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Corrosion
09-29-2013, 06:56 PM
Simple question - Does either Yates or Keenum give you a better chance to win that Schaub.



1 Yes , Yates

2 Yes , Keenum

3 No

4 Texan Bill for QB.

amazing80
09-29-2013, 06:57 PM
Yates, ALL aboard the Yater train

DX-TEX
09-29-2013, 06:58 PM
I DEMAND a 5- It can not get any worse

EllisUnit
09-29-2013, 06:59 PM
Keenum for me please.

DX-TEX
09-29-2013, 07:00 PM
Dan Pastorini!

:cow::kitten:

fiasco west
09-29-2013, 07:00 PM
If they don't throw a pick 6...then yep...

Rey
09-29-2013, 07:00 PM
I said this in another thread, but I'd settle for Yates. Would prefer keenum.

pirbroke
09-29-2013, 07:01 PM
I voted Keenum, but I would be happy with yates also, I want Schaub as 3rd string for rest of year.

Thorn
09-29-2013, 07:01 PM
At this point we know we aren't going to win, so what difference does it make it neither Yates or Keenum can win either?

In any case, given the choices, I voted for Keenum.

Bulls on Parade
09-29-2013, 07:02 PM
What kind of question is that? Heck. we would have likely won today's game against the Seahawks with Tim Tebow at quarterback. So yes, Yates and Keenum are looking very attractive right about now. But we should rally behind Matt Schaub and wish him well at San Francisco. This is a sinking ship that Matt Schaub is the captain on and we may as well go down with him.

bash
09-29-2013, 07:03 PM
I think Yates or Keenum will suit us over Schaub given our pocket issues.

Id rather gamble and see something new then to be continuously let down with things that arnt working.

I dont think our O line will get better anytime soon, and Matt Schaub with 5% of pressure = bust. I liked Keenum's/Yate's plays moving in and out (I know it was preseason).


You have tools like

two catching TEs: Garrett Graham, OD
Foster/Tate in the flats/run game, both can catch
AJ + Hopkins for size/speed/consistency (AJ had some ridiculous catches today and D.Hop vs Titans)
Martin/Posey for speed.

Hervoyel
09-29-2013, 07:03 PM
I'd sit Schaub next week and start Yates (even though I chose Keenum) but then if Yates couldn't produce I'd play the next guy in the second half. Mostly I'm thinking I need to see if I've got someone who's going to be able to step up on my roster. I'm not really all that concerned with the order.

I knee-jerk chose Keenum simply because he brings more mobility than Yates who I see as more of a more athletic Schaub. Either would be a step up in athleticism and a step back in experience BUT..... experiences come in both good and bad and it appears to me that Schaub's grow a little gun-shy. He seems worried about the pressure before it's actually on him. That's something Yates or Keenum won't have.

DocBar
09-29-2013, 07:03 PM
I voted for Yates because he's listed as #2. I think either of the backups can do better than Schaub.

chicagotexan2
09-29-2013, 07:04 PM
No but I'm sick of seeing this weak kneed wuss that goes down faster than a Tijuanan hooker.

fiasco west
09-29-2013, 07:06 PM
I'd sit Schaub next week and start Yates (even though I chose Keenum) but then if Yates couldn't produce I'd play the next guy in the second half. Mostly I'm thinking I need to see if I've got someone who's going to be able to step up on my roster. I'm not really all that concerned with the order.

I knee-jerk chose Keenum simply because he brings more mobility than Yates who I see as more of a more athletic Schaub. Either would be a step up in athleticism and a step back in experience BUT..... experiences come in both good and bad and it appears to me that Schaub's grow a little gun-shy. He seems worried about the pressure before it's actually on him. That's something Yates or Keenum won't have.

With what RG3, Kaep, and Wilson did last year...not sure Schaub could lean on experience any more.

Experience should have told him not to throw the ball willy nilly to the flats with a 7 point lead. Usually that's what experience is good for...y'know...not throwing the ball over the middle before realizing if the defense is playing a zone or not...things like that...

thunderkyss
09-29-2013, 07:06 PM
Simple question - Does either Yates or Keenum give you a better chance to win that Schaub.



1 Yes , Yates

2 Yes , Keenum

3 No

4 Texan Bill for QB.

I honestly don't know, but they can't do any worse. If either Tj or Case threw 6 interceptions after 4 games, 3 returned for scores..... I'd give them a little slack. It is what it is... but for Schaub to be trying to prove he can win with this team after 7 years????????


C'mon man.

EllisUnit
09-29-2013, 07:06 PM
Dont matter anyone can see by kubiaks post game speech that Schaub is the man and all the pick 6s he has thrown is Kubiaks fault, according to Kubes.

WolverineFan
09-29-2013, 07:07 PM
Throw Schaub to the wolves next week in SF. No reason to start Yates or Keenum in that environment.

Start Yates against the Rams week 6. If he plays horrible then start Keenum week 7 against KC.

eriadoc
09-29-2013, 07:09 PM
If we're going to keep seeing rookie mistakes from our QB, then I want to see some rookie upside. I voted Keenum. I would be fine with Yates. Schaub is a very good QB as long as the pass rushers leave him alone (cue the "leave Britney alone!" video here). If the defense insists on pressuring him, we're going to continue seeing bad Schaub. So we can either strike a deal with our upcoming opponents to count Three Mississippi before they rush, or we can put a QB in that can do something under pressure.

Honestly, when you see Schaub have to move off his spot, don't you already know the play is over? Or at least, you hope it's over and not going the other way for six?

amazing80
09-29-2013, 07:10 PM
If you decide to make a change, pick one guy and roll with him for the year. Don't be bouncing back and forth....you have to ride them out....

drs23
09-29-2013, 07:11 PM
I've been a Matt Schaub supporter from day one. Those days are now over. I have no idea what his problem is but his best is behind him. I voted #1 Yates but I wouldn't mind seeing Keenum either. Either is more mobile and I believe that to be a necessity behind the porous line that we're fielding right now. Either of these guys have the feet to buy a few extra seconds and surely they won't throw behind the receiver so often.

My Directv went out in the thunderstorm so I missed the 4th quarter. It came back on just in time to watch us lose in OT. Giving up a 20-6 lead when the tube went off only to find out it was a gifted 56yd pick-6 to Sherman.

Excuse me. I'm ill.

thunderkyss
09-29-2013, 07:12 PM
I said this in another thread, but I'd settle for Yates. Would prefer keenum.

I know Weeden got hurt, but that staff put their sht on the table & started their 3rd string guy over their back-up. Dude killed the Bengals today. Dude killed last week.

If most of us are right & Kubiak believe Keenum may be the future, this would be the time to find out. Start him on the road against the 49ers (who are having confidence/health issues right now)..... defense playing pretty good.

welsh texan
09-29-2013, 07:12 PM
I felt like Yates was ok, certainly did well his rookie season, but that once the tape was up on him he was nullifiable. I think Keenum may have the same problem, but obviously hasn't put the tape up yet.

Keenum for the rest of the season, if it goes terribly stick Yates in and let him just field Marshall, if it causes a losing season, do whatever it takes to move up to where we need to be on draft day to get a franchise QB, spend the spare cash freed up with a rookie QB contract on upgrading at safety, ilb and depth at DT.

The risk is one losing season, I don't think we go into full on rebuild by doing this, and for all the risk of drafting a QB high, what better team to plug a rookie into.

legacy_gt
09-29-2013, 07:12 PM
what's the point of having 2 backup qb's? seriously.

Honoring Earl 34
09-29-2013, 07:12 PM
I'm not sure the Texan QB solution is on the roster . That being said it may be time to find out . The Texans are missing their window because of Kubiak's reluctance to change and Schaub's inability to do so .

Rey
09-29-2013, 07:15 PM
I think keenum and Yates give us a better chance to win.

eriadoc
09-29-2013, 07:16 PM
what's the point of having 2 backup qb's? seriously.

2011. Seriously.

CloakNNNdagger
09-29-2013, 07:17 PM
I'd sit Schaub next week and start Yates (even though I chose Keenum) but then if Yates couldn't produce I'd play the next guy in the second half. Mostly I'm thinking I need to see if I've got someone who's going to be able to step up on my roster. I'm not really all that concerned with the order.

I knee-jerk chose Keenum simply because he brings more mobility than Yates who I see as more of a more athletic Schaub. Either would be a step up in athleticism and a step back in experience BUT..... experiences come in both good and bad and it appears to me that Schaub's grow a little gun-shy. He seems worried about the pressure before it's actually on him. That's something Yates or Keenum won't have.

For this reason, I chose Keenum. After all this I would try for separating the skill type as far away from what we have now as possible.

Rey
09-29-2013, 07:18 PM
I know Weeden got hurt, but that staff put their sht on the table & started their 3rd string guy over their back-up. Dude killed the Bengals today. Dude killed last week.

If most of us are right & Kubiak believe Keenum may be the future, this would be the time to find out. Start him on the road against the 49ers (who are having confidence/health issues right now)..... defense playing pretty good.

If keenum is active for the next game that will say a lot.

I really want to see what one of them can do though. We need to know if we have to draft a qb early next year.

DocBar
09-29-2013, 07:18 PM
I felt like Yates was ok, certainly did well his rookie season, but that once the tape was up on him he was nullifiable. I think Keenum may have the same problem, but obviously hasn't put the tape up yet.

Keenum for the rest of the season, if it goes terribly stick Yates in and let him just field Marshall, if it causes a losing season, do whatever it takes to move up to where we need to be on draft day to get a franchise QB, spend the spare cash freed up with a rookie QB contract on upgrading at safety, ilb and depth at DT.

The risk is one losing season, I don't think we go into full on rebuild by doing this, and for all the risk of drafting a QB high, what better team to plug a rookie into.Yates was a 5th round rookie the last time he put any real game film down. Kubiak nullified him as much as anything else. And he got a little bug-eyed in the playoff loss to Baltimore. With a much better grasp of the offense, I think he'd be fine. I'm definitely OK with Keenum but that will never happen with Kubiak. He'll take the experienced player if he ever discovers the stones to make the change in the 1st place.

legacy_gt
09-29-2013, 07:19 PM
Gary will protect Keenum and never play him this year.

burro
09-29-2013, 07:20 PM
I can't say whether Keenum would be better or worse, but anyone thinking Yates would be a huge improvement has a short memory. 3-4 INTs a game isn't going in the right direction.

Schaub had a bad game, but were .500 four games into the season. I don't see a good excuse to go nuclear at this stage.

fiasco west
09-29-2013, 07:21 PM
I felt like Yates was ok, certainly did well his rookie season, but that once the tape was up on him he was nullifiable. I think Keenum may have the same problem, but obviously hasn't put the tape up yet.

Keenum for the rest of the season, if it goes terribly stick Yates in and let him just field Marshall, if it causes a losing season, do whatever it takes to move up to where we need to be on draft day to get a franchise QB, spend the spare cash freed up with a rookie QB contract on upgrading at safety, ilb and depth at DT.

The risk is one losing season, I don't think we go into full on rebuild by doing this, and for all the risk of drafting a QB high, what better team to plug a rookie into.

I don't think Kubiak survives another losing season. Not even with the patience of McNair.

So if he's changing a QB he's going to have to have FULL faith in this guy.

nut
09-29-2013, 07:21 PM
A trained monkey could have won that game after JoJo's INT.

Texecutioner
09-29-2013, 07:24 PM
People who "want" Yates really shouldn't be complaining about Schaub. If you want to get rid of Schaub you should at least want an "upgrade" that can potentially be the QB here for years and run an electric offense. Anyone who thinks Yates is capable of that in the long term really shouldn't be complaining about Schaub.

Keenum on the other hand has some serious potential that this team needs to at least attempt to see what he can do in real time.

robroy72
09-29-2013, 07:24 PM
For me its a no; because they don't call the plays.

DocBar
09-29-2013, 07:24 PM
I don't think Kubiak survives another losing season. Not even with the patience of McNair.

So if he's changing a QB he's going to have to have FULL faith in this guy.So he can either lose his job by having "full faith" in Schaub or he can roll the dice with Yates and at least have a fighting chance to keep his job? We're playing a big boy schedule this year. Despite his size, Matt Schaub is not a big boy.

EllisUnit
09-29-2013, 07:28 PM
what's the point of having 2 backup qb's? seriously.

Go back and ask us this in 2011

YeaLikeRightNow
09-29-2013, 07:29 PM
This is eerily reminding me of Rex Ryan and Mark Sanchez....:spin:

Hervoyel
09-29-2013, 07:30 PM
With what RG3, Kaep, and Wilson did last year...not sure Schaub could lean on experience any more.

Experience should have told him not to throw the ball willy nilly to the flats with a 7 point lead. Usually that's what experience is good for...y'know...not throwing the ball over the middle before realizing if the defense is playing a zone or not...things like that...

Agree. With experience should come wisdom but he appears to have picked up some bad habits.

Mr teX
09-29-2013, 07:34 PM
If we're gonna make this move, I wanna see keenum....just b/c he hasn't really had a chance....I think I know what I'm getting with Yates....not much better than Schaub imo

fiasco west
09-29-2013, 07:39 PM
Agree. With experience should come wisdom but he appears to have picked up some bad habits.

Also...the Browns just played their rookie QB who just beat the Bengals again.

So I'm not sure experience is in play here, especially with these stupid throws Schaub makes.

The sad thing is, on the drive after the pick 6...he does the SAME thing. THE SAME EXACT THING. Except he rolls left and not right, he's under pressure...what does he do? He throws it up for grabs and was lucky that Earl Thomas went up with one hand to knock it down instead of pick it off.

It's even sadder because apparently Kubiak can't trust him. Kubes is saying that in the postgame he should have called another play, that he should have ran it. He doesn't even realize it but with what he says then he basically says "I should have ran it because I can't trust my own QB to keep possession of the football anymore...even if WE do need 3 points."

Now I'm starting to understand why Kubiak goes into turtle shell mode with any kind of lead.

PapaL
09-29-2013, 07:40 PM
After QB1, I'll take QB2. However, short of an injury I don't think you pull QB2 at any time.

I'm still not convinced our future QB is on the roster.

EllisUnit
09-29-2013, 07:42 PM
Haha anyone else hear the Fox crew just now talking about Schaub ??? Glad we as fans arent the only ones who see it.

Hottoddie
09-29-2013, 07:45 PM
This is probably wrong of me, but was anyone else hoping Schaub would get knocked out of the game by one of the hits he was taking? :evil:

fiasco west
09-29-2013, 07:46 PM
Haha anyone else hear the Fox crew just now talking about Schaub ??? Glad we as fans arent the only ones who see it.

Dungy just talked about it. Said it was ALL on Schaub obviously.

Kubiak is the only one who thinks otherwise. Kubiak in his own words blames himself for being TOO aggressive there.

Meh, I'll let him slide with the quotes since it's just media stuff but what irks me more is Matt Schaub saying how "We need to be mentally tougher." or "We need to be better." No Matt, it's YOU these past 3 games.

Rey
09-29-2013, 07:46 PM
Haha anyone else hear the Fox crew just now talking about Schaub ??? Glad we as fans arent the only ones who see it.

I was just watching dungy and Harrison talking about him.

What did the fox guys say?

EllisUnit
09-29-2013, 07:51 PM
I was just watching dungy and Harrison talking about him.

What did the fox guys say?

Basically all the same things we've been saying.

Norg
09-29-2013, 07:55 PM
yell if matt is good for a pick 6 every week then imma have to say YEs that's like starting every game -7 and 0 starting the game that's not good

look I hope yates knows the entire playbook by now like its that back of his hands

im a big matt schaub supporter but this is like his darkest days since hes been here I feel and if he does not start getting W's then I feel like we are wintnessing the end of the schaub era

Seegara
09-29-2013, 08:07 PM
Either one, but especially Keenum.

thunderkyss
09-29-2013, 08:15 PM
I'm not sure the Texan QB solution is on the roster . That being said it may be time to find out . The Texans are missing their window because of Kubiak's reluctance to change and Schaub's inability to do so .

