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CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 08:34 PM
I hope this helps you guys I did this based on the same amount of games Carrs first 12 games this year compared to Youngs 12 , I put together a side by side of Carr compared to Young you will notice there isnt much difference except that Carr is playing on a pro level every defense Carr faces is better than the College defenses. Carr has 324 attempts and 194 complete thats about 60% behind a Oline that hasnt blocked well , Carr Rushed 51 times for 290 yards average of 5.7 , the only difference here is Carr didnt have near the attempts running he Passed more than Young but when Carr does run hes just as effective again on a pro level and Young on a College one. Against the Colleges with good defenses you will see Young didnt fair so well. Hope this Helps you realise Bush is the better pick.

http://www.maddenusa.net/compare.jpg


heres Carrs 2000 College stats : 349 attempts 216 complete for 2729 yards thats 62%

thats for those of you that say you cant compare College to Pro which your right its hard too but as you see Carr's passing stats in college is just as good

Vinny
01-08-2006, 08:37 PM
You cannot compare stat lines in football or every run and shoot QB would be the best qb...and that's just not the case. You have to actually watch these guys to form a credible opinion.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 08:40 PM
well I have watched both all year and I just wanted to compare the stats , if the stats should favor anyone its Young sense its college

Tulip
01-08-2006, 08:42 PM
It's not really about stats, but if you want to talk about stats to make your argument, fine.

Vince, the "running quarterback", had almost 900 more PASSING yards than Carr did.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 08:47 PM
cant go by that thats including yards after the catch in College theres alot of yards after the catch and you also have to keep in mind Carr didnt have plays called all year where he threw down field , I Like Young alot but just showing a chart to show side by side and also to show we wont be missing anything by not picking him , Young wont get all those yards in the Profesional level against Pro level defenses

Tulip
01-08-2006, 08:48 PM
Also, averaging 150-something yards a game would rate you somewhere around "awful".

Hervoyel
01-08-2006, 08:49 PM
Stats only tell part of the story and without context they are completely meaningless.

Tulip
01-08-2006, 08:50 PM
cant go by that thats including yards after the catch in College theres alot of yards after the catch and you also have to keep in mind Carr didnt have plays called all year where he threw down field

If you're going to try to qualify some of your stats, but not others, don't post them. Everyone's passing stats include YAC.

Tulip
01-08-2006, 08:51 PM
Stats only tell part of the story and without context they are completely meaningless.

Exactly.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 08:52 PM
I would personally like to have Bush and Young but I know that wont happen so you are better off chooseing what helps you now not later down the road and like I said Young wont perform the same as at the College level , most people are baseing there opinion on one rose bowl game where he faced the 39th ranked defense.

HJam72
01-08-2006, 08:52 PM
Hope this Helps you realise Bush is the better pick.


No, but it makes me realize that Trading Down is. :)

TEXANRED
01-08-2006, 08:55 PM
You cannot compare stat lines in football or every run and shoot QB would be the best qb...and that's just not the case. You have to actually watch these guys to form a credible opinion.
Carr's a run and shoot QB? Looked to me we ran the ball 70% of the time and then getting sacked another 15%. So, with that, it seems the pro QB against pro defenses still out performed a wanna be pro QB against college defenses.

Vinny
01-08-2006, 08:57 PM
Carr's a run and shoot QB? Looked to me we ran the ball 70% of the time and then getting sacked another 15%. So, with that, it seems the pro QB against pro defenses still out performed a wanna be pro QB against college defenses.That's just absurd. Young doesn't even need to throw the ball when up 45-12....his offense averaged 50 points a game or so. It's just goofy to compare anything like this.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 09:02 PM
You know its funny how people live for the moment one moment the board is all Pro Bush then after 1 College championship game alot of you are pro Young all of the sudden , had Young of had a game like he did against A&M earlier this year nobody would be even considering him , instead he has a great game against a below average Defense on national television and now hes the best thing sense sliced bread LOL

dirty steve
01-08-2006, 09:02 PM
why don't you compare carr's 2001 season to young's 2005 season? like the one where carr had 46 TD's and 9 INT's. that is so lame to compare young's 2005 NCAA stats to carr's 2005 NFL stats.

# Colorado - Hit on 21 of 36 asttempts for 198 yards and a 21-yard touchdown
# Oregon State - Threw for 340 yards on 21 of 34 passes with 4 scores,
# Wisconsin - 22 of 38 for 240 yards and a pair of touchdowns.
# Tulsa - 22 of 29 passes for 314 yards and 3 touchdowns.
# Louisiana Tech> - 319 yards on 26 of 42 tosses with 2 touchdowns
# Colorado State - 28 of 37 throws for 389 yards and 2 scores.
# Boise State - Added 30 of 49 passes for 345 yards and 3 touchdowns.
# Hawaii - 28 of 45 attempts for 400 yards and 4 scores
# Rice - 20 of 32 passes for 334 yards and 4 touchdowns.
# Southern Methodist - 25 of 37 tries for 292 yards and another 4 scores.
# Nevada - 23 of 34 completions for 368 yards and 4 touchdowns.
# San Jose State - 328 yards on 21 of 36 attempts with 2 touchdowns.
# Utah State - 21 of 27 throws for 432 yards and 6 touchdowns.
# Michigan State (Silicon Valley Bowl) - 35 of 53 attempts for a career-best 531 yards and 4 touchdowns

along with 5 rushing TD's.

that's OK, i guess.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 09:06 PM
its not lame because I am compareing the now not the past , we are trying to move forward not backward , you cant expect young to come in and set the world on fire his first year , he wouldnt even be on the same level as Carr his first year .

