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GP
09-22-2005, 11:56 AM
Click here Casserly announced as Texans GM (CNNSI article) (http://www.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/news/2000/01/19/casserly_houston/) to be transported to the actual article.

Below is a copy-and-paste of that article. He knows what he's doing.


HOUSTON (AP) -- Charley Casserly, who won three Super Bowl rings during 22 years with the Washington Redskins, was named executive vice president and general manager of Houston's NFL expansion team Wednesday.

"This is not an on-the-job training program. We want people with a track record and success at this level," franchise owner Bob McNair said. "We did not interview a lot of people but we looked a lot.

"The overwhelming response was that Charley demands respect in the NFL and that is what we were seeking," McNair said.

McNair declined to give terms of Casserly's contract, other than to say it was a multi-year deal.

"We are long-term thinkers and we know it is going to take some time for this organization to be successful," McNair said. "Charley will have ample time to put this organization together."

Casserly, whom Redskins owner Daniel M. Snyder forced out before this season began, started with the team as an unpaid intern in 1977 and had been general manager in Washington since 1989.

Snyder said he decided to restructure the team's front office after becoming convinced that Casserly and coach Norv Turner could not work together. Casserly received blame for a series of disappointing first-round draft choices, including Bobby Wilson, Tom Carter, Heath Shuler and Andre Johnson.

"I knew every day I went to work, I was fired," Casserly said at a news conference Wednesday. "When Dan Snyder officially took over the team it was a matter if I left then or in six months.

"I wanted to go then so I could look for another job, I was prepared to do that," he said, adding he has no hard feelings for Snyder. "Now, this is the best thing that has happened to me because now I am here."

The Redskins made the playoffs this year led by other players Casserly acquired, including quarterback Brad Johnson, running back Stephen Davis and receiver Michael Westbrook. The Redskins lost 14-13 to Tampa Bay last Saturday.

He also drafted Georgia cornerback Champ Bailey and left Washington with three No. 1 picks in the April draft.

Casserly was considered a candidate for general manager jobs with the New Orleans Saints and New York Jets.

"We as a family came to the conclusion that Houston was the best fit for us," Casserly said. "The toughest calls I had to make were to those other teams to tell them I was not interested."

El Tejano
09-22-2005, 01:05 PM
Is the Andre Johnson mentioned in this clip our same Andre Johnson?

Scooter
09-22-2005, 01:12 PM
i wont be one to jump on the fire casserly bandwagon ... yet. however, this offseason was pathetic. the personnel moves were atrocious across the board. letting glenn & sharper walk, throwing away draft picks on bust corner, failing to upgrade the O-line, using the first pick on a backup as opposed to the playmaker that by miracle alone fell in our lap, and the decisions after preseason just left everyone scratching their heads. it's hard to believe that a team could make so many bad moves in 5 seasons, let alone all at once.

BUT, i cant fault him for the pitiful state we're in right now. i firmly believe that if cowher or belichick's staffs had 2+ years with most of our draftees we'd have a very respectable squad and a playoff contender. my blame goes squarely on the coaches. look at many of the young players ... babin, peek, pitts, faggins, orr, wand, simmons, carr, etc. these guys have talent. they play hard and play as well as they can with what they're given, and along with vets like seth payne, todd wade, aaron glenn, jamie sharper, marcus coleman ... the team shouldnt have this much difficulty coming together. the transition from highschool to college, & college to pros is hard enough ... these guys are appearing to have to do it by themselves.

Double Barrel
09-22-2005, 02:06 PM
Casserly's track record should be trusted right now

yeah, but he doesn't know half as much as some of the members of this board. :heh:

I swear we have at least 8-10 bonafide NFL GMs right here...not sure why they aren't working for an actual team, though... idonno:

CC is one of the most respected GMs in the NFL. I swear the short-term attitude of this fairweather town just kills the team spirit in me. And after all those times that I've defended Houston sports fans as educated and dedicated. ;)

Hookem Horns
09-22-2005, 03:25 PM
I agree, Casserly's track record speaks for itself. Just look at his draft history while he was in Washington.

Let's hope David Carr and Andre Johnson don't turn out to be another Heath Shuler and Desmond Howard.

2000
1. LaVar Arrington, LB, Penn St.
1. Chris Samuels, T, Alabama
3. Lloyd Harrison, CB, N.C. State
4. Michael Moore, G, Troy St.
5. Quincy Sanders, S, UNLV
6. Todd Husak, QB, Stanford
7. Del Cowsette, DT, Maryland
7. Ethan Howell, WR, Oklahoma St.

1999
1. Champ Bailey, CB, Georgia
2. Jon Jansen, T, Michigan
4. Nate Stimson, LB, Georgia Tech
5. Derek Smith, OL, Virginia Tech
6. Jeff Hall, K, Tennessee
7. Tim Alexander, WR, Oregon St.

1998
2. Stephen Alexander, TE, Oklahoma
3. Skip Hicks, RB, UCLA
4. Shawn Barber, LB, Richmond
5. Mark Fischer, C, Purdue
6. Pat Palmer, WR, Northwestern St.
7. David Terrell, CB, UTEP
7. Antwaune Ponds, LB, Syracuse

1997
1. Kenard Lang, DE, Miami
2. Greg Jones, LB, Colorado
3. Derek Smith, LB, Arizona St.
4. Albert Connell, WR, Texas A&M
5. Jamel Williams, S, Nebraska
5. Keith Thibodeaux, CB, N.W. Louisiana
5. Twan Russell, LB, Miami
5. Brad Badger, G, Stanford

1996
1. Andre Johnson, T, Penn State
4. Stephen Davis, RB, Auburn
5. Leomont Evans, S, Clemson
6. Kelvin Kinney, DE, Virginia St.
7. Jeremy Asher, LB, Oregon
7. Deandre Maxwell, WR, San Diego St.

