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View Full Version : Holy Schmokes!! Ricky Williams Retired


Vinny
07-25-2004, 01:05 AM
Just reported on ESPN. Unreal. I hope you havn't drafted in your FFL's yet.

scourge
07-25-2004, 01:06 AM
I just was coming here to post that! I wish he'd change his mind, he had a promising future...

Nawzer
07-25-2004, 01:15 AM
I won't believe it until I see it coming from Ricky Williams' mouth. But it's still very strange that he would consider doing something like this.

RTP2110
07-25-2004, 01:16 AM
Ricky Williams as in Miami Dolphins/Texas Longhorns Ricky Williams??

Fiddy
07-25-2004, 01:17 AM
Ricky Williams as in Miami Dolphins/Texas Longhorns Ricky Williams??Yep!!!! And they could have gotten Steven Jackson, Chris Perry, Kevin Jones, etc. in the draft if he would have told them sooner!!!! The Dolphins are screwed...

keyfro
07-25-2004, 01:21 AM
this makes absolutely no sense what so ever...why retire after only 5 years...he has no bad injuries that come to mind...he's in miami of all places...why retire...there must be more to this story

Nawzer
07-25-2004, 01:21 AM
I guess Ricky couldn't stand Shaq getting all the attention there so he had go make a bigger splash! hehe..

keyfro
07-25-2004, 01:23 AM
espn's website says they wonder if it's like robert smith and drugs being the reason...it doesn't seem like ricky to be into drugs but who knows

RTP2110
07-25-2004, 01:24 AM
Unbelieveable!!!

I thought this was a prank thread, and that it was Indianapolis Colts/Texas Tech Red Raiders Ricky Williams. I wonder what made him decide to retire?

scourge
07-25-2004, 01:26 AM
This article is the most i have found... (http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/)

Fiddy
07-25-2004, 01:27 AM
I wonder what made him decide to retire?He said he didnt want to play anymore, wasnt in his heart and he felt he would hurt the team if he went out there and didnt give it his all...

RTP2110
07-25-2004, 01:31 AM
I think he's hurting the team more by retiring. LoL

ArlingtonTexan
07-25-2004, 01:32 AM
Ricky has always been a different kinda of dude. Of the guys in the league that would wake one morning and not want to play anymore; he tops the list of person who would join the Barry sanders and Robert Smith fraternity of I am just quitting.

Williams carried the ball a ton at UT and in his years in the pros. I respect guys who quit early(even at the wrong time) more than those who hang collecting paychecks and destroying thier bodies when the player does not have the heart to compete.

HowBoutThemCowboys!
07-25-2004, 01:40 AM
All the draft picks they wasted and all the money. Ricky, Ricky, Ricky. I thought he was going to be big. Dang, they could of grabbed some awesome rb in the draft. Such a bad time to retire. Phins are done for this season. Feel sorry for the fans. the season ended early for them today. Good luck in 06' and let the rebuilding begin

ccdude730
07-25-2004, 01:44 AM
just heard that he is gonna retire to "travel the world"

scourge
07-25-2004, 01:46 AM
this is a reply on the Miami Herald web page... made me laugh, i feel for the guy.

need help, what the hell are we going to do, minor is good but not ricky. I am in serious shock and are season just took a turn toward another non playoff season. and i am sure glad that the one jersey i could afford to save up and get was ricky's. Have fun in asia or jamaca and leave us all hanging. you could have told us this months ago. we could have drafted a RUNNING BACK THANK YOU, SELFISH ASSH@LE.. ANYONE HAVE THOUGHTS.

Maybe since there was some previous talk that the Vikes were looking to trade M. Bennett for some defence, the Fins will look to grab him...

Fiddy
07-25-2004, 01:49 AM
Maybe since there was some previous talk that the Vikes were looking to trade M. Bennett for some defence, the Fins will look grab him...Adewale Ogunleye for Bennett??? Saying that is a longshot would be an understatement though...

scourge
07-25-2004, 01:56 AM
yeah, but it would benefit both parties involved...

drdjsmm
07-25-2004, 01:59 AM
Ricky probably retiring so he can smoke pot 24-7. What a doosh bag! He should stay away from the miami clubs! Man, if i was a maimi fan.....

tacoman_j
07-25-2004, 02:03 AM
Stacy MAck just got a JOB. He's the only free agent back remaining. Good Luck with the MACK lol:

HowBoutThemCowboys!
07-25-2004, 02:21 AM
Mack was awesome when I played the Texans in Madden 2004. lol, he ran all over me. Got me so frustrated :rofl:

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 02:31 AM
I didnt believe it I just had to go turn on espn to see it for myself. This is truly unreal, he has to be on drugs. Heres a question does this move make Ricky Williams one of the biggest NFL bust considering he didnt work out in New Orleans and is gone after 2 seasons in Miami and only 5 years in the NFL and all the picks the Saints used to move up to get him then all Miami spent to trade for him. He was supposed to be the next great back. Broke all those NCAA records and didnt do didly squat in the NFL. I mean he had decent numbers but if he only plays 5 seasons in kinda negates them. I dont know what else to say I am truly shocked I thought all this was a joke. Man my dad is a huge phins fan I sure hope he is having sweet dreams because tomorrow I'm going to have to call him and ruin his week, DAMN.

fball
07-25-2004, 02:38 AM
What's that!!!! :crazy:

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 02:41 AM
it is shocking

tacoman_j
07-25-2004, 02:52 AM
How is Wanny going to save his job. This must really suck. TE beats his wife, RB Quits, No clear cut QB, MLB has surgery before training Camps. Star DE plans to holdout till week 7 so that he can retain free agency status. Total turnover of players on the OL. Also, finish last season @ 10-6, yet no playoffs!!! THAT TEXANS LOSS REALLY HURT!!!! :jam:

SlimBooter
07-25-2004, 02:59 AM
This has got to be rough for the Dolphins. Not only does Ricky retire but he does so a day after Eddie George signs. Now they're stuck with Minor or have to trade out to find a RB. Maybe they can try and swindle a back from the Vikings but Minnesota probally couldn't get the paper work in on time. :rofl:

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 03:00 AM
I am just as shocked as everyone else. The only word that comes to mind is Wow! And they say there's never any big NFL news before training camps.

http://espn-att.starwave.com/media/nfl/2004/0724/photo/w_williams3_ft.jpg

Williams has always been an odd cat, but this is beyond anything I would've expected from him. His passion for the game seemed to be reinvigorated when he came to Miami. I wouldn't put it past him to do another 180 sometime this year or next, but one thing is for sure. Wanstedt and the front office for Miami will be looking for new jobs come next season.

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 03:05 AM
I was thinking about that too, he could have just single handedly screwed the Phins playoff chances and ended the Dave Wandstat era

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 03:22 AM
The Dolphins message boards are overloaded I cant even get in its like a bomb just went off oh well i guess ill give them to to grieve:(

SlimBooter
07-25-2004, 03:23 AM
Vikings' head coach Mike Tice said Thursday that running back Michael Bennett will take the bulk of the carries and reamin on the field during goal line situations. When interviewed by KFAN radio in the Twin Cities, Tice said he plans to use Bennett until the four-year veteran indicates that he needs a breather.

Don't they still have Mo Williams and Ontario Smith?? I was thinking more so one of those guys in a trade rather than Bennett. I guess it's going to be a wait and see with this but either way this really damages the Dolphins to epic proportions.

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 03:33 AM
They do look alot like a expansion team, after this season the everybody is going to want to jump ship. I would hate to be a Phins fan they are in for years of rebuilding. Maybe it will work out for the best I really dont think they were going to win anything with Dave at the helm hes to indecisive.

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 03:35 AM
I say its time for the Dolphins to move to somewhere in Asia. Nowhere inparticular. Just travel anywhere Ricky's heart desires. Seems like the only way you'll ever see him in a Dolphin's uniform again.

SlimBooter
07-25-2004, 03:37 AM
Would anyone else find it absolutely hilarious if Ricky Williams goes to all their road games and watches from the stands? After all, it would still be traveling.

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 03:38 AM
Im going to state this question again does this make Ricky one the NFL's biggest bust considering the hype and his potential coming into the league and what 2 teams gave up for him.

SlimBooter
07-25-2004, 03:40 AM
I wouldn't say he's a bust because he did produce quite a bit when he played.

I would think it would be more of a disappointment than a bust.

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 03:41 AM
If he truly retires I dont think he is going to be able to show his face anywhere near the dolphins or Florida for that matter He'd better stay in Asia.

