PDA

View Full Version : Draft knowledge is lacking


MikeMc
12-13-2005, 11:37 AM
I have been away from the HT.com MB for awhile, and I come on here and see some of the ridiculous comments regarding the 2006 NFL Draft and some "scenarios" that are simply pathetic.

I guess this site was better when it was in its original form with the Inaugural Blue Crew members. Now we have thousands of Monday Evening QBs and Armchair GMs that have no idea how off-the-wall their comments are regarding the Draft, Bush, and any number of football personnel decisions.

BroncoPride
12-13-2005, 11:38 AM
I have been away from the HT.com MB for awhile, and I come on here and see some of the ridiculous comments regarding the 2006 NFL Draft and some "scenarios" that are simply pathetic.

I guess this site was better when it was in its original form with the Inaugural Blue Crew members. Now we have thousands of Monday Evening QBs and Armchair GMs that have no idea how off-the-wall their comments are regarding the Draft, Bush, and any number of football personnel decisions.

I hope your not referring to my trade proposal when you made this post lolz...

Broncofreak

infantrycak
12-13-2005, 11:50 AM
Maybe some posts in response to specific bad scenarios/comments would be more constructive than blanket condemnation.

Corrosion
12-13-2005, 04:32 PM
I agree .... seems every mock has someone with first round talent being picked in round seven ....:pigfly:

People should do a bit of research before they make thier mocks .... or back up posts with fact on other topics .

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 04:37 PM
I agree .... seems every mock has someone with first round talent being picked in round seven ....:pigfly:

People should do a bit of research before they make thier mocks .... or back up posts with fact on other topics .

People should also wait until the final draft order is set and the combine and other workouts have gone by so they have somewhat of an idea of how good people are rather than just seeing a few games on TV against college competition. Then some serious mock drafts can start coming out (mine included).

royce1054
12-13-2005, 05:35 PM
well you can always if the season ended to day this is what i think. Then again we do have bowl games, senior bowls and combines to raise ppls stocks. Alot of things people are forgetting to add into their mocks. DAN REEVES FACTOR!! I was thinking about this. He was brought in to evaluate right. That means the players he doesnt like are going to be gone. To me i think hes taking Casserly's job. That means it will be Reeves selecting not Casserly (thank god). Now we have a RB signed to a 5 yr deal. We will pick up Carr's 8 mil (not sure why but we will). You know what i dont get is if we had an O-line we wouldnt be having this conversation right now. We would talk about 7-9 season. I think a team end up being the 49ers will offer us a good enough offer to make sure they get Bush. So basically i think we will swop 1 and 2 picks and pick up the 2nd pick in 2nd round. In most GM's mind thats technically 3 1st round quality players. With the players i think leaving Babin, Buchannon, Coleman, McKinney.. ect i think Reeves will start wheeling and dealing to fill these positions. If we have say #2 the 32 and 33rd picks we can get 3 of the top 33 people. So not only can we get our stud O-line we can get a TE and a CB/S in the 2nd round. Then we have 2 3rd rounders for depth in the OL/LB/DL. Then the 4th we can get a WR or a S. This is just so clear to me i dont see why others cant see it.

and this isnt even going into the thought that Det, N.O., or Tenn trades to #2 pick to get Leinhart which is also another theory that is very realistic

edo783
12-13-2005, 07:05 PM
I doubt Babin leaves. To much tied up and he CAN play.

royce1054
12-13-2005, 07:43 PM
orr will replace him

YoungTexanFan
12-13-2005, 08:29 PM
orr will replace him

babin is not likely to go anywhere. buchanon is not going anywhere either. greenwood might as far as LB's are concerned. he has not preformed at all this year, but i will attribute most of that to a bad version of a sucessful scheme.

royce1054
12-13-2005, 08:53 PM
i wouldnt be surprised if both left esp if Buchannon asks for any kind of significant money...

Babin... Babin what has he done for us. He has been poor - adaquate at best. Orr has shown he is ready and will come at a cheaper cost.

