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powda
10-09-2005, 05:49 PM
I think we can look back to last December with sharpers' ominous words to know something tragic was about to happen---"who will show us the way?" (Paraphrasing---but you get the drift) and then an odd off-season---sharper and Glenn both decide to quit the team? Both solid veterans and quality leaders---if you heard Glenn's show on 610 you knew he was an intelligent class act...but he quit? I'm not buying it.

-The coaches and management knew there was a possibility they lost the team.

-Casserly didn’t address the line in the off season because at the time it was believed to be a “mentality issue” rather than a talent issue.

-Foreman, sharper, Glenn out. Of course this raises an eyebrow. What does casserly do to stop the bleeding? He begins buying back players (and securing young talent in preparation for the breakdown?). Davis, Pitts, and company are gifted with nice contracts...the other players are watching...can this help?

-Capers’ spends the off season with a close eye on the offense allowing fangio far too much freedom with the defense. All of a sudden we have an issue on both sides of the ball. I can assume this because we have yet to see a capers’ classic defense.

-Perhaps palmer was at the spawn of the problem, but his offense’s performance on the field was bad as well. What happened? Fired----and fired in a hurry. 2 games? I saw those games.... I know how bad they were. In palmer’s defense it was the #1 and #2 defense. The problem was deeper, and capers’ put him out the door fast. Maybe this could appease those unruly players?

No such luck. The players have spoken with their performance. They will not be happy until capers’ is scalped.

I don't know how to take this. The talent is here...ive seen it. The coaches lost the players. Something happened behind the scenes-something happened in a practice. We’re a few Charles woodson quotes short of an all out "Bill Callahan Mutiny". Maybe those start next week...or maybe its status quo from the players...more coach speak from the players because they already know they've sabotaged capers' job and our season. My question is:

How high up the totem pole does this go? Is casserly seen as a “medic” by the players or culpable?

Things to look forward to:

-At 0-6 David Carr will be benched if mcnair has decided to keep casserly.

-More coach speak from the players because they already know capers is done. Why should they be seen as bad apples around the league for a lame duck coach? (Oddly enough they’d rather be viewed as bad players by fans...)

-No heated comments from Gary walker? Yup. Cause he knows.

-An off season bristling with free agent activity. Capers/fangio and company will be let go the day after our finale. Coaching candidates will preferably be 3-4 disciples...but if mcnair thinks he can get an elite coach in here he’ll scrap that along with the previous regime.

-A top 3 pick. (Geez can we skip the season and get to that already?)

And finally...
-A BRAND NEW 4-YEAR PROJECT!

wrestler4life
10-09-2005, 05:53 PM
Pretty bleak outlook. Is it really that bad? I know that not having seen any of the games I am not having the luxury of seeing as much as anyone in Houston, but I can say that I am really just about done with worrying about this team. I will always root for them, but like my dad did with the Oilers, I think that I am just about ready to cheer from a distance and move on with my Sundays.
7 sacks... and noone is pissed? Pitiful

HoustonFan
10-09-2005, 05:54 PM
Saban is showing that you can turn a team around over there in Miami. Maybe we need college coaches.

Ibar_Harry
10-09-2005, 06:06 PM
Saban is showing that you can turn a team around over there in Miami. Maybe we need college coaches.

One of the best out there is Tedford the Cal coach. Some will boo, but it would be interesting to see what he could do. He knows Carr well and Carr knows him. Actually Tedford was a QB who threw the long ball. He's a very good offensive coach. Been great as a teacher and taken a bad program and made a good one out of it. Seems to be a real talent when it comes to teaching players how to become QB's. Remember, Carr, Volick, Harrington, Bollier,Dilfer, and the young guy for GB. Again, laugh if you like, but the guy knows what he is doing. Its rummored though that he doesn't want to leave Cal.

rittenhouserobz
10-09-2005, 06:06 PM
-A BRAND NEW 4-YEAR PROJECT!