TEXANRED
01-08-2006, 09:06 PM
You know its funny how people live for the moment one moment the board is all Pro Bush then after 1 College championship game alot of you are pro Young all of the sudden , had Young of had a game like he did against A&M earlier this year nobody would be even considering him , instead he has a great game against a below average Defense on national television and now hes the best thing sense sliced bread LOL
That's what I have been saying, but I have been well out posted on this topic.

Seems that we are in the same minority as the "trade down in the first round" posters.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 09:12 PM
I dont want a trade down , unless it was one Heck of a Deal , I mean a really great deal , I want too see one of these guys in a Texan uniform next year along with the new coaching that would give us a positive outlook to start the new season you know out with the old in with the new type atmosphere , I was mearly stating which pick i think would have the biggest impact Now not later

Oilers/Texans
01-08-2006, 09:19 PM
You can not compare college stats to NFL stats to try and prove anything. You are comparing mustard seeds to water melons. There is no comparison at all.

TEXANRED
01-08-2006, 09:20 PM
why don't you compare carr's 2001 season to young's 2005 season? like the one where carr had 46 TD's and 9 INT's. that is so lame to compare young's 2005 NCAA stats to carr's 2005 NFL stats.



I dont get it. Why is it lame? Carr ,at a higher level, outperformed Vince at a lower level, in his championship season. The point that some are trying to make is if Young's stats in college are lower in college they will not improve when he get to the pro's where the compitition is much much harder.

The real stats we need to compare is after Vince's 2006 year and then compare Carr's 2002 stats.

Stats arent everything, the Redskins threw for 41 yards and still won their playoff game. It is a team effort and this whole entire team stank from top to bottom.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 09:22 PM
EXACTLY finally somone gets it , now imagine Young playing in the same games Carr did at that professional level do you think his stats would be even close ?

TEXANRED
01-08-2006, 09:22 PM
I dont want a trade down , unless it was one Heck of a Deal , I mean a really great deal , I want too see one of these guys in a Texan uniform next year along with the new coaching that would give us a positive outlook to start the new season you know out with the old in with the new type atmosphere , I was mearly stating which pick i think would have the biggest impact Now not later
I dont want to trade down either.

I like Bush.:cool:

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 09:34 PM
I included Carr's stats in the year 2000 at fresno for those that think Young will be any better .

heres Carrs 2000 College stats : 349 attempts 216 complete for 2729 yards thats 62%

thats for those of you that say you cant compare College to Pro which your right its hard too but as you see Carr's passing stats in college is just as good
so if its the extra yards rushing that Young gives you have Carr run more or draft Bush ;)

zeplin
01-08-2006, 09:43 PM
The comparison is interesting but only highlight the differece in the Pro game compared to the college level. And at the Pro level VY will have a big learning curve. The defensive schemes in college are not as complicated, And the speed of the game. Every NFL QB says that the NFL game speed is not the same as College.

Texans_Chick
01-08-2006, 09:55 PM
That's just absurd. Young doesn't even need to throw the ball when up 45-12....his offense averaged 50 points a game or so. It's just goofy to compare anything like this.


Funny how this point is being ignored.

IMO, VY wins the Heisman if the UT defense was bad or marginal. Too many blowouts that pulled him out of the game in the third quarter. He didn't really need to be a hero this season until the Rose Bowl.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 09:57 PM
yeah and that was against one of the worst defenses in College Ball

Texans_Chick
01-08-2006, 10:02 PM
yeah and that was against one of the worst defenses in College Ball

Why is it that before the Rose Bowl, Pete Carroll was supposed to be the mega defensive genius that would have all this time to game plan against VY and that USC was being voted on as one of the best team's ever on ESPN, but that after the Rose Bowl, people want to talk about how bad USC's defense is, ignoring their turnover stats etc, and the high powered offenses in the PAC 10 that they did shut down?

Don't answer that, it is rhetorical.

CyberTexan
01-08-2006, 10:10 PM
everyone can have a good game once in a while but the fact remains that it was USC's Offense that got them where they where , its a high powered offense of Leinhart and Bush that carried them.

TEXANRED
01-09-2006, 09:26 AM
Funny how this point is being ignored.

IMO, VY wins the Heisman if the UT defense was bad or marginal. Too many blowouts that pulled him out of the game in the third quarter. He didn't really need to be a hero this season until the Rose Bowl.
For the same reason everyone wants to ignore Bush only getting 19 touches and racking up 279 yards and a T.D. That is pretty impressive for a guy who only played for a 1/4 of a game.