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Exascor
10-08-2005, 04:41 AM
FOXSports (http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/8930293)

Pete Prisco

It's easy to pile on Carr, particularly because he was the first overall pick in 2002. That makes him a target. But whatever problems the Texans are having offensively are not his fault. The line has been terrible in his time there and he has taken far too many hits. Carr is on pace to get sacked 112 times, which would shatter the league record he already holds. The guy's lucky to be standing every Sunday night after all the hits he takes. Plus, the running game isn't much -- Domanick Davis is overrated -- and aside from Andre Johnson, the pass catchers don't offer much help. Johnson is constantly doubled, which makes it tough to get open. So Carr has a limited running game, one premier pass catcher who gets doubled and a line that really struggles in pass protection. Would Peyton Manning or Tom Brady succeed in those conditions? Not a chance. Neither will Carr, but he is not the problem.

Clark Judge

He should be part of the solution. The problem is, we may never find out. Not this year, at least. The offensive line is dreadful, and Carr is a sitting duck for blitzing defenses. The testament is in the 20 sacks he absorbed in three games. The poor guy barely has a chance to step back and throw, and if you don't believe me, check out those numbers of Andre Johnson. You find 10 catches, none for more than 16 yards and none for a touchdown. Carr has a cannon for an arm, but what good is a cannon if you can't fire it? Houston is finding out. Carr looked decent for much of last weekend's loss, but four sacks in the fourth quarter finished him -- including one that caused a game-clinching fumble. It was caused when the Bengals' Justin Smith blew past Houston tackle Todd Wade. The Texans must solve their offensive line problems, or we won't find out what David Carr can do.

ArlingtonTexan
10-08-2005, 05:38 AM
Think this has been debated pretty thoroughly on the board. Conventional notion all sacks = OLs fault even from so-called experts. The OL is below average in pass protection and Carr is mediocre at best in pocket awareness/sidestepping the rush. Awful combination and leads to a disaster as an offense.

TexasJedi
10-08-2005, 06:33 AM
Some "fumble". :rolleyes: Really though, many fans have focused in on that poor call by the refs, and it was terrible, but miss the complete breakdown of Todd Wade on that play. It was even more terrible than the refs call in that the fumble/incompletion would never have been an issue had Wade not been beat.

wrestler4life
10-08-2005, 08:32 AM
The problem is that when a quarterback develpos that pocket awareness and can use it effectively is when he trusts his line enough to keep his eyes downfield, rather than immediately trying to see who is coming full speed at him before his plant foot hits. I don't think that Carr has done a good job, but I understand and hope that this OL's replacements, whoever they are, can allow him to be able to see the field with the confidence every other QB in this league has about their protection.

Proteus
10-08-2005, 08:40 AM
Carr being the problem is a good question. I vote yes. In my previous posts I have stated many fatal flaws he has. I will name none of them here, but if you want to know what I said about Carr you can check out my last few posts for yourself. He has no awareness, no leadership skills, and actually... isn't even that good of a quaterback. Is Carr the problem? Yes
~Proteus

BREAZE
10-08-2005, 08:54 AM
http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?t=13010&page=3

As you can see, this topic has been beaten to death already and on more than 1 occasion...

Bottle-O-Bud
10-08-2005, 04:30 PM
I dont think is Carr's fault... the D just gets to him too quickly. Case and point the "the dirty call" against the Bengals. Wade got schooled there so badly on a critical play......... not even time to throw...

CajunTexan
10-08-2005, 04:58 PM
Carr being the problem is a good question. I vote yes. In my previous posts I have stated many fatal flaws he has. I will name none of them here, but if you want to know what I said about Carr you can check out my last few posts for yourself. He has no awareness, no leadership skills, and actually... isn't even that good of a quaterback. Is Carr the problem? Yes
~Proteus
Dude...wake and see the things everyone, well almost everyone, else, including the journalists in these articles see. You talk about pocket awareness. What pocket???? I'm sure you will bring up the few times in his 4 year career he has had a pocket to throw from and did not make the throw. But those opportunities are few and far between. As is mentioned in these articles he hasn't had enough pockets to prove he has any awareness!!!