I don't know if he is or if he's not. I don't think allowing Schaub to go back out there, unchallenged as our starter is going to get us any closer to finding out though.

We've been "supporting" him since week 14 of last season. Time to try something different. Throw someone out there. Give them the opportunity to win the job on the field, on a Sunday. If it doesn't work out, give Matt an opportunity to win the job.

giving it to him isn't working anymore.

thunderkyss
09-29-2013, 08:23 PM
Also...the Browns just played their rookie QB who just beat the Bengals again.

So I'm not sure experience is in play here, especially with these stupid throws Schaub makes.


Can you really call a guy a rookie if he's in his 5th season (http://www.nfl.com/player/brianhoyer/81294/profile) on his 4th NFL team?

Number19
09-29-2013, 08:24 PM
Having read through all the replies, it seems almost everyone answered the poll question in the context of who they'd like see in place of Schaub. But I'd ask, win what? If the task is to have a good shot at the Super Bowl, then it is extremely unlikely that a QB with as little experience as Keenum or Yates, would much improve our chances. If the task is to simply win any single game against a quality team, then I think that either of the two would have a reasonable chance of winning. If you are willing to give up playoff expectations and to start over with a new QB, then you make the change.

But a lot of Schaub's problem lies with our OL play. Not just sacks, but QB pressures. The young QB's have the advantage of mobility, but you also have to successfully execute under this pressure.

I've already lowered my expectations for the season and having done so, I'm now open to a change at QB; and between the two, I'd like to see what Keenum can do.

But as for the poll, I answered "no".

Norg
09-29-2013, 08:29 PM
image yates first strating game on the road against the 49ers WOW Scary

I also think if we start yates or keenum we will havesome good but also some growing pains

fiasco west
09-29-2013, 08:30 PM
Can you really call a guy a rookie if he's in his 5th season (http://www.nfl.com/player/brianhoyer/81294/profile) on his 4th NFL team?

Meh, this guy barely has any experience at all either way. Technically Kaepernick wasn't a rookie last year but everyone thinks of him as one. Either way experience has little to do with it, plenty of guys have shown with practically 0 experience that you can play in this league.

Our experienced QB is still the guy floating it into the flats with a 7 point lead.

ATXtexanfan
09-29-2013, 08:32 PM
Im just ready for change at qb

Heath Shuler
09-29-2013, 08:35 PM
Simple question - Does either Yates or Keenum give you a better chance to win that Schaub.



1 Yes , Yates

2 Yes , Keenum

3 No

4 Texan Bill for QB.

5. Josh Freeman

santo
09-29-2013, 08:39 PM
Honestly I'll take the guy eager to start in the NFL than the guy that only stepped it up because his backup job was on the line.

CloakNNNdagger
09-29-2013, 08:42 PM
5. Josh Freeman

No. For this year, experience may not be that important. But familiarity with the system and your supporting staff is.

Scooter
09-29-2013, 08:42 PM
we have probowlers all over the field. we cant be this talented with this good of a scheme on both offense and defense - and be this bad. the plays work, we've all seen it. we've seen schaub, yates, and keenum all shine in the role. schaub peaked and has regressed. he cant move and is actively costing us games with his slow and scared performances. anybody that doesnt lose us games is an upgrade.

yates is that upgrade, but we have a player with a much higher ceiling behind him. keenum has to be the guy. he has everything you want in this scheme. mobile, pocket awareness, throws well on the run, accurate, good ball fake, great deep ball, quick through his progressions, leads receivers. and he wont throw pick 6's every game.

jaayteetx
09-29-2013, 08:45 PM
we have probowlers all over the field. we cant be this talented with this good of a scheme on both offense and defense - and be this bad. the plays work, we've all seen it. we've seen schaub, yates, and keenum all shine in the role. schaub peaked and has regressed. he cant move and is actively costing us games with his slow and scared performances. anybody that doesnt lose us games is an upgrade.

yates is that upgrade, but we have a player with a much higher ceiling behind him. keenum has to be the guy. he has everything you want in this scheme. mobile, pocket awareness, throws well on the run, accurate, good ball fake, great deep ball, quick through his progressions, leads receivers. and he wont throw pick 6's every game.

C'mon, I'm as tired of Schaub as anybody but singing the praises of Keenum like you have, well, lets just wait until he actually plays in a real NFL game against real NFL starters with real defensive coordinators scheming against him.

the wonger need food
09-29-2013, 08:55 PM
Either way, the window is closed on Schaub and it's time to look toward the future. It makes no sense to win 8-9 games with Schaub when they could be building something sustainable.

ChrisG
09-29-2013, 08:57 PM
I DEMAND a 5- It can not get any worse

My vote would be: can they do any worse? I say give Yates or Keenum a shot. I like Keenum but he may need more time. I say Yates has been here long enough and has shown he can at least do as good.

BullBlitz
09-29-2013, 08:58 PM
Simple question - Does either Yates or Keenum give you a better chance to win that Schaub.



1 Yes , Yates

2 Yes , Keenum

3 No

4 Texan Bill for QB.

Yates? No.
Keenum? No.
Schaub? No.

Priceless. What now Rick Smith?

Double Barrel
09-29-2013, 09:02 PM
Man, that pick 6 to Sherman completely emptied me of any glimmer of hope that Schaub could be adequate enough if everything else fell into place (i.e. Dilfer).

But three pick 6's in a row? And one that directly cost us a game?? That is beyond inexcusable. That was embarrassingly pathetic. I'd say it's obvious evidence now. This team cannot even carry a QB like that on it's back.

I have no idea if either Yates or Keenum could give us a 'magical Brady season'. We can hope - based on the playoff win season by Yates or the pre-season potential of Keenum - but in the end it's a shot in the dark.

However, I do feel in my bones now that Schaub will never give us a 'magical Dilfer season'.

Heath Shuler
09-29-2013, 10:16 PM
No. For this year, experience may not be that important. But familiarity with the system and your supporting staff is.

I think we can Freeman cheap, what do we have to lose?

Kubiak is a qb maker remember?

legacy_gt
09-29-2013, 10:19 PM
can't wait the day till we have case burning the defenses that dare to blitz


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTc82mUeHkg

markn
09-29-2013, 10:23 PM
Seen enough of Yates to believe he's not the answer. Give Case a chance

DocBar
09-29-2013, 10:25 PM
I think we can Freeman cheap, what do we have to lose?

Kubiak is a qb maker remember?The only idea as bad as this one is sticking with Schaub.

CloakNNNdagger
09-29-2013, 10:30 PM
I think we can Freeman cheap, what do we have to lose?

Kubiak is a qb maker remember?

Yeh I remember QBs like Orlovsky.....

A QB in this system has to have at least some time to develop timing and chemistry.......at least an offseason or the equivalent.

chenjy9
09-29-2013, 10:31 PM
I don't know if Keenum will be better, but at this point, could he realistically be any worse? :foottap:

CloakNNNdagger
09-29-2013, 10:32 PM
Seen enough of Yates to believe he's not the answer. Give Case a chance

When examine Kubiak's decision to not have true open competition beginning in the offseason, you've got to also wonder about his decision for the order of choice of #2 and #3.............

ArlingtonTexan
09-29-2013, 10:33 PM
Man, that pick 6 to Sherman completely emptied me of any glimmer of hope that Schaub could be adequate enough if everything else fell into place (i.e. Dilfer).

But three pick 6's in a row? And one that directly cost us a game?? That is beyond inexcusable. That was embarrassingly pathetic. I'd say it's obvious evidence now. This team cannot even carry a QB like that on it's back.

I have no idea if either Yates or Keenum could give us a 'magical Brady season'. We can hope - based on the playoff win season by Yates or the pre-season potential of Keenum - but in the end it's a shot in the dark.

However, I do feel in my bones now that Schaub will never give us a 'magical Dilfer season'.

The major thing that Keenum or Yates gives us is the unknown which has great value for us fans. I am not sure what value that has in an NFL lockerrom.

utahmark
09-29-2013, 10:34 PM
There is not a QB on this team that is better than Schaub. I still think they should bench him at least for a game. Schaub has to be held accountable, just like everyone else. Hopefully it would make him better. If not I still think this defense is good enough to take us deep into the playoff's if we just run the ball and don't make mistakes.

Next year I hope we draft a QB early.

ArlingtonTexan
09-29-2013, 10:38 PM
I don't know if Keenum will be better, but at this point, could he realistically be any worse? :foottap:

yes...we have seen this theory in action over and over even the short history of the Texans. The next guy up can and more often than not is worse.

hradhak
09-29-2013, 10:38 PM
There is not a QB on this team that is better than Schaub. I still think they should bench him at least for a game. Schaub has to be held accountable, just like everyone else. Hopefully it would make him better. If not I still think this defense is good enough to take us deep into the playoff's if we just run the ball and don't make mistakes.

Next year I hope we draft a QB early.

Agreed. Schaub is the best QB on the team. Keenum is unproven and Yates is like a spare tire. You put him on after a blow out, but you can't ride him for long.

I think benching Schaub is not a bad idea. It reminds me of the season where the Oilers were 1-4 and they benched Warren Moon for a half. They won the next 11 games. I think Schaub just needs to get his head on straight for a game.

CloakNNNdagger
09-29-2013, 10:39 PM
The major thing that Keenum or Yates gives us is the unknown which has great value for us fans. I am not sure what value that has in an NFL lockerrom.

With Yates, there is not much unknown to defenses (which is the important thing) in anticipating his actions...........just a little quicker reaction than Schaub. With Keenum, the Ds lack not only significant film, but also lose predictability of how he will react in tight situations. This gives him some additional time to truly "develop."

ArlingtonTexan
09-29-2013, 10:50 PM
With Yates, there is not much unknown to defenses (which is the important thing) in anticipating his actions...........just a little quicker reaction than Schaub. With Keenum, the Ds lack not only significant film, but also lose predictability of how he will react in tight situations. This gives him some additional time to truly "develop."

Yates still has only 5 or 6 starts and while there is some book on him, that was written for a rookie who the Texans had about zero intention of ever playing a meaningful down in 2011. Anyway, the "unknown" is not true playing style, etc., but the idea of having hope (even false) that either guy might produce different results. We (and the entire league) know what Schuab is and he getting worse not better.

Hope really is not normally a good plan, but I know the fans at least do not really have any in regards to Schaub at this point.

DocBar
09-29-2013, 10:53 PM
There is not a QB on this team that is better than Schaub. I still think they should bench him at least for a game. Schaub has to be held accountable, just like everyone else. Hopefully it would make him better. If not I still think this defense is good enough to take us deep into the playoff's if we just run the ball and don't make mistakes.

Next year I hope we draft a QB early.

Agreed. Schaub is the best QB on the team. Keenum is unproven and Yates is like a spare tire. You put him on after a blow out, but you can't ride him for long.

I think benching Schaub is not a bad idea. It reminds me of the season where the Oilers were 1-4 and they benched Warren Moon for a half. They won the next 11 games. I think Schaub just needs to get his head on straight for a game.

With Yates, there is not much unknown to defenses (which is the important thing) in anticipating his actions...........just a little quicker reaction than Schaub. With Keenum, the Ds lack not only significant film, but also lose predictability of how he will react in tight situations. This gives him some additional time to truly "develop."

Where are y'all getting these opinions on Schaub and Yates? I was a HUGE supporter of Keenum in PS but realize that there is no way Kubiak will start Keenum over Yates.

How can there be definitive tape on Yates since his rookie year? He's shown that he knows the offense inside out in the PS. If you want definitive tape on him, run him out there and execute a full game plan with him at the helm.

How can anyone say that Schaub is definitely the best QB on the team? Kubiak hasn't ran a back up QB on the field, with full trust, since Rosenfels. Judging Yates based on his rookie(3rd string) year and a handful of attempts last year is ludicrous.

Schaub is the turkey that is keeping the Texans from soaring.

legacy_gt
09-29-2013, 10:57 PM
cle browns are starting a 3rd stringer. they just won their last 2 games beating the bengals today.

I do think that both Yates and Keenum are much better and could take this team further than Schaub at this point in time.

Norg
09-29-2013, 11:07 PM
if yates can prove he can run throw all his 4 reads in like 1 sec kinda like schaub used to do then hes got a shot

I think that why Kubes hs stuck with matt that's the only thing he has is EXP and uhh at times matt in between in the 50's he can light up any defense

bayoudreamn
09-29-2013, 11:09 PM
Having read through all the replies, it seems almost everyone answered the poll question in the context of who they'd like see in place of Schaub. But I'd ask, win what? If the task is to have a good shot at the Super Bowl, then it is extremely unlikely that a QB with as little experience as Keenum or Yates, would much improve our chances. If the task is to simply win any single game against a quality team, then I think that either of the two would have a reasonable chance of winning. If you are willing to give up playoff expectations and to start over with a new QB, then you make the change.

But a lot of Schaub's problem lies with our OL play. Not just sacks, but QB pressures. The young QB's have the advantage of mobility, but you also have to successfully execute under this pressure.

I've already lowered my expectations for the season and having done so, I'm now open to a change at QB; and between the two, I'd like to see what Keenum can do.

But as for the poll, I answered "no".

Key word in your reply is "much" and we don't need much. We need minimal improvement in pocket movement and 1 less interception a game. If we get a 6 yard run here or ther it's monumentally better than the one 5 yard gain we've gotten from Schaub.

I've tried to be supportive of the guy, I have not been a supporter or a hater. I have tried to allow him opportunity to earn respect. He just doesn't get it done and there won't be an improvement. Payton Manning and Brady may have value in their mid thirties due to amazing talent but Schaub's peak isn't behind him......his whole career is behind him, the guy is SO done!

leebigeztx
09-29-2013, 11:19 PM
I know Weeden got hurt, but that staff put their sht on the table & started their 3rd string guy over their back-up. Dude killed the Bengals today. Dude killed last week.

If most of us are right & Kubiak believe Keenum may be the future, this would be the time to find out. Start him on the road against the 49ers (who are having confidence/health issues right now)..... defense playing pretty good.

Keenum has schaub arm talent. Even in the preseason,everything was inside the numbers. If case is the future,then you might as well hand the division the colts for tye next 12 yrs.

Corrosion
09-29-2013, 11:23 PM
Im ready to get TexanBill loaded on good scotch and suit him up .... anything has to be better than gifting opponents a TD per game. :choke:

DocBar
09-29-2013, 11:29 PM
Keenum has schaub arm talent. Even in the preseason,everything was inside the numbers. If case is the future,then you might as well hand the division the colts for tye next 12 yrs.You must be smoking crack or have no idea what you're talking about. Either way, it's pure drivel.

Number19
09-29-2013, 11:30 PM
I think you could expect either of the young QB's to give up more int's than Schaub. I believe the key would be which one "reads" the field better and instinctively finds the open receiver; and a second key would be how well he can place the long ball when DeAndre, or Andre, is in single coverage deep.

Pantherstang84
09-29-2013, 11:30 PM
You must be smoking crack or have no idea what you're talking about. Either way, it's pure drivel.

Both I think.

ThaJokaa
09-29-2013, 11:32 PM
Either would be better, but im leaning Keenum since he went throw his progressions very well and didnt eye down one WR

maddogmrb
09-29-2013, 11:45 PM
I'm not sure the Texan QB solution is on the roster . That being said it may be time to find out . The Texans are missing their window because of Kubiak's reluctance to change and Schaub's inability to do so .

I would love to see Keenum get a chance but, honestly I think the problem is at least as much Kubiak as it is Schaub. EVERYONE knows how conservative Kubiak is in certain situations and especially with a lead and so they know they always have a shot at beating us because WE ALWAYS turn conservative and leave the other team room to make a comeback. If, with the talent we have, Kubiak doesn't have the confidence to keep the foot on the gas pedal and execute until we have put the game out of reach, then we have a coaching problem more than a QB problem.

