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Sudds
09-02-2005, 01:02 AM
It is so funny to hear the same posts every year regarding David Carr. I remember last year when we were racking up points and yeards after game 8 or 9 and everyone on this board loved Carr. They praised his leadership. They praised his abiltities to lead. The praised his toughness. Then all of a sudden things got difficult and those same people wante dhim cut.

The same is happening now. For those of you bandwagon jumpers, I've circled your names and am going to watch your posts. When Carr gets it going and starts leading this team in the right direction, once again, I'm going to see what type of posts you lay down then.

My advance...support the player who has been beaten, sacked, kicked, and bashed for three staright years and understand that until you play football behind our line, you need to pipe a down and have some stones. Overcoming adversity is something Carr has done for three straight years behind this Oline and this is the type of reaction the folks of Houston give him? A beer on his wife's head and a bash on their way out the stadium. If you had legitate football knowledge and could opening breakdown things he's doing worng, then write that. Be constructive and eeucated on what you're talking about. 2 bad games means nothing, especially now. Yu should be barking at Casserly...Yo, when you gonna protect a QB with legitimate gifts?

Corrosion
09-02-2005, 01:10 AM
Ive been one of the few to defend Carr lately but there is no way to defend his performance over the past two games .... pre-season or not he has stunk it up . I for one hope he gets it together in a hurry :texflag:

Sudds
09-02-2005, 01:10 AM
I'm a Califonria Kid who fell in love with Houston when they got the franchise over LA. I loved the Oilers, so that explains my connection. What I admired most about this board is how positive and educated you fans were on the game of football. We all disagreed on various aspect of this team and game, but everyone seemed to have a decent grasp of how things worked and that it would probably take 5 years for us to be in the playoffs. We all understood that no O-line equals disaster........but that was then.

Now we have a bunch of *****s roaming this board who are ready to throw in the towel before the season even starts. What happened to that Texan-Pride I've always heard about? Now it seems many of us are supporting our team when they win, and bashing them when we lose. And note, I use the word bash and not "criticize".That's not a true fan...you should be embarrased of yourselves if you've allowed the pre-season to determine how you are going to support this team for the entire year.

Sudds
09-02-2005, 01:13 AM
I agree completely...Carr has sucked these past two games. I've never seen him play s horribly. But, I still support the guy and think he's a great QB. He's got everything we want, but he's not perfect. When we loose, I'm pissed and upset, but I'm not ready to quit and fire the entire offense.

Shoot, AJ had 37 yards or something last week...where were the complaints about him?

For the past 3 years we've talked about how nothing can get done offensively without a decent O-Line....we all know e have a crappy one and yet we expect perfection out of Carr. Unrealistic.

texan279
09-02-2005, 01:14 AM
My advance...support the player who has been beaten, sacked, kicked, and bashed for three staright years and understand that until you play football behind our line, you need to pipe a down and have some stones. Overcoming adversity is something Carr has done for three straight years behind this Oline and this is the type of reaction the folks of Houston give him? A beer on his wife's head and a bash on their way out the stadium. If you had legitate football knowledge and could opening breakdown things he's doing worng, then write that. Be constructive and eeucated on what you're talking about. 2 bad games means nothing, especially now. Yu should be barking at Casserly...Yo, when you gonna protect a QB with legitimate gifts?

Just because someone posts something negative about Carr does not make them a "bandwagon jumper"...And he has had all of the time in the world this preseason in the backfield compared to years past...So if he continues to play like he has this preseason do we support Carr through another losing season and just take it or do we something for our team and put Ragone in? Football is a team sport, you do what's best for the team. I am not saying I do not support Carr because I always have and always will and I have been a Texan fan since day 1, but we are entering our 4th year and have made improvements in other areas and so far this preseason Carr almost looks like he has taken a step back...and don't give me this O line crap...look what Ragone did tonight behind the 2nd team O line...and things he is doing wrong, how about hitting a defender in the numbers with the ball 2 or 3 times so far this preseason...

ArlingtonTexan
09-02-2005, 01:14 AM
This a just for the record remark. I have been pretty consistent as saying that Carr is a good Qbs in the Hasselbeck, Plummer , Brooks range. A guy who is inconsistent, but a NFL starting quality guy. Just trying to say I am not a Carr hater. Worth having as a QB, but not an elite.

Sudds
09-02-2005, 01:18 AM
Bashing after a loss is completely different than being pissed and critical after a loss.

We lose...people want him fired.

We win...he's the greatest.

You gotta pick one or the other. Criticism is perfectly acceptable and required...but there is a big difference between critisism and bashing, in my opinion.

Sudds
09-02-2005, 01:20 AM
PLease don't compare Ragone to Carr. There is no comparison, period. He's a good player at this level and will be a good back-up...never going to be a starter.

Think about getting sacked over 140 times in three seasons and how that might affect a player. Ragone has never had to deal with that.

disaacks3
09-02-2005, 01:21 AM
What I admired most about this board is how positive and educated you fans were on the game of football.