No leadership skills. He is 25 or 26 and been pounded for 4 years. When he has not gotten frustrated by the poundings, as he has this year, he has shown leadership by example. Playing with a seperated shoulder and leading the Texans to a win over the ATL in his second year is enough leadership for me, and should be for you also.

Proteus and all other Carr bashers WILL BE WELCOME ON THE CARR BANDWAGON WHEN THE TIME COMES, AND THE TIME IS COMING, HIDE AND WATCH!!!!!! :texflag:

WiiBrawler
10-08-2005, 05:23 PM
Peyton Manning Would look like tim couch with that o line, at least david carr has legs, and if there is a distance between a defender he will take off and run. So he is not that bad

aj.
10-08-2005, 05:26 PM
Who watches the Texans more, Pete Prisco, Clark Judge, or us?

Their 50,000 ft. 'analysis' leaves everything to be desired and they add nothing new or insightful in that piece.

Elite
10-08-2005, 06:02 PM
OK at this point David is part of the problem. david has never been a good QB Potential you say since when does potential Equal Wins im still waiting we might get one this weekend but i think steve mcnair will find a way to beat us. now its not all david carr's fault first of he doesnt have the big game experience some QB's get in college but thats only because he went to fresno state and not a real football program and charlie casserly never did anything to give this poor fraud out of fresno state a chance to make it in this league no o-line no real second reciever. but david is mentally Screwed now he will never be effective with us we need to cut our losses and let him go at the end of the season We all know he isnt worth the 8.5 million he might get if we pick up his option im sure that will never happen i think mr mcnair is smarter than that.

ArlingtonTexan
10-09-2005, 05:46 AM
Makes it hard to acctualy know that doesnt it, when the line is so bad.

Bad O Line-=Great pocket awareness, hows that work.................Somebody tell me.

If you watched the games you could see where there are times when Carr steps into the rush instead up or away from it. When that sack occurs it on the QB not the line or Rbs. Pass protection is a coordinated effort between blockers moving defensive players in certain spot and the Qb moving into spots where there are no defenders or passing before the defender get to him. A Qb who always moves correctly/throws on time can still be the victim of a bad offensive line, but is more likely to make his OL look better than it is. A Qb who is average at best at stepping in right spot delivering on time, etc. can make an offensive line look worse than it is.

Runner
10-09-2005, 06:22 AM
Watch some of the other games today, and you'll se a lot of "U" shaped pockets. The Texans' looks more like a pulsating amoebae.

HardCoreTxn
10-09-2005, 08:09 AM
Dude...wake and see the things everyone, well almost everyone, else, including the journalists in these articles see. You talk about pocket awareness. What pocket???? I'm sure you will bring up the few times in his 4 year career he has had a pocket to throw from and did not make the throw. But those opportunities are few and far between. As is mentioned in these articles he hasn't had enough pockets to prove he has any awareness!!!

No leadership skills. He is 25 or 26 and been pounded for 4 years. When he has not gotten frustrated by the poundings, as he has this year, he has shown leadership by example. Playing with a seperated shoulder and leading the Texans to a win over the ATL in his second year is enough leadership for me, and should be for you also.

Proteus and all other Carr bashers WILL BE WELCOME ON THE CARR BANDWAGON WHEN THE TIME COMES, AND THE TIME IS COMING, HIDE AND WATCH!!!!!! :texflag:

I agree with you Cajun......I know Carr has made some mistakes, but when he DOES have a pocket to work in, how many times do the WR's drop passes or run the wrong routes. IMO Carr just needs a big game or 2 and ppl will lay off the bashing. :texflag:

Kaiser Toro
10-09-2005, 08:16 AM
I give no credence to out of market reporter's rants on our teams strengths and weaknesses.

jim rome
01-26-2006, 03:25 PM
proeuts does not know how to evaluate a QB. :listening :listening :listening :listening

Jack Bauer
01-26-2006, 03:29 PM
Who watches the Texans more, Pete Prisco, Clark Judge, or us?

