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rocka21
09-11-2005, 04:54 PM
down by 2 tds.

you punt on 4th and inches in the fourth quarter.

then punt again.



Please, someone, anyone give me a GOOD answer!

How many coaches in the NFL or High school even would have punt right there? What are you playing the game for if not to win.

I know there are some people that know football out there..........
Am I wrong?

toronado
09-11-2005, 04:57 PM
How many coaches in the NFL or High school even would have punt right there?
?[/QUOTE]

virtually all of them?

I'm no fan of the coaching but weren't we fairly deep in our own end? Punting seemed like a no-brainer IMHO. There was too much time left to get desperate.

BuffSoldier
09-11-2005, 04:59 PM
virtually all of them?

I'm no fan of the coaching but weren't we fairly deep in our own end? Punting seemed like a no-brainer IMHO. There was too much time left to get desperate.


Hell no they wouldnt. Its 4th and 3 with 5:00 left and you're down by 15. Stop beign so damn scared.

Goldeagle
09-11-2005, 05:00 PM
A good reason?

We did not get a lot of work in pre season on Punt coverage?? :)

toronado
09-11-2005, 05:01 PM
are you sure there was only 5 minutes left? I thought it was closer to 10..

bpergrem3
09-11-2005, 05:02 PM
We had a better chance scoring with our defense than with our offense today.

Goldeagle
09-11-2005, 05:02 PM
We had a better chance scoring with our defense than with our offense today.


LOL, just ask Peek

Elite
09-11-2005, 05:04 PM
why punt we answer we have a qb that cant pass worth a lick.

touttail
09-11-2005, 05:09 PM
are you sure there was only 5 minutes left? I thought it was closer to 10..


It was 5 minutes and some change. The TV comentator even said he couldn't believe we were punting the game errr ball away.

bobby 119C :homer:

Crank_It_Up
09-11-2005, 05:20 PM
...I'm no fan of the coaching but weren't we fairly deep in our own end? Punting seemed like a no-brainer IMHO. There was too much time left to get desperate.ok, lets put it like this... chances you can make the first down = 25%

chances you can punt and win the game with an exahausted defense, down by 15 points, and 5 minutes left in the game = 0%

get it now?

toronado
09-11-2005, 05:37 PM
ok, ok.. I thought there was more time left than that. jeez..

5 minutes left down by 15 we should have went although I think our chances of making it were closer to 2.5% than 25% LOL.

Crank_It_Up
09-11-2005, 05:45 PM
ok, ok.. I thought there was more time left than that. jeez..

5 minutes left down by 15 we should have went although I think our chances of making it were closer to 2.5% than 25% LOL.lol, I might have gotten carried away with the 25%

gtexan02
09-11-2005, 06:10 PM
Post it here:

I vote for the play when Carr hit Gaffney in the right elbow. I think Gaffney was just assuming Carr would be sacked and didn't bother even checking the play.

COOL V
09-11-2005, 06:12 PM
When they walked out onto the field!!!

Capster67
09-11-2005, 06:12 PM
There were so many embarassing plays, but I would have to agree. This game put the franchise back five years (and we are only 4 years old!!!)

AlexVanderpool
09-11-2005, 06:13 PM
Punting the ball on 4th and 1, down by 15 points, with 6 minutes left in the game.

swtbound07
09-11-2005, 06:14 PM
corey bradford dropping a bomb that fell from the heavens unto him

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 06:14 PM
He certainly didn't look like he was expecting the ball, but then again he hasn't been available that much for the preseason practices. We keep Hollings instead of another WR. None of our receivers really know how to get open.......................... May be we need to hire Rice to instruct our WR's. Might be a great move. OOPS we might have to get rid of a coach. On second thought, I guess we couldn't do that because it would upset the apple cart.....................

Vinny
09-11-2005, 06:15 PM
Punting the ball on 4th and 1, down by 15 points, with 6 minutes left in the game.
We were on our own 33. I don't blame them for punting. We still had a shot at the win if we hold them and score and get the onside. If we don't convert, the game is over right there. They are already in field position.

Wolf
09-11-2005, 06:15 PM
delay of game at the 2 drove me nuts. luckily we scored still but it was a stupid penalty

ccdude730
09-11-2005, 06:19 PM
Punting the ball on 4th and 1, down by 15 points, with 6 minutes left in the game.

i think it was more like 4th and 2cm. no confidence in the offense, and when the defense gets abused we act like we have confidence in them!

embarassing play of the day: simmons getting his ankles broken. next time he better not try to shake him. STICK HIM!

