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gtexan02
08-13-2005, 11:15 PM
Ok all in all this was a most excellent experience. I got to the Orange lot about 2 hours before game time where I had a bbq sandwhich and a beer while walking around and people/tailgate watching. Very fun. Went on inside and here are my thoughts on the Texans 1st preseason game.

Things I liked:
1. 1st offense looked good. I thought Riley did a good job. Very concerned with Wiegart going down. He was laying down for so long. I hope he'll be ok.
2. 1st defense looked pretty good.
3. Gary Walker did well, and I thought he looked ready to play.
4. Babin/Drob are progressing nicely
5. DD was cruising
6. Hollings had some nice plays
7. Cheerleaders are hotter than ever. One of them was having minor wardrobe issues, but I wasnt complaining...hehe

Disapointments
1. The rookies: TJ roughing the passer, Morency looking lost, Hogden false start, Mathis no receptions (I dont think)
2. BJ Symmons: As much love as I have because he's local, this kid needs to be cut. He looked like a scared HS kid
3. I was disapointed with Peek. I was hoping he'd be one of my brighest points, but he was offsides once, and many times was practically taken out of the play by the OT. Denver does have very good OTs though
4. Disapointed with Pbuch. I thought he was going to be faster. I saw him get beat multiple times, and he would make the tackle after giving up the catch, but he didnt seem to know the ball was coming.

All in all Im intrigued. Last year I saw Drob fall down while backpedaling in the preseason and then he rebounded nicely, so I wont judge the rookies yet. The game was a blast and I highly recommend going to everyone!!

LBC_Justin
08-13-2005, 11:22 PM
7. Cheerleaders are hotter than ever. One of them was having minor wardrobe issues, but I wasnt complaining...hehe

Let's cut straight to the important issues....
Was it one of the twins?
Tell us more of this wardrobe issue.

utahmark
08-13-2005, 11:22 PM
buchannon didnt look good

i thougt peek played pretty well. he was close to some big plays and he made some good tackles. but most impressive is that he seemed to always be in the right spot. i remember a bootleg that he stayed home and made the qb pass the ball. it was a completion but was not his fault. he did his job. he seemed to be in on a few running plays also.

gtexan02
08-13-2005, 11:38 PM
Let's cut straight to the important issues....
Was it one of the twins?
Tell us more of this wardrobe issue.

Haha, Well I was sitting in section 131 if anyone else knows what I am talking about. I don't think it was one of the twins. Anyway, baasically her pants were a bit low for the 2nd half so she had some undergarments showing. The cheerleader coach came over to her once or twice to ask her to retuck.

As for the actual football--

I guess the comment about Peek was in reference to comparing his energy for this game to last years energy. last year he seemed like a bomb waiting to explode. he seemed much more controlled this game, and I was hoping for that raw energy again.

TigerBait
08-13-2005, 11:50 PM
When did PBuch get beat "Multiple times"? only thing that could be considering being beat was that pass early to Lelie, and he had good technique just wasn't looking for the ball and was caught out of position, but he was there. No other plays against him stuck out in my mind. Granted he didnt make much of an impact but he was only in for 3-4 series.

gtexan02
08-13-2005, 11:52 PM
He was behind Lelie in that pass. Then there was another one where the pass was a deep throw down the sideline to the 20-25 or so, and he was running next to the receiver but not seeming to know where the ball was. It looked like it could have been an easily defended pass.

Grid
08-13-2005, 11:53 PM
my thoughts.

First offense and defense both looked good. Buchanan didnt impress but I thought everyone else looked good.

Wells looked good out there as well.. I think between Wells, Hollings, and Morency.. wells looks like the best candidate for #2 at this point.

Morency looked like a rook whos gonna need time to learn how to play in the NFL.

Kasper looked good... Starling didnt. Im thinking Johnson, Gaffney, Armstrong, Mathis, Bradford, and Kasper all make the team. Starling goes back to PT.

Hodgedon isnt ready to start.

all in all i thought the line looked ALOT better. Carr had protection.

We gotta do SOMETHING about our goalline situations.. 4 tries and no TD? ugh.

Matt Murphy did an impressive job.


All in all i think we looked really good for our first preseason game.

blockhead83
08-14-2005, 12:00 AM
I think our RB situation is looking very good. Wells didn't look like his normal 2 yards and a cloud of dust self. He didn't back into the line, he ran with a burst, and he fought for extra yards. Hollings displayed a veteran savvy that was absent his past two seasons. I think he's starting to really catch on. Morency has the physical attributes of a solid running back, he's exceptionally quick. If he can get himself into more of a north and south mindset, as well as calm some of his rookie jitters, I think he could be serving as our #2 at some point this season. It'll be a good battle among those guys. Wells ability to play both fullback and runningback may mean the end for Jarrod Baxter's stay with the Texans.

ledzeppelin229
08-14-2005, 12:01 AM
I was really impressed by Morency's quickness and acceleration. Even though he had a couple busted plays, the ability is definitely there.

Marcus
08-14-2005, 12:04 AM
Things I liked:

1st team offense and defense seemed to have the upper hand on the line of scrimmage. I was pleasantly surprised and encouraged by that. DD ran the ball well. I'm not counting the the 4 handoffs at the goal-line because Denver knew what was coming on all four downs. Capers wanted to see if they could get it in anyway. They didn't, and they'll regret it this week in practice.

I thought that both Riley and Seth Wand played well, especially Wand.

Antwan Peek seemed to be focusing on being in the right position, but he's still thinking, and not reacting instinctively, but I'm not worried about it. He'll get better.

Hollings carried the ball real well.

The things I didn't like:

First and foremost was the obvious lack of depth. The drop off in talent between the 1st and 2nd teams was very apparent.

Buchannon let his man get open a couple of times, but then, so did DRob.

Morency is a fumble waiting to happen. He's got the quickness, but he dances around too much. He's going to learn it the hard way just like DD learned it the hard way, but it will take time.

hook'em07carter
08-14-2005, 12:26 AM
I sat in section 129 row A and i saw what he was talking about

V Man
08-14-2005, 01:22 AM
Liked

The first offense (except the goalline stop)
The first defense
Was really impressed with Afred Malone #66. He was always around the ball. He looked pretty good for an undrafted rookie.
Van Pelt, I liked him in college (think Denver would take Ragone and Symmons for him).

Disliked

Non-starting secondary, they seemed lost all night.
Ragone and Symmons: Ragones passes were getting spiked like volleyballs, and Symmons didn't seem to realize that we were wearing white.

Ibar_Harry
08-14-2005, 02:56 AM
I went over to the chronicle and listened to McClain and I would say he didn't like a lot of what he saw. He tried to remain somewhat positive, but you can read between the lines. He's very nervous about the high ankle sprain suffered by Wiegert, if that indeed is what it is. Said there were about 20 fans in the stands at the end of the game. If that was the case I would think an owner would be getting a little bit POed. McClain seemed to emphasize that the honey moon is over. Also said the Texans got more out of 3 days of practice than the game tonight at Reliant. He said something about no one should have paid money to see the game.

I believe AJ, Kasper and Mathis will be the starting receivers as of now. I firmly believe Gaffny has injury problems and he may be a no show for the beginning or the entire season. Wells got injured and he was probably the number 2 back. Its amazing how we start TC and the next thing you know we are nothing but a bunch of walking wounded before the season even starts. We do not have the depth to withstand these kinds of injuries.

To me the offense is doing very much the same as they were last year. We often did well on our 1st series of downs and then the you know what hit the fan. Everyone is talking about the 1st series going well, but I didn't see that the rest of the game. We have little if any consistancy and that continues to show. We do not stretch the field. In fact we are quite frankly boring to watch.

I think Swinton lost his job tonight and Mathis will be the return man and WR. PBuck will be his backup. Murphy might become the TE we need. I know we are trying to evaluate personnel, but we seem to put them in a position to fail. Apparently they have been talking about making some offensive line switches, but the injury to Wiegert may preclude them from doing that. I really believe we are not using our O-line players in the best way we could, but that's a coaching issue.

Its nonsense to say this is only preseason. Yes, preseason is a time to learn, but you would expect to see the changes yield some results. If they are not really showing their offense, I suspect we will be learning well into the season. That is not a good indicator of success. You know what, I think this idea that Palmer changed everything up and they have changed the blocking assignments is a lot of BS. I keep saying something is rotten in Denmark. I hope I'm wrong, but something really smells about this game.

Malloy
08-14-2005, 04:24 AM
"Haha, Well I was sitting in section 131 if anyone else knows what I am talking about. I don't think it was one of the twins. Anyway, baasically her pants were a bit low for the 2nd half so she had some undergarments showing. The cheerleader coach came over to her once or twice to ask her to retuck"

But where are the PICTURES to prove this ? :)

clandestin
08-14-2005, 04:30 AM
To me the offense is doing very much the same as they were last year. We often did well on our 1st series of downs and then the you know what hit the fan. Everyone is talking about the 1st series going well, but I didn't see that the rest of the game. We have little if any consistancy and that continues to show. We do not stretch the field. In fact we are quite frankly boring to watch.

Its nonsense to say this is only preseason. Yes, preseason is a time to learn, but you would expect to see the changes yield some results. If they are not really showing their offense, I suspect we will be learning well into the season. That is not a good indicator of success. You know what, I think this idea that Palmer changed everything up and they have changed the blocking assignments is a lot of BS. I keep saying something is rotten in Denmark. I hope I'm wrong, but something really smells about this game.