Carr Bombed
07-25-2004, 03:45 AM
isnt disapointment and bust one in the same
Plus New Orleans gave up their whole 99 draft to get him-things didnt work out

Miami gave up 2 1st round picks to get him-things didnt work out

Yes he had decent numbers but retiring after only 5 years kinda negates that

I truly hate it when someone has so much god given talent and they just piss it away it just upsets me

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 03:57 AM
I don't think it negates his accomplishments at all. He was still very productive in those 5 years. 4 out of the 5 he had over 1000 yds. The only year he didnt get 1000 was his rookie season when he got around 800 yds. Barry Sanders retirement was seen as early and shocking, but it in no way negates his accomplishments in the NFL. It's the same as when someone attempts to discredit a QB for being a product of the system. He still put up the numbers and deserves credit for them. As I said before Ricky was an odd guy, but that wasn't unknown to NFL clubs. Drafting him came with inherent risks that come with any other prospect, but his negatives weren't the usual ones that GMs & coaches encounter. While most prospects were considered to be a risk due to their attitude/criminal history/behavior problems, Ricky was a risk because of his unusual nature and his personality disorder. I think you can chalk this up as you'd chalk up any other NFL player who suffered from a mental/personality disorder. Examples would be Barrett Robins, and the backup safety for the Bucs. Both suffered from depression, and I believe Robins also was bipolar. In the end you wouldnt take anything away from Sanders or Jim Brown for retiring early, therefore I don't think you can take much away from Williams even though his retirement is earlier than the other two. Football is like anything else in life. If you don't have the drive to do it anymore then there is no point in going through the motions.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
07-25-2004, 04:42 AM
look on the bright side. we just moved up one spot on all power rankings lists. :rofl:

H-TownRules
07-25-2004, 05:28 AM
I truly hate it when someone has so much god given talent and they just piss it away it just upsets me

I think Ricky Williams is too big for the NFL...not necessarily talent wise but in the since that he wants to do so much in life. The guy is talented in many of his hobbies (was even drafted by the Phillies in 8th round to play baseball before going to college) and I think that he has just closed one of the many great chapters of his life. He proved he could play in the best football league in the world and I think that influenced him in making his decision to move onto something else. I have a feeling Ricky will show up again later down the road...famous for something else other than football. I've always kinda liked the Dolphins so I'm surprised when I find myself supporting what he is doing. He did choose a somewhat bad time to do what he did, but in my opinion thats Ricky. So I wouldn't say he is just pissing his talent away...he is simply moving on to another area of his life where he can show his other talents...life isn't too long and someone at his age should want to see the world and educate himself. If I recall he is really into photography too, so maybe he wants to travel the world taking photographs. I think what he is doing is being himself...always marching to the beat of a drum we can't always hear.

If anyone else supports him I'd like to hear it...I'm already sick of people givin him crap, and Ive only known for 4 hours or so.

saintarnold
07-25-2004, 07:30 AM
More power to him if he can afford to do it. Ricky is legend up here in Austin, and he can do whatever the heck he wants to. At least he wasn't on the Texans-and quit!

JustBonee
07-25-2004, 08:39 AM
Why the sudden urge to travel to Asia?... voices in his head calling? :hmmm:
I also think he is one strange cat.
What bad timing. Dave Wannstedt will be pulling all of his hair out now!

ArlingtonTexan
07-25-2004, 09:54 AM
Carr bomb,

Ricky Williams is not a bust. He was highly productive for 5 NFL years. Bust refer to people who could not get the job done. Ricky Williams could play in the NFL, but does not want to play in the NFL.

H-town,

I have no problem with williams walking away. Football is not a summer job tearing tickets a movie theater where if you not into it really does not matter. Would hate to see that guy not protect himself or another player because he is not wanting to be there.

From a fantasy standpoint the team also has Sammy Morris. Mack is out there as is the guy who started for the Lions in 2002 and was injured last year. See lots of quality choices.

Honestly, I thought the Dolphins were a 3rd or 4th place team in that division before Williams, now I think it would be a miracle if they finished 7 and 9 or better. If Wanny goes his usual 9-7 or 10-6 borderline playoff in or out he will deserve to keep his job.

aj.
07-25-2004, 10:17 AM
Ricky was always a little "out there." This doesn't surprise me at all.

Fiddy
07-25-2004, 11:51 AM
They will applaud him and praise the fact that he walked away from the NFL on his terms, supposedly setting himself free from the shackles of fame -- and, let's not forget, fortune.

They will say Ricky Williams understands what life is all about, that football is just a game and not something all that important in a world where soldiers are being blown up on a regular basis in Iraq and starvation is ravaging countries throughout the world.

But some 24-year-old running back, just hoping for a chance to play in the NFL for one week, will pop on his TV Sunday morning and wake up to the news that Williams, a running back from the Miami Dolphins, is retiring and just get a sick feeling in his stomach.

How could he?

That player would do anything for one carry, and yet Williams is walking away a starting job and millions to be, in his words, free.

Williams notified the Dolphins that he is retiring from the NFL Friday, according to the Miami Herald. That newspaper would know since their lead columnist, the respected and well-read Dan Le Batard, is one of the few allowed in Williams' inner circle and the guy who reported the story Saturday.

Getting into that inner circle is said to be like breaking into the White House at midnight, but it also begs this question: Why would you want in?

If you looked up different in the NFL dictionary, Williams' picture would be next to the word. He is an enigma, a hard-running back who talked in a whisper and somehow seemed as if he was curling up in a fetal position every time someone stepped near his locker or asked to speak with him -- even after his much-publicized bout with a social disorder and the medical treatment he received for it.

What many NFL linebackers could not do, bring him to his knees, the sight of a camera or a writer invading his space often did.

Weirdo is a term some of his ex-teammates and coaches used when his name was brought up -- and that will be even more so now.

In telling the Herald why he is retiring, Williams said, "The people in Jamaica, living in these little tin shacks, they were the happiest people I've ever seen. This is an opportunity to be a real role model. Everyone wants freedom. Human beings aren't supposed to be controlled and told what to do. They're supposed to be given direction and a path. Don't tell me what I can and can't do."

Two things about that quote: Any Jamaican living in a shack who wouldn't trade places with Williams in an instant has been imbibing in too much of Bob Marley's favorite leaf. The second thing is that we're all told what we can and can't do. It's called laws and bosses and wives and parents.

The NFL said Williams couldn't smoke marijuana, so he reportedly did what he had to do to pass the tests -- drinking a masking agent, according to the Herald -- but he failed a test in 2002 and was facing a fine pending an appeal of a failed test late last season.

Now he is free to roll as many fat spliffs as he wants, provided the law doesn't find him. It is illegal, big guy. One more thing, Ricky: It takes green to buy the green, and leaving millions of salary behind isn't exactly a way to get the good stuff.

Williams told the Herald the only people who he has to be accountable to are his three kids. I bet they'll love it years from now when their friends tell them how their daddy walked away from NFL millions to smoke weed and hang out in tin shacks.

Lunacy.

But you can bet Williams will be praised in certain circles for standing up for his beliefs, not catering to the wants of others.

Free, baby.

Jim Brown, Barry Sanders and Robert Smith are all former NFL running backs who walked away from the game with plenty left to give. All three could be considered eccentric to some degree. Williams is friendly with Brown and he also was said to have had a recent conversation with Smith.

Oh, to be a fly on the wall to hear that one, two we're-smarter-than-the-rest-of-you-and-don't-need-this-mindless-game men trying to understand how so many other players put their lives into playing football.

Williams is also selfish. Making this kind of decision a week before the Dolphins were to open training camp makes anything Terrell Owens did seem trivial. This is a quitter, a guy who bailed on his teammates as they were readying to make a Super Bowl push. That's the ultimate insult.

Indications are that Dolphins coach Dave Wannstedt is furious. Wouldn't you be? His job is on the line and suddenly his star running back decides he'd rather sit in a circle with his legs crossed listening to poetry and clicking his fingers at every line he likes?

The Dolphins tailored their offense to Williams and now he runs over them as if they were a seven-year old trying to tackle his big butt. Miami's best option is to play Travis Minor, a fourth-year player from Florida State, who is little more than a third-down back.

Heck, if Williams had made his decision a couple of days earlier the Dolphins could have made a run at Eddie George. But he couldn't even do that for them to maybe make it a little easier.

Williams had three years left on his contract, with base salaries of $3.75 million in 2004, $3.74 million in 2005 and $3.5 million in 2006. The contract also included incentives that could have added more money, so Williams is walking away from $10 to $12 million.

But look at the bright side: At least now he's free. No more being told what plays to run. No more being forced to deal with the media and the spotlight and the constant adulation from fans. Wouldn't you walk away from $10 million and never having to make a reservation for a restaurant table in South Beach, with a bevy of models eyeing your every move to be free of a game that gave you the chance to be free?

As one of Williams' former coaches said recently, "He's as weird as they come."

Ricky W means Ricky Weirdo.

But at least he's free.

Free to see the world.

Free to do what he wants.

Free to put this mindless game away for good.

You can bet there's a young running back somewhere shaking his head wondering how Williams could give this all away and he can't even get a chance. Wasting God's gifts is a sad thing, but it's even more troubling to those who didn't quite get the full compliment, say a runner who might be a half a step slow or a tad too small.

Williams had it all, and now he's throwing it all away.

Is that really something that should be applauded?
nice article from Pete Prisco
http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/7523844

jacquescas
07-25-2004, 11:54 AM
I love how fans call him selfish. In reality they are the selfish ones. Why force someone to do something they are obviously, (or not obviously) not happy doing. Football is no joke and if you heart is not in it, why continue? for fans?

Of course now every year for the next half decade we will hear of teams trying to court him and coax him out of retirement.

jacquescas
07-25-2004, 11:58 AM
Also calling him a bust, please a bust is someone who can't play.

Ricky will be getting calls from the NFL for the next 5 years to try and get him to unretire.

A dissapointment? maybe by a fans perspective. Most running backs careers start to spiral down at around 30 years old. He left a couple years early.