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 06:20 PM
How about Payne who has the ball in front of him being off-side 3 or 4 times.

Hervoyel
09-11-2005, 06:21 PM
We were on our own 33. I don't blame them for punting. We still had a shot at the win if we hold them and score and get the onside. If we don't convert, the game is over right there. They are already in field position.


Yeah I see your point but honestly, if you can't get a yard when it's do or die then you should just head for the locker room right then and there. After what I'd seen prior to that the Texans needed to make a statement on that down. They needed to say "This stops right here" and get that first down. Instead they said "Ok, we're done." and kicked it away.

Vinny
09-11-2005, 06:24 PM
Yeah I see your point but honestly, if you can't get a yard when it's do or die then you should just head for the locker room right then and there. After what I'd seen prior to that the Texans needed to make a statement on that down. They needed to say "This stops right here" and get that first down. Instead they said "Ok, we're done." and kicked it away.We got the ball back and Carr threw another pick. Score and we have a shot...but we threw a pick. A FG at that point puts the Bills up 3 scores. No shot at all.

PapaL
09-11-2005, 06:24 PM
How about Payne who has the ball in front of him being off-side 3 or 4 times.

This is my vote. I mean YOUR LOOKING AT THE FREAKING BALL! Its right in front of your face.

thegr8fan
09-11-2005, 06:27 PM
most embarrassing play of the day was our ***** of a QB deciding he was going to throw the ball to AJ even though he was double covered from the snap and putting so much arch on the ball that the double coverage didn't have to intercept it because the safety, which made triple coverage, had enough time to run in and make the interception.

That had to be the best example of Carr's lack of mental ability to play as a starting QB.

Embarrassing isn't even harsh enough of a term for that dumb play.

daiges7
09-11-2005, 06:28 PM
We were on our own 33. I don't blame them for punting. We still had a shot at the win if we hold them and score and get the onside.

Yeah, because the parlay of scoring, recovering the onside (15% chance?) and scoring again is better than converting a 4th and 3 and going from there.... The call sucked.

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 06:30 PM
We got the ball back and Carr threw another pick. Score and we have a shot...but we threw a pick. A FG at that point puts the Bills up 3 scores. No shot at all.

Look at the play and ask if the receiver went to the ball or waited for it to come to him. Our receivers do not know how to play football period. Its how they are coached. They were constantly commenting on Losman's receivers coming back to the ball. The Texan's receivers don't do that. You are giving the defenders an unfair advantage if you don't go back to the ball. Oh, I forgot once again we have to give the other defense a chance because we are so superior defensively.

Vinny
09-11-2005, 06:31 PM
what play? I'm discussing a punt.

COOL V
09-11-2005, 06:33 PM
Does this mean that David Carr's Rookie Card is worthless??? Prediction:
Pittsburgh 38 Texans 10 That's if they spot us 7 points What is Capers always writing on the sidelines??? Grocery List??? This weeks excuse??? ENQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 06:34 PM
what play? I'm discussing a punt.

Sorry, I didn't know throwing a pick is punting the ball............

Vinny
09-11-2005, 06:34 PM
Yeah, because the parlay of scoring, recovering the onside (15% chance?) and scoring again is better than converting a 4th and 3 and going from there.... The call sucked.not converting the 4th when your opponent is in field position is the dumb call. The punt gave us a chance to win. A stop and the game is over at the 5 min mark.

TigerBait
09-11-2005, 06:36 PM
Peek dropping a INT thrown right to him, that would have been 6 and would have kept us into the game.

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 06:36 PM
Does this mean that David Carr's Rookie Card is worthless??? Prediction:
Pittsburgh 38 Texans 10 That's if they spot us 7 points What is Capers always writing on the sidelines??? Grocery List??? This weeks excuse??? ENQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW

IF WE HAD ONLY EXECUTED and the other team hadn't showed up we might have won the ball game.................

PapaL
09-11-2005, 06:36 PM
What is Capers always writing on the sidelines??? Grocery List??? This weeks excuse??? ENQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW

Milk
Eggs
Left Tackle
Bread
O Cordinator
Ham
Facial Expressions ( I swear he looks lost out there)
cheese
notebook

thegr8fan
09-11-2005, 06:38 PM
A stop and the game is over at the 5 min mark. uh, don't look now, but the Game WAS over at the 5 min. mark

Having said that, I agree with you Vinny, and hindsight is 20/20. The smart thing to do was punt the ball at that point.

J-Storm
09-11-2005, 06:38 PM
not converting the 4th when your opponent is in field position is the dumb call. The punt gave us a chance to win. A stop and the game is over at the 5 min mark.