Now we have a bunch of *****s roaming this board who are ready to throw in the towel before the season even starts.

Now it seems many of us are supporting our team when they win, and bashing them when we lose. We're still educated about the game, that's WHY we're so disappointed.

It's true that pre-season games don't count. It's also true that our First-Team offense has looked absolutely PATHETIC in these last two pre-season games. Carr and the first-team offense were only supposed to play ONE series / 10 plays tonight. Capers left them in quite a bit longer than that so that our starting QB might actually have a SINGLE completion tonight!

When your starting QB can't break double-digits in QB rating (and I don't care if it was against the defending SuperBowl Champs), then you've got some deep issues.

Take off the rose-colored glasses for a minute and understand that while many of us still LOVE our team; we ARE smart enough fans to recognize that there are more than minor issues to be resolved right now.

That makes me a :texflag: , but not a :homer:

HJam72
09-02-2005, 01:23 AM
We can't just fire him until the next game? :)

texan279
09-02-2005, 01:31 AM
We lose...people want him fired.

If he continues playing into the ergular season the way he has this preseason, why not put Ragone in?

PLease don't compare Ragone to Carr. There is no comparison, period. He's a good player at this level and will be a good back-up...never going to be a starter.

Preseason Ragone 11/21 233 yards 3 TD 0 INT Passer Rating 102.4
Carr 15/34 125 yards 1 TD 4 INT Passer Rating 40.9

No comparison? You are right...As of now Ragone is leaps and bounds ahead of Carr, and Ragone plays without AJ and Davis, our 2 best offensive weapons...

ThaShark316
09-02-2005, 01:33 AM
Sudds was nice....Cuz I was about 5 mins away from making a simliar thread and really going off. :) <<<(evil smile)

It's really sad how you Texans "Fans" act during the preseason....I'm a try to remember these same people who ripped on the Texans and on sept. 11th...I'll see their remarks change.

I COMPLETELY understand being a little critical of Carr for the last 2 games...but my god, don't say "oh,we're going 5-11 based on what I've seen"...base on what you've seen...its still...

.
.
.
.
.

PRESEASON!

Don't get worried, IM TELLING YOU, THIS TEAM CAN DO A LITTLE SOMETHING!

texan279
09-02-2005, 01:37 AM
Look I understand everyone has a bad game or 2 every now and then, but this has gone on for 4 games, preseason or not, it was 1st team offense against 1st team defense...No one is calling for Carr's head, not me anyway, just voicing concern about our "franchise" QB...I mean you can't sit here and say nothing is wrong, playoffs here we come, or it's only preseason after watching these last 4 preseason games...And why are some saying "it is only preseason"? Is there something that is going to change or happen to where Carr makes a total 180 starting 9/11?

SESupergenius
09-02-2005, 01:38 AM
What do you all really expect, we've havn't fixed our O-line problems, we didn't add a solid #2 reciever, we didn't address the TE position, we drafted DD II as a backup (no starters from rounds 1 and 3), we let go the heart and soul of our defense in Sharper and Glenn( our best linebacker and cornerback), we've got 3 our of our 4 linebackers that didn't play at their positions playing there now, we traded down our #1 pick and bypassed a hugely popular LB in DJ to get a backup Lineman in TJ, we traded for a CB that was the #2 cornerback for his previous team and we inserted him as our #1, we didn't resign our best nickel back in Wright, we get Greenwood to increase pressure on the QB who only has 3 CAREER sacks, we didn't get any quality free agent linebackers (Bell, Hartwell) ,we let a good safety go in McCree and insert a 4th round project to take the spot from another untested late rounder in Earl.

Yep, I can see why people are saying we are going to have a great season. :brickwall

thegr8fan
09-02-2005, 01:57 AM
Bandwagon?? when the heck did a bandwagon come through for the Texans? did we win a division championship and I missed it or something??

For all you "its only preseason" smucks, yes it is THANKFULLY.

If this is Preseason and these are only 'practice games', and we played like that in them, why is it such a 'screeching halt' of logic to deduct what were going to look like against Buffalo?

Oh wait, maybe we just put on the most elaborate ruse since the invention of the Trojan Horse. Yeah that's it!!! Carr, and company, came out and INTENTIONALLY looked that bad so we could fool Buffalo into playing their second string and saving their starters for the NEXT game after Houston's.

The Texans have 10 days to fix what they haven't been able to fix in over 4 month's. yeah, optimism is running high on THAT happening, isn't it. :ok:

thegr8fan
09-02-2005, 02:06 AM
and just for the record, ditto on what ArlingtonTexan said. DC is an average, meaning middle of the pack, starter for an NFL team. I don't expect to see him take and win a game entirely by himself, such as Manning. But I don't expect him to throw one away with lousy decisions at critical times either, such as the interceptions lately.

Hey there's 32 teams in the NFL, some of those QB's have to be rated 13-19, that is Carr's area. Not everyone can be a Manning.

