PDA

View Full Version : Vince Young = Matt Jones


BradK10
01-06-2006, 01:49 PM
per Chris Mortensen on the Dan Patrick show.

This guy is like the Peter Gammons of NFL for ESPN.

Lets take a look at this...

They both throw the ball about the same
Jones is faster than Vince
Similar size

The difference? Vince was obviously surrounded by better talent and coaching at Texas.

He's spoken with personnel people around the league, and the general consensus is "hold on a sec, don't get caught up in one game. The other point he made was "in the NFL, you don't get faster, you get slower" meaning that everything around you speeds up. He also said that if you take his thows from this year, close the passing window down, like it will at the NFL, then everything changes.

Just throwin out someone elses opinion out there since everyone else seems to be wearing their hearts on their sleeves about this.

Htown34s
01-06-2006, 02:05 PM
Vince Young=Steve McNair

VY was a better passer than Matt Jones last year, and has improved since then.

People don't realize that what makes VY great is his ability to read defenses.

And for God's sake, he's been doing this to defenses for a good year and a half, not just one game. This one game just got everyone else to notice him for the first time.

LBC_Justin
01-06-2006, 02:23 PM
This one game just got everyone else to notice him for the first time.
Yep he did the same thing against Ohio State and against Michigan last year.

I agree he does have more talent around him. But to me what makes him so great is how he preforms when the pocket clapses and his recievers are covered, that is when he squeeks through and breaks off a run for massive yardage. Plus the guy has proven on several occasions he performs well under pressure. You can't measure that at the combine.

Plus that fact that I have seen him directly hit on two occasions by future pro DBs (USC and Ohio state) and they just fell to the ground and he got the pass of for a completion. He is built like a Brick ****house, LOL

Kaiser Toro
01-06-2006, 02:26 PM
Mortensen knows his stuff, but whoever he is paraphrasing for this draft discussion is an *****. Young does not equal Jones. VY will be a very good NFL QB and Jones will be a very good NFL WR.

jacquescas
01-06-2006, 02:35 PM
I think what mortenson is saying is that Young has the potential to be a good QB at the NFL level but he isn't a lock and he doesn't have elite arm strength like Vick or Mcnabb, nor does he have the speed of a Mcnabb or Vick.

I think he can be good in the NFL in the right system, I see him as a poor man's steve young where he can easily move around and escape the pocket but he will not have 200 yard rushing days in the NFL.

after that game this board got gay married to vince its disgusting.

Youngstown Colt
01-06-2006, 04:08 PM
Vince Young=Steve McNair
Vince can't sniff being the kind of passer Steve was in college. I see no similarities. Steve could never run like Vince, and Vince could never throw like Steve.

Sorry, there's no similarities.

Afrokid
01-06-2006, 04:17 PM
McNabb is considered fast??? and that statement above could just about go to anyone comming from college including reggie bush...

rmartin65
01-06-2006, 04:40 PM
McNabb was fast. He just got old. That is why it is better in the long run to get an actual Quarterback than to get a Vick wannabe. If you want somebody to run the ball, you have runnningbacks. If you want somebody to throw the ball, you have quarterbacks.

Matt Jones had to be a WR in the NFL because he has a funky throwing motion, just like Young.

stevo3883
01-06-2006, 04:45 PM
McNabb was fast. He just got old. That is why it is better in the long run to get an actual Quarterback than to get a Vick wannabe. If you want somebody to run the ball, you have runnningbacks. If you want somebody to throw the ball, you have quarterbacks.

Matt Jones had to be a WR in the NFL because he has a funky throwing motion, just like Young.


no, Jones had to be a WR because he was a mediocre QB with a very weak arm and bad accuracy that lacked the ability to read defenses and was very mistake prone.


this is seriously grasping at such length that its ridiculous. Yes, theyre tall and fast, thats all they have in common. Jones was a so-so college player, Young is a 2x rosebowl mvp and heisman runner up.

when Matt Jones is half the football player vince is, then you can talk about comparisons.

