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View Full Version : Does Casserly really want Reggie Bush?


Marcus
12-12-2005, 03:17 PM
I really doubt it. Seriously.

He can't talk about it, at the risk of getting fined. But that doesn't stop Bob Allen or 610 from asking him about him. And from all the non-answers, this one sticks out. "I really like what Domanick Davis means to our football team."

And remember. Casserly doesn't give two squats what the fans think. Derrick Johnson should convince you of that.

tulexan
12-12-2005, 03:20 PM
true, but it isn't just fans saying that we should take him.

and i think he does give two squats about what bob mcnair thinks and he isn't about to let this gold mine go to someone else.

cadahnic
12-12-2005, 03:48 PM
Casserly has both said that they are very happy with Domanick Davis and that he would have a hard time spending the #1 pick on a part time player and I tend to agree with him on both those points.

tulexan
12-12-2005, 03:58 PM
And remember. Casserly doesn't give two squats what the fans think. Derrick Johnson should convince you of that.

Casserly gambled with Johnson. I really do believe that he thought he could trade down and still get him at 16. He was close, but wrong.

cadahnic
12-12-2005, 04:06 PM
Casserly gambled with Johnson. I really do believe that he thought he could trade down and still get him at 16. He was close, but wrong.

I am also led to believe that he thought Derrick would be there at #16 but it didn't work out, and all that to add a third round pick this year.

Blake
12-12-2005, 04:36 PM
Close only counts with horseshoes and hand grenades, and in this case it landed us an average D-lineman with the 16th pick, chosen ahead of successful starters this year like Ware or Spears. I hope we pick up a killer this year with that third rounder. Good one, Cass.

Ware was taken at #11. Spears #20.

beerlover
12-12-2005, 04:39 PM
everybody is focused on taking or not taking Reggie Bush if the Texans get the 1st pick and he declares for the draft but in all these trade down sceneros is anyone factoring facing Reggie Bush once he is in the NFL especially to a team in division or conference that we have to play on a regular basis?

I just can't imagine the Texans defense stopping Reggie Bush we make average backs look like all-pro's. therefore not only would we gain Reggies services we would not have to deal with those services being used against us.

JDizzle
12-12-2005, 05:52 PM
what average backs are you referring to? ... Haven't we been pretty good on the run defense this year? If I am just willfully blocking out bad memories, please refresh my mind here.

We're dead last in run defense this year.

tulexan
12-12-2005, 05:57 PM
what average backs are you referring to? ... Haven't we been pretty good on the run defense this year? If I am just willfully blocking out bad memories, please refresh my mind here.

Besides, who will Bush go to besides the Niners, Jets, or last I heard, maybe the Packers. Not like we see them much.


I think he is referring to trading down to a team like the Titans or some other 4-10 pick. Not necessarily just the Niners, Jets, and Packers.

royce1054
12-12-2005, 06:37 PM
Why do you think we are gonna draft a player we dont need when there are very good OL in this draft. Come on lets be honest here we have DD and we dont need BUSH. This whole lets draft Bush topic is dumb and needs to trashed and forgotten. OL, TE and S are more important than Bush. Even Linehart has more of a chance of being drafted by the Texans than Bush does. And the only way Linehart would be drafted is if Carr's 8mil isnt picked up. Lets be honest lets just stop talking about Bush and lets start talking about what we really are gonna do.

1. Draft Furgeson (sp) or OL
2. trade down


thats it.

tulexan
12-12-2005, 06:41 PM
Why do you think we are gonna draft a player we dont need when there are very good OL in this draft. Come on lets be honest here we have DD and we dont need BUSH. This whole lets draft Bush topic is dumb and needs to trashed and forgotten. OL, TE and S are more important than Bush. Even Linehart has more of a chance of being drafted by the Texans than Bush does. And the only way Linehart would be drafted is if Carr's 8mil isnt picked up. Lets be honest lets just stop talking about Bush and lets start talking about what we really are gonna do.

1. Draft Furgeson (sp) or OL
2. trade down


thats it.