1995
1. Michael Westbrook, WR, Colorado
2. Cory Raymer, C, Wisconson
3. Daryl Pounds, CB, Nicholls St.
4. Larry Jones, RB, Miami
5. Jamie Asher, TE, Louisville
5. Rich Owens, DE, Lehigh
6. Brian Thure, T, California
7. Scott Turner, CB, Illinois

1994
1. Heath Shuler, QB, Tennessee
2. Tre Johnson, T, Temple
3. Tydus Winans, WR, Fresno St.
3. Joe Patton, T, Alabama A&M
4. Kurt Haws, TE, Utah
6. Dexter Nottage, DE, Florida A&M
7. Gus Frerotte, QB, Tulsa

1993
1. Tom Carter, CB, Notre Dame
2. Reggie Brooks, RB, Notre Dame
3. Rick Hamilton, LB, Central Florida
3. Ed Bunn, P, UTEP
4. Sterling Palmer, DE, Florida St.
5. Greg Huntington, C, Penn St.
6. Darryl Morrison, CB, Arizona
6. Frank Wycheck, TE, Maryland
8. Lamont Hollinquest, LB, USC

1992
1. Desmond Howard, WR, Michigan
2. Shane Collins, DE, Arizona St.
3. Paul Siever, G, Penn St.
4. Chris Hakel, QB, William & Mary
6. Ray Rowe, TE, San Diego St.
7. Calvin Holmes, DB, USC
8. Darryl Moore, G, UTEP
9. Boone Powell, LB, Texas
10. Tony Barker, LB, Rice
11. Terry Smith, WR, Penn St.
12. Matt Elliott, C, Michigan

1991
1. Bobby Wilson, DT, Michigan St.
3. Ricky Ervins, RB, USC
6. Dennis Ransom, TE, Texas A&M
7. Keith Cash, WR, Texas
8. Jimmy Spencer, DB, Florida
9. Charles Bell, DB, Baylor
10. Cris Shale, P, Bowling Green
11. David Gulledge, S, Jacksonville St.
12. Keenan McCardell, WR, UNLV

1990
2. Andre Collins, LB, Penn St.
3. Moe Elewonibi, G, BYU
4. Cary Conklin, QB, Washington
5. Brian Mitchell, RB, S.W. Louisiana
6. Kent Walls, DT, Nebraska
9. Tim Moxley, G, Ohio St.
10. D’Juan Francisco, DB, North Dakota
10. Thomas Rayam, DT, Alabama
11. Jon Leverenz, LB, Minnesota

beerlover
09-22-2005, 03:42 PM
Casserly's track record speaks for itself. Just look at his draft history while he was in Washington.

valid point but he's not in Kansas (Washington) anymore :)

HJam72
09-22-2005, 03:49 PM
1993
1. Tom Carter, CB, Notre Dame
2. Reggie Brooks, RB, Notre Dame
3. Rick Hamilton, LB, Central Florida
3. Ed Bunn, P, UTEP
4. Sterling Palmer, DE, Florida St.
5. Greg Huntington, C, Penn St.
6. Darryl Morrison, CB, Arizona
6. Frank Wycheck, TE, Maryland
8. Lamont Hollinquest, LB, USC



Getting Frank Wycheck in the 6th round sounds pretty good. We could sure use a young Wycheck here right now....or a healthy Joppru.

beerlover
09-22-2005, 03:50 PM
Casserly's track record should be trusted right now

yeah, but he doesn't know half as much as some of the members of this board.

everyone is entitled to their opinions, even you & me :tomato:


I swear we have at least 8-10 bonafide NFL GMs right here...not sure why they aren't working for an actual team

if you checked Casserly's bio he started out as a unpaid interm :rolleyes:

CC is one of the most respected GMs in the NFL. I swear the short-term attitude of this fairweather town just kills the team spirit in me. And after all those times that I've defended Houston sports fans as educated and dedicated.

fans are fans no matter where you live this predispoition to believe anything different is pure fantasy :tv:

Hookem Horns
09-22-2005, 03:53 PM
valid point but he's not in Kansas (Washington) anymore :)

Actually, I was being sarcastic.

beerlover
09-22-2005, 04:18 PM
Actually, I was being sarcastic.

I know Hookem, your from UT :texflag:

Its a sensitive subject to be sure but I for one feel that the Texans should be operated for & by Texans, this not a personel attack on Casserly he is an outstanding GM & highly respected but for Texans he always seemed like a fish out of water, I could be wrong (usually am) but he does not understand the Texans fanbase, the schools alums who have the money and spend the bucks for psl's and the like, so I really feel a change at some point will be needed. passing on Derrick Johnson makes me sick even if he "doesn't fit the 3-4" you make adjustments, you satisfy your paying customer.

I'm not one to complain without soultions, but I have to believe the next Texans organizational makeup will include more local flavor. the one truely great thing the Texans do have in their favor is our owner Mr. McNair, in McNair I trust not Casserly :texans:

GP
09-22-2005, 04:19 PM
1999: Champ Bailey. Champ Bailey. General Manager Charley Casserly did some wheeling and dealing to move from the 5th pick in the draft down to the 12th pick in the draft and then back up to the 7th pick in the draft, to come up with this brilliant diamond from the University of Georgia.

