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Frills
12-19-2005, 12:51 PM
Anyone know what the issue is?

I heard swelling and pain, but what is causing it?

Seeing Wells and Morency play well yesterday, wouldn't it be a better idea to IR DD for the rest of the season, get him fixed for next year?

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 01:20 PM
Not just yet. He's a few yard short of that all-defining 1,000 yards that he gets every year, win or lose, rain or shine. He'll sit probably next week too and then against SF he'll come out in a totally meaningless game and run for a hundred or more yards against a lousy defense. He'll get his thousand and the talking heads on TV will act like he's another Emmitt Smith or something.

Just watch and see what happens. If there's not something seriously wrong with his knee then that's what will take place.

eriadoc
12-19-2005, 01:29 PM
Since it's been the same injury all season long (the knee), I'm betting he has some sort of torn cartilage and will have minor surgery after the season. I am not a doctor, nor do I pretend to play one on the message boards, so that's just my SWAG.

Jack Bauer
12-19-2005, 01:32 PM
He's a few yard short of that all-defining 1,000 yards that he gets every year, win or lose, rain or shine.

Got the sarcasm Herv...

Why is it that the media continues to place so much emphasis on 1000 yards rushing, when we all know this is commonplace now and not such an "all-defining" statistic (sarcasm detected)? The standard should be at least 1300 yards now.

Jack Bauer
12-19-2005, 01:34 PM
Since it's been the same injury all season long (the knee), I'm betting he has some sort of torn cartilage and will have minor surgery after the season. I am not a doctor, nor do I pretend to play one on the message boards, so that's just my SWAG.

Hey, I thought you were a doc! eria"doc"!! :challenge :)

eriadoc
12-19-2005, 01:39 PM
The standard of 1000 yards as a running back came about when the season was 14 games long and it averaged out to 71.something yards a game. Add two games at 72 yards, and that makes it 1144 a year. And I could be wrong, but I think it was more of a running era back then. Personally, I'm more concerned about YPC average. If we have a back that averages 4.0 YPC, then the other numbers can move around, based on game planning.

MorKnolle
12-19-2005, 01:58 PM
He injured his knee in our first game with the Colts, probably because he carried the ball like 22 times in the first half. They held him out of the next couple games and have held him out of most practices since then but that kind of thing needs more rest so it likely won't get better until the season ends and he can take some time off.

stevo3883
12-19-2005, 02:01 PM
Got the sarcasm Herv...

Why is it that the media continues to place so much emphasis on 1000 yards rushing, when we all know this is commonplace now and not such an "all-defining" statistic (sarcasm detected)? The standard should be at least 1300 yards now.


Clinton Portis had like 1350 yards last year and was considered a big disappointment.

DD gets 1000 and hes our best player on the team, and one of the best in the league.

doesn't make much sense.

z0rpAn
12-19-2005, 02:07 PM
Clinton Portis had like 1350 yards last year and was considered a big disappointment.

DD gets 1000 and hes our best player on the team, and one of the best in the league.

doesn't make much sense.

touchdowns...

<<EDIT>>

and receving yards, DD had ?1700? total last year i believe

stevo3883
12-19-2005, 02:10 PM
touchdowns...

<<EDIT>>

and receving yards, DD had ?1700? total last year i believe


Portis season last year is comparable to DD's this year.

but yet portis was a major disappointment, and DD is a fantastic RB.

infantrycak
12-19-2005, 02:12 PM
Clinton Portis had like 1350 yards last year and was considered a big disappointment.

DD gets 1000 and hes our best player on the team, and one of the best in the league.

doesn't make much sense.

Pretty obvious answer--because people credited Portis with being better than he was ripping off 1500 yd 5.5 ypc seasons in Denver and then he went to Washington and it is obvious OL's actually matter for more than pass blocking and elite RB's are created as much as they are born. Doesn't mean Portis isn't better than DD, he is--just not as much as the 2003 stats would say.