MikeMc
12-13-2005, 09:24 PM
Maybe the new coaching staff will have a different defensive philosophy. Then Babin and Wong could play on the End of a 4-3 (for example). Then we might be talking about a LB like Hawk, Greenway or any number of top LBs that are projected to go in the top 15 picks.

My point is that so many people make these ridiculous scenarios, like we trade DD and Carr for a 2 & 3, then trade down and pick up a 1st rd pick in 2010, a 2nd rd pick in 2007 and 4 3rd rd picks in 2006.


Just stick with the what if the Texans have the #1 pick. All of this ridiculous trade garbage floods the MB. I wish the Mods would group all 404 Bush threads into one.

BTW, this kid is not the second coming of Sweetness. And how can he run outside or inside if he is always getting met 5 yrds behind the LOS? DD has shown the muscle and toughness to turn the -3 yard play into 3 or 4 yards. And that has been at the NFL level....not the Pac10!

ghostlight
12-13-2005, 09:29 PM
MikeMc

Welcome back. I've missed your input and sharp wit. Can't wait to read your no-spin replies. Never agree with them but good reading.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 10:09 PM
Orr and Peek are both going to be restricted free agents so we can sign them to a one-year tender and keep them around for next year for very little money. Babin still has a decently big contract and since we wasted all those picks on him I think they'll keep him around at least another year and see if a new coach can get something out of him, and if we switch to a 4-3 he is sadly the best DE end we have in that system. Greenwood absolutely will not go, I wish he would but with his contract it would be very difficult to do at this point in time. Check out my "Houston Texans Player Contracts" thread in the bull pen to see the cap consequences of keeping and cutting all of our players and you'll see that some are unfortunately going to have to stay.

royce1054
12-13-2005, 10:28 PM
I pray every day we either stay in the 34 or switch to 46 but the 43 sux and sux hard. I hope we never switch to it.

Big B Texan Fan
12-14-2005, 08:54 AM
BTW, this kid is not the second coming of Sweetness. And how can he run outside or inside if he is always getting met 5 yrds behind the LOS? DD has shown the muscle and toughness to turn the -3 yard play into 3 or 4 yards. And that has been at the NFL level....not the Pac10!
It blows me away how people say things like "this is the NFL, not the Pac-10" or any conference for that matter. Most players come out of college. They don't have a choice. For exaple, your reference to Sweetness, well he came out of a super small school. How many times did he hear "well this is the NFL, not the NCAA Division ll". How many times was Emmit told "you're too small, too slow, and you come from a pass 1st college program". Hell, Aikman came out of the Pac-10. So did Marcus Allen, OJ, Carson Palmer. I know, so did Ryan Leaf.
I guess we should have the kids get drafted to the Arena League 1st, then hold a draft for them to then go to Canada, then after that then they can go to NFL Europe. And theeeeeeeeen they can come to the NFL. How does that sound. :challenge Of course then they still would not have been "at the NFL level"!!!!!!!

awtysst
12-14-2005, 11:09 AM
I have been away from the HT.com MB for awhile, and I come on here and see some of the ridiculous comments regarding the 2006 NFL Draft and some "scenarios" that are simply pathetic.

I guess this site was better when it was in its original form with the Inaugural Blue Crew members. Now we have thousands of Monday Evening QBs and Armchair GMs that have no idea how off-the-wall their comments are regarding the Draft, Bush, and any number of football personnel decisions.

Are you referring to mocks or comments. Look at some of the mocks. Some of them have been fairly developed utilizing the draft value chart. Like mine for example!
Check out Tryptophan Mock!

Vinny
12-14-2005, 11:15 AM
I've been here for years...and years.....and the goofy mocks are here every year (as well as the good ones). That hasn't changed a bit.

MikeMc
12-14-2005, 12:52 PM
I was using "Pac-10" to refer to level of comp....college that is. He will be facing guys that are experienced NFL players.