ArlingtonTexan
07-25-2004, 12:09 PM
Sorry Pete Prisco, but a free life is about doing what you have a desire to do, not what you the most talent at doing. Once a person is given a gift it is his to use as he pleases even if others don't like it.

keyfro
07-25-2004, 12:18 PM
this would be a time for miami to call up st. louis...and try to find a way to trade for steven jackson...i know he was st. louis's number one but they don't need him and he's already upset people there by not showing up...a trade to miami for next year's number one and number three sounds like a good trade

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 12:24 PM
It's an interesting article, but I have to totally disagree. Yes Ricky had awful timing, and he single handedly destroyed the Dolphins. No Ricky isn't the Dahli Lama or any other spiritual being on another level than the rest of us. But the main point here is to realize that football is just a game. With all the drama and storylines that the media puts into it sometimes magnifies it to a point where people see it as more than just a game. And with all due respect who is Pete Prisco to determine what the man's perception of freedom is? I can absolutely understand why some fans would be outraged, but they have to realize that these players are still human beings, and are still entitled to the same rights as we enjoy. One of those many rights is to follow your heart's desire. Perhaps for Ricky its taking photos in Asia, or perhaps its something else. Either way its within his rights to pursue that dream.

Fiddy
07-25-2004, 12:26 PM
this would be a time for miami to call up st. louis...and try to find a way to trade for steven jackson...i know he was st. louis's number one but they don't need him and he's already upset people there by not showing up...a trade to miami for next year's number one and number three sounds like a good tradeThe Rams arent trading Jackson for a couple reasons: 1) Faulk is old and missed half of last season and Jackson would be a great replacement 2) Faulk could retire after this season or the next and Jackson would be ready to go 3) If the Dolphins get Jackson the pick would be in the mid 20s so the Rams couldnt get someone to replace Faulk that is has good as Jackson

Tulip
07-25-2004, 12:47 PM
I love Ricky Williams. Have for a long time. I was thrilled when he was traded to the Dolphins because I can't stand the Saints coach and I thought that it was a bad fit, even when Ditka was there. I loved that he and Priest were tearing up the league at the same time. I enjoy that he is so odd.

With that said, for someone who just a month ago was cheerleading his teammates about dedication and focus, this is REALLY odd. I understand about the drug tests. But the guy sounds like someone who went on summer vacation and just doesn't want to go back to school.

I'm all for free spirits and doing what's right for yourself, but when you make a commitment, you make it. I just graduated two months ago, and my grades tanked terribly my last semester because I was trying to graduate and trying to finish my job at the same time. I wanted to quit my job, but I made a three-year commitment and would have never left my boss in the lurch. Yes, we have the right to be free, but we also have responsibilities in life. And his job is like any. There's a right time and a wrong time to walk away. This was the wrong time.

I hope Dave can talk him out of it. Or I at least hope Ricky can show up at Dave's office and have a face-to-face talk. This is incredibly irresponsible.

aj.
07-25-2004, 01:13 PM
2004 Dolphins look an awful lot like an expansion teamThe 2003 Dolphins looked an awful lot like an expansion team too when the Texans beat them in Week 1.

bad
07-25-2004, 01:13 PM
If Ricky leaving (I'm telling ya, he's going to Amsterdam) means Wannstedt is leaving, then Ricky could be doing the Dolphins a big favor in the long term.

The only times I've previously visited the Dolphins message board were before and after their loss to the Texans last year. Both times I came away impressed with the knowledge and attitude of their fan base. Today I'm seeing more of the same. Day 1 and some of them are already past Stage 1, which is denial.
We ALL KNEW Ricky was a risk when we brought him in. We should feel fortunate that we got 2 great years out of the guy. He came here he ran hard, he produced he did what was asked of him for AS LONG AS HE WANTED TO.

I keep hearing this "responsiblity" crap. Just what exactly does he owe us or our organization? How is he "responsible" for anything but his own life? This team banked on him, paid a pretty penny to bring him in, THEY built the team around HIM, not the other way around. The FO misplaced their trust on a player that was a gamble in the beginning and now we all have to pay a price for it. They built the team around ricky, something he never asked for. He never asked for more carries..hell he was happy with Minor as the 3rd round back. The FO rested on it's laurels and tried to have him carry the team. Instead of investing heavily in potent offensive WEAPONS and hungerly pursuing a franchise QB over the last few years. THEY banked on Ricky. I think Feeley has what it takes but i severly question his effectiveness without Ricky's running game. Something that would not be a problem had they secured a franchise QB BEFORE Marino retired. Same damn story as when Dan retired. The FO built the team around ONE guy never planning for the future and they scrammbled to fix it when he left. THEIR problem not his.

Ricky is a rich man, he doesn't owe us a damn thing. "we embraced him, we loved him"....well if Ricky ever did say something right it was that he was figuing out who his TRUE fans were. It's not the fairweather fans that stand by a player when he's good and then push him out the door as he approaches old age. The fact is Ricky has given WAY more to this franchise than they've given back. He's carried it for two years, HE has been the franchise player selling thousands of tickets just to see him, selling merchandise and bringing new fans to the team (those fans will leave now btw but i'll still be here). He's given them their due, now let him take his. "but people paid money to see him play this year" yeah, obviously they did so in effect he's sold THREE years worth of tickets while only taking 2 years in salary. He doesn't owe those fans a thing, he could be sick, injured, or suspended and not play those games. Fans that buy tickets to see a single player rather than a game are foolish to do so in the first place.

people are taking this WAY too damn personally. He made a PERSONAL decision to leave the GAME of football. That's it, he's a player that left a GAME. We knew he was different so just let him be. He doesn't like the spotlight yet he stood in it for a few years for us. If anything WE owe HIM the understanding to let him walk. And YES it is bad timing and he will be sorely missed. but I'm not going to get Rabidly made and slew his name. This is obviously something that came out after his trip to Australia. Do you people that say "I give 2 weeks notice" REALLY think that 2 weeks notice would have made a difference? We could have had over the hill Eddie George...no thanks. We have Minor, we'll make do and rebuild. Let him leave and wish him luck.


I've never been a Dolphins fan, but I may be becoming a Dolphins fan fan.

One is left to wonder how the Jags fans would react if Fred Taylor suddenly decided to join the Peace Corps.

jhawktx
07-25-2004, 01:37 PM
A dissapointment? maybe by a fans perspective. y.

How about from his teammates' perspective. If he was going to do this he should have done it in January so the Dolphins would have had time to go to plan B. Kinda tough to do in late July. My guess is his teammates are not going to throw a party for him.

edo783
07-25-2004, 01:38 PM
Some say Ricky marches to a different drummer, but to quote a writer "He not only marches to a different drummer, he marches to a completly different philarmonic orchestra!". _V_ touched on what I think is the real underlying reason. He has stated that people should not be told what to do (ie. Obey Laws) and so he wants to go and do weed as much as he wants to and watch sunsets or what ever. To much money, to little sense of responsibility and commitment, basically it is a thing that someone who has never grown up and accepts responsibility does.

vtech9
07-25-2004, 02:03 PM
Well, Ricky tested positive back in May for using weed, and would have been fined at the least. By retiring, I think he avoids that fine, but possibly also frees himself to stay out for a year or two and then come back to sign with the team he wants.

scourge
07-25-2004, 02:31 PM
The Dolphins' best approach, though, is to try to talk Williams out of retirement or force his hand financially.

When the Dolphins acquired Williams in a trade from the Saints, they did pick up the contract and the right to sue him if he quits early. The Saints gave him an initial signing bonus of $8.843 million, and even though the Dolphins didn't have to pay the Saints for a portion of the bonus, they do have the ability to sue for him to fulfill the contract.

If successful, the Dolphins would get a $3.3 million repayment for failure to perform. Williams is signed through 2006 and would owe the Dolphins three years.

the article at ESPN.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=1846119)
If I were the 'Fins, I'd be suing him. If he wanted to quit, fine, but this is a business and there are consequences for being a quitter. If he had at least told Wannstedt a few months ago that he was considering it, that wouldve been something. But to be pondering this for so long and then to surprise your head coach and whole team a week before training camp is ridiculous...

Hervoyel
07-25-2004, 02:36 PM
Sounds like someone needs a running back really bad to me. I wonder if the Dolphins would be interested in Tony Hollings for a 1?

Idle curiosity really. I don't want to see Tony go anywhere just yet but I'd be tempted if they came calling in deperation.

Also I wonder if this means Stacy Mack might get another chance to try and prove he's a full time running back. If he's healthy now and still out there then the Dolphins might take a look at him.

edo783
07-25-2004, 02:45 PM
IMO, Mack will probably be getting a call this week. He seems to be about the only back out there that's under thirty that's available.

