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revan
09-01-2013, 11:18 PM
I have a feeling this kid will be better than RG3 in the NFL. Wouldn't mind pilling a Colts and tank the season for this kid lol.

PapaL
09-01-2013, 11:51 PM
He's damned good too. Possible overall #1 next years draft.

steelbtexan
09-02-2013, 12:03 AM
He's damned good too. Possible overall #1 next years draft.


Depending on needs, but Clowney is the most talented player that I saw last yr.

PapaL
09-02-2013, 01:21 AM
Depending on needs, but Clowney is the most talented player that I saw last yr.

Depends on how the season plays out but I could see both going #1. Look back to the Julius Peppers and HWSNBN draft. Hindsight we probably should've taken Peppers ha. I think Bridgewater is a better prospect than HWSNBN was. Clowny has been NFL ready for awhile now.

It'll be interesting.

revan
09-02-2013, 02:41 AM
1. Raiders take Teddy Bridgewater
2. Jaguars take Jadaveon Clowney

Rock N Randy
09-02-2013, 03:47 AM
To be honest I would be surprised too see clowney go top 3 if not top 5.

Bridgewater will no doubt be the #1 pick
To many sorry QB needy teams for him not to be and he is a superior talent unlike the drafts in the past other then luck rg3 and Wilson those are rare

QBs always get pushed up so bridgewater then possibly Boyd then I think Clowney
Remember Kuechly who I had really high went like 10th or something and Willia went 10th or so and even recently Star Lotulelei who was my number 1 overall player went 10th or so which was mind blowing to me.

The best player rarely goes number one for some reason dude too need and justification of slot pay

Clowney and bridgewater are clearly 1&2 but with QBs being the top of the need chart cuz you can't win without one I defiantly can see a scenario where clowney drops some.

A lot of DEs have been bust look like Tarzan play like Jane
Now let me say that I personally believe Cloeney is the real deal and I believe TE hype cuz he has good hustle and rare abilities he is truly a wonder

We will see how it all shakes put before you know it combine and then draft time

b0ng
09-02-2013, 11:01 AM
Clowney was having motor issues in the 4th of the UNC USCe game. He's very talented but I can see that becoming a thing if that happens more during the season.

76Texan
09-02-2013, 04:35 PM
For now, I'm taking Clowney over the rest.
These QBs are really good, but for me, it has the same feel as JJ Watt vs. the others.

We'll see if any of them really jumps out.

badboy
09-02-2013, 04:39 PM
I have a feeling this kid will be better than RG3 in the NFL. Wouldn't mind pilling a Colts and tank the season for this kid lol.
I would rather win the Super Bowl and draft a very good QB at #32. See my 2014 mock.

Texian
09-02-2013, 09:43 PM
Depending on needs, but Clowney is the most talented player that I saw last yr.

Against N Caro Clowney was disappointing

1. Raiders take Teddy Bridgewater
2. Jaguars take Jadaveon Clowney

Tahj Boyd looked pretty good also, I wouldn't be surprised to see the 2nd pick go Tahj.

Texn4life
09-02-2013, 10:09 PM
Against N Caro Clowney was disappointing



Tahj Boyd looked pretty good also, I wouldn't be surprised to see the 2nd pick go Tahj.

I might be willing to give up half a finger for Boyd or Teddy.

TexansSeminole
09-02-2013, 11:16 PM
I might be willing to give up half a finger for Boyd or Teddy.

I would for Boyd. Dude has played HUGE in big games. Teddy really has only had 1 big game in his entire career.

Texn4life
09-02-2013, 11:21 PM
I would for Boyd. Dude has played HUGE in big games. Teddy really has only had 1 big game in his entire career.

Check out his Cincinnati game last year when he played the whole game on one leg. Dude has a good arm, he's accurate, has some mobility, and tough as nails. He's also probably one of the smarter QBs in College Football. He's the total package.

Rey
09-02-2013, 11:28 PM
I need to watch some more of clowney because atm I don't get the hype.

As far as who the number one pick will be how could you possibly k ow that without knowing what team will have the first pick or what their situation will be.

Rey
09-02-2013, 11:33 PM
I love Boyd's game. Haven't watched bridgewater much. Next year might be a great year to think about trading up for the qb of the future.

TexansSeminole
09-03-2013, 01:44 PM
Check out his Cincinnati game last year when he played the whole game on one leg. Dude has a good arm, he's accurate, has some mobility, and tough as nails. He's also probably one of the smarter QBs in College Football. He's the total package.

He looks the total package. Love what I have seen from him, I was just pointing out the difference in competition between the two guys.

76Texan
09-03-2013, 04:07 PM
I need to watch some more of clowney because atm I don't get the hype.

As far as who the number one pick will be how could you possibly k ow that without knowing what team will have the first pick or what their situation will be.

At halftime of the UH/Southern game, they had a little segment on Clowney, and he looked like the real deal.

I've watched most of his games last year.
I want that guy to replace Antonio Smith.
The Texans will look like the 85 Bears; no doubt about it.

TexanSam
09-03-2013, 04:13 PM
At halftime of the UH/Southern game, they had a little segment on Clowney, and he looked like the real deal.

I've watched most of his games last year.
I want that guy to replace Antonio Smith.
The Texans will look like the 85 Bears; no doubt about it.

That would be awesome, but there's no way that guy falls all the way down to the 32nd pick.

76Texan
09-03-2013, 05:10 PM
That would be awesome, but there's no way that guy falls all the way down to the 32nd pick.

Just wishing, LOL!

I like Hopkins, but I really wished that the Texans had tried to trade for future draft picks. There are some really good football players in the next draft that we would have to trade up for.

@Rey & all, FYI:

http://www.sbnation.com/longform/2013/8/28/4648518/jadeveon-clowney-south-carolina-football-gameplan?utm_source=sbnation&utm_medium=nextclicks&utm_campaign=articlebottom

They line him up everywhere, even at the nose once in a while.

And BTW, he was playing the last game with a stomach virus.
If you watch the whole game, you can see all the game planning that was talked about in that article.
They had to really account for him.
Watch how UNC had to rely on the quick short games and running plays away from him. They were limiting their offense to avoid the Clowney's effect. But that didn't help; USC got out to a lead and never looked back.

If you pair Clowney with Watt, one of them is going to be in the opponent's backfield unless the offense keeps six to block at all times. If they do that, they will limit your offense a whole lot.

NCTexan
09-06-2013, 12:23 PM
And BTW, he was playing the last game with a stomach virus.
If you watch the whole game, you can see all the game planning that was talked about in that article.
They had to really account for him.
Watch how UNC had to rely on the quick short games and running plays away from him. They were limiting their offense to avoid the Clowney's effect. But that didn't help; USC got out to a lead and never looked back.


He really didn't seem like that much of a force. I don't disagree that there was some planning around him, and I don't disagree that he's good. But if he plays the entire season like the UNC game he doesn't look deserving of the #1 overall pick. That's all I'm getting at.

I also don't feel like you're giving USC's offense enough credit in the first quarter. They ran roughshod over our D for that quarter.

Playoffs
09-14-2013, 11:06 AM
...is at Kentucky on ESPN right now.

TexansSeminole
09-14-2013, 01:52 PM
I become less impressed with Bridgewater as I watch more of him. He floats the ball entirely too much, doesn't zip it in as often as you would like. That works against terrible completion, like Kentucky, but those passes are going to be contested/intercepted in the NFL. He makes some good throws, but they are rarely contested by the defense. Most of his throws are to pretty wide open guys. He's tough to evaluate, because they literally play nobody this year. This Kentucky game is arguably their most difficult matchup of the season, and Kentucky is arguably the worst team in the SEC.

FirstTexansFan
09-15-2013, 08:01 AM
I tuned in to this game based on this thread, gotta agree with the above poster, wasn't impressed in the slightest.

badboy
10-18-2013, 10:25 PM
Wow wished I had watched this one. Central Florida beats undefeated Louisville 38-35.

Bridgewater 2 TDs 326 yds

ArlingtonTexan
10-19-2013, 12:23 AM
I watched the into the point that the game was 28-7 in favor of Louisville. Brdigewater had made several NFl level throws and CF looked over matched.

BTW, Louisvile has a couple of silly good safeties.

TexansSeminole
10-19-2013, 12:30 AM
I watched the game. Louisville is/was highly overrated.

Bridgewater looks pretty good, but he isn't #1 overall good.

Insideop
10-19-2013, 01:08 AM
What about the QB from CF? How'd he do? He's a "sleeper" prospect right now but he might start getting on people's radars if he had a good game. Here's a quote from Daniel Jeremiah at NFL.com:

Central Florida QB Blake Bortles vs. Louisville

Bortles is one of the most underrated players in college football. The strong-armed junior quarterback rarely hears his name mentioned among the top guys at the position, but he is playing very well this season. He'll have a chance on Friday to get everyone's attention, as the Knights go on the road to take on eighth-ranked Louisville and its star passer, Teddy Bridgewater. So far this season, Bortles has thrown nine touchdown passes and just three interceptions. He has outstanding size (6-foot-4, 230 pounds), a strong arm, and enough athletic ability to extend plays.

thunderkyss
10-19-2013, 01:28 AM
The game will be re-aired on EsPN @ 2am

ajohnson80
10-19-2013, 02:21 AM
overrrr rated

Texn4life
10-19-2013, 02:21 AM
Bridgewater was sharp this game. One of his best of the year against a pretty good defense. Louisville is just Louisville though at the end of the day. A good team that can compete with anyone on any given day, but not good enough to dominate week in a week out. Turnovers and some other mistakes killed them.

I don't know if there is a clear and consensus #1 pick right now, but he made some big time throws tonight to me. He's a more accurate and better deep ball passer than Geno Smith. I hate making that comparison, but they have pretty similar arm strength and similar mobility. Bridgewater has better pocket presence than Geno did this time last year though. I would say Teddy's a top 5 pick no questions asked IMO. He's one of those guys that just gives you the sense that you can trust that he's going to constantly work to improve and get better. That's the type of guy I want as a franchise QB. Not a finished product, but when he's on he has pinpoint accuracy.

TexansSeminole
12-05-2013, 06:40 PM
I thought surely we had a Teddy thread but I guess not.

He's playing now against Cincinatti. He just threw a short completion that was turned into a TD after the run after catch.

TexansSeminole
12-05-2013, 07:00 PM
Um, what the hell?

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 07:04 PM
Sounds like a good student to me.

http://network.yardbarker.com/college_football/article_external/louisville_cardinals_qb_teddy_bridgewater_dresses_ in_drag/13384300?story_article_yb_original_head_13384300

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 07:05 PM
ill be flicking over during the texans game to see how his going

TexansSeminole
12-05-2013, 07:08 PM
Sounds like a good student to me.

http://network.yardbarker.com/college_football/article_external/louisville_cardinals_qb_teddy_bridgewater_dresses_ in_drag/13384300?story_article_yb_original_head_13384300

No harm done then.

He threw an almost pick earlier. The TD was a semi tight window, although not really.

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 07:13 PM
No harm done then.

He threw an almost pick earlier. The TD was a semi tight window, although not really.

Yea tried to do too much on the near pick. Was surprised he threw it because he's been really good this year with taking care of the ball and throwing it away in those situations. The 3rd down pass was off too. Very tight window and he almost hit it. Ball was a little low though.

Texian
12-05-2013, 07:19 PM
Doesn't throw well running to his right.

Doesn't throw well running to his left.....hhmmm

Looks uncomfortable when rolling out to pass.

Gloves off, Gloves On, almost fumbles the snap

Another rollout to left, pass high and behind WR.

Takes a sack in RZ on 3rd DN. FG

INT w/ 1:00 min left

TexansSeminole
12-05-2013, 07:20 PM
Yea tried to do too much on the near pick. Was surprised he threw it because he's been really good this year with taking care of the ball and throwing it away in those situations. The 3rd down pass was off too. Very tight window and he almost hit it. Ball was a little low though.

Yeah, only 3 picks on the year.

Texian
12-05-2013, 07:29 PM
Hey Boys and Girls, Greg Blair could be a solid option for a mid draft ILB.

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 08:01 PM
Not a very impressive 1st half. 6/14 for 86 yards with 1 TD and 1 INT.

TD was on a short pass that the WR broke for a 36-yard TD. Counted 2 drops on passes that were high but went right through receiver's hands. INT came on a comeback where his WR fell down. He's been pretty off regardless though. Thrown high on a lot of his passes and took a sack on 3rd down inside the 10. Probably the least impressive half I've seen him play all season.

Rey
12-05-2013, 08:05 PM
I'm flipping back and forth between the two games. Not impressed with teddy.

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 08:24 PM
haven't been able to catch much of this game. hows teddy going??

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 08:33 PM
haven't been able to catch much of this game. hows teddy going??

Very sloppy. His mechanics look fine. He's just off so far tonight.

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 08:36 PM
Very sloppy. His mechanics look fine. He's just off so far tonight.

so his being 'lazy' in his reads ?? or his accuracy has dropped off?

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 08:38 PM
so his being 'lazy' in his reads ?? or his accuracy has dropped off?

It's been his accuracy. The ball looks good coming out but he's sailing quite a few throws.

Playoffs
12-05-2013, 08:44 PM
1/1 needs to blow my socks off in games versus underwear olympics.

Xcellerator
12-05-2013, 09:00 PM
Bridgewater hasn't looked good since the loss to UCF. Looking off today as well. Would pick Clowney over Bridgewater if the draft was now.

Rey
12-05-2013, 09:01 PM
Bridgewater looks like a mediocre player.

Texian
12-05-2013, 09:09 PM
just threw a long wideout with little zip that should have been a pick six but DB dropped the ball.

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 09:12 PM
It's been his accuracy. The ball looks good coming out but he's sailing quite a few throws.

thanks mate

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 09:13 PM
certainly doesn't sound good

Blake
12-05-2013, 09:14 PM
Bridgewater hasn't looked good since the loss to UCF. Looking off today as well. Would pick Clowney over Bridgewater if the draft was now.

Not going to say crazy, just doesn't make any sense when you do not have a franchise qb on the roster.

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 09:17 PM
Dude just broke 3 tackles and ran for a 1st down on 4th & 13.

Giant Tiger
12-05-2013, 09:18 PM
Cool throw there :clap:

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 09:19 PM
Broke some more tackles in the pocket and heaved an off balance pass for a TD to take the lead.

Rey
12-05-2013, 09:20 PM
Hmmmm....

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 09:23 PM
i saw a poor reply. was the TD throw a bad throw away or do you think he meant it

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 09:27 PM
i saw a poor reply. was the TD throw a bad throw away or do you think he meant it

I doubt he meant for that exact thing to happen, but it didn't look like a throwaway to me. Looked like he was just giving his guy a chance.

Texian
12-05-2013, 09:32 PM
i saw a poor reply. was the TD throw a bad throw away or do you think he meant it

It was a great play. He was definitely under duress. He was going down when he threw it, he just slung it on a hope and prayer and it worked.After watching replay TB spotted his guy and heaved it. The thing that made it work was there was no one around the WR, wide open as they say.

BetaV1
12-05-2013, 09:50 PM
I'll be the first to admit that I'm no scout and barely an archair GM. I also watch ziltch, nada, zero college football and I only watched this game to see what our potential next quarterback looks like.

That being said, I don't want any part of this. Does anyone else hate his throwing mechanics? His throwing motion just looks real sloppy to me and I think it's resulting in a lot of his passes spending far too much time in the air for NFL caliber corners to not take advantage of.

Texian
12-05-2013, 10:08 PM
I'll be the first to admit that I'm no scout and barely an archair GM. I also watch ziltch, nada, zero college football and I only watched this game to see what our potential next quarterback looks like.

That being said, I don't want any part of this. Does anyone else hate his throwing mechanics? His throwing motion just looks real sloppy to me and I think it's resulting in a lot of his passes spending far too much time in the air for NFL caliber corners to not take advantage of.

For an admitted novice you have summed up it pretty well.

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 10:12 PM
After a terrible 1st half, Teddy looked pretty good in the 2nd half.

17/23 for 169 yards and 2 TD's. Was under constant duress all night and made some great plays late in the game to get the lead back.

Louisville ran at a much higher tempo in the 4th quarter and that seemed to help him a lot. Their offense tends to bog down because they play very vanilla on offense and try to control the ball by running it and dinking and dunking in the passing game.