Your right there are a lot of good OL in the draft this year which means that we can afford to draft Reggie Bush and some good OL players. I don't know how you can say that Reggie isn't important to this team when we have a pathetic offense and only one playmaker on the team. We aren't lighting up the scoreboards every game last time I checked. We are losing a lot of these games by 1 or 2 touchdowns. Having another playmaker could turn this 1-12 season into a 6-7 or 7-6 season right now.

And Ferguson isn't even the best lineman in the country right now. He wasn't named to 1st team all american and a lot of people have questions about his size. If there was a slam dunk lineman, then yes I would say we shoudl trade down and get him, but there isn't. There is a slam dunk offensive player named Reggie Bush who could help turn this team around.

royce1054
12-12-2005, 06:51 PM
I think we are gonna be trading down. I am about 90% sure we will trade down and get 2 1st rd picks. Then we can OL and a TE. Then image how good we would be with a TE threat and a better blocking O-line instead of new RB same things as this year

tulexan
12-12-2005, 06:58 PM
That would mean that we are trading with Denver since they are the only team with 2 first round picks this year. Denver doesn't trade up to get running backs. Shannahan is too arrogant to do something like that because he believes he can put anyone in the lineup and have them be a successful running back. And he is right.

beerlover
12-12-2005, 09:13 PM
what average backs are you referring to? ... Haven't we been pretty good on the run defense this year? If I am just willfully blocking out bad memories, please refresh my mind here.

McGahee 117 yds.
Parker 111 yds.
R. Johnson 88 yds.
C Brown 78 yds.
R Droughns 99 yds.
L Johnson 211 yds.

I'll grant you that S Alexander 141 yds. & E James 139 & 122 yds are both all-pro.

Besides, who will Bush go to besides the Niners, Jets, or last I heard, maybe the Packers. Not like we see them much.

depends on the packages offered not neccesarily the team who finishes last, the Titans with Chow as the OC would be my primary concern or the team I was indicating.

MorKnolle
12-12-2005, 11:17 PM
I think we are gonna be trading down. I am about 90% sure we will trade down and get 2 1st rd picks. Then we can OL and a TE. Then image how good we would be with a TE threat and a better blocking O-line instead of new RB same things as this year

As was previously said, I doubt we end up with two first round picks this year as Denver is the only team with two first rounders, but we can trade down a couple spots and pick up a high second round pick this year and a first rounder next year, plus more similar picks if we trade down twice. I do not especially want to see us draft a TE, especially not in the first round.

McGahee 117 yds.
Parker 111 yds.
R. Johnson 88 yds.
C Brown 78 yds.
R Droughns 99 yds.
L Johnson 211 yds.

I'll grant you that S Alexander 141 yds. & E James 139 & 122 yds are both all-pro.


McGahee and Larry Johnson are definitely All-Pro quality RBs and Parker and Rudi Johnson definitely have a chance of becoming All-Pros at some point in their career.

YoungTexanFan
12-13-2005, 12:00 AM
As was previously said, I doubt we end up with two first round picks this year as Denver is the only team with two first rounders, but we can trade down a couple spots and pick up a high second round pick this year and a first rounder next year, plus more similar picks if we trade down twice. I do not especially want to see us draft a TE, especially not in the first round.



McGahee and Larry Johnson are definitely All-Pro quality RBs and Parker and Rudi Johnson definitely have a chance of becoming All-Pros at some point in their career.

willie parker doesnt have much of a chance. Rudi might become an all-pro or close to it.

YoungTexanFan
12-13-2005, 12:04 AM
everybody is focused on taking or not taking Reggie Bush if the Texans get the 1st pick and he declares for the draft but in all these trade down sceneros is anyone factoring facing Reggie Bush once he is in the NFL especially to a team in division or conference that we have to play on a regular basis?

I just can't imagine the Texans defense stopping Reggie Bush we make average backs look like all-pro's. therefore not only would we gain Reggies services we would not have to deal with those services being used against us.

Unfortunatly, you too beerlover, seem to have turned over in your opinion and joined the "other" side. Best wishes until you come back to "our" side after the combine.

:ouch: here once posted an honest man, not yet corrupted by chaos and hype. I salute you for the time you lasted, the train is picking up more members as the same arguments persist.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 12:09 AM
willie parker doesnt have much of a chance. Rudi might become an all-pro or close to it.

