PDA

View Full Version : Cushing - will he play another play?


silvrhand
10-20-2013, 06:46 PM
Two left knee surgeries in the last two years, and we just signed him to a fantastic large contract.. I am not sure he plays another play after looking at that and if he is will he still be able to chase down plays..

/joy

EllisUnit
10-20-2013, 06:49 PM
I think he may try to rehab it, but i dont see him ever coming back. Poor guy he could of had a HOF career.

Oh and F you J Charles.

ghostlight
10-20-2013, 06:51 PM
Charles makes me sick!!! Ruined a wonderful player and career.

AMartin56
10-20-2013, 06:52 PM
He's probably out for the season but I doubt his career is over.

fiasco west
10-20-2013, 06:54 PM
We don't know what the injury is at this point, doesn't have to be a tear. It looked pretty bad though but still we don't know.

Lurvinator11
10-20-2013, 06:54 PM
McNair called his injury Serious....

Section516
10-20-2013, 06:57 PM
RT @TomPelissero: Cushing on crutches in locker room. Slowly leaving. Teammates hugging him

Big Lou
10-20-2013, 06:57 PM
Their other running back cheap shotted JJ with a rib shot as well. This town is jinxed when it comes to football.

Didn't Demeco get hurt after his big contract?

dalemurphy
10-20-2013, 06:58 PM
We don't know what the injury is at this point, doesn't have to be a tear. It looked pretty bad though but still we don't know.

A few things:

1. As long as he has cartilage in the knee, the ACL can be repaired or rebuilt again and again... problem is that those injuries often include some cartilige loss.

2. I don't think this injury is an ACL... could be. It looked like a hyper-extension, which can be very painful but also can end up having minimal structural damage.

3. Or, with some hyper-extensions, it could the dreaded PCL tear (or triad), where almost everything gets ripped up.

... Hopefully, we will get good news that neither the Patella Tendon, PCL, or ACL were torn- possible (even given Cushing's reaction), though not likely

Brisco_County
10-20-2013, 07:01 PM
The best case scenario is MCL, but it looked much worse than that.

TheIronDuke
10-20-2013, 07:04 PM
That block by Charles was nothing we wouldnt ask our players to do. It was bad luck, not dirty play.

PapaL
10-20-2013, 07:06 PM
That block by Charles was nothing we wouldnt ask our players to do. It was bad luck, not dirty play.

BOTH of Charles' blocks were clean and things we do weekly. Sucks for Brian but it was legit.

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/10/21/ne9utu7y.jpg

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 07:08 PM
A few things:

1. As long as he has cartilage in the knee, the ACL can be repaired or rebuilt again and again... problem is that those injuries often include some cartilige loss.

2. I don't think this injury is an ACL... could be. It looked like a hyper-extension, which can be very painful but also can end up having minimal structural damage.

3. Or, with some hyper-extensions, it could the dreaded PCL tear (or triad), where almost everything gets ripped up.

... Hopefully, we will get good news that neither the Patella Tendon, PCL, or ACL were torn- possible (even given Cushing's reaction), though not likely

The way he was hit, I would not expect a patella tendon injury. (His past patella tendon surgery was on the right). Last year, he suffered a left ACL (expected from a hit from the back). I would be surprised if it were not an ACL and PCL this time (hit from the front).

Seegara
10-20-2013, 07:11 PM
So the extremely injury-prone Cushing is down again. From the way he looked when they helped him off the field, it looks llike he's out for the season this time. And to think we spent all that money extending his contract!

With Foster's hamstring issue as the starter, has there ever been anything more stupid than failing to suit up a 3rd running back for the game? Well, yes, the Tigers' manager pulling his starting pitcher was dumber. If allowed to pitch a complete game, Scherzer would have shut down the Red Sox the rest of the way. But you don't have to wonder how the world series will come out. The Cardinals don't lose when the chips are down.

I think the constant spread formation was a concession to what Keenum is used to. But he should have lined up as a man under center other than in the red zone. He could have run some play action rollouts and avoided the blitzers.

I think the fumble recovery at the end was actually a TD. Texans should have challenged it. If they give up a TD they have a chance to tie the game.

dalemurphy
10-20-2013, 07:14 PM
The way he was hit, I would not expect a patella tendon injury. (His past patella tendon surgery was on the right). Last year, he suffered a left ACL. I would be surprised if it were not an ACL and PCL this time.

Yeah, I'm worried about the PCL... Whether the ACL is torn, I think, will depend on how tight of a replacement ACL he was working with. The combination of the surgeon's execution and also rehab, I know, has a significant impact on the elasticity and flexion of the ACL... If it was "loose", it could be fine. Best case- a "minor" PCL strain, not requiring surgery... I will hope for it.

Naiirb
10-20-2013, 07:16 PM
Albert Breer on twitter: Torn LCL and broken leg

toronto
10-20-2013, 07:16 PM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer2m
Sorry ... On Cushing -- It's a torn LCL and a broken leg. Again, will need surgery.
8:13 PM - 20 Oct 13 Details

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer1m
So again ... Brian Cushing has a torn LCL and a broken leg. ACL is OK. Needs surgery. Done for the year.
8:14 PM - 20 Oct 13 Details

Vance87
10-20-2013, 07:17 PM
So the extremely injury-prone Cushing is down again. From the way he looked when they helped him off the field, it looks llike he's out for the season this time. And to think we spent all that money extending his contract!

Hey assclown, let me dive at your kneecap when you plant it on the ground and when I destroy your ligaments I'll stand over you as you writhe in pain and call you injury prone.

TexansBull
10-20-2013, 07:22 PM
[quote=Seegara;2234511]So the extremely injury-prone Cushing is down again. From the way he looked when they helped him off the field, it looks llike he's out for the season this time. And to think we spent all that money extending his contract!
quote]

Have you seen the hits he has taken on that leg? Injury prone is not how I describe him. He will be back.