"We have little if any consistancy and that continues to show"

Are you even aware that most of the starters got pulled after the first series? That the only time you saw the first team play they drove 70 some yards and made it look easy?

If your point is that the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd string teams were not "consistent" with eachother......hmm....actually if that's your point then the reply isn't worth the digital ink.

Quick summary:

1st and 2nd team offenses went:

--drive ~70 yards to the 1 (before being stopped on the GL which I admit was disappointing, but not concerning)

--2nd team drives half the field and scores a touchdown vs. the 1st team Denver D

1st team defense:

--held Denver to 3 and out
--gave up a 1st down, then forced a punt (that was nearly blocked)

There's just not much there to be pessimistic about, no matter how hard-core pessimist you are. Everything that came after those series was simply a chance to evaluate individual players.

Grid
08-14-2005, 04:35 AM
OH.. and I think Shantee Orr (think thats how its spelled) is quickly earning himself a spot on the depth chart. It could be Babin and Peek starting with Anderson and Orr backing them up.

ccdude730
08-14-2005, 04:35 AM
easy there ibar.

first of all, gaffney will play this season and they have not inserted him into a game because of the contact. i would much rather him ease his way back than shove him in to get playing time like everyone else. dont worry, there is no conspiracy here.

what is the situation with wells being injured? i did not hear about that. i thought he did really well and think he is our #2 RB while playing #2 FB also.

alot of these injuries are just precautions for keeping full contact minimal. most of these guys would be playing if this were the regular season.

as far as the offense, i did see some things different, but im not offensive guru to where i could tell you many of the changes and schemes they showed. adding to that, we ran basic offense. here are a few observations i took note of: the audibles were not run to the right, we set up bootlegs well with the runs, they tried wells at FB, and lots of communication between the linemen. i also think they are commiting to getting some yards rather than an incomplete, and by that i mean carr moving around and throwing a shorter route rather than a deep ball.

the reason we did well on our 1st series is because our first stringers were in there. there is a problem with depth but that is no reason to say we are the same team as last season that has no consistency.

and btw, as a texan fan, im always excited to see them play - even if some think we are boring to watch. :texans:

Porky
08-14-2005, 09:49 AM
Some personal observations based on just watching the game live...

The good:
I thought there were plenty of changes to the first team offense. The rollouts really worked well. Getting Carr on the move alot is a good idea. The whole first team offense looked good to me. Carr actually had a pocket to work in when needed, and the run blocking was excellent. Riley simply devoured his man a couple of times. He has the lead going into week 2 in my mind, although Wand did well too. In general, the first team Oline gets an A in my book.

Wells looked the best I have ever seen him. I also liked the plays where he lined up at FB and took a swing pass. He ran with authority and found the creases in the defense, and wasn't hesitant at all. Great job Wells! Hollings also looked the best I have seen yet, finally running a bit more north-south, although he has the speed to take it wide and run by guys at times too. It's very evident to me that we have the best group of RB's by far in year 4.

On defense, I liked what I saw from the first team, and some of the second team as well. I thought Robaire Smith and Gary Walker were really holding the point of attack well. This bodes well for us in the regular season. The line in general was really doing it's job well. Greenwood looked very athletic, but I didn't see anything that jumped out at me. Robinson was great in limited duty. Orr made some athletic plays on D and ST. He is a keeper. A guy who I had never heard of - Alfred Malone - really jumped out at me. Granted he was playing against 2nd and 3rd teamers, but he made a case for himself to at least make the practice squad. Jason Bell also flashed. Here was a guy I thought had little chance to make it again, and he showed last night he can cover, and can still be a good ST guy. He helped himself alot. Peek impressed me not because he played like a man possesed, but because he played an under controlled, disciplined game at OLB. He kept containment much better than last year, and although he didn't make a big play, he did all the little things right. I think in time, we will see the big plays return, but it is even more important to be a steady, consistent performer.

Now the bad:
Morency is not ready to play...yet. He has some pretty impressive talent for sure. He can cut on a dime, has impressive accelration, and the speed to turn the corner if needed. However, he was dancing way too much, and didn't always take the best path thru the d, often trying to bounce outside, when a move more up the gut would have been called for. He needs to develop a bit more patience, let his blocks develop, make his cut, and move thru the hole. In time, I think he has starters talent. Right now, I see him 3rd or even 4th on the depth chart with the talent we have now at RB.

It's obvious Ragone is an MVP canditite.....in NFL Europe. Playing against that grade of D, he might excel. In America, he is a 3rd stringer at best. In my mind, it's official. Using a 3rd rounder on Ragone was a mistake, and a bust. He cannot even excel againt NFL 2nd and 3rd stringers. What will he do against 1st team defenses if the need arose? I shudder to think.

Symons is not NFL ready, even as a 3rd stringer. Maybe they can stash him one more yr on IR after the shoulder injury. I think he deserves one more shot, but he is fading fast as far as a possible NFL career.

The one disapointment for the 1st team offense is not being able to move the ball one yard in 4 attempts. In the regular season, I doubt we run essentially the same play 4 times, but regardless, you have to punch it in there. Maybe Wells would have been able to power his way in, but again, this is preseason, and I'm sure he wanted to get Robaire, DD, and the oline on tape to evaulate, so once we get to the regular season, he will know better what to do.

That's the main things that stick out. After I watch the tape, I am sure I will see some things I missed.

Dime
08-14-2005, 09:55 AM
I went over to the chronicle and listened to McClain and I would say he didn't like a lot of what he saw. He tried to remain somewhat positive, but you can read between the lines. He's very nervous about the high ankle sprain suffered by Wiegert, if that indeed is what it is. Said there were about 20 fans in the stands at the end of the game. If that was the case I would think an owner would be getting a little bit POed. McClain seemed to emphasize that the honey moon is over. Also said the Texans got more out of 3 days of practice than the game tonight at Reliant. He said something about no one should have paid money to see the game.

I believe AJ, Kasper and Mathis will be the starting receivers as of now. I firmly believe Gaffny has injury problems and he may be a no show for the beginning or the entire season. Wells got injured and he was probably the number 2 back. Its amazing how we start TC and the next thing you know we are nothing but a bunch of walking wounded before the season even starts. We do not have the depth to withstand these kinds of injuries.

To me the offense is doing very much the same as they were last year. We often did well on our 1st series of downs and then the you know what hit the fan. Everyone is talking about the 1st series going well, but I didn't see that the rest of the game. We have little if any consistancy and that continues to show. We do not stretch the field. In fact we are quite frankly boring to watch.

I think Swinton lost his job tonight and Mathis will be the return man and WR. PBuck will be his backup. Murphy might become the TE we need. I know we are trying to evaluate personnel, but we seem to put them in a position to fail. Apparently they have been talking about making some offensive line switches, but the injury to Wiegert may preclude them from doing that. I really believe we are not using our O-line players in the best way we could, but that's a coaching issue.

Its nonsense to say this is only preseason. Yes, preseason is a time to learn, but you would expect to see the changes yield some results. If they are not really showing their offense, I suspect we will be learning well into the season. That is not a good indicator of success. You know what, I think this idea that Palmer changed everything up and they have changed the blocking assignments is a lot of BS. I keep saying something is rotten in Denmark. I hope I'm wrong, but something really smells about this game.

Wells was injuried? I didnt see this?

infantrycak
08-14-2005, 10:02 AM
The one disapointment for the 1st team offense is not being able to move the ball one yard in 4 attempts. In the regular season, I doubt we run essentially the same play 4 times, but regardless, you have to punch it in there.

One problem IMO was Robaire was coming off the snap like a DLmen and not a lead blocker. He fired off and ahead, generally crushing one or two people, but then D players flowed behind him to DD. Robaire needs to wait just long enough for DD to get the ball and get on his butt and then drive the train into the endzone.

Blake
08-14-2005, 10:08 AM
Wells pulled something in his hand. Nothing serious.

I was a little discouraged that with 4 attempts at the ONE YARD LINE we couldnt punch it in. David Carr talks about having a package built for that situation this year, but still, the fact that your front cant move their front one yard, in 4 attempts is a little discouraging.

Matt Murphy is soon to be the starter. He can block, and we all saw him catch.

Our overall Offense has me excited. We had no problem moving the ball down the field. I think we will have great sucess as a pass/run team, and not just pass, or run.

nunusguy
08-14-2005, 10:31 AM
Matt Murphy is soon to be the starter. He can block, and we all saw him catch.

I've been wondering if Murphy's TD catch was just kinda one of those
preseason flukes, or maybe the most significant play of our first preseason
game. With all the bad luck the team has had at TE because of poor ole
Bennie Joppru injuries, it sems like we deserve some good luck from an unexpected source at that position. Could Murphy really be ready to challenge for the the starting job at TE ?

Dime
08-14-2005, 10:33 AM
Wells pulled something in his hand. Nothing serious.

I was a little discouraged that with 4 attempts at the ONE YARD LINE we couldnt punch it in. David Carr talks about having a package built for that situation this year, but still, the fact that your front cant move their front one yard, in 4 attempts is a little discouraging.

Matt Murphy is soon to be the starter. He can block, and we all saw him catch.

Our overall Offense has me excited. We had no problem moving the ball down the field. I think we will have great sucess as a pass/run team, and not just pass, or run.