Parker had a decent rookie year and the Steelers love to run the ball, so as he develops and Bettis and Staley get older and phase out Parker could put up some nice numbers, but we'll have to wait and see on him.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 12:10 AM
everybody is focused on taking or not taking Reggie Bush if the Texans get the 1st pick and he declares for the draft but in all these trade down sceneros is anyone factoring facing Reggie Bush once he is in the NFL especially to a team in division or conference that we have to play on a regular basis?

I just can't imagine the Texans defense stopping Reggie Bush we make average backs look like all-pro's. therefore not only would we gain Reggies services we would not have to deal with those services being used against us.

We can't draft a player only on the premise that we don't want to have to defend against him two times every eight years when we actually play his team. Realistically we will probably only play against Reggie Bush twice in his career unless he goes to an AFC team and we meet in the playoffs.

tulexan
12-13-2005, 12:10 AM
Maybe there should be a dark side avatar just like the pink soap boys avatar

beerlover
12-13-2005, 12:19 AM
Parker had a decent rookie year and the Steelers love to run the ball, so as he develops and Bettis and Staley get older and phase out Parker could put up some nice numbers, but we'll have to wait and see on him.

this is getting comical but you pretty much proved my point that the Texans make them all look like all-pro :)

as far as "We can't draft a player only on the premise that we don't want to have to defend against him". maybe not but it should be noted in any trade that involves a divisional foe.

YoungTexanFan
12-13-2005, 12:21 AM
this is getting comical but you pretty much proved my point that the Texans make them all look like all-pro :)

as far as "We can't draft a player only on the premise that we don't want to have to defend against him". maybe not but it should be noted in any trade that involves a divisional foe.

only to a point. when do you stop advocating a pick based on inability to stop him, as opposed to ability to play him?

beerlover
12-13-2005, 12:28 AM
only to a point. when do you stop advocating a pick based on inability to stop him, as opposed to ability to play him?

maybe as high as 10% I'm not really sure, Reggie is such unusal talent that could turn a program around or bring one down (opposition) :rolleyes:

beerlover
12-13-2005, 12:31 AM
Unfortunatly, you too beerlover, seem to have turned over in your opinion and joined the "other" side. Best wishes until you come back to "our" side after the combine.

:ouch: here once posted an honest man, not yet corrupted by chaos and hype. I salute you for the time you lasted, the train is picking up more members as the same arguments persist.

thats funny, but I've been reserving judgement until he offically declares, you know I'm a Winston 1st, Davin 2nd Texan :texans:

tulexan
12-13-2005, 12:33 AM
He is going to be the LeBron of the NFL.

People were saying the same thing about him too. He is a men among boys, he hasn't played against real talent, all flash and no substance...

Like LeBron, Reggie is a special talent. He has a lot of doubters now, after the Rose Bowl he will have less, but if he is drafted by us people will love him, and if he is drafted by someone else people will be disgusted.

Kaiser Toro
12-13-2005, 12:36 AM
He is going to be the LeBron of the NFL.

People were saying the same thing about him too. He is a men among boys, he hasn't played against real talent, all flash and no substance...

Like LeBron, Reggie is a special talent. He has a lot of doubters now, after the Rose Bowl he will have less, but if he is drafted by us people will love him, and if he is drafted by someone else people will be disgusted.

Absolutely disagree with your comparision.

tulexan
12-13-2005, 12:56 AM
Would you care to explain, or are you just going to disagree for no reason?

stevo3883
12-13-2005, 01:01 AM
Absolutely disagree with your comparision.



I disagree with your disagreement.

royce1054
12-13-2005, 06:46 AM
There will be other teams with 2 picks. I think the Jets will package somethign to make sure they get Bush. The #2 pick and and their 2nd rounder and a 3rd next year sounds lovely to me. Then we can package another deal to Tennessee so they can get Linehart at #2. Dropping 3 picks should get us the #6 and i think tenn has 2 #3's. Then we package some of those 3's and move up in the 2nd round. Either that or keep them and get rid of half of our team and start over from scratch... being sarcastic there.

Obcourse that means we can get Ferguson or Winston at #6. then we still have 1st 2 picks in the 2nd. thats 3 1st round quality players.

