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Marcus
01-10-2006, 08:10 AM
No. 1 pick won't be up to Casserly (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/justice/3576638.html)
In the end, the Vince Young-Reggie Bush debate will be Kubiak's call. Casserly isn't about to make that kind of decision.

That's why it was surprising to see a weekend report on ESPN that the Texans had already decided to draft Bush no matter what Young did.

If that leak came from inside the Texans, it probably was an attempt to get Young to stay in school. If Young had stayed, the Texans could have drafted Bush, slid him into the backfield beside David Carr and been on their way.

Now they're faced with a tougher call: David Carr or Vince Young?

Ultimately it's Kubiak who'll make it.
No Richard, it won't. It will be McNair's decision. Kubiak won't need to look at the business/marketing aspect of it. But McNair will be forced to, as distasteful as it might be.

nunusguy
01-10-2006, 08:16 AM
"Now they're faced with a tougher call: David Carr or Vince Young?"
****** To clarify, its David Carr + player(s) selected for the #1
or just Vince Young. Big difference.

eric138
01-10-2006, 08:43 AM
If I remember correctly Young mentioned before the Rose Bowl, that he would come out IF the Texans would take him. Then after the game he said he was going to sit down and discuss with his family and others to see what he should do. Then he decides he is going to come out. Now it is possible that he just decided to hell with the Texans, I'm coming no matter what, OR he could have talked to the Texans, they said yeah we want you BUT we have to do it this way (shows how they do it), then he declares.

How they do it??

First say, they ARE taking Carr.
Then make all attempts to act like we are taking Carr.
Then once the new coaching staff comes along the statement of:
"After considering all our options the new Texans decide that Carr does not fit the direction we want to take the Texans." and we pick Young.
Makes Houston happy, for the most part, and IF it doesn't work out then McNair and Casserly blame the new coaching staff and we "start over" again in four years.
OR we win,win,win and Casserly and McNair look like a Football Gods for making that pick.

Brilliant

TEXANRED
01-10-2006, 08:50 AM
To me, in my humbled, humbled, humbled, opinion, David is primed to turn the corner but needs a diffrence maker in the coaching staff. The right coach to sit down with David and teach him how to play QB in the NFL. Seeing what Kubiack has done with Plummer is a credit to Kubiack. AJ, Carr, DD, Bush, and a zone blocking scheme that really works, again in my humbled, humbled, humbled opinion, I feel next year a possible 8-8 pushing for a 9-7 and at least be in playoff talks up to the last few weeks of the season.

I know alot of people say that we are in a rebuilding process but arent we supposed to be built to rebuild? I dont ever remember this team being assembled.

Here's to three more months of talking about this.:texflag:

eric138
01-10-2006, 08:56 AM
I agree TexanRed..

I makes me sick to think that we will throw our entire team away and "rebuild" just because of poor coaching.

Problem is many people are saying Carr and new staff cna take us to the playoffs but Young and a few years can give us repeated Super Bowls.

Who knows, I don't.,.. I personally feel a team needs more than a QB like Young to get to the SB. Look at the teams that continuously get there... like Pat's and Panthers.. Brady and cousin Jake are Carr like not Young like..

Big B Texan Fan
01-10-2006, 09:00 AM
If Carrs' agent and him are smart they'll start looking at ways to get out of here. Whether it's begging the team to not pick up an option (2 year or 3 year) or learning the full scope of what the transition tag does for you and how it helps you move from one team to the next or franchise tag n' trade. Although the NFL frowns upon trading your F Tag guys cuz it was designed to help you retain players you normally couldn't keep.

Marcus
01-10-2006, 09:03 AM
****** To clarify, its David Carr + player(s) selected for the #1 or just Vince Young. Big difference.

I think that's exactly how McNair is looking at this. He wants to take the best running back in the country. A potential Barry Sanders or Gale Sayers type running back and add him to the team.

But "Houston" wants him to switch quarterbacks, without adding anything.

I can see McNair going :hairpull:

abbest
01-10-2006, 09:07 AM
I agree TexanRed..

I makes me sick to think that we will throw our entire team away and "rebuild" just because of poor coaching.

Problem is many people are saying Carr and new staff cna take us to the playoffs but Young and a few years can give us repeated Super Bowls.

Who knows, I don't.,.. I personally feel a team needs more than a QB like Young to get to the SB. Look at the teams that continuously get there... like Pat's and Panthers.. Brady and cousin Jake are Carr like not Young like..Hope you get well soon. After a 2-14 season we are rebuilding . Kubiak ia a good coach but I don`t expect him to perform miracles with the current misfits ( Carr & CO.)