Best case......look at Maurice Clarett....dominated the Big Ten, but did not even make the NFL cut. Yes it is different, but you get the point. Hey, Ty Detmer lit it up at BYU, but it is is little brother who is still on a NFL roster.

Just because someone succeeds at one level, does not mean they will succeed at the next. That is all I was trying to say.

And BTW, Jackson St is a DivI-AA school, not DivII.

V Man
12-14-2005, 01:00 PM
Hey, Ty Detmer lit it up at BYU, but it is is little brother who is still on a NFL roster.



Ty plays for Atlanta, but I do see your point.

MikeMc
12-14-2005, 01:01 PM
He does? I thought it was Vick, Shaub....so I guess Ty is #3? So I would not go as far as to say he "plays" for ATL.

Sarg01
12-14-2005, 01:09 PM
I think I'll work on a mock where the Texans trade down 16 times and still get Reggie Bush, D'Brick, Hawk and 7 first round picks next year.

royce1054
12-14-2005, 01:20 PM
I think I'll work on a mock where the Texans trade down 16 times and still get Reggie Bush, D'Brick, Hawk and 7 first round picks next year.


i hope that was sarcasm

V Man
12-14-2005, 01:21 PM
He does? I thought it was Vick, Shaub....so I guess Ty is #3? So I would not go as far as to say he "plays" for ATL.


Excuse me "on their roster", anyway the only reason I knew that he was still "on their roster" is because I work with his father and brother-in-law.

Sarg01
12-14-2005, 01:45 PM
i hope that was sarcasm

Well, I wouldn't want to be unrealistic, so we'd probably have to give up our fourth rounder and Matt Stevens to seal the deal ... oh, wait. :yahoo:

royce1054
12-14-2005, 03:07 PM
/bump
I am serious here. If we draft Bush which i doubt we will. We will trade down. But if we do he will be on our team for about 3 hours til a team offers us a deal for us and he gone

Big B Texan Fan
12-14-2005, 05:35 PM
I was using "Pac-10" to refer to level of comp....college that is. He will be facing guys that are experienced NFL players.

Best case......look at Maurice Clarett....dominated the Big Ten, but did not even make the NFL cut. Yes it is different, but you get the point. Hey, Ty Detmer lit it up at BYU, but it is is little brother who is still on a NFL roster.

Just because someone succeeds at one level, does not mean they will succeed at the next. That is all I was trying to say.

And BTW, Jackson St is a DivI-AA school, not DivII.
So then what conference is OK to draft out of. We could just give them away.

real
12-14-2005, 05:42 PM
BTW, this kid is not the second coming of Sweetness. And how can he run outside or inside if he is always getting met 5 yrds behind the LOS? DD has shown the muscle and toughness to turn the -3 yard play into 3 or 4 yards. And that has been at the NFL level....not the Pac10!

I dont recall too many times DD has been met in the backfield....and then turned it into something positive, And are you saying that because someone plays in the NFL that automatically makes them better than college players?

real
12-14-2005, 05:46 PM
I was using "Pac-10" to refer to level of comp....college that is. He will be facing guys that are experienced NFL players.

Couldn't you say that about every player in the draft???? They wouldn't be in the draft if we'd seen them play in the NFL...

infantrycak
12-14-2005, 05:46 PM
I dont recall too many times DD has been met in the backfield....and then turned it into something positive, And are you saying that because someone plays in the NFL that automatically makes them better than college players?

Then you haven't been watching many Texans games. Try just going back to the last two and you will find several where he is hit at or behind the line of scrimmage and turns them into positive plays. Turn off the I want Bush filtered glasses and you will see them.

real
12-14-2005, 05:59 PM
Actually I have watched the games, I don't record them and go back to them, so Im not gonna argue with you about that, but I have watched enough of DD to know that he hasn't had too many spectacular runs. And our line doesn't have a problem run blocking, it's pass blocking thats our problem, so all of you who are trying to make him out to be some super back running through people are mistaken. He sees a hole and runs through, he may get past one defender, but it's not often...

infantrycak
12-14-2005, 06:06 PM
He sees a hole and runs through, he may get past one defender, but it's not often...