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 02:47 PM
Well as far as Ricky's responsibility to the team is concerned I think people are overating it. The NFL is a business. Yes I know we hear that cliche all the time, but it doesn't just apply to a team jettisoning a longtime fan favorite cause he hits the wrong side of 30 for salary cap reasons (ie. George, Smith). Ricky's situation isn't unlike what a few 'dot.com'ers were faced with several years ago. They made loads of money in a business they didn't care much for, so they took the money and pursued other interests. It's hard to relate, but if you didn't enjoy the job you had and you had the means to pursue whatever passion you wanted to in your life .... would you? I think many of us would. Ricky had planned to retire after this season anyway, and I'm unaware if he informed the Dolphins. However, Miami had to have known the situation they were getting themselves into. They based their entire team on one unpredictable guy. Ricky has been there for 2 years. It's not like the Dolphins didn't have time to add more playmakers on offense. I don't see how his marijuana use would effect his NFL career. LeBetard has said that Ricky regularly uses it, and has done so for awhile. He past drug tests by drinking a gallon of what I am guessing is a body toxin cleanser or something of that sort. If that really was the underlying reason for his retirement why now if hes been doing it for some time? He's passed previous tests, and I see no reason for him not being able to pass other ones. My last point concerns his teamates. Sure, I'm sure they are dejected and angry at Ricky. However, Ricky wasn't a social guy, and wasn't well liked by his teamates. I believe that Minor was the only teamate he even talked to while working out. If his teamates are angry then they need to direct their anger in a more deserving direction ... Dolphins Management. Considering that they were unable to locate him when he was on a trip in Europe you would think that they'd try and keep a close tab on him by now. However, they still didn't. The star of you're team should deem more attention from management than Ricky did. Especially considering how unpredictable he is. That is, after all, one of the reasons why New Orleans traded him to Miami. It just seems odd that the Dolphins were concerned about having a 'Plan B' if Ricky was to get injured this season, but never actually took the steps to pursue depth to ensure it's effectiveness. They got Sammy Morris. Someone they saw when he was with the Bills last year, and he was anything but effective. It's a very odd situation, granted, but blame can't be placed solely on Ricky. There is plenty of it to go around.

Hervoyel
07-25-2004, 02:52 PM
True, it would be a risk. Davis hasn't played a complete season without injury in what? Forever? I'd still be tempted though.

If it works out then great and Davis comes through plus I have another 1 to work with next season.

If it doesn't work out then that's a shame but hey, it's still 2004 and I've got an extra 1 to work with next season. Come 2005 I'm back to drafting myself another young back to take the job away from Domanick.

There aren't any "knowns" here. Nobody knows if Hollings will (or won't) work out. Nobody knows if Davis is going to be hell on wheels next year or a one hit wonder. Taking their 1 for Hollings would be one of those deals where in three years you find out if you were a fool to do it or brilliant. Knowing what little I do from my fan perspective I'd think about it and maybe go for it.

Hervoyel
07-25-2004, 02:56 PM
True. It was hypothetical to begin with.

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 03:01 PM
If the Dolphins do try and make a trade for another RB they will be in a very difficult situation. Given their handling of the Feely deal with Philadelphia I wouldn't put it past them to make yet another horrible deal in a desperate attempt to put a respectable team on the field this season. I doubt they'd try to get Hollings, but they might go after another solid #2 back in the NFL. They're at an extreme disadvantage since the entire NFL knows of what a desperate situation they're in, and they can use it to get more than they should in return.

Hervoyel
07-25-2004, 03:03 PM
Also, you guys totally overvalue Davis imo.

Oh and I do not overvalue Davis. I agree he's generally "overvalued" around here and that I've got high hopes but at heart I'm pretty realistic about him. It was a thousand yard season. Nice to see and after Allen/Wells it looked like the second coming of Jim Brown to us but a lot of guys who never made a lick of difference have generated a grand in a season since it went to 16 games.

If Davis improves upon it by averaging more yards per game, not just more yards overall because he plays in more games and making a real difference in the final outcome then I'll be getting real high on him. At present though he's accomplished nothing that James Allen didn't do with the Bears.

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 03:10 PM
Just a thought. What about William Green from the Browns? They do have Lee Suggs in the backfield too afterall. It could be the answer for the Dolphins this season. I heard someone mention on ESPNews that James might want to relocated back to Miami after this season with the Colts. Just something to think about. :hmmm:

Fiddy
07-25-2004, 03:12 PM
Just a thought. What about William Green from the Browns? It could be the answer for this season. I heard someone mention on ESPNews that James might want to relocated back to Miami after this season with the Colts. Just something to think about. :hmmm:I could see Green going there but the Browns would have to settle for a 2nd because there is no way the Dolphins give up a 1st for him.

And the Colts have to choose after this season if they want James or Harrision??? I'd take Harrision, so James might be the odd man out....

scourge
07-25-2004, 03:55 PM
Ogunleye could be trade bait... (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=1846178)

His agent doesnt really seem to think so, though

keyfro
07-25-2004, 04:15 PM
ogenleye is trade bait has been this entire offseason...the dolphins just didn't need anything til now...i could see a ogenleye for thomas trade coming very soon...along with the team signing mack...let's face it...go into training camp with thomas, mack, minor, and morris then cut the odd man out...it's not ricky williams but you get the job done like they did up in phili this past year

having thomas be your starter...mack in short yards...and minor for change of pace

mes311
07-25-2004, 05:01 PM
http://www.run-ricky-run.com

His personal website.

LonghornBabe
07-25-2004, 06:15 PM
Ok...I am a Longhorn so my view on this is probably different than a lot of y'alls! :)

I love Ricky...he is a great RB and a great person. I have had the opportunity to get to know him over the last few years. He does a lot for the University as well as many charities.

Yes, Ricky has some personal problems.....don't we all!?!

I will be honest here...I have smoked pot before...so what?!?!

I wish him nothing but the best!! If you want to retire Ricky...you are entitled. It is your life and noone elses!!! God Bless and Good Luck!!

texasguy346
07-25-2004, 07:02 PM
I guess everyone has had their fill of Ricky Williams, but I found this article on ESPN that I found interesting. Perhaps you will too.

ESPN Ricky's Gone--Not Exactly Breaking News (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?id=1846167)

HardCoreTxn
07-25-2004, 07:57 PM
I think he'll be back, he's prolly pulling a Clemens and wants to come home to Texas. :hmmm:

Fiddy
07-25-2004, 10:38 PM
Who has the better record this year, us or the Dolphins???
I still say the Dolphins because of there defense but they dont have a good RB and that will allow defenses to pay more attention to Chambers and Boston. But they are playing in a division with the defending champs, a good Bills team, and a Jets team with there best QB back. But you can say that we too play in a tough division. It will be intresting to see...

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
07-25-2004, 10:46 PM
maybe they can trade Ogunleye to the Vikings for Onterrio Smith.

MikeMc
07-25-2004, 10:48 PM
Well first off, it is not Ricky's fault for the Dolphins' Brass not planning ahead. I mean Dave Wann could have figured this one out, "We give RW the ball 30-40 times a game, and all we have to fill in if he goes down is a proto-typical 3rd down back.... if something happens to Ricky, we should be ready".

So what do the Dolphins do??

Miami
Rd Sel# Player Pos. Ht. Wt. School
1 19 Carey, Vernon G 6-4 363 Miami (Fla.)
4 102 Poole, Will CB 5-10 193 Southern California
5 160 Bua, Tony SS 5-11 218 Arkansas
6 174 Hadnot, Rex C 6-2 323 Houston
7 221 Pape, Tony G 6-6 323 Michigan
7 222 Pope, Derrick ILB 6-1 226 Alabama

--makes sense, right?

Secondly, I do not feel he had to give anyone a heads up on his decision. Do you honestly think teams give players a notice to being fired? They just cut them, of course the info is usually leaked to the media three days prior so I guess they do know it is coming.

Third, if Ricky wants to chill out in Jamaica and smoke herbs, it is his business. He made his money and now he can do what he wants.

Fourth, yes the Saints gave up the 99 draft, but they did get a 1st in 2002 & 3rd in 2003 of Ricky's trade to Miami....at a more crucial time in their development towards a playoff team.

---- 2002 #25 pick - Charles Grant (DE) UGA
-----2003 #86 pick - Cie Grant (MLB) Ohio ST

What would you rather Ricky do, go out while he is at the top of his game, or do the Emmitt thing??

Which one looks more ridiculous?

People gave Robert Smith crap for retiring "early", these guys are doing the smart thing...retiring while they can still have a promising future --the ability to walk without pain or being hopped up on pain killers!

I think Ricky is a man that knows how to make responsible decisions (less the wedding dress thing). He is being the one thing that most people will never be...himself! He does not choose to run with the crowds nor does he choose to conform.

Say what you will, but you must commend him for his individuality and uniqueness......you should not condemn him for his decision to retire.

disaacks3
07-26-2004, 04:04 AM
Well first off, it is not Ricky's fault for the Dolphins' Brass not planning ahead.
I guess the Dolphins should've consulted Miss Cleo? :confused:

If you factor in Ricky's somewhat, shall we say "temperamental" attitude, it makes a little more sense NOT to spend your 1st / 2nd rounder on an RB. What if Ricky gets upset and thinks you're actively trying to replace him? So, you don't pick up an RB till the later rounds and end up with no better choices than you've got right now..(if you're Fins mgmt.)

Ricky brought this anger & resentment down on himself, no one "forced" him to make this decision THIS LATE! He has the right to do so, and the fans have the right to be p.o.'d about it.

Personally, I think it can only help the Texans....one less quality running back to face in the AFC!

WWJD
07-26-2004, 08:34 AM
It's his life and I commend him for doing what he feels is right for himself. It's too bad it has to be bad news for so many people on his team but they'll move on, find somebody else and the sun will still come up tomorrow.

LonghornBabe
07-26-2004, 09:14 AM
Oh my gosh...please say it isn't so...I actually AGREE with something that MikeMc thinks.......