MYDAUGHTER'STEXANS
09-02-2005, 02:27 AM
Nobody is jumping the Wagon Suds Carr is a remarkable person and has the talent to be a great QB, but when you see mistakes like you have the last two weeks it makes you scratch your head . Also David's remark's after the game are typical of him we need to execute better, and so on. They get old he just needs to say he had a bad game and had poor misreads. Him and Charlie need to stop licking the salt off old wounds every week and get with it. Because I'm sure once the season starts and this downward progress continues Bob Mcnair will get tired of watching his money run around the field. Week 4 of the preseason you should start to see some type of gel in the first string offense, like in the Raider's game now a downward progression, I'm sure you would agree. So no one is jumping the band wagon on here we are all true Texans fans with concerns for our beloved Texans, I will continue to support the players no matter win or lose, but one would have to ask. When the owner looks down do I fire the team or the Mangement, well he is sure not going to get rid of the team. Alot of this is Charlie's fault, it really get's old listening to him week in and week out. Anyway go Texans and way to go Texans fans on donations to our freinds in LA from hurricane Katrina. God Bless them.

ROYDESTROY
09-02-2005, 02:36 AM
Ive been one of the few to defend Carr lately but there is no way to defend his performance over the past two games .... pre-season or not he has stunk it up . I for one hope he gets it together in a hurry :texflag:

This honest fan has respect :)

ROYDESTROY
09-02-2005, 02:38 AM
Bandwagon?? when the heck did a bandwagon come through for the Texans? did we win a division championship and I missed it or something??

For all you "its only preseason" smucks, yes it is THANKFULLY.

If this is Preseason and these are only 'practice games', and we played like that in them, why is it such a 'screeching halt' of logic to deduct what were going to look like against Buffalo?

Oh wait, maybe we just put on the most elaborate ruse since the invention of the Trojan Horse. Yeah that's it!!! Carr, and company, came out and INTENTIONALLY looked that bad so we could fool Buffalo into playing their second string and saving their starters for the NEXT game after Houston's.

The Texans have 10 days to fix what they haven't been able to fix in over 4 month's. yeah, optimism is running high on THAT happening, isn't it. :ok:


Great post..sober but honest..the :homer: just will not be honest :rolleyes:

SESupergenius
09-02-2005, 03:06 AM
Oh please Roy, you're only fooling yourself if you think your team is any better.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
09-02-2005, 03:30 AM
The 33 year old troll is still here? ROFL

J-Storm
09-02-2005, 05:41 AM
I don't see the problem with some of us Texans fans having our opinion and voicing it. Not everyone is going to agree about player's performances every day of every week. If we believe that Carr needs a good kick in the rear end and should get a game on the bench in place of Ragone, then so be it. If it makes him see that he is performing about as quality-wise as that QB they have in Baltimore...what's his name... ummm..hang on .. Bouler, or is it Bowler...oh no wait that Kylie Boller, then maybe David will get his rear off the bench and doing what it should be doing.

P.S. I'll apply that theory to any member of the O or D for that matter, I'm far from a Carr-basher btw...

texan279
09-02-2005, 06:14 AM
All you people bagging on Carr...have any of you been hit and landed on by 250lb, well conditioned, strong man 140 times? Has anyone ever had to throw a ball really hard, accurately, and someone in your face, with no one protecting you?

You pay me $8 million for a year, I'll let you kick me in the crotch 100 times a day for a year...


Now look...Ragone is good, but he's not great. I hear people saying he should start ahead of Carr, how wonderful he is running the offense, how great he played in NFL-Europe. I want to take you people aside and beat you:

1) If Ragone was a better QB than Carr...why wasn't he drafted in the 1st round and starting for another team.
2) You know what, Ragone is running the offense good. A 2-3 string QB is running the offense good against 2-3 stringer "D". But just curious everybody...how did Ragone run our offense during the season when he HAD to...that's right *****s.

The 2 games Ragone started were his rookie season and he was behind the same O line you say is so horrible...And you say Ragone is playing against lesser defenses, he is also out on the field without AJ and DD and playing with a rookie RB. Look at what Carr has done with AJ and DD and look at what Ragone has done without them...All I am saying is if this Carr's poor performance continues into the beginning of the season Ragone should at least get a chance. Carr is making top tier QB money and he has not even given an average QB performance yet this preseason...Just because he was a high pick and makes tons of money doesn't mean the job is just his automatically anymore, we are no longer an expansion team...Either way if Carr comes out and puts up Manning like numbers or if he comes out and looks like Ryan Leaf I still support him, but the coaches and front office need to do what is best to help the team win...

Derek
09-02-2005, 06:45 AM
Although you want your team to win, if you lose the game who cares, no matter how bad your 1st string offense was. Titans went 1-3 but I still see them having a good year.

Tedc
09-02-2005, 07:22 AM
Carr doesn't have to prove anything in preseason. He will force an ill-advised pass during preseason. I don't have a problem with that. The starters do not go all out in preseason games and you will see a difference in the REAL season.