Anyone with half an idea can see your point Vinny, I know I can but then I look at it this way as well (I'm a Libra so I have to balance it out, what can I say?)... If we can't convert a 4th and 1cm for instance in a season opener (no matter where we are on the field), then what do we do if it's week 17 and we end up same position with a playoff spot on the line??? Doesn't give us much hope from where I sit... again there is pro's and con's to both arguments...JMO is all

COOL V
09-11-2005, 06:40 PM
You forgot the D Coordinator and see if the Carolina Job is still available. Take him back Carolina please.

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 06:42 PM
Milk
Eggs
Left Tackle
Bread
O Cordinator
Ham
Facial Expressions ( I swear he looks lost out there)
cheese
notebook

The facial expression is almost scary because it looks like he really is totaly at a loss. It's amazing how many people have noticed this and yet I have been talking about how frozen and indecisive he is. I honestly believe its an inherant trait and has nothing to do with him as a person. People who are prolific note takers and who are so driven by minute detail are often incapable of making decisions on the fly. Capers is simply not a leader and never will be. He is a good man, but he shouldn't be leading this ball club.

Vinny
09-11-2005, 06:44 PM
Anyone with half an idea can see your point Vinny, I know I can but then I look at it this way as well (I'm a Libra so I have to balance it out, what can I say?)... If we can't convert a 4th and 1cm for instance in a season opener (no matter where we are on the field), then what do we do if it's week 17 and we end up same position with a playoff spot on the line??? Doesn't give us much hope from where I sit... again there is pro's and con's to both arguments...JMO is allI've watched football for parts of 4 decades and I will safely say that going for a 4th down while in your opponents field position isn't too common. There was time to win the game by playing good defense and scoring when you get the ball back, but we got th ball back and threw a pick. Get a TD there (instead of a pick) and we have a shot to win still. If we don't pick up the 4th we are 3 scores down instead of 2 and the game is over with 6 mins left. If we had 3 mins on the clock at that point I understand, but not with 5:55 left in the game.

COOL V
09-11-2005, 06:49 PM
Sorry J-Storm, but in week 17 there won't be a playoff spot on the line unless San Francisco kicks it up a notch and the rest of the NFC Teams all lose. I don't see them having that going for them right now, it sure won't be our spot on the line.

J-Storm
09-11-2005, 06:50 PM
You make a great point really and I see it easily. All I'm sayin' is I think (and this applies to other teams not just ours) the playcalling is way too conservative. The idea is possession and using that possession to score. You can't do that by punting on every 4th and ever-so-close... And ok we got the ball back and still threw a pick, but if you can't trust your team with time on the clock, how do you trust them with the clock moving against you...doesn't make sense to me...

J-Storm
09-11-2005, 06:52 PM
Sorry J-Storm, but in week 17 there won't be a playoff spot on the line unless San Francisco kicks it up a notch and the rest of the NFC Teams all lose. I don't see them having that going for them right now, it sure won't be our spot on the line.

Ha ha ha, good point, I was just using a hypothetical situation was all. I'm a realist unlike a few here and I'll be happy if we get away with 1 more win than last yr. I'm not counting on playoffs 'til next yr at earliest...

AlexVanderpool
09-11-2005, 06:55 PM
We were on our own 33. I don't blame them for punting. We still had a shot at the win if we hold them and score and get the onside. If we don't convert, the game is over right there. They are already in field position.

true, we were on our own 33, by punting the coaching staff destroyed the already meak confidence of the offense. did you see our next series, or lack there of?

PapaL
09-11-2005, 06:56 PM
The facial expression is almost scary because it looks like he really is totaly at a loss. It's amazing how many people have noticed this and yet I have been talking about how frozen and indecisive he is. I honestly believe its an inherant trait and has nothing to do with him as a person. People who are prolific note takers and who are so driven by minute detail are often incapable of making decisions on the fly. Capers is simply not a leader and never will be. He is a good man, but he shouldn't be leading this ball club.

It would almost have to be inheretied. Even in Carolina he never seemed like a coach that players rallied around. They were good because of all the veterns on that team that rallied the team. Here its becoming apperant that he is the problem as the HC. I really wouldnt mind seeing him as a DC. I just think he his overwhelmed as the HC.

COOL V
09-11-2005, 06:56 PM
I'm sorry I had to throw that in there. I hope for the best for my Texans and it kills me when we have so much potential, but keep coming up short. I thought Bob Mcnair was a business man, A Winner. Who knows, maybe he's tending to his horses. I hate having my football season end in December Year after Year.