I dont think Davis is the answer for goalline plays.. I think Wells would have had more sucess.

texanfan
08-14-2005, 10:36 AM
I've been wondering if Murphy's TD catch was just kinda one of those
preseason flukes, or maybe the most significant play of our first preseason
game. With all the bad luck the team has had at TE because of poor ole
Bennie Joppru injuries, it sems like we deserve some good luck from an unexpected source at that position. Could Murphy really be ready to challenge for the the starting job at TE ?


I just saw a clip of Carr being interviewed saying Matt Murphy does this all the time in practice.

infantrycak
08-14-2005, 10:41 AM
I dont think Davis is the answer for goalline plays.. I think Wells would have had more sucess.

Other than a roster saying Wells weighs 30 more pounds, what has he ever done to hint he would be a better goalline runner? He has never run as hard as DD and hasn't demonstrated any greater ability in short yardage situations over the past two years. Kudos to Wells for running much harder last season and yesterday, but he has been playing catch up to run anywhere near as hard as DD in the 1st place.

cuppacoffee
08-14-2005, 10:57 AM
Some personal observations based on just watching the game live...


It's obvious Ragone is an MVP canditite.....in NFL Europe. Playing against that grade of D, he might excel. In America, he is a 3rd stringer at best. In my mind, it's official. Using a 3rd rounder on Ragone was a mistake, and a bust. He cannot even excel againt NFL 2nd and 3rd stringers. What will he do against 1st team defenses if the need arose? I shudder to think.

Symons is not NFL ready, even as a 3rd stringer. Maybe they can stash him one more yr on IR after the shoulder injury. I think he deserves one more shot, but he is fading fast as far as a possible NFL career.




I have been holding out hope for Ragone. No more

IMHO We need to find the eventual replacement for Banks and the replacement is not currently on the team.

Txnpride
08-14-2005, 10:58 AM
I had to watch the game at home.....Any pics of the wardrope malfunction??????ANYONE??????As far as Peek,After watching the replay on the offsides call...the ref blew the call,the Bronco was def moving back before Peek jumped...he was moving so quick on the snap,it just looked like he was off sides.We will be alright......cant wait till the first teamers are on for the full game....very promising on both sides of the ball.I think Morency was a little nervous,he will get it together before its all said and done.Sure was good to see our boys back on the field.

nunusguy
08-14-2005, 11:11 AM
Anybody pay any attention to Hodgdon ? Yea, he got a couple of penalties,
but he's a rookie playing in his first NFL game and he'd be tight. Initially I was concerned about him being undersized, but nevertheless he looked real good on a couple plays, looked quick and aggressive. Now I'm not jumping to any conclusions and saying he's ready to start or anything, but we do need some quality reserves in the line and since this guy can play center and guard, he
might really help us and soon.

infantrycak
08-14-2005, 11:11 AM
As far as Peek,After watching the replay on the offsides call...the ref blew the call,the Bronco was def moving back before Peek jumped...he was moving so quick on the snap,it just looked like he was off sides.


One of the guys on 610 said it was absolutely a blown call after the game last night.

DoCt3rJ
08-14-2005, 11:15 AM
Both 1st string offense and defense looked good. If you watched Buch on the plays he diden't get beat, he was all over his man, their going to get beat... they just have to not get beat that often =) I think Buch is better at short passes, where he can use his quickness, instead of his long speed. Lelie is fast as hell, I don't think even Buch can keep up with him. I wanted to see more pass rushing out of Peek, but one thing I saw was he diden't bite on a PA fake and he moved out to cover the qb and jumped up and almost tipped the pass. Peek showed great awareness, just not great pass rushing =) yea he did get devoured by the OT alot, but what OLB in a 3-4 doesen't have that happen to them? I don't think Capers blitzed as much as he usual would in a regular game. Babin looked good, made some good tackles. I hope we show better pash rush than we did last night though...

nunusguy
08-14-2005, 11:28 AM
I wanted to see more pass rushing out of PeekI hope we show better pash rush than we did last night though...
They are gonna save the good stuff for the rook QB in Buffalo on 9/11 (Whoa-
just realized that will be the 4 yr anniversiry of "the" 9/11 !). You will see blitzing out the wazoo from Peek, Babin, & Co on that day. Oh we'll see a few
things between now and then, more than last night, but you'll have to wait for the regular season in September for the real show.

infantrycak
08-14-2005, 11:29 AM
Peek showed great awareness, just not great pass rushing =) yea he did get devoured by the OT alot, but what OLB in a 3-4 doesen't have that happen to them?

What OLB period doesn't have that happen to them? Not you specifically, but IMO a lot of people don't really realize how relatively rare sacks are. The top two OLB's in the league for sacks last year managed 10.5 and 10 sacks. That was on 501 and 607 passing plays. Heck the best DE in the league got 16 sacks on 557 passing plays. The vast majority of the time, the OT will win.

NathanT27
08-14-2005, 11:32 AM
Last night was my first ever Texans game I have ever been too, I do agree we need to find a better backup QB other then Tony Banks and Ragone. And I do agree Wells should have been put in on the goal line to get the TD then use DD who could not get in. All in all I did see alot of improvement. Now us fans need to get into it. I heard 2 guys say 2 season tickets for sale its going to be a long one, and personally its too early to give up on the Texans. I had a blast and I WILL be going back to another Texans game and I cannot wait to support my team!!!!!!!!

Ibar_Harry
08-14-2005, 11:41 AM
easy there ibar.

first of all, gaffney will play this season and they have not inserted him into a game because of the contact. i would much rather him ease his way back than shove him in to get playing time like everyone else. dont worry, there is no conspiracy here.

what is the situation with wells being injured? i did not hear about that. i thought he did really well and think he is our #2 RB while playing #2 FB also.

alot of these injuries are just precautions for keeping full contact minimal. most of these guys would be playing if this were the regular season.

as far as the offense, i did see some things different, but im not offensive guru to where i could tell you many of the changes and schemes they showed. adding to that, we ran basic offense. here are a few observations i took note of: the audibles were not run to the right, we set up bootlegs well with the runs, they tried wells at FB, and lots of communication between the linemen. i also think they are commiting to getting some yards rather than an incomplete, and by that i mean carr moving around and throwing a shorter route rather than a deep ball.

the reason we did well on our 1st series is because our first stringers were in there. there is a problem with depth but that is no reason to say we are the same team as last season that has no consistency.

and btw, as a texan fan, im always excited to see them play - even if some think we are boring to watch. :texans:

Yea, he injured his finger and will have to see a hand specialist. I forget who else has that problem on the Texans. Thank you for posting your observations and discussing what you saw. I'm nervous about accepting one series as a statement of how we are doing. If you look at the previous years, you will find we often do well on the 1st series, the other team adjusts, and then we struggle. I think we needed to play more than 1 series with our 1st team offense, but Capers has a problem with injuries and we have no depth. Its true we want to evaluate players, but I think they are scared to death of injuries like Wiegert suffered. That one injury potentially blows the whole season and everything they were working on. McClain said they were indeed thinking about moving McKinney to Guard and Washington to center, but that the Wiegert injury may nix that. I don't think anybody has seen any bright spots out of our backup O-linemen other than perhaps the new young center. He's a ways away, however, from being a lot of help.

Doom Capers
08-14-2005, 11:54 AM
We are one of the better red zone scoring teams in the AFC. Don't get all worked up because DD got stuffed. I don't recall that happening in a real game on the 1 yard line.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:05 PM
RoSmith was blowing people away at FB but we don't know if he was blowing up the right guy.

Wells didn't run very impressively. He has no explosion and is slow in the hole.

Morency looks shot out of a cannon when he gets the ball. He is going to be very explosive when he gets the feel for this scheme and learns to make one cut and go north and south.

Most of the QB pressure was coming from the inside again. I saw the reserve Guards getting lit up all night.

The overall team speed looks improved and our first team O-line was moving players off the LOS. I'm very upbeat about yesterday....got me very excited about our potential.

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:07 PM
yeah, the 4 stuffs on the 1 yard line was more of an experiment in my opinion. we had robaire playing fullback and after watching some tape, he hit whoever he hit hard, but sometimes he should have hit somebody else on the lead block. i think if norris was in there, we would have scored. no need to get worried on this one. all capers did was run 2 plays . we did something like left side, right side, left side, right side. probably just wanted to see which side would be best to run that play on. i think if this game meant something, the play calls would have been different. :texans:

BradK10
08-14-2005, 12:08 PM
after that first play where Robaire blocked Lynch, after the whistle Lynch was saying something to him. I wonder what he was saying....

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:13 PM
Now the bad:
Morency is not ready to play...yet. He has some pretty impressive talent for sure. He can cut on a dime, has impressive accelration, and the speed to turn the corner if needed. However, he was dancing way too much, and didn't always take the best path thru the d, often trying to bounce outside, when a move more up the gut would have been called for. He needs to develop a bit more patience, let his blocks develop, make his cut, and move thru the hole. In time, I think he has starters talent. Right now, I see him 3rd or even 4th on the depth chart with the talent we have now at RB.

Morency was our most impressive runner tonight if you are looking at sheer running ability and talent. EASILY. He missed one hole and laid the ball on the ground but he was easily our most explosive back as he was running with the second team unit. He just explodes out of his stance and he is going to be the future lead back here imo. That was his first rookie action. Game film and a little more scheme learning and he's going to be awesome. Hollings was impressive too, he brings tons of speed to the backfield. Wells may not make this team, he is slow to the hole and his only talent is that he can take a hit.