Wow--time to go back to the film. Fine with me if the Texans end up with Bush--no need to get patently outside the bounds of reality to slam players to justify the pick.

real
12-14-2005, 06:13 PM
Actually I would like them to get Bush but if they dont, thats alright..I'm not saying DD is the worst...He's just so far from the best...there are 15 backs that are better or just as good as far as ypc... reggie bush would esily be in the top ten if not the top 5....

royce1054
12-14-2005, 06:14 PM
Then you haven't been watching many Texans games. Try just going back to the last two and you will find several where he is hit at or behind the line of scrimmage and turns them into positive plays. Turn off the I want Bush filtered glasses and you will see them.


Wow /sign

infantrycak
12-14-2005, 06:19 PM
Actually I would like them to get Bush but if they dont, thats alright..I'm not saying DD is the worst...He's just so far from the best...there are 15 backs that are better or just as good as far as ypc... reggie bush would esily be in the top ten if not the top 5....

There are 13 with 100 or more carries, 9 with 200 or more carries that have a better ypc than DD.

Name which ones have worse run blocking OL's than the Texans.

real
12-14-2005, 06:27 PM
the texans problem is pass blocking, you cant really gauge run blocking as a team unless you know what play is being called and everyones assignment....The only way you can judge a teams run blocking is to look at where the running backs typically have their first contact, and DD doesn't get hit too many times before he gets two yards...

real
12-14-2005, 06:29 PM
the texans problem is pass blocking, you cant really gauge run blocking as a team unless you know what play is being called and everyones assignment....The only way you can judge a teams run blocking is to look at where the running backs typically have their first contact, and DD doesn't get hit too many times before he gets two yards...
I almost get the vibe that you are trying to tell me that if he were on the chargers, broncos, seahawks, chiefs, bears, bengals, falcons, giants or colts...Then he would be better than those teams running backs....or if any of those guys were on our team then they wouldn't be doing better than him...All I am trying to say is that teams who normally do well have a beast at running back...DD is no beast...he's decent and i refuse to give him anymore credit than that

YoungTexanFan
12-14-2005, 07:12 PM
I almost get the vibe that you are trying to tell me that if he were on the chargers, broncos, seahawks, chiefs, bears, bengals, falcons, giants or colts...Then he would be better than those teams running backs....or if any of those guys were on our team then they wouldn't be doing better than him...All I am trying to say is that teams who normally do well have a beast at running back...DD is no beast...he's decent and i refuse to give him anymore credit than that

tell me you arent calling bush a beast?

real
12-14-2005, 07:16 PM
tell me you arent calling bush a beast?


Uhhhhh....yeah.......He is the most dominating back, if not player in the NCAA, Will most likely be the number one pick, Won the heisman...I think that qualifies as beastly....

YoungTexanFan
12-14-2005, 07:28 PM
Uhhhhh....yeah.......He is the most dominating back, if not player in the NCAA, Will most likely be the number one pick, Won the heisman...I think that qualifies as beastly....

in the way it was stated, you seemed to be refering to him as a "physical" beast. one of impressive stature compared to others at his position.

The heisman means very little outside of college. The number one pick will be based on hype, regardless.

He is not the most dominating back, he is not even the most dominating back on him team. He has pleanty of flash, but he is far from dominating as many are saying DD is lacking dominance. Adrian Peterson is the most "dominating" back in the nation.

real
12-14-2005, 07:43 PM
Ok...I can understand you taking "beast" like that...But when I say beast I mean a game changing player...Someone that you constantly are watching...

I dont know where this AP stuff is coming from, but right now he's no where near bush's level...and I haven't seen him take over a game the way that Bush has...

YoungTexanFan
12-14-2005, 08:18 PM
Ok...I can understand you taking "beast" like that...But when I say beast I mean a game changing player...Someone that you constantly are watching...