Vinny
09-11-2005, 06:57 PM
true, we were on our own 33, by punting the coaching staff destroyed the already meak confidence of the offense. did you see our next series, or lack there of?You don't build confidence by taking risks that totally guarantee you losing the game in one play if it doesn't work out. If that play fails the game is over with 6 mins left. Punting keeps the game alive for the team.

baytoniantexan
09-11-2005, 07:01 PM
Do you think they could do that again if they tried?
Embarrassing!!!!

AlexVanderpool
09-11-2005, 07:02 PM
You don't build confidence by taking risks that totally guarantee you losing the game in one play if it doesn't work out. If that play fails the game is over with 6 mins left. Punting keeps the game alive for the team.

conventionally, you never go for it on 4 down in your own territory, but in a game where you are down 2 touchdowns with 6 minutes to go and your offense needs momentum more than anything not to mention that the opposing team has one of the best RBs and OLs in the league to effectively eat up clock, YOU GO FOR IT!!!

Grid
09-11-2005, 07:04 PM
We were on our own 33. I don't blame them for punting. We still had a shot at the win if we hold them and score and get the onside. If we don't convert, the game is over right there. They are already in field position.


I still dont agree with it Vinny. Our defense had been on the field way too much and were obviously tired. On top of that, we had been handing McGahee yards hand over fist.

Just seemed like a bad move.. of course.. our offense was sucking wind as well, so I dont blame Capers for not trusting them to get the 1st either.

run-david-run
09-11-2005, 07:10 PM
You don't build confidence by taking risks that totally guarantee you losing the game in one play if it doesn't work out. If that play fails the game is over with 6 mins left. Punting keeps the game alive for the team.

We had 107 yds of offense and 7 points in 54 minutes. If anything, go for it on 4th down as a symbolic gesture that we will keep trying, you and me both know the game is over at that point, but at least give your offense one defining play where they can make something happen. I mean, when you go for it in the first quarter and make it, you establish yourself as a risk-taking team, then not going for it when you needed a touchdown to maintain any illusion of a comeback, you take the ball out of Carr's hands and hand it back to Buffalo, who, by the way, were close to our 33 within about 4 plays..... :bomb:

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 07:11 PM
You don't build confidence by taking risks that totally guarantee you losing the game in one play if it doesn't work out. If that play fails the game is over with 6 mins left. Punting keeps the game alive for the team.

Vinny do you honestly believe that when the other team has a very good running back and have offensively dominated you in time and possession the whole day. The only way you were going to win the game was to keep the drive going and score a TD and then you might still have to do an onside kick to retain possession. If we were one touchdown down, then I would agree with you, but not two TD's down particularly when we play a bend and don't break defense. We had yet pressured Losman the whole game. That's loosing football at that point. The game was already lost and you are talking about not loosing. We really do have very different points of view and I think I have been watching longer than your 4 decades. After all I got to watch Gifford and YA Titel and then there was Van Brocklin with Philadelphia and Golden Hair QB with Detroit. Oh, well history does have its players, but we are talking now and not then. Cleveland had a running back by the name of Jimmy Brown too. Fact is I had an uncle way back when that played I believe it was for St Louis who later became the LA Rams and then back to St Louis. At least I though that was the way it was. May be I'm getting sennial.

Anyway I agree with most who are posting that we needed to give our offense a chance to build their confidence. They might not have made it, but at least they would have gone done trying. They would have known that they would have at least had a chance, rather than dying on the bench wondering what would have happened if they would have gone for it.

Vinny
09-11-2005, 07:13 PM
We had 107 yds of offense and 7 points in 54 minutes. If anything, go for it on 4th down as a symbolic gesture that we will keep trying, You don't make symbolic gestures when you can still win the game. Oye. Not punting with 6 mins left in a 2 score game while you are in your opponents field goal position is just dumb football.

I've said my peace on this one. You guys can bash the call till you feel better. Have fun.

:ok:

knbjr40
09-11-2005, 07:53 PM
I agree with this post.It makes no sense to punt when you need 2 scores and there's only 5 min. left.Thats giving up in my book.Who cares where we were on the field at that point in the game.

Texans Pride
09-11-2005, 08:03 PM
It was 5 minutes and some change. The TV comentator even said he couldn't believe we were punting the game errr ball away.

bobby 119C :homer:

I heard that too. He also said, "Is it me, or do the Texans always run on 1st down"

Porky
09-11-2005, 08:11 PM
Put me down in the "go for it" camp. I think the punt is defensible, but incomprehensible, given the circumestances. Unlike Vinny, I think the only chance they had was to go for it. When they punted, they basically surrerendered. With an ordinary offense on an ordinary day, I would have punted too. But, on this day, with this team, at this time, to me it was a no brainer to go for it.