ThaJokaa
09-29-2013, 11:48 PM
https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/563642_10152276272833957_753343915_n.jpg

DocBar
09-29-2013, 11:49 PM
I would love to see Keenum get a chance but, honestly I think the problem is at least as much Kubiak as it is Schaub. EVERYONE knows how conservative Kubiak is in certain situations and especially with a lead and so they know they always have a shot at beating us because WE ALWAYS turn conservative and leave the other team room to make a comeback. If, with the talent we have, Kubiak doesn't have the confidence to keep the foot on the gas pedal and execute until we have put the game out of reach, then we have a coaching problem more than a QB problem.All of the offense rolls through the QB. If Kubiak gameplans to his QB's weaknesses and strengths then it's no wonder why he calls the games like he does.

aussie_texan
09-30-2013, 12:03 AM
i have been a schaub guy for many years. believing that he had the skill to take this team to the promised land. but like i said in another thread, for me its all on schaub, not gary, not the offence. He hasnt elevated his game and perhaps gone backwards this year. disappointing. i feel sorry for him because i like him but his holding this team back.

leebigeztx
09-30-2013, 12:06 AM
You must be smoking crack or have no idea what you're talking about. Either way, it's pure drivel.


Case doesn't have a nfl arm. He can't drive the ball outside the numbers. Basically,the offense would be limited on routes just like it is now. That's a problem when teams cloud the inside.

DocBar
09-30-2013, 12:12 AM
Case doesn't have a nfl arm. He can't drive the ball outside the numbers. Basically,the offense would be limited on routes just like it is now. That's a problem when teams cloud the inside.Now you're just flaunting your ignorance. Case made several big time NFL throws in PS. I guess your next argument will be that it was against 2nd stringers or worst. Well, his offense was 2nd stringers or worse, also.

Case hit receivers in stride at all ranges in the PS, regardless of the level of talent. Go back and watch the PS games. Case kicked ass every bit as much as Schaub or Yates did.

legacy_gt
09-30-2013, 12:13 AM
Case doesn't have a nfl arm. He can't drive the ball outside the numbers. Basically,the offense would be limited on routes just like it is now. That's a problem when teams cloud the inside.

I've seen so many under thrown passes by schaub. case doesn't have an nfl arm? you still judging from the combine? lol apparently you haven't noticed he's actually got the strongest arm among the 3 let alone the best footwork and killer instincts.

what case is missing is the chance. believe me, case isn't going to throw an interception every game like MS has. and I'm a big schaub fan.

legacy_gt
09-30-2013, 12:19 AM
with that said, case can't start. he's 3rd. but I don't mind at this point starting TJ.

Norg
09-30-2013, 12:21 AM
its not going to happen right now cus we have not played our divison games


jags titans colts obvs if we win our divison games then all would be well

ArlingtonTexan
09-30-2013, 12:26 AM
I would love to see Keenum get a chance but, honestly I think the problem is at least as much Kubiak as it is Schaub. EVERYONE knows how conservative Kubiak is in certain situations and especially with a lead and so they know they always have a shot at beating us because WE ALWAYS turn conservative and leave the other team room to make a comeback. If, with the talent we have, Kubiak doesn't have the confidence to keep the foot on the gas pedal and execute until we have put the game out of reach, then we have a coaching problem more than a QB problem.

Actually, Kubiak not being conservative was the problem today. With 6 minutes left in the 4th quarter, the Texans started a drive relative deep in their territory. the 1st two plays were passes that failed. Kubiak, especially considering the Texans had been overall effective running the ball, not put the ball in schuab's hands. Would have killed another minute or so of clock.

On the backbreaking interception, that was a 3rd and two/three. Again, a situation where either just running the ball while boring, would have either ran clock or forced Seattle to use a timeout.


The problem today was that Kubes relied on schuab, not went all "conservative."

htownfan32
09-30-2013, 12:30 AM
Kubes was not the issue today. I saw so many 4 wide receiver sets I was practically begging Kubes to run the ball more.

We have three glaring issues on offense today. They are -

1) Matt Schaub - simply not the man. We know that. He can't even do a Dilfer and game-manage us to the big time. We draft a QB next year unless Yates/Keenum end up being the answer.

2) Offensive Line - We miss Duane Brown. Wade Smith needs to go (and will go, I suspect). Draft and with the return of Quessenbery and Brennan Williams should address this

3) Speed - we need more. We need one guy who can just take the top off a defense.

Norg
09-30-2013, 12:31 AM
Actually, Kubiak not being conservative was the problem today. With 6 minutes left in the 4th quarter, the Texans started a drive relative deep in their territory. the 1st two plays were passes that failed. Kubiak, especially considering the Texans had been overall effective running the ball, not put the ball in schuab's hands. Would have killed another minute or so of clock.

On the backbreaking interception, that was a 3rd and two/three. Again, a situation where either just running the ball while boring, would have either ran clock or forced Seattle to use a timeout.


The problem today was that Kubes relied on schuab, not went all "conservative."

the drive before the pick six I think we went 3 and out and I was saying we need to run the ball just 3 times and if we have to punt we have to punt

well we didn't we passed all 3 downs and went 3 and out that's when there was like 3:40 on the clock


im not even a coach and I knew this play calling was sooooo simple just run the ball try and get a first down and if u don't well then o well PUNT right there would not have been the end of the world

EVOLVIST
09-30-2013, 12:38 AM
The major thing that Keenum or Yates gives us is the unknown which has great value for us fans. I am not sure what value that has in an NFL lockerrom.

The NFL lockerroom...hmmm. I'm thinking these guys are human, too, regardless of the party line. I'm willing to bet nearly every man on the defense and a good bit of offensive players are not stupid and they have lost a lot of faith in Schaub. It's only human to question... and if they are NOT questioning then something is more wrong than we thought.

midway
09-30-2013, 12:42 AM
Why is there no "Yes, they both do" option?

midway
09-30-2013, 12:44 AM
Case doesn't have a nfl arm. He can't drive the ball outside the numbers. Basically,the offense would be limited on routes just like it is now. That's a problem when teams cloud the inside.

Schaub's arm strength is less of a problem than the fact that he's a high functioning retard.

DocBar
09-30-2013, 12:45 AM
Schaub's arm strength is less of a problem than the fact that he's a high functioning retard.You're just poking fun at his "sleepy eye".

Scooter
09-30-2013, 12:49 AM
C'mon, I'm as tired of Schaub as anybody but singing the praises of Keenum like you have, well, lets just wait until he actually plays in a real NFL game against real NFL starters with real defensive coordinators scheming against him.

i've seen enough between college, camp, and preseasons to be very confident in my support of keenum. i may be wrong, may be right, we wont know how far his skills will take him until case gets his shot. i dont think defensive coordinator's scheming him really matters though since we'd run basically the same offense - and more since kubiak would allow some designed scrambles. the quarterback just has to execute the offense and we are extremely tough to beat, i think keenum is the best equipped player on the squad to do that.

i think one hidden bonus to keenum is that he likely has a much better rapport with the backup receivers than schaub. it's one thing to find a wide open andre johnson, it's another to bang one to martin or jean on 3rd down. schaub cant seem to hit anyone but andre and the tightends - outside of a few floaters to nuk.

infantrycak
09-30-2013, 12:55 AM
Key word in your reply is "much" and we don't need much. We need minimal improvement in pocket movement and 1 less interception a game. If we get a 6 yard run here or ther it's monumentally better than the one 5 yard gain we've gotten from Schaub.

Seeing a lot of opinions equivalent to this and there is one HUGE assumption in it - that whoever replaces Schaub has the same level of play on the non-running plays. It isn't likely to eliminate or even lessen the sacks. Mobile QBs tend to take as many or more sacks. For example Wilson took 5 sacks on 23 attempts while Schaub took 4 sacks on 49 attempts. So the focus there is on the broken plays and turning some into extended time to throw and some into positive rushing gains instead of incomplete passes. How much that adds other than less frustration at immobility is pure conjecture. Are either of them going to do that and give the 262 yds 2 TDs (and yes knowing he also averages 1 INT per game) that Schaub plugs along very consistently with? Yes I would expect improvement but last time TJ was in there he averaged .5 TDs, .5 INTs and 158 ypg. That is a lot of improvement to get in the same ball park and frankly I just don't see his legs making up for it. Keenum looked good in preseason and if a replacement were to go in I would prefer him. But I think it is too early. Among all his poke the bear posts today TK did have a valid point - on a crappy day Schaub went up against the #1 pass D which was giving up 147 ypg and 1 TD in three games and put up 355 yds and 2 TDs. The Seahawks were also nabbing 1.67 INTs per game. I would stick with Schaub for now. If at the halfway mark we are at 4-4 then put Keenum in to show he can handle it and gain the experience to head into next year with a head of steam.

legacy_gt
09-30-2013, 12:58 AM
I would stick with Schaub for now. If at the halfway mark we are at 4-4 then put Keenum in to show he can handle it and gain the experience to head into next year with a head of steam.

you can't put keenum. he's 3rd.

DocBar
09-30-2013, 01:13 AM
Seeing a lot of opinions equivalent to this and there is one HUGE assumption in it - that whoever replaces Schaub has the same level of play on the non-running plays. It isn't likely to eliminate or even lessen the sacks. Mobile QBs tend to take as many or more sacks. For example Wilson took 5 sacks on 23 attempts while Schaub took 4 sacks on 49 attempts. So the focus there is on the broken plays and turning some into extended time to throw and some into positive rushing gains instead of incomplete passes. How much that adds other than less frustration at immobility is pure conjecture. Are either of them going to do that and give the 262 yds 2 TDs (and yes knowing he also averages 1 INT per game) that Schaub plugs along very consistently with? Yes I would expect improvement but last time TJ was in there he averaged .5 TDs, .5 INTs and 158 ypg. That is a lot of improvement to get in the same ball park and frankly I just don't see his legs making up for it. Keenum looked good in preseason and if a replacement were to go in I would prefer him. But I think it is too early. Among all his poke the bear posts today TK did have a valid point - on a crappy day Schaub went up against the #1 pass D which was giving up 147 ypg and 1 TD in three games and put up 355 yds and 2 TDs. The Seahawks were also nabbing 1.67 INTs per game. I would stick with Schaub for now. If at the halfway mark we are at 4-4 then put Keenum in to show he can handle it and gain the experience to head into next year with a head of steam.Do you even watch the games anymore?

eriadoc
09-30-2013, 01:14 AM
you can't put keenum. he's 3rd.

Well, unless the depth chart got chiseled in stone at the league office or something, yes you can. Hell, the Browns just did it a couple weeks ago. Skipped right over their backup in favor of the 3rd stringer. Shocking. :yawn:

thunderkyss
09-30-2013, 01:30 AM
on a crappy day Schaub went up against the #1 pass D which was giving up 147 ypg and 1 TD in three games and put up 355 yds and 2 TDs. The Seahawks were also nabbing 1.67 INTs per game.

Do you even watch the games anymore?

I'm going to be sick if either the Colts (next week) or the Titans (the week after) manage to beat the Seahawks with less impressive stats.

No lie.... no poke the bear anything.. but my head will explode.

DocBar
09-30-2013, 01:32 AM
Well, unless the depth chart got chiseled in stone at the league office or something, yes you can. Hell, the Browns just did it a couple weeks ago. Skipped right over their backup in favor of the 3rd stringer. Shocking. :yawn:I would LOVE to see Keenum start, but I realize that Kubiak won't allow that to happen, barring injury to Yates. That's why I'm in full Yates Support Mode now. Yates at least adds some mobility and arm strength to the equation. Plus he has played in some pressure situations.

It would be awesome to see Keenum go out balling a full game plan with Kubiak ready to cut him loose( I had to bold that because I missed an O in a previous post and got called out on it) to toss the rock and play his game..

infantrycak
09-30-2013, 01:41 AM
Do you even watch the games anymore?

Go back to spamming every thread repeating yourself like a petulant child. Everyone including their dead grandmothers knows you think Schaub sucks. Just keep at it and put an asterisk on it such as.

* Don't bother responding to me or I will insult you, put my fingers in my ears and cry for my diaper to be changed.

eriadoc
09-30-2013, 01:44 AM
I would LOVE to see Keenum start, but I realize that Kubiak won't allow that to happen, barring injury to Yates.

Oh, I don't expect anything like that to happen. I expect Schaub will play every game for which he's healthy and the mistakes will be shuffled off into an offseason decision.

Seegara
09-30-2013, 02:11 AM
I'd be in favor of starting Keenum now. He may not be ready, but he can develop into a quality starter, probably fairly soon since he studies the game. Nothing would be lost since Schaub can't get the job done. And Schaub has no potential for improvement.

leebigeztx
09-30-2013, 03:36 AM
I've seen so many under thrown passes by schaub. case doesn't have an nfl arm? you still judging from the combine? lol apparently you haven't noticed he's actually got the strongest arm among the 3 let alone the best footwork and killer instincts.

what case is missing is the chance. believe me, case isn't going to throw an interception every game like MS has. and I'm a big schaub fan.


I was at camp a lot, and there is no doubt yates has the best arm of the 3 and its not even close. The dude is a dink and dunk passer. When he plays,if he plays,the defense will play him like they play schaub because he can't throw outside the numbers. So the teams will cloud the middle and make him throw outside of the numbers with velocity or accuracy.

TheMatrix31
09-30-2013, 05:31 AM
..............

SAMURAITEXAN
09-30-2013, 05:37 AM
I was attempted to choose TexanBill. However, I just came to reality in time. If there's Yates or Keenum but no Schaub, I will choose this one.

welsh texan
09-30-2013, 05:47 AM
i've seen enough between college, camp, and preseasons to be very confident in my support of keenum. i may be wrong, may be right, we wont know how far his skills will take him until case gets his shot. i dont think defensive coordinator's scheming him really matters though since we'd run basically the same offense - and more since kubiak would allow some designed scrambles. the quarterback just has to execute the offense and we are extremely tough to beat, i think keenum is the best equipped player on the squad to do that.

i think one hidden bonus to keenum is that he likely has a much better rapport with the backup receivers than schaub. it's one thing to find a wide open andre johnson, it's another to bang one to martin or jean on 3rd down. schaub cant seem to hit anyone but andre and the tightends - outside of a few floaters to nuk.

I completely agree with this here, I'd much rather be proven completely wrong on this one than never find out as well.

I don't have a problem with Kubiak on this, yet. He's stood by his man up until this point, and I don't think you could really say that it was obvious that Schaub wasn't going to recover up until this point.

Now is the time for change, not the end of this season, not the end of last season, or the one before that, it's right now. Schaub has been given his fair chance and failed, lets move on.

I'm seeing the same pattern emerging as happened with Carr, the flashes of potential but when it really comes down to it, this guy is now sine handedly losing games.

Remember how much better the oline looked without a scared QB to protect? It'll happen again. My season expectations at this point have changed to accomodate a flyer on a young QB, this ain't a Super Bowl season and one and done in the playoffs no longer cuts it as success, even if we make the playoffs.