I dont know where this AP stuff is coming from, but right now he's no where near bush's level...and I haven't seen him take over a game the way that Bush has...

He did it his true freshman year.

Bush is a great talent, but there are game changing players at each position, just maybe not quite to the extent of bush. A dominant line allows for a dominant offense. We have enough playmakers right now to focus on other needs. We take the best playmaker at the position we need the most, after trading down.

real
12-14-2005, 08:27 PM
so now you are defending the point of AP being the most dominant back in college football? his freshman year? he said AP is the most dominating back in college...It sounds like you are defending that point... And of course there are gamechanging players at every position, but are there game changing players at every position in this draft? and enough play makers...we have two...D-Rob and AJ..They are playmakers...

YoungTexanFan
12-14-2005, 08:31 PM
so now you are defending the point of AP being the most dominant back in college football? his freshman year? he said AP is the most dominating back in college...It sounds like you are defending that point... And of course there are gamechanging players at every position, but are there game changing players at every position in this draft? and enough play makers...we have two...D-Rob and AJ..They are playmakers...

I am not saying he is the most dominating. Just more than bush. He proved himself a dominant back his true freshman year. I would also include mathis in our playmakers.

real
12-14-2005, 08:35 PM
Freshman year? What have you done for me lately...This shouldn't even be an argument, AP doesn't have the skills that reggie has...

And as far as JM is concerned, You are right he is a playmaker...He is a kick return specialist... hasn't proven himself as a receiver granted he hasn't had the chance, and he's not that good at returning punts and probably never will be...

YoungTexanFan
12-14-2005, 08:48 PM
Freshman year? What have you done for me lately...This shouldn't even be an argument, AP doesn't have the skills that reggie has...

And as far as JM is concerned, You are right he is a playmaker...He is a kick return specialist... hasn't proven himself as a receiver granted he hasn't had the chance, and he's not that good at returning punts and probably never will be...

you are comparing apples to oranges. AP and bush have a completly different style of dominating a game. Bush has more flash, AP has more overall talent as a RB. Bush has more overall talent because of his positions.

Mathis does not have the "right" speed to be a PR. Buchanon is much better suited for the job. PR need a very quick first few steps, followed by the ability to stop and juke and be back at the same speed. JM possess great straight ahead speed, but his running style is not suited towards a PR. Even when he hasnt been thrown the ball, he has beaten his man many times. He is just as much of a threat to score as bush.

real
12-14-2005, 08:55 PM
I know that about JM...you proved my point....

And as far as AP and Bush...I said game changers...I think it is fairly obvious that Bush, is clearly more of a game changer than AP

real
12-14-2005, 08:59 PM
You must be a bush hater, because to compare Adrian Peterson to him, and say he his more dominant, then to put him on the same level as Jerome Mathis...You gotta be kiddin' me....
How do you know he's beaten the defender soooo much...did you see that dropped pass...?

MorKnolle
12-14-2005, 10:39 PM
I would call Bush a very flashy and impressively athletic football player. I would not call him a beast. He is not the most dominant RB in the NCAA right now, he may be the most overall athletic player and a good RB, but he is not the best RB in the NCAA, much less in the last 20 years or whatever some people are claiming. He will likely be a Warrick Dunn-type RB, very fast and quick but not very big and not going to run over anyone. Dunn has developed a decent ability to run up the middle which I do not yet see in Bush, but he can develop that with time. As for Bush being in the top 5 in ypc, I seriously doubt that. Dunn for instance has had some very impressive seasons and some below-average seasons. When he had good blocking, he's excelled (5.2 ypc this year, 4.6 in 2000, 4.2 in 1998, 4.4 in 1997) but when the blocking hasn't been so good, he's looked really bad (3.2 ypc in 1999, 2.8 ypc in 2001), and I see Bush having the same tendencies. If he has a great OL in front of him, he could consistently average 4.7-5.2 yards per carry each season, but if he doesn't have great blockers (like we are now and will be for a couple years if we don't address the situation now) he will probably be more in the 3.6-4.1 yards per carry range. The most carries Dunn has ever had in a season was 265 last year (16.6 carries per game), for that matter the most touches he's had in a season (carries + catches) is 294 (18.4 touches per game), and that's about all I see Bush getting. I for one am not willing to spend $50 million and give up three or four additional draft picks for that kind of production.