Elite
09-11-2005, 08:16 PM
My favorite play call was 2 and 20 and its a hand off for 2 yards lol.

eriadoc
09-11-2005, 08:21 PM
My gut reaction was "Go for it!" when it was 4th and inches. Realistically, if he had gone for it and they didn't convert, he would have been blasted far worse. And most of y'all would have been right on the bandwagon blasting him. I totally identify with the thought that if you can't make 3 inches on a play, then go to the locker room now. However, the offense had given zero indication to that point that they could make the three inches (nor at any point thereafter, for that matter).

I really, really, really (I could type that a few more times) have a problem with the playcalling. I have pointed out playcalling flaws for the past few years that they just keep committing. Whoever it is that keeps deciding on draw plays on 2nd down, after losing yardage on 1st down, needs to be fired. NOW. A draw on 2nd and 10 .... MAYBE. 2nd and 20? No way. Especially when you factor in our O-line woes. One of our more successful plays is that little quick hit to AJ where he gets four to eight yards, on a pretty consistent basis, it seems. I don't think they called that play until the second half. And I'm not sure if anyone in the coaching staff has noticed, but that play doesn't work when you throw it to Bradford. Stop it, really.

/rant off

Vinny
09-11-2005, 08:23 PM
Whoever it is that keeps deciding on draw plays on 2nd down, after losing yardage on 1st down, needs to be fired. NOW. A draw on 2nd and 10 .... MAYBE. 2nd and 20? No way. Especially when you factor in our O-line woes. You may want to fire Carr then. I think that was an audible by Carr.

eriadoc
09-11-2005, 08:36 PM
You may want to fire Carr then. I think that was an audible by Carr.

Actually, if it's anything like it was the last couple seasons, Carr is not allowed to audible out to anything but a subset of plays, based on what he observes at the line of srimmage. So if he lines up on certan pass plays, he only has one run audible available to him. This subject has come up before and been beaten to death.

Whoever "sets" those audibles for Carr and limits him from doing anything creative at the line (not that he's capable; we don't know) is the culprit here.

ccdude730
09-11-2005, 08:42 PM
You may want to fire Carr then. I think that was an audible by Carr.
i mean why would you change to a draw in that situation. theyve got bookoos of formations for every play so why not try to throw off the defense. try something instead of changing things to runs. this offense looked almost unstopable the 1st 2 games of the preseason. all i can say now is wtf

i even remember complementing the offense in preseason for audibles to pass. this may seem like an ignorant comment but i see every team with guys wide open, why cant we have 1 frippin guy open from time to time.

:crying: <-- thats what i feel like doing

ccdude730
09-11-2005, 08:48 PM
Actually, if it's anything like it was the last couple seasons, Carr is not allowed to audible out to anything but a subset of plays, based on what he observes at the line of srimmage. So if he lines up on certan pass plays, he only has one run audible available to him. This subject has come up before and been beaten to death.

Whoever "sets" those audibles for Carr and limits him from doing anything creative at the line (not that he's capable; we don't know) is the culprit here.
if thats true, that is rediculous. carr has been here from day 1 and he should know the playbook like the back of his hand. someone needs to be beaten unconscious.

BradK10
09-11-2005, 09:32 PM
I think by far the most embarassing play of the game was that pass that hit Gaffney in the freakin' arm.

That pretty much sums up this team I think.

AndreJ
09-11-2005, 09:34 PM
I think by far the most embarassing play of the game was that pass that hit Gaffney in the freakin' arm.

That pretty much sums up this team I think.
:tv: h@!

Runner
09-11-2005, 09:36 PM
Actually, if it's anything like it was the last couple seasons, Carr is not allowed to audible out to anything but a subset of plays, based on what he observes at the line of srimmage. So if he lines up on certan pass plays, he only has one run audible available to him. This subject has come up before and been beaten to death.

Whoever "sets" those audibles for Carr and limits him from doing anything creative at the line (not that he's capable; we don't know) is the culprit here.

I'm not a big Carr basher, but I noticed this last year. This is why I'm uncertain about Carr's leadership. I think if he'd audible to plays he wants to run, instead of what he's "allowed" to audible to, he'd fire up his team and assume a status of leadership beyond, 'he's the QB".