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:16 PM
Morency was our most impressive runner tonight if you are looking at sheer running ability and talent. EASILY. He missed one hole and laid the ball on the ground but he was easily our most explosive back as he was running with the second team unit. He just explodes out of his stance and he is going to be the future lead back here imo. That was his first rookie action. Game film and a little more scheme learning and he's going to be awesome. Hollings was impressive too, he brings tons of speed to the backfield. Wells may not make this team, he is slow to the hole and his only talent is that he can take a hit.


Wells plays alot of special teams too. sure he's slow, but even then he still managed to get yards. i just don't see wells not making the team. he's too versatile.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:17 PM
I think we keep Hollings, Morency and Davis at back. If Wells can't make a spot at FB he's going to be toast.

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:21 PM
Wells 4 rushes for 18 yards. 4.5 avg
Hollings 4 rushes for 11 yards. 2.8 avg
Davis 7 rushes for 20 yards. 2.9 avg
Morency 10 rushes for 26 yards. 2.6 avg

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:22 PM
so what? I know what I see by my eyeballs. Wells loafed thru huge holes and was slow and plodding. Morency has the worst avg but was easily the most explosive back on the field last night...from either team. Hollings had that big screen pass and can make something happen at 3rd and long. Wells is slow, not elusive, but can take a hit and fall forward well.

Ibar_Harry
08-14-2005, 12:23 PM
Now the bad:
Morency is not ready to play...yet. He has some pretty impressive talent for sure. He can cut on a dime, has impressive accelration, and the speed to turn the corner if needed. However, he was dancing way too much, and didn't always take the best path thru the d, often trying to bounce outside, when a move more up the gut would have been called for. He needs to develop a bit more patience, let his blocks develop, make his cut, and move thru the hole. In time, I think he has starters talent. Right now, I see him 3rd or even 4th on the depth chart with the talent we have now at RB.


Actually, Dom said some similar things in his after the game press conference. Your saying he's not ready, not that he doesn't have talent. The same could be said of Mathis. He has a lot of talent, but he's not ready, yet. But he might be closer to being ready than Morancy.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:25 PM
Morency is MUCH closer to a complete player at his position than Mathis. At RB he just needs to adjust to a zone blocking scheme. Mathis has a ton of stuff to work out. Ibar you sure have a ton of opinions for a guy who didn't watch the game.

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:26 PM
so what? I know what I see by my eyeballs. Wells loafed thru huge holes and was slow and plodding. Morency has the worst avg but was easily the most explosive back on the field last night...from either team. Hollings had that big screen pass and can make something happen at 3rd and long. Wells is slow, not elusive, but can take a hit and fall forward well.

Wells will make the team. no doubt about it. slow, yes, but can fall forward and pick up yards where another guy would be driven back. he holds onto the ball, and is versatile. caught a nice pass, but the defender was right with him and took him down immediately.

Ibar_Harry
08-14-2005, 12:27 PM
Capers likes Wells versatility and work ethic. They like Morancy too, but I think Hollings is the more likely candidate for the axe.

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:28 PM
i think we're gonna keep 4 RBs this season. the axe will probably go to baxter at FB.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:29 PM
Wells will make the team. no doubt about it. slow, yes, but can fall forward and pick up yards where another guy would be driven back. he holds onto the ball, and is versatile. caught a nice pass, but the defender was right with him and took him down immediately.
We'll see. If he makes the team it will be due to special teams only. I have a pretty good eye for talent.

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:31 PM
i don't know about Wells just making the team because of special teams. if morency and hollings are so much better, why was wells running with the first and second teams while hollings was running with 2nd and 3rd teams and morency with 3rd teams. i think capers gets to see alot more of wells than we see on tv and practice. JMHO

Wolf
08-14-2005, 12:31 PM
i agree with Vinny on Morency. He has an explosion that DD or Wells doesn't have. He needs to learn to get North and South. Honestly with DD and Wells I don't get that "take it all the way" feeling when they get into the open field.. that is what is needed to pressure the defense to get out of the Cover 2.. Granted it was one game but at this point.

of course I am not a scout or coach.

Wolf
08-14-2005, 12:33 PM
i don't know about Wells just making the team because of special teams. if morency and hollings are so much better, why was wells running with the first and second teams while hollings was running with 2nd and 3rd teams and morency with 3rd teams. i think capers gets to see alot more than wells than we see on tv and practice. JMHO
sometimes it is a misconception on the depth chart.. sometimes not. With Wells it is either he earned it or the coaches want to evaluate a player with 1st string talent around them and going against 1st string talent on the D

vtech9
08-14-2005, 12:34 PM
We'll see. If he makes the team it will be due to special teams only. I have a pretty good eye for talent.
In YOUR opinion. It seems to me that you are in the minority as far as Wells is concerned.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:35 PM
Yep, and nothing wrong with that...but I do have a pretty good track history with my postings over the last 4 years here. I think I know what I talk of most of the time. Of course it's my opinion....der!

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:37 PM
I use to be a wells hater. but after watching 3 seasons, he's been improving every season which is why i kinda like the guy now. sure he's not the fastest guy out there or the most explosive, but not all good running backs are. if you can overpower and runover defenders you can also be a running back.

Wolf
08-14-2005, 12:41 PM
I use to be a wells hater. but after watching 3 seasons, he's been improving every season which is why i kinda like the guy now. sure he's not the fastest guy out there or the most explosive, but not all good running backs are. if you can overpower and runover defenders you can also be a running back.
I think Wells got the short end of the stick. Everybody thought he was just horrible in 2002 .. and it was unfair due to the OL being that bad.. DD came in and played with a little better OL in 2003 than what Wells had and yet people just marvel at DD.. When Well has played since 2002, his stats are comparible to DD with the same OL..I like JW. I just wish (with his size) he ran as hard as DD and punish people. and with that , I am not sure if he just got shell shocked being our line in 2002 or what.

Ibar_Harry
08-14-2005, 12:42 PM
I use to be a wells hater. but after watching 3 seasons, he's been improving every season which is why i kinda like the guy now. sure he's not the fastest guy out there or the most explosive, but not all good running backs are. if you can overpower and runover defenders you can also be a running back.

When you get on Vinny's list you just have to have a thick skin. He can be wrong too. From everything we've heard from Capers he really likes Wells a lot. I don't think he's locked into Wells, but someone else will have to take the job away from Wells and there will not be that many opportunities to do so. Wells played well while he was in there.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 12:43 PM
I don't have a 'list' Ibar. I will counter arguments I don't agree with though.

ATX
08-14-2005, 12:45 PM
vinny usually has good insight on the game and the texans. i just happen not to agree with him on this issue. but nothing wrong with that.

The Preacher
08-14-2005, 01:01 PM
Thanks for all the opinions I missed the game due to a satelite outage. No more trips to Tulsa during football season! Sounds like good news for the most part except Wiegert. :headbang:

blockhead83
08-14-2005, 01:03 PM
I dunno I was impressed with Wells relative to what he's done the last few seasons. He wasn't wasting time in the backfield or backing into the line of scrimmage. He picked his hole and used his size and momentum to carry him through. He also has the hands and speed (for a fullback) to give us alot of options if he's in at FB. Based purely on their performance last night he's our #2 right now behind DD. However, I think most would agree that based purely on athletic talent, Davis and Morency are on top. It's only a matter of time before Morency picks up the system and becomes a really productive back for us, IMO.

tsip
08-14-2005, 01:23 PM
...so, how many points did Carr/first team score?

Vinny
08-14-2005, 01:31 PM
...so, how many points did Carr/first team score?I have come to the conculsion you aren't a Texans fan. I never see anything 'fan-like' out of you. Just ripping the team on all levels with little digs and negative comments.

tsip
08-14-2005, 01:38 PM
...sorry, but I just got back into the city and thought I'd take a short cut
on how the game went...

Porky
08-14-2005, 01:45 PM
I agree with Vinny on Morency in that he clearly was the most explosive back out there. But I thought he didn't always pick the proper hole to run thru, and tried to use his speed, and change of direction ability to try and outwork the defense to the outside, rather than letting the blocks develop, and making his cut, and moving north-south. I saw way too much east-west from him. That's okay, as Hollings did the same thing as a rookie, and I thought Hollings did a much better job last night of waiting for his block, making one cut, and going. I think over time Morency will develop that as well. He just needs to get as much PT as possible. He may develop quickly, or it may take a year or so. Either way, I think he is the most gifted athlete at RB already.

I agree that Wells was the slowest to the hole last night. He doesn't have near the speed of Hollings, or the quickness and burst that Morency and Davis have. Having said that, I was still impressed by him last night, much more than Vinny was. I thought he was much more decisive with his moves, danced around a lot less, displayed more power thru the hole, and finished his runs very well. No, he isn't as phycisically gifted, but as a backup RB, I am more than okay with him. In addition, he is extremely versatile. I saw him line up at FB, and he can take passes from the FB spot, which Norris cannot do. He is also a ST standout. I would be shocked if he is cut. I think Baxter is the one that needs to watch for the Turk.

William.carter
08-14-2005, 01:50 PM
It amazes me that people who call themselves fans of the game or of our team miss the point of preseason entirely. If preseason was about winning then they wouldn't call it PRE season... it would just be THE SEASON. It's not about winning the game. I mean everyone wants to win, it's human nature, but win or lose what the coaches see during the game from each play is what matters. The coaches and staff have a limited amount of time to evaluate their players in game situations and try to determine which 53 guys out of the 90 something they currently have on their roster, they can get the most production out of in the REGULAR season. So look for the positives, find a way to build on the negatives and go from there.