I NEVER thought I would see this day! idonno:

Jonathan
07-26-2004, 09:23 AM
Just wondering; if David Carr were to retire tomorrow because his heart was no longer in it would some of these responses be the same? I personally don't care if Ricky plays or not, but i do question the timing.

As it was said earlier thats one less AFC running back we have to worry about.

Beastlyman2003
07-26-2004, 09:33 AM
You wanna know what the worse thing is? It isnt the fact that he left right before the season began, it isnt the fact that he left the Dolphins with little time to aquire a replacement. But the worse thing is that basically, the retired so he could, and i quote, " Smoke a joint whenever I want." He retired for WEED!

Txn_in_FL
07-26-2004, 09:46 AM
Obviously this is a pisser for any Dolphin fans out there. Yes, you can get into how many years he has left and what a WASTE it is to throw away such talent, but really is it such a waste? He's done what he wanted and what he was interested in and is now moving on.

I think we, the people who don't play sports professionally look at it in a sort of romamticized light. "WOW, wouldn't it great to play a game for a living?!?!".
Just like anything else as a job it has to get monotonous at times, the money is great but I don't know how great it would be to get run over by 250-300 pound monsters every Sunday.

I say better to get out while you are ahead rather than stick around and become some broken down has been.

TheOgre
07-26-2004, 10:13 AM
espn's website says they wonder if it's like robert smith and drugs being the reason...it doesn't seem like ricky to be into drugs but who knows

I don't remember drugs being the reason Smith retired. The guy wasn't a football player, he was "a guy who plays football". He is one of the smartest guys to ever play in the NFL. He is a science geek. He is always saying that our society puts too much emphasis on sports. He doesn't like the idea of athletes being role models. I actually agree with him.

chicagotexan
07-26-2004, 11:15 AM
Why the sudden urge to travel to Asia?... voices in his head calling? :hmmm:
I also think he is one strange cat.
What bad timing. Dave Wannstedt will be pulling all of his hair out now!


This is obvious. He has decided to become an insurgent in Iraq. What the !!??

MikeMc
07-26-2004, 02:53 PM
What's with all the arguing over Ricky retiring? Isn't Florida a "Right-to-work" State? How many of you have quit your job without letting someone know (2 week notice), or better yet, how many of you were still working at a job while you were actively trying to find a new one?

Why is it that so many "fans" have a double standard towards athletes? I mean, you want them to be treated like the "common person" when they get into trouble, but they must be put on some different level while in their "pro-life" because we all enjoy their contributions. Be consistent with what you want!

texasguy346
07-26-2004, 03:53 PM
I believe Robert Smith quit to go to medical school. I was never under the impression it had anything to do with drugs.

StarStruck
07-26-2004, 04:06 PM
Well y'all, after seeing Earl Campbell's attempt to walk out on stage during the Super Bowl's opening ceremony, I have no comment about anyone in the same profession deciding when it's time to retire.

StarStruck
07-26-2004, 04:23 PM
Heck, Eddie George was on the table last week. Now the Dolphins missed out on all the reasonably decent options to replace him.

I pause for a moment of silence.

Blake
07-26-2004, 04:25 PM
good thing I used the #9 pick on him this past week in my NFL.com fantasy football. I was on vacation over the weekend, and someone else got minor in FA before I could get a chance. Well, 15 bucks down the drain.

Blake
07-26-2004, 04:48 PM
I dont think a week before training camp is too early.

MikeMc
07-27-2004, 01:26 AM
Well V, I guess not every team shows the forthcoming as the Texans do when it comes to player replacement.

e.g., if Stacy Mack does not pan out, Texans draft Dominick Davis in the Draft..... Stacy Mack indeed does not pan out, and Davis replaces Mack in a very outstanding way.

----- Tony Banks is signed in the event Carr goes down. I believe Banks went 2-1 last year (3-1 if you count him coming off the bench to beat Buffalo) with his only loss coming against the Super Bowl winning Patriots in an OT nail biter!

So now you say that it is Ricky's fault for the Dolphins brass being unprepared? Please....as I said earlier, Dave Wannstedt should know that he needs a very capable back to replace Ricky in the event that those 400 carries per season catch up to him.

It's not Ricky's fault that so many DUMB owners, GMs & HCs put so much faith in him. What happened to the old adage "No one player can win games...it takes the whole team working together"? Seems like the Patriots have this "team concept" figured out!

MikeMc
07-27-2004, 02:14 AM
No not really, it is you and others like you that keep saying "he let his team down because of the timing of his retirement". No, maybe his HC, GM or Owner let the team down because they were not prepared for the day that Ricky was gone.

And yes, to many Dolphins' fans and those that know. Miami was basically the Defense and Ricky! You don't give an Offensive player the ball 400-500 times a year without some indication that he is "the man" on the Offense.

Look who they have...Sammy Morris, Rob Konrad and Travis Minor. You mean to tell me that there was not a "capable back" in the 4th round or beyond?

RBs taken in the Draft that Miami could have had (4th rd to 7th round....that were drafted):

4th #119 - Mewelde Moore (MIN)
4th #128 - Cedric Cobbs (NE)
5th #154 - Michael Turner (SD)
6th #191 - Troy Fleming (TEN)
7th #208 - Adimch Echemandu (CLE)
7th #219 - Quincy Wilson (ATL)
7th #235 - Derrick Ward (NYJ)
7th #242 - Bruce Perry (PHI)
7th #247 - Brandon Miree (DEN)

Notice that almost all of those players are on teams that are in a similar RB situation as MIA.... they rely heavily on the RB for their offensive success. See SD especially! Power Running game with one back responsible for the bulk of the offensive production, young RB at that. SD knew what to do, but MIA did not?

I guess David Boston & AJ Feeley will bring the Dolphins full circle to the Marino days! What does Wannstedt know about passing the ball....he is a D & running game coach. I guess he will be out soon.

disaacks3
07-27-2004, 02:28 AM
I don't understand the "expecting them to be psychic" model of analysis either! Especially when you consider tidbits like these.... :crazy:

From Pat Kirwan's article on NFL.com

What's even more strange is that a few weeks ago, Wannstedt held a team meeting for veterans, and Williams was one of the guys who stood up and spoke passionately about how they all needed to dig deep to get to the next level.

Read the whole article here.. (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/7524645)

ArlingtonTexan
07-27-2004, 09:04 AM
Just another reason not to draft early in serious leagues.

Since I play in a few leagues, I tend to try to have my drafts spread out and find that the early leagues have more trading and interaction that lasts throughtout the season as people react to the injuries and position battles.

Of course, my earliest league drafted like July 31 last year and included

Vick, Bledsoe, Carr, Faulk, Moulds and William Green which looked really good at draft time a turned out to be my only disaster of a team. :hmmm:

pv1999
07-27-2004, 03:18 PM
I don't understand the "expecting them to be psychic" model of analysis either! Especially when you consider tidbits like these.... :crazy:

From Pat Kirwan's article on NFL.com

What's even more strange is that a few weeks ago, Wannstedt held a team meeting for veterans, and Williams was one of the guys who stood up and spoke passionately about how they all needed to dig deep to get to the next level.

Read the whole article here.. (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/7524645)

Whats not to understand, Ricky Williams would rather smoke the sticky icky than play professional football for the Dolphins. There are no guaranteed contracts, he could get lit up tommorrow trying to carry this "team" they put together and have more in common with Earl than he already has and they don't have to give him squat. They clearly are not concerned with his health or they would have developed a passing game over the off-season to help out. Why should he care?

dmt217
07-27-2004, 03:37 PM
His timing...Classless? Yes, if I was the GM.
As a player/teamate? Nope

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=ratto_ray&id=1846713

Q: Is there a social conscience component to a good resignation?


RW: Absolutely. If you can arrange it so that a guy in your department that you like gets your job, you've done a good deed. I did that with my last job, and I felt almost as good about it as he did.

Porky
07-27-2004, 03:46 PM
The notion that the Dolphins were supposed to be mind readers and have another elite back just waiting in the wings is downright silly. Players of or near Williams's calibur don't grow on trees. There are only a handful of elite RB's in this world, and he happened to be one. If Ricky cares more about smoking the ganja than smoking lb's in the flat, that's his business. But to do that one week before camp opens, leaving the Fins no real alternative is classless. That somehow the Dolphins should have been prepared for this makes me lol:

MikeMc
07-27-2004, 04:12 PM
You guys can keep spouting off your double standard treatment of athletes (professional that is).

Why no comment towards my Banks filling in for Carr?

I doubt anyone thinks Tony Banks is an elite NFL QB that was able to fill in for David Carr (and perfrom very well).

I'm not saying the Fins needed a Deuce McAllister waiting in RWs place, but someone they felt could fill in adequately if something happened to Ricky, be it major career threatening injury or leaving the team, or whatever...you fill in the blank.

I have not said anything to the effect of the Dolphins needed to be psychic....I did say they needed to be well prepared in the case of anything happening. They seem to have addressed the QB situation nicely over the past few years. Did they just feel that confident that nothing would ever happen to Ricky? So much so that they failed to find an ADEQUATE replacement in the slight chance that he go down?

Keep saying what he did was classless......this is business, not a game. He can do whatever he wants to, just as the management can. Hell we are talking about a sport where noone (owners or players) honor their contracts. How is this any different? Because it is a week before camp? Hell, at least he gave them a week to figure out what to do.