Bubbajwp
09-11-2005, 09:40 PM
Post it here:

I vote for the play when Carr hit Gaffney in the right elbow. I think Gaffney was just assuming Carr would be sacked and didn't bother even checking the play.
lol: and true :crying:

utahmark
09-11-2005, 10:42 PM
We got the ball back and Carr threw another pick. Score and we have a shot...but we threw a pick. A FG at that point puts the Bills up 3 scores. No shot at all.


there was about 1min 30 left and we were on our 20 yard line when carr threw his last pick. the game is over when we punt with 6 min left.

Vinny
09-11-2005, 10:47 PM
there was about 1min 30 left and we were on our 20 yard line when carr threw his last pick. the game is over when we punt with 6 min left.We got the ball back with two mins left. It's still not sound football to go for it on 4th down at your own 33 when within two scores and 6 mins left.

4-3-HST 33 (5:55) 7-C.Stanley punts 37 yards to BUF 30, Center-48-B.Pittman, out of bounds.

Buffalo Bills at 5:47
1-10-BUF 30 (5:47) 21-W.McGahee up the middle to BUF 41 for 11 yards (42-M.Coleman). R19
1-10-BUF 41 (5:05) 21-W.McGahee up the middle to BUF 43 for 2 yards (91-S.Payne).
2-8-BUF 43 (4:22) 20-S.Williams left guard to BUF 45 for 2 yards (91-S.Payne, 93-J.Babin).
3-6-BUF 45 (3:38) 7-J.Losman pass to 80-E.Moulds to HST 48 for 7 yards (23-D.Robinson). Caught at HST 49, right side. P20
1-10-HST 48 (2:54) 20-S.Williams right guard to HST 47 for 1 yard (96-G.Walker, 52-K.Wong). HST-G.Walker injured on play, walks off.
2-9-HST 47 (2:36) 20-S.Williams up the middle to HST 44 for 3 yards (42-M.Coleman).
Timeout #2 by HST at 02:24.
3-6-HST 44 (2:24) 20-S.Williams right guard to HST 42 for 2 yards (91-S.Payne, 52-K.Wong).
Timeout #3 by HST at 02:20.
4-4-HST 42 (2:20) 8-B.Moorman punts 40 yards to HST 2, Center-54-M.Schneck, downed by BUF-15-G.Wilson.
PENALTY on BUF-33-J.Greer, Illegal Shift, 5 yards, enforced at HST 42 - No Play.
4-9-HST 47 (2:02) 8-B.Moorman punts 35 yards to HST 12, Center-54-M.Schneck, fair catch by 31-P.Buchanon.
Two-Minute Warning

Houston Texans at 1:53
1-10-HST 12 (1:53) 8-D.Carr right end ran ob at HST 15 for 3 yards.
2-7-HST 15 (1:46) (Shotgun) 8-D.Carr pass incomplete. Thrown away after pressure: C.Kelsay.
3-7-HST 15 (1:40) (Shotgun) 8-D.Carr left end ran ob at HST 25 for 10 yards. R12
1-10-HST 25 (1:33) (Shotgun) 8-D.Carr pass incomplete to 80-A.Johnson (22-N.Clements). Receiver and coverage at BUF 48, left side.
2-10-HST 25 (1:27) (Shotgun) 8-D.Carr pass intended for 81-M.Murphy INTERCEPTED by 36-L.Milloy at 50. 36-L.Milloy to 50 for no gain (81-M.Murphy). Coverage over middle.

htownhitman
09-11-2005, 11:28 PM
if you punt or if you don't. The game was was over at that point. I know, it's not really over, but our chances of winning were probably less than 5%.

The Gaffney GAFFE was the most embarrassing.

By the way, how many times have Bradford/Gaffney been shut out in a game? I mean, I actually forget these guys even play for us...

Ibar_Harry
09-11-2005, 11:46 PM
Actually, if it's anything like it was the last couple seasons, Carr is not allowed to audible out to anything but a subset of plays, based on what he observes at the line of srimmage. So if he lines up on certan pass plays, he only has one run audible available to him. This subject has come up before and been beaten to death.

Whoever "sets" those audibles for Carr and limits him from doing anything creative at the line (not that he's capable; we don't know) is the culprit here.

Montana was effective because he was allowed to do his own play calling including making them up at the end of the game. What you have are control freaks controlling this ball club. These are the plays you run period. We know what's best. Ah, coach this is what they are doing. No, the game films show they don't do that. Read my lips this is what you are to do. But coach that won't work based on the way the defense is lining up. I said run the play or else.

While I'm being a cynical I'm afraid this is very close to the truth. Capers want's control of everything down to the nats eye brow. It might be Palmer as well. Whatever the case they both need to go right now. Then we might have a team in place by next year.