False Start
10-20-2013, 07:22 PM
http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii202/J4103V/florida-1.gif

I really hate this. Cush is one of my favorite Texans ever. I just hate to see him go out like this.

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 07:23 PM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer2m
Sorry ... On Cushing -- It's a torn LCL and a broken leg. Again, will need surgery.
8:13 PM - 20 Oct 13 Details

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer1m
So again ... Brian Cushing has a torn LCL and a broken leg. ACL is OK. Needs surgery. Done for the year.
8:14 PM - 20 Oct 13 Details

If it's an LCL, it better not be a fragmented tibial plateau fracture like Spencer.

Premier
10-20-2013, 07:24 PM
some of you are full of ****.. we cut block in the zbs but when do our cuts look like that.. that looked like swearingers hit on keller.. **** is cheap if they have to outlaw cuts all together then so be it..

PapaL
10-20-2013, 07:25 PM
He was moving around pretty damn good too. Football is a tough sport and Cush is one tough SOB. He'll be rehabbing ASAP. You can bank on that.

htowntexans1985
10-20-2013, 07:25 PM
Man..............

Hervoyel
10-20-2013, 07:26 PM
Two left knee surgeries in the last two years, and we just signed him to a fantastic large contract.. I am not sure he plays another play after looking at that and if he is will he still be able to chase down plays..

/joy


That's pretty much the Texans M.O. isn't it. Sign them to a big contract and then watch them get injured, fall apart, or just plain start mailing it in. We have the worst luck when it comes to what players who choose to reward for their work and when we decide to do it.

HJam72
10-20-2013, 07:27 PM
So the extremely injury-prone Cushing is down again. From the way he looked when they helped him off the field, it looks llike he's out for the season this time. And to think we spent all that money extending his contract!

With Foster's hamstring issue as the starter, has there ever been anything more stupid than failing to suit up a 3rd running back for the game? Well, yes, the Tigers' manager pulling his starting pitcher was dumber. If allowed to pitch a complete game, Scherzer would have shut down the Red Sox the rest of the way. But you don't have to wonder how the world series will come out. The Cardinals don't lose when the chips are down.

I think the constant spread formation was a concession to what Keenum is used to. But he should have lined up as a man under center other than in the red zone. He could have run some play action rollouts and avoided the blitzers.

I think the fumble recovery at the end was actually a TD. Texans should have challenged it. If they give up a TD they have a chance to tie the game.

LOL:

You scored!

No, we didn't!!!

Yeah, you did!!

No!

:kubepalm:

Dishman
10-20-2013, 07:28 PM
Hurts seeing Cushing hurt like that again. Going to hurt all over again when I wake up in the morning and remember. Best of luck to you, Cush! I hope you make it back on the field next season.

Norg
10-20-2013, 07:29 PM
maybe I would say but for another team but since he just signed that contract I guess we just have to bite the bullet hope he can rehab and come back next year

fiasco west
10-20-2013, 07:29 PM
That's pretty much the Texans M.O. isn't it. Sign them to a big contract and then watch them get injured, fall apart, or just plain start mailing it in. We have the worst luck when it comes to what players who choose to reward for their work and when we decide to do it.

:ouch:

Sure seems that way :/

This was a nasty game, going into the 4th quarter I was just hoping for it to end because it seemed like all of our best players were getting hurt. I thought luck would be on our side this one game considering the circumstances.

Brisco_County
10-20-2013, 07:32 PM
So the extremely injury-prone Cushing is down again. From the way he looked when they helped him off the field, it looks llike he's out for the season this time. And to think we spent all that money extending his contract!

Wow, eff off. I've never had to add people to my ignore list until this season.

Premier
10-20-2013, 07:33 PM
I think the fumble recovery at the end was actually a TD. Texans should have challenged it. If they give up a TD they have a chance to tie the game.

first, we didnt have a challenge. second, under 2 minutes all reviews come from upsatirs. third, newtown downed him when he dove for the ball..

stingray
10-20-2013, 07:35 PM
Cushing thinks he broke his leg and tore his LCL.

Yesterday
10-20-2013, 07:37 PM
Cush will be back. Modern Medicine, special things can happen.

LCL usually doesn't require surgery (or so I've read). This is fantastic news for Cush.

F Jamaal Charles. That hit and he cheap shot JJ in the ribs, I now hate that guy.

Also, thank God it isn't the ACL again.

TejasTom
10-20-2013, 07:38 PM
I want cry.

BleedsRocketRed
10-20-2013, 07:38 PM
http://www.cedars-sinai.edu/Patients/Health-Conditions/Lateral-Collateral-Ligament-LCL-Tears.aspx

:vincepalm:


Injury

The lateral collateral ligament is a thin band of tissue running along the outside of the knee. It connects the thighbone (femur) to the fibula, which is the small bone of the lower leg that turns down the side of the knee and connects to the ankle. Like the medial collateral ligament, the lateral collateral ligament's main function is to keep the knee stable as it moves through its full arc of motion.

Symptoms

Signs of a torn lateral collateral ligament include:

A feeling that the knee may give way under stress and isn't stable
A locking or catching in the joint when it is moved
Numbness or weakness in the foot may occur if the peroneal nerve, which is near the ligament is stretched during the injury or is pressed by swelling in surrounding tissues
Pain that can be mild or acute
Stiffness
Swelling and tenderness along the outside of the knee

Causes and Risk Factors

Tears to the lateral collateral ligament most often occur from a direct blow to the inside of the knee. This can stretch the ligaments on the outside of the near too far and may cause them to tear. This type of injury occurs in sports that require a lot of quick stops and turns such as soccer, basketball and skiing or ones where there are violent collisions such as football or hockey.

The ligament can also be injured by repeated stress that causes it to lose its normal elasticity. Most knee injuries are to the ligaments that support the knee, not the knee joint itself.