Who has more football knowledge, Pete Prisco, Clark Judge, or us? No contest: Pete and Clark. When I say "us", I am not speaking of you aj or many of the other football savvy posters we have here. There are MANY who are not football savvy.

Jack Bauer
01-26-2006, 03:30 PM
Watch some of the other games today, and you'll se a lot of "U" shaped pockets. The Texans' looks more like a pulsating amoebae.

Hilarious, unfortunately sad and true!

rmartin65
01-26-2006, 03:47 PM
I like DD, but I kinda agree with what they said about him, that he is overrated.

chall8
01-26-2006, 04:34 PM
Pretty weak, surface-level analysis by the Fox "experts". Basically just says "he's been sacked a lot, so it's the OL's fault, not his".

For me David Carr is not the problem, nor is he the solution. I didn't think he was worth a #1 pick in the 2002 draft and nothing has happened in the last 4 years to change my mind. He is a "serviceable" QB, nothing more and nothing less.

I am extremely excited about the Kubiak hire but am under no illusions that he's somehow going to convert DC into a top-level NFL QB.

Double Barrel
01-26-2006, 06:24 PM
For me David Carr is not the problem, nor is he the solution. I didn't think he was worth a #1 pick in the 2002 draft and nothing has happened in the last 4 years to change my mind. He is a "serviceable" QB, nothing more and nothing less.

I am extremely excited about the Kubiak hire but am under no illusions that he's somehow going to convert DC into a top-level NFL QB.

I agree, and well said. If DC can be a QB that runs the offense - meaning he doesn't have to win games by himself, but does not make the mistakes that lose games - then we'll be successful under Kubiak's leadership. Teams have won championships with QBs that have less physical talent than DC. Matter-of-fact, look at the two QBs in the Superbowl this year. Neither of them can be considered "elite" QBs at this point in their careers. Why can't DC be the same way? Why does he have to be Superman? idonno:

chall8
01-27-2006, 01:13 PM
Teams have won championships with QBs that have less physical talent than DC. Matter-of-fact, look at the two QBs in the Superbowl this year. Neither of them can be considered "elite" QBs at this point in their careers. Why can't DC be the same way? Why does he have to be Superman?

You make a good point. Rothlesberger and Hasselback are hardly being compared with Montana, Elway, and Marino.

Which is why I'm a proponent of trading the pick and filling the other holes. As much as I'd love to see VY in a Texans uniform we can certainly "live" with DC. But if we don't drastically upgrade the defense then we're not going anywhere, because I can't think of a single team that made it to the Super Bowl playing bad defense.

jerek
01-27-2006, 01:49 PM
You make a good point. Rothlesberger and Hasselback are hardly being compared with Montana, Elway, and Marino.

Which is why I'm a proponent of trading the pick and filling the other holes. As much as I'd love to see VY in a Texans uniform we can certainly "live" with DC. But if we don't drastically upgrade the defense then we're not going anywhere, because I can't think of a single team that made it to the Super Bowl playing bad defense.

The Rams (99? 00? forget offhand) is the only one I can think of.

chall8
01-27-2006, 02:06 PM
Yeah, I can't remember much about the "greatest show on turf's" defense.

But you bring up another point in that Kurt Warner is another average, serviceable QB that excelled in a good system.

Double Barrel
01-27-2006, 04:52 PM
Which is why I'm a proponent of trading the pick and filling the other holes. As much as I'd love to see VY in a Texans uniform we can certainly "live" with DC. But if we don't drastically upgrade the defense then we're not going anywhere, because I can't think of a single team that made it to the Super Bowl playing bad defense.

I feel the same way. This pick, as much/more than any other year, is worth a fortune in football terms. I would figure that we could really use it to make some major upgrades at various positions, as opposed to an upgrade at just one position (that we may not really need to begin with).

But defense is the name of the game. Any Superbowl winner that wins without a dominant D is the exception, not the rule. More often than not, you'll see strong defensive teams with run-of-the-mill offenses win the big one.