Pantherstang84
09-30-2013, 07:16 AM
Seeing a lot of opinions equivalent to this and there is one HUGE assumption in it - that whoever replaces Schaub has the same level of play on the non-running plays. It isn't likely to eliminate or even lessen the sacks. Mobile QBs tend to take as many or more sacks. For example Wilson took 5 sacks on 23 attempts while Schaub took 4 sacks on 49 attempts. So the focus there is on the broken plays and turning some into extended time to throw and some into positive rushing gains instead of incomplete passes. How much that adds other than less frustration at immobility is pure conjecture. Are either of them going to do that and give the 262 yds 2 TDs (and yes knowing he also averages 1 INT per game) that Schaub plugs along very consistently with? Yes I would expect improvement but last time TJ was in there he averaged .5 TDs, .5 INTs and 158 ypg. That is a lot of improvement to get in the same ball park and frankly I just don't see his legs making up for it. Keenum looked good in preseason and if a replacement were to go in I would prefer him. But I think it is too early. Among all his poke the bear posts today TK did have a valid point - on a crappy day Schaub went up against the #1 pass D which was giving up 147 ypg and 1 TD in three games and put up 355 yds and 2 TDs. The Seahawks were also nabbing 1.67 INTs per game. I would stick with Schaub for now. If at the halfway mark we are at 4-4 then put Keenum in to show he can handle it and gain the experience to head into next year with a head of steam.

I get and understand what you are saying. So, let me set my calendar to start watching again at game 9. I am tired of watching the same old Schaub. He is so dang predictable I can usually tell what wiil happen as soon as the ball is snapped. This is getting pretty boring.

The1ApplePie
09-30-2013, 09:37 AM
Even though he is painfully mediocre, Matt Schaub is still an NFL QB.

Yates barley qualifies as one. And, sorry UH fanboys, but Keenum may not be an NFL QB at all.

The Texans will still make the playoffs, so you can forget drafting a franchise guy. I guess we would have Josh Freeman or Mark Sanchez to look forward to in the offseason.

Dread-Head
09-30-2013, 09:42 AM
Schuab plays like a back up. While backing up Dog-boy (Vick) in Atlanta he DREAMED of being a starter, unfortunately once he attained his dream he didn't aspire to be the starter on a championship team. He seems content with 3 and outs. He doesn't seem to inspire his O-line to be willing to die for him. He doesn't fire up his troops.

The best way to describe him would be like Butch in the rape scene in Pulp Fiction. He kicks in the door and dispatches of rapist #2 with a katana then threatens rapist #1 to stop him from making it to the 44 in his gunbelt. They're having a stand off when they hear the distinct sound of a shotgun being loaded and Marcellus saying "Step aside Butch" before knee capping his rapist.
My point? Schaub is GOOD against unarmed/unprepared/distracted rapist #2 and can buy you some time against rapist #1 until ced scuzball figures out how to get to his gun but in the end if scuzball #1 gets to his gun Butch is a dead man. Butch's JOB is to buy Marcellus time to pull up his pants and get the shot gun prior to knee capping the other guy and calling the guys from Compton with the pliers and blowtorches to get medieval.

Schaub is a career back up who is proving that he's a GREAT back up but NOT a starter. So on behalf of T.J. Yates, Keenum & several pissed off fans sick of seeing him throw one interception per game and 2 pick sixes in four games: (In best Ving Rhames voice) "Step aside Butch."


For the record...I voted for Bill!

Dread-Head
09-30-2013, 09:44 AM
Do you even watch the games anymore?



:headhurts: Woah. A debate between Doc & Cak? These things are always classic. Hold on. (steps out for second)

:popcorn: Go ahead.

Craig.
09-30-2013, 09:45 AM
Why don't they just start OD at QB?

This place is getting ridiculous.

Mr teX
09-30-2013, 09:58 AM
No surprise Keenum is winning this poll...... fans are such texas college homers.....especially here.

Cody Carlson comes out of baylor...whole contigent of fans clamor for him to start over a HOF qb.....he gets his chance and he sucks

Bucky Richardson comes out of A&M...whole contigent of fans clamor for him to start over a HOF qb...he gets his chance and he sucks

VY comes out of UT in the draft......strong contigent of fans blast the texans for not drafting him..he sucks for 3 different teams..& yet you still have a contigent of fans (albeit smaller) wanting the texans to bring him in.

& here we are at the Case Keenum stage with all this. Sure, we've got a back up qb who's won a playoff game for the team already...but lets go ahead & start the undrafted guy with over him b/c he went to U of H...:mariopalm:

I can only imagine how it's going to be when Manziel declares for the draft...

Yesterday
09-30-2013, 10:00 AM
there isn't a franchise Quarterback on this team. All three are about the same skill-wise...I may lean towards Keenum b/c of mobility, but at the end of the day, we need a franchise guy.

Good thing we drafted Travis Johnson over Aaron Rodgers when David Carr was our starter!

thunderkyss
09-30-2013, 10:03 AM
Matts biggest sell is that he runs the offense efficiently.

I think we can all agree that isn't the case anymore.

I think it's just as likely that he can turn it around as it is that Case or Yates can rally us to where we want to be. But I don't think it's going to happen if it's "his job to lose" & he doesn't lose it because "we're" being stubborn.

Bench him, hope that it has the effect we want & move on.

HOU-TEX
09-30-2013, 10:14 AM
Can either one of them read a nickel blitz that even my mom could see? If so, then yes

Seriously! How could he not see that blitz?! It's absolutely ridiculous

And Kubiak...why the hell would you not run the ball

gafftop
09-30-2013, 10:28 AM
Posted before season started based on watching MS for too many years, TJ during his year and Case this year versus last year.

Obviously Matt has gone down since that time. This team has enough talent to make playoffs this year still. Remember the year I think 2009 that we had Foster on practice squad and Chris Brown as our power back. I think that would have been the 1st playoff year if Kubiak had mad change earlier.

3 Weeks Ago #788
gafftop
Hall of Fame


Re: Case Keenum grabs early edge in Texans backup QB (Yates named #2)

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Tk I hear you but my take on MS is based on what I have seen since he has been here and what he really is. Also I agree 100% what you said about replacing MS but Kubiak I don't think will do that.

I posted this in a previous thread
"My take on MS is for the regular season games against the non elite teams I am ok with ms because you really don't need him to win game. As long as he manages game the Texans probably win. I think MS has the best chance of managing a game of the 3 QBs.

Against the elite teams you need the QB to do more and MS has a ceiling. We have seen it many times. The above is based on him playing like he did in the first 12 games last year. If he plays like he did at the end then I don't want him at all.

I think TJ has the same upside as MS a he gets more experience but not much more.

Case is the one I would want if we need the QB to win the game. I would not like him right now to get us to the playoffs because I think he will have lower lows but higher highs. He is not as consistent as MS but I think he has a chance to have a great game at times and carry a team. I really don't think MS has that in him.

Tough situation right now because MS is going to play and the other QB's get no experience so you have to ride MS in the playoffs and we win the game not because of MS does but what the rest of the team does.

Just my opinion. "

I think I understand more now what I meant after reading a SI article on How to beat Alabama and watching the UT vs BYU game.

Matt is maybe the least likely player to create, improvise, or make an unscheduled play. First he is possible the least physically gifted QB and he hasn't shown any ability to improvise if a play breaks down. Against lesser teams you can play that way and win. Against equal or better teams you can't play like that and win unless you have a dominating defense which we don't. We may have the most dominating defensive player but the defense as a whole is above average.

A good coach with good talent can come up with a way to stop a team. As Saban stated you can't scheme against a player that can make an unscheduled play. MS is maybe the least likely to make an unscheduled play and thus it is easier to scheme against the Texans because you do not need to account for MS. Just my opinion but I think TJ is very much like MS in that aspect. I would welcome the chance to see how TJ/CK would fare in real action but it won't happen unless MS is hurt.

In the regular season, as we saw last year you can get away with MS as QB. When the games really started to matter at the end of the season/playoffs we saw what happened.

Watching the UT vs BYU game hammered home what a multi talented QB has over a 1 dimension non athletic QB but really we see this fact every week.

Now to be fare to MS maybe GK has the handcuffs on MS but I think even if MS had a green light he does not have the ability to improvise.

Post too long and rambling now. I am out.
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The1ApplePie
09-30-2013, 10:41 AM
I can only imagine how it's going to be when Manziel declares for the draft...

I get the impression that Manziel is kind of hated on this board, at least in the college section. We have more blind UT fanboys then we do A&M fanboys.

We do have a lot of UH fans. I didn't even know UH had fans until I came to this board.

noxiousdog
09-30-2013, 10:44 AM
No surprise Keenum is winning this poll...... fans are such texas college homers.....especially here.

It's only logical. While some people think Keenum will succeed, it's mostly because he's the only unknown. Schaub's clearly regressed, and Yates has done nothing to impress.

cstyle42
09-30-2013, 10:44 AM
Matts biggest sell is that he runs the offense efficiently.

I think we can all agree that isn't the case anymore.

I think it's just as likely that he can turn it around as it is that Case or Yates can rally us to where we want to be. But I don't think it's going to happen if it's "his job to lose" & he doesn't lose it because "we're" being stubborn.

Bench him, hope that it has the effect we want & move on.

I'm starting to see that the offense runs Matt Schaub... literally and figuratively.

BullNation4Life
09-30-2013, 10:47 AM
ok I am gonna throw gas all over this fire and light this mutha' F'n thread up!!!

Don't know if it has already been mentioned, not going through each page to look, BUT...


Josh Freeman.....



From what LZ was talking about in cap space and whatnot, releasing Schaub would be like a 500k hit, when all the number crunching is done...

HOU-TEX
09-30-2013, 10:49 AM
ok I am gonna throw gas all over this fire and light this mutha' F'n thread up!!!

Don't know if it has already been mentioned, not going through each page to look, BUT...


Josh Freeman.....

What about him? He sucks worse than Schaub.

grinch1134
09-30-2013, 10:49 AM
Would I like to see the backups play, sure. Do I think they have a better chance winning, nope. I guess it will happen when the season is done as far as contention goes, is that now, nope.

BullNation4Life
09-30-2013, 10:51 AM
What about him? He sucks worse than Schaub.

does he? or is it the offense he is in with Schiano? He is 25, got a strong arm and can move a hell of allot better than Schaub. Plus he will come cheap! Low risk Very high reward....

he gets in Kubiak's system, may change things for everybody...

gafftop
09-30-2013, 10:52 AM
It's only logical. While some people think Keenum will succeed, it's mostly because he's the only unknown. Schaub's clearly regressed, and Yates has done nothing to impress.

100% agree
But also look at progress of Keenum from 1st year to 2nd and Yates 1st to 2nd.
Keenum seemed to improve dramatically while Yates seemed to regress.

TexanBacker93
09-30-2013, 10:59 AM
Also...the Browns just played their rookie QB who just beat the Bengals again.

So I'm not sure experience is in play here, especially with these stupid throws Schaub makes.

The sad thing is, on the drive after the pick 6...he does the SAME thing. THE SAME EXACT THING. Except he rolls left and not right, he's under pressure...what does he do? He throws it up for grabs and was lucky that Earl Thomas went up with one hand to knock it down instead of pick it off.

It's even sadder because apparently Kubiak can't trust him. Kubes is saying that in the postgame he should have called another play, that he should have ran it. He doesn't even realize it but with what he says then he basically says "I should have ran it because I can't trust my own QB to keep possession of the football anymore...even if WE do need 3 points."

Now I'm starting to understand why Kubiak goes into turtle shell mode with any kind of lead.

Hoyer isn't a rookie. He was Brady's backup for a few years before going to Arizona last year.

eriadoc
09-30-2013, 11:02 AM
No surprise Keenum is winning this poll...... fans are such texas college homers.....especially here.

Cody Carlson comes out of baylor...whole contigent of fans clamor for him to start over a HOF qb.....he gets his chance and he sucks

Bucky Richardson comes out of A&M...whole contigent of fans clamor for him to start over a HOF qb...he gets his chance and he sucks

I wouldn't mind seeing if Keenum sucks, instead of having a bunch of know nothing internet jockeys tell me he will, like they have a crystal ball. I already know Matt Schaub sucks. {"He doesn't suck! Look at the stats!"} OK, he only sucks when the defense puts pressure on him. So if we can get those mean old defensive guys to count Three Mississippi before they rush, then I'm happy with Schaub.

As I said upthread, I don't expect that to happen, but it's a message board, so I can want whatever the hell I want.

Mr teX
09-30-2013, 11:11 AM
100% agree
But also look at progress of Keenum from 1st year to 2nd and Yates 1st to 2nd.
Keenum seemed to improve dramatically while Yates seemed to regress.

He hasn't seen live bullets is the problem though. I am U of H alum & i want the guy to get his shot & succeed, i just don't think he's going to be that much different from what Schaub or Yates have done to this point...especially with our patchwork o-line as it is now.

You'll likely see more flash plays....plays Schaub simply can't make with his feet..........but likely just as many costly mistakes if not more.

gafftop
09-30-2013, 11:46 AM
He hasn't seen live bullets is the problem though. I am U of H alum & i want the guy to get his shot & succeed, i just don't think he's going to be that much different from what Schaub or Yates have done to this point...especially with our patchwork o-line as it is now.

You'll likely see more flash plays....plays Schaub simply can't make with his feet..........but likely just as many costly mistakes if not more.

You may be right, but you may be wrong. I would like to see him against live bullets. If he fails at least we know. Our patchwork line is one reason why it makes more sense. If our line was great Matt would possibly be OK. We need someone a little more mobile because of the patchwork line. Also I have said many times MS looks for 80 and if he is not open blindly throws to 81. I would like to see if Case sees the field better than Matt. I don't think Matt sees the field.

Remember when we moved up to get Tate because we really weren't sure about Foster because he just played the last few games? First Foster was better than Chris Brown and the Texans would possibly have made the playoffs that year not 2 years later. Second we basically wasted more than a 2nd round pick for a backup running back. Do we want to repeat that again because we refuse to let one/both backups play and see what we have.


Case for sure and probably TJ will change the whole attitude of the team even if for only a short time. MS to me seems to have a dark cloud around him.

I would love to have Gary and Matt mic'd up.

Bottom line is I don't think we have anything to lose and will gain something no matter what happens.

Mr teX
09-30-2013, 11:51 AM
I wouldn't mind seeing if Keenum sucks, instead of having a bunch of know nothing internet jockeys tell me he will, like they have a crystal ball. I already know Matt Schaub sucks. {"He doesn't suck! Look at the stats!"} OK, he only sucks when the defense puts pressure on him. So if we can get those mean old defensive guys to count Three Mississippi before they rush, then I'm happy with Schaub.

As I said upthread, I don't expect that to happen, but it's a message board, so I can want whatever the hell I want.

Noboby has said he will definitely suck..........You gotta admit though, the percentages are stacked wwaaaayyyyy against him given how he got into the league, where he is on the depth chart, his lack of experience and a whole host of other factors....It's an educated guess grounded more in reality than you and everyone else's hopeful "Anybody but Schaub" mentality.

Mr teX
09-30-2013, 11:59 AM
You may be right, but you may be wrong. I would like to see him against live bullets. If he fails at least we know. Our patchwork line is one reason why it makes more sense. If our line was great Matt would possibly be OK. We need someone a little more mobile because of the patchwork line. Also I have said many times MS looks for 80 and if he is not open blindly throws to 81. I would like to see if Case sees the field better than Matt. I don't think Matt sees the field.

Remember when we moved up to get Tate because we really weren't sure about Foster because he just played the last few games? First Foster was better than Chris Brown and the Texans would possibly have made the playoffs that year not 2 years later. Second we basically wasted more than a 2nd round pick for a backup running back. Do we want to repeat that again because we refuse to let one/both backups play and see what we have.


Case for sure and probably TJ will change the whole attitude of the team even if for only a short time. MS to me seems to have a dark cloud around him.

I would love to have Gary and Matt mic'd up.

Bottom line is I don't think we have anything to lose and will gain something no matter what happens.

I agree with mostly everything you said except the bolded parts...a patchwork o-line isn't good for any qb, mobile or not.

Furthermore i think right now is too early to look at starting keenum...imo the season has to be lost for him to get his shot....handle him much the same way we handled Arian. If he comes out on top next year in the preseason after open competition, fine. Yates deserves his shot 1st imo b/c the season is still salvageable.

bOODRO87
09-30-2013, 12:06 PM
It's only logical. While some people think Keenum will succeed, it's mostly because he's the only unknown. Schaub's clearly regressed, and Yates has done nothing to impress.