Please don't fool yourself. If a top notch coach comes to Houston they could turn us around in 2 years. We have quite a talent base. They just haven't been glued together right.

Solid coaching philosophy + top pick in the draft= rebuilt team in 2

IMHO

edo783
10-09-2005, 06:11 PM
Please don't fool yourself. If a top notch coach comes to Houston they could turn us around in 2 years. We have quite a talent base. They just haven't been glued together right.

Solid coaching philosophy + top pick in the draft= rebuilt team in 2

IMHO

YUP, two years IF IF IF there is an NFL quality offensive line. Without it....nothing.

Honoring Earl 34
10-09-2005, 06:12 PM
:eek: I think there is some talent . Because of this I say its a two year project .
I just hope the new GM does'nt reach on picks or trades . I hope he is the one taking advantage of the other guy . I wish Carr's option year was'nt next year .
On a positive note the Cheerleader named Celina is a 10 .

Hervoyel
10-09-2005, 06:13 PM
I'm going with rittenhouserobz on this one. Good coaches turn bad teams around quickly all the time. I've never been a big fan of Tuna but I'd be a fool to say the man can't coach. When the mummy in Dallas got tired of his team losing he went and hired Tuna, the rest is history. I have never been a big Marty Schottenheimer (sp?) fan either but the guy can coach and the Chargers went from garbage to the playoffs in the blink of an eye.

In two years a real-deal type coach who can get his players to buy into what he's doing can turn a team around. Saban will do it in Miami, Marvin Lewis did it in Cincinnati and when he got there players were almost willing to quit football to get out of there.

powda
10-09-2005, 06:15 PM
If a top notch coach comes to Houston they could turn us around in 2 years. We have quite a talent base. They just haven't been glued together right.


i actually agree fullheartedly with that ,but there seems to be a stigma around here with "4 year plans". 2years may be to much even---a good coach/off seaon/draft could cause a bounce back season in a hurry. at this rate what team is going to fear us in 07? i think the fans could deal with 2-3 years building as long as the product on the field was fun to watch and there were steady signs of progress.

WWJD
10-09-2005, 06:22 PM
The Titans have a very young team (the youngest I think they said) and they are well coached so they at least have a chance if they get a break here and there. I almost get the feeling the Texan players have lost some fight in their game....not that they don't try hard because they do...but they seem to get a bad break and they have no ability to bounce back.

I'm no expert; just a fan but sometimes I think you need new blood. Whether that be coaching or players I guess is the debate.

Ibar_Harry
10-09-2005, 06:23 PM
I'm going with rittenhouserobz on this one. Good coaches turn bad teams around quickly all the time. I've never been a big fan of Tuna but I'd be a fool to say the man can't coach. When the mummy in Dallas got tired of his team losing he went and hired Tuna, the rest is history. I have never been a big Marty Schottenheimer (sp?) fan either but the guy can coach and the Chargers went from garbage to the playoffs in the blink of an eye.

In two years a real-deal type coach who can get his players to buy into what he's doing can turn a team around. Saban will do it in Miami, Marvin Lewis did it in Cincinnati and when he got there players were almost willing to quit football to get out of there.

Well, well, Herv you are on the band wagon I've been saying for two years, now. Isn't that funny after all the comments you made about me not understanding what was going on. Really its sad that it has taken this long Herv and the worst part of it is it looks like its going to take a lot longer. Its a waste for all the FANS, PLAYERS, CASSERLY and the OWNER to put up with this nonsense. But no one in power will just say no.

Years ago as a foster parent I wrote a letter to the court on behalf of my foster son. The court's were known for not listening to foster parents, but I sat down with a lawyer friend and we tried to just state the facts in an unemotional way as possible. One of the lines began no one will just say no. At the court hearing the judge began by saying no will just say no, but I am. I couldn't believe my ears. That's the problem we have here. No one seems to have Mr. McNair's ear or can unemotionally get the point across to him. It's a shame, because so much is being lost by everyone connected to this team.