Finished the game 23/37 for 255 yards with 3 TD's and 1 INT. Also had 6 carries for 17 yards (sacked 3 times). Not great numbers, but he was pretty impressive in the 4th quarter after a horrible start to the game.

TheRealJoker
12-05-2013, 10:59 PM
He was clutch when it mattered. Something we do not currently have at QB. His mistakes can be corrected with coaching, but you cannot teach a player to be clutch.

htownfan32
12-05-2013, 11:03 PM
You know what's impressive? He bounced back. Started off with a bad half and bounced back. You know what none of our current QBs can do?

Bounce back.

Bridgewater's bag of tools may not be as big as Luck's, but it's a pretty big bag of tools. Give him a new coaching staff and FO and O-line help and we are .500 next year or better.

steelbtexan
12-05-2013, 11:11 PM
You know what's impressive? He bounced back. Started off with a bad half and bounced back. You know what none of our current QBs can do?

Bounce back.

Bridgewater's bag of tools may not be as big as Luck's, but it's a pretty big bag of tools. Give him a new coaching staff and FO and O-line help and we are .500 next year or better.

No to Teddy 1-1. I would rather take Manziel over Bridgewater and I'm not high on Manziel.

Give me a QB in Rd.2 or 3. Bortles/Mettenberger in Rd.2

Murray in Rd.3-4

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 11:14 PM
No to Teddy 1-1. I would rather take Manziel over Bridgewater and I'm not high on Manziel.

Give me a QB in Rd.2 or 3. Bortles/Mettenberger in Rd.2

Murray in Rd.3-4

With Mariota coming back (and Hundley probably doing the same) plus Murray and Mett getting injured I would be shocked if Bortles lasts to the 2nd round IF he enters.

pamperofirpo
12-05-2013, 11:25 PM
No to Teddy 1-1. I would rather take Manziel over Bridgewater and I'm not high on Manziel.

Give me a QB in Rd.2 or 3. Bortles/Mettenberger in Rd.2

Murray in Rd.3-4

Amen! While he may not be a bust, this draft reminds me of the David Carr vs Julius Peppers decision. David Carr also put up great numbers in a ****ty conference, like Bridgewater. I'd take Clowney in Round 1, and then Derek Carr in Round 2 (and make him wear number 8...):shades:

Good article on the high bust rate of 1st Round QBs from 2003 to 2012.
It's even worse if you go back to 2002 (Carr, Harrington, Patrick Ramsey).

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/91070/inside-slant-qb-drafting-is-50-50

eriadoc
12-05-2013, 11:26 PM
Bridgewater is being overrated by Texans fans who want a new QB. This draft could end up being like 2002 for QBs - 16 QBs taken, and they all suck. Carr, Harrington, and Ramsey at the top of that class. Or maybe a couple of them end up panning out, but I don't think Bridgewater has a better chance of panning out than McCarron or even Mett or Murray (injuries notwithstanding). Hell, Boyd might be the one that pans out. I just don't see Bridgewater being BPA. But fans want the team to force the pick because they have the top pick. Well, top pick means you should get the player with the most potential, irrespective of position.

Sucks this crappy record couldn't have waited a year.

eriadoc
12-05-2013, 11:28 PM
Good article on the high bust rate of 1st Round QBs from 2003 to 2012.
It's even worse if you go back to 2002 (Carr, Harrington, Patrick Ramsey).

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/91070/inside-slant-qb-drafting-is-50-50

Looks like we posted at the same time. 16 QBs taken in that '02 draft and every single one of them were busts (insofar as late rounders can be considered busts).

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 11:30 PM
With Mariota coming back (and Hundley probably doing the same) plus Murray and Mett getting injured I would be shocked if Bortles lasts to the 2nd round IF he enters.

if he enters it will be because he has info that his going to go in the top 15. otherwise it would be better for him to stay another year and compete for the top 10 next draft

aussie_texan
12-05-2013, 11:31 PM
Bridgewater is being overrated by Texans fans who want a new QB. This draft could end up being like 2002 for QBs - 16 QBs taken, and they all suck. Carr, Harrington, and Ramsey at the top of that class. Or maybe a couple of them end up panning out, but I don't think Bridgewater has a better chance of panning out than McCarron or even Mett or Murray (injuries notwithstanding). Hell, Boyd might be the one that pans out. I just don't see Bridgewater being BPA. But fans want the team to force the pick because they have the top pick. Well, top pick means you should get the player with the most potential, irrespective of position.

Sucks this crappy record couldn't have waited a year.

:goodpost:

WolverineFan
12-05-2013, 11:33 PM
Amen! While he may not be a bust, this draft reminds me of the David Carr vs Julius Peppers decision. David Carr also put up great numbers in a ****ty conference, like Bridgewater. I'd take Clowney in Round 1, and then Derek Carr in Round 2 (and make him wear number 8...):shades:

Good article on the high bust rate of 1st Round QBs from 2003 to 2012.
It's even worse if you go back to 2002 (Carr, Harrington, Patrick Ramsey).

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/91070/inside-slant-qb-drafting-is-50-50

The bust rate is higher for 1st round QB's because that's where teams are drafting starting Quarterbacks. 75% of the starting QB's in the NFL were drafted in the top 40 picks.

If 3 of 4 QB's drafted in the 1st round bust that's still a 25% success rate for those 1st round QB's.

Typically around 10 QB's get drafted after the top 40 picks and usually only 1 guy makes it at most. That's a 10% success rate at best.

Despite the high bust rate of QB's drafted in the 1st round, your odds of finding a franchise QB are still much higher in the 1st round than any other round.

steelbtexan
12-05-2013, 11:47 PM
I'm thinking McCarron 3-1

Or better Murray 4-1

Are much better values than Bridgewater at 1-1. I'm not sure that Bridgewater's arm strength is better than McCarron/Manziel. I know his arm strength isn't as good as Bortles/Mettenberger/Murray.

Texian
12-05-2013, 11:49 PM
Bridgewater is being overrated by Texans fans who want a new QB. This draft could end up being like 2002 for QBs - 16 QBs taken, and they all suck. Carr, Harrington, and Ramsey at the top of that class. Or maybe a couple of them end up panning out, but I don't think Bridgewater has a better chance of panning out than McCarron or even Mett or Murray (injuries notwithstanding). Hell, Boyd might be the one that pans out. I just don't see Bridgewater being BPA. But fans want the team to force the pick because they have the top pick. Well, top pick means you should get the player with the most potential, irrespective of position.

Sucks this crappy record couldn't have waited a year.

Funny to read TB fans comments and non fans comments. TB fans say he bounced back, what I saw is TB heave a ball to a wide open WR, (no one within 10 yards). As I watched TB tonight I tried to envision his game in the NFL. I see a BUST waiting to happen. He just doesn't have zip on the ball, passes come out slow and his deep ball has a high trajectory (floats).

I actually find this disappointing. I really wanted Teddy to be closer to his media sensationalized hype. I really wanted TB to be good enough that another team would fall in love with him enough to pay a Kings ransom for their perceived Franchise QB. Sadly I say, I don't see that happening.

My QB Draft Rankings today:
1. Blake Bortles
2. Zach Mettenberger
3. AJ McCarron
4. Johny Manziel
5. Aaron Murray
6. David Fales
7. Derek Carr
8. Tajh Boyd
9. Teddy Bridgewater

pamperofirpo
12-05-2013, 11:55 PM
Funny to read TB fans comments and non fans comments. TB fans say he bounced back, what I saw is TB heave a ball to a wide open WR, (no one within 10 yards). As I watched TB tonight I tried to envision his game in the NFL. I see a BUST waiting to happen. He just doesn't have zip on the ball, passes come out slow and his deep ball has a high trajectory (floats).

I actually find this disappointing. I really wanted Teddy to be closer to his media sensationalized hype. I really wanted TB to be good enough that another team would fall in love with him enough to pay a Kings ransom for their perceived Franchise QB. Sadly I say, I don't see that happening.

My QB Draft Rankings today:
1. Blake Bortles
2. Zach Mettenberger
3. AJ McCarron
4. Aaron Murray
5. Tajh Boyd
6. Teddy Bridgewater

Are any of the above better options than:

1) Taking Clowney @ #1, in Round 1
2) Dump Shaub & TJ - Save $4.7M in Cap Space
3) Picking up a QB that's a Cap Casualty (Bradford, Cutler, or Rivers)
4) Taking McCarron or Murray or Boyd in Round 3 - and see if they pan out for long term.

Texian
12-06-2013, 12:11 AM
Are any of the above better options than:

1) Taking Clowney @ #1, in Round 1
2) Dump Shaub & TJ - Save $4.7M in Cap Space
3) Picking up a QB that's a Cap Casualty (Bradford, Cutler, or Rivers)
4) Taking McCarron or Murray or Boyd in Round 3 - and see if they pan out for long term.

I am a firm believer in that you want to fix something you don't do it with band aids. Cutler and Bradford IMHO are band aids and I don't see Rivers leaving SD. I also believe that the most important player on a team is the QB. If you have a guy you truly believe in, think he could be a $100 mil guy, team QB with multiple playoffs for the next 15 years you go get him. I currently think Bortles and Mettenberger can be that guy but it's still early.

If you are making a decision on QB because you're afraid you might miss out on a franchise QB and you don't want to be the goat then you take Clowney. McCarron, Manziel, Bridgewater and Carr possible mid/late rd 1st. Murray, Boyd Fales could go as early as 2nd RD NLT 3rd RD. These guys are more wishing & hoping picks than conviction and committed picks.

Hookem Horns
12-06-2013, 12:18 AM
http://www.straitpinkie.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/TEDDY-GIRL.png



WTH is this about?

PapaL
12-06-2013, 05:12 AM
WTH is this about?

A class project.

Rey
12-06-2013, 07:31 AM
Bridgewater is being overrated by Texans fans who want a new QB. This draft could end up being like 2002 for QBs - 16 QBs taken, and they all suck. Carr, Harrington, and Ramsey at the top of that class. Or maybe a couple of them end up panning out, but I don't think Bridgewater has a better chance of panning out than McCarron or even Mett or Murray (injuries notwithstanding). Hell, Boyd might be the one that pans out. I just don't see Bridgewater being BPA. But fans want the team to force the pick because they have the top pick. Well, top pick means you should get the player with the most potential, irrespective of position.

Sucks this crappy record couldn't have waited a year.

I've gone back and forth on bridgewater.

But I think people should hold off judgement and reeeeaaaallllly think about this. Well, not us...but the texans...


Because as much as it'd suck to take bridgewater and he's nothing special, it'd suck even worse to pass on him when we had a shot at him and he becomes an elite qb in the league.

I think folks are making up their minds far too quickly. Texans scouting/decision makers have to be more open minded and examine this guy with a fine toothed comb.

Yeah he might not look great all the time, but I've watched some Louisville games and it doesn't seem like they are this greatly coached team. Their offensive scheme seems pretty basic as well.

One thing you have to consider is, can a good nfl coach take the raw skills/talent bridgewater possesses and really get the most out of him.

Just like you see mediocre guys put up monster numbers in great systems, sometimes guys are held back by mediocre systems/coaching.

I'm not sold on bridgewater right now either...but he does have some very enticing attributes that make me believe he could be a great qb.

eriadoc
12-06-2013, 07:38 AM
Yeah he might not look great all the time, but I've watched some Louisville games and it doesn't seem like they are this greatly coached team. Their offensive scheme seems pretty basic as well.

One thing you have to consider is, can a good nfl coach take the raw skills/talent bridgewater possesses and really get the most out of him.

Just like you see mediocre guys put up monster numbers in great systems, sometimes guys are held back by mediocre systems/coaching.


That's fair. I just don't see what you described as a #1 overall pick.

Texian
12-06-2013, 08:52 AM
it'd suck even worse to pass on him when we had a shot at him and he becomes an elite qb in the league.

This is exactly the kind of mind set and human behavior of why people like Gabbert, Locker, Ponder and Russell get drafted as early as they do. This type of thinking creates hold your nose draft picks that mostly end up as wasted picks.

One thing you have to consider is, can a good nfl coach take the raw skills/talent bridgewater possesses and really get the most out of him.

You've watched several Louisville games so have I. It's not hard to see that the ball comes out of Bridgewater's hand a little slow and often with a lack of zip. When he goes deep his passes need more air than most get there. That floater spells INT in the NFL. With Teddy's arm all coaching can really do is perfect a < 12 yd passing game to go with that arm. He doesn't have enough uumph. If the Bearcats pressure rattled his accuracy imagine what an NFL defense will do to that accuracy.

Rey
12-06-2013, 09:10 AM
That's fair. I just don't see what you described as a #1 overall pick.

That's fine.

I'm not trying to convince anyone he is. I'm just saying it's an important decision so every aspect should be considered.

Well, not so much for us...but I hope whoever is making this call hasn't made up their mind on these guys yet. Lots if things to consider.

Playoffs
12-06-2013, 09:16 AM
Sucks this crappy record couldn't have waited a year.

Indeed it does.

QB is not looking like the best choice at 1/1, although the hype machine will build it up that way by May.

BullNation4Life
12-06-2013, 10:08 AM
I am not sold on Teddy Bridgewater at all. Nothing he does really stands out and grabs you...

Honoring Earl 34
12-06-2013, 10:13 AM
That's fine.

I'm not trying to convince anyone he is. I'm just saying it's an important decision so every aspect should be considered.

Well, not so much for us...but I hope whoever is making this call hasn't made up their mind on these guys yet. Lots if things to consider.

I was on Teddy's side last week but after last night , without the glove , I'm not sure . Drafting a QB #1 overall , he can't have any warts . In 2002 the Texans took that to mean facial warts and look where that got them . :shades:

Vinny
12-06-2013, 10:15 AM
I was on Teddy's side last week but after last night , without the glove , I'm not sure . Drafting a QB #1 overall , he can't have any warts . In 2002 the Texans took that to mean facial warts and look where that got them . :shades:
I've mixed feelings also...Right now we have Neil O'Donnell (Schaub) and Billy Volek (Keenum) backing him up. No reason to add Geno Smith to that mix.

Honoring Earl 34
12-06-2013, 10:19 AM
I've mixed feelings also...Right now we have Neil O'Donnell (Schaub) and Billy Volek (Keenum) backing him up. No reason to add Geno Smith to that mix.

I'd keep Volek because he works cheap , I might keep TJ . If Murray and Mettenberger fell to the 4th and 5th round I might take them both . I might have a ... wait for it .... QB competition .

badboy
12-06-2013, 10:36 AM
Hey Boys and Girls, Greg Blair could be a solid option for a mid draft ILB.I am starting to focus on him. ESPN has him ranked 6-7 round #232. Dude is a tackler 2012: 138 T 9 TFLs, 2.5 sacks, 2 INTs, 6 pass breakups. He is 6'2 252

Vinny
12-06-2013, 10:39 AM
I'd keep Volek because he works cheap , I might keep TJ . If Murray and Mettenberger fell to the 4th and 5th round I might take them both . I might have a ... wait for it .... QB competition .
if you need a qb, fishing for one late in the draft is the longest of long shots....so that's only a good option if you did that 3 years ago.

Honoring Earl 34
12-06-2013, 10:41 AM
if you need a qb, fishing for one late in the draft is the longest of long shots....so that's only a good option if you did that 3 years ago.

I think both Murray and Mettenberger have talent . They also have torn ACL tears which is going to make them fall .

steelbtexan
12-06-2013, 11:17 AM
I think both Murray and Mettenberger have talent . They also have torn ACL tears which is going to make them fall .

Mettenberger to the 2nd/3rd at the latest.

Murray to the 3/4th

Which one do you like the best in those rds?

DexmanC
12-06-2013, 11:44 AM
The current Texans coaching staff has never been able to develop a player, especially with top-shelf talent, into anything better than his Day-One capability. With a new staff, one could hope.

The Texans entered the NFL one year too late to get Michael Vick. They suck one year too soon to get Jameis Winston. Bridgewater would be the best QB prospect they've had since David Carr. You'd hope the new staff would know what to do with him.

Jackie Chiles
12-06-2013, 08:16 PM
Finally got around to watching his game against Cincinnati. Rough first half but I like the way he bounced back in the 2nd. His O-line is nothing special and there were quite a few drops but he showed some real competitiveness and put his team on his back to finish off a tough opponent. He got in a groove and was extremely efficient towards the end including a circus scramble on 4th down and an Eli Manning-esque heave that resulted in a TD.