HoustonHarley
09-11-2005, 11:52 PM
I've watched football for parts of 4 decades and I will safely say that going for a 4th down while in your opponents field position isn't too common. There was time to win the game by playing good defense and scoring when you get the ball back, but we got th ball back and threw a pick. Get a TD there (instead of a pick) and we have a shot to win still. If we don't pick up the 4th we are 3 scores down instead of 2 and the game is over with 6 mins left. If we had 3 mins on the clock at that point I understand, but not with 5:55 left in the game.


You can watch football until your blue in the face, but after playing football for better than a decade, I can tell you that you could not be more wrong. Let me ask you this. If your Coach doesn't have the confidence to go for it in that situation, then what confidence are you going to have in him the rest of the year? Capers totally threw in the towel at that point and guess what....so did the rest of the team. This team was not prepared for this game and that is the bottomline. No more excuses, just results!

As far as the thread question, I would say the Gaffney pass. At the same time, he had already given up as well. Believe me or not, but this team has no confidence in its Coaches. I honestly think that was a big reason for the Glenn and Sharper releases. If you think we replaced them with equally talented players, you are dead wrong. It may have appeared that way, but we will continue to see medicore play from their replacements.

Vinny
09-11-2005, 11:59 PM
how often has anyone ever seen a football team go for it on 4th and 3 (inside the opponents field goal range) down only two scores with 6 mins left in a game? Rarely....I have probably never seen it happen. If I have (and don't recall) its been once or twice in 3 decades. Go down 3 scores right there the games over.

COOL V
09-12-2005, 12:20 AM
Well we might as well start taking chances rather than run with our tails between our legs. Capers won't have it, he's toooooo conservative. Even if his job is on the line. Like I said before, get me Gary Kubiak on the phone. Denver has had him too long. Let's start Fresh.

HoustonHarley
09-12-2005, 12:30 AM
how often has anyone ever seen a football team go for it on 4th and 3 (inside the opponents field goal range) down only two scores with 6 mins left in a game? Rarely....I have probably never seen it happen. If I have (and don't recall) its been once or twice in 3 decades. Go down 3 scores right there the games over.

It must have occured in those "parts of 4 decades" that you weren't watching. THE GAME WAS OVER WHEN THEY PUNTED! No more confidence, means you lose.

Vinny
09-12-2005, 12:37 AM
probably, but I'm not being sarcastic. I think 6 mins at that end of the field is too much time to throw away the game if you can't convert.

HoustonHarley
09-12-2005, 12:39 AM
Ok I give. We will agree to disagree. My only fear is that lack of confidence doesn't carry over to next week. I guess we will see.

Vinny
09-12-2005, 12:43 AM
I respect your opinion on this - I just don't agree with it. I may well be in the minority on this....it doesn't bother me much though. I'm ok with that ;)

HJam72
09-12-2005, 12:45 AM
About the Gaffney drop:

Is it just me, or was he not looking because he knew it was too early in his particular route to get the ball thrown to him? I got the impression that Carr saw pressure (as always) and just rifled toward Gaff, hoping he'd happen to see it coming. He was running straight up the field and still had both safeties still in front of him. I don't think these players are stupid. They just have a weak, weak, weak O-line.

HoustonHarley
09-12-2005, 12:53 AM
That may be true, but you if you have played on this offense for 3 years now, you know you have to look back to help the QB who has been running for his life the entire time you have been here.

BREAZE
09-12-2005, 01:06 AM
Under 6 min down by 2 TDs. Going for it on 4th down and not converting is the same as punting. The offense was struggling to make things happen and with time running out you toss conservitism out the window and take a shot. There comes a point when there is nothing to lose and they were at that point. Nobody is saying they would of threatened had they got a 1st down. The fact is winning programs understand risks and take shots when deemed necessary.

Punting was the same as throwing in the towl...

kcwilson
09-12-2005, 01:06 AM
About the Gaffney drop:

Is it just me, or was he not looking because he knew it was too early in his particular route to get the ball thrown to him?

I think what you saw was Gaffney not knowing what was going on since he was out of camp... Almost as if he thought the route was another 5-10 yards. That was the one time Carr had no pressure, and I remember thinking that as soon as I saw him throw it with confidence. If you see the replay, you will see Carr's reaction which is like, what is he doing?

Overall it is an OL problem, I think Capers is gone after week 5. The personnal on teh team is all messed up and I don't see great changes being made until at least 2 years from now.

DOES ANYONE THINK THE TEAM IS A PLAYOFF TEAM IN THE NEXT TWO YEARS?

