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View Full Version : My Thoughts on Today's Game vs. Arizona


TexansAllTheWayBaby
12-18-2005, 06:35 PM
Well, today was a tremendous game by our Houston Texans.

I thought we fought. We fought with emotion and itensity. Two key elements. We picked up a big win, and I'm proud of it.

In terms of offense, we played nice. Our execution shined today, we completed passes, and established a solid running game. This one obviously one of the better offense games we played this year.

Defensively, steller performance I feel. We pressured the passer from various angles, and the result was a good number of sacks on the day. We also got 2 interceptions. That is the sign of a good defense.

In the third phase of the game, special teams, a significant improvement from last week. Kris Brown nailed his field goals, we had solid punt and kick returns, and for the most part good punts. We also foreced a fumble on special teams, when we kicked off to them. Great job.

It takes courage to fight the way we did today given the situation. I thought their was a lot of speculation on whether our team was playing full force or not due to the no. 1 pick, and today's game ended all of that talk. Our team consists of fighters. I've always said that and I strongly stick to it today.

With a team like this, we can experience many more days like this.

Fans- superve job at Reliant Stadium today, I apploude you. I also credit you who cheered on greatly for a Texans win at home, as I did.

Good win today, now we can build on it next week against a Jacksonville team which will be fighting for a playoff berth, similar to last year when we played them.

Go Texans!:redtowel:

Fiddy
12-18-2005, 06:42 PM
...we completed passes... Yeah, we got that hitch pass down. :dontknowa

Kurt Warner had 35 less passing yards than Carr...on 23 less attempts. (And I think Warner only played one quarter.)

tulexan
12-18-2005, 06:43 PM
We got lucky. Warner was looking really good even on one leg. I have no doubt that if he played the entire game we would've been blown out.

Goldeagle
12-18-2005, 06:45 PM
Yes, Warner is a great QB, and if we had an O-line we would not have to do a 1 step drop pass all the time. Its embarassing to see what we have to call for our offense due to these guys.

I really hope to kick the you know what out of Jax since they are our Rival. Be nice to rain on their parade.

bpergrem3
12-18-2005, 06:46 PM
This win means nothing. A crappy team beat another team.

If it means anything, it's that if we beat SF in two weeks we will drop to the 4th or 5th pick of the draft.

And that is just soooooooooo freaking great. I can't freaking wait.:redtowel: :redtowel: :redtowel:

Goldeagle
12-18-2005, 06:48 PM
I hope we win out and show some heart. I was not mad today watching our team play. I actually ENJOYED 3 hours of my life with this team

bpergrem3
12-18-2005, 06:50 PM
I didn't get it on TV today. Fox showed the New Orleans - Carolina game

Fiddy
12-18-2005, 06:53 PM
Yes, Warner is a great QB, and if we had an O-line we would not have to do a 1 step drop pass all the time. Its embarassing to see what we have to call for our offense due to these guys.

I really hope to kick the you know what out of Jax since they are our Rival. Be nice to rain on their parade. Carr had plenty of time today. The Cardinals were the ones that didnt. And Carr was calling most of the plays, atleast in the first half, according to the SR610 crew.

Either way, Carr screwed up a few times:
1) Before our first TD, Carr had plently of time, got happy feet and instead of stepping up and getting a few more seconds, he scrambled forward for a yard or two.
2) At our 8, 2nd down, 20 seconds left in the half, Carr spikes the ball to get to the 3rd down and then calls a timeout so he wasted a down. We have to settle for a FG.
3) The INT. The LB baited him like Carr was a rookie.
4) After we had gotten a turnover, Carr scrambles to buy time and then instead of throwing it away, tries to pick up 2 yards and fumbles the ball.

If Warner plays the entire game, we lose.

Kaiser Toro
12-18-2005, 07:02 PM
2) At our 8, 2nd down, 20 seconds left in the half, Carr spikes the ball to get to the 3rd down and then calls a timeout so he wasted a down. We have to settle for a FG.

This is the one that blew my mind. In a frantic state he hurries the team when we have 40 seconds left in the game and gets them to the line and spikes the ball. In the infinite wisdom that either Pendry or Carr have they call a hitch to Bradford for -1 yards. They are, how do you say, not as smart as they look. Carr has as much feel for the game as someone who spends their whole day rooting for their favorite team to lose.

2-7-ARI19 (:45) D.Carr pass to C.Bradford to ARZ 8 for 11 yards (D.Macklin). (1 yard after catch.)
1-8-ARI8 (:28) D.Carr pass incomplete.
2-8-ARI8 (:28) D.Carr pass to C.Bradford to ARZ 9 for -1 yards (A.Rolle, L.Reid).

Runner
12-18-2005, 07:05 PM
In the first half we were certainly capable of capitalizing on a team that gave us good field position on every kick-off. I haven't read the game thread yet where I'm sure this has been brought up, but those kick-offs away from Mathis were giving us the ball between the 40s every time. On top of thier obvious fear of Mathis, I was wondering why they kicked it to Wells instead of Norris. Apparently our players were talking about the same thing on the sidelines. That was pretty poor game planning by the Cards.