He looked like he was in total command of that offense and I really like his feet in the pocket and how quickly he was getting rid of the football. No panic in him at any point. Once he hit his stride his accuracy was top notch. It sounded to me like David Pollack (one of the announcers) was skeptical at the beginning of the game and by the end he had bought in.

I like the fact that he just turned 21 but has had 3 years under center and made improvements to his game every year. QBs are notoriously difficult to project to the next level but I would be excited to see him develop for us.

stingray
12-06-2013, 08:37 PM
Finally got around to watching his game against Cincinnati. Rough first half but I like the way he bounced back in the 2nd. His O-line is nothing special and there were quite a few drops but he showed some real competitiveness and put his team on his back to finish off a tough opponent. He got in a groove and was extremely efficient towards the end including a circus scramble on 4th down and an Eli Manning-esque heave that resulted in a TD.

He looked like he was in total command of that offense and I really like his feet in the pocket and how quickly he was getting rid of the football. No panic in him at any point. Once he hit his stride his accuracy was top notch. It sounded to me like David Pollack (one of the announcers) was skeptical at the beginning of the game and by the end he had bought in.

I like the fact that he just turned 21 but has had 3 years under center and made improvements to his game every year. QBs are notoriously difficult to project to the next level but I would be excited to see him develop for us.

I was impressed by his play in the 4th quarter. His line was not very good but he wouldnt panic and would make the play. His accuracy is pretty good. Overall, I would love the Texans to draft him from what I have seen and read about him.

Exascor
12-06-2013, 09:43 PM
I'm not pushing for TB (or anyone else). To me it's too early. I've seen some good posters getting nervous or flat out condemn TB for the last game or another game. "#1 picks shouldn't have questions"

Honest question - did Andrew Luck, Matt Stafford or Peyton Manning never have poor games in college?

bhsman
12-06-2013, 10:15 PM
I'm not pushing for TB (or anyone else). To me it's too early. I've seen some good posters getting nervous or flat out condemn TB for the last game or another game. "#1 picks shouldn't have questions"

Honest question - did Andrew Luck, Matt Stafford or Peyton Manning never have poor games in college?

I'm sure they did, though Luck played in a resurgent Pac 12 and Stafford/Peyton played SEC teams. Teddy's biggest question was competition and a poor first half against an un-ranked Cincy takes the tiniest amount of polish from his armor.

JCTexan
12-06-2013, 10:33 PM
I'm not pushing for TB (or anyone else). To me it's too early. I've seen some good posters getting nervous or flat out condemn TB for the last game or another game. "#1 picks shouldn't have questions"

Honest question - did Andrew Luck, Matt Stafford or Peyton Manning never have poor games in college?

I don't mind QB's having bad games but even watching Bridgewater's highlights has me concerned over the Texans taking him. He reminds me of Vince Young. He has the mobility to make his college team very good but his arm is questionable. He seems to lob way too many of his passes and it simply won't work in the NFL. I would be very concerned if the Texans decided to take TB.

beerlover
12-06-2013, 11:04 PM
blah blah blah blah ****ing blah.... does anyone really watch the tape or better question, does anyone around here know how to evaluate QB play? but then again, given Texan history I can't really blame y'all... lol

this kid is special, mark it down.

mussop
12-07-2013, 12:58 AM
The bust rate is higher for 1st round QB's because that's where teams are drafting starting Quarterbacks. 75% of the starting QB's in the NFL were drafted in the top 40 picks.

If 3 of 4 QB's drafted in the 1st round bust that's still a 25% success rate for those 1st round QB's.

Typically around 10 QB's get drafted after the top 40 picks and usually only 1 guy makes it at most. That's a 10% success rate at best.

Despite the high bust rate of QB's drafted in the 1st round, your odds of finding a franchise QB are still much higher in the 1st round than any other round.

To add to this, the success of the first QB taken in each draft compared to QB's taken in the first round is much much higher.

If you have a chance to take the first QB in a draft and you know what you are doing, you do it. I'm very hopefully the new coaching staff will put in the time and effort to make an accurate judgement on this.

infantrycak
12-07-2013, 02:01 AM
To add to this, the success of the first QB taken in each draft compared to QB's taken in the first round is much much higher.

I think that is accurate. I'd only call 4 of the past 16 busts.

EJ Manuel - too soon to judge and taken much lower than usual
Andrew Luck
Cam Newton
Sam Bradford - disappointing to date
Matthew Stafford
Matt Ryan
JaMarcus Russell - bust
Vince Young - bust
Alex Smith - underwhelming
Eli Manning
Carson Palmer - never the same after injury but not a bad pick
David Carr - bust
Michael Vick
Chad Pennington - 1st taken but bottom half of 1st round.
Tim Couch - bust
Peyton Manning

Wolf6151
12-07-2013, 02:07 AM
blah blah blah blah ****ing blah.... does anyone really watch the tape or better question, does anyone around here know how to evaluate QB play? but then again, given Texan history I can't really blame y'all... lol

this kid is special, mark it down.

I'm by no means an NFL scout so take this with a grain of salt, but I just spent the past couple hours watching alot of YouTube videos of Teddy Bridgewater and concentrating on evaluating his mechanics. Here's my observations:

*Very accurate thrower, hits moving targets in small windows.
*Quick release, he gets the ball out of his hands fast.
*Effortless throwing motion, he really makes it look smooth and easy.
*Holds the ball high, up around his upper chest so that his throwing motion can be quick.
*Good feet/Quick Feet, feet are always in motion while scanning the field but plants them quickly when throwing.
*Athletic, moves effortlessly and runs well when needed. He's not a runner who can throw, he's a passing QB that can run very well.
*Arm strength, it's very good but not what I'd call great. He's no John Elway.
*Throws well on the run, almost throws better on the run than from the pocket.
*Looking off a Safety, I saw him several times looking off a Safety while going through his progressions. Other times he stared down a receiver. This is something he'll have to work on in the NFL.
*Post route, he can hit a WR over the middle on a post route. A few times he overthrew a WR on a post route and he'll need to work with his receivers on this but he can make that very difficult throw.
*Wears gloves on both hands. Not sure if that's a pro or con but thought it a little unusual.
*Speaks well, he can form a cohesive sentence.

I like what I see and would take him as the 1st overall pick. I don't know if he'll ever be the next Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, but to me he's got the skill set to be an elite level QB.

The Pencil Neck
12-07-2013, 02:40 AM
I'm not pushing for TB (or anyone else). To me it's too early. I've seen some good posters getting nervous or flat out condemn TB for the last game or another game. "#1 picks shouldn't have questions"

Honest question - did Andrew Luck, Matt Stafford or Peyton Manning never have poor games in college?

In his last college game, one of those QBs got beat 42-17 in a bowl game.

His stat line was:
21/31 for 134 yards, 1 TD and 1 INT.

That was Peyton Manning against Nebraska.

leebigeztx
12-07-2013, 05:10 AM
Been in these type of threads for a minute now and I've read it all. Its funny how a lot of people want to give a undersized,undrafted free agent qb another year yet they have already called bridgewater a bust. For all the stat trackers or qb bust,go back and check the bust for ol and d-line. I'm pretty sure there just as high. In fact,the highest is wr. Missed in all those numbers since 2002 and busted qbs,nobody posted the winning qbs and the rds they were drafted in. The only exception to the rule has been brady and brees. Since 02, big ben twice,eli twice,peyton,rodgers,flacco. So in 11 yrs,7 have been won by 1st rd qbs. The last time a 1st rd qb didn't win it was brees and he was the 1st pick of the 2nd rd.

All this doesn't matter but for our enjoyment. One minute the guy needs to have a hand cannon for an arm,the next he just needs to have a nfl arm . Bridgewaters arm is on par with peyton,rodgers,eli,luck,and brees. His arm isn't. Flacco,ben,staffords coming out,but there are no limitations to the type of offense you can run. From west coast to vertical norv turner/hue jackson type. I guess we will see when the new coaching staff and peple get in place. I say this a lot,don't be wrong either way. Go back and look at the teams that passed rodgers. Go look at the raiders who passed big ben and rivers for gallery. Truth be told and this is the true testament, who would trade their qb for jj watt? Jj is one of the best,mos dominant players in football. I'm willing to bet,you couldn't get luck,stafford,cam,matt ryan,flacco,rg3,kaepernick,wilson,romo,or eli for him. Notice I didn't even name a top 6 guy. All those gms would hang up the phone and laugh at you and we're talking about JJ Watt. As great as watt is,he doesn't touch the ball every play and can be schemed against.

htownfan32
12-07-2013, 05:49 AM
http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/12/06/teddy-bridgewater-touchdown-against-cincy.gif

Play from Thursday night.

Exascor
12-07-2013, 07:24 AM
Been in these type of threads for a minute now and I've read it all. Its funny how a lot of people want to give a undersized,undrafted free agent qb another year yet they have already called bridgewater a bust. For all the stat trackers or qb bust,go back and check the bust for ol and d-line. I'm pretty sure there just as high. In fact,the highest is wr. Missed in all those numbers since 2002 and busted qbs,nobody posted the winning qbs and the rds they were drafted in. The only exception to the rule has been brady and brees. Since 02, big ben twice,eli twice,peyton,rodgers,flacco. So in 11 yrs,7 have been won by 1st rd qbs. The last time a 1st rd qb didn't win it was brees and he was the 1st pick of the 2nd rd.

All this doesn't matter but for our enjoyment. One minute the guy needs to have a hand cannon for an arm,the next he just needs to have a nfl arm . Bridgewaters arm is on par with peyton,rodgers,eli,luck,and brees. His arm isn't. Flacco,ben,staffords coming out,but there are no limitations to the type of offense you can run. From west coast to vertical norv turner/hue jackson type. I guess we will see when the new coaching staff and peple get in place. I say this a lot,don't be wrong either way. Go back and look at the teams that passed rodgers. Go look at the raiders who passed big ben and rivers for gallery. Truth be told and this is the true testament, who would trade their qb for jj watt? Jj is one of the best,mos dominant players in football. I'm willing to bet,you couldn't get luck,stafford,cam,matt ryan,flacco,rg3,kaepernick,wilson,romo,or eli for him. Notice I didn't even name a top 6 guy. All those gms would hang up the phone and laugh at you and we're talking about JJ Watt. As great as watt is,he doesn't touch the ball every play and can be schemed against.
Nice post lee.

beerlover
12-07-2013, 10:13 AM
http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/12/06/teddy-bridgewater-touchdown-against-cincy.gif

Play from Thursday night.

AMAZING?

one of many spectacular athletic, gifted plays he made, on what many felt was an "off night" for Bridgewater. Yet, very easy for me to quickly fill a page with positive attributes you'd expect of a the top rated NFL QB prospect. Teddy has ability to quickly assimilate information needed to run a high tempo offense like Chip Kelly runs so effectively. Not this painfully slow, laborious, clock mismanaged Kubiak/Schaub pace. :polevault:

bah007
12-07-2013, 11:45 AM
I love watching Bridgewater come to the LOS and get his team in the correct play time and time again. He has very little talent in the backfield and on the OL. He does have weapons at WR and he takes advantage of them.

He definitely has a mind for the game, which is a necessary skill at the next level.

mussop
12-07-2013, 12:06 PM
AMAZING?

one of many spectacular athletic, gifted plays he made, on what many felt was an "off night" for Bridgewater. Yet, very easy for me to quickly fill a page with positive attributes you'd expect of a the top rated NFL QB prospect. Teddy has ability to quickly assimilate information needed to run a high tempo offense like Chip Kelly runs so effectively. Not this painfully slow, laborious, clock mismanaged Kubiak/Schaub pace. :polevault:

He had several plays on that level in that game. For those who want to point out he had an "off night" they obviously didn't watch the game. Any QB would have an off night when his OL plays like his did.

Rey
12-07-2013, 12:31 PM
Yeah. I'd be fine with teddy b at number 1.

I can understand the apprehension about him becoming a star, but I don't get the posts saying he sucks or is sure to bust.

Texian
12-07-2013, 01:32 PM
Been in these type of threads for a minute now and I've read it all. Its funny how a lot of people want to give a undersized,undrafted free agent qb another year yet they have already called bridgewater a bust. For all the stat trackers or qb bust,go back and check the bust for ol and d-line. I'm pretty sure there just as high. In fact,the highest is wr. Missed in all those numbers since 2002 and busted qbs,nobody posted the winning qbs and the rds they were drafted in. The only exception to the rule has been brady and brees. Since 02, big ben twice,eli twice,peyton,rodgers,flacco. So in 11 yrs,7 have been won by 1st rd qbs. The last time a 1st rd qb didn't win it was brees and he was the 1st pick of the 2nd rd.

All this doesn't matter but for our enjoyment. One minute the guy needs to have a hand cannon for an arm,the next he just needs to have a nfl arm . Bridgewaters arm is on par with peyton,rodgers,eli,luck,and brees. His arm isn't. Flacco,ben,staffords coming out,but there are no limitations to the type of offense you can run. From west coast to vertical norv turner/hue jackson type. I guess we will see when the new coaching staff and peple get in place. I say this a lot,don't be wrong either way. Go back and look at the teams that passed rodgers. Go look at the raiders who passed big ben and rivers for gallery. Truth be told and this is the true testament, who would trade their qb for jj watt? Jj is one of the best,mos dominant players in football. I'm willing to bet,you couldn't get luck,stafford,cam,matt ryan,flacco,rg3,kaepernick,wilson,romo,or eli for him. Notice I didn't even name a top 6 guy. All those gms would hang up the phone and laugh at you and we're talking about JJ Watt. As great as watt is,he doesn't touch the ball every play and can be schemed against.

The reason I don't have Teddy higher in my evaluations is I disagree with you, Bridgewaters arm is NOT on par with peyton,rodgers,eli,luck,and brees. Bridgewaters arm is on par with Landry Jones and why I think he will be a bust. His deep floater is an NFL INT waiting to happen.

htownfan32
12-07-2013, 01:33 PM
A QB who can win with a crappy OL?

Sounds like he's destined to be the Texans Franchise QB :boogereater:

The Pencil Neck
12-07-2013, 02:30 PM
I haven't started preparing for the draft, yet. (Although I might start early this year. smh) So I haven't watched any tape on any of these guys or figured out who's who, yet.

But.

That's an impressive play for lots of different reasons.

:heart:

mussop
12-07-2013, 02:34 PM
I haven't started preparing for the draft, yet. (Although I might start early this year. smh) So I haven't watched any tape on any of these guys or figured out who's who, yet.

But.

That's an impressive play for lots of different reasons.

:heart:

Well then you are going to love Johnny manzel. He has about 4 Or 5 of those per game.

Corrosion
12-07-2013, 02:37 PM
I think that is accurate. I'd only call 4 of the past 16 busts.

EJ Manuel - too soon to judge and taken much lower than usual
Andrew Luck
Cam Newton
Sam Bradford - disappointing to date
Matthew Stafford
Matt Ryan
JaMarcus Russell - bust
Vince Young - bust
Alex Smith - underwhelming
Eli Manning
Carson Palmer - never the same after injury but not a bad pick
David Carr - bust
Michael Vick
Chad Pennington - 1st taken but bottom half of 1st round.
Tim Couch - bust
Peyton Manning

Only one thing to nit pick from that list.


Alex Smith 30-5 over the last three seasons - not including their current 3 game skid (30-8).

He didn't come out and light the world on fire .... but he has won a very high percentage once the light came on.

Statistically underwhelming .... Sure but bottom line underwhelming no.

Honoring Earl 34
12-07-2013, 02:44 PM
I think that is accurate. I'd only call 4 of the past 16 busts.

EJ Manuel - too soon to judge and taken much lower than usual
Andrew Luck
Cam Newton
Sam Bradford - disappointing to date
Matthew Stafford
Matt Ryan
JaMarcus Russell - bust
Vince Young - bust
Alex Smith - underwhelming
Eli Manning
Carson Palmer - never the same after injury but not a bad pick
David Carr - bust
Michael Vick
Chad Pennington - 1st taken but bottom half of 1st round.
Tim Couch - bust
Peyton Manning

The reason I don't have Teddy higher in my evaluations is I disagree with you, Bridgewaters arm is NOT on par with peyton,rodgers,eli,luck,and brees. Bridgewaters arm is on par with Landry Jones and why I think he will be a bust. His deep floater is an NFL INT waiting to happen.

The biggest bust on this list had the best arm . You could argue that Carr had the 3rd best arm on this list . Teddy has a plenty good arm .

infantrycak
12-07-2013, 02:47 PM
Only one thing to nit pick from that list.