2000: Lavar Arrington. Acquired as part of Charley Casserly's 1999 daylight robbery of Mike Ditka (in the Ricky Williams deal), Arrington came out of Penn State as the second pick in the draft with a reputation as a hard-hitting maniac with the speed of a lightning bolt and the power of a runaway freight train.

link: Casserly selections (http://www.hailredskins.com/darfthistoryarticle.htm)

Just posting these two draft picks to at least make us realize that the guy is not some wacko who doesn't have the ability to see good value, as well as to make a few deals to get it done.

Double Barrel
09-22-2005, 04:31 PM
everyone is entitled to their opinions, even you & me :tomato:

And I always defend the right to have that opinion. :thumbup

But when people express their opinion that a highly respected NFL GM is a "king of grease" and "insufferable a-hole", I don't have to respect the opinion. It is uneducated pap, IMHO.

It is one thing to respect the right to an opinion, but an entirely different matter to respect the opinion itself. The first is a right, the second is earned.

(ps. I have no problem with agreeing to disagree...matter-of-fact, I always welcome educated opinions that are different than mine, as it serves to elevate. But personal swipes are not called for)

cadahnic
09-22-2005, 04:43 PM
I dont argue with his past picks and for the most part his early picks and late picks have been solid. His middle round have always been a little sketchy because he likes to reach and wheel and deal. We will turn this season the right way once we get Carr attacking a defense and our defense on the blitz. What kind of 3-4 does not blitz often. Anyway keep gettin it done Cass, met him at the game sunday and he had alot of good things to say. Plus his lux. box is freakin awesome.

Elite
09-22-2005, 04:47 PM
I agree, Casserly's track record speaks for itself. Just look at his draft history while he was in Washington.

Let's hope David Carr and Andre Johnson don't turn out to be another Heath Shuler and Desmond Howard.

2000
1. LaVar Arrington, LB, Penn St.
1. Chris Samuels, T, Alabama
3. Lloyd Harrison, CB, N.C. State
4. Michael Moore, G, Troy St.
5. Quincy Sanders, S, UNLV
6. Todd Husak, QB, Stanford
7. Del Cowsette, DT, Maryland
7. Ethan Howell, WR, Oklahoma St.

1999
1. Champ Bailey, CB, Georgia
2. Jon Jansen, T, Michigan
4. Nate Stimson, LB, Georgia Tech
5. Derek Smith, OL, Virginia Tech
6. Jeff Hall, K, Tennessee
7. Tim Alexander, WR, Oregon St.

1998
2. Stephen Alexander, TE, Oklahoma
3. Skip Hicks, RB, UCLA
4. Shawn Barber, LB, Richmond
5. Mark Fischer, C, Purdue
6. Pat Palmer, WR, Northwestern St.
7. David Terrell, CB, UTEP
7. Antwaune Ponds, LB, Syracuse

1997
1. Kenard Lang, DE, Miami
2. Greg Jones, LB, Colorado
3. Derek Smith, LB, Arizona St.
4. Albert Connell, WR, Texas A&M
5. Jamel Williams, S, Nebraska
5. Keith Thibodeaux, CB, N.W. Louisiana
5. Twan Russell, LB, Miami
5. Brad Badger, G, Stanford

1996
1. Andre Johnson, T, Penn State
4. Stephen Davis, RB, Auburn
5. Leomont Evans, S, Clemson
6. Kelvin Kinney, DE, Virginia St.
7. Jeremy Asher, LB, Oregon
7. Deandre Maxwell, WR, San Diego St.

1995
1. Michael Westbrook, WR, Colorado
2. Cory Raymer, C, Wisconson
3. Daryl Pounds, CB, Nicholls St.
4. Larry Jones, RB, Miami
5. Jamie Asher, TE, Louisville
5. Rich Owens, DE, Lehigh
6. Brian Thure, T, California
7. Scott Turner, CB, Illinois

1994
1. Heath Shuler, QB, Tennessee
2. Tre Johnson, T, Temple
3. Tydus Winans, WR, Fresno St.
3. Joe Patton, T, Alabama A&M
4. Kurt Haws, TE, Utah
6. Dexter Nottage, DE, Florida A&M
7. Gus Frerotte, QB, Tulsa

1993
1. Tom Carter, CB, Notre Dame
2. Reggie Brooks, RB, Notre Dame
3. Rick Hamilton, LB, Central Florida
3. Ed Bunn, P, UTEP
4. Sterling Palmer, DE, Florida St.
5. Greg Huntington, C, Penn St.
6. Darryl Morrison, CB, Arizona
6. Frank Wycheck, TE, Maryland
8. Lamont Hollinquest, LB, USC

1992
1. Desmond Howard, WR, Michigan
2. Shane Collins, DE, Arizona St.
3. Paul Siever, G, Penn St.
4. Chris Hakel, QB, William & Mary
6. Ray Rowe, TE, San Diego St.
7. Calvin Holmes, DB, USC
8. Darryl Moore, G, UTEP
9. Boone Powell, LB, Texas
10. Tony Barker, LB, Rice
11. Terry Smith, WR, Penn St.
12. Matt Elliott, C, Michigan

1991
1. Bobby Wilson, DT, Michigan St.
3. Ricky Ervins, RB, USC
6. Dennis Ransom, TE, Texas A&M
7. Keith Cash, WR, Texas
8. Jimmy Spencer, DB, Florida
9. Charles Bell, DB, Baylor
10. Cris Shale, P, Bowling Green
11. David Gulledge, S, Jacksonville St.
12. Keenan McCardell, WR, UNLV