Texas_Thrill
01-06-2006, 04:49 PM
First of all if you're going to compare him to someone I'd say McNair is as close as it got from the college aspect.

As someone who is very familiar with the Old SWAC I got to see McNair play through college.

He ran shotgun pretty much the entire time as VY has and I think the same concerns of how he would handle going UNDER center apply here as well but McNair would be a good teacher for him. I think they have very different running styles. McNair scooted where it seems VY has such a long stride it looks like he's gliding. This is just comparing them in college though.

Htown34s
01-06-2006, 04:49 PM
Matt Jones had to be a WR in the NFL because he has a funky throwing motion, just like Young.

Did you ever see Matt Jones play QB for Akansas? Just wondering if you are saying that Matt Jones and VY throw the same from experience or something that you read.

Vinny
01-06-2006, 04:57 PM
Vince can't sniff being the kind of passer Steve was in college. I see no similarities. Steve could never run like Vince, and Vince could never throw like Steve.

Sorry, there's no similarities.McNair threw for 3,541 yards and 29 touchdowns, and 10 rushing scores his last year at Alcorn State. I'd bet Young could do the same if he played there too. Young never needed to throw the ball much when you have a 42-10 lead at halftime. I think McNair is an excellent comparison.

Htown34s
01-06-2006, 04:57 PM
Vince can't sniff being the kind of passer Steve was in college. I see no similarities. Steve could never run like Vince, and Vince could never throw like Steve.

Sorry, there's no similarities.

I see Young developing into a McNair style NFL QB.

If you compare college passing, you do know which QB played at a Div 1-AA school and which one won the Div 1-A Championship, right?

tulexan
01-06-2006, 05:01 PM
If you are talking about Steve McNair, I thought he was a Heisman finalist. I didn't realize that Alcorn State ever won the National Championship.

Huge
01-06-2006, 05:03 PM
Vince can't sniff being the kind of passer Steve was in college. I see no similarities. Steve could never run like Vince, and Vince could never throw like Steve.

Sorry, there's no similarities.
McNair had over 1,600 passing attempts and only completed 55.5% of those against 1-AA competition.

To say Vince "could never throw like Steve" is a pretty short sighted viewpoint considering Vince has had games where he's completed well over 70% of his passes.

rmartin65
01-06-2006, 05:44 PM
Did you ever see Matt Jones play QB for Akansas? Just wondering if you are saying that Matt Jones and VY throw the same from experience or something that you read.
I watched a couple of their games.

nunusguy
01-06-2006, 05:48 PM
Dang, I didn't know Jones was the MVP in 2 consecutive Rose Bowls and
won the BCS championship for his team.

tulexan
01-06-2006, 05:50 PM
To be fair to Jones, he didn't have the talent surrounding him that Vince Young has and he was in by far the hardest conference.

rodog
01-06-2006, 05:52 PM
What I like about Vince, is that the kid has got the confidence to lead any team, he has a calmness about him. The kid is a born leader, thats what this team needs leadership. Leadership that Carr does not and cannot provide.:twocents:

LongBignasty1
01-06-2006, 06:04 PM
:redtowel: Johny Unitas had a funky throwing motion was he any good?

LongBignasty1
01-06-2006, 06:05 PM
Tulexan, the hardest conference is the Big 12, stop stating opinion and start with fact. Thank you

tulexan
01-06-2006, 06:07 PM
You are joking right?

run-david-run
01-06-2006, 06:39 PM
I think what mortenson is saying is that Young has the potential to be a good QB at the NFL level but he isn't a lock and he doesn't have elite arm strength like Vick or Mcnabb, nor does he have the speed of a Mcnabb or Vick.