Texas_Thrill
12-13-2005, 09:52 AM
I mean I want to see how our off-season goes before I determine who I am behind but I will say this having a gamebreaker at RB is a special thing to have and as much as I like DD this aint a popularity contest and he's shown little in the way of being a gamebreaker.

Hervoyel
12-13-2005, 10:21 AM
I think that in light of yesterdays press conference we might just find out that by the time the draft arrives it won't much matter what Charlie Casserly wants. He could very well be gone.

infantrycak
12-13-2005, 10:43 AM
Why do you think we are gonna draft a player we dont need when there are very good OL in this draft. Come on lets be honest here we have DD and we dont need BUSH. This whole lets draft Bush topic is dumb and needs to trashed and forgotten. OL, TE and S are more important than Bush. Even Linehart has more of a chance of being drafted by the Texans than Bush does. And the only way Linehart would be drafted is if Carr's 8mil isnt picked up. Lets be honest lets just stop talking about Bush and lets start talking about what we really are gonna do.

1. Draft Furgeson (sp) or OL
2. trade down


thats it.

No way we should spend the #1 on Ferguson. Should the Texans entertain trade offers and if they receive fair value trade down--absolutely IMO, but if the Texans cannot get fair value to trade down they should stand pat and take Bush.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 11:01 AM
this is getting comical but you pretty much proved my point that the Texans make them all look like all-pro :)

as far as "We can't draft a player only on the premise that we don't want to have to defend against him". maybe not but it should be noted in any trade that involves a divisional foe.

No one in our division is going to trade up for Bush. The Colts have Edgerrin, the Jaguars still have Fred Taylor and are far enough down in the draft anyways that we could not get a good enough value for trading down, and the Titans are already going to be in cap Hell and no be able to afford a #1 overall contract, plus they have a young tandem in Chris Brown and Travis Henry and have other holes to fill that they are not going to trade off a bunch of picks for him.

thats funny, but I've been reserving judgement until he offically declares, you know I'm a Winston 1st, Davin 2nd Texan :texans:

Great draft plan, I love it. I don't know enough about Davin, McNeil, Justice, and some of the others that might be down there to make my final decision on our second pick yet, but it will be one of those guys.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 11:08 AM
There will be other teams with 2 picks. I think the Jets will package somethign to make sure they get Bush. The #2 pick and and their 2nd rounder and a 3rd next year sounds lovely to me. Then we can package another deal to Tennessee so they can get Linehart at #2. Dropping 3 picks should get us the #6 and i think tenn has 2 #3's. Then we package some of those 3's and move up in the 2nd round. Either that or keep them and get rid of half of our team and start over from scratch... being sarcastic there.

Obcourse that means we can get Ferguson or Winston at #6. then we still have 1st 2 picks in the 2nd. thats 3 1st round quality players.

The Jets won't likely have the #2 pick anyways, plus if Pennington isn't going to be healthy enough to be their franchise QB they will draft Leinart over Bush anyways. Either way, we should be able to get the #2 overall and their 2nd rounders for both this year and next year, that's about even on the charts and they would be trading up for the all-mighty Reggie Bush so they'd be willing to trade extra for him. I also don't see Tennessee taking Leinart, they are going to have significant cap problems again and have Billy Volek that they have been pretty pleased with so I think they'll go with him for a year if McNair retires or they can't restructure his deal. Look for the Ravens, Raiders, Cardinals, or Saints to trade up for Leinart, adn they will all have high picks too. We can realistically end up with the #5-8 pick, three high 2nd round picks, and four high 3rd round picks on the first day, or maybe get one or two 2nd round picks for next year instead of this year's 3rd rounders.

TheOgre
12-13-2005, 11:22 AM
No way we should spend the #1 on Ferguson. Should the Texans entertain trade offers and if they receive fair value trade down--absolutely IMO, but if the Texans cannot get fair value to trade down they should stand pat and take Bush.

*Applaud*

edo783
12-13-2005, 11:24 AM
We can realistically end up with the #5-8 pick, three high 2nd round picks, and four high 3rd round picks on the first day.

If that were to happen, we would be WELL on the road to becoming what we all want...a team that is competative and a contender.

tulexan
12-13-2005, 11:28 AM
We can realistically end up with the #5-8 pick, three high 2nd round picks, and four high 3rd round picks on the first day, or maybe get one or two 2nd round picks for next year instead of this year's 3rd rounders.