1990
2. Andre Collins, LB, Penn St.
3. Moe Elewonibi, G, BYU
4. Cary Conklin, QB, Washington
5. Brian Mitchell, RB, S.W. Louisiana
6. Kent Walls, DT, Nebraska
9. Tim Moxley, G, Ohio St.
10. D’Juan Francisco, DB, North Dakota
10. Thomas Rayam, DT, Alabama
11. Jon Leverenz, LB, Minnesota



I might be wrong but im pretty sure that Casserly did not draft the 2000 class not that its that great but yeah i think he got the Axe before he got a chance of ruining that draft.

beerlover
09-22-2005, 04:51 PM
But when people express their opinion that a highly respected NFL GM is a "king of grease" and "insufferable a-hole", I don't have to respect the opinion. It is uneducated pap, IMHO

we don't need to point fingers we've all read those threads, none of those are on this thread. Vinny and the moderators do a great job censoring as needed, and I agree it does get sickening and dissapointing at times but people are people and say things out of pure emotion without thinking. for the most part this is the greatest forum to talk about all things Texans, not to mention Hookem's outstanding TexansTalk.com :thumbup

one of the really great things is when fans of other teams access this site and expouse their opinions and usually a healthy dialouge insues, good bantering and everything special about being a fan of a NFL team. but I regress, the arguement seems to me not that if Casserly is a great GM but is he a good fit for this organization now :cool:

GP
09-22-2005, 04:56 PM
"...But when people express their opinion that a highly respected NFL GM is a "king of grease" and "insufferable a-hole", I don't have to respect the opinion. It is uneducated pap, IMHO." -- Double Barrel

---------------------------------------------

That's exactly why I posted this thread. It's one thing to say he's made some bad choices, but when someone makes a statement (as if it's FACT) that someone has NEVER done so and so.....or that someone will ALWAYS do so and so.....and it has to do with someone who's been in the GM game for a pretty long time, it goes to show that sometimes our emotions over recent draft picks and potentially "bust" draft picks can cause someone to overlook Casserly's overall track record. His overall record is not "awesome," but it IS solid to say the least. I think he's done a fairly good job, and the coaching is suspect right now.

I agree he's made some bad choices (Hollings, for starters). Nobody will make 100% star-quality picks, even when it seems like a sure-thing: Ryan Leaf, Heath Shuler, Ki-Jana Carter, Ron Dayne, Desmond Howard, etc. I think it's rather odd how sometimes the sure-thing is not sure, and it's actually intriguing to see those big time "busts" occur....course, I'm sure it's not so fun when you're the one who's a "bust," or when you drafted the bust. But hey, that's why I watch it and not work at it.

Hookem Horns
09-22-2005, 05:02 PM
link: Casserly selections (http://www.hailredskins.com/darfthistoryarticle.htm)

Just posting these two draft picks to at least make us realize that the guy is not some wacko who doesn't have the ability to see good value, as well as to make a few deals to get it done.

gpshafer,

The link you posted is page about how horrible the Redskins under Casserly drafted in the first round. Now I am really depressed.

You posted 2 good players (ok only one IF Arrington wasn't drafted by Casserly), however look at the rest, very brutal. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

beerlover
09-22-2005, 05:22 PM
I'm just not satisfied with breaking down what makes a great GM. Is it his track record or what has he done lately? What makes someone qualifed or better qualified? I'm still searching for someone with Texas ties (any suggestions?) but I saw this profile of Pete Carrol and it was just stunning the vast amount of experience he has & how he turned around programs (I'm one who think he got a raw deal in NE that the wheels were already set in motion and all Parcells did was bear the fruit-or was it really Bellichick? check this out-

YEAR-BY-YEAR WITH PETE CARROLL
YEAR TEAM POSITION RECORD (POST-SEASON) HEAD COACH
1974 Pacific Graduate assistant/wide receivers 6-5 Chester Caddas
1975 Pacific Graduate assistant/secondary 5-6-1 Chester Caddas
1976 Pacific Graduate assistant/secondary 2-9 Chester Caddas
1977 Arkansas Graduate assistant/secondary 11-1 (Orange) Lou Holtz
1978 Iowa State Secondary coach 8-4 (Hall of Fame) Earle Bruce
1979 Ohio State Secondary coach 11-1 (Rose) Earle Bruce
1980 North Carolina State Defensive coordinator/secondary coach 6-5 Monte Kiffin 1981 North Carolina State Defensive coordinator/secondary coach 4-7 Monte Kiffin
1982 North Carolina State Defensive coordinator/secondary coach 6-5 Monte Kiffin 1983 Pacific Asst. head coach/offensive coordinator 3-9 Bob Cope
1984 Buffalo Bills Defensive backs coach 2-14 Kay Stephenson
1985 Minnesota Vikings Defensive backs coach 7-9 Bud Grant
1986 Minnesota Vikings Defensive backs coach 9-7 Jerry Burns
1987 Minnesota Vikings Defensive backs coach 8-7* (2-1) Jerry Burns
1988 Minnesota Vikings Defensive backs coach 11-5* (1-1) Jerry Burns
1989 Minnesota Vikings Defensive backs coach 10-6** (0-1) Jerry Burns
1990 New York Jets Defensive coordinator 6-10 Bruce Coslet
1991 New York Jets Defensive coordinator 8-8* (0-1) Bruce Coslet
1992 New York Jets Defensive coordinator 4-12 Bruce Coslet
1993 New York Jets Defensive coordinator 8-8 Bruce Coslet
1994 New York Jets Head coach 6-10 -
1995 San Francisco 49ers Defensive coordinator 11-5** (0-1) George Seifert
1996 San Francisco 49ers Defensive coordinator 12-4** (1-1) George Seifert
1997 New England Patriots Head coach 10-6** (1-1) -
1998 New England Patriots Head coach 9-7* (0-1) -
1999 New England Patriots Head coach 8-8 -
2001 USC Head coach 6-6 (Las Vegas) -
2002 USC Head coach 11-2 (Orange) -
2003 USC Head coach 12-1# (Rose) -
2004 USC Head coach 13-0# (Orange) -
http://usctrojans.collegesports.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/carroll_pete00.html