Double Barrel
12-18-2005, 08:03 PM
It's good to feel a win today. Regardless of how meaningless it is in this dismal 2-12 season, it's still nice to go to a game and cheer our team to victory. :thumbup

Even though it was the lowly Cardinals, I still think we've got some talent on the team. We just need a new front office to come in and put the peices together (with some new peices, of course), and turn things around.

It'll happen. Just takes time. :texflag:

Goldeagle
12-18-2005, 08:06 PM
I also saw 3 dropped passes and why does our team call roll outs to Carrs opposite throwing arm?

stevo3883
12-18-2005, 08:07 PM
I also saw 3 dropped passes and why does our team call roll outs to Carrs opposite throwing arm?


Dom thinks it looks cooler when he throws across his body

Vinny
12-18-2005, 08:08 PM
I also saw 3 dropped passes and why does our team call roll outs to Carrs opposite throwing arm?If we kept the gameplan to what Carr does best we would only throw hitch passes....oh wait, our long pass was 11 yards. nevermind.

wiley2002
12-18-2005, 08:10 PM
I got stuck watching either the Colts' tromping or the onslaught the Panthers gave the Saints. What happened to showing Houston in the Corpus Christi area? You bet they make sure to show Dallas games though. Everyone seems to be a Cowgirl fan down here.

:penalty: :challenge :tv:

Bullpen Drew
12-18-2005, 08:15 PM
I got stuck watching either the Colts' tromping or the onslaught the Panthers gave the Saints. What happened to showing Houston in the Corpus Christi area? You bet they make sure to show Dallas games though. Everyone seems to be a Cowgirl fan down here.

:penalty: :challenge :tv:

At least the Cowgirls lost! Don't worry, we will be on every Sunday next year after we draft Bush!

bigcarlos
12-18-2005, 08:17 PM
Games havent been shown here in SA and Austin as of late

Buffi2
12-18-2005, 08:19 PM
I felt pretty good about today's game - even though we were playing a totally inept team and went through three QB's. The team was obviously trying their darndest to play as well as they could - possibly to impress Reeves.

Carr (sigh) and I've been a Carr supporter for the most part, had something like a 4 yard average per pass. Now, that isn't going to cut it over the long haul and I'm really hopeful that since we are probably going to keep him that someone can manage to un-teach him that one step, sharpen the o-line, and make him a long passer once again. Our running game was pretty good - given who we were playing - but we still don't have a playmaker in that dept. DD doesn't appear to be able to stay healthy for even half a season and that isn't going to cut it either.

The fans were good. Not much booing, no sacks, no Reg-gie chants. Our team may not be the greatest - but we have the greatest fans!

I just tuned in so I don't know if this has been asked and answered already. Why does Capers and Co change things in the second half when the first half is working? Working better than usual, anyway. Haven't they heard if it ain't broke don't fix it? The offense that came out in the second half bore no resemblance to the offense that went to the dressing room at the end of the first half. Most perplexing.

Goldeagle
12-18-2005, 08:27 PM
Guys, our O line is that bad, that is why we only do 1 step drops and passes, WE CANT DO ANYTHING ELSE!

Vinny
12-18-2005, 08:30 PM
Guys, our O line is that bad, that is why we only do 1 step drops and passes, WE CANT DO ANYTHING ELSE! Carr makes this line look much much worse than it really is. For me it's really frustrating to watch such bad QB play game after game after game. If Carr had some dynamic plays mixed in with all the short hitch passes I'd be a bit happier...but he can't read defenses and the team doesn't let him throw to the middle of the field because they don't trust him.

Goldeagle
12-18-2005, 08:45 PM
Carr makes this line look much much worse than it really is. For me it's really frustrating to watch such bad QB play game after game after game. If Carr had some dynamic plays mixed in with all the short hitch passes I'd be a bit happier...but he can't read defenses and the team doesn't let him throw to the middle of the field because they don't trust him.


I dont think they run anything because if he drops back he gets sacked. They cant run much down the middle because Carr with this O-line an O-line that Mark Schlerith of ESPN (Former lineman) called the worst O-line he has ever seen in all his years of football. The problem with Carr is that he has not developed as Joe Theissman and Tony Dungy have said because of this O-line. Dungy went on to say not even Peyton Manning could do any better.


Carr could be shell shocked though and that means damaged goods. I wont argue with how you feel cuz that is your opinion and well it is yours. I just disagree, this O line has made Carr look FAR more worse than he has or could ever make them look bad.

mean mark8
12-18-2005, 08:48 PM
We won the turn-over battle and this third string QB wasn't from Harvard. Of course he still put up better numbers than Carr. I can't wait until the end of the season to see everyone on Caper's staff including himself get the axe as well as Casserly. I'm not too worried about the Reggie Bush bowl. We have lots of needs to fill and we'll be picking a top 5 guy no matter what.

Goldeagle
12-18-2005, 08:49 PM
We won the turn-over battle and this third string QB wasn't from Harvard. Of course he still put up better numbers than Carr. I can't wait until the end of the season to see everyone on Caper's staff including himself get the axe as well as Casserly. I'm not too worried about the Reggie Bush bowl. We have lots of needs to fill and we'll be picking a top 5 guy no matter what.

Thank God Navarre was not from Harvard lol!

ghostlight
12-18-2005, 09:02 PM
Vinny, that's how I see it also. The Ol has given some better protection and Carr seems to react to quickly to step out of protection. There have been open receivers down field but his movement puts him in harms way much to often.