Wait a second. We get more than one draft pick this year? That can't be. I thought it was either draft Bush or make the line better. You must be wrong because we only get one draft pick. You must be confused with baseball who has multiple round drafts.

infantrycak
12-13-2005, 11:55 AM
Wait a second. We get more than one draft pick this year? That can't be. I thought it was either draft Bush or make the line better. You must be wrong because we only get one draft pick. You must be confused with baseball who has multiple round drafts.

Try reading a little closer and you will see he is talking about picking up multiple extra 1st day picks. The potential for that is huge.

A reasonable trade value scenario (let's look at the trade being made in 2004 so we can have real examples)--our #1 overall for #5 the same year plus #5 in the 2nd and a 1st rounder the next year, let's say #10 and a the #10 3rd as well.

So trade Reggie Bush for:

1st--Sean Taylor, Kellen Winslow, Roy Williams or DeAngelo Hall
2nd--Ben Troupe, Tatum Bell, Bob Sanders or Michael Boulware

1st--DeMarcus Ware or Shawnee Merriman
3rd--Justin Tuck, Kirk Morrison, Domonique Foxworth or Nick Kaczur

I have a hard time imagining Bush will help the Texans more than Sean Taylor, Ben Troupe, DeMarcus Ware and Justin Tuck combined.

tulexan
12-13-2005, 12:01 PM
I think you are the one who is mistaken. According to the experts on this board. It is impossible to draft Bush and fill other holes that we have.

I mean there is no possible way that we could lets say draft Bush with the first pick, take a good OT with our second pick, take an OL or TE with our third pick, and take a safety with our other third pick.

That would work, but I apparently am wrong in thinking that you can fill multiple holes in a single draft.

infantrycak
12-13-2005, 12:06 PM
I think you are the one who is mistaken. According to the experts on this board. It is impossible to draft Bush and fill other holes that we have.

I mean there is no possible way that we could lets say draft Bush with the first pick, take a good OT with our second pick, take an OL or TE with our third pick, and take a safety with our other third pick.

That would work, but I apparently am wrong in thinking that you can fill multiple holes in a single draft.

I'm not saying you are wrong about the fact that there is more than one draft pick--rather an obvious observation, but not an incorrect one. The point is you (a) responded to a post about trading down as if you didn't read it and (b) act like no trade no matter how much is received in return could ever be worth Bush. That IMO is just silly. I would bet 30+ GM's would trade the opportunity to pick Bush for Sean Taylor, Ben Troupe, DeMarcus Ware and Justin Tuck. Oh, and let's see how that would address the Texans' needs--punishing FS, dual threat TE, pass rushing OLB and center--yeah that would suck and wouldn't contribute anything to winning. But hey, keep up the Bush needs to be promoted from god to titan posts.

tulexan
12-13-2005, 12:10 PM
No I would take all of them over Bush, but how can you guarantee that there will be players of that quality available? Wouldn't that just be more Riverboat Gambling? That is no different from Casserly trading from 13 to 16 betting that Derrick Johnson would still be available and he would pick up an extra 3rd rounder. I personally think that if there is a player that you want then you should take him if he falls in your lap.

infantrycak
12-13-2005, 12:19 PM
No I would take all of them over Bush, but how can you guarantee that there will be players of that quality available? Wouldn't that just be more Riverboat Gambling? That is no different from Casserly trading from 13 to 16 betting that Derrick Johnson would still be available and he would pick up an extra 3rd rounder. I personally think that if there is a player that you want then you should take him if he falls in your lap.

Two totally different issues. First, I don't think Casserly was gambling DJ would be there at #16. There is no evidence for that and KC's biggest need was obviously LB. In any event, as I have said elsewhere, if you stay at #1 then Bush is the pick. By no means if he is the guy you want do you trade down and hope he falls. That isn't the same thing though as saying what is someone going to offer me to give him up. That is a scenario that has to be considered. There is talent out there every year--it is just a matter of evaluating it and taking it--the odds are much better for it to work out in the 1st 3 rounds.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 12:24 PM
Try reading a little closer and you will see he is talking about picking up multiple extra 1st day picks. The potential for that is huge.