Alex Smith 30-5 over the last three seasons - not including their current 3 game skid (30-8).

He didn't come out and light the world on fire .... but he has won a very high percentage once the light came on.

Statistically underwhelming .... Sure but bottom line underwhelming no.

I didn't list him as a bust but I haven't heard anyone call him a franchise QB even with all his wins. He is the NFL's current definition of a game manager. The team that drafted him dumped him. I think underwhelming is fair for a #1 pick discussion.

You're giving him tons of credit by looking only at the last 3 years. Dude was talked about for benching and replacement frequently in the 5 seasons before that. He is career 47-39.

bhsman
12-07-2013, 03:19 PM
Only one thing to nit pick from that list.


Alex Smith 30-5 over the last three seasons - not including their current 3 game skid (30-8).

He didn't come out and light the world on fire .... but he has won a very high percentage once the light came on.

Statistically underwhelming .... Sure but bottom line underwhelming no.

You mean those three years when he's had an amazing running game and defense to keep the game from being all about him? :P

thunderkyss
12-07-2013, 03:27 PM
Bridgewater is being overrated by Texans fans who want a new QB. This draft could end up being like 2002 for QBs - 16 QBs taken, and they all suck. Carr, Harrington, and Ramsey at the top of that class. Or maybe a couple of them end up panning out, but I don't think Bridgewater has a better chance of panning out than McCarron or even Mett or Murray (injuries notwithstanding). Hell, Boyd might be the one that pans out. I just don't see Bridgewater being BPA. But fans want the team to force the pick because they have the top pick. Well, top pick means you should get the player with the most potential, irrespective of position.

Sucks this crappy record couldn't have waited a year.

If we find a way to win a game or two, end up with the 5-10th pick in the draft, I'd be fine getting Matthews from A&M, then getting Mettenberger early in the second, even trade back into the late first to get him if we need to. Same for Murray.

badboy
12-07-2013, 04:03 PM
He had several plays on that level in that game. For those who want to point out he had an "off night" they obviously didn't watch the game. Any QB would have an off night when his OL plays like his did."laughing my ass off" signed Case Keenum

leebigeztx
12-07-2013, 04:19 PM
The reason I don't have Teddy higher in my evaluations is I disagree with you, Bridgewaters arm is NOT on par with peyton,rodgers,eli,luck,and brees. Bridgewaters arm is on par with Landry Jones and why I think he will be a bust. His deep floater is an NFL INT waiting to happen.

Id argue with you all day on his ball velocity. Do you remember the knock on peyton arm vs leaf? Peytons ball wobble a lot was the word vs the guy who can throw it through the car wash and not get wet. Phil simms said luck can't really drive the ball and can't make all the throws. Rodgers, go read his reports and the stigma of benefitting from the tedford touch. He always had a nfl arm,but in cal he held the ball right by his ear. In gb, the coaches got him to lower his release point and lok what happened. Point is at 21,you get bigger and stronger. Brady didn't even have a nfl arm coming out.

I know these discussions stem from my evaluation of bridgewater. I thought he was the best pro prospect as a sophmore. I feel good about what I watch on him as a qb talent. Not to mention,unlike a lot of these spread,bubble screen qbs, he comes to the los with 3 plays. His fbi is off the charts and that will be the lure of the next texans head coach.

Rey
12-07-2013, 04:34 PM
Id argue with you all day on his ball velocity. Do you remember the knock on peyton arm vs leaf? Peytons ball wobble a lot was the word vs the guy who can throw it through the car wash and not get wet. Phil simms said luck can't really drive the ball and can't make all the throws. Rodgers, go read his reports and the stigma of benefitting from the tedford touch. He always had a nfl arm,but in cal he held the ball right by his ear. In gb, the coaches got him to lower his release point and lok what happened. Point is at 21,you get bigger and stronger. Brady didn't even have a nfl arm coming out.

I know these discussions stem from my evaluation of bridgewater. I thought he was the best pro prospect as a sophmore. I feel good about what I watch on him as a qb talent. Not to mention,unlike a lot of these spread,bubble screen qbs, he comes to the los with 3 plays. His fbi is off the charts and that will be the lure of the next texans head coach.

This.

Don't agree with everything lee says, but he's spot on a lot.

Texian
12-07-2013, 04:48 PM
Id argue with you all day on his ball velocity. Do you remember the knock on peyton arm vs leaf? Peytons ball wobble a lot was the word vs the guy who can throw it through the car wash and not get wet. Phil simms said luck can't really drive the ball and can't make all the throws. Rodgers, go read his reports and the stigma of benefitting from the tedford touch. He always had a nfl arm,but in cal he held the ball right by his ear. In gb, the coaches got him to lower his release point and lok what happened. Point is at 21,you get bigger and stronger. Brady didn't even have a nfl arm coming out.

I know these discussions stem from my evaluation of bridgewater. I thought he was the best pro prospect as a sophmore. I feel good about what I watch on him as a qb talent. Not to mention,unlike a lot of these spread,bubble screen qbs, he comes to the los with 3 plays. His fbi is off the charts and that will be the lure of the next texans head coach.

and what about that Landry Jones floater?

DexmanC
12-07-2013, 08:57 PM
From what I've watched of Teddy Bridgewater...

He has more physical tools than David Garrard (referenced him due to his display of toughness,) and a mind for the game like Byron Leftwich. He has almost no NFL talent around him, except MAYBE his favorite receiver, #9. When they play big schools, he's shown he's belonged.

Is he a #1 pick?

If the Texans are holding that pick, they have no choice but to take him.

mussop
12-07-2013, 09:55 PM
and what about that Landry Jones floater?

What about it?

Jackie Chiles
12-07-2013, 11:22 PM
From what I've watched of Teddy Bridgewater...

He has more physical tools than David Garrard (referenced him due to his display of toughness,) and a mind for the game like Byron Leftwich. He has almost no NFL talent around him, except MAYBE his favorite receiver, #9. When they play big schools, he's shown he's belonged.

Is he a #1 pick?

If the Texans are holding that pick, they have no choice but to take him.

I'm on board with the Bridgewater pick at #1, why are you trying to scare everyone else off by mentioning Garrard and Leftwich in the same sentence?

htownfan32
12-07-2013, 11:27 PM
I'm on board with the Bridgewater pick at #1, why are you trying to scare everyone else off by mentioning Garrard and Leftwich in the same sentence?

You don't know Dex's posting history very well do you?

Blake
12-09-2013, 01:02 PM
Ive seen enough to know Teddy is ready for the NFL. He has an above average throwing motion. He is athletic enough to keep plays alive with his legs, but doesnt resort to running it whenever there is pressure as he keeps his eyes downfield. He is a great example of a hybrid QB who has a nice blend of pocket passer skills and athleticism.

The Texans would be wise to take Bridgewater who can compete for the starting job against Keenum, then come back in round 2 and grab an offenseive lineman.

beerlover
12-09-2013, 01:20 PM
Ive seen enough to know Teddy is ready for the NFL. He has an above average throwing motion. He is athletic enough to keep plays alive with his legs, but doesnt resort to running it whenever there is pressure as he keeps his eyes downfield. He is a great example of a hybrid QB who has a nice blend of pocket passer skills and athleticism.

The Texans would be wise to take Bridgewater who can compete for the starting job against Keenum, then come back in round 2 and grab an offenseive lineman.

I agree with you but have one question in regards to Tackle position, what is your position on Brennan Williams, who when healthy is = to another 2nd rd OT prospect?

Blake
12-09-2013, 02:35 PM
I agree with you but have one question in regards to Tackle position, what is your position on Brennan Williams, who when healthy is = to another 2nd rd OT prospect?

I thought about that for awhile. There are some guard/tackle prospects out there that I think would be a good fit for either RT if BW does not come back healthy, and LG if he does come back healthy.

Corrosion
12-09-2013, 02:37 PM
I agree with you but have one question in regards to Tackle position, what is your position on Brennan Williams, who when healthy is = to another 2nd rd OT prospect?

Didn't Williams have microfracture surgery ?! He may never be the same after that ... I wouldn't count on him ever playing a down , if he does good but I just wouldn't count on it.

I think you have to upgrade the RT and LG spots one way or another - Draft or FA.

htownfan32
12-09-2013, 02:37 PM
I agree with you but have one question in regards to Tackle position, what is your position on Brennan Williams, who when healthy is = to another 2nd rd OT prospect?

CnD has been warning against Williams ever playing well after a microfracture surgery.

Rey
12-09-2013, 02:39 PM
I would've never taken Williams to be a tackle. Dude has guard written all over him.

WolverineFan
12-09-2013, 02:42 PM
Didn't Williams have microfracture surgery ?! He may never be the same after that ... I wouldn't count on him ever playing a down , if he does good but I just wouldn't count on it.

I think you have to upgrade the RT and LG spots one way or another - Draft or FA.

RT will be upgraded next year regardless because, whoever the new coach may be, he certainly won't be starting Derek Newton.

The Pencil Neck
12-09-2013, 03:07 PM
RT will be upgraded next year regardless because, whoever the new coach may be, he certainly won't be starting Derek Newton.

If our new coach starts Derek Newton at RT, I'm going to laugh.

It will be the maniacal, hysterical laugh of someone losing their tenuous grip on sanity but I will laugh.

Blake
12-09-2013, 04:09 PM
If our new coach starts Derek Newton at RT, I'm going to laugh.

It will be the maniacal, hysterical laugh of someone losing their tenuous grip on sanity but I will laugh.

http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/965kvki.com/files/2012/08/greatest-evil-laughs.jpg

thunderkyss
12-10-2013, 11:44 AM
RT will be upgraded next year regardless because, whoever the new coach may be, he certainly won't be starting Derek Newton.

Ryan Harris hasn't been much of an upgrade. Just saying, it could get worse.

WolverineFan
12-10-2013, 11:52 AM
Ryan Harris hasn't been much of an upgrade. Just saying, it could get worse.

If Newton is not the starter next year then I don't see any way it could get worse. There was a thread a few days ago with profootball focus rankings for the Texans offense. IIRC, Newton was 74th out of 78 OT's. Harris was 43rd.

Harris is an average to slightly below average starting RT. Newton is an outright bottom of the league RT. We could sign a vet off the street next year to play RT and, while he may not play well, he can't be worse.

Texian
12-10-2013, 06:12 PM
I'm not sure that Teddy Bridgewater will be as good an NFL QB as Geno Smith.

......Teddy Bridgewater, 6'3" 205.....................Geno Smith, 6'2" 218

Pass Yards: 9370..........................................11,6 62
TDs:..........69.................................. ............98
INTs...........24................................. .............21
RAT:..........169.7............................... ............163.9
Comp. %:....70.2%....................................... ..71.2%

TexansSeminole
12-10-2013, 06:15 PM
I'm not sure that Teddy Bridgewater will be as good an NFL QB as Geno Smith.

......Teddy Bridgewater, 6'3" 205.....................Geno Smith, 6'2" 218

Pass Yards: 9370..........................................11,6 62
TDs:..........69.................................. ............98
INTs...........24................................. .............21
RAT:..........169.7............................... ............163.9
Comp. %:....70.2%....................................... ..71.2%

Again, completely different systems.

Texian
12-10-2013, 06:49 PM
Again, completely different systems.

Not as different as Bridgewater fans want/wish it were.

TexansSeminole
12-10-2013, 08:00 PM
Not as different as Bridgewater fans want/wish it were.

I don't agree but don't feel like having another pointless argument with you over it, so agree to disagree.

WolverineFan
12-10-2013, 09:44 PM
Again, completely different systems.

No point trying bro. He's either trolling or just doesn't get it so don't waste your time.

TexansFTW
12-10-2013, 11:21 PM
Teddy B is the truth. Everyone is going to see it. He definitely needs to mass up a little bit, but I love this dude's game.

Maybe Mario Williams was the best pick in 2006, but we never won a single playoff game with him on the team (2011 didn't count cause he was on IR).

I don't want a 4 year D-Line rental while we try to figure out the QB situation.

I want Teddy B now and never being in the situation where we can draft a #1 QB in the draft for another 10+ years.

bhsman
12-11-2013, 12:07 AM
Not as different as Bridgewater fans want/wish it were.

Meh, I'm a Clowney fan and even I'd admit the analogy is a stretch. Geno played a spread system that rarely ran the ball, so he accumulated passing yards, whereas Bridgewater uses more of a pro system. That's not a knock on Geno, as Teddy was also the centerpiece of his respective offense, just that Bridgewater's accomplishments are pretty praiseworthy as a result.

Texian
12-11-2013, 06:32 AM
I don't agree but don't feel like having another pointless argument with you over it, so agree to disagree.

No point trying bro. He's either trolling or just doesn't get it so don't waste your time.

Check out the number rushing attempts vs passing attempts for West Virgina and Louisville for Geno and Teddy's respective careers. You'll find they're pretty darn close. It's a whole lot closer than Bridgewater fans want or wish it to be. THEY'RE VERY SIMILAR

TexansFTW
12-11-2013, 09:04 AM
Check out the number rushing attempts vs passing attempts for West Virgina and Louisville for Geno and Teddy's respective careers. You'll find they're pretty darn close. It's a whole lot closer than Bridgewater fans want or wish it to be. THEY'RE VERY SIMILAR

I'm not seeing it at all.

Teddy B throws over 100 times less in their last 2 years in college.

What WV ran and what Louisville ran look absolutely nothing alike.

WV was a gimmicky, high powered offense where a WR rushed the ball for over 600 yards. Geno Smith was much closer to Texas Tech offense than he is Louisville offense.

As for their rushes, if you use that argument you might as well say that Teddy B rushes a similar amount of times to any pocket QB, the only comparison I see between Teddy B and Geno is they are both black QBs.

Teddy extends plays with his feet while still looking downfield for his playmakers which I love, a lot like Ben Ro (minus taking the big hits every play). If you are going to compare Teddy to any quarterback who has a question mark next to what they will do in the NFL ranks it's Blake Bortles, which you've come out and said you love.

Also, don't fall in love with that semi-rushing ability of Bortles. That 4.9 speed and RG3 size will lead to a lot of missed games if he doesn't give that up quick.

thunderkyss
12-11-2013, 09:24 AM
Check out the number rushing attempts vs passing attempts for West Virgina and Louisville for Geno and Teddy's respective careers. You'll find they're pretty darn close. It's a whole lot closer than Bridgewater fans want or wish it to be. THEY'RE VERY SIMILAR

College stats mean little, in and of themselves. In my mind. What I want to know, is he better on his last day than he was on his first day.

Johnny Manziel. I love watching the kid play. But... he's the same guy who started his first game. He isn't any better now than he was then. Not in the way he approaches the game, not in the way he commands his offense, not in the way he breaks down a defense.

All of these kids have talent. What they do with it is what separates an NFL starter from a career back up.

Texian
12-11-2013, 09:41 AM
Johnny Manziel. I love watching the kid play. But... he's the same guy who started his first game. He isn't any better now than he was then. Not in the way he approaches the game, not in the way he commands his offense, not in the way he breaks down a defense.

All of these kids have talent. What they do with it is what separates an NFL starter from a career back up.

Texas A&M UniversityVerified account ‏@TAMU

RT @aggiefootball: Take a look at Johnny Manziel's passing improvements since his Heisman winning campaign #12thman pic.twitter.com/7JKpOOepyA

https://twitter.com/TAMU/status/409842438229204992

b0ng
12-11-2013, 10:07 AM
I think (And have thought pretty much all along) that Bridgewater was the man since about bowl season earlier this year (2013). I think he's the guy that goes #1 overall and whether that's to the Texans or whomever, I think he has the tools to succeed in the NFL. Bad coaching can ruin great prospects though so who knows what his career will be like.

BullNation4Life
12-11-2013, 10:21 AM
If Texans draft Bridgwater #1 over all, they will have got it wrong 3 different times they have had the #1 pick in the Draft.

None of the QB's in this draft are worthy of the #1 draft pick. If they draft him, this is what think is going to happen over the next 4 years...

Year 1 - Bridgewater makes some plays, shows flashes of brilliance, Texans are 6-10 and give fans hope

Year 2 - Defenses now are corralling Bridgewater, he has a sophomore slump, Texans are 7-9, fans still have hope

Year 3 - Bridgewater has not improved from previous year, making same mistakes in reads as he did his first 2 years, fans starting to doubt
Texans go 6-10

Year 4 - Bridgewater is replaced by mid season, contract not extended and he is a back up for another team the next year and the Texans are looking for another QB
Texans are 5-11 and coach is replaced, again...