Diagnosis

Your doctor will generally ask you how the injury occurred, how your knee has been feeling since the injury and whether you have had other knee injuries. You may be asked about your physical and athletic goals to help your doctor decide on the best treatment for you.

Your injury will be classified as follows:

Grade 1 - Some tenderness and minor pain at the point of the injury. This means there have been small tears in the ligament.

Grade 2 - Noticeable looseness in the knee (the knee opens up about five millimeters) when moved by hand. There is major pain and tenderness on the inner side of the knee as well as swelling. This means there have been larger tears in the ligament, but it is not completely torn.

Grade 3 - Considerable pain and tenderness at the inner side of the knee; some swelling and marked joint instability. The knee opens up slightly less than half an inch when moved. A grade 3 LCL tear means the ligament is completely torn. There may also be a tear of the anterior cruciate ligament.

If there is too much pain and swelling to accurately judge how serious the injury is, your doctor may recommend that you wear a light splint, apply ice and raise your knee. Once the swelling and pain have gone down somewhat, he or she can then make the diagnosis.

Your doctor may order a magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) scan. An MRI has an accuracy rate of nearly 90% in determining whether and how badly a lateral collateral ligament has been torn. It is not very good, however, at detailing a partial tear.


Treatments:


Lateral collateral ligament tears do not heal as well as medial collateral ligament tears do. Grade 3 lateral collateral ligament tears may require surgery.

In some cases, all that is required is rest, wearing a brace, taking pain relievers such as ibuprofen and having physical therapy.

Your doctor may recommend that you wear a lightweight cast or brace that allows your knee to move backward and forward but restricts side-to-side movement. This is usually worn 72 hours. Depending on how well it reduces your pain and swelling, you may be able to start a rehabilitative program in a few days.

When the pain and swelling have gone down, you should be able to start exercises to restore strength and normal range of motion to your knee. If you still have soreness while doing these exercises, go slowly to prevent further irritation. It may take up to eight weeks to fully recover, depending on the grade of your injury.

If the lateral collateral ligament was torn where it attaches to the thighbone (femur) or shinbone (tibia), the surgeon will re-attach the ligament to the bone using large stitches or a metal bone staple.

If the tear happened in the middle of the ligament, the surgeon will typically sew the torn ends together.

If the damage was severe and cannot be repaired, your surgeon may reconstruct a tendon by using a graft taken from a tendon of your thigh muscles (quadriceps) or your hamstrings.

Lateral knee reconstruction is an open-knee procedure, and is not done arthroscopically. The tendon graft is passed through bone tunnels and fixed to the thighbone and lower leg bone (fibula) using screws or posts or with stitches tied around a post.

Seegara
10-20-2013, 07:41 PM
Hey assclown, let me dive at your kneecap when you plant it on the ground and when I destroy your ligaments I'll stand over you as you writhe in pain and call you injury prone.
Well you sorry namecaller, I was just stating the fact. Wasn't even talking to Cush.

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 07:45 PM
The preliminary diagnosis as it stands now (without MRI) is LCL and fibula fracture. I suspect the MRI will be performed tomorrow in Houston. MRI may show cartilage damage and other ligament tear damage or other stress fracture that cannot be diagnosed by physical exam and plain x-rays alone. And I would not be so quick to rule out partial ACL or PCL either without MRI (even with this modality, partial tears can be sometimes missed).

utahmark
10-20-2013, 07:46 PM
So the extremely injury-prone Cushing is down again. From the way he looked when they helped him off the field, it looks llike he's out for the season this time. And to think we spent all that money extending his contract!

With Foster's hamstring issue as the starter, has there ever been anything more stupid than failing to suit up a 3rd running back for the game? Well, yes, the Tigers' manager pulling his starting pitcher was dumber. If allowed to pitch a complete game, Scherzer would have shut down the Red Sox the rest of the way. But you don't have to wonder how the world series will come out. The Cardinals don't lose when the chips are down.

I think the constant spread formation was a concession to what Keenum is used to. But he should have lined up as a man under center other than in the red zone. He could have run some play action rollouts and avoided the blitzers.

I think the fumble recovery at the end was actually a TD. Texans should have challenged it. If they give up a TD they have a chance to tie the game.

It was not a td. You might want to watch that again.

cbs1507
10-20-2013, 07:49 PM
LOL:

You scored!

No, we didn't!!!

Yeah, you did!!

No!

:kubepalm:

I know that sound crazy what the guy said. but if you think about it then it makes sense. It 17-16. We had 0 time outs with around a minute left. KC got the ball to run the clock out. If they score the TD, then it's still a 1 possession game and we get a chance.

AggieTexan
10-20-2013, 08:00 PM
I feel terrible for Brian...I was so happy to see him back on the field this year.

Playoffs
10-20-2013, 08:01 PM
The preliminary diagnosis as it stands now (without MRI) is LCL and fibula fracture. I suspect the MRI will be performed tomorrow in Houston. MRI may show cartilage damage and other ligament tear damage or other stress fracture that cannot be diagnosed by physical exam and plain x-rays alone. And I would not be so quick to rule out partial ACL or PCL either without MRI (even with this modality, partial tears can be sometimes missed).

Prognosis if it's just the fracture & LCL?

amazing80
10-20-2013, 08:02 PM
Not to be THAT guy, BUT how much of the ligament injuries are due to steroids? I don't want to bash him, because I love Cush and could care less about what he did or didn't do, but honestly do steroids wear down the ligaments and make them easier to tear? Or is he really just THAT unlucky?

dtran04
10-20-2013, 08:03 PM
This should bump Reed inside and give Jefferson a shot at OLB. Bye week comes at the best time really.

Big Lou
10-20-2013, 08:06 PM
That block by Charles was nothing we wouldnt ask our players to do. It was bad luck, not dirty play.