This is where I stand.

Porky
09-30-2013, 12:07 PM
I would like to see either or both instead of what we have now. Might be a disaster, but right now, I would rather see a new disaster then the one we have now.

While Yates is pretty mobile, and Keenum very mobile, you don't HAVE to be mobile to be successful. While the game has certainly moved that direction the last few years, if mobility was the end all/be all, Tom Brady and Payton Manning would be watching football from the comfort of their easy chairs.

And don't give me the BS about a better line. Manning lost Clady, and Brady has an average line. And watching that game last night just about made me puke my cookies. Brady has a bunch of nobody's at all the skill positions and somehow he torches Atlanta. The freaking guy has an average line, is a complete statue, and has no weapons and gets it freaking done.

Our guy has more toys than Hugh Hefner on his 80th birthday, and he doesn't use most of them and the ones he does...he screws it up. Again, mobility is a nice asset, but can anyone tell me what this offense looks like with Manning or Brady under center...both of whom are no more mobile than MS?

It's mostly on Schaub, but I'm not letting Kubiak get off totally scot free. I'm sick of his lame ass too. We need to package them to Outer Mongolia in exchange for a camel and a goat.

Anyone got some pink soap? :kitten:

noxiousdog
09-30-2013, 12:13 PM
Noboby has said he will definitely suck..........You gotta admit though, the percentages are stacked wwaaaayyyyy against him given how he got into the league, where he is on the depth chart, his lack of experience and a whole host of other factors....It's an educated guess grounded more in reality than you and everyone else's hopeful "Anybody but Schaub" mentality.

At this point, what's wrong with ABS? Well, that's not exactly true. I don't see any point in going to Yates or Freeman for that matter.

But I think you need to find out if Keenum has the ability prior to spending a first round pick on a QB in the off-season.

Rolling with Schaub means we limp to a mediocre record, wind up on the road in the playoffs (if we even get there) and get ousted. Schaub is worse next year and we're hopeless next year.

txstate_texan
09-30-2013, 12:15 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/09/30/texans-can-escape-schaubs-contract-after-the-season/

After reading this I already know what I would do with Schaub at the end of the year. If that is my thought process I go with Yates now to figure out his contract situation at the end of the year.

eriadoc
09-30-2013, 12:51 PM
Noboby has said he will definitely suck..........You gotta admit though, the percentages are stacked wwaaaayyyyy against him given how he got into the league, where he is on the depth chart, his lack of experience and a whole host of other factors....It's an educated guess grounded more in reality than you and everyone else's hopeful "Anybody but Schaub" mentality.

Actually more than a few people have said that.

The percentages may be stacked against him, but the percentages don't look any better with Schaub, do they? Furthermore, if you play him and find out he sucks, it helps the future decision making process.

In all actuality, I want to see Schaub benched for a game, or a half, or hell, even a series. I don't necessarily want to switch QBs mid-season. That's likely a recipe for disaster. But at this point, playing Schaub looks like a recipe for 8-8, which is worse, IMO. At this point in time, with the way this team is built, either be great or take the next future step toward being bad. Keenum is that next future step, IMO. He either succeeds or he tells you all you need to know about the position going forward.

Mr teX
09-30-2013, 01:16 PM
Actually more than a few people have said that.

The percentages may be stacked against him, but the percentages don't look any better with Schaub, do they? Furthermore, if you play him and find out he sucks, it helps the future decision making process.

In all actuality, I want to see Schaub benched for a game, or a half, or hell, even a series. I don't necessarily want to switch QBs mid-season. That's likely a recipe for disaster. But at this point, playing Schaub looks like a recipe for 8-8, which is worse, IMO. At this point in time, with the way this team is built, either be great or take the next future step toward being bad. Keenum is that next future step, IMO. He either succeeds or he tells you all you need to know about the position going forward.

As many have already said, If Schaub with no upside continues to make rookie mistakes..........& that pick yesterday is the epitome of a rookie mistake, then you may as well let Yates....or Keenum get in there & do the same things b/c at least they do have the potential for upside.

My big concern with starting Keenum or Yates is that it in effect has the potential to reset Kubiak's clock on his tenure here.....and i firmly believe that he's as much the problem as Schaub is.

People have to remember that it was McNair who forced Gary to bring Wade in here...If not for McNair putting his foot down, Gary may very well have brought another one of his buddies in here. I say that to say that McNair is ultimately the guy who has to make the decision to fire Gary and move in another direction.

Now If Keenum or Yates get in there, muddy the waters in any way & this team has success, but neither of them really impresses, McNair may stand pat & give Gary another 2-3 years to do the same **** he's done for the last 8.

That simply cannot happen....fire the HC & get a new HC in here with a new philosophy. The latter almost always comes with a new qb..No disrespect to Keenum or Yates, but i dont want to just hand them the job..they need to win it outright. Furthermore, this is the year to go after a qb in the draft so bring in a young stud to compete....If either of them win it, fine but we can't sabotage this season just yet.

eriadoc
09-30-2013, 01:29 PM
As many have already said, If Schaub with no upside continues to make rookie mistakes..........& that pick yesterday is the epitome of a rookie mistake, then you may as well let Yates....or Keenum get in there & do the same things b/c at least they do have the potential for upside.

My big concern with starting Keenum or Yates is that it in effect has the potential to reset Kubiak's clock on his tenure here.....and i firmly believe that he's as much the problem as Schaub is.

People have to remember that it was McNair who forced Gary to bring Wade in here...If not for McNair putting his foot down, Gary may very well have brought another one of his buddies in here. I say that to say that McNair is ultimately the guy who has to make the decision to fire Gary and move in another direction.

Now If Keenum or Yates get in there, muddy the waters in any way & this team has success, but neither of them really impresses, McNair may stand pat & give Gary another 2-3 years to do the same **** he's done for the last 8.

That simply cannot happen....fire the HC & get a new HC in here with a new philosophy. The latter almost always comes with a new qb..No disrespect to Keenum or Yates, but i dont want to just hand them the job..they need to win it outright. Furthermore, this is the year to go after a qb in the draft so bring in a young stud to compete....If either of them win it, fine but we can't sabotage this season just yet.

I see the value in your overall post. As to the bolded, this is why I want to see Schaub benched for a short time, but not permanently. It sends the message that this crap is unacceptable, that anyone and everyone will be held accountable, and it gives the younger QBs a chance to show something, even if it's only for a half. If Schaub comes out focused after the reset, then the season will likely go well. If he doesn't, then you know even more than you did prior to the benching.

As for Kubiak in general, I have long been a detractor. I may even dredge up the Fire Kubiak thread, within which I have quite a few posts. But I'm going to defend the guy for a minute here. He's grown into the position. He sure as hell wasn't qualified at the beginning, but most of the things he did terribly before have improved - time management, challenges, and even being more aggressive. I'm willing to accept that he keeps the aggressiveness in check until he has no choice many times, simply because he can't trust his QB. So that leaves me with the #1 criticism I have and have had about Kubiak - this is his team. He built it. He hired everyone, including the GM. He keeps putting Schaub out there. When Jacoby Jones fumbled away the Ravens game, Kubiak kept putting him out there, and he kept screwing up (though not as bad as the first play). When Tate fumbled, he benched him the rest of the game. When Schaub throws crucial picks game after game after game, going into the collapse of last season, Kubiak keeps putting him out there with no accountability.

So in the end, I get what you're saying, but I think Kubiak could actually be a good HC going forward if he had a good QB. I do not know if I trust him to select that QB, however. So I'm torn. In many ways, I think he's more likely to stumble into a good QB (like Keenum could be, small chance) than he is to select one. He can improve any QB he gets, but the great ones have intangibles that Kubiak doesn't seem to be able to identify.

Dread-Head
09-30-2013, 01:32 PM
I'm still tripping at the fact that there are 9 other people who voted for Bill.

ObsiWan
09-30-2013, 01:35 PM
At this point we know we aren't going to win, so what difference does it make it neither Yates or Keenum can win either?

In any case, given the choices, I voted for Keenum.

Me too.

I started to vote for Texan Bill but then I considered his weakness. All the opposing team would need do is have their cheerleaders flash him and there goes his concentration out the window.
:kitten:

fiasco west
09-30-2013, 01:57 PM
After having cooled down...my opinion has not really changed.

I'm feeling like...Schaub was thought to be the best option because of the talent around this team, that he could be a game manager AT WORST and we could have still won the past two games.

But...he's not doing that. He's doing the opposite of that. We were in a defensive struggle in the Ravens game where points were a premium and he gave them points because he failed to realize the LB was playing a zone and carelessly put it over the middle.

He failed to do that the previous game, completely failing to understand the situation. Up 7, your defense is playing well...take the sack man. Make Seattle WORK for the tie at least.

The hard part about it is man...Schaub can be clutch at times...but when he's not clutch he's throwing the game away. It's feast or famine in clutch situations with Schaub it seems. Like there is no middle ground with him, he's gotta be the hero or the zero. It's like Brett Favre except without all the success...so it's more like Tony Romo...These two Texas QBs have a lot in common I'm starting to realize.

ObsiWan
09-30-2013, 02:08 PM
Actually more than a few people have said that.

The percentages may be stacked against him, but the percentages don't look any better with Schaub, do they? Furthermore, if you play him and find out he sucks, it helps the future decision making process.

In all actuality, I want to see Schaub benched for a game, or a half, or hell, even a series. I don't necessarily want to switch QBs mid-season. That's likely a recipe for disaster. But at this point, playing Schaub looks like a recipe for 8-8, which is worse, IMO. At this point in time, with the way this team is built, either be great or take the next future step toward being bad. Keenum is that next future step, IMO. He either succeeds or he tells you all you need to know about the position going forward.

This is where I am also. If Tate had to sit out the rest of the second half - and along with him his nearly 7 yds/carry - because he turned the ball over, then Schaub should have to sit out a game or two. These misreads/screwups/panic throws cannot continue to be rewarded by starting him week after week. And just maybe, Schaub might see some things from the safety of the sideline that he doesn't see under fire.

I don't think pulling Schaub will sabotage the season, but I do fear it will cause Kubiak to go even more conservative than he normally is. And THAT would defeat the purpose, at least partially, of making the change.

HOU-TEX
09-30-2013, 02:13 PM
In the end, I think we (most of us) realize Schaub will be the QB for the rest of this season and likely next season. He and Kubiak are tied together, benching him will be admitting failure on his part.

IMO, we're stuck like Chuck with the both of them.

Double Barrel
09-30-2013, 02:27 PM
In the end, I think we (most of us) realize Schaub will be the QB for the rest of this season and likely next season. He and Kubiak are tied together, benching him will be admitting failure on his part.

IMO, we're stuck like Chuck with the both of them.

QFT. There is absolutely NOTHING fans can do right now to make the HC do anything.

Kubiak will keep Schaub in there until the end. Fans just need to get it out of their system because we are ultimately powerless.

And like I said in another thread, I've given up on Schaub, but I will not give up on the team. The season is far from over.

thunderkyss
09-30-2013, 02:27 PM
In the end, I think we (most of us) realize Schaub will be the QB for the rest of this season and likely next season. He and Kubiak are tied together, benching him will be admitting failure on his part.

Why?

Kubiak Benched Arian for a half...... may have been the best move he ever made. He's benching Tate, doesn't appear to be sticking yet.

If there's a chance that this would kick start Schaub, why not bench him for a qtr, or a half? Even a game.

If I were Kubiak, this would be the game I would do it. Set Tj Yates up to fail. If he looks bad, people won't feel so bad when I bring Schaub off the bench.

If he kicks butt.... & I mean kick butt, not get by.... then I've got something to work with. Kubiak picked all three of the QBs on our roster.

b0ng
09-30-2013, 02:37 PM
What does benching your QB for a half, or a quarter or a game do exactly? What message are you sending? To the team? To the QB's? You can be down on Matt Schaub all you want, and that's fine and understandable, but playing musical QB's when the team is still in contention to get a playoff spot seems like a waste.

Really if Matt Schaub is going to break down, then this would be the year to do it, as the QB class for the next draft looks pretty good. And no, we do not owe it to Yates or Keenum to "see what they got" if we are thinking about going this route and passing up drafting a QB next year.

Double Barrel
09-30-2013, 02:38 PM
Why?

Never forget that Kubiak was a QB in the NFL.

Everything he does comes into focus when you understand that perspective.

I think he sees RB's as expendable.

But with QBs - especially Matt Schaub - Kubiak is never going to do anything that undermines the mental state or questions the QBs leadership.

Right or wrong, understand it or hate it, just accept that this is the way it is and the way it will be with Kubiak.

QB =/= RB

QB >>> RB

I would be shocked if he ever benched Schaub for anything outside of injury.

Did you see Kubiak's post game press conference? He took ALL responsibility away from Schaub. He accepted ALL responsibility for the loss and even admitted that it was not good playcalling. While the QB failed to execute and made stupid decisions, in the end, Kubiak claimed it was all on him for putting Schaub in that position. That press conference tells you everything you need to know about the possibility of him benching Schaub.

All this talk is just frustrated fan venting, because it's not reality.

And to be honest, I think his players are accepting it. Owen Daniels pretty much said it, too. Something along the lines that they don't always like the playcalling, but "make the best of it".

thunderkyss
09-30-2013, 02:50 PM
What does benching your QB for a half, or a quarter or a game do exactly? What message are you sending? To the team? To the QB's? You can be down on Matt Schaub all you want, and that's fine and understandable, but playing musical QB's when the team is still in contention to get a playoff spot seems like a waste..

I need Matt Schaub to kick it up another notch.

I'd be happy if he starts sharing first team snaps with Tj, Case, even Owen Daniels.

Whatever it takes, we need to see Schaub respond (actually, looked like he responded well up until the 6 minute mark of the 2nd half). He's the leader of the team. Especially the offense.

MistaRed
09-30-2013, 02:50 PM
I want Yates to start.

gafftop
09-30-2013, 02:51 PM
I agree with mostly everything you said except the bolded parts...a patchwork o-line isn't good for any qb, mobile or not.

Furthermore i think right now is too early to look at starting keenum...imo the season has to be lost for him to get his shot....handle him much the same way we handled Arian. If he comes out on top next year in the preseason after open competition, fine. Yates deserves his shot 1st imo b/c the season is still salvageable.

I agree a patchwork o-line is no good for any qb but worse for an immobile QB in my opinion.

The only reason I mentioned Keenum 1st is because I was responding to your post based on Keenum seeing no live bullets. I have no problem with TJ getting first shot and then Keenum. I have posted this idea before, ideally Schaub is inactive and the other two are active.

The only reason I feel you are risking nothing is because my goal is the SB and I don't see MS getting us there. You may think he can still get us there therefore you will think we are risking something.

ArlingtonTexan
09-30-2013, 02:55 PM
Never forget that Kubiak was a QB in the NFL.

Everything he does comes into focus when you understand that perspective.

I think he sees RB's as expendable.

But with QBs - especially Matt Schaub - Kubiak is never going to do anything that undermines the mental state or questions the QBs leadership.

Right or wrong, understand it or hate it, just accept that this is the way it is and the way it will be with Kubiak.

QB =/= RB

QB >>> RB

I would be shocked if he ever benched Schaub for anything outside of injury.

Did you see Kubiak's post game press conference? He took ALL responsibility away from Schaub. He accepted ALL responsibility for the loss and even admitted that it was not good playcalling. While the QB failed to execute and made stupid decisions, in the end, Kubiak claimed it was all on him for putting Schaub in that position. That press conference tells you everything you need to know about the possibility of him benching Schaub.

All this talk is just frustrated fan venting, because it's not reality.