Adrian Peterson is a more dominant RB than Reggie Bush. Bush may be a more talented overall player, but Peterson is the better pure RB. Peterson had possibly the best freshman season ever in the NCAA by a RB. When Peterson had a team full of studs like Bush currently has, he posted 1925 rushing yards (5.7 ypc) and 15 TDs, and that as a true freshman. He beat out Cedric Benson in rushing that year, the same Cedric Benson that was the #4 pick in this year's draft, and Peterson was a freshman while Benson was a senior. Comparing Bush to Peterson this year is not a great comparison because Peterson lost half the starters on his team and was left as the only weapon and he was injured for a decent portion of the year. That said, Peterson put up better rushing numbers as a freshman than Bush has done as a junior when the two had comparable teams around them, so I would call him a more dominant RB, not to mention he is a much more physical runner. Bush is still a better athlete and likely a better all-round player, but Peterson is the superior RB.

MikeMc
12-14-2005, 10:53 PM
You guys are playing into the media's hands. They feed you garbage and you spout garbage.

The most Dominating RB in NCAA now is DeAngelo Williams. He does not play on a team in a BCS Conf, nor does he have studs at every position around him. Hell, he was in the backfield for most of the season with a 3rd string QB or a 4th string converted WR as QB, and teams were stacking 9 guys in the box and he still beat them.

And do not use the "Weak Conf" comp against him, he dominated the big boys when Memphis played them.

I say, let the Jets salivate over Bush, and the Texans can trade down, build on extra picks and still get a dominating RB.

But my guess is that if they trade down and pass on Bush, that the pick will be an OL.

BTW, go back to DD's first game as a pro vs the Miami upset......tell me he is not a beast. He runs with authority and can go inside or outside. He can block and catch. He is a 4-tool RB......I'm not sure how the smallish Bush can keep up with the pounding he will take based on the Texans porous OL. Hell, Victor Riley was the top OL FA signee from last year and he got cut! Look at how the OL has rotated the 4 years......swinging door!

Tell me that Emmitt Smith was not half the RB he was because he had the most dominate OL his whole career.

Kaiser Toro
12-15-2005, 08:04 AM
You guys are playing into the media's hands. They feed you garbage and you spout garbage.

Pot meet kettle. Railing against people and then pulls out a Conference USA homer rant.

Williams will be a good back and I like your overall take, but have some restraint in calling out people while pushing a Sports Information Director's release.

infantrycak
12-15-2005, 08:57 AM
the texans problem is pass blocking, you cant really gauge run blocking as a team unless you know what play is being called and everyones assignment....

Talk about being simplistic. The Texans OL's worst problem is pass blocking--that doesn't mean it is the only problem.

The only way you can judge a teams run blocking is to look at where the running backs typically have their first contact, and DD doesn't get hit too many times before he gets two yards...

No, you can look at that, the size of the holes opened, how well blockers are getting down field to make second level blocks, how well teams in zone blocking seal off the cut back lane (something the Texans are particularly poor at). Try watching Denver and Atlanta and tell us they are not clearly superior run blocking lines employing the same zone blocking scheme.

The underlined statement is just blatantly wrong.

I almost get the vibe that you are trying to tell me that if he were on the chargers, broncos, seahawks, chiefs, bears, bengals, falcons, giants or colts...Then he would be better than those teams running backs....or if any of those guys were on our team then they wouldn't be doing better than him...

Well you got your vibe on wrong, close, but wrong. Pretty simple assertion really--better blocking equals better production from the RB whoever he is and worse blocking equals less production from the RB. Yes it is reasonable to expect that if DD were running behind the Denver, KC, Atlanta or Seatle OL's that his ypc and overall stats would go up--in some instances that would not catch him up to the current RB in others it would.