Kaiser Toro
12-18-2005, 09:17 PM
If Carr was indeed calling his own plays he must be commended (no sarcasm) as he managed the game well enough to win and I applaud that. However, what is Carr the playcaller saying about Carr the QB when 75% of his passer are passes within 3 yds of the line of scrimmage.

Did anyone notice that DC the playcaller only threw to AJ once after 13:18 in the second half and that was the interception. Before 13:18, AJ had seven catches, wouldn't someone who has their finger on the pulse of the game know that AJ had no looks. Did anyone on the staff tell DC, or do you think they were hanging DC out to dry and expose his lack of QB IQ?

After 12:13 and us up by 27-10 we go the following on our possessions fo the rest of the game:
3 and out
3 and out
5 and interception (interception was not caused by OLine)
3 and out
2 and fumble (fumble was not caused by OLine)
3 and out
3 and FG

Once again I commend DC for taking advantage of this opportunity, but it was not a total victory, in my opinion, in the eyes of Dan Reeves.

Hervoyel
12-18-2005, 09:28 PM
For me it's really frustrating to watch such bad QB play game after game after game.

Exactly and it never seems to be addressed, only gameplanned around. For instance say they drafted a QB who could only throw 5 yard passes to his left as long as his target was standing perfectly still and then instead of going "wait a minute? This is nuts!" they decided to take all of the passing plays out of the playbook that didn't fit this description instead of trying to teach him to do something else.

I really wonder sometimes if I've ever seen anything like this before in the NFL. I mean, admittedly I've really only paid a lot of attention to Houston teams (Oilers, Texans) but I don't think I've ever seen an offense cut back (almost completely) to one single type of play before. I swear I think the Oilers gave Bucky Richardson more variety to work with when he got a start.

Double Barrel
12-18-2005, 09:36 PM
I've been wanting them to start Banks or Ragone the past few games just to see what they could do behind this line. What do we have to lose? If someone else can step in and make something of it (like Brad Johnson did with the Vikings), we'd have a better idea in the debate of Carr vs. o-line.

He had some pretty weak throws today, that's for sure.

Grndzro
12-18-2005, 10:32 PM
There are definately Pro Carr and anti-Carr members of this forum and I see for the most part everyone falls either far right and far left. I tend to stay in the grey somewhere in between. I think it is a combination of things that have detered his progression. The combination of o-line, coach philosophy, and Carr himself. I believe the coaching staff got tunnel vision on the sack issue that they have ruined this offense to the point that it is completely broke. Some of you have such "inside knowledge" that you know how the plays are called and what Carr is told by the coach. Vinny I really enjoy your knowledge of the game and your point of view, but I have noticed over this season that you have been increasingly bitter and down on the whole team even when there are some good things that happen (I will say they are few and far between). I can not remember one good thing you have said about this team. I can understand because of the product that is now on the field, but I think you were once alot more even keeled than I have seen this season. I could be wrong, but I look forward to the old Vinny's return. I think it will take Carr making some changes, a coaching change, and more offensive talent to really make it a better product. Remember the old saying about the glass being half full, lol.

Vinny
12-18-2005, 10:33 PM
Thanks for the nice words and the semi-backhanded compliment but I don't gloss homerisms for 2-12 teams that are 30th and 31st in the NFL on both sides of the ball. We have been awful this year...no getting around it.

Grndzro
12-18-2005, 10:50 PM
Vinny I completely understand and I by know means want to gloss anything over, but at the same time I understand all that seems to be wrong with this team yet I respect the fact that they come out play hard, don't quit, and have some heart. Eventually that will get them further than you might think in the future. I understand your points on talent and I agree on several issues but not all on Carr, but i will give credit to them when they warrent it. I look forward to your contiued knowledge and assessment.

mean mark8
12-18-2005, 11:15 PM
Does anyone else notice that JP Losman, and 2 3rd string QBs nobody has ever heard of have had better stat lines when we've played them than Carr has had in the same game? I'm more with Vinny, our defense is horrible and I want some honest competition for Carr's job. I don't think in the 32 years I've followed pro football I've seen a team so blindly stick with one QB who's having such a cruddy year. After 14 games, Carr has finally gone over 2,000 yards yet he's the only QB to have thrown a pass for us all year. We've been blown out in lots of games yet we've not once put Ragone in to even take a snap. Why'd we send him to NFL Europe anyway? Of course this is the same coaching staff who started Riley for over half of the season just to RELEASE him because he was worse than any other lineman on the team, including all of our backups and guys not even active for games. If I were McNair, I'd be looking for some outside help to evaluate these guys too because they just look like they haven't got a clue. Maybe Reeves will demand to see Ragone get some playing time.

blockhead83
12-18-2005, 11:24 PM
I actually got to go to the game today, which was awesome, here's my thoughts:

- Jason who? Oh yea, Jason Babin, he finally played like the guy we were expecting with our first round pick. 2 sacks, a FF, and a whole lot of hustle.

- Dunta played decently, but he is still by no means a shutdown corner, he may have even regressed a touch since last year. He's still great and the heart of our secondary, but he could play better.

- Wells is a solid backup, he's improved alot since his rookie year by using his size more to his advantage, but IMO he's peaked and he's just a solid backup.