And to be honest, I think his players are accepting it. Owen Daniels pretty much said it, too. Something along the lines that they don't always like the playcalling, but "make the best of it".

I actually think this is an NFL thing, more than Kubes alone. When we see QBs openly treated like kickers (see you Josh Freeman) we are actually surprised. They have the strange combination of being more responsible for the team, and less accountable.

thunderkyss
09-30-2013, 02:56 PM
Furthermore i think right now is too early to look at starting keenum...imo the season has to be lost for him to get his shot....
I admit I may have been a little Knee jerk, but after that first INT I'd have had him on the sideline sizing up a walking boot.

fiasco west
09-30-2013, 03:16 PM
QFT. There is absolutely NOTHING fans can do right now to make the HC do anything.

Kubiak will keep Schaub in there until the end. Fans just need to get it out of their system because we are ultimately powerless.

And like I said in another thread, I've given up on Schaub, but I will not give up on the team. The season is far from over.

Agree with this.

I've given up on him as well, but not the team. I'm not going to root against Schaub to validate my opinion on him, will root for him to turn this around and hopefully lead us to a magical season.

Thorn
09-30-2013, 03:25 PM
Agree with this.

I've given up on him as well, but not the team. I'm not going to root against Schaub to validate my opinion on him, will root for him to turn this around and hopefully lead us to a magical season.

A lot of us don't like certain aspects of the Texans, be it a player or a coach or something. But we still love the team which is why we are here.

leebigeztx
09-30-2013, 03:31 PM
Thing is, brady,hasselbach,and warner are exceptions,not the rule.If you just look at the last 10yrs in the nfl,the sb qbs are 1st rd picks. Now gary has done wonders with schaub,just like they did wonders with jake plummer,but at some point you have to draft a guy with a high ceiling or your project needs to be a guy with a ceiling. I blame kubes moreso on sticking to his guns with schaub. I thought tj should've gotten then job after the injury and the team was still good enough playoff wise. If tj failed,then they need to get a qb which is where they're at now. To me,gary has squeezed every once out of schaub. He had the playaction rolls to keep his feet clean. He shortnened the throwing lanes for his lack of arm strength.He added a young wr who will catch anything in his area,plus a slot,another te,and another young wr and he still can't get it done. I don't know what else there is.

Dread-Head
09-30-2013, 04:23 PM
Looks like Gary is doing what psychologist call "transference". He projecting his OWN feelings unto someone else. In this case he's remembering spending an ENTIRE CAREER as a back up to John Elway and wishing that someone had plucked him from the #2 spot to groom him to be a starting QB. After he ceased to be a QB he became an Offensive Coordinator and made it his mission to "groom" QBs.

Kubiak sees a bit of himself in Matt Schaub. A GOOD QB who just needs a chance to PROVE how good he is. UNFORTUNATELY he has blinders on and can't see that while Schaub is a diamond in the ruff he's not a Jeweler's diamond but an INDUSTRIAL diamond used to make blade sharpeners.

Coach Kubiak needs to accept that his gut insticts about Matt Schaub were WRONG, put him back at #2 where he belongs and groom one of the two young men who would KILL for Schaub's current job.

thunderkyss
09-30-2013, 05:18 PM
To me,gary has squeezed every once out of schaub. He had the playaction rolls to keep his feet clean. He shortnened the throwing lanes for his lack of arm strength.He added a young wr who will catch anything in his area,plus a slot,another te,and another young wr and he still can't get it done. I don't know what else there is.

I'm confused. You mention the addition of a young WR.... which happened this year.

Then you say that Schaub can't get it done.... I'm pretty down on Schaub right now, but how do we know he can't get it done? After 4 games where we're 2-2.

do you think Matt Ryan can't get it done either?

I'm asking for clarification, because we know Flacco can do it & his last 4 games weren't much better than Schaub's. They lost to Buffalo & Denver.

Again, this is not in defense of Matt, just trying to understand your reasoning.

Hottoddie
09-30-2013, 05:38 PM
The one thing that grates on my nerves more than his inaccuracy, red zone picks, lead feet & lately his pick 6's is his lack of fire. There's no visible passion to Schaub. He never gets in anyone's grill for anything. Show me one great/elite QB that won't jump his guys on the field every once in a while if they're screwing up. Matt & his droopy eyes never gets upset or shows any fire what so ever. Who's really in charge on the field?

When you watch Peyton, Brady, Brees, etc., there's no doubt in anyone's mind who is in control on the field. But with Schaub, if you had never watched a football game in your life, you wouldn't know to assume the QB was in charge. So, you wouldn't have a clue who was in charge.

leebigeztx
09-30-2013, 07:14 PM
I'm confused. You mention the addition of a young WR.... which happened this year.

Then you say that Schaub can't get it done.... I'm pretty down on Schaub right now, but how do we know he can't get it done? After 4 games where we're 2-2.

do you think Matt Ryan can't get it done either?

I'm asking for clarification, because we know Flacco can do it & his last 4 games weren't much better than Schaub's. They lost to Buffalo & Denver.

Again, this is not in defense of Matt, just trying to understand your reasoning.

I never thought schaub could do it. He's too limited in his physical talent. Mostly the slow feet,avg arm. Yesterday would've been a grea chance to get hopkins targets. I've been watching schaub and pre dtermin3ed wherehes going with the ball despite the coverage. On the pick 6,the wrse thing was the pick,but just as bad was johnson exploding down the fied,but schaub already had set his mind on throwing it to daniels who was covered by the best cb in the game. This happens a lot with schaub and that's something a vet qb shouldn't do. Go back and watch all those 3rd and 4s and watch how seattle was manipulating his reads.Even when the opportunity presented itself to throw it down the field or audible and run the te up the seams,he ddnt do it. Just to be fair,I don't think matt ryan can do it either.He's a better version of schaub,but he has some of the same issues talent wise.The best thing the gm did was recognize early he was gonna need a lot of help to try to get there. That's why they moved up for julio,signed jackson,traded for gonzales.When you think your qb can overcome shortcomings,you kinda stay staus quo.

Schaub to me is trent green,marc bulger type of qbs. They can function and win some games in the nfl,but they will never be good enough to help the team get to the superbowl. That is the ultimate prize,right?

Rey
09-30-2013, 07:58 PM
I'm actually more pissed off than I was yesterday.

Watching some of the clips again on the networks I just can't believe how bad Schaub is. I don't care about the stats. I don't care that he "knows the system". We aren't going anywhere with him. He's not ok. He's not mediocre. He's bad.

If this was Yates, or sage folks would be all over them. But some people just have their blinders on with Schaub. This past game wasn't the low point. Expect for it to get worse.

Rey
09-30-2013, 08:03 PM
The one thing that grates on my nerves more than his inaccuracy, red zone picks, lead feet & lately his pick 6's is his lack of fire. There's no visible passion to Schaub. He never gets in anyone's grill for anything. Show me one great/elite QB that won't jump his guys on the field every once in a while if they're screwing up. Matt & his droopy eyes never gets upset or shows any fire what so ever. Who's really in charge on the field?

When you watch Peyton, Brady, Brees, etc., there's no doubt in anyone's mind who is in control on the field. But with Schaub, if you had never watched a football game in your life, you wouldn't know to assume the QB was in charge. So, you wouldn't have a clue who was in charge.

Schaub, after that pick, looked just like Sanchez last year after the butt fumble. Look at the guy running the other way with your football then shed tears in the turf.

Hottoddie
09-30-2013, 09:17 PM
Schaub, after that pick, looked just like Sanchez last year after the butt fumble. Look at the guy running the other way with your football then shed tears in the turf.

The "Butt Fumble". That still cracks me up everytime I hear it. It's like when Jose Canseco bounced the ball off the top of his head for a homerun. Those moments will follow them until the day they die. :lol:

eriadoc
09-30-2013, 09:28 PM
I'm actually more pissed off than I was yesterday.

Watching some of the clips again on the networks I just can't believe how bad Schaub is. I don't care about the stats. I don't care that he "knows the system". We aren't going anywhere with him. He's not ok. He's not mediocre. He's bad. .

Yep.

CloakNNNdagger
09-30-2013, 10:52 PM
I don't know how many times I have heard the argument against Keenum here on the MB..........."If Keenum was allowed to QB this team, he would only have a limited portion of the playbook opened up to him to work with." It should be obvious to everyone by now that Schaub has been playing with a playbook that has been dictated very much by his abilities...........a very limited playbook.

eriadoc
09-30-2013, 10:56 PM
I don't know how many times I have heard the argument against Keenum here on the MB..........."If Keenum was allowed to QB this team, he would only have a limited portion of the playbook opened up to him to work with." It should be obvious to everyone by now that Schaub has been playing with a playbook that has been dictated very much by his abilities...........a very limited playbook.

Rep.

DocBar
09-30-2013, 11:19 PM
I don't know how many times I have heard the argument against Keenum here on the MB..........."If Keenum was allowed to QB this team, he would only have a limited portion of the playbook opened up to him to work with." It should be obvious to everyone by now that Schaub has been playing with a playbook that has been dictated very much by his abilities...........a very limited playbook.But Keenum has so many more skills. Much larger playbook....

deucetx
10-01-2013, 09:24 AM
I'll say the unpopular thing and say...at this point you ride Schaub out. Do I have confidence in him? Honestly, no. I lost it after this past game and realizing he has now thrown an int in 7 straight games. At the same time I don't have a ton of confidence in Yates nor Keenum just yet when we're going into San fransico and 2-2 at this point. I see Keenum as more of a future so don't think he'd be worked in over Yates in any case unless they know for certain they aren't re-signing Yates. In that situation they may go like the Browns and throw Keenum in there but doesn't seem Kubiak's style.

I think both Yates and Keenum were great in the preseason. I lean more toward Case but in the end I realize one thing. It was preseason. We're talking vanila defenses, no disguised coverages, blitzes or formations. Even Brandon Weeden looked awesome in the preseason until defenses made him actually think for a second. So I'm hesitant to bank all my confidence on either just yet.

After the 49ers we play some medicore defenses (except the Chiefs but their offense is nothing to worry on) and I could changes being made if Schaub continues. But right now I say you have to ride the horse you saddled and hope he can break out mentally....

....just don't hold your breath on it. May have to sacrifice a chicken to some out of the world god but that's about it.

CloakNNNdagger
10-01-2013, 09:35 AM
But Keenum has so many more skills. Much larger playbook....

Exactly what I was trying to point out.

Texan_Bill
10-01-2013, 09:39 AM
Other than me, what other dumbasses voted for me??

**************************

Meh, like it or not Schaub is still light years ahead of both Yates and Keenum (as much as I don't want that to be the case).

noxiousdog
10-01-2013, 10:52 AM
Then you say that Schaub can't get it done.... I'm pretty down on Schaub right now, but how do we know he can't get it done? After 4 games where we're 2-2.

do you think Matt Ryan can't get it done either?

I'm asking for clarification, because we know Flacco can do it & his last 4 games weren't much better than Schaub's. They lost to Buffalo & Denver.

Again, this is not in defense of Matt, just trying to understand your reasoning.

As much as we like to deal with absolutes, it's not about can and can't. Nearly everyone that makes it to this level can get it done. The question is how likely is it, keeping in mind that for every quarterback, including Manning, Brees, and Brady, it's very unlikely each of them will get to, let alone win another superbowl. One of them probably will, but individually, it's unlikely. Only two per year get in. Only one wins it. As they say in investing, past performance is no indicator of future results.

That being said, Matt Ryan is still young and has played consistently good football.

Flacco and Schaub have not. Flacco is still in his prime; Schaub is not.

So, he can get it done, it's just really, really, really, unlikely.

GNTLEWOLF
10-01-2013, 01:19 PM
There is only one person that needs to be convinced, and he is either too blind, too stupid, or too loyal to make a change that might actually help the future of the team.
That person also might not yet think this season is toaste and he might still believe Schaub gives him the best chance to win now.

infantrycak
10-01-2013, 01:33 PM
I think everybody by now knows Matt Schaub is not the answer. ...

Please do not post redundant threads. Thanks.

leebigeztx
10-01-2013, 01:42 PM
Exactly what I was trying to point out.

The problem with keenum is the same with schaub, arm talent. When you dont have an nfl arm, the playbook is automatically limited in terms of what u can call as a coach. No deep comebacks or outs. No deep dagger routes off 5 step drop. Basically,the same offense in terms of being able to exploit the defense.

Grams
10-01-2013, 01:44 PM
The problem with keenum is the same with schaub, arm talent. When you dont have an nfl arm, the playbook is automatically limited in terms of what u can call as a coach. No deep comebacks or outs. No deep dagger routes off 5 step drop. Basically,the same offense in terms of being able to exploit the defense.

Did dyou not watch the preseason game where he hit whoever in stride down the sideline?

leebigeztx
10-01-2013, 01:57 PM
Did dyou not watch the preseason game where he hit whoever in stride down the sideline?

Watchef the whole preseason as well as throwing at camp. Schaub can throw a sideline throw down the field when his feet are clean. The problem is can he drive the ball while in the phonebooth when guys are around his feet? Case nor schaub can do it. Does that mean u cant play qb? No,but it really limits what the offense can do vs a defense.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 02:02 PM
how could you post that garbage after seeing the throws that Keenum made in preseason?

joe montana had a weak arm. so does peyton manning. It wasnt hat big of a problem for them was it?

The problem with schaub is that not only does he have a weak arm, he is also immobile, nonathletic, has horrible pocket presence, crumbles under pressure, and has trouble progressing through his reads, and is not very accurate.

Keenum might not have Matt Ryan's cannon arm but he is accurate, mobile, very poise under pressure, and is more importantly, he is a playmaker. He makes things happen when plan A is no longer an option. Something that Schaub cannot do.

Keenum is a natural at the qb position. A true gamer. All the things that schaub is not. The only thing matt has on keenum is height and experience. That's it.




Very hard to compare college/preseason nfl to regular season mobility, accuracy, poise under pressure and playmaking ability. It is all a rather big bowl of speculation Brah

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 02:12 PM
Not really. Those throws keenum made in preseason where big time nfl throws. the TD throw to martin and especially that throw keenum made on the run in the back of the end zone to ryan griffin shows keenum's talent and potential is for real. That was a spectacular throw that schaub could have never made.

btw, its breh, not brah.

breh.




Its all specualtion that any performance could be duplicated in the regular season against first string D. brah

deucetx
10-01-2013, 02:19 PM
Well, already voiced my thoughts on the fact we should continue with Schaub (for now at least) but this whole arm strength is silly in regards to any of these guys. None of them have really strong arms so not even sure where this 'Yates has the bigger arm' is coming from. Look up the scouting reports and the main consensus are the same. He lack arm strength.

The main flaw in T.J. Yates’s game is definitely his lack of arm strength. On throws over 20 yards Yates really struggles to put the ball in the right spot. Because his arm is so weak, he’s not asked to throw deep much, so he never really developed much accuracy throwing down field either. He puts poor touch on his deep ball, and the receiver usually has to adjust and come back to the ball.

Analysis: Yates is a terrific game manager who is always in control of the situation. He lacks the size and arm strength to be a starter at the next level yet may be effective backing up in a timing or West Coast offense

Negatives: Might be maxed out. Doesn't possess the size, athleticism or arm strength most teams are looking for in a developmental prospect. Only average arm strength and accuracy outside of the hashes.

So let's stop already with the Yates arm strength thing as if his arm strength is that much different than the two we have already. If it is any stronger than Keenum's it will be a small margin or Keenum may have a stronger one. But in either direction we're not talking some amazing margin of difference for it to be the reasoning between either.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 02:23 PM
you will never know unless you try.

breh.



and thats very true the pro Case crowd thinks he can do it and would like to give him a try and the anti case thinks any performance to date is not a reflection of true playing time

Texan_Bill
10-01-2013, 02:34 PM
The problem with keenum is the same with schaub, arm talent. When you dont have an nfl arm, the playbook is automatically limited in terms of what u can call as a coach. No deep comebacks or outs. No deep dagger routes off 5 step drop. Basically,the same offense in terms of being able to exploit the defense.