It seems from your posts that you don't think the OL has anything to do with the performance of the RB. Best example around:

Clinton Portis
Denver 2002--5.5 ypc (11 carries of 20+), 2003--5.5 ypc (13 carries of 20+)
Washington 2004--3.8 ypc (5 carries of 20+), 2005--4.3 ypc (5 carries of 20+)

Hmmm, same RB--over 25% reduction in ypc and huge cutoff in home run threat (Bush fanatics take note here--the OL ceratinly does affect home run potential and getting a RB clean thru the hole). I'll stick with the OL has something to do with it.

MikeMc
12-15-2005, 10:48 AM
Pot meet kettle. Railing against people and then pulls out a Conference USA homer rant.

You think I am talking about DeAngelo as a CUSA homer? Please! He has been one of the best if not THE best the past 3 years!

And how is it "pot meet kettle"? Maybe pot meet microwave? CUSA gets no love from the media because it is no a BCS conf. Maybe if you had seen DW play over the past 3 years you could comment. As a Coogs fan, I can comment and make a good opinion on what he is capable of.

BTW, he is rated as Mel Kiper #1 RB among the seniors and #7 on his Big Board. So I guess I have some validity to my comments!

Kaiser Toro
12-15-2005, 10:51 AM
BTW, he is rated as Mel Kiper #1 RB among the seniors and #7 on his Big Board. So I guess I have some validity to my comments!

Pot meet kettle, part 2.

You guys are playing into the media's hands. They feed you garbage and you spout garbage. :cool:

JDizzle
12-15-2005, 10:59 AM
Lol

MikeMc
12-15-2005, 11:05 AM
Anything you'd like to add to this conversation, Kaiser?

Like I said, you are in Austin, and thus are feed the UT BS everyday, and how great Bush is. Why would anyone in the Austin media give any props to a CUSA school?

You probably have never heard of DeAngelo Williams until my mentioning. That is true example of media BS only focusing on the BCS conf schools and their players.

I guess the MAC Conf has yet to produce a decent QB! Where are all of the great UT QBs that have played in the NFL? Hell, UH has had two! UT???? one - Chris Simms!

Kaiser Toro
12-15-2005, 11:34 AM
Anything you'd like to add to this conversation, Kaiser?

Like I said, you are in Austin, and thus are feed the UT BS everyday, and how great Bush is. Why would anyone in the Austin media give any props to a CUSA school?

You probably have never heard of DeAngelo Williams until my mentioning. That is true example of media BS only focusing on the BCS conf schools and their players.

I guess the MAC Conf has yet to produce a decent QB! Where are all of the great UT QBs that have played in the NFL? Hell, UH has had two! UT???? one - Chris Simms!

Do not assume you know me, because you do not. I went to a small school in upstate NY and represented many small college players in Europe. So I do not have any prejudice against smaller schools.

Go back and read my post and see what I said about Williams. I saw him earlier this year on Espn against UAB. As far as CUSA goes admittedly I do not watch alot of their games as it is difficult to find programming, but when they are on weekday night games I watch.

I watch college football because I like to see prospects for my team and do not buy into talking heads. I am a Texans fan. When it comes to UT I am a fan as well because I was born in Austin. I do not go to the games as I really do not like our fans either.

real
12-15-2005, 06:24 PM
so now DD is clinton portis

infantrycak
12-15-2005, 06:30 PM
so now DD is clinton portis

Seriously, if you can't understand the direct application of that example (try looking that word up) to the discussion at hand, well...

real
12-15-2005, 06:37 PM
No I understand it perfectly... but what I am trying to get you to understand, is that O-line doesn't have as much to do with it as you are trying to tell me...IMO Barry Sanders...If you are talented then you will be talented anywhere...There is no x-factor...If you have talent it shouldn't be.."well if he had a better line"...he'll never be a 1500 yard rusher..period...and yeah he gets 1000 but that aint what it used to be

real
12-15-2005, 06:41 PM
and of course you would use denver's line...anyone would have a drop of coming from denver....IMO portis will still get 1500 this season...DD would have to almost kill himself to smell 1350...

infantrycak
12-15-2005, 06:49 PM
and of course you would use denver's line...anyone would have a drop of coming from denver...