True, but it makes me feel better to call Charles a piece of sh!t, so let me at least have that.

chicagotexan2
10-20-2013, 08:10 PM
The man busted his ass to get ready after last season. I doubt he's finished. He may not be the same but I think he'll be back. Good luck 56.

steelbtexan
10-20-2013, 08:11 PM
That's pretty much the Texans M.O. isn't it. Sign them to a big contract and then watch them get injured, fall apart, or just plain start mailing it in. We have the worst luck when it comes to what players who choose to reward for their work and when we decide to do it.

You mean sign them up after they've been injured severely and watch them get injured again. Rick's MO

MEGA SWATT
10-20-2013, 08:19 PM
Terrible injury. Get well soon and next man up:overreact:

silvrhand
10-20-2013, 08:23 PM
Not to be THAT guy, BUT how much of the ligament injuries are due to steroids? I don't want to bash him, because I love Cush and could care less about what he did or didn't do, but honestly do steroids wear down the ligaments and make them easier to tear? Or is he really just THAT unlucky?

If he was just running along and took a arrow to the knee then so be it I might be on that train too. But he had his foot planted and JC exploded into his leg, and basically destroyed it.

What happens if he doesn't play another down, how do career ending injuries get resolved with the salary cap?

dalemurphy
10-20-2013, 08:23 PM
The preliminary diagnosis as it stands now (without MRI) is LCL and fibula fracture. I suspect the MRI will be performed tomorrow in Houston. MRI may show cartilage damage and other ligament tear damage or other stress fracture that cannot be diagnosed by physical exam and plain x-rays alone. And I would not be so quick to rule out partial ACL or PCL either without MRI (even with this modality, partial tears can be sometimes missed).

Cloak, given the nature of the injury, as it is being reported... If the fracture is only to the fibula... could the fibula be fractured from stress in a way similar to what happened to Spencer's tibia, where it sort of created a fault line into the knee itself and cut blood flow, causing knee tissue to die, etc...?

I realize the injury to the LCL and other possibilities still undetermined could mean serious consequences to the knee... However, I'm wondering about just the fibula and if a similar situation is possible/likely... because, it does look like a stress fracture and one that could have been violent enough to be much more than a hairline fracture.

Trap_Star
10-20-2013, 08:38 PM
Terrible injury. Get well soon and next man up:overreact:

sharpton :lol:



















































:(

TheIronDuke
10-20-2013, 08:44 PM
Once Sharpton is injured, I guess Mohamed is going to be our MLB?

htowntexans1985
10-20-2013, 08:57 PM
Some words from the beast.....


Brian Cushing @briancushing56
It's not how many times you fall down but
how many times you get back up. Life is
tough but I'm the toughest SOB it's ever
seen. Ill be back

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 09:30 PM
Prognosis if it's just the fracture & LCL?

Cloak, given the nature of the injury, as it is being reported... If the fracture is only to the fibula... could the fibula be fractured from stress in a way similar to what happened to Spencer's tibia, where it sort of created a fault line into the knee itself and cut blood flow, causing knee tissue to die, etc...?

I realize the injury to the LCL and other possibilities still undetermined could mean serious consequences to the knee... However, I'm wondering about just the fibula and if a similar situation is possible/likely... because, it does look like a stress fracture and one that could have been violent enough to be much more than a hairline fracture.

The fibula is called a nonwieght-bearing bone because it is itself not any part of the the knee joint. It is positioned below and outside of the knee joint. It is the tibia that is the leg contact joint bone that bears all of the weight. Any fracture of the tibia that goes into the joint surface (tibial plateau) of the knee must be considered a serious injury....especially if it is fragmented. A fracture of the fibula will never in itself result in a knee joint fracture.

But since this is reported as a fracture of the fibula (not specified as a stress fracture) and an LCL (also called the Fibula Collateral Ligament because it attaches distally to the fibula), I believe the actual injury (as I stated before, not withstanding other injuries that may be identified on MRI) is probably not a tear of the LCL, but an avulsion fracture of the large fragment of fibula still attached to the LCL. This would require open fixation of the fibula fracture, which would then automatically replace the LCL into correct anatomic position. (It could be both a separate tear of the LCL AND a fracture of the fibula, but much less likely.)


NORMAL ANATOMY:


http://images.wisegeek.com/illustration-of-right-knee.jpg



AVULSION FIBULA FRACTURE WITH LCL ATTACHED:



http://www.eorthopod.com/sites/default/files/images/adult_knee_fx_types05.jpg

If the above is the only injury, then the knee function will not be affected after he is healed.......and his overall performance should be returned to normal by OTAs.

Fili
10-20-2013, 09:42 PM
Not to be THAT guy, BUT how much of the ligament injuries are due to steroids? I don't want to bash him, because I love Cush and could care less about what he did or didn't do, but honestly do steroids wear down the ligaments and make them easier to tear? Or is he really just THAT unlucky?

Did you see the play?

DocBar
10-20-2013, 09:51 PM
The fibula is called a nonwieght-bearing bone because it is itself not any part of the the knee joint. It is positioned below and outside of the knee joint. It is the tibia that is the leg contact joint bone that bears all of the weight. Any fracture of the tibia that goes into the joint surface (tibial plateau) of the knee must be considered a serious injury....especially if it is fragmented. A fracture of the fibula will never in itself result in a knee joint fracture.

But since this is reported as a fracture of the fibula (not specified as a stress fracture) and an LCL (also called the Fibula Collateral Ligament because it attaches distally to the fibula), I believe the actual injury (as I stated before, not withstanding other injuries that may be identified on MRI) is probably not a tear of the LCL, but an avulsion fracture of the large fragment of fibula still attached to the LCL. This would require open fixation of the fibula fracture, which would then automatically replace the LCL into correct anatomic position. (It could be both a separate tear of the LCL AND a fracture of the fibula, but much less likely.)