Ragging and moaning about how much we suck isn't team spirit and isn't remotely productive. Stating your opinion is one thing, but blatenly flaiming the team at every corner isn't being a fan. If that is you objective here, fine another team to "support". The Texans don't need "fans" like that.

GP
08-14-2005, 01:53 PM
We have a very flammable situation at RB.

We just gave DD a big contract, and he deserves it. But at some point, something is going to happen that will cause us to insert Morency. And from what I saw of last night's game...he has the goods to create a RB controversy.

He is so explosive off the snap that I think most of his busted plays were the result of the blocking not taking place FAST enough. Just think what he could have accomplished with our first team offense.

Wells is just a weird situation altogether. Good special teams guy, made some clutch plays last season, etc. He should have been cut the first two seasons, but after last year's effort and with what I saw last night...I think he hangs on for this year at least.

Overall, I am very pleased with our RB situation thus far.

McClain can kiss my rear. I watched every single minute of the game last night. Yes, it wasn't entertaining...but at least our first-string QB didn't break his ankle like Grossman did. Last time I checked, the regular season is the schedule that COUNTS. And, at least we weren't as pathetic and desperate for a pre-season win as the Broncos. They ran their second-string QB through three quarters when we had already cycled through our first THREE (Carr, Banks, Ragone).

Lucky
08-14-2005, 02:09 PM
They ran their second-string QB through three quarters when we had already cycled through our first THREE (Carr, Banks, Ragone).
Van Pelt has very few snaps under his belt. He needs the work. But you're right, the Broncos did go with their frontline guys longer than the Texans did.

NoBullTexan
08-14-2005, 02:12 PM
According to the Chronic, Wells has a possible torn tendon in his right index finger. :crying:

disaacks3
08-14-2005, 02:34 PM
The biggest concern I had was the inability of the 1st-team offense to put it in from 1 yd. out. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt on that though, since they were still trying out some new things for goal-line situations.

P-Buc went into the locker room at halftime w/ a noticeable limp...anyone know if he was suffereing some sort of lingering injury?

Morency did look more explosive than the other choices. Beyond the first string O-Line, we had major assignment problems.

Since we didn't get any good replay of the TJ roughing the passer play at the game, was he really that late with the hit? The flag wasn't thrown until after the play was essentially over.

Now for the "important" stuff.... :pigfly:

Halftime Pt. I - The halftime show just.....BLEW. I think Alto Gary came up with that nightmare of a cheerleader show after a night of binge drinking or something. When they came out, everyone around me thought they were middle school / high school girls. I thought it looked like the Shirelles with the metallic outfits and blonde wigs. It was scary. For those who saw it, I'm sorry. For those who didn't, consider yourselves lucky. It was definitely a "WTF" experience.

Halftime Pt. II - Somebody, somewhere in the Texans organization needs to learn how to 'mike' the band properly. Playing "Also Spake Zarathustra" in honor of Tribute to Space day isn't terribly impressive when you can't hear the horns. It was pretty dismal, especially in light of the really strange Pt. I.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 02:36 PM
Since we didn't get any good replay of the TJ roughing the passer play at the game, was he really that late with the hit? The flag wasn't thrown until after the play was essentially over.

It wasn't a late hit at all. If it was any player other than QB that is a no-call. If he kept his head up instead of down it wouldn't have been a flag. Kind of a cheap call. He hit the QB square between the numbers as the pass was released.

infantrycak
08-14-2005, 02:42 PM
Since we didn't get any good replay of the TJ roughing the passer play at the game, was he really that late with the hit? The flag wasn't thrown until after the play was essentially over.

I'd like to see a replay as well, but it looked like it wasn't the timing of the hit so much as not letting up and driving into his sternum that got the flag.

Vinny
08-14-2005, 02:45 PM
I'd like to see a replay as well, but it looked like it wasn't the timing of the hit so much as not letting up and driving into his sternum that got the flag.Yes, it's a crown of the helmet issue. Not a late hit issue. He has to learn that he has to pick his head up (hit him with his facemask so to speak) when plowing into the QB. You can keep your head down in College but not in the Pros.

disaacks3
08-14-2005, 02:47 PM
It wasn't a late hit at all. If it was any player other than QB that is a no-call. If he kept his head up instead of down it wouldn't have been a flag. Kind of a cheap call. He hit the QB square between the numbers as the pass was released. Thanks, since we were essentially 'behind' the Denver QB, it was hard to tell. It also makes me feel better about 'voicing my displeasure' to the official in question. :heh:

texasguy346
08-14-2005, 04:07 PM
I actually was attending a wedding last night, and I didn't get back in till around 11:30 or so. I recorded the game (Thank You DVD-R) and watched the game from 12 till around 2 this morning. There were several things I liked watching the game early on. Both the first team offense and defense looked pretty good in their first preseason game. The defense looks so much quicker, and the D-Line did a very good job of putting pressure on Plummer in the early going. I saw more blitzing than I've seen in the past from the Texans in a preseason game. There was one play in the second defensive series where the Texans were in their nickle package on a 3rd and long. The Texans came with a zone blitz where Babin dropped from the line into coverage, and the pressure got to Plummer quickly forcing him to make a bad throw. He threw the ball behind his receiver and forced the Broncos to punt. There was another play later on where the Texans brought 5 and looked to drive the Broncos OLine back into Plummer who again forced a bad throw. Peek looks like he's got a very good understanding of his assignments as evidenced by his keeping containment on a running play forcing the RB into the middle where the DLine and ILBs could make a play. He also read and reacted well to a naked boot by Van Pelt by getting between him and his receiver. He looked to tip the pass, but the TE still caught it. Nice recognition still. Babin looks even better with Peek opposite him at the ROLB spot. Wong looked pretty good in what little time he saw at ILB, and Greenwood looked alright but didn't make much noise. Robaire Smith looked very trim, and he did a good job while he was in there. Phillip Buchanon played well but he did get beat by Ashley Lelie at least once. As for the rookies on defense TJ and Brown were very impressive. TJ was a force on the DLine and routinely pushed his man back 4 or 5 yards into the backfield. He made the Broncos RBs change directions many times forcing them into outside defenders. Brown looked good in his first action, and his only blown play to speak of was the pass to Rice in the endzone where Faggins knocked it away at the last moment. It looked as though Brown was supposed to help out on that play, but I could be wrong on that one. Pettway looks alot like Charlie Anderson did this time last year. Lots of potential but needs to improve his strength. McKenzie looked decent, but he will be dominated by bigger receivers. Now for the offense. Offensively the OLine held up well against a pretty good Broncos defense. This was all without Bruener mind you who is our best blocking TE. It looks like the new blocking schemes could pay off. AJ is AJ, and is a physical freak of nature. No surprise there. Carr did a good job in recognizing Bradford had one on one coveraged deep towards the endzone, and tossed it up for grabs. He got a flag that put the ball at the one so a smart play by Carr that won't show up in the stat column. Unfortunately shortly before that Weigert went down, and was out for the rest of the game. That put Weary in at Weigerts spot, and he disappointed. He got absolutely leveled at the goal line. Specifically the fourth down play. Watch the play, and he gets manhandled and goes down quickly. Allowing the defenders to swarm DD. Murphy's TD catch from Banks was a thing of beauty. The Broncos have one safety deep, and either Gold or Wilson was the deep LB responsible for Murphy. At the snap Murphy leaves the line of scrimmage as Gold or Wilson go to cover him he gives a fake to the outside as if he's headed for the pile on in the endzone then as soon as the LB bites he takes it up field. Keep in mind that Gold and Wilson are both very fast LBs. Murphy gets a step on him and as the ball is in the air he increases the distance between he and the defender to make a great TD catch. Very nice play. The pass to Armstrong later on in the game that came on a blitz from the Broncos should have been flagged for pass interference, but Armstrong still almost made the catch anyway. Now for the rookies on offense. Mathis didn't get to show much, but he is very fast (DUH). Morrency is a bit unpolished, but he's got the raw ability to be a very good RB. He was very explosive, but often times he would try to cut outside when he should take the ball upfield. I don't think Hollings has much of a shot of securing the #2 spot on the depth chart at RB if Morrency can learn to hold on to the ball better. I was very surprised at how long and how well Hodgdon played. He did have a couple of penalties, and thats to be expected for a rookie OLineman in his first preseason game. However he did hold his own against guys that were much bigger than him. There wasn't any fumbled snaps or anything of that sort that I'd expect with a rookie center. He was very active, and he didn't stop until the play was over even though the RB was upfield. Once he improves his strength and technique he will be a very good player. Great find by CC. Overall I was very impressed with this draft class, and they seem to be the most NFL ready group of rookies that the Texans have trotted out there to date. The special teams were great last night. Swinton looked good back there fielding punts, and Kasper played well as a gunner. Stanley and Brown played well. I know its a long winded post, but then again with me you have to expect it.

the wonger need food
08-14-2005, 05:33 PM
We saw good and bad last night... mostly bad.

1st and 2nd string units moved the ball well on the ground well. Aside from Banks' TD pass to Murphy, the passing game was anemic and inconsistant, much like last year. While Denver's receivers were consistantly open, Houston's receivers were blanketed all night. Let's hope that Capers and Palmer have a plan to improve the passing game this year.