- Morency has some great burst, I look forward to seeing more from him the next couple seasons.

- Our safety play was MUCH improved and that had alot to do with this win. Earl was laying the wood and both he and CC finally got their hands on some passes. We have a good looking young duo back there.

On the subject of Carr and the O-Line, I learned my lesson in the Rams game. It sure looks like the OLine is giving him time when he gets rid of the ball in 0.75 seconds, try and let him take a 5 step drop and he'll still get sacked. Carr doesn't make the OLine look any better, but guess what, they're still not giving him the protection he needs to go through his reads on a regular basis. How can you expect him to progress in making reads when the coaches scheme our offense with runs and 1 look hitch passes? Atleast give him an average NFL offensive line, an o-coordinator who's not afraid of throwing the ball, and another season before you write him off. He simply hasn't had a fair shake with this club yet, and it's difficult to argue otherwise if you've been watching this team since it's inception.

Overall, good game, would've been great game if we hadn't let up in the second half. You'd think after all the times he's played more conservatively in the second half and ended up losing he'd have abandoned that philosophy.

*EDIT* However, I would definitely love to see the team bring in some good veteran competition for Carr. He hasn't had a fair shake but he hasn't proven anything yet either. It could do nothing but help us to bring in some competition and find out just how much of this is Carr's fault.

SESupergenius
12-19-2005, 12:45 AM
Carr had plenty of time today. The Cardinals were the ones that didnt. And Carr was calling most of the plays, atleast in the first half, according to the SR610 crew.

Either way, Carr screwed up a few times:
1) Before our first TD, Carr had plently of time, got happy feet and instead of stepping up and getting a few more seconds, he scrambled forward for a yard or two.
2) At our 8, 2nd down, 20 seconds left in the half, Carr spikes the ball to get to the 3rd down and then calls a timeout so he wasted a down. We have to settle for a FG.
3) The INT. The LB baited him like Carr was a rookie.
4) After we had gotten a turnover, Carr scrambles to buy time and then instead of throwing it away, tries to pick up 2 yards and fumbles the ball.

If Warner plays the entire game, we lose.Funny how you don't mention ANY of Carr accomplishments today. Do you want me to name you a few or are you just that biased?

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 01:51 AM
I dont think they run anything because if he drops back he gets sacked. They cant run much down the middle because Carr with this O-line an O-line that Mark Schlerith of ESPN (Former lineman) called the worst O-line he has ever seen in all his years of football. The problem with Carr is that he has not developed as Joe Theissman and Tony Dungy have said because of this O-line. Dungy went on to say not even Peyton Manning could do any better.


Carr could be shell shocked though and that means damaged goods. I wont argue with how you feel cuz that is your opinion and well it is yours. I just disagree, this O line has made Carr look FAR more worse than he has or could ever make them look bad.

I have a question. Which O-line are you talking about? Is it the 2002 O-line that helped generate 76 sacks and set the record because there are only two starters left over from that group and they don't run the same run blocking scheme or pass protection assignments that they did then. They aren't being coached by the same guy anymore.

Is it the 2003 version of the offensive line that helped drop that total to a more respectable 36 sacks? That group again has the same two starters (Pitts and McKinney, Weigert is in and out so I don't know what to say there) This group started run blocking pretty well and seemed to come together on the pass protection.

Are we talking about the 2004 version with Seth Wand at LT and Chester Pitts at LG? Steve McKinney and Zach Weigert were the only two guys to stay in their previous position and Todd Wade was new to the team. Wand was little more than a rookie starting at LT. New coach in Joe Pendry and a new way of doing things in run blocking and pass protection brought that sack total back up into the mid to high 40's (I can't remember).

Or is it this 2005 group that have more players changing positions again than I think we even had in our first year. Victor Riley is in, Wand is out, Pitts is a LG, no wait a LT, Hodgdon is the C and McKinney is the LG...but he makes the line calls and....wait, Hodgdon is down, McKinney is back to C and now Milford Brown is going to be our LG. Riley can go to RT since he plays there and Wade is down but wait, Riley sucks and he's cut, Weigert is now our RT even though he's a better RG and Weary is our new RG (We still have a guy named Weary on our team?) and Brown stays at LG. I think. Maybe....For a game or two at least. Where's Wand?

This is the worst built (and coached) offensive line in history but these are not the worst offensive linemen out there. I simply do not believe that these guys are as bad as the circumstances have made them. No continuity is present and players, positions, and schemes change almost yearly.

I don't blame the Texans for the moves that didn't work out. I blame them for creating this roller coaster of an O-line that never once has been allowed to build on the things that worked. Yes things have worked.

36 sacks in 2003 was functional pass protection. Davis getting a thousand yards in 2003 was just as good as the same thousand he got in 2004 and he will probably get in 2005. How did the zone blocking scheme help? How did Joe Pendry's working with the line do anything but blow up what had worked to much greater effect the year before he arrived?

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 01:55 AM
Funny how you don't mention ANY of Carr accomplishments today. Do you want me to name you a few or are you just that biased?

Are you talking about his astonishing 3.7 yards per pass? Was it the pick? His completion percentage wasn't shabby at all so maybe that's the accomplishment of which you speak.