A reasonable trade value scenario (let's look at the trade being made in 2004 so we can have real examples)--our #1 overall for #5 the same year plus #5 in the 2nd and a 1st rounder the next year, let's say #10 and a the #10 3rd as well.

So trade Reggie Bush for:

1st--Sean Taylor, Kellen Winslow, Roy Williams or DeAngelo Hall
2nd--Ben Troupe, Tatum Bell, Bob Sanders or Michael Boulware

1st--DeMarcus Ware or Shawnee Merriman
3rd--Justin Tuck, Kirk Morrison, Domonique Foxworth or Nick Kaczur

I have a hard time imagining Bush will help the Texans more than Sean Taylor, Ben Troupe, DeMarcus Ware and Justin Tuck combined.

Expanding on the Chargers/Giants example, if we had been the Chargers we could have chosen from:
2004 1st - Sean Taylor, Kellen Winslow, Roy Williams (the WR), DeAngelo Hall, Dunta Robinson (who we actually picked at #10), Jonathan Vilma, D.J. Williams.
2004 2nd - Teddy Lehman, Ben Troupe, Travis LaBoy, Bob Sanders, Dontarrious Thomas, Michael Boulware.
2005 1st - Shawne Merriman, Jammal Brown, Derrick Johnson, Marcus Spears (Ware went earlier)
2005 3rd - Justin Tuck, Kirk Morrison, Domonique Foxworth or Nick Kaczur

I have no doubts Reggie Bush will be a good NFL talent, but I don't think he fits well enough into our team the way it is currently been built to make up for the talent of 4-5 extra draft picks like this that we could pick up. Bush will likely create higher demand with more teams than Eli Manning did so we will be able to get more in a trade for him than what the Chargers got for Eli. Especially with Leinart being a high-demand QB in the draft this year as well, we could possibly trade down twice and pick up two extra 2nd rounders, two extra 3rd rounders for this year, and maybe a 1st or a couple 2nd rounders for next year. The way our team has been built Bush will not be able to come in and be an every down RB that will rack up 1700 rushing yards and 700 receiving yards like I had seen someone post on one of these threads (I'm not sure he can do that for any team except maybe the Broncos), that just isn't going to happen with our team. We should be able to trade the #1 pick away and acquire an additional 3-4 immediate starting quality players and a few extras as well, so I don't see how we can pass up on that. If for whatever reason teams back out on offering any kind of decent trade for him then by all means draft him and find some way to use him, but the 49ers, Jets, and maybe the Cardinals and Packers will all have very high picks in the draft and will likely be willing to trade a lot for Bush.

Holden135
12-13-2005, 12:41 PM
Why would we draft Bush? RIght now our only two solid positions are RB with Davis and KR with Mathis. Drafting someone to split time with them would be ignorant. If we wait til round 2 for an OL we are risking missing out on an all pro calliber olineman. That is what we need. We need someone that can act as a brick wall on pass protection and guarantee us 5 yards per carry on a run to their side of the line. People remember football games are won in the trenches, not by a wr or a rb.

JDizzle
12-13-2005, 01:34 PM
Try reading a little closer and you will see he is talking about picking up multiple extra 1st day picks. The potential for that is huge.

A reasonable trade value scenario (let's look at the trade being made in 2004 so we can have real examples)--our #1 overall for #5 the same year plus #5 in the 2nd and a 1st rounder the next year, let's say #10 and a the #10 3rd as well.

So trade Reggie Bush for:

1st--Sean Taylor, Kellen Winslow, Roy Williams or DeAngelo Hall
2nd--Ben Troupe, Tatum Bell, Bob Sanders or Michael Boulware

1st--DeMarcus Ware or Shawnee Merriman
3rd--Justin Tuck, Kirk Morrison, Domonique Foxworth or Nick Kaczur

I have a hard time imagining Bush will help the Texans more than Sean Taylor, Ben Troupe, DeMarcus Ware and Justin Tuck combined.