The first defensive unit looked good for the most part. Seemed like there was quite a bit of penetration up front all night. Travis Johnson had some good plays but also took a lot of plays off. Seems like that was his M.O. in college also. Hopefully the good plays will make up for that. The secondary looked confused at times and left guys with 5 yard cushions consistantly. The long pass to devoe was inexcusable. C.C. brown looked terrible against the pass and/or trying to tackle anyone. The dropped interception in the end zone was ugly and would have been a big play in the game.

Special teams looked really good for the most part. Swinton impressed as a returner, and is an upgrade over JJ. Scates probably had the best punt of the night.

Another pre-season loss is what it is, but winning begets winning and the coaching staff makes no effort to win games. If this team is ever going to make it to the next level it has to learn how to win, pre-season or not.

Best performances:
Kevin Kasper - The guy plays hard and has good instincts. Not as talented as Starling or Swinton, but will make the team ahead of them if he has 3 more games like last night.
Reggie Swinton - As a returner. Big upgrade over J.J. but probably will not make the team unless Gaffney is out for a while. Can't wait to see Mathis here.
Travis Johnson - Lots of penetration most of the night. Took some plays off but you can see the potential.
Domanick Davis - Some very nice runs.
1st and 2nd string O-Line - Running the ball. They were blowing guys off line last night.

Worst performances:
C.C. Brown - Looked a lot like Matt Stevens.
Quarterbacks - From Carr down to Symons the quarterbacks were terrible. The Banks to Murphy hookup was one of the few nice plays of the night. Ragone looked like NFL Ragone and Symons is now irrelevant.
Drew Hodgen - Penalties and allowing pressure up the middle summed up his night.
Coaches - Overall, the team did not look prepared or particularly enthusiastic about playing. Very few players were in position to make plays. The passing offense and defensive secondary looked very bad at times.

nunusguy
08-14-2005, 05:52 PM
McClain can kiss my rear.
Yup, McClain's column today had a hard *** critique of the game last night as if he was talking about a team playing in midseason instead of one playing its first preseason game. Don't know what that was about ?

texanfan2002114
08-14-2005, 05:53 PM
Jason Simmons was burnt atleast twice and was shook by Van Pelt on that 40 yard run. Look bad last night!!

dtran04
08-14-2005, 06:06 PM
Believe it or not, C.C. Brown led the team in tackles.

Marcus
08-14-2005, 06:26 PM
Hey texasguy346, would it kill ya to separate your long-winded posts into more than one long paragraph with some spaces in between, for God' sake?

I could even read it! I took one look at that big blob, and thought I was going to go freaking blind! :embarrass Have a little consideration for us older folks . . please! :whew

bckey
08-14-2005, 06:39 PM
Hey texasguy346, would it kill ya to separate your long-winded posts into more than one long paragraph with some spaces in between, for God' sake?

I could even read it! I took one look at that big blob, and thought I was going to go freaking blind! :embarrass Have a little consideration for us older folks . . please! :whew


LMAO!

TexansTrueFan
08-14-2005, 06:52 PM
i have to agree i say PB didnt look to good, oh and he got burned really bad one time but luckly for us watts couldnt hold onto the ball. I hope i see a lil coverage from him the next pre-season game !!!

BattleRedGuy
08-14-2005, 08:31 PM
My observations

1. We have a problem if we need to rely on Jason Simmons.
2. Penalties. I don't care that it was the first game with no-names playing. Winning is contagious. How many penalties did Denver have?
3. Morency reminds me of Hollings his first year. Hopefully he learns he can not outrun guys to the corner and has the vision to make the right reads.

I look forward to next Saturday when the first team plays more than one series.

texasguy346
08-14-2005, 08:39 PM
Hey texasguy346, would it kill ya to separate your long-winded posts into more than one long paragraph with some spaces in between, for God' sake?

I could even read it! I took one look at that big blob, and thought I was going to go freaking blind! :embarrass Have a little consideration for us older folks . . please! :whew

Yeah sorry bout that, but when I get going it just keeps on going till I'm on empty. It's like when your sick. It's all coming out in one big blob one way or another. Perhaps I'll have to put a warning for older folks in advance of my blobs in the future. :texans:

WWJD
08-14-2005, 08:44 PM
My only observation is that it was a typical preseason game.

And as usual good players around the league go down in the first preseason game and hurt their team's chances for the regular season. Can't be helped but it sure hurts teams like Chicago when their starting QB goes down for months.

Honoring Earl 34
08-14-2005, 09:33 PM
:tv: It may be only the 1st pre-season game but the Cowboys offense is in midseason form .
I think when your team has some big question marks you try to find some signs of improvement . The Texans held an audition more than a game to get the regulars ready . :texans:

texansfan88
08-14-2005, 11:05 PM
I still want an explination of how Drew Hodgon can commit 3 false starts while having the ball in his possesion...

texansfan88
08-14-2005, 11:16 PM
My observations


2. Penalties. I don't care that it was the first game with no-names playing. Winning is contagious. How many penalties did Denver have?




Denver had 10 for 95 yards and we had 12 for 84 yards... I dont catch your reasoning?

texasguy346
08-14-2005, 11:51 PM
I still want an explination of how Drew Hodgon can commit 3 false starts while having the ball in his possesion...

I'm hoping thats more about rookie jitters than anything else. Washington was held out last night, and perhaps running with the second team along with playing his first game in Reliant Stadium got him a little jumpy. Either way I'm expecting less mistakes from him against the Raiders.

tsip
08-15-2005, 12:50 AM
I have come to the conculsion you aren't a Texans fan. I never see anything 'fan-like' out of you. Just ripping the team on all levels with little digs and negative comments.

My family has 4 season tickets in section 107 and we've had those since
day one. I believe I have the right to post my thoughts on this public forum.
Yes, this is the preseason and everyone has an opinion on the Texans, and
only time will tell who is right and who is wrong. I do not posts disertations
that ramble on and on about every little thing, nor do I post (like some people
do) statements that put other people down or 'dog' them because their
posts don't agree with mine. Again, this is a public forum and to disagree is
one of the basis of a forum. As the administrator of this forum, you should
set the standard by which all posters should conduct themselves.

Vinny
08-15-2005, 12:56 AM
I just see you ripping team like the trolls do. Nothing complicated. I just post my thoughts like everyone else. Gonna keep doing it too - I hope everyone does the same.

tsip
08-15-2005, 01:09 AM
I went back and read all 50 of my posts and none of them 'rip' the team.
I question things other posters say and offer statistical feedback but I
don't bash the team. I've 'been around the block' a few times so I've got
thoughts on what I think will work and won't work. To me, disagreeing is not
'ripping' the team.

Vinny
08-15-2005, 01:15 AM
Lots of trolls come in and say nice things at first, get a little group following and start ripping the team as they post...disguised as disgruntled fans. It's an anonymous board - it happens pretty often. I just openly questioned it with you because your commentary seems to fit this pattern. I'll take your word for it.

phan1
08-15-2005, 02:06 AM
Not much to say, you guys pretty much said everything.

I would have liked to see more of Mathis as we all would. Buchanon is a nice, solid addition to our team, but he's not something to scream about like I thought he would be. I was disappointed in Ragone. He is definitely not taking Bank's job any time soon. So far, I do like the changes in our defense. Cutting Sharper, Glenn, and Foreman are so far not bad decisions, even though I'm sure we've grown to love them over their years in Houston. And despite his obvious lack of experience, I was definitely impressed with Morency and his raw talent.

But in the end, this looks pretty much like what we looked like last year. I'm still not totally confident we will be able to have an offense that is consistent. We need to develope a "winning attitude" and I'm not sure we have that yet. The only thing I can really say that makes us look any different than last year is our defense. I really think our defense will be good this year, and I do like the changes that the coaches and owners have made.

TexHorns
08-15-2005, 03:48 AM
I went over to the chronicle and listened to McClain and I would say he didn't like a lot of what he saw. He tried to remain somewhat positive, but you can read between the lines. He's very nervous about the high ankle sprain suffered by Wiegert, if that indeed is what it is. Said there were about 20 fans in the stands at the end of the game. If that was the case I would think an owner would be getting a little bit POed. McClain seemed to emphasize that the honey moon is over. Also said the Texans got more out of 3 days of practice than the game tonight at Reliant. He said something about no one should have paid money to see the game.

I believe AJ, Kasper and Mathis will be the starting receivers as of now. I firmly believe Gaffny has injury problems and he may be a no show for the beginning or the entire season. Wells got injured and he was probably the number 2 back. Its amazing how we start TC and the next thing you know we are nothing but a bunch of walking wounded before the season even starts. We do not have the depth to withstand these kinds of injuries.

To me the offense is doing very much the same as they were last year. We often did well on our 1st series of downs and then the you know what hit the fan. Everyone is talking about the 1st series going well, but I didn't see that the rest of the game. We have little if any consistancy and that continues to show. We do not stretch the field. In fact we are quite frankly boring to watch.

I think Swinton lost his job tonight and Mathis will be the return man and WR. PBuck will be his backup. Murphy might become the TE we need. I know we are trying to evaluate personnel, but we seem to put them in a position to fail. Apparently they have been talking about making some offensive line switches, but the injury to Wiegert may preclude them from doing that. I really believe we are not using our O-line players in the best way we could, but that's a coaching issue.