By year 3, I will have moved on from the Texans until Bob McNair pulls his head out of his arse and learns how to get a real coach and not some morel standard...

PapaL
12-11-2013, 10:37 AM
If Texans draft Bridgwater #1 over all, they will have got it wrong 3 different times they have had the #1 pick in the Draft.

None of the QB's in this draft are worthy of the #1 draft pick. If they draft him, this is what think is going to happen over the next 4 years...

Year 1 - Bridgewater makes some plays, shows flashes of brilliance, Texans are 6-10 and give fans hope

Year 2 - Defenses now are corralling Bridgewater, he has a sophomore slump, Texans are 7-9, fans still have hope

Year 3 - Bridgewater has not improved from previous year, making same mistakes in reads as he did his first 2 years, fans starting to doubt
Texans go 6-10

Year 4 - Bridgewater is replaced by mid season, contract not extended and he is a back up for another team the next year and the Texans are looking for another QB
Texans are 5-11 and coach is replaced, again...

By year 3, I will have moved on from the Texans until Bob McNair pulls his head out of his arse and learns how to get a real coach and not some morel standard...

HWSBN - Should have taken Peppers; obvious.

Mario - should have taken who exactly? Bush and VY were the "top" choices at the time.

I'm not saying Bridewater is the answer but saying we screwed up every #1 is kind of far fetched especially when Young and Bush were the other options.

BullNation4Life
12-11-2013, 10:45 AM
HWSBN - Should have taken Peppers; obvious.

Mario - should have taken who exactly? Bush and VY were the "top" choices at the time.

I'm not saying Bridewater is the answer but saying we screwed up every #1 is kind of far fetched especially when Young and Bush were the other options.

Ok I retract that statement, 2006, in retrospect, they got it "right" not by picking the best player, but by lack of options, being VY is out of the league and Bush is on his 3rd team. Mario had a very lack luster career here in Houston.

Personally, I think the franchise QB the Texans wanted went back to Oregon and now they are in a position to either take the player they liked 2nd or get a vet to play QB and trade back...

Problem is you don't take the guy you liked 2nd #1 overall. Unless Bridgewater turns into another Warren Moon, which I guess could happen, I don't think he is worth the #1 pick.

Texian
12-11-2013, 10:57 AM
Geno Smith was much closer to Texas Tech offense than he is Louisville offense.

As for their rushes, if you use that argument you might as well say that Teddy B rushes a similar amount of times to any pocket QB, the only comparison I see between Teddy B and Geno is they are both black QBs.

Teddy extends plays with his feet while still looking downfield for his playmakers which I love, a lot like Ben Ro (minus taking the big hits every play). If you are going to compare Teddy to any quarterback who has a question mark next to what they will do in the NFL ranks it's Blake Bortles, which you've come out and said you love.

Also, don't fall in love with that semi-rushing ability of Bortles. That 4.9 speed and RG3 size will lead to a lot of missed games if he doesn't give that up quick.

Leach last 3 years at Texas Tech:
Rushing Attempts = 848 = 30% ; Passing Attempts = 1967 = 70%

Louisville last 3 years:
Rushing Attempts = 1352 = 52%; Passing Attempts = 1231 = 48%

West Virginia Geno's last 3 years:
Rushing Attempts = 1404 = 49%; Passing attempts = 1461 = 51%

RUSHING
Teddy Bridgewater (3 yrs) = rushing yds 146 yd/5 TDs
Geno Smith (3 yrs) = rushing yds 335 yds/4 TDs
Blake Bortles (2 yrs) = rushing yds 464/13 TDs
Andrew Luck (3 yrs) = 957 yds/7 TDs

Rushing and Passing attempts are team totals not individual. Teddy and Geno were part of a much more balanced offense than any Leach "Air Raid" Red Raider team.

TexansFTW
12-11-2013, 10:58 AM
When you have a "solid", not great, but solid team all around and your biggest glaring weakness is at the QB position AND you have the #1 pick with a franchise QB available, there is no decision.

I see the arguments here that Teddy B is not "franchise" material, but most reputable "expert" draft guys I follow disagree. Regardless, it's not a decision, it's a mandate. Just don't give the guy #8 to wear on his jersey.

In response to your playing out the next 4 seasons scenario, I got one for you too, I added a 5th year for good measure as well. In this scenario we draft Jadaveon Clowney:

Year Wins Losses Ties Playoffs
2010 6 10 0 Nope
2009 9 7 0 Nope
2008 8 8 0 Nope
2007 8 8 0 Nope
2006 6 10 0 Nope

Also in this scenario, the coach will get a contract extension after 2009 and be rewarded with many more undeserved seasons and NOT be let go.

The above scenario I did was a real life example, you might recognize it.

michaelm
12-11-2013, 11:13 AM
Texas A&M UniversityVerified account ‏@TAMU

RT @aggiefootball: Take a look at Johnny Manziel's passing improvements since his Heisman winning campaign #12thman pic.twitter.com/7JKpOOepyA

https://twitter.com/TAMU/status/409842438229204992


INT: 2012-9 / 2013-13
RAW QBR: 2012-86.4 / 2013-78.9
ADJ QBR: 2012-90.5 / 2013-84.5
Rushing: 2012-1410 / 2013-686
Rush TD: 2012-21 / 2013-8

TexansFTW
12-11-2013, 11:22 AM
Leach last 3 years at Texas Tech:
Rushing Attempts = 848 = 30% ; Passing Attempts = 1967 = 70%

Louisville last 3 years:
Rushing Attempts = 1352 = 52%; Passing Attempts = 1231 = 48%

West Virginia Geno's last 3 years:
Rushing Attempts = 1404 = 49%; Passing attempts = 1461 = 51%

RUSHING
Teddy Bridgewater (3 yrs) = rushing yds 146 yd/5 TDs
Geno Smith (3 yrs) = rushing yds 335 yds/4 TDs
Blake Bortles (2 yrs) = rushing yds 464/13 TDs
Andrew Luck (3 yrs) = 957 yds/7 TDs

Rushing and Passing attempts are team totals not individual. Teddy and Geno were part of a much more balanced offense than any Leach Red Raider team.

1st year of the 3 years skews the stats quite a bit. Those years didn't really matter. Let's only take away from them that both players grew as QBs and developed from their first year to their 2nd years.

Teddy B (last 2 years) = 801 pass attempts

Bortles (last 2 years) = 750 Pass attempts

Geno S (last 2 years) = 1044 pass attempts

Big difference. Did I mention Geno had a WR who had 70+ rushing attempts his final year there. You only show Bortles 2 years of stats, but he had a 3rd year too, just wasn't good enough to outright beat a guy who will probably be an accountant somewhere next year. BTW, all stats can be manipulated to prove a point.

I know Bortles rushes more, but he's more comparable to Teddy B than Geno is what I'm saying. If he thinks he can run w/ similar success like he's had in college as a pro he will find himself in Brian Hoyer's shoes on a training table. Andrew Luck has 10 more pounds and runs a 40 ~0.3 seconds faster too, the comparison between those two's running styles is non-existent IMO.

Corrosion
12-11-2013, 11:28 AM
When you have a "solid", not great, but solid team all around and your biggest glaring weakness is at the QB position AND you have the #1 pick with a franchise QB available, there is no decision.

I don't disagree with the thought process at all. Either you have a franchise QB or you don't. This team doesn't.

I see the arguments here that Teddy B is not "franchise" material, but most reputable "expert" draft guys I follow disagree. Regardless, it's not a decision, it's a mandate. Just don't give the guy #8 to wear on his jersey.

Im not going to say "Bridgewater wont be a franchise QB" but .... I just don't see him being one of the top 5 elite QB's in the league in the future.

What I see is a guy much like Schaub at his best , a step or two below those elite QB's.

You can get that type of QB without spending the #1 overall pick in the draft on him.

As for all those "experts" .... they have been wrong many many times in the past. Most of them are self serving in their analysis of these players - looking for clicks / facetime . Hell many of them don't have any real football experience.

In response to your playing out the next 4 seasons scenario, I got one for you too, I added a 5th year for good measure as well. In this scenario we draft Jadaveon Clowney:

Year Wins Losses Ties Playoffs
2010 6 10 0 Nope
2009 9 7 0 Nope
2008 8 8 0 Nope
2007 8 8 0 Nope
2006 6 10 0 Nope

Also in this scenario, the coach will get a contract extension after 2009 and be rewarded with many more undeserved seasons and NOT be let go.

The above scenario I did was a real life example, you might recognize it.

Yeah , and that so called franchise QB we could have drafted instead of .... Clowney in this scenario is .... out of the league. :vincepalm:

TexansFTW
12-11-2013, 11:40 AM
What I see is a guy much like Schaub at his best , a step or two below those elite QB's.

Completely disagree, I value your opinion though, so that's fine.

You can get that type of QB without spending the #1 overall pick in the draft on him.

You can, your probability of doing so successfully just decreases exponentially though, and I think it's safe to say that is THE most important position in the new NFL.

As for all those "experts" .... they have been wrong many many times in the past. Most of them are self serving in their analysis of these players - looking for clicks / facetime . Hell many of them don't have any real football experience.

I hear you, I'm not going off of ESPN though if that matters.


Yeah , and that so called franchise QB we could have drafted instead of .... Clowney in this scenario is .... out of the league. :vincepalm:

Don't get me wrong here, I agree with your point in theory, but my hands are tied and I had to do this after you facepalmed me...

2007 - 10-6 - playoff appearance

Young was never gonna be a Texan though, and Young is not Bridge by a long shot. Young is closer to Tebow than he is Bridge.

I've been a thread hog lately, I need to try to back off a little. Yall have a good one.

PapaL
12-11-2013, 12:06 PM
Ok I retract that statement, 2006, in retrospect, they got it "right" not by picking the best player, but by lack of options, being VY is out of the league and Bush is on his 3rd team. Mario had a very lack luster career here in Houston.

Personally, I think the franchise QB the Texans wanted went back to Oregon and now they are in a position to either take the player they liked 2nd or get a vet to play QB and trade back...

Problem is you don't take the guy you liked 2nd #1 overall. Unless Bridgewater turns into another Warren Moon, which I guess could happen, I don't think he is worth the #1 pick.

It just seems that every year we pick #1 there's a QB and DE slotted as the "best player". Both QBs, in hindsight, have been a disaster and the DE's have been Great and...$100M to Bills. If our short history is any indicator on the future success of these two, I'm taking Clowney hahaha. I can't deal with another HWSBN scenario...then again another eyar of Case/Schaub would be bad too.

Texian
12-11-2013, 12:26 PM
Teddy B throws over 100 times less in their last 2 years in college.

the only comparison I see between Teddy B and Geno is they are both black QBs.

If you are going to compare Teddy to any quarterback who has a question mark next to what they will do in the NFL ranks it's Blake Bortles, which you've come out and said you love.

Also, don't fall in love with that semi-rushing ability of Bortles. That 4.9 speed and RG3 size will lead to a lot of missed games if he doesn't give that up quick.

Black has nothing to do with it. I did compare Bridgewater's arm to Landry Jones. Both throw a very similar "FLOATER".

I'm guessing Bortles runs closer to a 4.7 than a 4.9. Mettenberger yes, Bortles, I don't think so.

Geno ran a 4.56 and I'm guessing Bridgewater will be closer to a 4.65.

Bortles is the same size as Luck, Both are 6'4" Bortles weighs 230, Luck 234. RGIII 6'2" 223

Teddy B (last 2 years) = 801 pass attempts

Bortles (last 2 years) = 750 Pass attempts

Geno S (last 2 years) = 1044 pass attempts

Big difference.

Not really, over the course of two years that is a difference of 2 passes per quarter. However Leach and WVU ran more plays than Louisville (up tempo, no huddle) so that accounts for the 2 passing plays per quarter.

BullNation4Life
12-11-2013, 01:00 PM
It just seems that every year we pick #1 there's a QB and DE slotted as the "best player". Both QBs, in hindsight, have been a disaster and the DE's have been Great and...$100M to Bills. If our short history is any indicator on the future success of these two, I'm taking Clowney hahaha. I can't deal with another HWSBN scenario...then again another eyar of Case/Schaub would be bad too.

Here is something to ponder, what if HWSNBN's brother has a great training camp, Texans pass on him solely because of the name, and he ends up in like Tennessee and is the best QB out of the draft and taking the Titans to the playoffs every year, killing the Texans for the next 10 years...

Talk about irony...

TexansSeminole
12-11-2013, 01:16 PM
Not really, over the course of two years that is a difference of 2 passes per quarter. However Leach and WVU ran more plays than Louisville (up tempo, no huddle) so that accounts for the 2 passing plays per quarter.

Oh, you know, a 30% increase is not that much of an increase. Lol, too funny.

I try not to engage you, but you are just so ridiculous it's like impulse for me to respond.

Texian
12-11-2013, 02:17 PM
Oh, you know, a 30% increase is not that much of an increase. Lol, too funny.

I try not to engage you, but you are just so ridiculous it's like impulse for me to respond.

Apparently you're having difficulty understanding up tempo and no huddle means more plays. That doesn't necessarily effect the balance of the offense. You're in college, you can't understand this and you think this is funny? No it's not really funny or ridiculous, it's worrisome. There are a couple of reason why WVU threw a tad more than they ran but if you can't understand up tempo no huddle I doubt you could understand those reasons. I'd just be wasting my time to post them. And remember I respond to post in a manner in which I'm responded to. That's why I am exchanging pleasantries in a similar manner as you. You love my posts and you know it. It's the first thing you look for when you sign in. :)
Don't you have a kegger you need to attend?

TexansSeminole
12-11-2013, 02:28 PM
Lol:clap:bravo

TexansFTW
12-11-2013, 04:01 PM
Black has nothing to do with it. I did compare Bridgewater's arm to Landry Jones. Both throw a very similar "FLOATER".

I'm guessing Bortles runs closer to a 4.7 than a 4.9. Mettenberger yes, Bortles, I don't think so.

Geno ran a 4.56 and I'm guessing Bridgewater will be closer to a 4.65.

Bortles is the same size as Luck, Both are 6'4" Bortles weighs 230, Luck 234. RGIII 6'2" 223



Not really, over the course of two years that is a difference of 2 passes per quarter. However Leach and WVU ran more plays than Louisville (up tempo, no huddle) so that accounts for the 2 passing plays per quarter.

1. 4.78 – I took his 40 high to skew the stat in my favor. I doubt you’d disagree with that style of thinking

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=105489&draftyear=2015&genpos=QB

2. I highly doubt you “guessed” a 4.65. Regardless, he is faster, but prefers not to run. This is a great quality for a guy that loves to look downfield to find the true playmakers on the football field instead of scrambling for 5 yards and getting smashed.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=119428&draftyear=2015&genpos=QB

3. Luck is 6’4” and 240.

Every place I see that gives close accuracy has Bortles at 6’3” and 227-230.

4. Finally, being a super up tempo, no huddle team completely invalidates the point they run similar offenses IMO. That’s just as big of a difference as run/pass ratio, or taking snaps under center as opposed to spread out wide in the shotgun.

thunderkyss
12-11-2013, 04:04 PM
Here is something to ponder, what if HWSNBN's brother has a great training camp, Texans pass on him solely because of the name, and he ends up in like Tennessee and is the best QB out of the draft and taking the Titans to the playoffs every year, killing the Texans for the next 10 years...

Talk about irony...

Who cares?

Is anyone talking about him being the best (http://profootball.scout.com/a.z?s=127&p=9&c=12&yr=2014&nid=83&lnid=124&rc=4&pid=10) QB in this class? The second best?

Chances are we're going to be selecting the first QB of the 2014 draft, maybe the second. Unless he's in that conversation, it doesn't matter. We should be drafting the best, or the second best QB prospect in this up coming draft.

If we're picking first or second, no one is going to fault the Texans for not picking the 5th/6th best QB in the draft.

BullNation4Life
12-11-2013, 04:54 PM
Who cares?

Is anyone talking about him being the best (http://profootball.scout.com/a.z?s=127&p=9&c=12&yr=2014&nid=83&lnid=124&rc=4&pid=10) QB in this class? The second best?

Chances are we're going to be selecting the first QB of the 2014 draft, maybe the second. Unless he's in that conversation, it doesn't matter. We should be drafting the best, or the second best QB prospect in this up coming draft.