Remember, we start with Buffalo and Pittsburg, so losing one or two of those games is NOT the end of the world. Winning one would be great.

touttail
09-02-2005, 07:29 AM
My comment in another post was, look at Drew Brees two years ago, he sucked. Now look at what he did last year.
Carr will come around, I think he is shell shocked from the sacks and blitzes from the past years. He needs a confidence booster.

Bobby 119C :texans:

Corrosion
09-02-2005, 08:08 AM
What do you all really expect, we've havn't fixed our O-line problems, we didn't add a solid #2 reciever, we didn't address the TE position, we drafted DD II as a backup (no starters from rounds 1 and 3), we let go the heart and soul of our defense in Sharper and Glenn( our best linebacker and cornerback), we've got 3 our of our 4 linebackers that didn't play at their positions playing there now, we traded down our #1 pick and bypassed a hugely popular LB in DJ to get a backup Lineman in TJ, we traded for a CB that was the #2 cornerback for his previous team and we inserted him as our #1, we didn't resign our best nickel back in Wright, we get Greenwood to increase pressure on the QB who only has 3 CAREER sacks, we didn't get any quality free agent linebackers (Bell, Hartwell) ,we let a good safety go in McCree and insert a 4th round project to take the spot from another untested late rounder in Earl.

Yep, I can see why people are saying we are going to have a great season. :brickwall


You took the words right outa my mouth ..... BTW , the project at safety is a 6th rounder not a 4th .... :texflag:

Oh please Roy, you're only fooling yourself if you think your team is any better.

Unfortunately the Cowboys are probably a win better than the Texans at this point ..... It really pains me to say that :embarrass

MightyTExan
09-02-2005, 08:18 AM
I've always been a fan of Carr. Reminds me of a combination of Elway and Farve.I don't know if his head is in the wrong spot or if it's the new plays, because it looks like the timing was off for the receivers/QB and vice versa. He is the toughest QB besides Farve that I have seen in a long time. At this point it's all mental. We have the talent to make it to the playoffs. Either we are going to royally suck this season or be the suprise team of the season....i.e. last years Chargers.

Crank_It_Up
09-02-2005, 08:34 AM
Although you want your team to win, if you lose the game who cares, no matter how bad your 1st string offense was. Titans went 1-3 but I still see them having a good year.hopefully the texans will beat bud the crud adams at least once this year... we'll never forget ya bud :challenge

Corrosion
09-02-2005, 08:41 AM
And you know what...I have Carr on my fantasy team, and I'm going to start him all season.
:texflag:

Carr went D. Carr 1/5 for 4 yards and TWO INT's in the first quarter , Numbers like that are gonna kill your fantasy team .

He cant play that bad again .... Can he ? :brickwall

hopefully the texans will beat bud the crud adams at least once this year... we'll never forget ya bud :challenge


Good GOD i hope they can beat the Titanics at least once this season , I would HATE to have to deal with all the Titanic TROLLS bragging they swept the Texans .... that would make for one LONG off-season :hairpull:

The Preacher
09-02-2005, 09:16 AM
Because I'm sure once the season starts and this downward progress continues Bob Mcnair will get tired of watching his money run around the field. Week 4 of the preseason you should start to see some type of gel in the first string offense, like in the Raider's game now a downward progression, I'm sure you would agree.

4-12 How is this downward progress. I guess the Colts should be panicked
5-11 because they're 0-4. Chiefs are 0-3 they're in trouble too.
7-9 Week 4 most starters around the league don't even play. Philly got blown out at home last night. What does that say? Carr looked sharp the first two preseason games(one series each) so how are some fluky int's in the last two games a sign of what's to come. I'm sure all the naysayers think I have some serious homer blinders on and that's just great. The Texans are on the verge of being a playoff team, the future is very bright and positive progress is being made, period. It's rare a team like the Chargers can go from worst to first but look at the talent they have. For those of you who see nothing but black please tell me the next time you decide to wholesale sell your stock portfolios.

William.carter
09-02-2005, 09:39 AM
Ive been one of the few to defend Carr lately but there is no way to defend his performance over the past two games .... pre-season or not he has stunk it up . I for one hope he gets it together in a hurry :texflag:

There is no need to defend his performance. He had a couple of bad games and that's the bottom line. Which is unexpected and unfortunate at this stage in the preseason, but I have to say that he had help. Timing routes don't work if the receiver doesn't complete the route but the corner does. Last night's poor performance wasn't Carr's alone. He isn't innocent but he couldn't have stunk it up like that alone.


And for the record, I'm still a Carr fan and supporter. He will turn it around. That's what leaders do.

