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View Full Version : If Chris Simms can take a team to the playoffs


Mr. White
01-07-2006, 06:18 PM
...then Vince will take somebody to the Super Bowl. It's called "intangibles", it's called the "it factor." Whatever you wanna call it, VY has it and DC doesn't. That's the bottom line. How many come from behind wins does Carr have? Did Fresno State even win their conference when he was there? Carr at best might be another Trent Dilfer or Brad Johnson. Vince Young at best might be another John Elway or Joe Montana.

I hope Bob and Charley take note of my signature.

The Dream
01-07-2006, 06:20 PM
Did Fresno State even win their conference when he was there?

No my Cuz at Rice made sure that didn't happen...lol

tulexan
01-07-2006, 06:21 PM
Chris Simms has nothing to do with the Bucs going to the playoffs. The Bucs defense is the reason why they are there. That is like saying Kyle Orton has lead the Bears to the playoffs.

The Dream
01-07-2006, 06:23 PM
Simms hasn't been having a bad year though.

Mr. White
01-07-2006, 06:25 PM
Simms is having a good enough year to go to the playoffs. How many passes have the Bucs' D thrown into the end zone?

Sutton=08Heisman
01-07-2006, 06:26 PM
VY is taking a team to the super bowl if wed are playing in a silo

Mr. White
01-07-2006, 06:34 PM
VY is taking a team to the super bowl if wed are playing in a silo

?????:confused: ??????

dtran04
01-07-2006, 06:37 PM
If Chris Simms can, thats more proof that the Texans should trade down. If anything, Simms hurts this argument. Both of these teams have excellent defenses. We are not even close. Our depth anywhere on defense is horrible.

Grid
01-07-2006, 07:12 PM
Simms is a good example of how an average QB can get you to the playoffs if he has help from his defense and his Oline.

If Carr had the help that Simms had, im betting he could take us to a superbowl too.

Kaiser Toro
01-07-2006, 07:14 PM
Simms is a good example of how an average QB can get you to the playoffs if he has help from his defense and his Oline.

If Carr had the help that Simms had, im betting he could take us to a superbowl too.

This is why there is no need to pay first pick money on a QB.

Grid
01-07-2006, 07:21 PM
hmmm.. Well its an arguement for why its not always NECESSARY to pay first pick money for a QB.. but then there is Peyton Manning, and other 1st pick QBs in the past who have been worth the money.

Either way is a viable option. We already have Carr though, and I think we should go ahead and pay the money to keep him around for the new coaching staff.. see if he is worth it or not. ANd if not, replace him later.. there will be other QBs.. and we can focus on improving other weaknesses on the team while Carr is getting his second chance.

IshouldbeGM
01-07-2006, 07:30 PM
david carr can lead his team to the playoffs....period. I mean if kyle orton can do it, any qb can....if trent dilfer can win a sb, any qb can! The difference is the people around carr. Andre johnson is the only legitimate playmaker we have on offense. J wells and morency given a chance can both run for 1000 and catch 30 passes....we've seen how they played when given chances....domanik davis is an avg rb nothing more nothing less. The texans need to surround carr with playmakers, a real offensive line, and better coaching...bottom line!

Tulip
01-07-2006, 07:37 PM
david carr can lead his team to the playoffs....period. I mean if kyle orton can do it, any qb can....if trent dilfer can win a sb, any qb can! The difference is the people around carr. Andre johnson is the only legitimate playmaker we have on offense. J wells and morency given a chance can both run for 1000 and catch 30 passes....we've seen how they played when given chances....domanik davis is an avg rb nothing more nothing less. The texans need to surround carr with playmakers, a real offensive line, and better coaching...bottom line!

OK. Then why don't the Texans just decline to pick up Carr's option and start Dave Ragone? The Texans can just spend David's money on some playmakers and o-line for Ragone. And they can pick up another rookie QB in the 3rd or 4th round.

Mr. White
01-07-2006, 07:47 PM
I mean(GR) some of the things that people come up with in this place just make me shake my head.
More then half of these threads started have know(SP) thought or reasoning to them, just stupid statement after stupid statement(GR) know your football or just stop making these things you make your self (SP) sound like you dont know what your talking about.

What's REALLY stupid, Homer? An opinion that you don't agree with or not checking your own grammar before you push <reply>?

swtbound07
01-07-2006, 07:48 PM
chris simms can take a team to the first round of the playoffs and then lose....

Tulip
01-07-2006, 07:51 PM
chris simms can take a team to the first round of the playoffs and then lose....