and as far as the offense is concerned I've always subscribed to practice makes perfect, when asked "If this is the best offense since Pete Carroll has been a coach at USC"
"What I am happy about is that they are playing like they practiced. We have practiced really well for some time now. Spring football and fall camp, this is what we have been seeing and the whole idea of this coaching business is to get your guys to practice their stuff and in the game they perform it. Offensively that is what happened. We were able to execute the game plan that we went in with, and Matt has done a marvelous job of allowing everybody to do what they are supposed to do. He has been giving the right opportunity with the checks and the guys are making their plays. It is the best start we have had. I feel very fortunate that we have gotten off to a good start with the new staff. It is has only been two games; it will be a long haul."

rittenhouserobz
09-22-2005, 09:17 PM
I wish I could say that I have been around NFL players and that I have graded their abilities. Unfortunately, :) I get to grade them after they have been picked by the real GM. This is my disclaimer. All my comments about how good or bad a player is are based on a 2-dimensional picture over a 1000 miles away from the real action. This is the main reason I tend to have faith in the GM.

In hindsight, the second round picks or lack of them has seemed to have a tremendous effect on the team IMO.

here is the draft history (http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/teams/HST) for the Texans.

Draft History


2002
Rd Sel# Player Pos. School
1 1 David Carr QB Fresno State
2 33 Jabar Gaffney WR Florida
2 50 Chester Pitts G San Diego State
3 66 Fred Weary G Tennessee
3 83 Charles Hill NT Maryland
4 99 Jonathan Wells RB Ohio State
5 136 Jarrod Baxter FB New Mexico
5 153 Ramon Walker SS Pittsburgh
6 173 Demarcus Faggins CB Kansas State
6 190 Howard Green DT Louisiana State
7 229 Greg White DE Minnesota
7 261 Ahmad Miller DT Nevada-Las Vegas

2003
Rd Sel# Player Pos. School
1 3 Andre Johnson WR Miami
2 41 Bennie Joppru TE Michigan
3 67 Antwan Peek OLB Cincinnati
3 75 Seth Wand T N.W. Missouri
3 88 Dave Ragone QB Louisville
4 101 Domanick Davis RB Louisiana State
6 192 Drew Henson QB Michigan
6 214 Keith Wright DT Missouri
7 217 Curry Burns DB Louisville
7 233 Chance Pearce C Texas A&M

2004
Rd Sel# Player Pos. School
1 10 Dunta Robinson CB South Carolina
1 27 Jason Babin OLB Western Michigan
4 122 Glenn Earl SS Notre Dame
6 170 Vontez Duff DB Notre Dame
6 175 Jammal Lord DB Nebraska
6 200 Charlie Anderson OLB Mississippi
7 210 Raheem Orr LB Rutgers
7 211 Sloan Thomas WR Texas
7 248 B.J. Symons QB Texas Tech

2005
Houston
Rd Sel# Player Pos. Ht. Wt. School
1 16 Johnson, Travis DT 6-4 290 Florida State
3 73 Morency, Vernand RB 5-9 212 Oklahoma State
4 114 Mathis, Jerome WR 5-11 181 Hampton
5 151 Hodgdon, Drew C 6-3 309 Arizona State
6 188 Brown, Ceandris SS 6-0 208 Louisiana-Lafayette
7 227 Pettway, Kenneth OLB 6-4 255 Grambling State

Previous drafts were not perfect, but the 2005 draft gave us possibly 4 maybe 5 starters. I just hope we don't trade away our 2nd rounder this year unless it is really going to work. :goodnight

Hervoyel
09-22-2005, 09:35 PM
I'm just enjoying the "cycle" I'm seeing on the boards these days. Someone will toss up a post with all kinds of information claiming that Casserly is completely inept and then all those who agree with him will climb aboard for the ride. Later someone else will generate a post claiming that Charlie's record speaks for itself and that he's on the right track. Likewise all those agreeing answer in kind.

I don't personally think Casserly is anything special. You can find a dozen teams who have drafted as well as the Redskins did (or better) under Casserly during his time there and I think just like his drafts here he gets too much credit for his 1's followed by insane love for the rare late round steal. Most important though I see little evidence that he's had the same kind of (so called) success here that he had in Washington.

HJam72
09-22-2005, 10:04 PM
Someone will toss up a post with all kinds of information claiming that Casserly is completely inept and then all those who agree with him will climb aboard for the ride. Later someone else will generate a post claiming that Charlie's record speaks for itself and that he's on the right track. Likewise all those agreeing answer in kind.



I agree totally! If you agree too, then jump on board! :)

PS-Those of us who agree with everyone are always happy and fruitie. :ok:

Wolf
09-22-2005, 10:09 PM
At one time I had a list of the Ravens 1st rounders and who/what they became in the NFL world and whoever the GM is or was there. they had a great streak in getting players.