Doug
09-02-2005, 10:56 AM
Personally, this whole thread is crazy. Just because you criticize your team or team members doesn't make you a basher or a bandwagon jumper. If anything I think it makes you more of a fan. If my best friend is doing something wrong, I'm going to tell him how he's mucking up because I care about him and want him to excel in what he's doing. How I go about presenting it is based on my personality. It's not always going to jive with the way other people would handle it. I've been the first to act like everythinig is going to be okay even though our team was stinking it up and I'd have several reasons for why things didn't turn out so well. You know there comes a time when you have to look at things realistically and know what good things and bad things are going on with your team from an unbiased stand point. That to me makes you a real fan (Not always looking at the positives but taking into consideration the negatives and being able to discuss the negatives without trying to make it into a positive). The one thing I, as a fan, would like to comment on is the playing of David Carr (I'm well aware he's not the only one stinking it up but it almost always starts with the quarterback). His play is horrible. He's not going through his progressions, and his aim has alot to be desired. I firmly believe that until someone is pushing him for the starting quarterback role we will never see what David Carr is fully capable of. I guarantee to you that if he was aware that the starting role is for the taking and not his alone, you would see a huge fire under his rear and he'd take it to that next level. That's not bashing David, that's reality. Everyone becomes lax in a position at work and thinks they have a good thing till the new guy shows up and starts learning what you're supposed to be doing. That's the fire I'm talking about; The same one that take's everybody to that next level when you feel threatened in one way or another.

Corrosion
09-02-2005, 11:07 AM
Good post Doug :texflag:

angeltexus
09-02-2005, 11:19 AM
Good post Doug :texflag:
I continue to blame coach Capers for our embarassing performance. All spring and summer he talks about getting the job done, after games he makes excuses for his team. Excuses satisfy the people who say them and Texas do not put up with them. All week we heard about the way Carr was going to play 10 plays at least, so the team did not even take this game serious. Way to go coach, for now! Time to dump this Caper.. Hope you had fun at the Luncheon and made our fans miserable Thursday night. :confused:

Dime
09-02-2005, 11:20 AM
I live in CA, so I only see the highlights, or in some cases, lowlights of Texans games. As far as I'm concerned the pre-season is meant for these types of games, mistakes, blunders, screw-ups...however you want to put them. It is soooo frustrating to see Carr play like this, because it reminds me of his 2nd game his rookie season where he was like, 2-12, 16 yds, 2 int...and I remember people yelling "way to go leaf." I got to see Carr play at Fresno State, and there was never a bigger gamer than him. He showed up, for everything. I remember watching every Texans game I could during the past few seasons, and seeing all the krap he went through, with the sorry excuse of a line that has allowed 140 sacks, only one real quality WR to throw the ball to, dropped passes, and krappy play call selection, but yet he got back up and got his game face going again. I remember seeing him throw the ball into double coverage, along with other bad decisions, and at the same time, I saw him make passes that only today's elite QBs could ever make.

All you people bagging on Carr...have any of you been hit and landed on by 250lb, well conditioned, strong man 140 times? Has anyone ever had to throw a ball really hard, accurately, and someone in your face, with no one protecting you? I heard some chump says he knows and understands the game. Look you tard...you don't know till you go through what he has. What...did you play in high school with a bunch of other pimpled face twits, so that gives you a complete understanding of what a professional goes through? Look, I get frustrated when I see Carr make piss-poor decisions, but you all need to check yourself. Untill you throw on a uni, strap that helmet down, you know nothing.

Here is something I found interesting...every year, the Texans have had both spectrums of the games head in different directions. The Texans offense looked horrible its first year, and has steadily gotten better. Carr did not look bueno his rookie campaign, but has gotten steadily better. The Texans D its first year was actually pretty decent. And they have steadily gotten worse. Basically, what I am trying to say, is that the people writing on these message boards about what we need to do, what we shouldn't do, who we should have and shouldn't have drafted, don't know ****.

Now look...Ragone is good, but he's not great. I hear people saying he should start ahead of Carr, how wonderful he is running the offense, how great he played in NFL-Europe. I want to take you people aside and beat you:
1) If Ragone was a better QB than Carr...why wasn't he drafted in the 1st round and starting for another team.
2) You know what, Ragone is running the offense good. A 2-3 string QB is running the offense good against 2-3 stringer "D". But just curious everybody...how did Ragone run our offense during the season when he HAD to...that's right *****s.
3) NFL-Europe is an extention of college football. It is a league for back-ups to start. Don't get me wrong, there are a damn good players, but not NFL starter material. Ragone was a good QB in college, so him succeeding in NFL-Europe, aka NCAA part II, isn't overly impressive. Ragone may start one day, but not ahead of Carr on the same team.

Look, I'm tired. I'm trying to concentrate on work, staying awake, and tear you doubters a new one. This may seem like a ramble...but I don't care. In the words of Carlos Mencia, "dee dee-dee!"