LOL, I just watched the game-ending interception. Still, it must have been nice to win the division and actually go to the playoffs. I would have taken that over playing in the "Bush Bowl".

daveebarb
01-07-2006, 08:08 PM
Chris Simms has nothing to do with the Bucs going to the playoffs. The Bucs defense is the reason why they are there. That is like saying Kyle Orton has lead the Bears to the playoffs.
I AGREE. SIMS SUCKS!!!

run-david-run
01-07-2006, 08:12 PM
This is why there is no need to pay first pick money on a QB.
Peyton, Eli, and Carson might have something to say to that. This proves that you must have something to hang your hat on, whether its a great D (TB, Bears), great O (, Cincy, Pats) or well round (Redskins, Giants, etc...). We have neither. also, the bengals D led the league in turnovers. we have to be a complete team to have sucess, VY or Bush will not increase the number of sacks or turnovers our D forces...

Hervoyel
01-07-2006, 08:23 PM
Simms hasn't been having a bad year though.

Simms year vs Carrs year.

Player Games Comp Att Pct Yds Yds/Att TD INT

Simms 11 191 313 61.0 2035 6.5 10 7
Carr 16 256 423 60.5 2488 5.9 14 11


They don't look all that different to me. Their completion percentage is a half a percentage point different as is Yds/Att and Carr's got more TD's (and more INT's too) as you might expect since he played in all 16 games.

Which one is it. Is Carr "sub par" or did he not have a bad year? If Chris Simms didn't have a bad year with numbers like this then how could Carr's numbers make his year "sub-par"?

Tulip
01-07-2006, 08:52 PM
Vince Young is not remotely comparable to Joe Montana, and is hardly similar to Elway. Of all the names you could have used to make your case, why would you automatically discredit your analysis by comparing Vince to one of those two?

If you go back and read the post you quoted, you will see that he's comparing Vince to them based on intangibles.

Vince is like Elway and Montana in that he finds a way to win the ball game.

pv1999
01-07-2006, 09:51 PM
If you go back and read the post you quoted, you will see that he's comparing Vince to them based on intangibles.

Vince is like Elway and Montana in that he finds a way to win the ball game.

And they are comparable at this point in their career. You can't compare NFL Elway or NFL Montana to any college player. But Stanford Elway v. Texas Young or even Michigan Brady. But the fact remains, if Chris F'in Simms was in the post season, Vince has a shot. And since you are comparing resumes if Young was in the playoffs now, he would be the only QB with a National Championship Ring.

stevo3883
01-07-2006, 09:53 PM
And they are comparable at this point in their career. You can't compare NFL Elway or NFL Montana to any college player. But Stanford Elway v. Texas Young or even Michigan Brady. But the fact remains, if Chris F'in Simms was in the post season, Vince has a shot. And since you are comparing resumes if Young was in the playoffs now, he would be the only QB with a National Championship Ring.


Brady was on the '97 michigan team

pv1999
01-07-2006, 10:01 PM
Brady was on the '97 michigan team

Yes, you are right, he was. It slipped my mind probably because he was carrying a clipboard on a juggernaut. Vince WAS the juggernaut. So he would make two QB's with jewelry. OOPs forgot Carson.

Napa Auto Parts
01-07-2006, 10:33 PM
Chris Simms has nothing to do with the Bucs going to the playoffs. The Bucs defense is the reason why they are there. That is like saying Kyle Orton has lead the Bears to the playoffs.


Come on have you seen any of the bucs games has Simms not won any games for the bucs its ok to hate but dont let the hatred blind you.

tulexan
01-07-2006, 10:38 PM
maybe my language was a little strong, but the Defense of the Bucs, not Chris Simms lead them to the playoffs.

TB was 5-1 before Chris Simms took over the team. They went 6-4 when he was the QB.

Tulip
01-07-2006, 10:48 PM
Speaking of former Texas QBs, Major Applewhite was hired by Rice as their offensive coordinator.

He's moving up the ranks quickly.

DomDavis
01-08-2006, 01:58 PM
Chris Simms has nothing to do with the Bucs going to the playoffs. The Bucs defense is the reason why they are there. That is like saying Kyle Orton has lead the Bears to the playoffs.

Except Simms had a QB rating above 80 and led 4 (would've been 6 if not for a missed FG against the Bears and a dropped pass from Edell Shepperd yesterday) comebacks for wins in the final minutes of close games. He's quickly gaining a reputation for being one of the best young quarterbacks when the game is on the line. Orton, on the other hand, has a QB rating below 60. No comparison.

pv1999
01-08-2006, 02:03 PM
Except Simms had a QB rating above 80 and led 4 (would've been 6 if not for a missed FG against the Bears and a dropped pass from Edell Shepperd yesterday) comebacks for wins in the final minutes of close games. He's quickly gaining a reputation for being one of the best young quarterbacks when the game is on the line. Orton, on the other hand, has a QB rating below 60. No comparison.