Its nonsense to say this is only preseason. Yes, preseason is a time to learn, but you would expect to see the changes yield some results. If they are not really showing their offense, I suspect we will be learning well into the season. That is not a good indicator of success. You know what, I think this idea that Palmer changed everything up and they have changed the blocking assignments is a lot of BS. I keep saying something is rotten in Denmark. I hope I'm wrong, but something really smells about this game.

Well I guess thats it, we should just forfeit the rest of the season. Maybe i'll start watching golf. :texflag:

southtexan
08-15-2005, 11:19 AM
I still want an explination of how Drew Hodgon can commit 3 false starts while having the ball in his possesion...
Butterflies?

edo783
08-15-2005, 12:18 PM
Special Teams were VERY good.

Ibar_Harry
08-15-2005, 12:22 PM
Well I guess thats it, we should just forfeit the rest of the season. Maybe i'll start watching golf. :texflag:

At this point I would say don't expect them to be in the playoffs. Fix the O-line and we have a chance. But injuries are starting to put us in a deep hole once again and we have little if any depth in certain areas.

ATX
08-15-2005, 12:28 PM
At this point I would say don't expect them to be in the playoffs. Fix the O-line and we have a chance. But injuries are starting to put us in a deep hole once again and we have little if any depth in certain areas.


what injuries? the only texan i know who's gonna miss the season is joppru. all the other injuries are minor injuries that most teams have.

Austin_Texans_Fan
08-15-2005, 12:34 PM
what injuries? the only texan i know who's gonna miss the season is joppru. all the other injuries are minor injuries that most teams have.


Exactly, most pre-season injuries are minor at best. Why risk getting someone REALLY hurt if they already have the spot locked?

Str8tupg42k1
08-15-2005, 01:04 PM
On that onside kick by Kris Brown did you see when he went back to the sidelines Jason Bell was just ripping him I know he said "what was that, the was horrible" and he kept on talking. And then when Kris left you could see the coaches and Jason crack up and laugh. That was funny. :tomato:

wags
08-15-2005, 01:23 PM
The one thing I would like to see out of our next preseason game is a few more "pocket" passes from Carr. I like the rollouts because they offer easy protection for Carr, but I'd like to see if our OL can protect Carr in the pocket and also if Carr looks comfortable in the pocket.

donbmt
08-15-2005, 01:54 PM
So, how long will it be before someone starts a 'Fire Palmer' thread, after the Raiders game?

ojthecat
08-15-2005, 03:30 PM
But injuries are starting to put us in a deep hole once again and we have little if any depth in certain areas.

Ibar what injuries are you talking about?

Back down from the ledge the sky is not really falling.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
08-15-2005, 03:44 PM
And the award for Best Overly Dramatic Performance for a preseason game goes to Ibar_Harry.

TexansJunkE
08-15-2005, 04:23 PM
:yahoo: At last! We threw the ball down field and got a pass interference call. I believe that is the first one we got in 2 seasons? I know enough of that. I thought our first teams played well, but I'm not gonna read too much into anything. I thought P-buc got lost, but that is ok. This is the reason we play preseason games, so that the coaches can correct or answer any problems that the players might have. I have no reason to believe that Hoke can't fix that. Of course I would have like to see Carr play more, but like in Chicago dam&^% if you do dam&^% if you don't. I really am optimistic this year!

U4ikrob
08-15-2005, 04:38 PM
I was at the SOAD concert on Sat night so missed the game :/

I am Hoping to find someone who will be gracious enough to loan or burn me a copy of the game so I can watch it myself. It is pre-season so i'm not that overly concerened.

On to the Game : From the sounds of all the commentary and highlights - the Texans played much like I saw at practice last week - Sloppy

I'm hoping the injuries were not too bad esp Weigert - that one could really hurt in the long run if he's out several weeks. I heard about J. Wells maybe having a torn tendon in his finger too that didnt sound good along with BJ's separated shoulder.

The Good : I like what I heard about the first team's Offensive drive, the O-line play being better, good blocking and time to throw [not counting the goaline enigma]. That certainly seems a lot more promising than before. Riley was doing well at practice so this may be the start of somethign good at LT. I liked hearing that most of the rookies all got good minutes.

The Tossup - Backup QB's - I still have hope for Ragone and think from the sounds of things he was having some jitters and started off with a few bad series and got into a rhythm later. IMO he looked really decent in practice this week against the Denver D whereas Banks looked like a disaster. I think he will see more minutes thru Pre-season and we will get a much better idea/look at him as for backup potential then. Symons - Sorry to hear about the injury to him, but honestly as I said last week after practice - I thought he would be cut before the season anyway as he looked really bad in practice and it seems the results from the game werent any better.

The Bad : The only thought I have on this is the comments about the sloppy Play of the team - That didnt change from practice and I was hoping to hear better.

buddyroe
08-15-2005, 05:04 PM
This 1st preseason game gave me really no reason
to change my prediction of a 13-3 season.
I was pleased with what our starters did in the 2
series that they played (though Carr only played 1).
Against a team who's offense and defense ranked in
the top five last year we outgained them 118 yards
to 13 yards for them.I like rolling Carr out,it keeps the
defense from just pinning back their ears and makes
them play the running lanes on passing downs.
Somethings didn't work so well, like using d-lineman
as fullbacks.I never have liked that.But it's better
that they get that out of their heads now than to decide
during the season to try it.If the boat don't float it's
better to find out before your in the middle of the
ocean.
As expected we didn't see too much of the starters
as this game and the next game against Oakland will
be more about evaluation of players than of winning.
I expect to see the starters play most of three
quarters on the 27th against Dallas.That will be our 1st
real opportunity to see how well they execute when
they have to stay on the field and how well they
make adjustments at halftime.

the wonger need food
08-15-2005, 05:39 PM
All in all, it was a typical Texans game with inconsistency on both sides of the ball.

On offense, much like last year, the receivers were blanketed. Hopefully there will be a cure for the anemic passing game this year. Aside from the one TD pass from Banks, the passing game was abysmal. They did run the ball really well with the first and second string units.

Defensively, there was good pressure upfield from the line. The secondary looked lost in the zone coverages and left receivers wide open on many occasions. (How many times did we see a Texan's receiver wide open?) Way too many missed tackles, especially on the long TD to Devoe which was embarrassing at best. Nice run defense for the most part. Travis Johnson made some nice plays, but took too many plays off. Hopefully the good plays will make up for this in the regular season.

As always, keeping it close was more important to the coaching staff than winning the game. Winning begets winning, and this coaching staff has yet to instill this mentality into the team.

The sky isn't falling yet, but I just don't see any improvement comparing this game to last year's first pre-season game.

infantrycak
08-15-2005, 05:45 PM
Travis Johnson made some nice plays, but took too many plays off. Hopefully the good plays will make up for this in the regular season.

Other than reciting something from a draft notebook, what did you see specifically that made you think TJ took a play much less too many off?

the wonger need food
08-15-2005, 06:09 PM
Other than reciting something from a draft notebook, what did you see specifically that made you think TJ took a play much less too many off?

There were several, mostly when he was getting doubled, that he kind of stood up and didn't make a lot of effort to get low and make a push. More than likely he was tired (he played a lot of downs). He did get that rep in college. I'm guessing that it is mostly due to the fact that he is very talented and people expect him to get upfield every play. Either way, it was just an observation after watching him closely on 20 or so plays.

infantrycak
08-15-2005, 06:17 PM
There were several, mostly when he was getting doubled, that he kind of stood up and didn't make a lot of effort to get low and make a push. More than likely he was tired (he played a lot of downs). He did get that rep in college. I'm guessing that it is mostly due to the fact that he is very talented and people expect him to get upfield every play. Either way, it was just an observation after watching him closely on 20 or so plays.

Well I didn't see that at all. IMO he had a very high effort but neither DLmen nor the OLmen have the same assignments nor try the same things every play so he got mixed results. As with all rookies he has some technique issues as well. Basically I saw a high motor rookie with a rookie's rawness, not a refined player being a slacker.

the wonger need food
08-15-2005, 06:24 PM
Well I didn't see that at all. IMO he had a very high effort but neither DLmen nor the OLmen have the same assignments nor try the same things every play so he got mixed results. As with all rookies he has some technique issues as well. Basically I saw a high motor rookie with a rookie's rawness, not a refined player being a slacker.

His motor was revving on several plays. He had one in the 4th quarter where he split a double-team and was on the QB with suddenness. But he also had several, on pass plays, where it seemed that the effort was lacking.

edo783
08-15-2005, 07:13 PM
His motor was revving on several plays. He had one in the 4th quarter where he split a double-team and was on the QB with suddenness. But he also had several, on pass plays, where it seemed that the effort was lacking.

He also said after the game that he was gassed and had to come out for a breather. Might just be playing his way in to NFL type of game condition.

outofhnd
08-16-2005, 01:24 AM
Can you blame him?
I was immensly impressed because he was pushing NFL caliber lineman into the backfield. One of my concerns was he wouldnt be able to disrupt things as dramatically as he did in college that the penetration shown on film was not against top tier talent.

I only got to see the first half then my girlfriend forced me to go out. Id also like to say kudos to NFL networks break down and movement between games. We looked great and i didnt read anything into the 1 yd plunges, if we wanted to score, we couldve easily pitched it and let DD just out run the D to the corner. All in all i thought the progression was excellent for everyone cept weigart. Id really like to see Weary possibly step up and really fill in well for zach while he is out. It makes me wonderif mckinney could move to RG, and wasington to C where would wiegart play?