If the above is the only injury, then the knee function will not be affected after he is healed.......and his overall performance should be returned to normal by OTAs.Doc, how much can be diagnosed by the amount of movement in the knee? Would the avulsion fracture, mentioned above, give more movement or about the same as a complete tear of the ACL? Would the amount of pain involved hamper a proper diagnosis because the patient couldn't stand the pain to show full amount of movement from the avulsion fracture?

EDIT: What is the prognosis for other ligamentous and/or menisci damage along with the avulsion fracture? Still ready by TC or 2014 regular season? At what point could Cushing expect to experience debilitating arthritis in this knee?

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 09:52 PM
Not to be THAT guy, BUT how much of the ligament injuries are due to steroids? I don't want to bash him, because I love Cush and could care less about what he did or didn't do, but honestly do steroids wear down the ligaments and make them easier to tear? Or is he really just THAT unlucky?

This may not even be a true ligament injury. [See my post above] We may know more tomorrow after the MRI.

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 10:00 PM
Doc, how much can be diagnosed by the amount of movement in the knee? Would the avulsion fracture, mentioned above, give more movement or about the same as a complete tear of the ACL? Would the amount of pain involved hamper a proper diagnosis because the patient couldn't stand the pain to show full amount of movement from the avulsion fracture?

A plain x-ray can usually diagnosed the avulsion fracture........and many times, upon physical exam, you can feel he fragment out of place and move it.
A complete ACL should be able to be diagnosed by physical exam using the "Drawer Sign." Some patients with complete ACLs can still manage to walk if they can take the pain. It's the partial ACLs which may reveal little or no movement that are difficult to diagnose, sometime even with the use of MRI.

DocBar
10-20-2013, 10:01 PM
Not to be THAT guy, BUT how much of the ligament injuries are due to steroids? I don't want to bash him, because I love Cush and could care less about what he did or didn't do, but honestly do steroids wear down the ligaments and make them easier to tear? Or is he really just THAT unlucky?You're being THAT guy and it's wholly unwarranted. The hit's that Cush has taken to be expected to end with the resultant injuries. I would expect that ligament/tendon damage caused by steroid use to occur during training or with no contact. This is due to the muscles being strengthened at a faster rate than the ligament/tendon. Ligaments and tendons get far less blood supply and strengthen much slower than muscle tissue. I would also expect to see more tendon injuries than ligament injuries.

Vance87
10-20-2013, 10:02 PM
Well you sorry namecaller, I was just stating the fact. Wasn't even talking to Cush.

Oh you weren't talking about Cush? "Well the injury prone Cushing goes down again" please tell me more about how you weren't talking about Cush.

http://ct.fra.bz/i59/5/11/28/f_2a0ec29bef.jpg

steds
10-20-2013, 10:02 PM
So what are the best case/worst case scenarios as things stand at the moment?

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 10:07 PM
Doc, how much can be diagnosed by the amount of movement in the knee? Would the avulsion fracture, mentioned above, give more movement or about the same as a complete tear of the ACL? Would the amount of pain involved hamper a proper diagnosis because the patient couldn't stand the pain to show full amount of movement from the avulsion fracture?

EDIT: What is the prognosis for other ligamentous and/or menisci damage along with the avulsion fracture? Still ready by TC or 2014 regular season? At what point could Cushing expect to experience debilitating arthritis in this knee?

Too many potential scenarios if other injuries involved. Let's wait until we have more definitive information (if we ever get it) before trying to prognosticate anymore. After the types of injuries that Cushing has suffered in both knees, it would not be surprising for him to develop varying degrees of arthritis within 5 years of his injuries. To what extent it may debilitate him is variable from player to player.

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 10:08 PM
So what are the best case/worst case scenarios as things stand at the moment?

I've covered these in my initial posts. Let's be patient for additional info.

WolverineFan
10-20-2013, 10:09 PM
So what are the best case/worst case scenarios as things stand at the moment?

He's obviously out for the year. However, Rotoworld said it is not as severe an injury as last year. That is all just rumor and conjecture for the moment though.

dalemurphy
10-20-2013, 10:12 PM
I've covered these in my initial posts. Let's be patient for additional info.

Well, I'm rooting for the evulsion fracture. That looks good to me... I am quite concerned with the accumulation of cartilage damage with these injuries... and that one looks like a scenario where there may have been none. It also, to be very optimistic, could indicate that his knee is quite healthy post surgery for it to take on enough force to break that bone but not have other structural damage to the ligaments...

We will see about some of it soon, I guess, though I'm sure getting clear information from the Texans will be difficult.

CloakNNNdagger
10-20-2013, 10:29 PM
Well, I'm rooting for the evulsion fracture. That looks good to me... I am quite concerned with the accumulation of cartilage damage with these injuries... and that one looks like a scenario where there may have been none. It also, to be very optimistic, could indicate that his knee is quite healthy post surgery for it to take on enough force to break that bone but not have other structural damage to the ligaments...

We will see about some of it soon, I guess, though I'm sure getting clear information from the Texans will be difficult.

That may be true. But it could be more of a function of the hit being taken off-center directly onto the fibula only (avoiding direct severe trauma to the tibia, which would more likely cause an ACL and/or PCL). He may have just lucked out.

Goatcheese
10-20-2013, 10:35 PM
Cushing will just drink some milk. He'll be alright.



They need to outlaw diving into a player's knees. Diving in front and having him trip over you is one thing, but putting your entire body weight and the force of your momentum into a dude's livelihood is fugging bullcrap.

:mad:

DocBar
10-20-2013, 10:42 PM
Cushing will just drink some milk. He'll be alright.



They need to outlaw diving into a player's knees. Diving in front and having him trip over you is one thing, but putting your entire body weight and the force of your momentum into a dude's livelihood is fugging bullcrap.