I think he can be good in the NFL in the right system, I see him as a poor man's steve young where he can easily move around and escape the pocket but he will not have 200 yard rushing days in the NFL.

after that game this board got gay married to vince its disgusting.
No, it broke off its marrige to Reggie and started an affair with VY.

run-david-run
01-06-2006, 06:43 PM
Tulexan, the hardest conference is the Big 12, stop stating opinion and start with fact. Thank you
I realize you are being sarcastic, but please dont say Young's numbers are slanted because of the competion. If you look at any of the top 3, they all have a much better surrounding cast around them, hell, VY, Bush and Leinart lost about 4 games between them...

Youngstown Colt
01-06-2006, 06:50 PM
First of all if you're going to compare him to someone I'd say McNair is as close as it got from the college aspect.

As someone who is very familiar with the Old SWAC I got to see McNair play through college.

He ran shotgun pretty much the entire time as VY has and I think the same concerns of how he would handle going UNDER center apply here as well but McNair would be a good teacher for him. I think they have very different running styles. McNair scooted where it seems VY has such a long stride it looks like he's gliding. This is just comparing them in college though.Yes, they played in completely different offenses, have different running styles. Where are the similarities? I watched Steve up close and personal in college, and I saw none of these comparisons.

If anything, McNabb is a better comparison.

axman40
01-06-2006, 07:01 PM
IMHO VY = Joe Montana or John Elway. You do not want to see em in the last 2 min of a game , they will lead their team to score and the win!

:ok:

Huge
01-06-2006, 07:34 PM
To be fair to Jones, he didn't have the talent surrounding him that Vince Young has and he was in by far the hardest conference.
I would think the NFL scouts would've taken this into consideration when they were evaluating Jones and offered him a chance to prove he can play QB in the NFL where he'd be surrounded by better talent.

But they didn't do that...did they.

My guess would be that they looked at his overall ability (to include athletic ability, arm strength, accuracy, etc.) and decided he'd be better off playing a different position. And it would appear that Jones didn't mind agreeing with them.

My other guess would be that this will not be the course for Vince when he comes into the league.

tulexan
01-06-2006, 07:35 PM
I never said that Matt Jones was as good as Vince. I was just saying that he might not have had the same success because he was on a bad team and was in a tougher conference that's all.

cadahnic
01-06-2006, 08:30 PM
:redtowel: Johny Unitas had a funky throwing motion was he any good?

I have a pretty funky throwing motion too, maybe I should try out.

BradK10
01-06-2006, 09:23 PM
IMHO VY = Joe Montana or John Elway. You do not want to see em in the last 2 min of a game , they will lead their team to score and the win!

:ok:

ha ha ha, this bs runs thick on this board

ready to vault VY to EQUAL Montana and Elway?

Someone cue up the Tom Brady "We get no respect" tape

Tulip
01-06-2006, 09:44 PM
IMHO VY = Joe Montana or John Elway. You do not want to see em in the last 2 min of a game , they will lead their team to score and the win!

:ok:

My very favorite comparison. I never liked Montana or Elway, and part of it was because they always found a way to win, and they didn't play for my team.

Goodness, it will be a sad 2 days a year when VY is playing against us and for the Titans.

Kaiser Toro
01-06-2006, 10:02 PM
You are joking right?

Not sure if was since the numbers this year bear themselves out. ACC and Big 12 had the most bowl victories, 5 wins.

BradK10
01-06-2006, 10:09 PM
judging who's the best conference goin on bowl wins is probably the least accurate way of doing so...

but unfortunately...it's the only way

tulexan
01-06-2006, 10:15 PM
How about most ranked teams?

real
01-06-2006, 10:24 PM
Brad what high school did you go to and what yr? if you don't mind me asking?