And to answer your post and others... I have one who have not been happy (ever) with Carrs play. I wasnt on him the first year or two because everyone has to develop. That being said... He is not leading the reciever correctly (most passes are thrown behind), he is more accurate under 5 yards then anything over 5. He has questionable judgement at times. He does scramble well, but he had to do that to survive a horrible online in years past. Has he showed improvement, yes.. but slowly and only in certain areas, not all areas. Those are my beefs against him, and those have always been my beefs against him. And no, ragone isnt better then Carr, but Ragone HAS shown more improvement then Carr in the time being here. Ragone, however, isnt ready quite yet.

Now to address your comments BigTexan8

---All you people bagging on Carr...have any of you been hit and landed on by 250lb, well conditioned, strong man 140 times? Has anyone ever had to throw a ball really hard, accurately, and someone in your face, with no one protecting you? I heard some chump says he knows and understands the game. Look you tard...you don't know till you go through what he has. What...did you play in high school with a bunch of other pimpled face twits, so that gives you a complete understanding of what a professional goes through? Look, I get frustrated when I see Carr make piss-poor decisions, but you all need to check yourself. Untill you throw on a uni, strap that helmet down, you know nothing.

Your right... but neither have you... so you must know nothing as well. He is being paided as a professional football QB, and yes... he should be having a better o-line, but dont tell me 'oh its hard' crap. Good QB's make the best of the sititution. If a line weak, exploit it with more screens, dump-offs, etc. I hope he gets a better o-line, but he has to step up his play to where he is at right now.

---Basically, what I am trying to say, is that the people writing on these message boards about what we need to do, what we shouldn't do, who we should have and shouldn't have drafted, don't know ****.


Really.. I didnt know this... So those folks who yelled because we didnt draft a o-line until the late rounds havent a clue how good the oline is. Those people here who are concerned about preseason games where they are blow out of the water in the 1st half of the last preseason game dont know what thier speaking of. Wow... That means since your posting here, you dont know **** either.

Let me educate you on something..

This is a forum. Fans of the Houston Texans come here to do several things. They post. Sometimes thier post are stupid (I have done a few in my time too), some of thier posts are emotional, some of them are informative, some of them are even funny. I invite everyone with something to say to post. I only ask it isnt insultive personally against a member or player. We are all critics here of our teams because we are looking for a future SB visit and win. So if people want to post because they are furstrated with the team... well, maybe they should have a place to vent. Maybe if people see something they would do different, they have a place to say. If you cant handle it .. NMP!

angeltexus
09-02-2005, 11:27 AM
And to answer your post and others... I have one who have not been happy (ever) with Carrs play. I wasnt on him the first year or two because everyone has to develop. That being said... He is not leading the reciever correctly (most passes are thrown behind), he is more accurate under 5 yards then anything over 5. He has questionable judgement at times. He does scramble well, but he had to do that to survive a horrible online in years past. Has he showed improvement, yes.. but slowly and only in certain areas, not all areas. Those are my beefs against him, and those have always been my beefs against him. And no, ragone isnt better then Carr, but Ragone HAS shown more improvement then Carr in the time being here. Ragone, however, isnt ready quite yet.

Now to address your comments BigTexan8

---All you people bagging on Carr...have any of you been hit and landed on by 250lb, well conditioned, strong man 140 times? Has anyone ever had to throw a ball really hard, accurately, and someone in your face, with no one protecting you? I heard some chump says he knows and understands the game. Look you tard...you don't know till you go through what he has. What...did you play in high school with a bunch of other pimpled face twits, so that gives you a complete understanding of what a professional goes through? Look, I get frustrated when I see Carr make piss-poor decisions, but you all need to check yourself. Untill you throw on a uni, strap that helmet down, you know nothing.

Your right... but neither have you... so you must know nothing as well. He is being paided as a professional football QB, and yes... he should be having a better o-line, but dont tell me 'oh its hard' crap. Good QB's make the best of the sititution. If a line weak, exploit it with more screens, dump-offs, etc. I hope he gets a better o-line, but he has to step up his play to where he is at right now.

---Basically, what I am trying to say, is that the people writing on these message boards about what we need to do, what we shouldn't do, who we should have and shouldn't have drafted, don't know ****.


Really.. I didnt know this... So those folks who yelled because we didnt draft a o-line until the late rounds havent a clue how good the oline is. Those people here who are concerned about preseason games where they are blow out of the water in the 1st half of the last preseason game dont know what thier speaking of. Wow... That means since your posting here, you dont know **** either.

Let me educate you on something..