TexanFanInCC
08-16-2005, 04:06 AM
what i liked:

first team offense and defense
reggie swinton and the rest of the special teams

what i disliked:

a. domanick davis not able to punch in a TD from a yard away with 3 or 4 opportunities.
b. the fact that carr only got in 2 passes.

ATX
08-16-2005, 11:45 AM
i wouldn't read too much into DD not being able to punch it in from less than 2 yards away 4 times. we had robaire in playing fullback and while he hit whoever he hit hard, it wasn't always the right guy to hit. i think having norris in there wold have been a different story, but this was just an experiment. i mean we ran it 3 times to the right in the same spot.

Str8tupg42k1
08-16-2005, 12:06 PM
i have a question, all of the preseason games i saw most of the teams had their starters in for at least one quarter and a couple of drives, why is it that the Texans only use them for like one drive because of injuries but why do the other teams leave them in.

Lucky
08-16-2005, 12:17 PM
...why is it that the Texans only use them for like one drive because of injuries but why do the other teams leave them in.
You have to remember that the Texans starters got a lot of work in last week against the Broncos 1st team defense. One drive in the lights was all they needed, considering that it was more or less a "successful" drive. Other teams don't necessarily get the opportunity to work against an opponent in practice prior to the preseason game.

Blake
08-16-2005, 12:24 PM
Other than reciting something from a draft notebook, what did you see specifically that made you think TJ took a play much less too many off?


Dont try and make it sound like he is spewing notes from an online mockster.

TJ took off 2 plays that I specifically watched him. And maybe a couple that I didnt see.

But make no mistake, he took off a few.

Ball is snaped, he is stood up, and going backwards real slow, and you can tell that there is no fight going on.

So save me the "reciting something from a draft notebook"

infantrycak
08-16-2005, 01:23 PM
Well you're certainly entitled to your opinion. I didn't see that in the game and also do not automatically interpret different results to mean different effort levels. Payne gets pushed back some plays (by the way going backwards real slow for a DLmen is better than going back real fast) and no one has ever questioned his effort level. And by the way, plenty of people do just regurgitate things they have read on the internet.

JamesLovesGames
08-16-2005, 02:58 PM
Haha, Well I was sitting in section 131 if anyone else knows what I am talking about. I don't think it was one of the twins. Anyway, baasically her pants were a bit low for the 2nd half so she had some undergarments showing. The cheerleader coach came over to her once or twice to ask her to retuck.
I wasn't able to make it to the game but if the cheerleader in question was Emily I will be very upset I missed it.
I did watch the first half of the game on tv and wasn't very impressed with our boys but I keep telling myself there's nothin wrong with saving up our whoop ***** for the steelers.

buddyroe
08-16-2005, 04:20 PM
i have a question, all of the preseason games i saw most of the teams had their starters in for at least one quarter and a couple of drives, why is it that the Texans only use them for like one drive because of injuries but why do the other teams leave them in.



Some teams (like the Cowboys) have a lot of questions about
their starting lineup's while some aren't happy with what their
starters did so they leave them in trying to get them to click.
Houston's starters not playing tells me they are comfortable
with who they have starting and didn't need to see more of
them or risk getting them hurt.
As for TJ taking plays off, I'm sure part of that was just being
winded.Even pro-bowl players take a play off now and then.
The difference is they know how to pick their spots and they
don't have everyone watching hoping to catch them.
On goal to go plays this year I expect to see Carr rolling out
more this year in a run pass option.
I don't put much stock in winning or losing in the preseason
except for game 3.That's the game the starters really get
to go out their and work.
Not too many superbowl winners have gone undefeated in
the preseason.
Motor City,here come the Texan's !!! :piano:

Blake
08-16-2005, 04:27 PM
Well you're certainly entitled to your opinion. I didn't see that in the game and also do not automatically interpret different results to mean different effort levels. Payne gets pushed back some plays (by the way going backwards real slow for a DLmen is better than going back real fast) and no one has ever questioned his effort level.

Thats exactly why I said "and you can tell that there is no fight going on."

He looked like he was doing a walk thru.

=================================

But other than those few plays, he gave a great effort, and I really enjoyed watching him.

El Tejano
08-16-2005, 10:15 PM
Other than a roster saying Wells weighs 30 more pounds, what has he ever done to hint he would be a better goalline runner? He has never run as hard as DD and hasn't demonstrated any greater ability in short yardage situations over the past two years. Kudos to Wells for running much harder last season and yesterday, but he has been playing catch up to run anywhere near as hard as DD in the 1st place.
Please look at the game film when we played Oakland, Tenn in Tenn, and Jacksonville at home. Not saying he runs harder than DD, but he does let out some frustration in the short yardage situations.

El Tejano
08-16-2005, 10:19 PM
Did it ever occur that sometimes the nose tackle in a 3-4 will occasionally slip back a "bit" in coverage to bring an offensive lineman out a bit so that the two inside linebackers can scoot in the holes? I think that is what you saw.

thegr8fan
08-16-2005, 10:24 PM
I am not, nor have I ever been, a Wells fan. I will give him credit for learning how to 'fall forward' in the preseason, but that is, in general, against backup/roster depth players, not starters. Wells was our starter in 2002 and was a 3rd round pick. DD was a 4th round pick and took the job away from Wells. And rightfully so, IMHO.

Wells will get credit for learning how to be a 'bruising RB' from me, when he does it, consistantly, against other starting D's. Until then, he still has alot to prove and EARN back. The guy has the build to be a punisher, yet he plays like a prima-donna, IMHO.

Watch most of the game tapes from last year, DD gets hit, doesn't go down till the second tackler gets there, and still manages to fall forward. Wells turns his back to the tackler about the same time that the tackler gets to him.

I think Wells being moved to FB is an indication of the team trying to find a roster spot for him, and basically admitting that he is NOT what we are looking for in an every down type RB, but he MIGHT be what we are looking for in short yardage situations as a decoy perhaps more than anything else.

SESupergenius
08-17-2005, 12:08 AM
Did it ever occur that sometimes the nose tackle in a 3-4 will occasionally slip back a "bit" in coverage to bring an offensive lineman out a bit so that the two inside linebackers can scoot in the holes? I think that is what you saw.
That's actually called the 3-4 Dagger where the 2 ILB blitz towards the center and the NT holds his spot and doesn't push into the backfield.

ATX
08-17-2005, 12:57 AM
I am not, nor have I ever been, a Wells fan. I will give him credit for learning how to 'fall forward' in the preseason, but that is, in general, against backup/roster depth players, not starters. Wells was our starter in 2002 and was a 3rd round pick. DD was a 4th round pick and took the job away from Wells. And rightfully so, IMHO.

Wells will get credit for learning how to be a 'bruising RB' from me, when he does it, consistantly, against other starting D's. Until then, he still has alot to prove and EARN back. The guy has the build to be a punisher, yet he plays like a prima-donna, IMHO.

Watch most of the game tapes from last year, DD gets hit, doesn't go down till the second tackler gets there, and still manages to fall forward. Wells turns his back to the tackler about the same time that the tackler gets to him.

I think Wells being moved to FB is an indication of the team trying to find a roster spot for him, and basically admitting that he is NOT what we are looking for in an every down type RB, but he MIGHT be what we are looking for in short yardage situations as a decoy perhaps more than anything else.

you can't compare what wells did in 2002 with what Davis did in 2004. The Olines were different and our starting FB was Baxter. I know Wells isn't Davis and never will be, both are totally different types of backs, but Wells has played alot better against first team defenses the longer he plays. There were a few games last year where Wells got the job done and ran some nice runs off. I think Wells being tried as a FB shows his versatility on this team, not them trying to find a roster spot. this is the NFL, you don't just find a roster spot for some guy, he earns it, and Wells has earned it with better play and versatility on the team. I admit, i was a Wells hater back in 2002 and 2003, then last year he surprised me alot. He's progressing and playing better every year, and thats what you want. Draft order doesn't really matter in the NFL, its what you can do. Hollings was a 2nd round pick, I still think Wells is better, and DD was a 4th rounder who'd the best of the group.

infantrycak
08-17-2005, 07:47 AM
Please look at the game film when we played Oakland, Tenn in Tenn, and Jacksonville at home. Not saying he runs harder than DD, but he does let out some frustration in the short yardage situations.

Well there isn't really any need to look back at those games when you agree he doesn't run harder than DD. That was the original point--why put Wells in over DD in short yardage situations when he has never demonstrated an inclination or ability to run harder than DD? Has he gotten better than his rookie season?--yes, but he hasn't gotten better than DD in his rookie season.

BattleRedGuy
08-17-2005, 08:59 AM
Denver had 10 for 95 yards and we had 12 for 84 yards... I dont catch your reasoning?

Thanks for the clarification. It did not seem Denver had that many penalties. By the time I posted, I could not find a box score to get the numbers.

Penalties have been a problem since the beginning (my perception anyway). 12 in the first pre season game still tells me this is a potential problem. I hope I'm wrong.

Vinny
08-17-2005, 09:37 AM
Davis is clearly a better goal line back than Wells is. Wells has very little ability to find creases and explode into them. Davis does have a good nose for the end zone....Wells obviously doesn't run low or hard....that's why he is being tried at FB.

TJ looked fine to me. I watched the game again and don't really have anything to say about him other than, 'he sure looks good for a rookie'. His intensity and quickness is impressive.