Get off his back. I don't believe there was this much "outcry" in disgust of a player's actions when the T.O. "trade" dibacle happened!

Porky
07-27-2004, 05:01 PM
Get off his back? LOL. The guy signed a contract. He came to all of the offseason programs. He gave every indication he planned on being there, until it was too late for the Fins to make a legit recovery, and we should "get off his back". You have to be kidding me. You need to get in the real world. If you have a team, any team, the team usually relies on its best "players" ie, empoyee's. If that employee signed a 4 yr contract, would you expect the company to then recruit, at great expense, someone to wait in the wings to replace the best employee on the team, just in case the bus runs him over on the way to work, or he decides he would rather go smoke wacky weed all over the world? Get real.

Lucky
07-27-2004, 05:19 PM
I don't know if this has been brought up, but there has been a rumor floating around that Ricky told his buddy Travis Minor about retiring much earlier than he did the team. It's said that Ricky waited to inform the Fins until the top RB's, like Eddie George, were off the market so Minor would have the best opportunity to win the starting RB gig. Only those guys know if it's true or not, be it would help explain why Ricky waited so late in the summer to call it quits.

Porky
07-27-2004, 05:23 PM
I don't know if this has been brought up, but there has been a rumor floating around that Ricky told his buddy Travis Minor about retiring much earlier than he did the team. It's said that Ricky waited until the top RB's, like Eddie George, were off the market so Minor would have the best opportunity to win the starting RB gig. Only those guys know if it's true or not, be it would help explain why Ricky waited so late in the summer to call it quits.

If true, that would make me even more furious were I a Dolphins front office type, player, or fan. Ricky Williams doesn't get to make personell decisions. That is up to the FO and coaching staff. You don't delay an important decision just to put your buddy in the best posostion just because he is your buddy. If Minor is good enough to deserve the starting nod, then he should have to earn it. I have lost a lot of respect for Captain Ganja.

kbourda
07-27-2004, 06:19 PM
Did anyone get in an uproar about the Cowgirls unloading Chad Hutchinson this week? Don't think so. Like McMike said it's a two way street. The best way to handle this is let him go on about his merry way. No one player is bigger than the game itself.

JustBonee
07-27-2004, 07:34 PM
Another thought on Williams quick exit ...
Just think of all the little kids who begged their parents to buy them a $150 Ricky Williams jersey. How would you like to explain to them about their hero?
A lot of things come in to play in this situation, not just someone quitting their job because they want to go off into the sunset and smoke pot.

kbourda
07-27-2004, 09:42 PM
I see your point V, he's a nobody so it doesn't matter.

infantrycak
07-27-2004, 09:59 PM
Well they are not the same level player and this is not IBM (using a simple workplace analogy ie: its easy to replace you). This is a game of skill. Williams quitting this week would be like David Carr quitting this week. The Chad is a different level player and is not being counted on by his team and his fans like Carr or Williams is.

I tend to think classless goes beyond the quality of person(s) involved. The Cowboys have known for a long time they would let Hutchinson go--the timing definitely affects his ability to catch on with another team. I don't see why they couldn't have been classier about giving him that courtesy just as Williams could have and should have given his team as much notice as possible. Did they have to--no, but neither did Williams have to. Would it have been classier if Williams had let the Dolphins know earlier--sure, and so would it have been if the Cowboys had released Hutchinson two months ago.

kbourda
07-27-2004, 10:10 PM
I believe the fans pay the owner and he in turn pays the player. Last time I checked players didn't own NFL franchises. I think we need to have a 9 plus page post every time an owner decides to cut a player under contract whom is on the wrong side of 30. As a matter of fact, I think I will be that burden bearer. I think owners should think of the fans when their favorite players are being cut because they don't want to pay them.

Porky
07-27-2004, 11:02 PM
I don't either V. I just see a vast difference. While I agree the Pokes could have/should have cut Hutch earlier, it's a huge difference in how it affects the team. In addition, NFL contracts are not guranteed, but that's what signing bonuses are for. Hutch got a signing bonus of some sort to sign I'm sure. In one situation, you have a journeyman QB trying like heck to beat out 3 others, and can't do it. In the other, you have a marquee player that potentially has a huge impact on the Fins season, who walks out on his contract a week before camp opens. I just don't see the anology. Using that logic, every time a team cuts someone, we're suppsed to throw a big pity party, and raise money to make sure his kids can squeeze into college. Bologna. Let em eat cake :popcorn:

infantrycak
07-27-2004, 11:18 PM
While I agree the Pokes could have/should have cut Hutch earlier, it's a huge difference in how it affects the team...Using that logic, every time a team cuts someone, we're suppsed to throw a big pity party, and raise money to make sure his kids can squeeze into college. Bologna. Let em eat cake

Who is talking about how it affects the team? Does Williams leaving affect the team more or less than Hutchinson leaving regardless of whether it was one hour notice or 5 months?--sure it does. The discusssion was what was classy. If that is the standard then why is a team held to a less classy standard than a player?

P.S. I really don't care but either both decisions were ok or both were classless--just don't see the "vast difference"--so Hutchinson sucked, we get to treat him like dirt--nope, not buying it.

MikeMc
07-28-2004, 12:03 AM
No "V", sometimes owners pay players too much and can't afford to keep them (i.e. honor the players' contract) so the owners have to cut that player.

No one cares to stop and think about how that player's family must now deal with moving or other changes involved. I mean, if you signed a 5 year $5 million per contract (in good faith) and the owner decides to cut you at the end of your 3rd year......you might be a little ticked that your "contract" has been voided and you and yours will lose that $10 million! Maybe you were at the top of your game and still able to produce (Eddie George, Marcus Allen, etc.) but because the owner went over his invisible budget, you and yours must now figure out what to do!

Granted the decisions might be easier if you dealt with that $15 million from the previous 3 years in an intelligent way. That's beside the point.

If the fans actually paid the players' salaries, why don't we have more of a say in what happens with the team? Like we were the stock holders and we had annual stockholders' meetings. We would discuss things like player movement, draft selection, FA acquisitions, coaching changes, etc.

Also, the NFL is "like" a business. Mostly from the aspect of money exchanging hands. The rest is a game/crap shoot! To compare it to IBM or any other top business is silly. BTW, a smart business owner is always looking out for the "team", trying to find that better replacement in case the "ace" should falter. A dumb business owner just runs with the "ace", never realizing that he/she might be gone in the near future.

I should understand your points more because of the fact that Houston fans are just like that. "Keep Hakeem until he can no longer walk...he is the Dream after all, he brought us two titles" or "Bagwell & Biggio should remain Astros for life...who cares if they can't produce and they are overpaid!" or "Boselli might make it back....we did sign him for 4 years, we should honor the deal". Typical Houston fans' chatter!

I say cut the bums when they can no longer keep up with the rest. That is why the Astros will lose Carlos Beltran. He is the real future for the Astros to build on, but because they will keep Bags & Bige, the Astros will never make it to the World Series! If Beltran wanted $15 million per, I would find a way to give it to him. Hell, the Astros will lose Bagwell, Biggio & Kent within the next few years...where will Beltran be? Probably with a team in the World Series! Just like all the rest that were passed on because the Astros wanted to keep Bags & Bige!!!

pv1999
07-28-2004, 12:18 AM
The 'Boys knew they were going to cut Chad when they brought in Testaverde. Chad should have looked around and saw 1. They brought in Vinny the knife 2. I'm still not ahead of Carter 3. They got a baseball player to compete at my position.
I've had about 6 jobs in my life and I have been fired about 6 times and I could always tell when I needed to start looking for something else.

Little Ricky Marley just got up one day and said its either the ball or the bong, but I can't do both, it's killing me. I guess he figured the life with the hippie lettuce is greater than life as the tackling dummy for the Patriots miami division practice squad.

Chad knew...but the Cowboys didn't say it, but they showed it and he should have seen it coming all summer.
Ricky was waiting to sober up before making a decision and it took him all summer, What a Party.
Both were untimely but better now than during the season or even worse during a game.

Wolf
07-28-2004, 12:21 AM
I would say chad should have seen the writing on the wall after he didn't do much in NFLE

MikeMc
07-28-2004, 12:58 AM
Hey V, it seems like Gary Walker was still at the top of his game when he was cut...err...let exposed in the Expansion draft. Seth Payne, Aaron Glenn & Marcus Coleman as well. They were cut because they were overpriced or they were just taking up too much cap room on their respective teams. Boselli was the injured/damaged one that deserved to be cut. The RT was the throw in for the taking of Coleman & Glenn. (I forget the RT's name).

BTW, what are all of you doing now that bought the Boselli jersey? How are your kids coping with that?

That little argument was ridiculous...."what do you tell those people that paid their hard earned money to buy their kids a RW Phins jersey"? Well, what about all of those that bought a TO 49'ers jersey, or an Eddie George Titans jersey? Nothing Iguess...just that the NFL is all about money and less about sports (football).


I thought Chad had setbacks in NFLE because of a shoulder injury. That's why the Boys signed Vinny (well that and the fact that Parcells is destined to make the Boys the Dallas "Parcells"!

Why do all of you get on to a guy that wants to do what he has the right to do? Make some change and then live life to its fullest. I guess he just figures he is in a place in his life where he is finacially secure and healthy and that he wants to live life...not dwindle away until he can no longer fly in an airplane because of the pain the pressure changes cause his body!