Hookem Horns
09-23-2005, 10:53 AM
You can find a dozen teams who have drafted as well as the Redskins did (or better) under Casserly during his time there and I think just like his drafts here he gets too much credit for his 1's followed by insane love for the rare late round steal. Most important though I see little evidence that he's had the same kind of (so called) success here that he had in Washington.

Actually, I posted his Washington drafts simply to show how bad they were. I was agreeing that his track record speaks for itself and it isn't saying much. gp also posted a link to show 1 or 2 good good players that Casserly drafted, however that page was written by a Redskins fan complaining about how bad the Skins have drafted over the last 10 years or so.

I only agreed that the track record speaks for itself. :cool:

lucky13
09-23-2005, 11:37 AM
At one time I had a list of the Ravens 1st rounders and who/what they became in the NFL world and whoever the GM is or was there. they had a great streak in getting players.

the ravens braintrust is ozzie newsome. he's the best in the league, but i doubt mcnair would hire someone like him.

GP
09-23-2005, 12:02 PM
At least I'm doing some homework and bringing some research into this board.

It gets tiring looking at everybody;s opinions and no facts or stats or history to back it up or rip it apart.

The links I provided do not entirely prove that Casserly is a wizard, and it wasn't my point to make him into a draft God.

However.....the main point of my post and my links to what I am saying is that Casserly is NOT a wacko who can't be trusted to be a GM.

Three rings. Nice deals to get what turned out to be quality players who are still quality players. Yeah, many other teams are also hitting about the same percentages as Casserly....but it's a little absurd for anybody to look at our busts and say, "Casserly is nuts. He stinks. Horrible." All those other teams have had plenty of busts, too, and it's just not an exact science for their profession. If it were, every team would finish 15-1 every season.

Point: Casserly is not nuts. He has a track record and trying to point to a few bad picks or deals to say that he's insane is insane in of itself.

beerlover
09-23-2005, 12:15 PM
the ravens braintrust is ozzie newsome. he's the best in the league, but i doubt mcnair would hire someone like him.

in your opinion lol:

I like Mark Clayton their 1st pick WR from Oklahoma, and at one time I liked Dan Cody until it was reported he had health concerns. Terry is a promising project type tackle as is Jason Brown a future Center/back-up. Justin Green is a back-up FB, Derek Anderson was released last week then picked up by another team and 7th rd pick from Texas Tech Mike Smith did not make the roster. overall a good draft but nothing to suggest as the best.

I have stated before that Casserly should have spent some free agent money on a legit #2 WR & Ozzie did aquire Derrick Mason of Titan fame so I do give him props for free agency signings.

lucky13
09-23-2005, 12:23 PM
gshafer-

can i assume you are too young to know who bobby beathard is, so you take that PR piece on cnnsi.com as objective journalism?

btw, it's also pretty comical for people to act like:

1) lavar arrington was some "steal" and

2) arrington has been anything but injured a large part of his career, for what it's worth

casserly has been directly involved with some of the biggest busts in the history of the draft, from heath shuler to michael westbrook to desmond howard. casserly would be in the hall of fame of bad drafting.

rdbrem
09-24-2005, 12:44 PM
I wish I could say that I have been around NFL players and that I have graded their abilities. Unfortunately, :) I get to grade them after they have been picked by the real GM. This is my disclaimer. All my comments about how good or bad a player is are based on a 2-dimensional picture over a 1000 miles away from the real action. This is the main reason I tend to have faith in the GM.

In hindsight, the second round picks or lack of them has seemed to have a tremendous effect on the team IMO.

here is the draft history (http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/teams/HST) for the Texans.

Draft History

2005
Houston
Rd Sel# Player Pos. Ht. Wt. School
1 16 Johnson, Travis DT 6-4 290 Florida State
3 73 Morency, Vernand RB 5-9 212 Oklahoma State
4 114 Mathis, Jerome WR 5-11 181 Hampton
5 151 Hodgdon, Drew C 6-3 309 Arizona State
6 188 Brown, Ceandris SS 6-0 208 Louisiana-Lafayette
7 227 Pettway, Kenneth OLB 6-4 255 Grambling State

Previous drafts were not perfect, but the 2005 draft gave us possibly 4 maybe 5 starters. I just hope we don't trade away our 2nd rounder this year unless it is really going to work. :goodnight

5 starters out of that draft will be tough. Pettway is gone, so all the rest have to become starters. We're not even playing Mathis or Hodgdon. Morency has been returning kicks only, so he's merely a replacement for Moses. He may have been in, but hasn't carried the ball. Also, I think you've got to factor in the acquisition of Buchanon, which has been a major disappointment.

What we need most was O-linemen. How many did we acquire?

TexansTrueFan
09-24-2005, 07:24 PM
[b]I swear the short-term attitude of this fairweather town just kills the team spirit in me. And after all those times that I've defended Houston sports fans as educated and dedicated. ;)


i feel ya........ :embarrass

beerlover
09-25-2005, 12:42 AM
i feel ya........ :embarrass

that's sick TTF..... :goodnight

Bassinguy
01-13-2006, 11:25 PM
I know Hookem, your from UT :texflag:

Its a sensitive subject to be sure but I for one feel that the Texans should be operated for & by Texans, this not a personel attack on Casserly he is an outstanding GM & highly respected but for Texans he always seemed like a fish out of water, I could be wrong (usually am) but he does not understand the Texans fanbase, the schools alums who have the money and spend the bucks for psl's and the like, so I really feel a change at some point will be needed. passing on Derrick Johnson makes me sick even if he "doesn't fit the 3-4" you make adjustments, you satisfy your paying customer.