:mad:How can they do that when a defender can't go anywhere above the shoulders with more than a pinky finger? DJ got penalized for an elbow to the head on a QB that slid immediately before the elbow to the head. The NFL is actively directing players to go at the legs.

Is the NFL going to develop a "strike zone"? If so, I hope it's more strictly regulated than the one that MLB employs.

waynegg
10-20-2013, 11:02 PM
CBS is reporting a broken leg and torn acl. Truth or bull****?

Seegara
10-20-2013, 11:16 PM
Wasn't even talking to Cush.
Response:
Oh you weren't talking about Cush? "Well the injury prone Cushing goes down again" please tell me more about how you weren't talking about Cush.
You can see for yourselves, folks. I'm sure most of you know the difference between the prepositions to and about.

SchaubApologist
10-20-2013, 11:28 PM
Cushing will just drink some milk. He'll be alright.



They need to outlaw diving into a player's knees. Diving in front and having him trip over you is one thing, but putting your entire body weight and the force of your momentum into a dude's livelihood is fugging bullcrap.

:mad:

i don't know about that because there goes kubiak's ZBS

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
10-20-2013, 11:33 PM
i don't know about that because there goes kubiak's ZBS



Hopefully Kubiak won't be here next season so it wouldn't matter to us. :)

SchaubApologist
10-20-2013, 11:35 PM
Hopefully Kubiak won't be here next season so it wouldn't matter to us. :)

hehe don't hold your breath. take a look at bob mcnair's comments & prepare yourself to be disappointed.

Vance87
10-20-2013, 11:56 PM
Response:

You can see for yourselves, folks. I'm sure most of you know the difference between the prepositions to and about.

Oh, you weren't talking TO Cushing. Wow. Are you currently posting from a mental institution?

DocBar
10-21-2013, 12:10 AM
Response:

You can see for yourselves, folks. I'm sure most of you know the difference between the prepositions to and about.So the extremely injury-prone Cushing is down again. From the way he looked when they helped him off the field, it looks llike he's out for the season this time. And to think we spent all that money extending his contract!
You were most definitely talking about Cushing, in a negative way, not talking to him. You're an asshat, pure and simple. The injuries he's had the last two years were from playing football at a high level, not from being injury prone.

DocBar
10-21-2013, 12:31 AM
no they are not. they are trying to change the tackling target of aiming for the head to properly changing the target area to below the head and what should be above the knee. that is the proper target area.

what you are seeing is players going the extreme route and now going for the knees which is a lot more devastating than hits to the head head. NFL needs to get in front of this new trend which is the effect of that new rule.

OUTLAW all hits to the knee. They need to to emphasize that. Change the tackling rules to only allowing hits below the head above the knee. That actually would make defenders better tacklers and a much safer game.You prove that the speed of light is faster than the speed of sound. You appear bright until you type something(yes, typing can be heard. You're listening right now to see if it's true).

Football is far too dynamic to expect a player to aim for where another player might be. Hence all the angst about players diving at legs instead of having his head up, hitting and wrapping up. BTW, the head up, wrapping up technique is the safest method for the tackler.

How can a player accurately predict where another player will be, in space? How can a much smaller DB tackle a much bigger TE/WR/RB by hitting higher? Have you ever played football outside the Pop Warner level? You appear to be making knee jerk reactions to a legal hit because it hurts the Texans. Charles did NOT make a dirty hit on Cush. It was clean, legal and what I would expect from any Texans RB.

silvrhand
10-21-2013, 12:36 AM
no they are not. they are trying to change the tackling target of aiming for the head to properly changing the target area to below the head and what should be above the knee. that is the proper target area.

what you are seeing is players going the extreme route and now going for the knees which is a lot more devastating than hits to the head head. NFL needs to get in front of this new trend which is the effect of that new rule.

OUTLAW all hits to the knee. They need to to emphasize that. Change the tackling rules to only allowing hits below the head above the knee. That actually would make defenders better tacklers and a much safer game.

Just put them in skirts and flag football. Cushing should have never allowed Jamal Charles to get to his legs, he tried to bull him over instead of getting his hands down. This is football injuries happen, I'm already tired of the 50-51 games and who has the ball last.

Football is a physical sport...

MEGA SWATT
10-21-2013, 01:06 AM
Just put them in skirts and flag football. Cushing should have never allowed Jamal Charles to get to his legs, he tried to bull him over instead of getting his hands down. This is football injuries happen, I'm already tired of the 50-51 games and who has the ball last.

Football is a physical sport...

Cushing should not have allowed that? gmamfb. The guy went low and lunged into cushing's knee. That kind of sh!t has no place in the nfl

silvrhand
10-21-2013, 01:26 AM
Cushing should not have allowed that? gmamfb. The guy went low and lunged into cushing's knee. That kind of sh!t has no place in the nfl

Seriously everyone needs to wake up on this.

- Cushing was not engaged by anyone else.
- Jamal didn't hit him from behind.
- Jamal was in clear sight of Cushing.
- Cushing decided to ignore Jamal Charles.
- Jamal Charles blew up Cushing cause of the above.
- The hit was not illegal.

Always protect yourself.. rule #1, if you ignore a player and let them blow you up in your legs it's just a bad decision. Look it sucks but it's a completely legal hit, sometimes just bad things happen. What do you expect Jamal Charles to do, say hold on Mr. Cushing could you please hold still for a second and let me hit you in the "strike zone" and then get run over?

http://fauxjohnmadden.lockerdome.com/media/110015925
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/assets/3425485/cushing_medium.gif

MEGA SWATT
10-21-2013, 01:48 AM
Seriously everyone needs to wake up on this.

- Cushing was not engaged by anyone else.
- Jamal didn't hit him from behind.
- Jamal was in clear sight of Cushing.
- Cushing decided to ignore Jamal Charles.
- Jamal Charles blew up Cushing cause of the above.
- The hit was not illegal.