Huge misconception. Case can make any throw you need him to make. I've watched him a lot more than preseason. Remember he was at UH for like 16 years.

That said, I wouldn't be comfortable with him taking the reins.

thunderkyss
10-01-2013, 02:39 PM
Isn't it spelled Brah??

Texan_Bill
10-01-2013, 02:40 PM
Isn't it spelled Brah??

In Hawaii! :kitten:

Vinny
10-01-2013, 02:41 PM
Isn't it spelled Brah??
is there a protocol on how you spell improper or slang words?

HOU-TEX
10-01-2013, 02:42 PM
is there a protocol on how you spell improper or slang words?

No, but saying 'breh' is like beginning to say 'breast' then throat-chopped mid word

thunderkyss
10-01-2013, 02:45 PM
No, but saying 'breh' is like beginning to say 'breast' then throat-chopped mid word

I keep wanting to say Brey....

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 02:45 PM
It's funny, the people who think Kevin Sumlin is a gimmicky offensive guru think Keenum gives us the best chance to win.

Yates won that competition, tight as it was. And the difference is Yates has faced the heat of the regular season and the playoffs before and Keenum never has.

I think Keenum shows a lot of promise, but the people thinking he'll be our savior need to cool it down a little bit. Neither of them are going to end up being the next Tom Brady for us.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 02:52 PM
which crowd are you in?


I dont think Case can perform during the season as he did in preseason. Its possible but I dont think it is likely

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 03:01 PM
why not?

he performed in college where he was a record setting quarterback. He performed very well in preseason. I think its very likely that he performs in the regular season.

Whether it was first string or second string, preseason or regular season, those were where NFL caliber throws that keenum was making.

Its not like schaub set the bar so high in houston that any change can never come close to schaub's pro bowl legend's level.

Because in college he performed in an offense so unlike any in the pro game that those performances and numbers cannot be compared to an NFL game. Hell, if you really want a Sumlin quarterback that much, lets just tank the season and get Manziel. That guy lit up the SEC, all Keenum did was light up C-USA lol.

As far as the preseason goes, there's less pressure for him to be facing. I don't think he survives a whole season with the first string defense of every NFL team facing him. I don't believe his good preseason translates to the regular season.

Don't get me wrong, he looked good in the preseason. I have my reservations about him doing good in the regular season.

Lets be honest, though. If Kubiak benches Schaub, you know it'll be Yates suiting up unless he gets injured.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 03:01 PM
why not?

he performed in college where he was a record setting quarterback. He performed very well in preseason. I think its very likely that he performs in the regular season.

Whether it was first string or second string, preseason or regular season, those were where NFL caliber throws that keenum was making.

Its not like schaub set the bar so high in houston that any change can never come close to schaub's pro bowl legend's level.



Case put up tons of numbers in college in a conf that wasnt elite so there has to be an adjustment to the jock hugging. Those nfl caliber throws certainly change in a real game and you should be well aware of the difference between the preseason non starters playing and a third string QB coming into a regular game. Food for thought Case couldnt beat out TJ for the second spot but some how the eye test you and others are putting him on is a bit out there

Dread-Head
10-01-2013, 03:04 PM
Other than me, what other dumbasses voted for me??

**************************

Meh, like it or not Schaub is still light years ahead of both Yates and Keenum (as much as I don't want that to be the case).


Who you callin' a DUMB-ASS...DUMB-ASS?! :slapfight:

:dread: Now damn it Bill, go to practice already you have a game Sunday.

Scooter
10-01-2013, 03:05 PM
i need only 2 plays to pick keenum. the first is the rainmaker that he dropped to jean against the dolphins. exactly in stride 40 yards down the sideline for a touchdown. that thing couldnt have been more perfect. i havent seen schaub complete that pass or a better one in his time here.

the other is the designed sneak. sure it didnt go for much, but kubiak was willing to spread the defense and let keenum try to make something. that's a playcall that schaub wont get outside of goalline situations, if even then.

Texan_Bill
10-01-2013, 03:09 PM
Case put up tons of numbers in college in a conf that wasnt elite so there has to be an adjustment to the jock hugging. Those nfl caliber throws certainly change in a real game and you should be well aware of the difference between the preseason non starters playing and a third string QB coming into a regular game. Food for thought Case couldnt beat out TJ for the second spot but some how the eye test you and others are putting him on is a bit out there

I'm a big fan of Case's but I agree with everything you say! Not to mention preseason defenses are usually fairly vanilla and don't really try to disguise what is that they are trying to do.

****************

BTW, here is a short list of other "record setting" QB's:
Colt Brennan
David Klingler
Timmy Chang
BJ Symons

santo
10-01-2013, 03:11 PM
i need only 2 plays to pick keenum. the first is the rainmaker that he dropped to jean against the dolphins. exactly in stride 40 yards down the sideline for a touchdown. that thing couldnt have been more perfect. i havent seen schaub complete that pass or a better one in his time here.

the other is the designed sneak. sure it didnt go for much, but kubiak was willing to spread the defense and let keenum try to make something. that's a playcall that schaub wont get outside of goalline situations, if even then.

My favorite one was the one where the texans are in their own end zone and Keenum makes a great pass for the first down.

Texan_Bill
10-01-2013, 03:13 PM
Who you callin' a DUMB-ASS...DUMB-ASS?! :slapfight:

:dread: Now damn it Bill, go to practice already you have a game Sunday.

Think about it in my terms:

In order for me to take a snap from under center I would be required to set my adult beverage down and that my friend ain't gonna happen.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 03:17 PM
ahhhh yes the old he played in a inferior conference argument that has been debunked several times already.

:toropalm:

How many superbowls have Colt McCoy, Vince Young, Matt Leinart, Christian Ponder and Cam Newton have won or even played in because they played in major conferences?

Yea, Case doesnt stand a chance.

Just like Kurt Warner, undrafted Northern Iowa
Just like Ben Rothlisberger, Miami OH
Just like Brett Farve, Southern Mississippi
Just like Doug Williams, Grambling
Just like Phil Sims, Morehead State
Just like Steve Mcnair, Alcorn State
Just like Rich Gannon, Delaware

I can keep going.

smdh....


Shake your head and get plenty of sand in your crack. He was in a weak conf so the numbers he put up are/were inflated. Also you ignore the fact college football or preseason NFL is nothing like the regular season.

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 03:22 PM
Keenum was torching defenses before sumlin got there. Sumlin actually ruined Keenum's ending with his stupidity.



ahhhh yes the old he played in a inferior conference argument that has been debunked several times already.

:toropalm:

How many superbowls have Colt McCoy, Vince Young, Matt Leinart, Christian Ponder and Cam Newton have won or even played in because they played in major conferences?

Yea, Case doesnt stand a chance.

Just like Kurt Warner, undrafted Northern Iowa
Just like Ben Rothlisberger, Miami OH
Just like Brett Farve, Southern Mississippi
Just like Doug Williams, Grambling
Just like Phil Sims, Morehead State
Just like Steve Mcnair, Alcorn State
Just like Rich Gannon, Delaware

I can keep going.

smdh....

and lol at keenum not beating out a 3 year qb with regular and playoff season reps compared to keenum who was undrafted and had zero experience.

anybody with a brain knows keenum either outplayed or played yates to a draw.

This U of H homerism is horrible.

Here are some of the winners from the 25 superbowls past.

Tom Brady - Michigan
Aaron Rodgers - Cal
Peyton Manning - Tennessee
John Elway - Stanford
Joe Montana (who you make Keenum comparisons to) - Notre Dame
Troy Aikman - UCLA

So I can just spit names there and it doesn't make a difference.

The fact of the matter is we do not know how Keenum will hold up until he plays with the 1s against the 1s of the opposing defense.

Torching the defense of the C-USA doesn't impress me at all. Hooray, you wrecked UAB. Congratulations.

thunderkyss
10-01-2013, 03:23 PM
I'm a big fan of Case's but I agree with everything you say! Not to mention preseason defenses are usually fairly vanilla and don't really try to disguise what is that they are trying to do.


In college, they don't play with the speed they do in the NFL. CBs & LBs don't close those holes as fast as they do in the NFL.

Same in the preseason. Those guys aren't playing 100% unless they were playing NCAA football the year before.... meaning not NFL quality.

Another difference, NFL stands for Not for Long. You're either getting it done or you're not. Schaub has 7 years of good-faith built up, so he can throw a pick six, or tow, or even three & he's still the starter. Joe Blow from the UofH doesn't get that kind of a leash. One bad play may be the end of his career all together.

Case is going to get his time. Pray that he's ready when he does.

Trail.Blazr
10-01-2013, 03:24 PM
Because in college he performed in an offense so unlike any in the pro game that those performances and numbers cannot be compared to an NFL game. Hell, if you really want a Sumlin quarterback that much, lets just tank the season and get Manziel. That guy lit up the SEC, all Keenum did was light up C-USA lol.

As far as the preseason goes, there's less pressure for him to be facing. I don't think he survives a whole season with the first string defense of every NFL team facing him. I don't believe his good preseason translates to the regular season.

Don't get me wrong, he looked good in the preseason. I have my reservations about him doing good in the regular season.

Lets be honest, though. If Kubiak benches Schaub, you know it'll be Yates suiting up unless he gets injured.

I would point out is that our other 2 QB options on the roster both hail from the Atlantic Coast Conference.... A REAL NCAA football powerhouse conference!

Whatever the conference, it's meaningless. It's what you do in the now....

What's happening NOW?

I like the notion of Yates or Keenum being paraded out as the starter while Schaub holds that clipboard. Even if for a quarter, or a game. He's so quick to yank a RB and sit him after a fumble. Let's hope 4 straight games with a pick 6 is his limit for QB's? At worst, I'd lay money down that given the task, either TJ or Case could match 3 straight. So at best, Kubes seemingly has nothing to lose. At worst, it turns out that Kubes can continue with his "it's on me" speeches.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 03:26 PM
he still put up the numbers just like those super bowl winning qbs i listed who didnt play in majors. i mean you have to have some kind of talent to put up those numbers do you? Add in his great preseason play its not unreasonable to expect some kind of competency from him if given the chance.

I mean, where do you think nfl players come from? they come from college football. not regular season nfl games.

yates has 3 years experience along with regular and playoff reps, yet he couldnt distance himself from the undersized, rookie undrafted qb.



I never said the kid didnt have talent but I have zero expectation that he can play as well as he did in college or preseason during a regular season game, zero. Throwing out names of past or present players in the nfl doesnt do anything to help your case as I could post a long list of good college QB who didnt do squat in the NFL. Yates clearly did enough not to give up the second spot. If Case was the next coming of Jesus he would have been drafted by someone or at least outperformed Yates to a point where he took the second spot. Dont talk to me about Yates' experiance because college kids come in a start all the time so taking a backup roll isnt out of the question

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 03:26 PM
I would point out is that our other 2 QB options on the roster both hail from the Atlantic Coast Conference.... A REAL NCAA football powerhouse conference!

Whatever the conference, it's meaningless. It's what you do in the now....

What's happening NOW?

I like the notion of Yates or Keenum being paraded out as the starter while Schaub holds that clipboard. Even if for a quarter, or a game. He's so quick to yank a RB and sit him after a fumble. Let's hope 4 straight games with a pick 6 is his limit for QB's? At worst, I'd lay money down that given the task, either TJ or Case could match 3 straight. So at best, Kubes seemingly has nothing to lose. At worst, it turns out that Kubes can continue with his "it's on me" speeches.

The difference is that Yates has won (and lost, too) in the NFL. He knows the speed of the regular game. That, and he played in a pro system at North Carolina. He knows it better than Keenum does at this stage.

But I agree, I'll take either of them out there. I just think TJ gives us a better chance of winning. Case just has that "hungry" factor going for him, and we all wanna cheer for an underdog but I'll take whichever of them is better for our team. In my personal opinion, that's TJ.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 03:29 PM
I would point out is that our other 2 QB options on the roster both hail from the Atlantic Coast Conference.... A REAL NCAA football powerhouse conference!

Whatever the conference, it's meaningless. It's what you do in the now....

What's happening NOW?

I like the notion of Yates or Keenum being paraded out as the starter while Schaub holds that clipboard. Even if for a quarter, or a game. He's so quick to yank a RB and sit him after a fumble. Let's hope 4 straight games with a pick 6 is his limit for QB's? At worst, I'd lay money down that given the task, either TJ or Case could match 3 straight. So at best, Kubes seemingly has nothing to lose. At worst, it turns out that Kubes can continue with his "it's on me" speeches.


The conf doesnt really matter all that much until you start to try and use it as a leverage point to justify your opinion. You cant say "He put up big numbers in college, set records so I think he can perform on gameday in the NFl"

Dread-Head
10-01-2013, 03:29 PM
Think about it in my terms:

In order for me to take a snap from under center I would be required to set my adult beverage down and that my friend ain't gonna happen.

Awww damn it Bill it's for the team!

thunderkyss
10-01-2013, 03:35 PM
I like the notion of Yates or Keenum being paraded out as the starter while Schaub holds that clipboard. Even if for a quarter, or a game. He's so quick to yank a RB and sit him after a fumble. Let's hope 4 straight games with a pick 6 is his limit for QB's? At worst, I'd lay money down that given the task, either TJ or Case could match 3 straight. So at best, Kubes seemingly has nothing to lose. At worst, it turns out that Kubes can continue with his "it's on me" speeches.

I understand the frustration, but let's not "hope" to see another pick six thrown by one of our QBs for a few years.

Heck, I'd bench him if a ball gets batted down, sails high, floats... won't happen.

So I'll lower my expectations. If he throws another interception, I want the headphones to hit the floor. I want the Denny's menu in the second row. I want Kubiak to grab that facemask & yank on it a couple dozen times.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 03:38 PM
you're doing the same exact thing. You're leveraging the fact that keenum didnt play in major, was undrafted as to why you dont like him. I just gave examples of players who didnt play in majors and had great success in the nfl.

hypocrite.


I am not doing the samething. I said his numbers are inflated because of where he played and they are. If he played in a stronger conf his number would not be as good.


Guess what his college numbers dont meant sh!t in the nfl and niether do his preseason numbers against 2nd and 3rds and a host of players that arent playing in the nfl any longer. I dont think you know what hypocrite means brah


PAGING GRAM HARRELL

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 03:38 PM
you're doing the same exact thing. You're leveraging the fact that keenum didnt play in major, was undrafted as to why you dont like him. I just gave examples of players who didnt play in majors and had great success in the nfl.

hypocrite.

If you're giving examples, be sure to show how Keenum is in any way, shape, or form, like Ben Rapistberger, Kurt Warner, or Brett Farve.

Come on. If you think Keenum is even close to their talent level, you have to give me the number of your pot dealer. He's got some good isht.

badboy
10-01-2013, 03:38 PM
Think about it in my terms:

In order for me to take a snap from under center I would be required to set my adult beverage down and that my friend ain't gonna happen.Just put the container on Myers' back and tell him not to straighten up and your drink should be fine. Just make sure you keep the full back in to block.

Trail.Blazr
10-01-2013, 03:47 PM
I understand the frustration, but let's not "hope" to see another pick six thrown by one of our QBs for a few years.

Heck, I'd bench him if a ball gets batted down, sails high, floats... won't happen.

So I'll lower my expectations. If he throws another interception, I want the headphones to hit the floor. I want the Denny's menu in the second row. I want Kubiak to grab that facemask & yank on it a couple dozen times.


I'm with you. I'm not hoping for one. I was insinuating that 3 is not the limit, so is it 4? I pray we don't find out. And if we do, my money is on it NOT being the limit.