If we're picking first or second, no one is going to fault the Texans for not picking the 5th/6th best QB in the draft.

First off pull the stick out of your ass and lighten the F up! The comment was in jest...

Second, after the Bowl games and combine, he very well could shoot right to the top of the draft board, then what smart ass? You gonna tell me the Texans are gonna pick Derek Carr #1 overall after the absolute debacle they had with his brother and helicopter father? NO F'ing WAY!

Just because they are not talking about him now, doesn't mean they won't be after the Senior Bowl or his workouts. Nobody was talking about Eric Fisher, I damn sure never heard of him, until AFTER the combine, where did he go again?

infantrycak
12-11-2013, 05:13 PM
Oh, you know, a 30% increase is not that much of an increase. Lol, too funny.

I try not to engage you, but you are just so ridiculous it's like impulse for me to respond.

LOL - he knows it is a significant increase which is why he broke it into quarters to make the number look small.

Apparently you're having difficulty understanding up tempo and no huddle means more plays.

Sure it does. That's why the Eagles are 10th in the league in offensive plays run and the Texans are 3rd. Even more to the point, the Eagles are 27th in passing plays and the Texans are 4th.

Why not just provide the # of plays and examine whether it accounts for the extra passes?

Texn4life
12-11-2013, 05:14 PM
INT: 2012-9 / 2013-13
RAW QBR: 2012-86.4 / 2013-78.9
ADJ QBR: 2012-90.5 / 2013-84.5
Rushing: 2012-1410 / 2013-686
Rush TD: 2012-21 / 2013-8

Not trying to prove or disprove what you're attempting to show here but QBR takes into account Quarterback rushing numbers which is why Manziel's numbers there show a decline. It doesn't really support the argument he hasn't developed as a passer. Its a Teddy B thread though so I won't even get into my thoughts on it.

Corrosion
12-11-2013, 05:26 PM
I guess my biggest issue with Bridgewater is his throwing mechanics , I see a rather long wind up with a slow release .... and he holds the ball somewhat low at times. Not as exaggerated as Tebow but a slow release none the less.

He can get away with that in college especially the level of competition he's faced on a regular basis but that dog wont hunt in the NFL. Any team that drafts him is going to have to clean up his mechanics ....

He definitely has a lot of tools to work with ... but he's got a lot of work to do to get to an NFL level.

powda
12-11-2013, 05:45 PM
Initial thoughts after watching limited film


Good athlete. Quick feet. I see a stronger then average arm ... not great but better then average. Good mobility while maintaining a pass first mindset and keeping his eyes down field. Stonger then his frame suggest. Solid poise...not elite. Sometimes sloppy mechanics. Ok accuracy. Has the arm downfield but placement seems general...lots of deep balls where defenders and safties have a chance at it...he's raw and could be molded with the right support system ...could be a franchise style qb but it won't happen overnight. Will need some time to grow. Playbook understanding appears average. Not as refined as sam Bradford comming out...not as gifted as rg3.

Corrosion
12-11-2013, 05:47 PM
Initial thoughts after watching limited film


I see a stronger then average arm ... not great but better then average. Good mobility while maintaining a pass first mindset and keeping his eyes down field. Solid poise...not elite. Sometimes sloppy mechanics. Ok accuracy. Has the arm downfield but placement seems general...lots of deep balls where defenders and safties have a chance at it...he's raw and could be molded with the right support system ...could be a franchise style qb but it won't happen overnight. Will need some time to grow. Playbook understanding appears average. Not as refined as sam Bradford comming out...not as gifted as rg3.

Yep .... lots of risk with a high potential reward.

Texian
12-11-2013, 05:51 PM
1. 4.78 – I took his 40 high to skew the stat in my favor. I doubt you’d disagree with that style of thinking

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=105489&draftyear=2015&genpos=QB

2. I highly doubt you “guessed” a 4.65. Regardless, he is faster, but prefers not to run. This is a great quality for a guy that loves to look downfield to find the true playmakers on the football field instead of scrambling for 5 yards and getting smashed.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=119428&draftyear=2015&genpos=QB

3. Luck is 6’4” and 240.

Every place I see that gives close accuracy has Bortles at 6’3” and 227-230.

4. Finally, being a super up tempo, no huddle team completely invalidates the point they run similar offenses IMO. That’s just as big of a difference as run/pass ratio, or taking snaps under center as opposed to spread out wide in the shotgun.

I would hope that your "style of thinking" is OBJECTIVE but since you're trying to skew numbers to YOUR FAVOR, sadly I can see that it's not. Objective thinking is absent any bias, prejudice, FAVOR, falling in love with or wishing or wanting a player to be good. Absent Objective Thinking is how mistakes are made and what gets people fired.

Luck at the Combine weighed 234. So Luck is a 1/2" taller and weighs 4 lbs more than Bortles.

powda
12-11-2013, 05:53 PM
Yep .... lots of risk with a high potential reward.

Would you agree he needs 3/4's to a full season of bench time before being what he can be? I know literally nothing about his mental make up , but the last thing I wanna do is "carr" him. I'd look for a journeyman qb to start if we draft him.

Corrosion
12-11-2013, 06:26 PM
Would you agree he needs 3/4's to a full season of bench time before being what he can be? I know literally nothing about his mental make up , but the last thing I wanna do is "carr" him. I'd look for a journeyman qb to start if we draft him.

I really cant answer that right now.

I'd have to evaluate his progress on many issues - absorption of the playbook , mechanics & footwork , progressions , reading defenses , understanding protection packages.

At this point , I wouldn't throw him to the wolves .... I'd put him behind a vet in preseason but for how long , I couldn't answer. He may be ready to start week one , it may be half or an entire season. There's a whole lot to learn about QB play in the NFL ....

powda
12-11-2013, 06:34 PM
I really cant answer that right now.

I'd have to evaluate his progress on many issues - absorption of the playbook , mechanics & footwork , progressions , reading defenses , understanding protection packages.

At this point , I wouldn't throw him to the wolves .... I'd put him behind a vet in preseason but for how long , I couldn't answer. He may be ready to start week one , it may be half or an entire season. There's a whole lot to learn about QB play in the NFL ....

I still want to see things like blitz pick ups or his success against top competition (completion percentage, etc.) I think we all agree he has good tools (not elite!) Personally I'm more concerned about who his oc and qb coach is going to be. Teddys success will be a joint effort. Right place/right time...can we get that just once?

bhsman
12-11-2013, 06:51 PM
Right place/right time...can we get that just once?

We can, but it doesn't necessarily have to be Teddy. One alternative is to get an injured prospect like Murray or Mettenberger (preferably the latter as his injury doesn't really hurt his playstyle and his arm strength can stretch the field) and have either Case or a vet QB like McCown play for a year/three-quarters of the season while picking up Clowney first overall/trading down for more defensive players. Improving the defense and offensive line is probably the best thing you can do for a young QB.

Corrosion
12-11-2013, 07:06 PM
We can, but it doesn't necessarily have to be Teddy. One alternative is to get an injured prospect like Murray or Mettenberger (preferably the latter as his injury doesn't really hurt his playstyle and his arm strength can stretch the field) and have either Case or a vet QB like McCown play for a year/three-quarters of the season while picking up Clowney first overall/trading down for more defensive players. Improving the defense and offensive line is probably the best thing you can do for a young QB.

Somehow I knew you would get :clown: into this conversation.

bhsman
12-11-2013, 07:11 PM
Somehow I knew you would get :clown: into this conversation.

Well, I'll turn that argument back on itself, then: It doesn't even have to be Clowney. Cleveland has two firsts, if we got those a minimum we could take a guy like Lewan at #7 and shore up the RT spot, or CJ Mosely or Khalil Mack and have a playmaker at ILB next to Cush, or even a guy like Mike Evans and have a Jimmy Graham-esque wideout.

Then, at Indy's ~25th overall pick we could get a guy like Trent Murphy to replace Ninja, an OT if we didn't grab Lewan, Tajh Boyd, or trade it back for more picks, etc.

My point is, this is a good draft to have #1 overall in. Lots of flexibility and a stacked talent pool.

Corrosion
12-11-2013, 07:16 PM
I still want to see things like blitz pick ups or his success against top competition (completion percentage, etc.) I think we all agree he has good tools (not elite!) Personally I'm more concerned about who his oc and qb coach is going to be. Teddys success will be a joint effort. Right place/right time...can we get that just once?



I do think he's an elite athlete with elite physical tools , that's the only reason I'd consider him as the #1 pick , those physical tools. No he doesn't have the biggest arm but its more than adequate with good touch and plenty of velocity.

What Im not sold on is level of competition , the mental part of the game (reading defenses , protections and others) as well as mechanics.
I really like how he moves around in the pocket ... kinda reminds me a bit of Brady there. But you do have to factor in the level of competition. His internal clock will have to speed up in the NFL.

No doubt about his success being a joint effort. The first thing they have to do is shorten that release and get him to keep the ball up high , ready to come out quickly.

Well, I'll turn that argument back on itself, then: It doesn't even have to be Clowney. Cleveland has two firsts, if we got those a minimum we could take a guy like Lewan at #7 and shore up the RT spot, or CJ Mosely or Khalil Mack and have a playmaker at ILB next to Cush, or even a guy like Mike Evans and have a Jimmy Graham-esque wideout.

Then, at Indy's ~25th overall pick we could get a guy like Trent Murphy to replace Ninja, an OT if we didn't grab Lewan, Tajh Boyd, or trade it back for more picks, etc.

My point is, this is a good draft to have #1 overall in. Lots of flexibility and a stacked talent pool.

That I wouldn't complain about .... I just don't like the idea of :clown: @ #1 with all the question marks surrounding him.

michaelm
12-11-2013, 07:19 PM
Not trying to prove or disprove what you're attempting to show here but QBR takes into account Quarterback rushing numbers which is why Manziel's numbers there show a decline. It doesn't really support the argument he hasn't developed as a passer. Its a Teddy B thread though so I won't even get into my thoughts on it.

Those stats were really posted to satisfy my need for objectivity. Clearly, the person who created that pretty Johnny Football graphic with only his positive statistics was biased. I only meant to present the stats to reflect the whole picture.

Texian
12-11-2013, 07:39 PM
LOL - he knows it is a significant increase which is why he broke it into quarters to make the number look small.



Sure it does. That's why the Eagles are 10th in the league in offensive plays run and the Texans are 3rd. Even more to the point, the Eagles are 27th in passing plays and the Texans are 4th.

Why not just provide the # of plays and examine whether it accounts for the extra passes?

For starters, I know the difference between the college game and the NFL. It's silly to compare the two. One or two additional passes per quarter does not make a BIG difference, it's even less if you include a full body of work. Of course the bias had to juggle the numbers to skew the numbers in their favor. Your Mr. research if you want to know the number of plays look them up, I have. I told you I am not your research assistant. Bottom line Geno Smith and Teddy Bridgewater played in a much more balanced offense than any Mike Leach "Air Raid" offense. Neither Teddy nor Geno came close to playing in a 70% passing offense. This should keep you LOL for awhile. :)

powda
12-11-2013, 08:23 PM
I do think he's an elite athlete with elite physical tools , that's the only reason I'd consider him as the #1 pick , those physical tools. No he doesn't have the biggest arm but its more than adequate with good touch and plenty of velocity.

What Im not sold on is level of competition , the mental part of the game (reading defenses , protections and others) as well as mechanics.
I really like how he moves around in the pocket ... kinda reminds me a bit of Brady there. But you do have to factor in the level of competition. His internal clock will have to speed up in the NFL.

No doubt about his success being a joint effort. The first thing they have to do is shorten that release and get him to keep the ball up high , ready to come out quickly.



That I wouldn't complain about .... I just don't like the idea of :clown: @ #1 with all the question marks surrounding him.

Elite is subjective. He doesn't have tools like vick, cam, luck, or 3. Perhaps thats unfair. I need to see more game managment etc. I've surely seen less of him then most of you. I think he COULD become a franchise qb...I'm just not as sold as you sound. I'm not so sold that I wouldn't take clowney or barr instead. Its a long process.

bah007
12-11-2013, 08:41 PM
I'm not sure that Teddy Bridgewater will be as good an NFL QB as Geno Smith.

......Teddy Bridgewater, 6'3" 205.....................Geno Smith, 6'2" 218

Pass Yards: 9370..........................................11,6 62
TDs:..........69.................................. ............98
INTs...........24................................. .............21
RAT:..........169.7............................... ............163.9
Comp. %:....70.2%....................................... ..71.2%

I know you're a stats guy. You have even tried to make the argument here that Bridgewater will not be as good as Geno Smith because his college stats aren't as good.


For starters, I know the difference between the college game and the NFL. It's silly to compare the two. One or two additional passes per quarter does not make a BIG difference, it's even less if you include a full body of work. Of course the bias had to juggle the numbers to skew the numbers in their favor. Your Mr. research if you want to know the number of plays look them up, I have. I told you I am not your research assistant. Bottom line Geno Smith and Teddy Bridgewater played in a much more balanced offense than any Mike Leach "Air Raid" offense. Neither Teddy nor Geno came close to playing in a 70% passing offense. This should keep you LOL for awhile. :)

And yet here, despite using college stats to try to boost your earlier argument, you now admit that it is silly to compare college to the pros (unless it suits your argument, apparently).

You then claim that a couple of extra pass attempts in each quarter does not make a big difference on the numbers. Let me illustrate that it does:

Geno Smith averaged over 8.1 YPA his senior year. With two extra pass attempts per quarter he would get eight extra attempts per game. We could safely assume an average of 8 yards per attempt on those eight throws, which would result in a net gain of 64 yards per game. Over the course of a 12 game season that would lead to a net gain of over 750 passing yards, far from insignificant.

And I'm sure you took all of that into consideration when you tried to make your statistical argument earlier, since it quite clearly bothers you when other posters try to skew the numbers into their favor.

Honoring Earl 34
12-11-2013, 08:44 PM
I know you're a stats guy. You have even tried to make the argument here that Bridgewater will not be as good as Geno Smith because his college stats aren't as good.




And yet here, despite using college stats to try to boost your earlier argument, you now admit that it is silly to compare college to the pros (unless it suits your argument, apparently).

You then claim that a couple of extra pass attempts in each quarter does not make a big difference on the numbers. Let me illustrate that it does:

Geno Smith averaged over 8.1 YPA his senior year. With two extra pass attempts per quarter he would get eight extra attempts per game. We could safely assume an average of 8 yards per attempt on those eight throws, which would result in a net gain of 64 yards per game. Over the course of a 12 game season that would lead to a net gain of over 750 passing yards, far from insignificant.

And I'm sure you took all of that into consideration when you tried to make your statistical argument earlier, since it quite clearly bothers you when other posters try to skew the numbers into their favor.

Texian = Uncle Nate

Texian
12-11-2013, 08:56 PM
I know you're a stats guy. You have even tried to make the argument here that Bridgewater will not be as good as Geno Smith because his college stats aren't as good.




And yet here, despite using college stats to try to boost your earlier argument, you now admit that it is silly to compare college to the pros (unless it suits your argument, apparently).

You then claim that a couple of extra pass attempts in each quarter does not make a big difference on the numbers. Let me illustrate that it does:

Geno Smith averaged over 8.1 YPA his senior year. With two extra pass attempts per quarter he would get eight extra attempts per game. We could safely assume an average of 8 yards per attempt on those eight throws, which would result in a net gain of 64 yards per game. Over the course of a 12 game season that would lead to a net gain of over 750 passing yards, far from insignificant.

And I'm sure you took all of that into consideration when you tried to make your statistical argument earlier, since it quite clearly bothers you when other posters try to skew the numbers into their favor.

First, you're wrong, I never said Bridgewater would be worse than Geno, I expect Bridgewater to be on par or equal to Geno. That is what started this all in the first place. My biggest complaint against Teddy is he throws an air ball on his deep pass. (AKA Landry Jones) I never compared any Geno NFL stats to Teddy's ONLY Geno's college stats were posted. I don't know where you got that. You must be in love with Teddy or just looking for an argument.

As to your analysis, let me try and make this as simple as I can. When one team runs more offensive plays than another team, there is a very high probability there will be more passing plays and more passing yards by the team that ran more offensive plays. Their offenses are still similarly balanced and still not any thing close to Mike Leach's "Air Raid" 70% passing Offense.