Then again, maybe we are entering the Matt Leinart lottery early?

aphia1996
09-12-2005, 01:07 AM
The most embarassing play to me was when Jabar didn't even look back and the ball hit his arm...all he had to do is look in for one second!!!

Most embarasing coaching move was the punt with around 5 min. left and they punt....what kind of message are you sending to the players? WE SUCK and WE DON'T HAVE ANY HEART SO LETS JUST THROW IN THE GAME RIGHT NOW!!!

making a list of bad plays:

....5 false starts by the Defense???? I don't get that one! That is just poor coaching, PERIOD!!!
....Running on first down every single ..........YOU ADD THE WORDS HERE!.....time we had a first down.
----Corey, you only get about 5 chances a game please make them count the ball hit you in the hands and numbers..CATCH IT!!!


.....NO HEART!!! The Texans had no heart and it waw painfully clear watching them today!

Those are just my views on it!

Geaux Texans,

James H.
Houston, Texas

kcwilson
09-12-2005, 01:09 AM
Under 6 min down by 2 TDs. Going for it on 4th down and not converting is the same as punting. The offense was struggling to make things happen and with time running out you toss conservitism out the window and take a shot. There comes a point when there is nothing to lose and they were at that point. Nobody is saying they would of threatened had they got a 1st down. The fact is winning programs understand risks and take shots when deemed necessary.

Punting was the same as throwing in the towl...


Totally agree, we had nothing to lose at that point... Sometimes the coaches need to be a little more confident and aggressive to fire the team up, which showed no emotion today (Cowher, for example).

Since running wasn't all that effective, a play action boot leg with AJ coming across the middle on top of a rolled out TE might have been good. Worse case, Carr should throw it up for an interception a few yards down the field, close to a bad punt.

Hottoddie
09-12-2005, 01:09 AM
I've just got one word to say.

PATHETIC!!!

BREAZE
09-12-2005, 01:11 AM
DOES ANYONE THINK THE TEAM IS A PLAYOFF TEAM IN THE NEXT TWO YEARS?

Yes, but only if McNair brings in leadership that are proven winners...(ie, ice on the fingers)

eriadoc
09-12-2005, 03:48 AM
Then again, maybe we are entering the Matt Leinart lottery early?

I don't see how ruining a second QB would solve anything :(

ATX
09-12-2005, 05:09 AM
In No Particular Order:

1.Phillip Buchanon burned countless times.
2.Gaffney non look pass off his shoulder.
3.Gary Walker looking the wrong way on a Mcgahee run, if you saw it, you know what i'm talking about.
4. Oline
5. Capers punting on 4th down, throwing in the towel
6. 5 Turnovers
7. Deep Pass to Bradford dropped.
8. Non existent pass rush-Losman had all day, what's new?
9. Predictable play calling
10. Stupid penalties

geofb
09-12-2005, 08:24 AM
how often has anyone ever seen a football team go for it on 4th and 3 (inside the opponents field goal range) down only two scores with 6 mins left in a game? Rarely....I have probably never seen it happen. If I have (and don't recall) its been once or twice in 3 decades. Go down 3 scores right there the games over.

You are just wrong. They were down 15 points. That is probably 3 scores already (not just 2) unless they make a 2 point conversion. "I've watched football for 4 decades." Good grief, give us all a break.

Rightnow
09-12-2005, 09:01 AM
Does this mean that David Carr's Rookie Card is worthless??? Prediction:
Pittsburgh 38 Texans 10 That's if they spot us 7 points What is Capers always writing on the sidelines??? Grocery List??? This weeks excuse??? ENQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW

He is writing:


Note to self:

Close your mouth, you look like an mouth breathing fool.

Cjeremy635
09-12-2005, 09:20 AM
You don't build confidence by taking risks that totally guarantee you losing the game in one play if it doesn't work out. If that play fails the game is over with 6 mins left. Punting keeps the game alive for the team.

Vinny, don't you call it "taking risks" when you repeatedly run it on first down? The announcers on CBS were even commenting on how predictable it was. They were constantly taking a risk of getting tackled for a loss or sacked the whole game. I for one, would just like to see some fire from these guys and some execution. The constant excuse of "we just didn't go out there and execute today" is getting really old. Why didn't you execute? Isn't that what you get payed millions a year for? I wish they would look at the game like a chess match and try to out think the oppossing team coaches.

BlueHair
09-12-2005, 09:27 AM
The whole game was an embarassment. Run defence looked good at first but after being out there longer in the first quarter than most the pre season they were done. :embarrass But at least we have next week :brickwall

chuckm
09-12-2005, 09:48 AM
has anyone heard or read Gaffney's reason (excuse) for not looking back at that point in his route?