All he did today was execute a gameplan that just about any pine rider in the NFL today could have done. Banks can make those throws and call those audibles. Ragone could do it. Hell, Navarre would have looked like Carr in our offense today.

SESupergenius
12-19-2005, 02:32 AM
Are you talking about his astonishing 3.7 yards per pass? Was it the pick? His completion percentage wasn't shabby at all so maybe that's the accomplishment of which you speak.

All he did today was execute a gameplan that just about any pine rider in the NFL today could have done. Banks can make those throws and call those audibles. Ragone could do it. Hell, Navarre would have looked like Carr in our offense today.
What is this Carr's offensive plan or the Coaches?? You confuse yourself by not distingquishing the player from the plays called. Carr has to play the cards delt with. Carr lead this team to plenty of scoring drives this game, but of course he will not get the credit by you because that would mean you'd have to actually say something positive about the team and Carr.

ccdude730
12-19-2005, 02:44 AM
What is this Carr's offensive plan or the Coaches??
theres an advantage to staying up late :)

from the chron (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/3533916.html)
But from the opening kickoff, the Texans played as if they had every intention of winning. With quarterback David Carr calling the plays in the first half, the Texans scored a franchise-record 24 points in the second quarter. They finished with a season-high 30 points.

"Our plan was to let David take charge of the offense," McKinney said. "It was a cat-and-mouse game, and I thought David handled it well. They were giving him some tough looks. He was doing a good job of putting us in the right plays for the right looks."

Coach Dom Capers and offensive coordinator Joe Pendry allowed Carr more freedom in the first half than Carr has had at any time in his career.

"We've done it before, but we did a lot more of it today," Pendry said. "We need to be prepared to do it every week. Because he has a good understanding of the offense, we know we can."

Carr was 16-of-20 for 93 yards in the first half, and after Pendry took over the play calling in the second half, the QB was 6-of-13 for 57 yards.

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 09:12 AM
If Carr was indeed calling his own plays he must be commended (no sarcasm) as he managed the game well enough to win and I applaud that. However, what is Carr the playcaller saying about Carr the QB when 75% of his passer are passes within 3 yds of the line of scrimmage.

Did anyone notice that DC the playcaller only threw to AJ once after 13:18 in the second half and that was the interception. Before 13:18, AJ had seven catches, wouldn't someone who has their finger on the pulse of the game know that AJ had no looks. Did anyone on the staff tell DC, or do you think they were hanging DC out to dry and expose his lack of QB IQ?

After 12:13 and us up by 27-10 we go the following on our possessions fo the rest of the game:
3 and out
3 and out
5 and interception (interception was not caused by OLine)
3 and out
2 and fumble (fumble was not caused by OLine)
3 and out
3 and FG

Once again I commend DC for taking advantage of this opportunity, but it was not a total victory, in my opinion, in the eyes of Dan Reeves.

After the revelation of Pendry calling the plays it shows that waht we all have known, Pendry does not knw what he is doing and Carr is not a leader.

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 09:36 AM
What is this Carr's offensive plan or the Coaches?? You confuse yourself by not distingquishing the player from the plays called. Carr has to play the cards delt with. Carr lead this team to plenty of scoring drives this game, but of course he will not get the credit by you because that would mean you'd have to actually say something positive about the team and Carr.

The Texans scored three touchdowns and they were all running plays. Carr was playing QB all day (unless I missed something) and you're right, this was the coaches game plan and not Carr's. Nevertheless he didn't do anything outside of what was called (not his fault of course, just stating a fact) so then what did he accomplish? He wasn't asked to accomplish practically anything yesterday. Don't turn the ball over and get those hitches thrown in the blink of an eye? Was that his accomplishment.

I applaud his first half play calling. Good job within the limits of what the Texans were capable of doing yesterday.

Carr succeeded in performing efficiently (excluding the pick) in an offense that any Division I or II QB could have run in their sleep. I understand that he can't do something if he's not allowed to but by the same token he can't accomplish much if the game plan just calls for him to do what he did yesterday.

If my negativity bugs you then I recommend the "ignore" function. You won't miss me.

HJam72
12-19-2005, 09:39 AM
Carr succeeded in performing efficiently (excluding the pick) in an offense that any Division I or II QB could have run in their sleep.

But Pendry can't. :brickwall

billtxus
12-19-2005, 09:39 AM
Guess you didn't watch the second half when Dom tried to give the game away by putting the offense on hold. The only thing that saved the win was that Arizona was pretty incompetent and had to try to win with a third string quarterback, if Warner stayed in the game they would be 1-13 now.

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 09:42 AM
But Pendry can't. :brickwall

That's right. Pendry can't.

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 10:15 AM
Vince Young never makes mistakes. I mean honestly, has he ever thrown an interception?

Carr did some things wrong: the fumble could have been particularly costly. However, in times past, people have argued that statistically, Carr is doing alright, especially for the system he plays in, and that the Texans troubles are not due only to him: to which others are quick to respond, "well, he just doesn't win. He doesn't do enough to get the win." Today he did, and of course now your format for decrying his play has to be switched up.

I like the fact he called his own plays in the first half and Pendry in the second half as it shows two things. Carr does not belive in his own game as he dinks and dunks. And Pendry is awful as we all have known. I have no doubt that Reeves got a lot out of this game for his evaluations.