That's a good scenario, however I don't have much confidence in Casserly. He essentially gave up a Ben Troupe / Bob Sanders, DeMorrio Williams, and a Chad Lavalais (all of which are starters.) for Jason Babin.

beerlover
12-13-2005, 02:04 PM
That's a good scenario, however I don't have much confidence in Casserly. He essentially gave up a Ben Troupe / Bob Sanders, DeMorrio Williams, and a Chad Lavalais (all of which are starters.) for Jason Babin.

the voice of reason, thankyou JD :)

must........fire.........casserly..........:bomb:

Kaiser Toro
12-13-2005, 02:25 PM
Would you care to explain, or are you just going to disagree for no reason?

You are comparing apples and oranges. Basketball and Football carry a multitude of differences:
Cap
Amount of players under contract
Guaranteed money
Incentives
Playing offense and defense
Multi position players
Endorsements

The list goes on an on. If you want to compare Bush to another candidate for the #1 pick in the past or to a current NFL player let's do it. But there is no comparision between the two sports that will foster any present dialogue that can stand on its own two feet for the potential drafting of Bush.

David's Busted Carr
12-13-2005, 02:29 PM
Casserly won't be here to pick so who cares what he thinks???

:)

Hervoyel
12-13-2005, 04:23 PM
Try reading a little closer and you will see he is talking about picking up multiple extra 1st day picks. The potential for that is huge.

A reasonable trade value scenario (let's look at the trade being made in 2004 so we can have real examples)--our #1 overall for #5 the same year plus #5 in the 2nd and a 1st rounder the next year, let's say #10 and a the #10 3rd as well.

So trade Reggie Bush for:

1st--Sean Taylor, Kellen Winslow, Roy Williams or DeAngelo Hall
2nd--Ben Troupe, Tatum Bell, Bob Sanders or Michael Boulware

1st--DeMarcus Ware or Shawnee Merriman
3rd--Justin Tuck, Kirk Morrison, Domonique Foxworth or Nick Kaczur

I have a hard time imagining Bush will help the Texans more than Sean Taylor, Ben Troupe, DeMarcus Ware and Justin Tuck combined.

I tend to agree with JackDizzle about the dangers of such a scenario in the hands of Charlie Casserly but overall I see your point and think that yes, if we could be assured of getting those kinds of players for the Bush pick then I'd make that deal in a heartbeat.

The only problem to such a scenario in my mind is that it's a hindsight kind of example. Every draft can be revisited a year or two later and someone can carve some kind of ultimate set of picks out of it. This has that kind of feel and I wonder if we could accomplish as much in real life.

The idea is of course sound.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 04:47 PM
Of course looking back at it is hindsight, but that was posted and I followed up on it to illustrate the kind of talent that was available in those drafts with the picks that were acquired. We might not have made all those picks (knowing Casserly we probably would have missed on a couple of them), but it shows the potential power of trading down and acquiring so many more picks and the caliber of talent that will be there. I honestly think we can get a better deal than the Chargers got and could likely end up trading down twice and get even more picks.

JDizzle
12-13-2005, 04:53 PM
I just hope that if a trade is considered, we already have the value we want in return predetermined and non-negotiable. In this case it's necessary to place a higher-than-normal value on that #1 pick given it's Reggie Bush (if he declares, of course.). I wouldn't even accept any 2nd day picks as part of the deal. Something like the Chargers got in 2004 would be out of the question IMO.

MorKnolle
12-13-2005, 05:10 PM
I just hope that if a trade is considered, we already have the value we want in return predetermined and non-negotiable. In this case it's necessary to place a higher-than-normal value on that #1 pick given it's Reggie Bush (if he declares, of course.). I wouldn't even accept any 2nd day picks as part of the deal. Something like the Chargers got in 2004 would be out of the question IMO.

I am with you on this one. I am guessing we could trade down with the 49ers (from #1 to #2) and pick up their 2nd round picks for this year and next year and this year's 3rd or 4th round pick, not a bad deal for moving down one spot. We'll also have to sell the point that we are considering drafting Bush to drive up his value and take offers from other teams (Jets, Packers for sure) and see what they can offer. If the Jets are #3, we could probably move down to #3 and pick up this year's 2nd rounder and next year's 1st rounder from them, or maybe get John Abraham instead of this year's 2nd round pick, or something like that. If we drop to #2 we should be able to trade down a second time for a team looking to ensure they get Leinart and acquire another 2nd and 3rd round pick for this year and maybe another 2nd round pick for next year to move down another 2-5 spots.