This is a forum. Fans of the Houston Texans come here to do several things. They post. Sometimes thier post are stupid (I have done a few in my time too), some of thier posts are emotional, some of them are informative, some of them are even funny. I invite everyone with something to say to post. I only ask it isnt insultive personally against a member or player. We are all critics here of our teams because we are looking for a future SB visit and win. So if people want to post because they are furstrated with the team... well, maybe they should have a place to vent. Maybe if people see something they would do different, they have a place to say. If you cant handle it .. NMP!Pretty good educating, thanks for staying in Cali..
:homer: :homer:

the wonger need food
09-02-2005, 11:31 AM
You pay me $8 million for a year, I'll let you kick me in the crotch 100 times a day for a year...
The 2 games Ragone started were his rookie season and he was behind the same O line you say is so horrible...And you say Ragone is playing against lesser defenses, he is also out on the field without AJ and DD and playing with a rookie RB. Look at what Carr has done with AJ and DD and look at what Ragone has done without them...All I am saying is if this Carr's poor performance continues into the beginning of the season Ragone should at least get a chance. Carr is making top tier QB money and he has not even given an average QB performance yet this preseason...Just because he was a high pick and makes tons of money doesn't mean the job is just his automatically anymore, we are no longer an expansion team...Either way if Carr comes out and puts up Manning like numbers or if he comes out and looks like Ryan Leaf I still support him, but the coaches and front office need to do what is best to help the team win...

texan279, remember this one on 1/3/05?

This challenging Carr for his job thing is ridiculous. How about we challenge each of our O linemen for their jobs? I think that might work.

and this one...

And like I said in the other post, who challenges him for the job, Dave Ragone? :shocked If you bring in another QB to challenge Carr for his job all you will be doing is spending money on a veteran QB that no other team wants who will have to come in and learn our offense and our system and will most likely ride the bench anyways.


I applaud you for opening your eyes on this one. It takes a big man to admit he's wrong.

Dime
09-02-2005, 11:39 AM
Pretty good educating, thanks for staying in Cali..
:homer: :homer:

Rofl.. Love those who post something I have no clue what they are saying..

randy54
09-02-2005, 12:28 PM
keep on dreaming Houston will will SOMEDAY

Corrosion
09-02-2005, 12:43 PM
keep on dreaming Houston will will SOMEDAY

huh ? :confused:

What on earth is he talking about ? :bomb:

Blake
09-02-2005, 12:48 PM
keep on dreaming Houston will will SOMEDAY

Can you say "Troll?"

Diehardtexan
09-02-2005, 12:51 PM
Can you say "Troll?"
Troll

Exascor
09-02-2005, 12:51 PM
keep on dreaming Houston will will SOMEDAYI'm sure Houston will will SOMEDAY. I just hope they don't won't won't. Will will is better than won't won't! :ok:

Hervoyel
09-02-2005, 12:57 PM
PLease don't compare Ragone to Carr. There is no comparison, period. He's a good player at this level and will be a good back-up...never going to be a starter.

Think about getting sacked over 140 times in three seasons and how that might affect a player. Ragone has never had to deal with that.


A couple of points I'd like to make.

1. Nobody should be forced to deal with 140 sacks in three seasons.

2. You have no idea whether Dave Ragone will be a starter or is capable of being a starter in the NFL. The vast majority of people who say things like this are basing that on seeing Ragone play two times during his rookie season (something that should never have happened) with Tony Hollings as his running back (hence exactly zero running game) and on watching him play with the 3rd team in the preseason. Lousy blocking, often pitiful recievers, and again, Tony Hollings as his running game.

Ragone should easily be the #2 right now and could, very easily find himself starting for the Texans sometime this season if Carr keeps putting up performances like he did last night and last week.

Absolutely David Carr is the starter here. No doubt about it. If we go into week 6 or 7 with one win and that record can be realistically hung on Carr's play then Dave Ragone will get a look.

evil_scotsman
09-02-2005, 01:32 PM
I don't know why everbody's moaning, we're going 16-0 :texflag:

the wonger need food
09-02-2005, 01:44 PM
I don't know why everbody's moaning, we're going 16-0 :texflag:

Really? I thought they were 0-0.

texan279
09-02-2005, 03:54 PM
I applaud you for opening your eyes on this one. It takes a big man to admit he's wrong.

At the time there was no challenge from Ragone. Where is the post that I made that also stated that whoever is performing at the highest level should start whatever position it may be? Remember when I said Wells should get the chance to start? I wasn't wrong about anything, just my opinion, which is what a message board is for...glad you got nothing better to do than dig my old posts up...

Doug
09-02-2005, 05:31 PM
Personally, this whole thread is crazy. Just because you criticize your team or team members doesn't make you a basher or a bandwagon jumper. If anything I think it makes you more of a fan. If my best friend is doing something wrong, I'm going to tell him how he's mucking up because I care about him and want him to excel in what he's doing. How I go about presenting it is based on my personality. It's not always going to jive with the way other people would handle it. I've been the first to act like everythinig is going to be okay even though our team was stinking it up and I'd have several reasons for why things didn't turn out so well. You know there comes a time when you have to look at things realistically and know what good things and bad things are going on with your team from an unbiased stand point. That to me makes you a real fan (Not always looking at the positives but taking into consideration the negatives and being able to discuss the negatives without trying to make it into a positive). The one thing I, as a fan, would like to comment on is the playing of David Carr (I'm well aware he's not the only one stinking it up but it almost always starts with the quarterback). His play is horrible. He's not going through his progressions, and his aim has alot to be desired. I firmly believe that until someone is pushing him for the starting quarterback role we will never see what David Carr is fully capable of. I guarantee to you that if he was aware that the starting role is for the taking and not his alone, you would see a huge fire under his rear and he'd take it to that next level. That's not bashing David, that's reality. Everyone becomes lax in a position at work and thinks they have a good thing till the new guy shows up and starts learning what you're supposed to be doing. That's the fire I'm talking about; The same one that take's everybody to that next level when you feel threatened in one way or another.

