the starter - yet never plays any minutes and has caused controversy and pushed Brees to be the better QB thus far. Brees is a Pro-bowler now and they have a #1/#3 pick sitting on the bench in Rivers who never gets any PT yet had to pay 1st rounder money for a backup QB. His trade value has been reduced every year he's on the bench and after a while he will either have to be traded or may loose his confidence and never start. Thus they spent 20+ million dollars on a backup QB - And some think this was a good idea? : Boggle: :confused: Honestly with all the QB's going down this year - Im surprised nobody is contacting the Chargers to try and make a deal for Rivers. They dont need him and should have spent that money elsewhere. Of course that brings up my point above about him loosing confidence and other teams loosing confidence in him too because he has no PT to evaluate him with. So 3 years later is he still worth the 1st round pick they used on him?? Hardly IMO - Just think if the Chargers had a 1st round WR to match up with Boldin how much better they could have possibly been. IMO the Chargers made a knee-jerk call on going with another QB and now have had to pay him for the last few years to sit and twiddle while paying him 1st round money when they could have used it on FA players to give them even more advantages on the field.

Honestly I hope the Texans dont make this choice - I still feel they made a big mistake in drafting Manning/Rivers and have had to pay for it for a few years at the expense of the team. I dont want to see the Texans make that same mistake and try to play it up as an advantage. Tying up all that 1st round money in another QB is not going to help put a better O-line and Defense on the field which is where the Texans are truly lacking talent.

IMO - The texans go Bush or trade down - We have a decent RB in DD - but not in the class of an Edge - LT - etc etc.. - A game changing playmaker. Thats what IMO you go for with a 1st round pick - Last year we made the mistake IMO of drafting a D-line guy in the first round to sit the bench when we should be drafting starters/Playmakers in the 1st 2 rounds. Casserley has shown to have a horrible track record with picks thus far including his tenure in Washington and almost all of our second round and lower picks outside of DD & Mathis. Referring to the up above topic Cass- has allready spent extra picks on Backup QB's whom have never seen the field or very limited action for that matter. A backup QB IMO doesnt exactly spell cant miss trade prospect a few years down the road when he gets no PT.

My :twocents: Young is going to be a playmaker - Either with his athletic ability or his head - Time will show which he becomes [Mcnair or Vick] but IMO he's not the cant miss prospect at QB peopel are trying to make him out to be. I think he will struggle his first few years in the league and will adjust - but to what level is unknown. IMO Leinart would be a much better choice if were goign that route. Same with Bush - I think hes a playmaker, but another prospect I dont have down as a cant miss prospect as hes never shown himself to be an every down guy. Just a faster and smaller DD.

OF course I'm no Johnny Carson with a crystal ball - this is just my own observations from watching both players and looking at our team needs.

IMO We trade down and try to package a few lower round picks to give us a 2nd - 1st rounder and go for Lendale White, a starting LT and a starting TE. Go with the idea of trying to use the extra picks to fill in all the other holes on the team and try to make up some ground from the last 4 years drafts. IMO The team has a serious lack of depth and playmakers because of bad drafting and trading away picks by Casserley over the last 4 years and this is an opportunity to try and re-coup some of those losses and shore up some problem areas.

DRAMA
01-12-2006, 11:12 AM
Two things - Rich Lord calling VY GOD is just stupid. But, Rich is pretty dense though.

If Rich Lord is right and VY actually IS God well, it's funny...

....because God wouldn't start week 1 in the NFL!