Its not really a hate Capers thing, rather he's just not head coaching material and its as simple as that. Its simply time to change and cut your losses. God bless all and let's say a prayor our words are heard......

JamesLovesGames
10-09-2005, 06:26 PM
:eek: I think there is some talent . Because of this I say its a two year project .
I just hope the new GM does'nt reach on picks or trades . I hope he is the one taking advantage of the other guy . I wish Carr's option year was'nt next year .
On a positive note the Cheerleader named Celina is a 10 .

Celina is quite nice. :drool:

Bobo
10-09-2005, 06:27 PM
I believe it will be a 3-4 year project as well. It will take that long for a new OL to mesh.

powda
10-09-2005, 07:01 PM
the whole concept on an o-line being given time to gel was a farce. pitts/mckinney/weigert/wade all had experience together and riley had previous experience playing in the league.

the same person calling the blocking assignments has always called the blocking assignments :mckinney.

i bought into the company line for a while ,but teams plug in new starters in their line all the time without needing a decade to become cohesive. in the meantime carr is becoming a comatose vegetable. its time to yank him for the sake of his carreer.

WWJD
10-09-2005, 07:09 PM
I made this comment on another thread...the Cowboys had a horrible O line last year and this year they've plugged in some new players and they seem to be doing much better in that department. Drew Bledsoe said he wasn't touched today and Philly has a really good defense. If they can do it so can the Texans. And it all starts with the line play.

throwANDREtheBALL
10-09-2005, 07:21 PM
Exactly what I was about to say.

Meet Rob Petitti - OT, Dallas - I think he was drafted in Round 6

WOW, I'm glad we got that 2-3 year project C - Hodgdon kid. Seeing our line for this year was already SUPER. Way to go Casserly, you da man. Way to think ahead, when your ship is sinking right now.

Hervoyel
10-09-2005, 07:47 PM
the whole concept on an o-line being given time to gel was a farce.

I disagree but I think the amount of time a group of offensive linemen take to gel was greatly exaggerated by the Texans. I'm sure it can vary depending on the aptitude of the players you're talking about. For example where the zone blocking transition was concerned I personally believe a good line that was well coached could put that in during training camp and "perform" by midseason relatively easily. I'd expect some screw ups early in the year and then that would start smoothing out after a 4-6 games. By the middle of the year they should be in fine form.

The idea that offensive lines need to gel has never been in question. I personally am embarrassed at how long I accepted that excuse though and that I accepted the situations that it was given under. When you lose a lineman to injury and his backup steps in to fill the void that should be a fairly smooth transition. It's not like the guy came from another team or was practicing out of a different playbook with someone elses system in it. Here though you get the "Now they need to "gel" some more" excuse.

Like I said, I can't believe I accepted that for as long as I did. I'm embarrassed.

Scooter
10-09-2005, 07:58 PM
pretty much both right IMO. the O-line does need time to gel, that's not a question i wouldnt think. but that's more to be seen as time to perfect their moves in cohesion with the rest of the line. out of the gate with proper coaching they SHOULD be competant provided they've got enough experience to know their jobs.

powda
10-09-2005, 08:00 PM
ditto.

my point was 4 of the 5 had played with one another comming into the season. i'm beyond blaming the talent level or the blocking schemes. these are all players and coaches with previous nfl caliber experience. they werent this inept elsewhere...why so bad here?

they dont care.

that pisses me off more then anything. there are a lot of diehards that come in here year round. when the season is through we closely monitor free agency and the draft. i personally spend a lot of time here and i know im not the only one. i'm glued to anything texans related be it on tv-radio-chronicle articles etc. i've anticipated this season since the cleveland game and this is the effort i get? you gotta be kidding me. if i pulled that crap at work i'd be in the unemployment line.

right now the only silver lining i see is a new regime and a high (very high) draft pick. i'm ready for april and this was only game 4.