How is marijuana any different than underage drinking (that I know half of you participated in or allow your kids to participate in)? They are both illegal, but the beer compaines have more of a sayso than the marijuana companies (oh wait, there are none). Also the tobacco companies would like nothing more than to supress canibus from becoming legal!

Politics and money. I never heard of smoking weed being Texas' number one cause of death!

Ricky is not Derrick Russell!

texan279
07-28-2004, 02:56 AM
Interesting article from www.espn.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=1847599)

WWJD
07-28-2004, 12:34 PM
The NFL is a BUSINESS.

People are replaced in a business. That is why Hutchison has/will be released.
The Cowboys don't feel he fits into their BUSINESS. I'm sure Chad is smart enough to know that he stood the chance of being released or "fired" at any time.

So now Chad has the opportunity to move on to another team or find himself a new career. It's the way of the world. Sometimes bad things happen to you and you have to adjust.

Ricky made a decision that he doesn't want to play anymore. He didn't break a law, but to me it was poorly timed and only he can know why he picked this time to do this. But it's his choice.

Comparing Ricky Williams to Chad Hutchison is a little like comparing a Yugo to a Mercedes.

JustBonee
07-28-2004, 01:13 PM
"The NFL is a BUSINESS."

The corporation might try to recoup prepaid wages .. according to this ...

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2004/07/27/sports1920EDT0375.DTL

WWJD
07-28-2004, 01:29 PM
I am fairly sure Barry Sanders was required to repay the Lions millions when he retired.

MikeMc
07-28-2004, 07:53 PM
Yes, but isn't it funny how a team can cut a player (who has 2 years left on their contract) and the team is not obligated to pay that player his full amount (if any).....no guaranteed contracts in the NFL.

Maybe not funny but it sure is hypoctical!

If the owners keep "making" players pay back past earnings (usually because of signing bonuses), will the so-called NFLPA ensure that players will finally get guaranteed contracts?

How is the timing bad for Ricky? He didn't want to answer anymore questions related to the marijuana test, the rigors of training camp was right around the corner, and maybe after going through the team's mini-camp, he finally made up his mind.

Sounds like perfect timing to me! Bad timing would be during the season or during a game. It's not like the Dolphins brass can't get a player in to help. Besides, it sounds to me like the Dolphins are switching to more of a passing team.....with the signning of AJ Feeley and David Boston. At this rate, Travis Minor fits in perfectly....he is a scat back that catches the ball very well. Plug in Stacy Mack for the goalling, and there you have it!

Blake
07-28-2004, 08:02 PM
Ricky Williams vs. Travis Minor and Stacy Mack. You are saying that they can fill the void that he left? I dont think so.

And they didnt sign AJ Feeley and Boston to become an air game. They signed AJ to light a fire under one of their QB's ***. And Boston because he can take the pressure off of Chambers. If they had Ricky this year, they would still run the hell out of him.

WWJD
07-28-2004, 08:14 PM
A few days before training camp isn't bad timing?

Of course it is.

It makes it harder for them to find a good FA back. They could have drafted somebody to step in if he had told them at the BEGINNING of the offseason.

It's bad timing for the team. For Ricky who knows? He has his reasons I suppose. I don't imagine that too many Dolphins fans are real happy with him.
Or for that matter his teammates who I would suspect counted on him having a solid year. Or the coaches that build gameplans around his skills.

Perhaps I'm off base but he could have done this with a little more thought to these things. But yea it's his life; he's the one that's got to do what he thinks is best for him. There is no disagreement there.

But I personally think it's a deep wound to the team in an area where they were pretty solid with him back there.

pv1999
07-28-2004, 10:28 PM
What about the speculation that his homosexuality was about to be exposed?
Has he been hitting more than the bong?

A guy who played with Sticky Icky Ricky at UT say that he wasn't much for hard work and pretty much did enough to get by. I dunno how "just enough to get by" wins a heisman but he said most of the skills and strength that #34 has was natural ability and not hard work. I kinda belive him because I don't think he ever showed a tremendous amount of heart on the field.

Genuine
07-28-2004, 11:49 PM
What about the speculation that his homosexuality was about to be exposed?
Has he been hitting more than the bong?

A guy who played with Sticky Icky Ricky at UT say that he wasn't much for hard work and pretty much did enough to get by. I dunno how "just enough to get by" wins a heisman but he said most of the skills and strength that #34 has was natural ability and not hard work. I kinda belive him because I don't think he ever showed a tremendous amount of heart on the field.
I remember after Ricky was traded to Miami, he was signing stuff at this card show in Houston, when he was through I saw him getting up and I noticed he had on these huge ankle weights, and the season had just ended. What kind of slacker that just gets by on his natural abilitys would be doing that?
I don't know, I just never got the feeling he wasn't a hard worker.

MikeMc
07-29-2004, 01:26 AM
V, just how does it say that if a player is cut from a team, it is not the responsibility of the team to pay his remaining contrct, but it is the responsibility of the player to his team IF he decisdes to leave early (e.g. RW retiring). Granted the idea of a contract (in theory) is to honor that contract, which clearly stipulates guidelines and agreed upon conditions. Of course, I doubt any of us know the details of RW's contract, in terms of voideable years, paybacks, etc.

Obviously if a player is signed to a 4 year contract, he has made the team, and the team is therefore obligated to honor the terms & conditions of the contract. Otherwise teams and players would not agree to contracts based on the fact that they are not credible, consaidering that neither party really gives a flip about them.....but I am only commenting based on the fact that the contracts are binding agreements, meant to be honored.

WWJD, so how would a FA back or drafted rookie replace RW? In theory no RB could replace him despote of "timing". Therefore, with that logic, even if RW had told the Dolphins back in March, do you really think Eddie George, Antwoin Smith, Charlie Garner, Duce Staley, or Corey Dillion or any of the rookie RBs could have filled RW's place on the Fins? Do you think any of those guys could have carried the ball 40 times a game (or 400 times a year) not to mention carrying the hopes of the whole team or city on their backs? HELL NO!

So obviously, timing is not the true issue, it is simply the fact that RW has retired and no one will ever replace him.....sort of like Barry Sanders in Detroit. Somehow, by some miracle, Minnesota has been able to get by just fine without Robert Smith.......funny how they now have 3 quality RBs capable of being the main guy.

If David Carr decides to retire next March for whatever reason, religion, family, Momentom BMW commercials, etc.; will any of you be easier on him than RW? Or will you all react to the fact that the Texans are now left scrambling to fill the void that he will create, possibly setting the team back 3 or 4 years?

WWJD
07-29-2004, 01:34 AM
I didn't say anybody would replace him that would be of the same caliber of Ricky but certainly the team would have benefitted with more notice.

They could have maybe signed the guy from Cincy; the guy from Philly....the timing was horrid for the team.

Now I read that he has attended all meetings required of him this off-season and in fact gave a pep talk not so long ago to some teammates at a meeting about team improvement and so forth.

I don't get the timing of it...I'd be really teed off if I were a Dolphin fan or a member of that team or coaching staff.

But it's his life; he has to live with his decisions and he's the only one that can make them.

MikeMc
07-29-2004, 01:42 AM
Please, I doubt any of his teammates really care about him leaving. If anything else, they are glad.

Think the WRs are unhappy? No, they wiull now get a chance to get the ball.

Only ones upset are the Defense (will no longer get the long rests between possessions) and the QBs (they will now be required to do some quarterbacking, a monkey can hand the ball off 40 times a game).

Nowadays, players are only concerned about themselves and getting "theirs". See TO or any other recent Free Agent. Do you think any of them have any thought of team loyalty?

Well, the Patriots do, but what do you expect from a group of Has-beens and last chance players? They have nothing else to look forward to except that last chance to do something!

WWJD
07-29-2004, 01:57 AM
Mike.. If you want to think the Dolphin players are glad that their best offensive weapon is gone I cannot convince you otherwise.

It would be equal to Emmitt Smith quitting the Cowboys at the height of his career.

It would be equal to Dom Davis walking away from the Texans tomorrow.

It's not hard to understand. He has a right to do what he did. Nobody disputes that. But the fact that he has made it very tough on his teammates is irrefutable. Sure they'll find another RB. I don't even know who they have on their roster.

But I think..in my opinion...it has got to be upsetting to the team because he is a top notch player. And you don't just replace those guys on the spur of the moment.

Adios.

MikeMc
07-29-2004, 02:23 AM
Trust me, those guys are so numb to player movement, that it is no different than a player leaving via Free Agency. Both reasons (RW's & FA) are more of personal reasons. It's just that too many cannot understand leaving that does not involve getting paid. Maybe that is the biggest problem here. If he had gone to another team, it would just be "a part of the business".

Players nowadays do not put all of their hopes on a certain player because it is seen as a business, not a team sport. Players understand that any year, at any moment, a teammate will be gone.

Why can't any of you understand that it is more of a blow ti the fans, not the team like many of you keep stating. As if he dissappointed the team, no just the fans...the ones most of you identify with.

Fiddy
07-29-2004, 10:49 AM
Report: Ricky Failed 3rd drug test :crazy:

http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/7535147

He didnt quit because he failed the tests, he failed the tests because he was ready to quit...

Blake
07-29-2004, 11:42 AM
Trust me, those guys are so numb to player movement, that it is no different than a player leaving via Free Agency.