Thank you. OL does matter--case closed.

IMO portis will still get 1500 this season

He is on pace for 1450 on get this 60 extra carries. But we already concluded the OL matters so you already knew that.

real
12-15-2005, 06:51 PM
Thank you. OL does matter--case closed.



He is on pace for 1450 on get this 60 extra carries. But we already concluded the OL matters so you already knew that.
More carries+less injuries+better ypc average= better than ya boy DD

I never said OL didn't matter just not as much of a crutch you all are trying to give DD...

real
12-15-2005, 06:52 PM
More carries+ less injuries+ better ypc average = better and more durable than ya boy DD

I never said OL didn't matter just not as much of a crutch you all are trying to give DD...:)

LORK 88
12-15-2005, 07:10 PM
More carries+ less injuries+ better ypc average = better and more durable than ya boy DD

I never said OL didn't matter just not as much of a crutch you all are trying to give DD...:)

Clinton's YPC is 4.3 and Davis' is 4.2 so if you gave Davis the extra 45 carries that Portis got, there wouldnt be much difference. Davis has missed 5 games in his career compared to Clinton's 3.

You need to quit searching for reasons to call DD bad and give credit where its due. How many people have averaged over 4 YPC before or after Davis got here? NONE. How many 1000 yard rushers? ONLY DAVIS. Give him a good OL and he'll get your 1800 yard season.

real
12-15-2005, 07:18 PM
1800 thats funny...everyone else thinks he's a 2000 kinda guy

ccdude730
12-15-2005, 07:51 PM
with a good Oline DD can consistenly get 1500-1700 yards. as of now, our best weapon at run blocker is norris...the FB! 2000 total yards is something he can do as well.

his power and vision are underrated. he has questionable durability but when he accounts for so much of our offense, its not hard to see why. every offseason we hear about how we try to limit his touches so he can last longer but we continue to use him time and time again.

back to the dolphin game, mike, i remember him pushin zach thomas out of his way. thats his strength. if you remember the run against the jets using his vision and quickness. thats his strength.

i like DD and sure he isnt that bruiser back we need. but neither is bush...

royce1054
12-15-2005, 08:05 PM
one 1 good thing about DD is i always see him get yards after contact.

Bush doesnt like to run between the tackles... what gonna happen when he gets hit by an NFL quality player not the PAC10. He will wish we traded him thats what.

infantrycak
12-15-2005, 09:01 PM
better than ya boy DD

I never said OL didn't matter just not as much of a crutch you all are trying to give DD...

Try reading back thru the thread and catching my drift again instead of reading things into it.

1st you said DD doesn't get met in the backfield and make anything out of it--basically, DD doesn't get yards after contact. That is pretty patently untrue regardless of whether DD is a top 5 or top 50 RB. He is a tough interior runner as can easily be seen from his 1st game against Miami thru to the last game.

Then you asserted he rarely even makes it past one defender, i.e. DD gets tackled the majority of the time by the 1st guy--clearly wrong by even a cursory review of actual game film once again. Keep with me here--no assertion that DD is LT, but your statement is still wrong.

Your next assertion was there were at least 15 RB's with better ypc. I asked a question (not an assertion, a question) for you to name which of those RB's had OL's worse than the Texans. You asserted basically that OL quality basically can't be judged (although you certainly recognize it in Denver) and DD rarely gets hit before 2 yds down field. The 1st assertion is subject to opinion, the 2nd is demonstrably wrong. Staying with me--still no assertion DD is LT.

Then in your self vibe quote we get into OL's and come to the conclusion you actually do admit they make a difference. I don't see the assertions of DD's hall of fame running, but I see several incorrect assertions about what he and the Texans OL do accomplish.