Always protect yourself.. rule #1, if you ignore a player and let them blow you up in your legs it's just a bad decision. Look it sucks but it's a completely legal hit, sometimes just bad things happen. What do you expect Jamal Charles to do, say hold on Mr. Cushing could you please hold still for a second and let me hit you in the "strike zone" and then get run over?

http://fauxjohnmadden.lockerdome.com/media/110015925
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/assets/3425485/cushing_medium.gif

My pt is it should be an illegal hit and I predict that one day rules will change to disallow this which IMO is a cheap shot

imatexan
10-21-2013, 01:48 AM
Seriously everyone needs to wake up on this.

- Cushing was not engaged by anyone else.
- Jamal didn't hit him from behind.
- Jamal was in clear sight of Cushing.
- Cushing decided to ignore Jamal Charles.
- Jamal Charles blew up Cushing cause of the above.
- The hit was not illegal.

Always protect yourself.. rule #1, if you ignore a player and let them blow you up in your legs it's just a bad decision. Look it sucks but it's a completely legal hit, sometimes just bad things happen. What do you expect Jamal Charles to do, say hold on Mr. Cushing could you please hold still for a second and let me hit you in the "strike zone" and then get run over?

http://fauxjohnmadden.lockerdome.com/media/110015925
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/assets/3425485/cushing_medium.gif


Yes did you get that everyone?

If you run to try to tackle someone, expect a helmet full force into your knee that will end your season and maybe more.

So sad to see this happen, I feel bad for myself as a Texans fan for not having Cushing on the field...can't imagine how Cush feels.

MEGA SWATT
10-21-2013, 01:50 AM
Yes did you get that everyone?

If you run to try to tackle someone, expect a helmet full force into your knee that will end your season and maybe more.

So sad to see this happen, I feel bad for myself as a Texans fan for not having Cushing on the field...can't imagine how Cush feels.

Agreed

waynegg
10-21-2013, 01:52 AM
Seriously everyone needs to wake up on this.

- Cushing was not engaged by anyone else.
- Jamal didn't hit him from behind.
- Jamal was in clear sight of Cushing.
- Cushing decided to ignore Jamal Charles.
- Jamal Charles blew up Cushing cause of the above.
- The hit was not illegal.

Even in high school clipping is illegal. Deliberately striking the side of the knee falls under that rule.

cstyle42
10-21-2013, 06:29 AM
Cushing is done regardless I wish him well next year. This year is another sacrifice. I had a feeling he would get hurt midseason it's inevitable.

silvrhand
10-21-2013, 06:35 AM
Even in high school clipping is illegal. Deliberately striking the side of the knee falls under that rule.

No it doesn't you clearly don't understand the rules..

CloakNNNdagger
10-21-2013, 07:23 AM
CBS is reporting a broken leg and torn acl. Truth or bull****?

All CBS reports I have reviewed are stating LCL and leg or fibula (part of leg) fracture. They report that this is the same leg as the ACL he suffered LAST year. I've not seen a report of an ACL tear. He could still have an ACL, but that would be likely a partial ACL since it wasn't supposedly evident on physical exam alone......and then would be only diagnosed AFTER he undergoes the MRI later today.

http://catalog.nucleusinc.com/imagescooked/387W.jpg

This is the type of injury [See above] that you would not want to find after full evaluation......one including the tibial plateau, a separate LCL tear in addition to a fibula fracture. Since the plain x-rays did not mention displaced tibial fracture(s), the MRI would probably only reveal stress fracture(s) of the tibia plateau.........along with more definitive evaluation of knee ligament and cartilage structures.

EDIT: Now the new information from McClain is that he has a separate LCL tear and a LOWER fibula fracture (I still don't know for sure that he does not mean LOWER LEG (which still could include the proximal avulsion fracture scenario) instead of LOWER FIBULA, since the fibula is considered part of the lower leg-----will have to wait until after the MRI at Kubiak's conference to clarify this). His prognosis, if these are the only injuries, are still good for return to pre-injury performance. Keep in mind, that from last year's ACL, Cushing has done very well when moving forward and backward, but he has definitely lost lateral movement, impeding his sideline to sideline coverage. Independent of this latest injury, this may or may not ever return.

TheIronDuke
10-21-2013, 07:59 AM
Do people not understand what a cut block is? That is what Charles did and what all RB's do because they CAN'T FREAKING BLOCK LINEBACKERS ONE ON ONE! RB's from high school learn how to cut block defenders, and if it's outlawed it will lead to a hell of a lot more pressure on QB's from defenses which will lead to more hits on QB's etc. That block by Charles was NOT dirty and anyone saying it is needs to realize that if that was dirty then we are the dirtiest team in the league because even our O-linemen cut block all the damn time.

silvrhand
10-21-2013, 08:06 AM
Yes did you get that everyone?

If you run to try to tackle someone, expect a helmet full force into your knee that will end your season and maybe more.

So sad to see this happen, I feel bad for myself as a Texans fan for not having Cushing on the field...can't imagine how Cush feels.

Don't get me wrong it sucks to lose Cushing, but part of that play is just bad on Cushing. If anything I'm upset with losing a major player we just signed to a huge contract. I don't like it anymore than anyone else but Cushing used poor technique on that play. I don't know how you can see that Jamal hit him with his helmet in the knee, oh wait you just didn't see this above?

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/assets/3425485/cushing_medium.gif

bOODRO87
10-21-2013, 08:07 AM
Do people not understand what a cut block is? That is what Charles did and what all RB's do because they CAN'T FREAKING BLOCK LINEBACKERS ONE ON ONE! RB's from high school learn how to cut block defenders, and if it's outlawed it will lead to a hell of a lot more pressure on QB's from defenses which will lead to more hits on QB's etc. That block by Charles was NOT dirty and anyone saying it is needs to realize that if that was dirty then we are the dirtiest team in the league because even our O-linemen cut block all the damn time.