Something else I wanted to point out that kind of helps my theory on competition for the starting qb role is the situation in San Diego. Why is it that San Diego drafts Rivers (Originally Manning) and all of a sudden Drew Brees is a pro bowl quarterback? It's not like he had the makings of being one the year before. Just curious about your opinions on this one.

TMac48
09-02-2005, 05:37 PM
If he continues playing into the ergular season the way he has this preseason, why not put Ragone in?



Preseason Ragone 11/21 233 yards 3 TD 0 INT Passer Rating 102.4
Carr 15/34 125 yards 1 TD 4 INT Passer Rating 40.9

No comparison? You are right...As of now Ragone is leaps and bounds ahead of Carr, and Ragone plays without AJ and Davis, our 2 best offensive weapons...
Ok, put Carr in against a bunch of 3rd-stringers and see what happens. He would tear it up too!

Exascor
09-02-2005, 05:58 PM
Ok, put Carr in against a bunch of 3rd-stringers and see what happens. He would tear it up too!Thank you. Why do people insist on making our backups out to be better than our starters when they've only played against 2nd or 3rd string players? That said...Carr's preseason was one to forget.

Corrosion
09-02-2005, 05:58 PM
Something else I wanted to point out that kind of helps my theory on competition for the starting qb role is the situation in San Diego. Why is it that San Diego drafts Rivers (Originally Manning) and all of a sudden Drew Brees is a pro bowl quarterback? It's not like he had the makings of being one the year before. Just curious about your opinions on this one.


Competition bring out the best in some people , others will sulk and whine ....Brees seems to be one that thrives on competition . As of this point whether Rivers is a bust or not doesnt matter as it pushed Brees to improve .... by leaps and bounds .

Problem is I dont think the Texans have the luxury of drafting a QB high in the draft just for the sole purpose of competing with Carr , they have too many other holes to fill . And again , how woulkd Carr respond ?

As for those QB's on the roster pushing Carr ....

Forget about Banks doing that , he just doesnt have it in him . At this point in his career Banks is suitable as a back-up and nothing more .

Ragone on the other hand is Rapidly improving . He looks like a totally different player than he did in his rookie year when he was forced to start two games . In those games he looked like a deer caught in the headlights , now he looks as if he belongs in the NFL , that being as a starter or a back-up is yet to be determined .

It wouldnt bother me a bit come week 4 and they are 1-3 if Carr were benched in favor of Ragone for a game or two just to send a message . :tv:

the wonger need food
09-02-2005, 06:11 PM
At the time there was no challenge from Ragone. Where is the post that I made that also stated that whoever is performing at the highest level should start whatever position it may be? Remember when I said Wells should get the chance to start? I wasn't wrong about anything, just my opinion, which is what a message board is for...glad you got nothing better to do than dig my old posts up...

Sorry man, I didn't mean to offend. I just thought it ironic that my suggestion to challenge Carr was met with such universal disdain, and now after posting a QB rating lower than Roger Clemens' ERA, a lot of other people suggesting the same thing. It's nothing personal, I just happened to remember your responses specifically.

Corrosion
09-02-2005, 06:47 PM
I just thought it ironic that my suggestion to challenge Carr was met with such universal disdain, and now after posting a QB rating lower than Roger Clemens' ERA


:ouch: ... but the truth hurts .... :dangit:


Carr .... the honeymoon is over .

Capers .... its time to take the diapers off .

:goodnight

BigDTexansFan
09-02-2005, 07:21 PM
This a just for the record remark. I have been pretty consistent as saying that Carr is a good Qbs in the Hasselbeck, Plummer , Brooks range. A guy who is inconsistent, but a NFL starting quality guy. Just trying to say I am not a Carr hater. Worth having as a QB, but not an elite.


your post sounds eeerily similar to what friends of mine who are Dallas cowboys fans said about Troy Aikman....guess we need to give him time to prove he is an elite as you tab it. I for one think that preseason has as much to do with regular season as summer heat has to do with winter snow. I for one support Carr he has as a earlier poster said been beat up and yet he is still out there trying, I haven't heard him whine about officiating (which having been at Dallas game he could) or blame anyone he has stood up and took heat. I respect him and always will!!! I remember what my ol daddy used to say. "Rush to judgement repent in leisure" so some who are complaining will one day find themselves in a differnet situation

texan279
09-02-2005, 07:31 PM
Ok, put Carr in against a bunch of 3rd-stringers and see what happens. He would tear it up too!

OK, put him in without AJ and DD...see what happens...