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 08:29 PM
Pretty obvious answer--because people credited Portis with being better than he was ripping off 1500 yd 5.5 ypc seasons in Denver and then he went to Washington and it is obvious OL's actually matter for more than pass blocking and elite RB's are created as much as they are born. Doesn't mean Portis isn't better than DD, he is--just not as much as the 2003 stats would say.


But Portis is right back on track for another 1,500 yard season so how does that work? He's carrying the rock more but he's also holding up to the load and his average is going back up.

I think elite RB's are born and then they must have an opportunity to perform. Davis is on his third straight season of "opportunity" but he can't be what he isn't. Davis isn't going to ever be able to withstand a 300-350 carry season and stay healthy.

real
12-19-2005, 08:35 PM
DD has a ceiling of about 1250...I dont ever see him getting past 1250 rushing yards...

touttail
12-19-2005, 09:15 PM
Since it's been the same injury all season long (the knee), I'm betting he has some sort of torn cartilage and will have minor surgery after the season. I am not a doctor, nor do I pretend to play one on the message boards, so that's just my SWAG.


Thought you were hence tha name doc!

Bobby 119C:brickwall

Frills
12-20-2005, 11:57 AM
Just read he'll sit out practice all week and be a game time decision.

Is there really any harm in IR'ing him now?

El Tejano
12-20-2005, 01:02 PM
Okay, so seeing how many pro athletes who have surgery struggle for the better part of the start of the season, do we still think not getting Bush is a good thing?

I know Wells and Morency are good but they can't carry the load for a half season.

Frills
12-20-2005, 01:15 PM
Okay, so seeing how many pro athletes who have surgery struggle for the better part of the start of the season, do we still think not getting Bush is a good thing?

I know Wells and Morency are good but they can't carry the load for a half season.

Bush averages 13 carries a game, Wells can carry more of a load than Bush ever will

MorKnolle
12-20-2005, 01:21 PM
Just read he'll sit out practice all week and be a game time decision.

Is there really any harm in IR'ing him now?

Why would we bother to IR him with two games left? It's not like we need to open up a roster spot for Jonathan Anderson to be promoted from the practice squad.

run-david-run
12-20-2005, 03:47 PM
Wells has had less then 100 carries this year. He has started a few games (Indy, Jags, Arizona) that means that in the rest of the season, when DD is playing, he has had about 40 carries. I really dont understand this staff in not using anyone else to share the carries. The only time we run is when DD is in the game and every season he gets hurt. If our coaches acctually learned how to use the bench, DD would be healthy the whole year and be flirting with 1300 rushing yards...

Texan Asylum
12-20-2005, 04:42 PM
Wait a minute, that would mean that the coaching staff would be multi-taskers and I don't think that was a requirement to be a coach for this team.

Texans Horror
12-20-2005, 04:51 PM
Clinton Portis had like 1350 yards last year and was considered a big disappointment.

DD gets 1000 and hes our best player on the team, and one of the best in the league.

doesn't make much sense.

DD's an average back, but I think he's lauded in Houston because unfortunately, yeah, the dude puts up a lot of Houston's offense. As much as I appreciate it, that's not saying much.

MorKnolle
12-20-2005, 05:32 PM
Clinton Portis had like 1350 yards last year and was considered a big disappointment.

DD gets 1000 and hes our best player on the team, and one of the best in the league.

doesn't make much sense.

2004 Stats:..........Clinton Portis.....Domanick Davis
Rushes.......................343.................. .302
Rushing Yards.............1315..................1188
Yards Per Carry............3.8....................3.9
Rushing TDs..................5......................13
Receptions...................40................... .68
Receiving Yards............235...................588
Receiving TDs................2......................1
Total Yards................1550.................1776
Total TDs.....................7.....................14
Team Total Yards........4397..................5128
Rank..........................30th................ .19th
% of Team's Offense....35.3%...............34.6%

Davis had 226 more total yards and 7 more total TDs than Clinton Portis last year and averaged more yards per carry. Portis had a slightly higher % of his team's total offense for a far worse offense.