ChampionTexan
10-01-2013, 03:59 PM
he still put up the numbers just like those super bowl winning qbs i listed who didnt play in majors. i mean you have to have some kind of talent to put up those numbers do you?

Case is the FBS leader in career passing yards (I assume those are at least some of the "numbers" you're talking about). Here's the other nine guys in the top 10:


Timmy Chang
Landry Jones
Graham Harrell
Ty Detmer
Kellen Moore
Colt Brennan
Phillip Rivers
Colt McCoy
Kevin Kolb

He's also the leader in career TD passes, and career completions. The remaining nine players in each category is very similar to the nine listed above.

So in terms of NFL level talent, the answer to your bolded question is obviously "No, no you don't".

And to all you Case Fan boys, this doesn't mean I believe it's a given Case is going to fail in the NFL. I think he's got a chance to succeed, and I hope he does (and you won't find any of my posting history to the contrary). I just don't feel it's a given, and I feel like for the 2013 season, Matt still gives us a better chance to win than either Case or TJ.

HOU-TEX
10-01-2013, 04:01 PM
Think about it in my terms:

In order for me to take a snap from under center I would be required to set my adult beverage down and that my friend ain't gonna happen.

The answer to your dilemma....except the jersey, of course

http://www.zymetrical.com/images/beer-football-helmet.jpg

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 04:08 PM
yea you are a hypocrite. i never said just because he put up record setting numbers in college that he's gonna break records like peyton in the nfl.

never said that.


what i said was that he put up record setting numbers in college which has to require some kind of athletic and quarterbacking talent, and you add the fact that he played great during preseason, showed great ability to make big time throws and eventaully made the 53 man roster, stands to reason he has a chance to be a competent nfl qb in the regular season.

unlike you who doesnt even want to give the man a chance and expects nothing out of him if he even got a chance.



You clearly can't read nor do you know what hypocrite means

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 04:10 PM
wrong.

i was specifically talking about keenum's situation not those other guys. timmy chang in particular was very talented but was never given a chance because he was asian and due to institutional racism in the nfl.

If you're specifically talking about Keenum, stop trying to draw comparisons to Ben Roethlisberger, Kurt Warner, or Brett Farve.
If you're arguing stats, his post wasn't wrong, it was dead on the money.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 04:17 PM
you clearly are a hypocrite and im pretty sure im smarter than you.


You are good at wild speculation brah

HOU-TEX
10-01-2013, 04:17 PM
wrong.

i was specifically talking about keenum's situation not those other guys. timmy chang in particular was very talented but was never given a chance because he was asian and due to institutional racism in the nfl.

Good grief.

ChampionTexan
10-01-2013, 04:20 PM
wrong.

i was specifically talking about keenum's situation not those other guys.

he still put up the numbers just like those super bowl winning qbs i listed who didnt play in majors. i mean you have to have some kind of talent to put up those numbers do you? .

So if you're talking about Case's current situation, what do the numbers he put up in the past have to do with anything?

dream_team
10-01-2013, 04:30 PM
In all honesty, none of us can truly answer this question. We don't know how they're performing in practice, the film room, meetings, or how much of the playbook they understand. And with Case, we have no idea how he'll perform against a starting NFL defense for 4 quarters, with defensive coordinators scouting him to find his weaknesses. We have no idea how he'll perform on the big stage when games matter.

So alot of you would come back and say, "Who cares? Put them in, see what we got, it can't be any worse!" It could actually get ALOT worse! We're actually having no problems moving the ball on offense. We just gained like 450+ yards on the league's so-called best defense! We are just making a couple of dumb mistakes a game.

It's a lot safer route to try to fix those few mistakes, rather than gamble with a whole new QB.

If playoffs ever get out of the picture, that's the only time I think it's a good idea to bring in Yates or Keenum.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 04:40 PM
just look at the poll results.

good grief.


The odd lot theory applies here. Also maybe less intelligent people can draw the connection between case, uofh, the texans and this poll.

Good grief brah

76Texan
10-01-2013, 04:49 PM
Sure, we have to take into account the lesser talent level that Keenum faced in college.

That's why when I evaluated him, I did these things:

1. I evaluated games he played against better defenses, like Alabama, UCLA, S. Miss, Penn St., Miss St., Oregon, TCU, E. Carolina (the years they had good defense under Skip Holtz, who had been with major teams like ND, Fla St, S. Car., and won multi C-USA championships.)

2. I evaluated games he played against common opponents in the same year with drafted QBs like Luck, RG III, Weeden, Ponder, etc.)

3. I evaluated his O-line play; for example, against UCLA in 2011, he was under pressure some 24-25 times as compared to 4 by Luck.
UH played UCLA early in the year, while Stanford played UCLA late, when the Bruins suffered some injuries in the secondary.

On the details, I check to see:

1. How fast does the ball leaves his hand on a 10-yd route, an intermediate route between 15-22 yards, a deep route of 30-40 yards as compared to other QBs from the same formation, running the same or a similar play.
(In his Fr year, the Cougars did run a small but significant number of plays out of the traditional I formation with 2 backs and a TE. They did run a few bootleg out of the PA just like the Texans have been doing.)
In the spread, Keenum got the ball out a hair faster than RG III, and much quicker than Weeden, for example.

2. How good is his presnap read. Can he reads defense and find the open receiver against that particular defense.
Does he recognize a potential blitzer and counter the D-call, making the aggressors pay for their aggressiveness.

3. On the post-snap read, can he recognize the disguises of the defense so as not to make stupid mistakes like Schaub has been doing on a consistent basis.

4. Does he understand his own protection scheme; for example, when the QB has max-protect (let say 7 blockers against 4), he can afford to stay in the pocket longer, and not having happy feet, or panic too soon.
When he has one-on-one protection, it means that his five weapons would also have single coverage (plus a single safety deep), the QB wants to find the mis-match .

There are a whole lot more nuances than just those things.
I took Bill Walsh's manual for things that he wants when evaluating a QB, and apply it, basically.

I rated Keenum more highly than Kolb or Ware (at the same moment in time before their respective draft period.)
So, there you have it; a few things in my thought process when I try to evaluate a QB for the draft.

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 04:50 PM
says the guy who is internet friends with gary. :toropalm:

Says the insecure mb member

2012Champs
10-01-2013, 04:55 PM
lol at insecure. maybe i should send a friend request to gary so i wouldnt be so insecure.

keep back pedaling and moving the goal posts.



If it would help your insecurities go right ahead

busterspencer
10-01-2013, 04:59 PM
Simple question - Does either Yates or Keenum give you a better chance to win that Schaub.



1 Yes , Yates

2 Yes , Keenum

3 No

4 Texan Bill for QB.
I was hoping Schaub would be better this year..He had a great 1st half and was throwing the ball down the field. The the second half he started throwing the ball to the bubble screen and short of the 1st down on 3rd down. I am ready to try a new QB. We need to start Yates and Keenum in the next few weeks to see what we have before we draft a QB in the draft. Like I said I have given Schaub every oppertunity to show he is the one but now is the time to move on.

dream_team
10-01-2013, 05:01 PM
Sure, we have to take into account the lesser talent level that Keenum faced in college.

That's why when I evaluated him, I did these things:

1. I evaluated games he played against better defenses, like Alabama, UCLA, S. Miss, Penn St., Miss St., Oregon, TCU, E. Carolina (the years they had good defense under Skip Holtz, who had been with major teams like ND, Fla St, S. Car., and won multi C-USA championships.)

2. I evaluated games he played against common opponents in the same year with drafted QBs like Luck, RG III, Weeden, Ponder, etc.)

3. I evaluated his O-line play; for example, against UCLA in 2011, he was under pressure some 24-25 times as compared to 4 by Luck.
UH played UCLA early in the year, while Stanford played UCLA late, when the Bruins suffered some injuries in the secondary.

On the details, I check to see:

1. How fast does the ball leaves his hand on a 10-yd route, an intermediate route between 15-22 yards, a deep route of 30-40 yards as compared to other QBs from the same formation, running the same or a similar play.
(In his Fr year, the Cougars did run a small but significant number of plays out of the traditional I formation with 2 backs and a TE. They did run a few bootleg out of the PA just like the Texans have been doing.)
In the spread, Keenum got the ball out a hair faster than RG III, and much quicker than Weeden, for example.

2. How good is his presnap read. Can he reads defense and find the open receiver against that particular defense.
Does he recognize a potential blitzer and counter the D-call, making the aggressors pay for their aggressiveness.

3. On the post-snap read, can he recognize the disguises of the defense so as not to make stupid mistakes like Schaub has been doing on a consistent basis.

4. Does he understand his own protection scheme; for example, when the QB has max-protect (let say 7 blockers against 4), he can afford to stay in the pocket longer, and not having happy feet, or panic too soon.
When he has one-on-one protection, it means that his five weapons would also have single coverage (plus a single safety deep), the QB wants to find the mis-match .

There are a whole lot more nuances than just those things.
I took Bill Walsh's manual for things that he wants when evaluating a QB, and apply it, basically.

I rated Keenum more highly than Kolb or Ware (at the same moment in time before their respective draft period.)
So, there you have it; a few things in my thought process when I try to evaluate a QB for the draft.

Serious question, I'm not trying to be a smart-a**. So why was he undrafted? What was it about him that scouts didn't like? I don't buy being too short, or lack of competition, or inflated stats, being the main reasons he went undrafted.

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 06:46 PM
breh or brah or whatever has a stench of 4chan edginess about him.

https://0-media-cdn.foolz.us/ffuuka/board/a/image/1346/48/1346485916102.jpg

Grams
10-01-2013, 07:08 PM
I went with Keenum.

I just thinks he brings an excitement to the offense that the other 2 do not. During preseason the offense seemed to have more energy when he was in.

I would just like to see what he can do in a real NFL game.

santo
10-01-2013, 07:14 PM
Serious question, I'm not trying to be a smart-a**. So why was he undrafted? What was it about him that scouts didn't like? I don't buy being too short, or lack of competition, or inflated stats, being the main reasons he went undrafted.


I could be wrong, but it may have to do with the fact that he played at uh, is not tall enough and was injured during the combine.

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 07:18 PM
Serious question, I'm not trying to be a smart-a**. So why was he undrafted? What was it about him that scouts didn't like? I don't buy being too short, or lack of competition, or inflated stats, being the main reasons he went undrafted.

I feel like those actually are the issues scouts have with him. Height really shouldn't mean too much now, but I've heard arm strength and lack of familiarity with the pro style offense as knocks on him.

DX-TEX
10-01-2013, 07:20 PM
jeez....Ive calmed down since Sunday. Some of you are STILL going at this??

Fact isL switching QB's at week 5 of a season is just plain stupid. Not opinion but fact. Teams don't do it because all it says is you have given up on the season.

Stop it

thunderkyss
10-01-2013, 07:53 PM
breh or brah or whatever has a stench of 4chan edginess about him.


I really didn't know...... learned something. I thought he was trying to say Brah.... like a hippie surfer


from (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=breh) the jamaican word bretheren (means brother, whereas sistheren, is sister)
wheres ur breh's now?


I would imagine it is pronounced breah.... like bretheren, bread.

DBCooper
10-01-2013, 08:25 PM
breh or brah or whatever has a stench of 4chan edginess about him.



"Stench" is a good word.

leebigeztx
10-01-2013, 08:51 PM
Serious question, I'm not trying to be a smart-a**. So why was he undrafted? What was it about him that scouts didn't like? I don't buy being too short, or lack of competition, or inflated stats, being the main reasons he went undrafted.

I'm just gonna say this matter a factly,he doesn't have a nfl arm. I was at camp on the sidelines standing next to pat kirwan and soloman wilcots. We were right there watching the qbs throw. When the qbs started throwing 15yd comeback and out route,case and matt schaub ball looked like a parachute was attached to it. The lack of rpms on the ball vs a ghost db was alarming. Its clear as day to anyone watching that yates has the best arm of the 3 and its not really close.

Case is a smaller,mobile version of schaub. His arm talent would restrict the playbook as much as schaubs. I'm not saying yates is the future either,but I think he's the most talented qb on this roster. He's mobile,strong,and has an nfl arm. He has good arm talent without a doubt. Ideally,yates is probably a hold the fort guy probably.

Craig.
10-01-2013, 08:59 PM
You guys can have Mr. Excitement, I'd rather go with the guy that gives you the best chance to win.

That's not Yates and it sure as HELL isn't Keenum.

Rey
10-01-2013, 09:25 PM
I'm just gonna say this matter a factly,he doesn't have a nfl arm. I was at camp on the sidelines standing next to pat kirwan and soloman wilcots. We were right there watching the qbs throw. When the qbs started throwing 15yd comeback and out route,case and matt schaub ball looked like a parachute was attached to it. The lack of rpms on the ball vs a ghost db was alarming. Its clear as day to anyone watching that yates has the best arm of the 3 and its not really close.

Case is a smaller,mobile version of schaub. His arm talent would restrict the playbook as much as schaubs. I'm not saying yates is the future either,but I think he's the most talented qb on this roster. He's mobile,strong,and has an nfl arm. He has good arm talent without a doubt. Ideally,yates is probably a hold the fort guy probably.

Strong arm isn't the end all. Part if what made keenum so good in college and to a degree in pre-season is his anticipation and placement and quick reads.

Peyton doesn't have a cannon. Never did, and he sure as hell doesn't have a cannon now.

Personally I think case has a stronger arm than Matt, but going with your premise we can make a comparison that shows that there is something different about the way they throw the ball. Keenum very rarely floats balls that offensive players have to wait on. That's a trademark of Schaub's. If you look at film of keenum you see him consistently hit guys in stride. Even this past pre season.

So you can say they have the same arm, but anyone can look at game film and see that their throws are very different.

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 10:59 PM
You guys can have Mr. Excitement, I'd rather go with the guy that gives you the best chance to win.

That's not Yates and it sure as HELL isn't Keenum.

Is that an indirect way of saying we should sign Josh Freeman? :trapstar:

DX-TEX
10-01-2013, 11:11 PM
"Hey Ben how would you like to be traded to the Texans?"

http://cdn2.mocksession.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/BIGBENTONGUE.gif

Trade for the man Rick!

htownfan32
10-01-2013, 11:15 PM
"Hey Ben how would you like to be traded to the Texans?"

http://cdn2.mocksession.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/BIGBENTONGUE.gif

Trade for the man Rick!

Ugh. That gif just makes me uncomfortable, especially given that it's Rapistberger...

Scooter
10-01-2013, 11:21 PM
ew, no thanks on ben. has there ever been a quarterback who holds onto the ball as long? he's not very accurate, takes forever to find his target, and hiss off-field antics arent exactly "texans worthy".

DX-TEX
10-01-2013, 11:23 PM
ew, no thanks on ben. has there ever been a quarterback who holds onto the ball as long? he's not very accurate, takes forever to find his target, and hiss off-field antics arent exactly "texans worthy".

He got married and settled down. He is mobile, has a good arm and I think he would thrive in this system with the roll outs.

brakos82
10-01-2013, 11:52 PM
http://i.imgur.com/lCUzSeY.png

VTexan
10-02-2013, 12:23 AM
breh or brah or whatever has a stench of 4chan edginess about him.

https://0-media-cdn.foolz.us/ffuuka/board/a/image/1346/48/1346485916102.jpg

you know that OT we drafted this year (his name escapes me but like the 4-5th round) posted on /sp/ the moment he got drafted.

thunderkyss
10-02-2013, 03:09 AM
Is there any reason to believe Tj... or Case.. couldn't be better than Jake Locker?

Just last year we were talking about how bad Locker was. It's early, but he's completing 62% of his passes, he's thrown 6 TD passess, ran 1 in, no INTs, & a 99 passer rating.

Compared to 65% completion, 8 TD, 6 INTs, & an 85.7 passer rating.