If that doesn't work try this. It doesn't matter whether they ran 100 offensive plays or 1000, Geno and Teddy were much closer to 50% passing plays than Mike Leach's 70% passing plays.

steelbtexan
12-11-2013, 09:00 PM
HWSBN - Should have taken Peppers; obvious.

Mario - should have taken who exactly? Bush and VY were the "top" choices at the time.

I'm not saying Bridewater is the answer but saying we screwed up every #1 is kind of far fetched especially when Young and Bush were the other options.

Ngata?

bhsman
12-11-2013, 09:02 PM
Ngata?

Maybe not the sexiest pick at #1 overall, though with hindsight, yeah, that'd be a pretty nice grab. Ngata's one of my favorite players, anyway...

powda
12-11-2013, 09:03 PM
Ngata?

Cherry picking. At the time he was "roughly" a top ten pick. Now? I'd agree wholeheartedly.

bah007
12-11-2013, 09:10 PM
I'm not sure that Teddy Bridgewater will be as good an NFL QB as Geno Smith.

......Teddy Bridgewater, 6'3" 205.....................Geno Smith, 6'2" 218

Pass Yards: 9370..........................................11,6 62
TDs:..........69.................................. ............98
INTs...........24................................. .............21
RAT:..........169.7............................... ............163.9
Comp. %:....70.2%....................................... ..71.2%

First, you're wrong, I never said Bridgewater would be worse than Geno, I expect Bridgewater to be on par or equal to Geno. That is what started this all in the first place. My biggest complaint against Teddy is he throws an air ball on his deep pass. (AKA Landry Jones) I never compared any Geno NFL stats to Teddy's ONLY Geno's college stats were posted. I don't know where you got that. You must be in love with Teddy or just looking for an argument.

As to your analysis, let me try and make this as simple as I can. When one team runs more offensive plays than another team, there is a very high probability there will be more passing plays and more passing yards by the team that ran more offensive plays. Their offenses are still similarly balanced and still not any thing close to Mike Leach's "Air Raid" 70% passing Offense.

I never once mentioned the Air Raid. You are the one who compared the two QBs college stats as part of your argument that you're "not sure that Teddy Bridgewater will be as good an NFL QB as Geno Smith."

In one post you use college stats to support your argument and then in a later post you say that comparisons between college and NFL are silly. Which is it?

As for your analysis in this thread, simplicity isn't an issue. In fact, your take couldn't be more simple.

steelbtexan
12-11-2013, 09:10 PM
Ok I retract that statement, 2006, in retrospect, they got it "right" not by picking the best player, but by lack of options, being VY is out of the league and Bush is on his 3rd team. Mario had a very lack luster career here in Houston.

Personally, I think the franchise QB the Texans wanted went back to Oregon and now they are in a position to either take the player they liked 2nd or get a vet to play QB and trade back...

Problem is you don't take the guy you liked 2nd #1 overall. Unless Bridgewater turns into another Warren Moon, which I guess could happen, I don't think he is worth the #1 pick.

I hope for the Texans sake and my sanity if Bridgewater is drafted he doesn't turn into another Moon. I cant take many more Buffalo/Denver/Kansas City playoff choke jobs.

WolverineFan
12-11-2013, 09:16 PM
First, you're wrong, I never said Bridgewater would be worse than Geno, I expect Bridgewater to be on par or equal to Geno. That is what started this all in the first place. My biggest complaint against Teddy is he throws an air ball on his deep pass. (AKA Landry Jones) I never compared any Geno NFL stats to Teddy's ONLY Geno's college stats were posted. I don't know where you got that. You must be in love with Teddy or just looking for an argument.

As to your analysis, let me try and make this as simple as I can. When one team runs more offensive plays than another team, there is a very high probability there will be more passing plays and more passing yards by the team that ran more offensive plays. Their offenses are still similarly balanced and still not any thing close to Mike Leach's "Air Raid" 70% passing Offense.

If that doesn't work try this. It doesn't matter whether they ran 100 offensive plays or 1000, Geno and Teddy were much closer to 50% passing plays than Mike Leach's 70% passing plays.

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view3/3383434/troll-dance-o.gif

powda
12-11-2013, 09:18 PM
I hope for the Texans sake and my sanity if Bridgewater is drafted he doesn't turn into another Moon. I cant take many more Buffalo/Denver/Kansas City playoff choke jobs.

I'd be thrilled with another moon. Those chokes didn't happen single handidly. It was a group effort of monumental proportions to do what they did.

bhsman
12-11-2013, 09:30 PM
I hope for the Texans sake and my sanity if Bridgewater is drafted he doesn't turn into another Moon. I cant take many more Buffalo/Denver/Kansas City playoff choke jobs.

I'd be ecstatic if we got another Warren Moon.

Texian
12-11-2013, 09:40 PM
In one post you use college stats to support your argument and then in a later post you say that comparisons between college and NFL are silly. Which is it?

First thing is let's put your question back in it's original context. That way it will less confusing for you. Where I said comparing NFL and college was silly was Cak's attempt in comparing the number of plays an NFL Team runs vs number of plays a College Team runs. Your basic Apples and Oranges. Comparing the balance of one College Team's Offensive plays to another College Team's balance of Offensive plays is not only apples to apples but it's the same kind of apple.

leebigeztx
12-11-2013, 09:41 PM
Texian comparing bridgewater to geno is retarded. The biggest issue most people had with geno were the passes behind the los. Same with the big guy in denver whos name slips my mind now. Ive never read anyone compare bridgewater to geno or landry jones. Yep, the same landry jones who always cracked under pressure. Everything and 90 percent of people who make comparison say 6'3 russell wilson or aaron rodgers. Even if you thought he could be a taller russell wilson or aaron rodgers and you thought clowney could benthe next peppers, who will help you win more games?

For every example of david carr as most like to bring up, I can bring up ben and rivers,ryan and flacco. Point is,its a risk because as ive said,we are talking about 21 yr old kids. There are no safe picks or ones with less risk per se. Steve emtman never missed a game in pop warner,jr high,or college, but he got hurt soon as he signed his contract.

Texian
12-11-2013, 09:41 PM
http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view3/3383434/troll-dance-o.gif

Trolling again? or just back from the kegger? or both?

Texian
12-11-2013, 09:45 PM
retarded.

Is that the best you got? I would've thought your education could do much better than retarded. Guess not.

infantrycak
12-11-2013, 09:56 PM
Where I said comparing NFL and college was silly was Cak's attempt in comparing the number of plays an NFL Team runs vs number of plays a College Team runs. Your basic Apples and Oranges.

What is stupid is screaming apples and oranges without understanding the point being made. To spell that out one more time for you - running a fast paced, no huddle offense doesn't necessarily mean you get more plays. College or NFL that is true.

WolverineFan
12-11-2013, 10:01 PM
Texian comparing bridgewater to geno is retarded. The biggest issue most people had with geno were the passes behind the los. Same with the big guy in denver whos name slips my mind now. Ive never read anyone compare bridgewater to geno or landry jones. Yep, the same landry jones who always cracked under pressure. Everything and 90 percent of people who make comparison say 6'3 russell wilson or aaron rodgers.

None of his comparisons make sense. I quit taking him serious a while ago because it's obvious that he's just bored and trying to start stuff with different posters to entertain himself.

His hate for Landry Jones is hilarious though because he is always parroting what his boy Bill Polian is saying. He must have missed this one...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/19/bill-polian-says-landry-jones-is-the-best-qb-in-the-draft/

steelbtexan
12-11-2013, 10:06 PM
I guess my biggest issue with Bridgewater is his throwing mechanics , I see a rather long wind up with a slow release .... and he holds the ball somewhat low at times. Not as exaggerated as Tebow but a slow release none the less.

He can get away with that in college especially the level of competition he's faced on a regular basis but that dog wont hunt in the NFL. Any team that drafts him is going to have to clean up his mechanics ....

He definitely has a lot of tools to work with ... but he's got a lot of work to do to get to an NFL level.

Haven't the Texans already drafted a QB with an elite skill set that just needed his mechanichics to be cleaned up at 1-1? I cant remember his name.

LOL, pass on Bridgewater, if Rick drafts him history most likely will be repeating its self. But hey, this is BoB's Texans we are talking about. All fluff, very little substance. According to BoB wasn't this supposed to be another SB or bust yr. Sell those tickets boardroom Bobby.

thunderkyss
12-11-2013, 11:35 PM
First off pull the stick out of your ass and lighten the F up! The comment was in jest...


Because I said who cares? Really?


Second, after the Bowl games and combine, he very well could shoot right to the top of the draft board, then what smart ass? You gonna tell me the Texans are gonna pick Derek Carr #1 overall after the absolute debacle they had with his brother and helicopter father? NO F'ing WAY!


Doubt it. I provided a link to Scout.com, they have Carr as the 8th best QB prospect. I was generous suggesting he might be the 5th best when it's all said & done.



Just because they are not talking about him now, doesn't mean they won't be after the Senior Bowl or his workouts. Nobody was talking about Eric Fisher, I damn sure never heard of him, until AFTER the combine, where did he go again?

Still, we can have that converstation after the Senior Bowl & workouts. Or after we win the next three games & end up with the 5th pick, where we'd be looking at the 3rd or 4th best QB.

& Eric Fisher was always (far as I know) considered the second best OT & suggested to go 5-8 early in the process. I don't think anyone is talking about Carr going in the top 10.

We're going to be picking in the top 10.

SAMURAITEXAN
12-12-2013, 12:14 AM
I don't know how good Bridgewater is but, it seems to me a lesser NFL starter material QB/s than past several years. I really like for us to look into other position who may rate higher than mentioned QB especially at front 7 position. Or, if we can find a trading partner and trade down to obtain more picks.

Whichever we decided to do with our pick, I hope we have a great draft.

With right coaching staffs + very talented players already on this team + a great draft, we can quickly turn this team around next year.

Go Texans!!!

leebigeztx
12-12-2013, 12:36 AM
Is that the best you got? I would've thought your education could do much better than retarded. Guess not.

I thought you watched college football until you compared teddy bridgewater to geno. The only comparison is both are black and from miami.

thunderkyss
12-12-2013, 07:36 AM
I don't know how good Bridgewater is but, it seems to me a lesser NFL starter material QB/s than past several years.

I honestly believe if we end up with the #1 overall pick, most people will project Bridgewater as "the best player" in the draft. But realistically, he's probably not top 5.

steelbtexan
12-12-2013, 08:10 AM
I honestly believe if we end up with the #1 overall pick, most people will project Bridgewater as "the best player" in the draft. But realistically, he's probably not top 5.

^^^^
This

And the Texans will be repeating history.

Very Oileresque, the deeper question is, is Rick Smith the Texans version of Ladd Herzeg? Not as a person but as a leader of a franchise.

SAMURAITEXAN
12-12-2013, 09:25 AM
I honestly believe if we end up with the #1 overall pick, most people will project Bridgewater as "the best player" in the draft. But realistically, he's probably not top 5.

I hope not. But, usually happens with top rated QB each year.

SAMURAITEXAN
12-12-2013, 09:39 AM
^^^^
This

And the Texans will be repeating history.

Very Oileresque, the deeper question is, is Rick Smith the Texans version of Ladd Herzeg? Not as a person but as a leader of a franchise.

Lad, no Ladd. OK lad?

After Kube is gone, hope Rick is able to show his vision of this franchise and become a leader he needs to be. Kube no longer has the power so now Rick needs to show what he is capable of. If his vision pans out, OK, job well done but if it doesn't, he needs to take the responsibility as a leader of franchise.

Texian
12-12-2013, 10:51 AM
What is stupid is screaming apples and oranges without understanding the point being made. To spell that out one more time for you - running a fast paced, no huddle offense doesn't necessarily mean you get more plays. College or NFL that is true.

College Coaches seem to disagree with you. Most think you can go from 60 plays to close to 80 plays with no huddle up tempo. Not necessarily true with the oranges of the NFL.

Texian
12-12-2013, 10:56 AM
None of his comparisons make sense. I quit taking him serious a while ago because it's obvious that he's just bored and trying to start stuff with different posters to entertain himself.

His hate for Landry Jones is hilarious though because he is always parroting what his boy Bill Polian is saying. He must have missed this one...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/19/bill-polian-says-landry-jones-is-the-best-qb-in-the-draft/

I was right and Polian was wrong. WOW! Landry completed less than 50% of his passes that impressed Polian so much. Polian says Landry needs a good cast cast around him to play well. That story is bizarre to say the least.

infantrycak
12-12-2013, 11:12 AM
College Coaches seem to disagree with you. Most think you can go from 60 plays to close to 80 plays with no huddle up tempo. Not necessarily true with the oranges of the NFL.

Now there you go. You properly demonstrated apples and oranges. What you hope to achieve v. what is actually achieved.

Texian
12-12-2013, 12:09 PM
Now there you go. You properly demonstrated apples and oranges. What you hope to achieve v. what is actually achieved.

Here you go hot shot: College coaches KNOW they can increase the number of plays by approx 20 plays by using an up temp no huddle offense. Something coaches in the NFL haven't been able to accomplish because it's a different league, with different rules, different time constraints, different regulations. Other than that infantrycak thinks they're exactly the same and equally comparable.........now, back to Teddy.

badboy
12-12-2013, 12:26 PM
If Newton is not the starter next year then I don't see any way it could get worse. There was a thread a few days ago with profootball focus rankings for the Texans offense. IIRC, Newton was 74th out of 78 OT's. Harris was 43rd.

Harris is an average to slightly below average starting RT. Newton is an outright bottom of the league RT. We could sign a vet off the street next year to play RT and, while he may not play well, he can't be worse.

Well the FA could be worse if he developed a knee injury effecting his slide and back pedal as did Newton. If we use fair standards (like that will ever happen) Duane Brown should be benched for his sh==ty play as #1 pick coming off pro bowl status. He should get same treatment as Newton. For some reason you and others never seem to mention that.

I am not defending Newton but if you critique one player you should treat all the same.

TexansFTW
12-12-2013, 12:49 PM
I hope not. But, usually happens with top rated QB each year.

Quite a bit of the top rated QBs for a long time have lived up to the hype, even if it took them finding a head coach from Stanford to do it.

Since 2003: Palmer, Manning/Rivers, Alex Smith, The Mattural, Stafford, Cam, and Luck. 2013 didn't really have a top rated QB, they (Geno and EJ) were both projected 2nd round by most notable guys.

This one will be no different. He's gonna live up to it and shine. There is a lot of time until the Russell Athletic Bowl, then combine/pro days, then fake girlfriends to be discovered. But as of today, I've definitely planted my flag with this guy.

And Texian... Let's let it go, we've got almost 5 months until draft day. I respect your opinion, maybe you're right and I'm wrong. We will see. As I said above, there is a lot of time for things to go wrong for Teddy, I'm just hoping things stay the course.

Finally, Derek Newton is scum, sorry bro. New #1 pick at QB means you gotta send him packing.

infantrycak
12-12-2013, 01:27 PM
Here you go hot shot: College coaches KNOW they can increase the number of plays by approx 20 plays by using an up temp no huddle offense. Something coaches in the NFL haven't been able to accomplish because it's a different league, with different rules, different time constraints, different regulations. Other than that infantrycak thinks they're exactly the same and equally comparable.........now, back to Teddy.

Do you see the NFL mentioned in the post you quoted? No you do not just like you can't find any assertion the NFL and college are exactly the same and equally comparable in any of my posts.

Goals v. results are not the same. That is true regardless of league.

You're just fixated on your spurious NFL distinction because you don't have a real response to that truth.

SAMURAITEXAN
12-12-2013, 01:36 PM
Quite a bit of the top rated QBs for a long time have lived up to the hype, even if it took them finding a head coach from Stanford to do it.

Since 2003: Palmer, Manning/Rivers, Alex Smith, The Mattural, Stafford, Cam, and Luck. 2013 didn't really have a top rated QB, they (Geno and EJ) were both projected 2nd round by most notable guys.

This one will be no different. He's gonna live up to it and shine. There is a lot of time until the Russell Athletic Bowl, then combine/pro days, then fake girlfriends to be discovered. But as of today, I've definitely planted my flag with this guy.

And Texian... Let's let it go, we've got almost 5 months until draft day. I respect your opinion, maybe you're right and I'm wrong. We will see. As I said above, there is a lot of time for things to go wrong for Teddy, I'm just hoping things stay the course.