Long-Spurs-Texan
01-08-2006, 09:48 PM
Normally, Mortenson is pretty level headed. He is an 1diot comparing VY to Matt Jones. What makes Vince Vince is the leadership combined with the physical gifts. I am disapointed in Mort. Too bad he is blinded by his man crush on Matt Jones, not to mention his son plays at Arkansas...
http://proxy.espn.go.com/nfl/draft05/columns/story?columnist=mortensen_chris&id=2025109

Errant Hothy
01-08-2006, 10:09 PM
Speaking of Mort, he was on the radio here in Dallas last Thursday and the host, Randy Galloway (aka Grandpa Urine) asked him if he agreed with all the people raving that VY is as good as if not better then Mike Vick coming out of school.

His response was an emphatic no, it porbally would have been a hell no if Mort spoke like that and he wasn't on ESPN Radio. He basically said that VY does not have the arm strenght that Vick had, nor is he as quick as Vick, he alos used two of my favorite predraft words "suddenness" and "explosiveness" and basicly said that VY was nowhere near Vick in those terms.

He basiclly said that we should and will take Bush, and that it was the right descision.

Just reporting what I heard.

Long-Spurs-Texan
01-08-2006, 10:17 PM
Hey Neighbor! The lame @$$ all Cowgirl / Maverick / Rangers local radio prompted me to buy multiple XM radios since moving here from SA over the summer. I can't stomach these local losers on the radio. They are HORRIBLE! I actually liked the AM610 hacks when I lived in H-Town. They were not afraid to whack the locals.

Errant Hothy
01-08-2006, 10:27 PM
Hey Neighbor! The lame @$$ all Cowgirl / Maverick / Rangers local radio prompted me to buy multiple XM radios since moving here from SA over the summer. I can't stomach these local losers on the radio. They are HORRIBLE! I actually liked the AM610 hacks when I lived in H-Town. They were not afraid to whack the locals.

Howdy!

No doubt to that, I know when to tune in to get the national guys with their weeekly interviews. FYI Fitzgus, on 1310AM, will start having rick Gosslin on once a week, probally starting next week. Gosslin is the BEST draft guy in the biz, very well worth your while to catch it.

Afrokid
01-08-2006, 10:34 PM
all it seems to me is that this thread is promoting the idea that Young is going to be the next Titan selected in the first round. I would actually prefer him going to the titans (if anyone ask) and i do believe he would develop into quite a qb under McNairs instruction.

Wordem
01-09-2006, 12:12 PM
If you think VY = Matt Jones, you don't watch a lot of college football. That is laughable.

TreWardTxn
01-09-2006, 10:18 PM
I think what mortenson is saying is that Young has the potential to be a good QB at the NFL level but he isn't a lock and he doesn't have elite arm strength like Vick or Mcnabb, nor does he have the speed of a Mcnabb or Vick.

I think he can be good in the NFL in the right system, I see him as a poor man's steve young where he can easily move around and escape the pocket but he will not have 200 yard rushing days in the NFL.

after that game this board got gay married to vince its disgusting.

What draft scouting report are you reading? Vince's best asset as a passer is his arm strength and ability to throw the deep ball. He could throw the ball 65-70 yards with a low arc, and that was in high school. Is he able to fit throws into the kind of windows seen in a cover two (behind the LB in front of the safety) is the question...

tulexan
01-10-2006, 12:32 AM
What draft scouting report are you reading? Vince's best asset as a passer is his arm strength and ability to throw the deep ball. He could throw the ball 65-70 yards with a low arc, and that was in high school. Is he able to fit throws into the kind of windows seen in a cover two (behind the LB in front of the safety) is the question...

Actually he does not have very strong of an arm. Most likely do to his "flinging dog poo off of his hand" throwing style.

Reddevil63
01-10-2006, 02:28 AM
Its funny how the guy from Indiana and a very well respected NFL journalist are the only guys in this thread who can see Young for what he really is

Big B Texan Fan
01-10-2006, 03:22 AM
Actually he does not have very strong of an arm. Most likely do to his "flinging dog poo off of his hand" throwing style.
Kinda like Losman huh

tulexan
01-10-2006, 11:31 AM
Actually Losman does have a very strong arm. He just doesn't have an accurate one.