I'm not one to complain without soultions, but I have to believe the next Texans organizational makeup will include more local flavor. the one truely great thing the Texans do have in their favor is our owner Mr. McNair, in McNair I trust not Casserly :texans:
I absolutely agree with you as far as Casserly is concerned. His "excellent history" mostly refers to being able to get draft choices signed without long holdouts and not nearly as much on the merits of the players chosen. I personally don't think he's qualified to make the choices that we'll have to live with long after he's gone. Unfortunately, Bob Mcnair didn't run him out with Capers. I think that will bite him on the butt. I thought passing on D Johnson was a mistake, also. Most quality HC's make an adjustment to their offenses or defenses to accomodate players of that caliber and make their system fit those players abilities. When they do that, they often wind up with instant impact players who otherwise might have been mediocre, at best. Just my opinion, of course. I'm hoping that someone other than Casserly has the final word on their picks in the draft and their off season player acquisitions. His last few have stunk up the stadium. I'm also hoping that we wind up with a local guy as HC. I believe Kubiak would do a great job.

HoustonFrog
01-13-2006, 11:34 PM
One thing no one is bringing up, or if they did, I have decided not to read the 20 posts, is that Bobby Bethard and Joe Gibbs were responsible for his most successful years and the minute they left he went into the tank and screwed them completely. He was run out of town because of this. He had a run of 1st round failures and was inept. He has done the same thing here starting with the expnsion draft and Tony Boselli. He has not been a success anywhere on his own.

TexansTrueFan
01-13-2006, 11:38 PM
that's sick TTF..... :goodnight


my bad but we do have a lot of support the team if they're winning but forget them if they're losing. i dont care how bad they may be i still support them.

Bassinguy
01-13-2006, 11:52 PM
i wont be one to jump on the fire casserly bandwagon ... yet. however, this offseason was pathetic. the personnel moves were atrocious across the board. letting glenn & sharper walk, throwing away draft picks on bust corner, failing to upgrade the O-line, using the first pick on a backup as opposed to the playmaker that by miracle alone fell in our lap, and the decisions after preseason just left everyone scratching their heads. it's hard to believe that a team could make so many bad moves in 5 seasons, let alone all at once.

BUT, i cant fault him for the pitiful state we're in right now. i firmly believe that if cowher or belichick's staffs had 2+ years with most of our draftees we'd have a very respectable squad and a playoff contender. my blame goes squarely on the coaches. look at many of the young players ... babin, peek, pitts, faggins, orr, wand, simmons, carr, etc. these guys have talent. they play hard and play as well as they can with what they're given, and along with vets like seth payne, todd wade, aaron glenn, jamie sharper, marcus coleman ... the team shouldnt have this much difficulty coming together. the transition from highschool to college, & college to pros is hard enough ... these guys are appearing to have to do it by themselves.Your assesment of Casserly's personnel moves during the last off season is correct. In four years, he still hasn't done anything to rectify the Boselli fiasco he made prior to season one. Carr still has to run for his life as a result. The Orlando Pace deal fell through, and he had all his eggs in that basket. I find it impossible to understand how he couldn't find a quality lineman for the left side in four years. I do agree that it's not all his fault, although he ultimately has to shoulder the blame. He hired Capers, when he should have looked at Capers overall record, or lack thereof. Capers was a great person, but not a great head coach. They do have enough talent to be competitive, but have had no motivation or training. Neither offensive coordinators had a bonafide attack plan and Fanzio's defensive schemes left a lot of holes that running backs poured through. Here's hoping the future is much brighter.

Bassinguy
01-14-2006, 12:02 AM
Actually, I posted his Washington drafts simply to show how bad they were. I was agreeing that his track record speaks for itself and it isn't saying much. gp also posted a link to show 1 or 2 good good players that Casserly drafted, however that page was written by a Redskins fan complaining about how bad the Skins have drafted over the last 10 years or so.

I only agreed that the track record speaks for itself. :cool:
Actually, his drafting talents in Washington weren't just bad; they were a debacle. He was run out on a rail when the owner woke up and realized it. The Redskins were a disaster when he left. It'll take several years to rectify that mess, but at least the owner had the intelligence to rehire a quality HC.

TexansTrueFan
01-14-2006, 12:14 AM
D. Rob, D. Davis, A. Johnnson, D. Carr >(over Joey H)<"thank god for that" J. Mathis, J. Gaffney, C. Pitts. Come on those arent to bad.

Big B Texan Fan
01-14-2006, 12:18 AM
Charlie has had 15 pix available to him in the 2nd and 3rd rounds in all of our drafts and has only gotten 1.5 starters worth a poop. Pitts and Peek. And Peek has done more harm than good this year as a starter.

TexansTrueFan
01-14-2006, 12:20 AM
Charlie has had 15 pix available to him in the 2nd and 3rd rounds in all of our drafts and has only gotten 1.5 starters worth a poop. Pitts and Peek. And Peek has done more harm than good this year as a starter.


forget D. Davis or J. Gaffney ? or J. Mathis ?

Big B Texan Fan
01-14-2006, 12:25 AM
D. Rob, D. Davis, A. Johnnson, D. Carr >(over Joey H)<"thank god for that" J. Mathis, J. Gaffney, C. Pitts. Come on those arent to bad.
It's hard to mess up the 1st rd especially when they're early in the 1st. As far as DD, Wells, Mathis, Earl, CC Brown, and maybe Faggins (if used as a nickel CB). Those guys are 2nd day pix. He's been great at those, it's his choices from rds 2-3 that are baffling. A total of 15 pix and only 2 starters. For a expansion team we should have had at least half of those turn out better for us.