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 10:45 AM
I like the fact he called his own plays in the first half and Pendry in the second half as it shows two things. Carr does not belive in his own game as he dinks and dunks. And Pendry is awful as we all have known. I have no doubt that Reeves got a lot out of this game for his evaluations.

I'm not so sure that this is what it shows. I think that while Carr may have called his own plays he probably was limited to a selection of plays given to him by Pendry. I don't think the Texans OC gave him a lot of way down the field options to choose from. He got to call whatever he wanted "so long as it was one of these twenty or so dink and dunk plays right here on this piece of paper"

I thought yesterday demonstrated that Carr is better at mixing up things than Joe Pendry. Offensive lines excepted of course. Nobody can mix up an offensive line like Joe Pendry. Just look what he's done with the Texans big uglies in the two years since he first showed up.

Vinny
12-19-2005, 10:48 AM
I'm not so sure that this is what it shows. I think that while Carr may have called his own plays he probably was limited to a selection of plays given to him by Pendry. I don't think the Texans OC gave him a lot of way down the field options to choose from. He got to call whatever he wanted "so long as it was one of these twenty or so dink and dunk plays right here on this piece of paper"On the David Carr show this morning he said that Pendry sent him "suggestions or formations" every few plays but Carr had an open canvas of the plays they practiced all week. He had like 5 pass options, 5 run options and so forth per package/formation.

Bobo
12-19-2005, 10:54 AM
>This is the worst built (and coached) offensive line in history but these are not the worst offensive linemen out there. I simply do not believe that these guys are as bad as the circumstances have made them. No continuity is >present and players, positions, and schemes change almost yearly.

You complain about the offensive line being awful and then when they try to make changes for the better, you complain about the lack of continuity? No wonder coaches don't listen to the fans.

SESupergenius
12-19-2005, 10:56 AM
This is laughable, Carr leads this team to a team record of most points in a half and gets absolutely no credit. Yet if Carr doesn't lead the team then he gets ALL the blame. You can't have it both ways. The fact is Carr was given complete control of this offense and he led score many points and a victory. All along the people with an open mind have been saying that Carr needs to be handed the reigns on this team and look what he does. These are just facts folks, Carr led this team to a victory, there is no denying it. The play from the 1st half to the 2nd was like night and day. Say goodbye to Pendry.
Some people just can't admit they are wrong and look foolish being so stubborn. Just like when the pundits said that Carr can't find his secondary targets, then boom he drops a sweet long pass to Bradford right in his hands, but of course Carr didn't catch it for him and the Carr haters crucified him for Bradford not making the catch. It's getting rediculous around here.

Bobo
12-19-2005, 10:57 AM
I'm not so sure that this is what it shows. I think that while Carr may have called his own plays he probably was limited to a selection of plays given to him by Pendry. I don't think the Texans OC gave him a lot of way down the field options to choose from. He got to call whatever he wanted "so long as it was one of these twenty or so dink and dunk plays right here on this piece of paper"

I thought yesterday demonstrated that Carr is better at mixing up things than Joe Pendry. Offensive lines excepted of course. Nobody can mix up an offensive line like Joe Pendry. Just look what he's done with the Texans big uglies in the two years since he first showed up.

I said this from the start -- Pendry is just as conservative as was Palmer. Palmer was the fall guy for this team and I don't think it was right. If you aren't going to do anything different, why the change? Of course, I understand why they don't do much downfield passing. The OL can't give Carr the time and the coaching staff didn't think they had to go downfield to win. If your defense is good, short dinks and a strong running game can get you victories. Yesterday was proof of that.

texan279
12-19-2005, 10:58 AM
theres an advantage to staying up late :)

But from the opening kickoff, the Texans played as if they had every intention of winning. With quarterback David Carr calling the plays in the first half, the Texans scored a franchise-record 24 points in the second quarter. They finished with a season-high 30 points.

"Our plan was to let David take charge of the offense," McKinney said. "It was a cat-and-mouse game, and I thought David handled it well. They were giving him some tough looks. He was doing a good job of putting us in the right plays for the right looks."

Coach Dom Capers and offensive coordinator Joe Pendry allowed Carr more freedom in the first half than Carr has had at any time in his career.

"We've done it before, but we did a lot more of it today," Pendry said. "We need to be prepared to do it every week. Because he has a good understanding of the offense, we know we can."

Carr was 16-of-20 for 93 yards in the first half, and after Pendry took over the play calling in the second half, the QB was 6-of-13 for 57 yards.

Alright...I'll say it...Carr for offensive coordinator! :redtowel:

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 11:02 AM
What are you talking about? I said that Carr did a better job of calling the plays than Pendry normally does? What do you want me to do? Give him the Joe Montana Memorial Trophy because he efficiently ran an offense that makes Kenny Stablers 1980 Oilers look like Air Coryell?

He did good, he won the game with his uncanny play selection and bullet like 3.1 yard strikes. Jeez, let it go already.