Yea he was real clutch yesterday.

tulexan
01-08-2006, 02:04 PM
Yea he was real clutch yesterday.


For the Redskins

Kaiser Toro
01-08-2006, 02:05 PM
Yea he was real clutch yesterday.

Great value for the Bucs as a third round pick and showing marked improvement with room for further development.

DomDavis
01-08-2006, 02:05 PM
Yea he was real clutch yesterday.

Only in Texas can you find that kind of anti-Simms bias. He threw, as Paul McGuire put it, as good a pass as "anyone in the history of the NFL" could throw it to tie the game. Beautiful throw, beautiful read. Receiver didn't make the catch. Still a clutch throw.

As far as the interceptions, it's not as if he made bad reads. It's not as if he made a bad decision. The balls were tipped and fell to the wrong place. It happens sometimes.

DomDavis
01-08-2006, 02:07 PM
For the Redskins

Yeah, it's Simms' fault Tampa has a terrible offensive line and occasionally one of them gets a hand on the ball and deflects it. :rolleyes:

tulexan
01-08-2006, 02:09 PM
That last pass was not tipped. And even if it was, he was still passing to a receiver who was in triple coverage and that ball probably still would have been intercepted.

By the way, you can't believe anything that you hear with that ESPN crew. Their combined IQ is equivalent to that of a block of wood.

DomDavis
01-08-2006, 02:14 PM
That last pass was not tipped. And even if it was, he was still passing to a receiver who was in triple coverage and that ball probably still would have been intercepted.

By the way, you can't believe anything that you hear with that ESPN crew. Their combined IQ is equivalent to that of a block of wood.

You're delusional. It was clearly tipped... wasn't even debatable! It was replayed about five times. Furthermore, the Tampa receiver was wide open about 8 yards behind Marcus Washington. If not for the tip, that's a 15-yard completion and the receiver likely gets out of bounds.

As far as the ESPN crew, I'd rather someone dumb as a block of wood as opposed to someone with a significant enough bias to honestly think that last pass wasn't tipped.

Hervoyel
01-08-2006, 02:16 PM
By the way, you can't believe anything that you hear with that ESPN crew. Their combined IQ is equivalent to that of a block of wood.

You need to watch it tulexan. If you keep saying things like this you'll be lucky if you don't get sued by a block of wood alleging defamation of character.

That block of wood will have a pretty good case too. That's just an insulting thing for you to say. You owe blocks of wood everywhere an apology.

Tulip
01-08-2006, 02:16 PM
The Bucs got one more chance, taking over at their 46 after a 14-yard punt with 1:05 to go. But Simms' first-down pass was tipped at the line and intercepted by Washington, and the Redskins ran out the clock.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=260107027

I actually remembered it happening from watching the game yesterday, but there it is in print.

DomDavis
01-08-2006, 02:16 PM
Actually, I found it in the AP recap of the game... is the Associated Press now part of the pro-Simms conspiracy?

The Bucs got one more chance, taking over at their 46 after a 14-yard punt with 1:05 to go. But Simms' first-down pass was tipped at the line and intercepted by Washington, and the Redskins ran out the clock.

tulexan
01-08-2006, 02:18 PM
I saw the replay and replayed it myself on Tivo, and I didn't see any tippage. Simms had some nice passes last night. That touchdown should have been caught, but that doesn't mean that Simms didn't make some awful throws like that last interception and his slowly developing 4th and inches play.

DomDavis
01-08-2006, 02:25 PM
You're blaming him for the fourth and inches play? There was no one even close to being open - are you kidding?!?!

Let's look at the facts of that last play.

The ball went about 10 yards short of the receiver, with no other Tampa receiver anywhere close to it. Do you really think Simms would throw it to that spot for no apparent reason? It's one thing to miss a read. It's another to throw it to a person of the other team who isn't anywhere close to one of your receivers... that doesn't exactly happen all that often.

Furthermore, the ABC commentators, all Bucs and Redskins fans, and the Associated Press, Tampa Tribune and Washington Post articles all say the last pass was tipped. On the other hand, we have one individual here with a pretty clear bias claiming otherwise. I'm going to go with the former.

He didn't make a single awful throw the entire game. I'm not saying he played perfect - ideally the throw on 4th and 10 would've been a little shorter to give Sheppard a chance - but he didn't have a single throw or read that you could point to and say it was awful.