McKinney Responds to Ricky...
Posted on: 2004-07-28
http://www.finheaven.com/newsimages/seth_mckinney.jpg

[Sun-Sentinel] After being told of lineman Seth McKinney's comments to ESPN Radio, Ricky Williams answered, "I owe Seth an explanation? That guy owes me. I almost got my head taken off last year because of him."

To this, McKinney replied:

"What Ricky seems to misunderstand is that in a team setting, people are accountable to each other," McKinney wrote Tuesday, by e-mail. "He said he doesn't owe me anything. That would be true if we had no association with each other. However, we are on a TEAM. That's the association we have -- teammates. He owes me AND I owe him -- that's the reality of it. I owe him to block to the best of my ability. I owe him because he makes an offensive line look better than it really is. He owes me to run to the best of his ability, and that is all he owes me as a TEAMMATE. I expect nothing more than that, however I expect nothing less. I may have let someone 'take his head off.' However, I NEVER quit on him."



I guess some do care Mike.

nunusguy
07-29-2004, 01:32 PM
Drugs play a role in Ricky's decision ? Check out this late SI story.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/football/nfl/07/29/bc.fbn.dolphins.williams.ap/index.html

SESupergenius
07-29-2004, 02:14 PM
""I didn't quit football because I failed a drug test," Williams said. "I failed a drug test because I was ready to quit football."

-Thanks man, I'll be sure to try and explain this to my kid. Bad enough we have to fight drugs in school, now we have to explain why a talented RB can just quit his job and and can focus on smoking all day. Great.

Big difference in him wanting (deserving) more money through Free Agency and quitting. 5 years and still very healty and he quits. He still has boat loads of money so the guaranteed money is what players focus on more. The contract is just present value guage, players and owners adjust it all the time. Players can holdout and put a stanglehold on team just as well as a GM can cut him for last of performance, it's an equal balance. But the players still get guaranteed money if they are let go, while there is no guarantee that he will perform even to his present value contract. Take the new contract by E. Manning for instance. $20 mil guaranteed and he could be a total flop. The owner runs the risk of a player not performing and a player runs the risk of getting cut for that, but still gets the guaranteed money. Seems fairly equal to me.

Porky
07-29-2004, 03:34 PM
More from Ricky "Cheech" Williams. This guy makes the movie Up in smoke, seem like a classic Shakespeare play. This article is similar to the one just posted, but a bit more indepth...

The Hippie Lettuce made me quit! (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=1848492)

Among other revelations...

In emphasizing that his lifestyle choices, rather than the failed tests, had driven his decision to retire from football, Williams told the Herald that he sees nothing wrong with smoking marijuana -- that in fact, it's "just a plant." He also said he admired reggae singer Bob Marley, who was reputed to smoke it every day before his death.

Also, Williams, who has been diagnosed with a social-anxiety disorder and was taking the anti-depressant Paxil, told the paper that he'd stopped taking the medication he'd once been a spokesman for. He said it interfered with his diet.

''Marijuana is 10 times better for me than Paxil,'' he said.

TheOgre
07-29-2004, 03:34 PM
The management side move that is even in the same ballpark as what Ricky pulled was the Lawyer Milloy waiver move last year. The Patriots wave the guy just a few days before the opener. If they felt that they needed to cut his salary they should have done it a LONG time before that.

WWJD
07-29-2004, 04:03 PM
Didn't Bob Marley die from a brain tumor?

JustBonee
07-29-2004, 05:06 PM
"Didn't Bob Marley die from a brain tumor?"

From Yahoo.com:
More than you wanted to know ...

The charismatic, beloved Jamaican singer who introduced reggae infused with Rastafarian themes died from a cancerous brain tumor on May 11, 1981, in Miami, Florida. He was only 36 years old.

Born on February 6, 1945, to an English father and a Jamaican mother, Robert Nesta Marley grew up in Trenchtown, an impoverished yet comfortable community near Kingston. Along with Peter Tosh, Bunny Livingston, and a few others, Marley went on to form the Wailers in 1964. By the '70s, the group was an international success.

The first indication that something was amiss with Marley's health came in May of 1977. While on tour in France, Marley re-injured a right toe during a soccer game. The injury refused to heal and instead quickly worsened -- the entire nail came off and doctors recommended amputation. Citing religious beliefs, a limping Marley refused the surgery and gamely continued on tour. Later that summer, Marley finally allowed an orthopedic surgeon to perform a skin graft on the toe, and the procedure was deemed "a success."

In September of 1980, a weakened Marley almost fainted onstage while performing in New York. The next day, he collapsed while jogging in Central Park. Marley was diagnosed with a brain tumor (a result of the untreated cancer in his toe) and given less than a month to live. Despite the grim news, Marley played one final show in Pittsburgh before being flown to Miami. There doctors verified that the singer had cancer in the brain, lung, and stomach. Eight months later, Marley passed away.

Marley's death was the cause for much rumor and speculation. Some credited his survival for so long despite the widespread cancer to his marijuana use, while others have attributed his death to nefarious causes.

kbourda
07-29-2004, 05:19 PM
For the last time, Ricky Williams owes noone an explanation as to why he quit football. It's his loss plain and simple. Deal with it.

WWJD
07-29-2004, 05:26 PM
Thanks for the info Sassy! Interesting.

Blake
07-29-2004, 05:44 PM
For the last time, Ricky Williams owes noone an explanation as to why he quit football. It's his loss plain and simple. Deal with it.

he does owe the dolphins some clams though.

pv1999
07-29-2004, 09:48 PM
I remember after Ricky was traded to Miami, he was signing stuff at this card show in Houston, when he was through I saw him getting up and I noticed he had on these huge ankle weights, and the season had just ended. What kind of slacker that just gets by on his natural abilitys would be doing that?
I don't know, I just never got the feeling he wasn't a hard worker.

Those were not ankle weights...
That was his stash and he was too paranoid to let his little "just a plant" garden out of his sight.

texan279
07-30-2004, 05:36 PM
NFL | Marijuana Played Large Role in R. Williams' Retirement - from www.KFFL.com
Fri, 30 Jul 2004 11:10:51 -0700

Dan Le Batard and Jason Cole, of the Miami Herald, reports retired RB Ricky Williams admitted Thursday, July 29, that marijuana was more of a factor in his retirement than he originally indicated. Williams added that he learned of a third failed test for marijuana and upcoming suspension just days before informing Miami Dolphins head coach Dave Wannstedt of his decision to quit football.

SESupergenius
07-30-2004, 06:10 PM
http://www.extremeskins.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=banghaha&file=index

pv1999
07-30-2004, 11:53 PM
It is good that he chose to quit rather than "disgrace" himself with another weed case. He could tarnish the heisman (OJ) or blemish the image of UT (Benson) What would Earl and Doak (RIP) think of their second coming now?

I guess somebody needed to replace Barkley as the biggest sports jerk.

JustBonee
07-31-2004, 09:08 AM
That Bang cartoon is one of their best.

Fiddy
08-04-2004, 06:01 PM
Said he would love to play for the Raiders in 05. :crazy:
The Dolphins will still own his rights so it will never happen....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/writers/michael_silver/08/04/silver.openmike/index.html

Ihategeeks
08-04-2004, 06:42 PM
:hehe: no crow for me

infantrycak
08-04-2004, 09:09 PM
Said he would love to play for the Raiders in 05. :crazy:
The Dolphins will still own his rights so it will never happen....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/writers/michael_silver/08/04/silver.openmike/index.html

If the Dolphins sue Ricky to receive part of the signing bonus back, it could be an opening for exactly this. Dolphins sue--Ricky agrees to pay back half of what is sought in exchange for a release of his contract. 2005, hello Raiders.

texasguy346
08-08-2004, 05:14 PM
If the Dolphins sue Ricky to receive part of the signing bonus back, it could be an opening for exactly this. Dolphins sue--Ricky agrees to pay back half of what is sought in exchange for a release of his contract. 2005, hello Raiders.

Pending a 4 game suspension for violating the substance abuse policy. However, it looks as though the Dolphins will sue Ricky.

Sunday, August 8, 2004

ESPN.com news services

Dolphins May Try And Recoup Money From Williams

The Dolphins want payback from Ricky Williams. Literally. An angry Wayne Huizenga will try to recoup more than $5 million paid in incentive money to the retired Williams over the last two years, a source close to the Dolphins owner told the Miami Herald on Saturday.

''Wayne is incredibly [angry] about what Ricky did,'' the source told the newspaper. "He has his lawyers together, and he's going after all the money the team paid Ricky. He wants to make sure this never happens again."

Huizenga could not be reached for comment by the newspaper.

Last month, Williams suddenly retired after five seasons in the NFL, stunning the Dolphins and the league. The Dolphins now have to try to figure out how to replace Williams' 1,372 rushing yards of last season. To make matters worse, the Dolphins lost receiver David Boston earlier this month with a knee injury.

Under the conditions of the revised contract Williams signed before the 2002 season, the Dolphins can seek reimbursement of any incentives he earned if he retired early or held out.

Williams earned approximately $5.3 million in incentives from the Dolphins during the past two years.

Before he filed retirement paperwork with the NFL, Williams talked about filing for bankruptcy and letting the team come after the money in court. He said coming after a man with three children might be embarrassing to the team.
Ricky (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=1854937)

SheTexan
08-08-2004, 05:38 PM
And this guy has devoted followers! What a scumbag!!