Season Averages:...Clinton Portis.....Domanick Davis
Games.........................44.................. ...29
Rushes......................302.0................. 270.0
Rushing Yards............1471.3...............1109.5
Yards Per Carry............4.9.....................4.1
Rushing TDs................11.3...................10.5
Receptions..................37.0.................. 57.5
Receiving Yards..........304.3..................469.5
Receiving TDs..............1.3.....................0.5
Total Yards...............1775.7...............1579.0
Total TDs....................12.7..................11.0

Thru 2004 (three seasons for Portis, two for Davis) they have had relatively similar stats, but you can see how Portis' season last year dropped off so much from the production that he had with Denver (hence he was called a disappointment last year, even though many people expected such a drop off by going from Denver to Washington). Denver's proven to be able to churn out 1000 yard rushers like no one else can and will make any RB look good. I'm not saying Davis is better than Portis but in Denver's system I think he could put up huge numbers, and he put up better numbers last year than Portis did in Washington.

HJam72
12-20-2005, 05:50 PM
57.5

How do you get half a reception? :confused:

Did someone else catch it simultaneously? :)

abbest
12-20-2005, 06:41 PM
Bush averages 13 carries a game, Wells can carry more of a load than Bush ever willBush plays on a winning team that doesn`t need him to carry more than that. USC blows teams out before halftime and Bush is directing the Band. dont hate--appreciate

MorKnolle
12-20-2005, 08:31 PM
57.5

How do you get half a reception? :confused:

Did someone else catch it simultaneously? :)

SEASON AVERAGES as it says on there, didn't you notice all the other decimals too?

sprtsfanatic
12-20-2005, 10:05 PM
2004 Stats:..........Clinton Portis.....Domanick Davis
Rushes.......................343.................. .302
Rushing Yards.............1315..................1188
Yards Per Carry............3.8....................3.9
Rushing TDs..................5......................13
Receptions...................40................... .68
Receiving Yards............235...................588
Receiving TDs................2......................1
Total Yards................1550.................1776
Total TDs.....................7.....................14
Team Total Yards........4397..................5128
Rank..........................30th................ .19th
% of Team's Offense....35.3%...............34.6%

Davis had 226 more total yards and 7 more total TDs than Clinton Portis last year and averaged more yards per carry. Portis had a slightly higher % of his team's total offense for a far worse offense.

Season Averages:...Clinton Portis.....Domanick Davis
Games.........................44.................. ...29
Rushes......................302.0................. 270.0
Rushing Yards............1471.3...............1109.5
Yards Per Carry............4.9.....................4.1
Rushing TDs................11.3...................10.5
Receptions..................37.0.................. 57.5
Receiving Yards..........304.3..................469.5
Receiving TDs..............1.3.....................0.5
Total Yards...............1775.7...............1579.0
Total TDs....................12.7..................11.0

Thru 2004 (three seasons for Portis, two for Davis) they have had relatively similar stats, but you can see how Portis' season last year dropped off so much from the production that he had with Denver (hence he was called a disappointment last year, even though many people expected such a drop off by going from Denver to Washington). Denver's proven to be able to churn out 1000 yard rushers like no one else can and will make any RB look good. I'm not saying Davis is better than Portis but in Denver's system I think he could put up huge numbers, and he put up better numbers last year than Portis did in Washington.

Look at DD's durability...we have yet to see him go through a full year without an injury that does not sideline him for several games throughout the course of the year....now if that doesnt concern you...then i dont know what will.

eriadoc
12-20-2005, 11:43 PM
Look at DD's durability...we have yet to see him go through a full year without an injury that does not sideline him for several games throughout the course of the year....now if that doesnt concern you...then i dont know what will.

Define "several", please. If he's sidelined for "several" games per year and still posting 1700 total yards, then he's a heckuva lot better than I've been giving him credit for!

Tell ya what, go add up his rushing attempts and receptions (ie, how many times he touches the ball) and compare that to some other backs in the league. If you get really ambitious, go ahead and average out his production per touch and compare that to other backs in the league.