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 11:04 AM
This is laughable, Carr leads this team to a team record of most points in a half and gets absolutely no credit. Yet if Carr doesn't lead the team then he gets ALL the blame. You can't have it both ways. The fact is Carr was given complete control of this offense and he led score many points and a victory. All along the people with an open mind have been saying that Carr needs to be handed the reigns on this team and look what he does. These are just facts folks, Carr led this team to a victory, there is no denying it. The play from the 1st half to the 2nd was like night and day. Say goodbye to Pendry.
Some people just can't admit they are wrong and look foolish being so stubborn. Just like when the pundits said that Carr can't find his secondary targets, then boom he drops a sweet long pass to Bradford right in his hands, but of course Carr didn't catch it for him and the Carr haters crucified him for Bradford not making the catch. It's getting rediculous around here.

I think it is quite clear in the posts that DC the playcaller is pretty smart. DC the QB is average.

texan279
12-19-2005, 11:09 AM
I think it is quite clear in the posts that DC the playcaller is pretty smart. DC the QB is average.

Average is better than most QB's would be behind this O line...

SESupergenius
12-19-2005, 11:12 AM
I think it is quite clear in the posts that DC the playcaller is pretty smart. DC the QB is average.And how many times have we seen on this board where some of the members constantly badger Carr for his lack of game smarts? Doh! That game should pretty much shut them up because it was well documented that he led this team to many points after being given complete control of the offense. Case closed.

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 11:18 AM
And how many times have we seen on this board where some of the members constantly badger Carr for his lack of game smarts? Doh! That game should pretty much shut them up because it was well documented that he led this team to many points after being given complete control of the offense. Case closed.

DC the playcaller is smart enough to know not to put DC the QB in a position to fail, hence hand offs and hitches.

texan279
12-19-2005, 11:21 AM
DC the playcaller is smart enough to know not to put DC the QB in a position to fail, hence hand offs and hitches.

What is more important? Winning? Or what you do to win? Carr got the job done.

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 11:27 AM
What is more important? Winning? Or what you do to win? Carr got the job done.

Winning and that should be apparent in my posts. But as most are afraid that somehow Capers and Cass will be back or we lose the #1 sweepstakes if we continue to win I am afraid that we resign DC at the 2 or 3 year option.

edo783
12-19-2005, 11:46 AM
Let's see, 1st half Carr calls the game that he sees will work (within the framework he is given and only that which they have practiced and using plays that work with the O-line provided ie.short tosses) and we put up a good amount of points. In the second half controll reverts back to the coaches and we don't do squat. I wonder where the issue lays. Just can't seem to see it. Anyone able to help me out to see it?

cuppacoffee
12-19-2005, 12:22 PM
On the David Carr show this morning he said that Pendry sent him "suggestions or formations" every few plays but Carr had an open canvas of the plays they practiced all week. He had like 5 pass options, 5 run options and so forth per package/formation.

Open canvas? :rolleyes:
Do we even know what plays they practiced all week? I don't. :confused:
My guess would be all dink and dunk. Carr can only call what they practice. The only deep threat we did have is now a bigger waste of money than Carr. No, I am not talking about Bradford, he never has been a threat. If we want to talk about busts, where is Andre? Andre is no help to Carr. He cannot beat double teams, then drops TD passes right in his gut. I wouldn't throw the ball to him anymore either. Don't even think about complaining that we don't throw deep to Andre. Watch other receivers run deep and fight for and come down wih the ball. Johnson does not do this. Now there is a good opportunity to discuss/argue about a player. Where is all the outcry about Andre ? Is he overrated? Has our staff completeley ruined him too? (that would be my guess). We have other receivers on this team, lets replace Bradford and Andre. Do you realize why the second teamers come in and look better than the regular players, (clue) they haven't been receiving intensive, but inferior, coaching all year long from this bunch.

All the blame for our poor offense is placed on Carr and the O line. If I was Carr all my passes would go to DD too, at least he will catch it. This regime has destroyed any talent these players had when they showed up to play for the Texan team. Blame individual players all you want, they have not been recieving very good coaching. Pendry as OC ??? What a joke!

And our defensive coaches? Has anyone noticed the difference in Dunta since he got here? He recieved better coaching in college. Another year here and he will become mediocre.

Carr not a good QB? This is becoming a self perpetuating myth.

Thank you Mr McNair for realizing this and bringing in help.

Diversity abounds on this board. That's a good thing.


That's my opinion.
Carr haters have their opinion.


:coffee:

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 12:29 PM
AJ was in the Pro Bowl last year and we are ready to throw him to the wolves? The fact that he was injured this year has no bearing nor that he cannot throw it to himself, correct? Yeah I am still po'd that he dropped that one pass.

Drob had a good year last year as he was second fiddle to Glenn and now that he is the man and not had as a good of a year (not sure how we are measuring) we need to give up on him?

I am all for new coaches, but to give up on these guys I cannot endorse.

texan279
12-19-2005, 12:33 PM
AJ was in the Pro Bowl last year and we are ready to throw him to the wolves? The fact that he was injured this year has no bearing nor that he cannot throw it to himself, correct? Yeah I am still po'd that he dropped that one pass.

Drob had a good year last year as he was second fiddle to Glenn and now that he is the man and not had as a good of a year (not sure how we are measuring) we need to give up on him?

I am all for new coaches, but to give up on these guys I cannot endorse.