Runner
01-10-2006, 09:19 AM
If we are rebuilding, the major tear down has taken place with the release of the coaches. The major rebuilding will be done when we hire good coaches. The rest of the rebuilding is minor comapred to that. IMO.

cap1
01-10-2006, 09:26 AM
I think that's exactly how McNair is looking at this. He wants to take the best running back in the country. A potential Barry Sanders or Gale Sayers type running back and add him to the team.

But "Houston" wants him to switch quarterbacks, without adding anything.

I can see McNair going :hairpull:

Marcus,
I am with you. I think McNair wants to keep Carr and add more people around him. Here is to Bush in 2006.

Buffi2
01-10-2006, 09:34 AM
If we are rebuilding, the major tear down has taken place with the release of the coaches. The major rebuilding will be done when we hire good coaches. The rest of the rebuilding is minor comapred to that. IMO.
I agree. There is rebuilding, and then there is starting all over from square one.:brickwall With some good coaching and a few key additions, the fans will (hopefully) be surprised at how good this core team can be. We came so close to winning 4 more games; surely whatever is wrong can be fixed without going back to year 1. At least that is the reality of my dream world.:)

bdiddy
01-10-2006, 09:48 AM
Fans pulling for Vince Young are matching the decision based on emotions, not looking at what is the best way to build the team. The Texans personnel right now is mediocre, however, if you add a top-tier player like Bush and several other players from the drant and free agency, this team could be playoff ready within 2 years.

Vince Young may be a wonderful QB, but he takes the Texans backwards. Sometimes you have to go backwards to go forward, but in this case there is no need. Carr will be a quality QB in the league. He has all the tool and once we improve the line and add Bush as a playmaker he will not be forced to do it on his own. Will Vince Young eventually be better than Carr, quite possibly. However, as Kubiak has stated it is about the "team," not the guy that might end up being the eventual best player. The "team" would benefit more from picking Bush and improving the o-line.

I love Vince and I am a Longhorn, but it is not the best decision once emotions are taken out of the equation. I wish Vince the best in NO or Tennessee. I hope he is a great player, but I know the Texans will be a great team.

Texan Gal 312
01-10-2006, 09:49 AM
Does it bother anyone that Justice thinks Kubiak will have significant input in the draft decision and Kubiak was on the staff that selected Maurice Clarett. In the third round as I remember. I hope one of McNairs questions during the interview was what were you guys thinking in drafting Clarett ?

cap1
01-10-2006, 09:53 AM
Does it bother anyone that Justice thinks Kubiak will have significant input in the draft decision and Kubiak was on the staff that selected Maurice Clarett. In the third round as I remember. I hope one of McNairs questions during the interview was what were you guys thinking in drafting Clarett ?

As far as the Clarett thing, The Broncos probably knew it was hit or miss. If any team could have made him into a decent running back after his time out of football it was Denver. They gave him a chance and it didn't work out. It has happened here with 3rd rounders too (Charles Hill in 2002 I believe).

TEXANRED
01-10-2006, 09:54 AM
Again in my very humbled opinion, for me its all about the coaching. Where would Montana and Young have been without Walsh? Brady with Belicheck, Marino without Shula, Aikman without Johnson, Elway without Reeves, Simms without Parcell's, would Bledsoe ever made it to the superbowl without Parcell's?

What QB has ever come out of college and been a success right away? Dont say Rothlissberger cause once again that is the coach.

In my opinion lets see what we really have in Carr once we get a new Head coach.

Runner
01-10-2006, 09:57 AM
Does it bother anyone that Justice thinks Kubiak will have significant input in the draft decision and Kubiak was on the staff that selected Maurice Clarett. In the third round as I remember. I hope one of McNairs questions during the interview was what were you guys thinking in drafting Clarett ?

Didn't you SEE the Ohio State - Miami Championship game? Clarett single handedly saved the game by ripping the ball out Sean Taylor's hand after he had intercepted a pass! He had the game winning score!! Clarett has an NCAA Championship!!! :)

Whoa - head rush. What was the question again?

No it doesn't bother me too much. Denver was talented enough that they could take a gamble on a draft pick.

Texans Horror
01-10-2006, 10:05 AM
No it doesn't bother me too much. Denver was talented enough that they could take a gamble on a draft pick.
Especially in the running game.

BREAZE
01-10-2006, 10:41 AM
If Carrs' agent and him are smart they'll start looking at ways to get out of here. Whether it's begging the team to not pick up an option (2 year or 3 year) or learning the full scope of what the transition tag does for you and how it helps you move from one team to the next or franchise tag n' trade. Although the NFL frowns upon trading your F Tag guys cuz it was designed to help you retain players you normally couldn't keep.