Big B Texan Fan
01-14-2006, 12:27 AM
forget D. Davis or J. Gaffney ? or J. Mathis ?
DD and Mathis were 4th rounders. Gaffney is not anywhere near the WR they thought him to be. He'll start, not start, start again.......c'mon.

Big B Texan Fan
01-14-2006, 12:32 AM
We even had the chance to get Berrien, Carrs' go to guy in college. We passed on him and he's quite a good job in Chicago. He is one of their threats (a minor one but a threat none the less) and I believe they are in the playoffs. Hmmmmmm, why pass on a guy who your strugglin' QB would love to have. Guess he (casserly) still knows what he's doing.

Hookem Horns
01-14-2006, 12:33 AM
LOL, the title of this thread is even more funny now than it was back in September. Actually, as a Texans fan it is more scary than funny. Someone please wake me up and tell me this guy was fired last month and this is all a terrible nightmare. :sleep:

TexansTrueFan
01-14-2006, 12:35 AM
We even had the chance to get Berrien, Carrs' go to guy in college. We passed on him and he's quite a good job in Chicago. He is one of their threats (a minor one but a threat none the less) and I believe they are in the playoffs. Hmmmmmm, why pass on a guy who your strugglin' QB would love to have. Guess he (casserly) still knows what he's doing.


sorry if u think they are in the playoffs because of their offense than u are greatly mistaken.

Grid
01-14-2006, 01:27 AM
Ive never had an issue with Casserly's draft picks. I think he has done a very good job of bringing young talent onto this team.

It is FA where he has totally boned. I have a hard time thinking of ONE good FA move. THere may be a few in the first season.. but since then I cant think of any good FA prospects he has brought in... not any he has kept anyway.. and there is a long list of good players he has let go.

TexansTrueFan
01-14-2006, 01:28 AM
Ive never had an issue with Casserly's draft picks. I think he has done a very good job of bringing young talent onto this team.

It is FA where he has totally boned. I have a hard time thinking of ONE good FA move. THere may be a few in the first season.. but since then I cant think of any good FA prospects he has brought in... not any he has kept anyway.. and there is a long list of good players he has let go.


R. Smith and thats all

Big B Texan Fan
01-14-2006, 01:32 AM
:bag: sorry if u think they are in the playoffs because of their offense than u are greatly mistaken.
I know, I know......tust me, a femle in my Fantasy League had them and she tore us up. It was me and her in the SB and she whipped me.

Grid
01-14-2006, 01:39 AM
ahh..yah Smith was a good signing. But yah..other than him.. and we have signed ALOT of guys who are starting for us.. none of them have done a thing to help this team win.

TexansTrueFan
01-14-2006, 01:39 AM
:bag:
I know, I know......tust me, a femle in my Fantasy League had them and she tore us up. It was me and her in the SB and she whipped me.


it happens man i mean their D came out of nowhere and has suprised alot of people this year, maybe texans next year huh !?!?!?!?!?!?! :ok:

TexansTrueFan
01-14-2006, 01:42 AM
ahh..yah Smith was a good signing. But yah..other than him.. and we have signed ALOT of guys who are starting for us.. none of them have done a thing to help this team win.


helped us win first pick in the draft yay :redtowel:

aight tired going to sleep gotta be up in 3 hours. good night everyone

infantrycak
01-14-2006, 09:14 AM
We even had the chance to get Berrien, Carrs' go to guy in college. We passed on him and he's quite a good job in Chicago. He is one of their threats (a minor one but a threat none the less) and I believe they are in the playoffs. Hmmmmmm, why pass on a guy who your strugglin' QB would love to have. Guess he (casserly) still knows what he's doing.

Aah, the Berrien idea again. Not sure how this one is still being trotted out.

Two years in the NFL for Berrien--28 rec., 471 yds, 16 1st downs, 2 TD's vs. just last year for Jabar Gaffney--55 rec., 492 yds, 31 1st downs, 2 TD's. Ooh look, there is some grass on the other side of the fence.

Grid
01-14-2006, 09:18 AM
hehe.. I love Gaffney.. he gets my vote for "most underappreciated Texan"

Texans_Chick
01-14-2006, 10:17 AM
It is FA where he has totally boned. I have a hard time thinking of ONE good FA move. THere may be a few in the first season.. but since then I cant think of any good FA prospects he has brought in... not any he has kept anyway.. and there is a long list of good players he has let go.

FA is tough. Most really good FAs get kept by their teams if they are that valuable. And most quality FAs don't want to risk a finite career on an expansion team. Our most experienced best players came from the initial expansion draft, and some of them will be leaving in the short term because of age and injury.

We have a nice city to attract players to, no state income tax, a nice stadium, and lots of good players from Texas want to come back to the state, but unless you look like you are gonna be winning soon, it is hard to attract good FAs without overpaying them.

As for the good players we have let go, it is non suprising that a number of them thrive in systems better than ours and surrounded with players better than ours. You take any good player, and surround them with more talent and a cohesive system, and they are going to play better as part of a better team. It is hard to say if we had kept Foley or McCree or any number of players, they would have had made much of a difference to our 2-14.

I don't mean to be a CC apologist or anything, but I have to say that I am extremely empathetic to any GM trying to put together a team from scratch with a hard cap, teams understanding the FA market better and being able to keep their better players, and just the development time it takes with rookies--whose development is the key to having a better team.

People say in retrospect, we should took this guy or kept that guy, but there is no saying how those players would do with a team with as little depth as ours. And depth takes time.