I'm not trying to come across as attacking your post specifically, so please don't take it that way. It's just that the durability issue is overblown a bit, especially lately. DD could benefit from another back to share carries with him, but he's been a very productive back during his short career and people do not seem to want to give credit where it is due.

texplayer2
12-20-2005, 11:58 PM
Bush averages 13 carries a game, Wells can carry more of a load than Bush ever will

What???Bush hasn't need more than 13 carries "On Average" to get his team ahead and sit down. That has nothing to do with his potential.

HJam72
12-21-2005, 02:39 AM
We have Wells AND Morency. We don't even need DD to play the 13 or 14 games a year that he plays. When he sits down, we lose very little and that's not a knock against him. His backups are exceptional for bench players. I still think Wells should get a quarter every other game and so should Morency. Fresh legs.

Malloy
12-21-2005, 05:32 AM
57.5

How do you get half a reception? :confused:

Did someone else catch it simultaneously? :)


Or even better, 1.3 recieving TD's :)

aj.
12-21-2005, 08:10 AM
Define "several", please. .

Last week was DD's sixth full game missed due to injury since his start in '03. Saturday could be his seventh. In just under three seasons, that's enough to cause at least a little concern, especially since each missed game is due to a unrelated nicks and dings - usually knee and ankle, sometimes ribs and wrist - and not all due to a chronic issue. The Texans are wearing him out and he needs relief more often.

Here's a list of some of the top RBs in the NFL and the number of games each has missed due to injury during the same period (2003 season to now):

Shaun Alexander - 0
Tiki Barber - 0
L.Tomlinson - 1
Edgerrin James - 3
Clinton Portis - 4
Warrick Dunn - 5 (all in '03)

eriadoc
12-21-2005, 10:49 AM
Last week was DD's sixth full game missed due to injury since his start in '03. Saturday could be his seventh. In just under three seasons, that's enough to cause at least a little concern, especially since each missed game is due to a unrelated nicks and dings - usually knee and ankle, sometimes ribs and wrist - and not all due to a chronic issue. The Texans are wearing him out and he needs relief more often.

Here's a list of some of the top RBs in the NFL and the number of games each has missed due to injury during the same period (2003 season to now):

Shaun Alexander - 0
Tiki Barber - 0
L.Tomlinson - 1
Edgerrin James - 3
Clinton Portis - 4
Warrick Dunn - 5 (all in '03)


I get that. Seven qualifies as several, I suppose. But the post I pointed out stated several per season, which is simply not true, and only serves to perpetuate a common exaggeration.

MorKnolle
12-21-2005, 10:57 AM
Look at DD's durability...we have yet to see him go through a full year without an injury that does not sideline him for several games throughout the course of the year....now if that doesnt concern you...then i dont know what will.

Davis missed three games in his first two years (three more this year) while Portis missed four games in his first three years. RBs will get injured from time to time and Davis' this year was from him being overworked IMO (went on injury report after first game against Colts when he had 22 first half carries) and never getting a chance to fully recover. If we had brought Wells and Morency in there for a few more plays throughout the whole year then I don't think Davis would have any problems.

Coach C.
12-21-2005, 11:02 AM
Until DD gets some relief, or better said a coach that relieves him more often, he will continously get dinged and nicked. RBs take more punishment than any skill player and need to have some type of relief or a philosophy change in their running style. Take Tiki Barber, he does not run up the gut as much as DD does, because he is a smaller back in order to keep him healthy they make sure that he does not take as much punishment. Also, I think DD has not learned the art of deflecting punishment, such as many smaller backs due. DD has good size, but he is a smaller back by most standards. We have Wells who is adequate if he stops dancing and just runs downhill, and we have Morency who is DD with less break tackle ability and more speed. He also needs to learn to stop dancing. We have a mid/top flight RB and two adequate support guys that could stand to take 10 carries per game from him. Morency should have been our 3rd down back at the beginning of the year. DD does get injured more than I like, but it is system and inexperience more than he is just fragile.

PapaL
12-24-2005, 11:13 AM
So once again, anyone know DD's status for this week? Seems like this is the question of topic every week.

Dre_80
12-24-2005, 12:00 PM
Dom Davis is OUT! Jonathan Wells will start.