At least he is not in a pressure cooker now. You have fan polls wanting VY, local sport writers wanting VY, and local sports reporters who probably know him on a personal level wanting VY.

He has been the whipping boy for 4 years and I'm still on the fence as to whether he is damaged beyond repair or not, but if you have a pulse you have to feel for the guy right now. The guy has never complained which could be the very thing that keeps him here...but would he welcome that?

dirty steve
01-10-2006, 10:49 AM
Does it bother anyone that Justice thinks Kubiak will have significant input in the draft decision and Kubiak was on the staff that selected Maurice Clarett. In the third round as I remember. I hope one of McNairs questions during the interview was what were you guys thinking in drafting Clarett ?

they were also able to draft terrell davis in the 6th round.

everybody hits and misses.

Frills
01-10-2006, 10:50 AM
Justice needs to stick to being a beat writer for the stros

Texan Asylum
01-10-2006, 11:30 AM
If we are rebuilding, the major tear down has taken place with the release of the coaches. The major rebuilding will be done when we hire good coaches. The rest of the rebuilding is minor comapred to that. IMO.
AGREED!

Double Barrel
01-10-2006, 11:37 AM
I think that's exactly how McNair is looking at this. He wants to take the best running back in the country. A potential Barry Sanders or Gale Sayers type running back and add him to the team.

But "Houston" wants him to switch quarterbacks, without adding anything.

I can see McNair going :hairpull:

I agree with you. I think Mr. McNair will stick with Carr and add an offensive playmaker to the team with Bush.

I think he wants a winning product now, and starting over with a rookie QB (no matter how much potential he's got) means another 2-3 years before our first winning season. It's not often that a rookie QB just joins a team and makes them a winner, and it is especially rare (if not highly improbable) for a rookie QB to join a 2-14 team and immediately turn them into a winning franchise.

exclude
01-10-2006, 12:00 PM
Casserly and McNair look like a Football Gods for making that pick.

Brilliant


I'd never thought I'd see this but Casserly and "Football Gods" mentioned in the same sentence. :ok:

SBTexans08
01-10-2006, 12:48 PM
He has been the whipping boy for 4 years and I'm still on the fence as to whether he is damaged beyond repair or not, but if you have a pulse you have to feel for the guy right now. The guy has never complained which could be the very thing that keeps him here...but would he welcome that?


Carr is the friggin man for that!! He deserves a chance with a new coach on this team just like all the other players on this team do! And...he deserves it more than any other player here!!

Keyser Soze
01-10-2006, 12:58 PM
I agree with you. I think Mr. McNair will stick with Carr and add an offensive playmaker to the team with Bush.

I think he wants a winning product now, and starting over with a rookie QB (no matter how much potential he's got) means another 2-3 years before our first winning season. It's not often that a rookie QB just joins a team and makes them a winner, and it is especially rare (if not highly improbable) for a rookie QB to join a 2-14 team and immediately turn them into a winning franchise.

That's the way I see it.

MorKnolle
01-10-2006, 01:02 PM
Kubiak will play a significant role in who they draft, but bottom line it is McNair's decision and he will do what he thinks is best for the success of the team on the field, not what the fans are screaming for. That said, during Shanahan/Kubiak's time in Denver, they never took a QB or RB in the 1st round, so it will be interesting to see what they do, but McNair, Casserly, and Kubiak all really like David Carr, they have said they are resigning him to the 3 year option, and they have said they will not draft a QB in the 1st round with Carr here, and getting Young would essentially be trading David Carr and Reggie Bush for him which is not at all a smart deal, so between all that I say it's 0% chance Young gets drafted by the Texans. I am interested to see if Kubiak encourages McNair/Casserly to trade the pick down and go after defense/OLine help as Denver has historically done, but that will depend on whether Kubiak even comes here (it sounds like he is but it's not certain yet) and what his evaluation of our current players are. On a side note, trading Carr, drafting Vince, and rebuilding the team like that basically guarantees another 2-3 years with a maximum of 5 wins, and I think Kubiak is smart enough to not leave the successful team he has in Denver to come here and be the rebuilding coach that starts to get the team back on its feet only to get fired after 3-4 years and few wins and look really bad in the process, and allow another coach to come in and finish off the rebuilding and look like a great coach for it.

HoustonFrog
01-10-2006, 01:13 PM
I think that's exactly how McNair is looking at this. He wants to take the best running back in the country. A potential Barry Sanders or Gale Sayers type running back and add him to the team.

But "Houston" wants him to switch quarterbacks, without adding anything.