So you are ready to throw Carr under the bus for leading the offense to a franchise record 24 points in the 2nd quarter, but after all of the passes AJ has dropped this season you cannot give up on him because he was in the Pro Bowl last season? :confused:

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 12:36 PM
So you are ready to throw Carr under the bus for leading the offense to a franchise record 24 points in the 2nd quarter, but after all of the passes AJ has dropped this season you cannot give up on him because he was in the Pro Bowl last season? :confused:

How many years has AJ been in the league? How many games did AJ miss this year? How many drops does he have? You will get my answer and help your confusion once you provide those answers. Otherwise I will keep my word, to a respected poster, regarding my comments on DC.

texan279
12-19-2005, 12:44 PM
How many years has AJ been in the league? How many games did AJ miss this year? How many drops does he have? You will get my answer and help your confusion once you provide those answers. Otherwise I will keep my word, to a respected poster, regarding my comments on DC.

AJ has been in the league one year less than Carr. How about this...Wide receivers are ranked according to DPAR, or Defense-adjusted Points Above Replacement. This number represents the total number of points scored due to plays where this WR caught the ball, compared to a replacement-level WR in the same game situations. That last number is catch percentage...So basically, on average, every tim AJ catches a pass we score -1.3 points compared to a replacent WR in the same game situation. And Johnson's catch percentage is 55%, not the greatest considering the elite WR's in the NFL have 60% plus catch percentage on average, with most of them in the 65-75% range...

86-J.Gaffney HOU 3.0 58 2.6 59 -9.3% 64 -10.0% 80 445 2 61%
85-C.Bradford HOU 2.6 62 3.2 57 -6.7% 55 -4.5% 47 268 3 53%
80-A.Johnson HOU -1.3 76 1.5 70 -18.1% 77 -12.4% 88 515 1 55%

Jack Bauer
12-19-2005, 12:46 PM
How many years has AJ been in the league? How many games did AJ miss this year? How many drops does he have? You will get my answer and help your confusion once you provide those answers. Otherwise I will keep my word, to a respected poster, regarding my comments on DC.

I'll provide the answers. This is Andre's third year. He missed three games and all except one play of the Tennessee game on 10/9. He has 4 dropped passes this year. I for one have not said anything negative about Johnson. Our offensive line is to blame for his drop off as well. If Carr can't get the ball to Johnson, obviously his stats are going to suffer.

Jack Bauer
12-19-2005, 12:48 PM
That last number is catch percentage...

Catch percentage is NOT indicative of drops.

texan279
12-19-2005, 12:50 PM
Catch percentage is NOT indicative of drops.

I understand that, but for one, I have no idea where to find dropped passes kept as a stat, and for 2 it shows insight into playmaking ability.

eriadoc
12-19-2005, 01:22 PM
The hypocrisy displayed by a significant percentage of posters on this board is mind-boggling.

cuppacoffee
12-19-2005, 04:40 PM
AJ was in the Pro Bowl last year and we are ready to throw him to the wolves? The fact that he was injured this year has no bearing nor that he cannot throw it to himself, correct? Yeah I am still po'd that he dropped that one pass.

Drob had a good year last year as he was second fiddle to Glenn and now that he is the man and not had as a good of a year (not sure how we are measuring) we need to give up on him?

I am all for new coaches, but to give up on these guys I cannot endorse.

Kaiser
Guess I was a little off target there. I was trying to make a point that several of our players have suffered at the hands of this staff. It was not my intention to downgrade AJ or DRob. They both were outstanding players when they got here. They, like the rest of the team, are suffering from neglect. The way our oline has been shuffled from position to position borders on criminal neglect. If your RT is underperforming during the season, (clue to Pendry) sub him with the back up RT, don't reshuffle the entire line. :penalty:
Same thing for any position on the team for that matter. Positions and subs should be determined during preseason, not the regular season. Pendry is worthless, clueless, and many other adjectives I cannot recall at the moment. Pendry has taken a player that had shown promise his first year (Wand) and ruined him. Hopefully a real oline coach can come in and revise Wands career before it is too late. Our players are NFL quality players. NFL quality, not necessarily pro-bowl calibre.
I've stated before that our coaches are not NFL quality and I stand by that.
Capers membership in the good ol boy network will cost him his job, deservedly so, he should have put the success of the team first. :twocents:

:coffee:

Kaiser Toro
12-19-2005, 04:44 PM
We are on the same page on this one.

Hervoyel
12-19-2005, 08:35 PM
No, I am not talking about Bradford, he never has been a threat.

You are mistaken. In 2002 and 2003 to a lesser extent Corey Bradford was a very real threat. Even in 2004 he wasn't a liability like he has been this year. This year it's like he's trying to make me die on the inside. It's like it's intentional or something. We all knew he was going to drop some balls but this year has been just silly-crazy-stupid.

He was a threat though the first couple of years. He could catch (usually) and he was fast. He caught 6 touchdown passes in 2002 and in his three years in the NFL AJ, with his Pro Bowl credentials has only matched it, not beaten it.

touttail
12-19-2005, 09:13 PM
This win means nothing. A crappy team beat another team.
If it means anything, it's that if we beat SF in two weeks we will drop to the 4th or 5th pick of the draft.

And that is just soooooooooo freaking great. I can't freaking wait.:redtowel: :redtowel: :redtowel:

My thought s too, we played a team much worse than we are. Look what happened to us when we play a top calibre team such as Indy.

Bobby 119C:brickwall