No sh*t. Look at what our O-line does.

deucetx
10-21-2013, 08:09 AM
Yeah have to agree with others. Hates losing Cushing but there was nothing wrong with what Charles did. Running backs do that all the time including our own. There's a reason defensive players are taught how to deal with low blocks. Hell, I use to cut quite a bit as well and I was a freaking corner. So don't expect a running back to go up high on a linebacker unless he's of some good size. Just won't happen.

Here's to hoping a strong and timely recovery for the Cush.

CloakNNNdagger
10-21-2013, 08:55 AM
In this NFL.com link, you will find a VIDEO (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000266545/article/brian-cushings-season-believed-to-be-over-for-texans) of the play and the aftermath..............be warned, it is difficult to watch.

CloakNNNdagger
10-21-2013, 09:01 AM
Brian Cushing ‏@briancushing56 13h
It's not how many times you fall down but how many times you get back up. Life is tough but I'm the toughest SOB it's ever seen. Ill be back

Yes you are, Brian...........Yes you are!:texflag:

Seegara
10-21-2013, 10:55 AM
You were most definitely talking about Cushing, in a negative way, not talking to him...
That's exactly the point I was trying to make.
...You're an asshat, pure and simple. The injuries he's had the last two years were from playing football at a high level, not from being injury prone.
This is bs. History has shown over and over that Cushing is extremely injury prone. I stated that fact and somebody implied that saying that about Cushing was equivalent to saying it to his face.

Honoring Earl 34
10-21-2013, 11:00 AM
That's exactly the point I was trying to make.

This is bs. History has shown over and over that Cushing is extremely injury prone. I stated that fact and somebody implied that saying that about Cushing was equivalent to saying it to his face.

There is nothing Cushing could have done about his last two injuries . If he was Tom Brady they would implement a rule .

Ktexan68
10-21-2013, 11:05 AM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer 10m
Tests confirm broken fibula, torn LCL for Texans LB Brian Cushing. ACL, PCL, MCL, patella are fine. Three-month recovery timetable for Cush.
Retweeted by Tania Ganguli

PapaL
10-21-2013, 11:19 AM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer 10m
Tests confirm broken fibula, torn LCL for Texans LB Brian Cushing. ACL, PCL, MCL, patella are fine. Three-month recovery timetable for Cush.
Retweeted by Tania Ganguli

So he'd be ready for the Super Bowl?!?

silvrhand
10-21-2013, 11:32 AM
There is nothing Cushing could have done about his last two injuries . If he was Tom Brady they would implement a rule .

The first knee injury I totally agree, the second one he used 0 technique and let the guy get a clean shot on him. It sucks that the timing on the shot happened at the same time he planted his foot. If had had gotten his hands on the guy the guy as they are taught, and delivered the blow instead of taking the blow, the outcome might have been different.

It's a tough break for him, but doesn't look good long term.

silvrhand
10-21-2013, 11:33 AM
Yes you are, Brian...........Yes you are!:texflag:

Have to admire his spirit for sure.

:texflag: :texflag:

Vance87
10-21-2013, 12:36 PM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer 10m
Tests confirm broken fibula, torn LCL for Texans LB Brian Cushing. ACL, PCL, MCL, patella are fine. Three-month recovery timetable for Cush.
Retweeted by Tania Ganguli

Wow! Much better than I thought. That's great news.

CloakNNNdagger
10-21-2013, 05:51 PM
John McClain @McClain_on_NFL 15m
Dr. James Andrews operates this week on Brian Cushing, who'll travel to Pensacola, Fla., to have his LCL and fractured fibula repaired.

That means that Cushing will probably be put back in action for the Colts game after being fit with a large brace. :kitten:

SchaubApologist
10-21-2013, 06:49 PM
There is nothing Cushing could have done about his last two injuries . If he was Tom Brady they would implement a rule .

Well... He could have jumped over Charles instead of running knee first directly into the low block.

But, the Jet's game injury... Nothing anyone could have done about that. I believe that kind of block has been made illegal.

PapaL
10-21-2013, 07:17 PM
Well... He could have jumped over Charles instead of running knee first directly into the low block.

But, the Jet's game injury... Nothing anyone could have done about that. I believe that kind of block has been made illegal.

He also could have had a Red Bull, grown wings, and flown over the block.

fiasco west
10-21-2013, 07:21 PM
Great news, good to know that we won't have ANOTHER hole to fill. Not saying that he'll be the same Cush but still hoping he could be a productive player for us moving forward.

CloakNNNdagger
10-22-2013, 09:20 AM
John McClain ‏@McClain_on_NFL 52m
Darryl Sharpton to start in place of injured Brian Cushing

McClain meant to tweet a qualifier:

Soon-to-be injured Darryl Sharpton to temporarily start in place of injured Brian Cushing.

Thorn
10-22-2013, 09:47 AM
Sharpton ought to last about half a game. What do we do then?

Vance87
10-22-2013, 01:32 PM
Sharpton ought to last about half a game. What do we do then?

I think I'd go with a one-legged Brian Cushing over Sharpton.

CloakNNNdagger
10-22-2013, 01:41 PM
I think I'd go with a one-legged Brian Cushing over Sharpton.

Do I hear $500 for a one-legged QB?...........going once........going twice..........

Trap_Star
10-22-2013, 01:53 PM
We should tempt the 9ers with a 2nd round pick for Bowman. They already have Willis.

Vance87
10-22-2013, 03:04 PM
Do I hear $500 for a one-legged QB?...........going once........going twice..........

...........

silvrhand
10-22-2013, 03:05 PM
Tim Tebow for LB!

DX-TEX
10-22-2013, 03:12 PM
We should tempt the 9ers with a 2nd round pick for Bowman. They already have Willis.

They would laugh in our face