I can see McNair going :hairpull:

Just playing devil's advocate because I think they will take Bush but isn't having VY like adding a QB and a RB that can open holes for the existing backs?Just an interesting question.

Dennis007
01-10-2006, 01:22 PM
Carr is the friggin man for that!! He deserves a chance with a new coach on this team just like all the other players on this team do! And...he deserves it more than any other player here!!

What DC needs? What about the fans?! We need a QB, I'm not saying he's bad but I'm not saying he's good! texanpride



Texas champs by 8002 with DC! :fans:

SBTexans08
01-10-2006, 01:30 PM
What DC needs? What about the fans?! We need a QB, I'm not saying he's bad but I'm not saying he's good! texanpride



Texas champs by 8002 with DC! :fans:
You said nothing in your post......just FYI.

jacquescas
01-10-2006, 01:36 PM
I think everyone feels the same way, we love the hometown kid vince young, we wanna get better production from the QB position but we know we wont get much from Carr in a trade and no one is so keen on starting a rookie QB.

Kaiser Toro
01-10-2006, 01:38 PM
Carr is the friggin man for that!! He deserves a chance with a new coach on this team just like all the other players on this team do! And...he deserves it more than any other player here!!

Deserves? This is America, this is football. Nobody deserves anything, but an opportunity. Four years of opportunity is a lot in the NFL. I do grant you the fact that it was not his fault he was the #1 pick, but we owe him nothing for the amount of money he was paid for his lack of performance save one half against the frightening Arizona Cardinals defense. :rolleyes:

aj.
01-10-2006, 01:40 PM
Cass has had his wings clipped very short which makes it seem unlikely that he will hold the title of GM with this organization beyond this year, that is if he stays with the organization beyond this year. I wouldn't think he would accept a demotion in title. Actually, I think Justice is pretty much spot on with this article re: Casserly.

Dennis007
01-10-2006, 01:43 PM
Deserves? This is America, this is football. Nobody deserves anything, but an opportunity. Four years of opportunity is a lot in the NFL. I do grant you the fact that it was not his fault he was the #1 pick, but we owe him nothing for the amount of money he was paid for his lack of performance save one half against the frightening Arizona Cardinals defense. :rolleyes:

Texan Superbowl Champs in 8002 with DC :trophy:

I feel a breakthrough! LOL :heh:

OzzO
01-10-2006, 01:50 PM
Cass has had his wings clipped very short which makes it seem unlikely that he will hold the title of GM with this organization beyond this year, that is if he stays with the organization beyond this year. I wouldn't think he would accept a demotion in title. Actually, I think Justice is pretty much spot on with this article re: Casserly.

Yep I thought that an interesting piece that he called out Casserly for granting previous coach's wishes to acquire players without questioning.... and if Richard Justice knows that, everyone else already does as well.

SBTexans08
01-10-2006, 02:00 PM
Deserves? This is America, this is football. Nobody deserves anything, but an opportunity. Four years of opportunity is a lot in the NFL. I do grant you the fact that it was not his fault he was the #1 pick, but we owe him nothing for the amount of money he was paid for his lack of performance save one half against the frightening Arizona Cardinals defense. :rolleyes:
I never said anything about us oweing him.....c'mon now. I said he deserves it..................owes.....deserves.....two totally different words.

MorKnolle
01-10-2006, 02:04 PM
I think everyone feels the same way, we love the hometown kid vince young, we wanna get better production from the QB position but we know we wont get much from Carr in a trade and no one is so keen on starting a rookie QB.

I do not "love" Vince Young in any way, I don't want to see him on the Texans. I do want better production from the QB and I also know that we won't get much in a trade for Carr and am definitely not keen on starting a rookie QB.

SBTexans08
01-10-2006, 02:05 PM
Texan Superbowl Champs in 8002 with DC :trophy:

I feel a breakthrough! LOL :heh:
You're a nuisance...you know that. For your information....I made that call as soon as the franchise was declared. Up until this year.....2008 looked very possible. Likely? Maybe not.....but still possible. It looks very unlikely now.....but it's happened before to a franchise this piss poor....actually, even worse, a 1-15 team. That team? The Carolina Panthers....a complete turnaround within 2 years, representing the NFC here in Houston in Super Bowl XXXVIII.

You concentrate on nonsense however.....I wouldn't expect for your brain to compute this info very well anyhow.

Dennis007
01-10-2006, 02:05 PM
I never said anything about us oweing him.....c'mon now. I said he deserves it..................owes.....deserves.....two totally different words.

You're right, we owe him what he deserves = A Trade!

:neener: