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WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 10:06 AM
How do you rate each position...?

QB: Texans, Carr has more experiance
WR: Bills, Andre Johnson is the best overall, Moulds and evans are the better tandem, by alot.
RB: Willis and DD are pretty equal, but that was based on last year when Willis was 85%
TE: Wash
OL: Bills, You have one of the few OL's that is worse than ours.

DL: Bills, Our D is nasty
LB: Bills, see above
DB: Bills, see above
ST: Bills, best in the league last year.
K: Houston, anyone is better than Lindell

SESupergenius
09-06-2005, 10:43 AM
I'd have to agree with that, but what do you think about the coaching? That comes into play a lot.

gtexan02
09-06-2005, 11:36 AM
I agree with most of that, but have some problems:
TE: I dont know who your TE is, but Im sure he's better than our extra OL Bruener
DB: Our DBs (Robinson, Bucchannon, and Coleman) are one of the best in the league. Plus i heard Clements is injured
ST: Wash. with all the speed we have on returns now, this could be close.

El Tejano
09-06-2005, 11:44 AM
Remember our team had alot of INTs last year and are pretty stout throughout our depth.

bckey
09-06-2005, 11:53 AM
Yeah and don't forget you lost Pat Williams on the DL and Jonas Jennings on the OL.

tsip
09-06-2005, 12:05 PM
I'd have to agree with that, but what do you think about the coaching? That comes into play a lot.

IMO coaching will be the key in this game, with things like

1) Game Plan
2) Adjustments to game plan
3) Motivation
4) Ready to play/preparedness

Whatever coach puts his players in the best posistion to use their strengths
will have a team victory. This means exploiting the Bills weaknesses while
featuring the Texans strength and vice versa for the Bills. Too, another
key is going to be playing the game for 60 minutes. The Texans need to
rattle Loseman from start to finish, be relentless-same for the Bills on Carr.
When a team gets into the red zone--early or late--it needs to score TDs,
something the Texans have been harping on since their existence.

Both teams ended last season on a bad note, with the Bills unable to beat
the Pittsburg subs for a playoff spot and the Texans unable to take it
to the next level (.500) against the worse team in the league, the Browns.
It will be a long day for whatever team carries that play over to this first
game but--on the other hand--it could be very interesting if both teams
come to play.

LBC_Justin
09-06-2005, 12:22 PM
How do you rate each position...?

QB: Texans, Carr has more experiance
WR: Bills, Andre Johnson is the best overall, Moulds and evans are the better tandem, by alot.
RB: Willis and DD are pretty equal, but that was based on last year when Willis was 85%
TE: Wash
OL: Bills, You have one of the few OL's that is worse than ours.

DL: Bills, Our D is nasty
LB: Bills, see above
DB: Bills, see above
ST: Bills, best in the league last year.
K: Houston, anyone is better than Lindell
I agree with most of your post. I would change the following.
TE: Bills....Texans are weak there.
DB: Not fimilar with your DBs but ours are Damn good. Any(or All) three could make the pro bowl this year.
ST: Wash......I know you guys are good but the Texans are STACKED at kick/punt return.

Cheroqui
09-06-2005, 12:40 PM
Remember our team had alot of INTs last year and are pretty stout throughout our depth.

True, and some forced fumbles with Antwan along with Dunta's work, but the only thing is what did we do with the ball afterwards? We can get 5 INT's and 3FF's but if you don't turn that into 3-7 after... :brickwall

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 01:06 PM
I agree with most of your post. I would change the following.
TE: Bills....Texans are weak there.
DB: Not fimilar with your DBs but ours are Damn good. Any(or All) three could make the pro bowl this year.
ST: Wash......I know you guys are good but the Texans are STACKED at kick/punt return.


I didn't know yours either... Mark Campbell is our #1, he's good but underused... Tim Euhus is out with injury.

Our DB's

CB-Nate Clements (got dinged up, he will play)
CB- Terrance McGee (Pro bowl returner, played well down the stretch last year, and in preseason)
SS- lawyer Milloy (fear hitter, good run support)
FS- Troy Vincent (his first full time year at safety, had the offseason to pick it up.

wags
09-06-2005, 01:50 PM
How do you rate each position...?

TE: Wash

Good lord. Buffalo must have some terrible TE's for it to be a wash.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 01:57 PM
Good lord. Buffalo must have some terrible TE's for it to be a wash.


Not really, i just don't know much about you're guys, and our guys are just average... plus we have under used them in the past.

nunusguy
09-06-2005, 02:13 PM
"Sep. 11 Houston
10 a.m. at Buffalo
Favorite BUF BUF
Point spread -4 -4
Total 39o/u 39o/u
Total money line -110 -110"
http://www.vegas.com/gaming/index.html
***********************************
Line got the Bills favored by 4 1/2 at this time with an o/u of 39 - Sept 6

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 02:21 PM
4 1/2, thats a close game.

The over under 39 1/2 is also attainable, but with us having a better D, and being at home on top of Losman playing conservativly I'd imagine that it will be under.... but who knows.

ATX
09-06-2005, 02:24 PM
How do you rate each position...?

QB: Texans, Carr has more experiance
WR: Bills, Andre Johnson is the best overall, Moulds and evans are the better tandem, by alot.
RB: Willis and DD are pretty equal, but that was based on last year when Willis was 85%
TE: Wash
OL: Bills, You have one of the few OL's that is worse than ours.

DL: Bills, Our D is nasty
LB: Bills, see above
DB: Bills, see above
ST: Bills, best in the league last year.
K: Houston, anyone is better than Lindell

I agree with some of your assessments, but you're off on some. Moulds and Evans are not better than Johnson and Gaffney or even Johnson and Bradford. Even if they are better, it's not by much, and definitely not alot. Our Oline isn't as bad as alot of people make it out to be. We're really good with run blocking, it has always been our pass blocking that has hurt us. As for RB, DD has been 85 percent the past 2 seasons and has gone over 1,00 yards there. His experience over Mcgahee is the difference.

I'd say your defense is better as a whole, but our seondary is better than yours. As for special teams, you just never know. Just because it was good last year, doesn't mean it will be good this year. It's called adjustment, Teams make adjustments to counter strengths, so don't expect them to be the same as last year. just a thought for you.

ATX
09-06-2005, 02:26 PM
4 1/2, thats a close game.

The over under 39 1/2 is also attainable, but with us having a better D, and being at home on top of Losman playing conservativly I'd imagine that it will be under.... but who knows.

How do you know JP will play conservatively? If Mcgahee can't get his running going, he's going to have to throw the ball. You can't just run Mcgahee on every play, you'll get crushed. Expect the Texans to put 8 men in the box and dare Losman to throw at them.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 02:37 PM
How do you know JP will play conservatively? If Mcgahee can't get his running going, he's going to have to throw the ball. You can't just run Mcgahee on every play, you'll get crushed. Expect the Texans to put 8 men in the box and dare Losman to throw at them.

Mcgahee had 8 in the box all last year too, do you think anyone feared Bledsoe?


Losman will play conservativly because thats the game plan... I don't expect alot of points in this game.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 02:45 PM
I agree with some of your assessments, but you're off on some. Moulds and Evans are not better than Johnson and Gaffney or even Johnson and Bradford. Even if they are better, it's not by much, and definitely not alot. Our Oline isn't as bad as alot of people make it out to be. We're really good with run blocking, it has always been our pass blocking that has hurt us. As for RB, DD has been 85 percent the past 2 seasons and has gone over 1,00 yards there. His experience over Mcgahee is the difference.

I'd say your defense is better as a whole, but our seondary is better than yours. As for special teams, you just never know. Just because it was good last year, doesn't mean it will be good this year. It's called adjustment, Teams make adjustments to counter strengths, so don't expect them to be the same as last year. just a thought for you.

WR's:

Johnson- 1142yds 6TD's
Gaffney- 632yds 2TD's
Bradford- 399yds 3TD's

Moulds- 1043yds 5 TD's
Evans- 843yds 9TD's

I think its pretty safe to say that however you pair them up, the Bills WR's are more productive..... Johnson is only better than Moulds because he's younger. Keep in mind that Lee Evans didn't play on a regular basis until week 5 last year as he was a rookie, he would have easily had 1000 yards and 10-12 TD's had he been a starter on opening day.

OL:
Very debatable.... I haven't been a fan of our OL much in years, but yours isn't much differant, I'll call it a wash.

DB's: Dunta is very good, hes not clements good yet. McGee is underrated as a corner, but Buchanon is over rated IMO.... Our safties have like 15 probowls between them or something like that. With Troy vincent at safety we have three guys who can man up a WR at all times.

Our special teams will be great again, they have been all preseasn, and we have Jason Peters as our secret weapon... he s a 300lb guy who runs a 4.8, hes a lead blocker and wedge buster... I dare anyone on your team to try and hold a block against a man that big moving that fast on a mission to injure.

jbinbny
09-06-2005, 02:55 PM
I think McGahee can catch the ball just fine. Matter of fact i wish they would throw it too him more often!

LBC_Justin
09-06-2005, 03:03 PM
4 1/2, thats a close game.

The over under 39 1/2 is also attainable, but with us having a better D, and being at home on top of Losman playing conservativly I'd imagine that it will be under.... but who knows.

Forget all the matchups.

I think the deciding point in the Texans vs Bills game is going to be JP Loseman.

If you think the Texans are going to sit back and let Losman handoff the ball all game to your RB you are crazy. The Texans are going to be throwing in a mix of crazy blitzes and run stuffing plays untill the Losman can prove that he can step up and get it done in the air.

Look for this game to be either Losman's coming out party or the Bills fan's "Oh Crap, this is our starting QB?" party.

Any way you look at it the Bills are not the '04 Steelers and Losman will not have the same luxuries that Rothlisberger had.

good luck both teams and I hope there are no major injuries.

PS: this game could actually mean alot, it might be the Wildcard tie breaker.

ATX
09-06-2005, 03:05 PM
Mcgahee had 8 in the box all last year too, do you think anyone feared Bledsoe?


Losman will play conservativly because thats the game plan... I don't expect alot of points in this game.


They feared Bledsoe alot more than Losman i guarantee that. We fear Holcomb alot more than Losman, Holcomb has played like a hall of famer against us. I guess since you know the gameplan, we better tell the texans coaches to read your posts to get an insight. Man, you don't know the gameplan, it's all your opinions as of now.

ATX
09-06-2005, 03:10 PM
WR's:

Johnson- 1142yds 6TD's
Gaffney- 632yds 2TD's
Bradford- 399yds 3TD's

Moulds- 1043yds 5 TD's
Evans- 843yds 9TD's

I think its pretty safe to say that however you pair them up, the Bills WR's are more productive..... Johnson is only better than Moulds because he's younger. Keep in mind that Lee Evans didn't play on a regular basis until week 5 last year as he was a rookie, he would have easily had 1000 yards and 10-12 TD's had he been a starter on opening day.


Those are last year's stats with a different QB. I thought Losman wasn't going to throw it much, isn't that what you said. Johnson isn't just better than moulds because he's younger, that's bad logic man. That would mean that Evans is better than Johnson because he's younger. Andre is a beast, He is better because simply he is better. Yards and TDs don't always show the whole picture. Don't let simple stats lead you to believe that your WRs are better than ours.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 03:23 PM
Those are last year's stats with a different QB. I thought Losman wasn't going to throw it much, isn't that what you said. Johnson isn't just better than moulds because he's younger, that's bad logic man. That would mean that Evans is better than Johnson because he's younger. Andre is a beast, He is better because simply he is better. Yards and TDs don't always show the whole picture. Don't let simple stats lead you to believe that your WRs are better than ours.

I'm not, I'm letting the fact that Moulds has been putting up Andre Johnson Numbers for years, and Evans came in as a rookie and was more productive than your number 2 and 3 guys combined.

We won't be throwing it much, but we will go deep 2-3 times to Evans, and he'll be open, unless you want to leave Moulds in single coverage which I don't recomend.

Andre johnson is a beast, but he has yet to establish himself as a top 5 reciever.

ATX
09-06-2005, 03:30 PM
I'm not, I'm letting the fact that Moulds has been putting up Andre Johnson Numbers for years, and Evans came in as a rookie and was more productive than your number 2 and 3 guys combined.

We won't be throwing it much, but we will go deep 2-3 times to Evans, and he'll be open, unless you want to leave Moulds in single coverage which I don't recomend.

Andre johnson is a beast, but he has yet to establish himself as a top 5 reciever.


Davis is our number 2 receiver as of now. check out his stats. Enough with the psychic crystal ball stuff. So now, you're going to go deep to Evans 2-3 times and he will be open? You're looking at stats too much to determine realpotential. You can't catch the ball 100 times if you're only thrown the ball 50 times. Just because your receivers get thrown at more, doesn't mean they're better. We throw alot more to our running back than most teams do. You probably don't see that though if you're only looking at WR stats.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 03:54 PM
Davis is our number 2 receiver as of now. check out his stats. Enough with the psychic crystal ball stuff. So now, you're going to go deep to Evans 2-3 times and he will be open? You're looking at stats too much to determine realpotential. You can't catch the ball 100 times if you're only thrown the ball 50 times. Just because your receivers get thrown at more, doesn't mean they're better. We throw alot more to our running back than most teams do. You probably don't see that though if you're only looking at WR stats.


I know what I'm talking about, I know how this offense works, I know how football works....

davis was you're 3rd best WR last year.

Heres the deal... Moulds is a proven vet who demands double coverage, always has, did last year, is healthier and in better shape this year....

Evans was a stud in his rookie year, consistantly open, great hands.

Thrown at more? Moulds and Evans had maybe 10-15 more catches than Gaffney and Johnson, yet had 100 more yards and 6 more TD's....

Maybe I know what my team will do because I know more about my team? No crystal ball stuff, We will go deep to evans 2-3 times on Sunday, when you have a deep threat thats what you do... not that difficult. And he will be open, because he was open all last year, you can't single cover him and expect to stop him,...evans runs crisper routes than i've seen from a rookie...

Lee Evans will be a clone of Marvin Harrison in 1-2 years. Mark my words.

ATX
09-06-2005, 04:23 PM
I know what I'm talking about, I know how this offense works, I know how football works....

davis was you're 3rd best WR last year.

Heres the deal... Moulds is a proven vet who demands double coverage, always has, did last year, is healthier and in better shape this year....

Evans was a stud in his rookie year, consistantly open, great hands.

Thrown at more? Moulds and Evans had maybe 10-15 more catches than Gaffney and Johnson, yet had 100 more yards and 6 more TD's....

Maybe I know what my team will do because I know more about my team? No crystal ball stuff, We will go deep to evans 2-3 times on Sunday, when you have a deep threat thats what you do... not that difficult. And he will be open, because he was open all last year, you can't single cover him and expect to stop him,...evans runs crisper routes than i've seen from a rookie...

Lee Evans will be a clone of Marvin Harrison in 1-2 years. Mark my words.

Wrong, Davis was our second best receiver last year. that's where you are wrong. 10-15 more catches and 100 more yards, sounds about right. 8-10 yards per catch. how does that show they are better? Alot of teams have a deep threat, Look at our Rookie Mathis 4.2 speed, fastest player out of the draft, is he not a deep threat? will we throw to him 2-3 times, i don't really know, i'm not psychic like you. So about Evans, did you go to every game last year? because it's hard if not impossible to see receivers run routes watching on TV. I think you're just saying that because someone on your message board said that or that's what you've read somewhere. Evans will never be anywhere near Harrison, dream on. oh wait, i forgot, you got a crystal ball.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 04:55 PM
Wrong, Davis was our second best receiver last year. that's where you are wrong. 10-15 more catches and 100 more yards, sounds about right. 8-10 yards per catch. how does that show they are better? Alot of teams have a deep threat, Look at our Rookie Mathis 4.2 speed, fastest player out of the draft, is he not a deep threat? will we throw to him 2-3 times, i don't really know, i'm not psychic like you. So about Evans, did you go to every game last year? because it's hard if not impossible to see receivers run routes watching on TV. I think you're just saying that because someone on your message board said that or that's what you've read somewhere. Evans will never be anywhere near Harrison, dream on. oh wait, i forgot, you got a crystal ball.


Umm... I have season tickets and watch every game. When they show replays of long TD's oTD passes in general they always show the coach cam shot, you watch the WR get off the line, you watch him run his routes...

Listen, just because you don't know anything about your team doesn't mean thats the case with everyone. Just because I know more than you shouldn't make you so angry, it should make you want to learn more....

Its not the yards (although Evans averages around 2.5 more YPC than anyone from Houston) its the TD's.....

ATX
09-06-2005, 05:16 PM
Listen, just because you don't know anything about your team doesn't mean thats the case with everyone. Just because I know more than you shouldn't make you so angry, it should make you want to learn more....


You're a troll dude, I'm not mad that would eb pointless. I know alot about my team, where do you come off saying things like you know more than me. You know nothing about me except my post name and my age. you know more about Buffalo, but not about Houston. Get off your high horse.

LBC_Justin
09-06-2005, 06:24 PM
Again this game boils down to play of JP Losman.

Who has never started a regular season game.
His regular season stats are... 5 Attempts, 3 completions, 0 TDs, 1 Int

Really hard to forecast how he or the Bills offense is going to do based on those last season stats.

I just hope no one sustains any major injuries.

rmartin65
09-06-2005, 06:31 PM
i hate trolls.

Corrosion
09-06-2005, 07:03 PM
IMO coaching will be the key in this game, with things like

1) Game Plan
2) Adjustments to game plan
3) Motivation
4) Ready to play/preparedness




Capers always has a gameplan ..... and he wont change it even if its NOT working . :brickwall
I think the Texans staff is the worst in the league at making adjustments . :crying:

Texas
09-06-2005, 07:27 PM
First...Evans may not have had a whole league of games to cover his stats but neither did gaffney or bradford. They switched out alot and we have another now who is all about speed (mathis)...
DD and W.M. are about even
Carr is more experienced and a little bit better
Our Secondary is better by a small margin.
I beleive our Linebackers are even
Yalls OL and DL are both better.

Texans I beleive will win this or lose this by a close margin

vtech9
09-06-2005, 08:35 PM
You're a troll dude, I'm not mad that would eb pointless. I know alot about my team, where do you come off saying things like you know more than me. You know nothing about me except my post name and my age. you know more about Buffalo, but not about Houston. Get off your high horse.
Dude, just from reading this thread, you are the one that is acting more like the troll. He isn't coming to our board and trashing anyone, he is saying what he believes and doing so in a calm and mature manner. Your bashing of him is more in the lines of what we call trolls. There are alot of us Texans fans that like to debate with fans of other teams like him.

Honestly, I was enjoying this thread until you started. I think your input has actually degraded this thread. Just my opinion.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 08:59 PM
First...Evans may not have had a whole league of games to cover his stats but neither did gaffney or bradford. They switched out alot and we have another now who is all about speed (mathis)...
DD and W.M. are about even
Carr is more experienced and a little bit better Carr is alot better at this point, Losman is an unknown
Our Secondary is better by a small margin. Hard to believe, Milloy and vincent at Saftey, then Clements who is the best gut on either team
I beleive our Linebackers are evenDefinatly not, not even close, sorry.
Yalls OL and DL are both better. Who knows... Our OL might royally suck.

Texans I beleive will win this or lose this by a close margin

Thats what I think

#1 Bills Fan
09-06-2005, 09:49 PM
First...Evans may not have had a whole league of games to cover his stats but neither did gaffney or bradford. They switched out alot and we have another now who is all about speed (mathis)...
DD and W.M. are about even
Carr is more experienced and a little bit better
Our Secondary is better by a small margin.
I beleive our Linebackers are even
Yalls OL and DL are both better.

Texans I beleive will win this or lose this by a close margin
I don't really feel like debating this until the real football has begun, but please tell me you at least realize who the Bills have in their secondary. Nate Clements, Terrance McGee, Troy Vincent, and Lawyer Milloy. In your unbiased heart of hearts you feel Coleman, Earl, Buchanon, and Robinson are better?

run-david-run
09-06-2005, 10:00 PM
Thats what I think
And Clemens is the best corner in the league based on? Robinson was a rookie, early in the year all quartebacks were throwing to him and staying away from Glenn's side. BY about midway through the season they were throwing to Glenn and staying away from Robinson. Because he was a rookie and teams planned to consitently attack him until they got burned ( 6 picks), there is no real way to determine how good Dunta really is. He might be the next great Deion ( there is always hope for Texan fans) or he might just be a a good corner. I think this season will tell a lot more about his potenatial than the last...

tsip
09-06-2005, 10:03 PM
Capers always has a gameplan ..... and he wont change it even if its NOT working . :brickwall
I think the Texans staff is the worst in the league at making adjustments . :crying:

...almost seems like Capers has the same game plan for every game,
or maybe has 2 or 3 that he alternates

#1 Bills Fan
09-06-2005, 10:03 PM
Clements is the best corner in the league based on his own hype. Truth is he's not a true shut-down corner. He's a ballhawk who gets burned for a deep touchdown about as frequently as he jumps and out route and takes it to the house. What makes his value rise is the fact that he's been relatively durable and contributes on special teams.

But from a pure cover perspective, Clements is top 10 at best, not #1 by any means.

texasguy346
09-06-2005, 10:04 PM
In your unbiased heart of hearts you feel Coleman, Earl, Buchanon, and Robinson are better?

Earl won't start the Buffalo game. A rookie, C.C. Brown, will start the game and he's been pretty good in the preseason. Earl has been slowed by a shoulder injury.

tsip
09-06-2005, 10:05 PM
Capers always has a gameplan ..... and he wont change it even if its NOT working . :brickwall
I think the Texans staff is the worst in the league at making adjustments . :crying:


...admitting he is wrong is not a Caper's strong point

#1 Bills Fan
09-06-2005, 10:09 PM
Earl won't start the Buffalo game. A rookie, C.C. Brown, will start the game and he's been pretty good in the preseason. Earl has been slowed by a shoulder injury.
I know, but when healthy I assumed Earl would return to the starting lineup. The question still stands though. You'd take your secondary over the Bills? Again, I'm not debating, just looking for an unbiased answer and the reasoning behind it.

Bubbajwp
09-06-2005, 10:15 PM
I think its pretty safe to say that however you pair them up, the Bills WR's are more productive..... Johnson is only better than Moulds because he's younger
I dont see your point
Johnson- 1142yds 6TD's
Gaffney- 632yds 2TD's
Bradford- 399yds 3TD's
Domanick Davis 588yds 1TD's

Moulds- 1043yds 5 TD's
Evans- 843yds 9TD's
Reed- 153yds 0TD's
McGahee- 169yds 0TD's

Johnson > Moulds
Gaffney < Evans
Bradford > Reed
Davis > McGahee

Bubbajwp
09-06-2005, 10:22 PM
You'd take your secondary over the Bills? Again, I'm not debating, just looking for an unbiased answer and the reasoning behind it.
Honestly it depends if i was trying to win the superbowl this year. I would take the bills secondary. The Texans is much Younger and has the potential to be THE best.
Nate Clements in my opinion is the third best in the league behind Chris McAlister and Champ Bailey. Drob is arguably top five

texasguy346
09-06-2005, 10:24 PM
I'm not so sure Earl gets his spot back. I think Brown might be getting the nod to see if he can take the job from Earl who's played well as a rookie. Brown has been a pleasant surprise, and he's shows good range at SS. If he comes out against the Bills and flops I'm sure Earl gets his spot back JMO of course.

As far as the secondary I really do like the Texans secondary over the Bills, but not by much. DRob is well on his way to being one of the best CBs in the NFL, and Faggins is a very good NB who would be a starter on most teams. PBuch is a bit of a question mark. He's sort of like Clements in the fact that he gambles (sometimes he wins and sometimes he loses), but he's not near the tackler of Nate and doesn't have the same great instincts as Nate. I'm sure the Bills will be testing him anytime they put it in the air. We have Coleman back at FS, and this will be his second season playing that position. He looked like a natural back there last year, and I figure he'll improve this season. He's got a great nose for the ball. Overall they make for a very good secondary, and I think the Bills aren't too far behind them. Of course the Bills have a good pass rush so that will help make their secondary look even better. The Texans have shown signs of improvement in the pass rush department (watch #98 Peek closely he's fun to watch), but we won't know for sure till Sunday if all the added blitzes will be effective. I hope so.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 10:32 PM
And Clemens is the best corner in the league based on? Robinson was a rookie, early in the year all quartebacks were throwing to him and staying away from Glenn's side. BY about midway through the season they were throwing to Glenn and staying away from Robinson. Because he was a rookie and teams planned to consitently attack him until they got burned ( 6 picks), there is no real way to determine how good Dunta really is. He might be the next great Deion ( there is always hope for Texan fans) or he might just be a a good corner. I think this season will tell a lot more about his potenatial than the last...


Let me preface this by saying Deion is sick, one of my favorite players who wasn't a Bill, but since you brough him up..Clements is on his way to being the next Deion, Nates not quite as fast, but 100X more physical.... check it:

First four years -

Deion: 89 Tackles, 1 Sack, 17 INT's 3TD's, 3 Forced Fumbles

Deion also had 2 Punt returns for TD's

Nate: 263 Tackles, 1.5 Sacks, 18 INT's 4TD's, 8 Forced Fumbles

Nate also had 2 Punt returns for TD's


See what I mean.... You should hope Dunta is the next nate clements. And he might be.

Bubbajwp
09-06-2005, 10:34 PM
Its a little early to compare Nate or Drob to Deion

texasguy346
09-06-2005, 10:39 PM
Deion has never been known as a physical player.

Dunta's stats from one year are:

87 tackles
3 FF (two were returned for scores)
6 INT
3 sacks
13 Pass Def

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 10:40 PM
Its a little early to compare Nate or Drob to Deion


How so, Nates been putting up Deion numbers since he was a rookie... Four years is forever in the NFL.

Deion was a better shut down, less big plays, But nate is better at tackling and stuffing the run.

Why the hard time recognizing greatness? Dunta's sick, but he's gotta put together years and years, and he probably will.

WillisXPress
09-06-2005, 10:41 PM
Deion has never been known as a physical player.

Dunta's stats from one year are:

85 tackles
3 FF (two were returned for scores)
6 INT
3 sacks


Thats sick, if he does it again I'll be a believer. I see this Sunday.

Texas
09-06-2005, 10:44 PM
No argument that Nate is a great. However to compare him to deion is like comparing AJ to Jerry Rice...Its just too early to tell...

texasguy346
09-06-2005, 10:44 PM
I really don't want DRob to be the next Nate (no offense). I'd prefer he be DRob. One of the better things about him is that he's also a very good cover guy, to go along with his physical style of play and playmaker skills. Should be a fun game to watch.

Bubbajwp
09-06-2005, 10:47 PM
IMO with Deion you could just throw him out there and not worry about that side of the field for the rest of the game. He would have had more ints, TDs, and tackles if QBs were not afraid of throwing at him. Also I dont think that there is a CB in the league that compares to Deion. :cool:

Bubbajwp
09-06-2005, 10:56 PM
Im doing a fantasy draft on madden 06. I thought you might like that my first two picks were Nate clements and Takeo Spikes

Trapped
09-06-2005, 11:14 PM
DRob nor Nate Clements have the cover ability of a Deion Sanders. It's safe to say that they will never meet that level either.

Clements game is more like Troy Vincent and Drob's game is similar to Ronde Barber. But neither posses the agility, footspeed, and cover ability of a Deion Sanders.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-06-2005, 11:35 PM
Lucky for us none of this matters since games aren't won on paper.

There isn't a single CB in the NFL right now that is as good as Deion was. Deion didn't have to tackle anyone because teams rarely ever threw to his side of the field.

gr8slayer
09-07-2005, 01:10 AM
You're a troll dude, I'm not mad that would eb pointless. I know alot about my team, where do you come off saying things like you know more than me. You know nothing about me except my post name and my age. you know more about Buffalo, but not about Houston. Get off your high horse.
I know alot about both teams. I have been to and watched plenty of Texan games (living in Texas) and follow the Texans almost as close as I follow the Bills. WXP speaks the truth.

gr8slayer
09-07-2005, 01:13 AM
Dunta and Nate are both easily top ten CB's as of right now. The one thing that Nate has over Dunta is experience and alittle more size. I have nothing but respect for Dunta and he is one of my favorite players. BTW he should have been Defensive Rookie of the Year last year.

gr8slayer
09-07-2005, 01:19 AM
First...Evans may not have had a whole league of games to cover his stats but neither did gaffney or bradford. They switched out alot and we have another now who is all about speed (mathis)...
DD and W.M. are about even
Carr is more experienced and a little bit better
Our Secondary is better by a small margin.
I beleive our Linebackers are even
Yalls OL and DL are both better.

Texans I beleive will win this or lose this by a close margin
I must disagree with you on several points. First LB's. Well nevermind that I know your just joking.

CB's - P. Buch is a joke, he was the laughing stock of Raider Nation and will always be known as a first round bust.

I would take Carr over Losman right now since Losman has never started a game.

Our OL's are pretty evenly matched if you ask me.

And I dont feel that Davis is in the same league with Willis.

Just my opinions, Im entitled to them just like you are to yours.

Oh well, thankfully we wont have to wait too long.

Corrosion
09-07-2005, 01:48 AM
DRob nor Nate Clements have the cover ability of a Deion Sanders. It's safe to say that they will never meet that level either.

Clements game is more like Troy Vincent and Drob's game is similar to Ronde Barber. But neither posses the agility, footspeed, and cover ability of a Deion Sanders.


In my 30+ years of watching Football ..... I dont think Ive ever seen a corner with Deon's cover ability .

gr8slayer
09-07-2005, 01:52 AM
In my 30+ years of watching Football ..... I dont think Ive ever seen a corner with Deon's cover ability .
Dick Lane.

ATX
09-07-2005, 04:29 AM
Dude, just from reading this thread, you are the one that is acting more like the troll. He isn't coming to our board and trashing anyone, he is saying what he believes and doing so in a calm and mature manner. Your bashing of him is more in the lines of what we call trolls. There are alot of us Texans fans that like to debate with fans of other teams like him.

Honestly, I was enjoying this thread until you started. I think your input has actually degraded this thread. Just my opinion.


Where have i bashed the guy? please give an example. 991 posts and this is the first time i've been called a troll.

rmartin65
09-07-2005, 02:38 PM
Deon was the best. period.

TigerBait
09-07-2005, 02:52 PM
http://members.iinet.net.au/~kumquat/argument.jpg

And yes that is Shaq and 'Toine Walker.

gr8slayer
09-07-2005, 03:15 PM
http://members.iinet.net.au/~kumquat/argument.jpg

And yes that is Shaq and 'Toine Walker.
Ah man now that is just wrong.

TigerBait
09-07-2005, 03:37 PM
Ah man now that is just wrong.
mwuhahahahaha *cough* *cough* :evilb:

SESupergenius
09-07-2005, 03:58 PM
I must disagree with you on several points. First LB's. Well nevermind that I know your just joking.

CB's - P. Buch is a joke, he was the laughing stock of Raider Nation and will always be known as a first round bust.

I would take Carr over Losman right now since Losman has never started a game.

Our OL's are pretty evenly matched if you ask me.

And I dont feel that Davis is in the same league with Willis.

Just my opinions, Im entitled to them just like you are to yours.

Oh well, thankfully we wont have to wait too long.


This sounds soo eerily like the Dolphins fans before our first game with them a couple of years back. This game seems so familiar in so many ways. Overconfidence, underestimating, too much focus on home field advantage, etc....

bbills4life
09-07-2005, 04:12 PM
Fortunately y'all don't have Banks anymore, so if Carr gets hurt, we wont' get completely burnt again.

texasguy346
09-07-2005, 04:15 PM
We still have Banks, and he came in when Posey knocked Carr out of the game in the 2003 win in Buffalo.

bbills4life
09-07-2005, 04:42 PM
We still have Banks, and he came in when Posey knocked Carr out of the game in the 2003 win in Buffalo.

Crap. I thought he got traded. My bad.

gr8slayer
09-07-2005, 10:58 PM
This sounds soo eerily like the Dolphins fans before our first game with them a couple of years back. This game seems so familiar in so many ways. Overconfidence, underestimating, too much focus on home field advantage, etc....
Please dont ever compare us the Dolphins again or Ill pay off TKO to take out Carr for the season! :brickwall

SESupergenius
09-08-2005, 02:34 AM
Please dont ever compare us the Dolphins again or Ill pay off TKO to take out Carr for the season! :brickwall

Heres another eery coincidence, the year we beat the Dolphins, the Dolphins had a 9-7 record the previous year. Wanna know what the Bills record was last year? 9-7. ewwwwwww, creepy. :popcorn:

ATX
09-08-2005, 07:01 AM
Please dont ever compare us the Dolphins again or Ill pay off TKO to take out Carr for the season! :brickwall


Yeah, that wouldn't be fair to the Dolphins. The Dolphins were the only team in NFL history to go 16-0 in the regular season. The Bills, as long as they've been around have yet to win a superbowl, like the Dolphins have.

gr8slayer
09-08-2005, 09:51 AM
Yeah, that wouldn't be fair to the Dolphins. The Dolphins were the only team in NFL history to go 16-0 in the regular season. The Bills, as long as they've been around have yet to win a superbowl, like the Dolphins have.
Im more impressed with teams that can win the free agency period. Back then you could buy your SB: see, 49ers, Cowboys, Steelers. But somehow or another, even when you could easily just buy your trophy Houston still couldnt make it to the big game. Are you girls still bitter about the comeback.

bbills4life
09-08-2005, 09:57 AM
Im more impressed with teams that can win the free agency period. Back then you could buy your SB: see, 49ers, Cowboys, Steelers. But somehow or another, even when you could easily just buy your trophy Houston still couldnt make it to the big game. Are you girls still bitter about the comeback.

Dude. Don't get started on the comeback (and I'm a Bills fan). We throw out the comeback and they can come back with the throwback (don't forget that the Titans are the Oilers-relocated).

TEXANS84
09-08-2005, 10:03 AM
Im more impressed with teams that can win the free agency period. Back then you could buy your SB: see, 49ers, Cowboys, Steelers. But somehow or another, even when you could easily just buy your trophy Houston still couldnt make it to the big game. Are you girls still bitter about the comeback.

www.titansonline.com

Go tell your story over there. This is a different team. Nice try though.