Finally, Derek Newton is scum, sorry bro. New #1 pick at QB means you gotta send him packing.
TexansFTW, I've should of said top rated QB from less starter material QB crop year. Like I mentioned in the earlier post, there seems to be less NFL starter QB material this year in comparison with past several years of draft QB prospects. What I am saying is if Luck was available this year, I would take Luck over Bridgewater and I would certainly rate Luck, Stafford, Cam, RG2 higher but that's me. Overall, this year's top QB prospect seems to me less talented and I am asking myself is really worth taking him at #1 spot and came up with an answer NO. I prefer Texans to draft front 7 prospect that may worth taking at top spot or trade down to obtain more picks if we can find a suitable trading partner. Now, I wouldn't mind Texans to draft QB in the 3rd or later. But if the Texans decided to draft Bridgewater, I will hope him best and pray he pans out for us.

Texian
12-12-2013, 01:48 PM
Do you see the NFL mentioned in the post you quoted? No you do not just like you can't find any assertion the NFL and college are exactly the same and equally comparable in any of my posts.

Goals v. results are not the same. That is true regardless of league.

You're just fixated on your spurious NFL distinction because you don't have a real response to that truth.

You're the one that brought up the NFL and the Eagles. Do you ever stay on message, on subject. You're always misleading, misdirecting, going to another ballpark to make some obscure point to support your comments. If this were a court of law counselor, your comments are inadmissible......now, back to Teddy.

Blake
12-12-2013, 02:14 PM
First, you're wrong, I never said Bridgewater would be worse than Geno, I expect Bridgewater to be on par or equal to Geno. That is what started this all in the first place.

You said it right here.

I'm not sure that Teddy Bridgewater will be as good an NFL QB as Geno Smith.

My biggest complaint against Teddy is he throws an air ball on his deep pass.

Where is that criticism coming from? Yes, below is a highlight video, but he makes several deep throws where the ball drops into a bucket to a outstretched WR. Example, check the first play of the video.

"https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=br9-OACeru4#t=17

The thing I like the most about TB is that he doesnt force a play with his legs. He slides around the pocket really well, feels pressure coming, shrugs off arm tackles while keeping his eyes down-field to deliver the ball.

I think we all get that you dont feel TB is worthy of a #1 draft pick, but to start banging the drum for Manziel because he is more "stout" just sounds silly.

Corrosion
12-12-2013, 02:39 PM
The thing I like the most about TB is that he doesnt force a play with his legs. He slides around the pocket really well, feels pressure coming, shrugs off arm tackles while keeping his eyes down-field to deliver the ball.

I think we all get that you dont feel TB is worthy of a #1 draft pick, but to start banging the drum for Manziel because he is more "stout" just sounds silly.

My issue with TB is his mechanics and slow / long release / delivery. He'll have to work on his mechanics to make it in the NFL.


His pocket awareness is one of the things I really do like about him ... along with the physical traits.

If he can improve his mechanics he has a chance to be really special. If not , he'll look a lot like the QB's who have player for the Texans this season.


I do think he's a better overall prospect than Manziel .... but that dude has special ability in the way he escapes pressure and makes teams pay for that pressure. If his game translates to the NFL (which I question) he will be difficult to defend .... He's a better passer than Vick or RG3 IMO with just as much ability to run.

Texian
12-12-2013, 02:41 PM
And Texian... Let's let it go, we've got almost 5 months until draft day. I respect your opinion, maybe you're right and I'm wrong. We will see. As I said above, there is a lot of time for things to go wrong for Teddy, I'm just hoping things stay the course.

Got It! You Love you some Teddy. You're entitled. To each his own

You said it right here.....Where is that criticism coming from? Yes, below is a highlight video, but he makes several deep throws where the ball drops into a bucket to a outstretched WR.

"I'm not sure" is not a definitive statement. "I'm not sure" is closer to saying I don' know. To suggest that someone saying I'm not sure really means Teddy is WORSE then Geno is really a reach and stretch of epic proportions.

I have watched enough Teddy games to see that his deep ball needs a lot of air under it to get to it's destination. It appears to me Teddy needs more air than many other high profile QBs. It is MHO that this kind of floater is highly susceptible to being an INT in the NFL. Dropping a deep pass over a college defender is not the same thing as dropping a pass over an NFL defender. One thing that reinforces this thinking and another criticism of Teddy is the suspect level of competition Teddy has faced. I have seen several of those passes he dropped over a defender while thinking in the NFL that is an INT. Clearly, you Love You some Teddy too, me not so much, I have my concerns.

Blake
12-12-2013, 02:45 PM
My issue with TB is his mechanics and slow / long release / delivery. He'll have to work on his mechanics to make it in the NFL.


His pocket awareness is one of the things I really do like about him ... along with the physical traits.

If he can improve his mechanics he has a chance to be really special. If not , he'll look a lot like the QB's who have player for the Texans this season.

How long does he take to release the ball vs how long you would like him to take to release the ball?

TexansFTW
12-12-2013, 02:51 PM
TexansFTW, I've should of said top rated QB from less starter material QB crop year. Like I mentioned in the earlier post, there seems to be less NFL starter QB material this year in comparison with past several years of draft QB prospects. What I am saying is if Luck was available this year, I would take Luck over Bridgewater and I would certainly rate Luck, Stafford, Cam, RG2 higher but that's me. Overall, this year's top QB prospect seems to me less talented and I am asking myself is really worth taking him at #1 spot and came up with an answer NO. I prefer Texans to draft front 7 prospect that may worth taking at top spot or trade down to obtain more picks if we can find a suitable trading partner. Now, I wouldn't mind Texans to draft QB in the 3rd or later. But if the Texans decided to draft Bridgewater, I will hope him best and pray he pans out for us.

It doesn't really matter with regards to the QB CLASS when you have the #1 pick. All you need is the best QB in that class.

Ask the Panthers in 2011. The other 1st rounders were Locker, Ponder, and Gabbert. Who cares about that group, #1 is all that matters.

Florida safety Matt Elam said that Bridgewater was the best quarterback they played in 2012. That was high praise considering the Gators took on the Heisman Trophy winner.=, Texas A&M's Johnny Manziel. They also played Tyler Bray, Aaron Murray and E.J. Manuel. The Florida defense had just dominated Manuel, but Bridgewater completed 20-of-33 passes for 266 yards with two touchdowns and an interception on a tipped pass in Louisville's Sugar Bowl victory.

Luck was a once in a decade player, last person as praised coming out as him was Peyton, who also had a QB father. I feel like you haven't really done much research on Teddy from the way that you talk. He's just as highly regarded as many of those names you just threw out there.

Let me help you out a little:

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=teddy+bridgewater+nfl+draft+prospects

If the Texans draft a QB in the 3rd round or later we will 2 games again and likely lose every free agent we have, including JJ Watt.

Blake
12-12-2013, 02:52 PM
"I'm not sure" is not a definitive statement. "I'm not sure" is closer to saying I don' know. To suggest that someone saying I'm not sure really means Teddy is WORSE then Geno is
really a reach and stretch of epic proportions.

Dude you are so full of sh#t. I know what you said. Everyone in this thread knows what you said. You can weasel your way out of that statement.

I have watched enough Teddy games to see that his deep ball needs a lot of air under it to get to it's destination. It appears to me Teddy needs more air than many other high profile QBs. It is MHO that this kind of floater is highly susceptible to being an INT in the NFL. Dropping a deep pass over a college defender is not the same thing as dropping a pass over an NFL defender. One thing that reinforces this thinking and another criticism of Teddy is the suspect level of competition Teddy has faced. Clearly, you Love You some Teddy too, me not so much, I have my concerns.

Really?! Dropping a pass over a college kid is not the same as an NFL'er? WOW! Thanks for the enlightenment. It appears to you that Teddy needs more air than other "high profile" qbs? You say sh#t that doesnt mean anything. You dont back it up, you just say it and see if it sticks. It appears to me that you are making crap up as you go and love to argue with everyone.

TexansFTW
12-12-2013, 03:07 PM
lol, it's all good Blake, just let it go.

I also don't agree with his point, but it's fine. A lot can happen between today and early May.

We should all probably discuss something different, even I am quite guilty of basically just fighting people that disagree with me at this point. We aren't learning anything new, just drawing lines in the sand, lol.

Texian
12-12-2013, 03:18 PM
[/B] that Teddy needs more air than other "high profile" qbs? You say sh#t that doesnt mean anything. You dont back it up, you just say it and see if it sticks. [B]

That is my opinion, (see IMHO or MHO), sorry unfortunately I do not have any video of my opinions. :)

Texian
12-12-2013, 03:19 PM
lol, it's all good Blake, just let it go.

I also don't agree with his point, but it's fine. A lot can happen between today and early May.

We should all probably discuss something different, even I am quite guilty of basically just fighting people that disagree with me at this point. We aren't learning anything new, just drawing lines in the sand, lol.

We can discuss Teddy here in the Teddy Bridgewater thread, there is just no reason to get mad angry and vindictive when some one disagrees with you.

Corrosion
12-12-2013, 03:22 PM
How long does he take to release the ball vs how long you would like him to take to release the ball?

That's difficult to say .... every play is different . Its not just the release , its the position of the ball prior (a bit low). There are times he will need to get the ball out ~1.5seconds. against some blitz packages. When you hold the ball low and in front of the chest , that's going to be a difficult task to accomplish.
He's got to hold that ball near the ear hole and open the shoulders rather than wind up like a baseball. He's got a looping motion when he opens up to throw , especially when he throws it on a line or a deep ball.

The other thing that concerns me is that he throws a lot of balls with air under them , throwing to a spot rather than on a rope which is OK in a lot of situations but I think NFL DB's are going to be able to exploit that.

Watch some video and you'll see what I mean .... then go watch Peyton or Aaron Rodgers make the same throws with velocity.

Dutchrudder
12-12-2013, 04:07 PM
The rhetoric regarding Teddy sounds a lot like what I heard about Cam Newton coming out. People were over-critical of him, and I think he fell to 15th in our TT mock draft because everyone thought he was overrated. I think he's proven he was worthy of the #1 pick so far.

None of these guys come out of college without question marks, it's impossible because nobody has a perfect college career. Even some of the "can't miss" prospects in college turn out to be duds like Aaron Curry. It happens, the point is to analyze the players and make accurate assessments of their strengths and weaknesses in order to mitigate the risks when making draft selections. If we can't do that, then it's just pointless argument, which is what this thread is turning into.

Now if you really feel like evaluating the guy, here are his plays in some games. You will see the good, the bad and the ugly. Feel free to point to plays based on the time of the video, and link other stuff as needed. That first play in the Florida game is amazing though, he's on the run, tries to drop the ball in between the WR and sideline, takes a huge hit, loses his helmet, and gets right back up. Tough kid. Jon Bostic was the one laying the wood, who is now the MLB in Chicago.

2013 season in order of schedule (the ones I could find):

UL vs Ohio 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCXEwGsJUHc

UL vs Eastern Kentucky 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKSvFriM0PI

UL vs Kentucky 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZzmXxB64ec

UL vs FIU highlights 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Z4sXiTw8zI

UL vs Houston 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQKN-F6fk6I




2012 season in order of schedule (the ones I could find):

UL vs Kentucky 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bQ_uMplUEY

UL vs UNC 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bQ_uMplUEY

UL vs Pitt 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kkk0ZTRPDI

UL vs USF 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k922kI7X2qI

UL vs Cincy 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB5xvBbLszk

UL vs Temple 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZ5uXu_TejM

UL vs Syracuse 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxxnyvJzt-4

UL vs UCON 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjkqprC7jYI

UL vs Rutgers 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ELPwI9_y5U

UL vs Florida in the Sugar Bowl 2012:
http://youtu.be/VmyPaOy7OTs


Compilation highlight/Heisman video of TB. Worth a watch if you want to know some more about his personal life. Kubiak would definitely say he's a good kid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxA8zqa6MEg

Teddy Bridgewater's Story by ESPN (full segment):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lizVzzsbFQU

Found this video, it's kinda funny and I'm sure the critics will enjoy it. TB is terrible at sliding:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8KcWzu7LTI

TexansFTW
12-12-2013, 04:47 PM
Good stuff bro. Thanks.

Texian
12-12-2013, 05:15 PM
Most of your QB's in discussion to be the #1 draft pick are usually Heisman Finalist.....just saying.

Quarterbacks Jordan Lynch of Northern Illinois, Johnny Manziel of Texas A&M, AJ McCarron of Alabama and Jameis Winston of Florida State were all invited to the Heisman ceremony on Saturday (8 p.m. ET, ESPN)......where is Teddy?.....just asking.

bhsman
12-12-2013, 06:06 PM
Youtube

Thanks for compiling this; I'll give it a look once I'm done with finals.

amazing80
12-12-2013, 08:26 PM
I haven't been sold on teddy and couldn't figure it out until now. He has no zip on his ball. He has the arm to throw deep, but his zip, or ability to throw a dart seems to be non existent, even his wr screens are bad. the ball TAKES FOREVER to get there. In the NFL he will need to be able to sling that thing into tight windows, Im not sold he can.......

SAMURAITEXAN
12-12-2013, 09:07 PM
It doesn't really matter with regards to the QB CLASS when you have the #1 pick. All you need is the best QB in that class.

Ask the Panthers in 2011. The other 1st rounders were Locker, Ponder, and Gabbert. Who cares about that group, #1 is all that matters.



Luck was a once in a decade player, last person as praised coming out as him was Peyton, who also had a QB father. I feel like you haven't really done much research on Teddy from the way that you talk. He's just as highly regarded as many of those names you just threw out there.

Let me help you out a little:

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=teddy+bridgewater+nfl+draft+prospects

If the Texans draft a QB in the 3rd round or later we will 2 games again and likely lose every free agent we have, including JJ Watt.

Only QB I added was RG3 other than that in accordance with your earlier post. Now, I do understand about QB position of the Texans and many of TT members here are concern about the position including myself. What I am pointing out about the situation is, it seems less talented QB crop this year. When you have one 0.85 carat diamond among 0.7 carat diamonds, it looks a lot bigger than the others and stands out. However, when you have a few more 0.85~1 carat diamonds in a crop, suddenly it doesn't stands out. I am no expert on evaluating QB but I feel 2014 QB prospects are not as good as past several years.

Some of TTC members aware that I follow UH and naturally I watch other AAC teams when possible.

What I am saying is there an alternative way of spending #1 pick and I feel we should spend it on front 7 prospect or trade down to obtain more picks.

Like I mentioned in earlier post, if the Texans decided to draft Teddy, I will wish him best and pray he pans out for us. So, I am not hater but, I think there's better way to spend #1 overall pick due to the above mentioned contents.

Bottom line is you are in drafting Teddy and I feel there's an alternative way. But, it's all good as we all are concern about the Texans as fan.

Corrosion
12-12-2013, 10:21 PM
I haven't been sold on teddy and couldn't figure it out until now. He has no zip on his ball. He has the arm to throw deep, but his zip, or ability to throw a dart seems to be non existent, even his wr screens are bad. the ball TAKES FOREVER to get there. In the NFL he will need to be able to sling that thing into tight windows, Im not sold he can.......

The other thing that concerns me is that he throws a lot of balls with air under them throwing to a spot rather than on a rope

...... :kitten:

steelbtexan
12-12-2013, 11:45 PM
The rhetoric regarding Teddy sounds a lot like what I heard about Cam Newton coming out. People were over-critical of him, and I think he fell to 15th in our TT mock draft because everyone thought he was overrated. I think he's proven he was worthy of the #1 pick so far.

None of these guys come out of college without question marks, it's impossible because nobody has a perfect college career. Even some of the "can't miss" prospects in college turn out to be duds like Aaron Curry. It happens, the point is to analyze the players and make accurate assessments of their strengths and weaknesses in order to mitigate the risks when making draft selections. If we can't do that, then it's just pointless argument, which is what this thread is turning into.

Now if you really feel like evaluating the guy, here are his plays in some games. You will see the good, the bad and the ugly. Feel free to point to plays based on the time of the video, and link other stuff as needed. That first play in the Florida game is amazing though, he's on the run, tries to drop the ball in between the WR and sideline, takes a huge hit, loses his helmet, and gets right back up. Tough kid. Jon Bostic was the one laying the wood, who is now the MLB in Chicago.

2013 season in order of schedule (the ones I could find):

UL vs Ohio 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCXEwGsJUHc

UL vs Eastern Kentucky 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKSvFriM0PI

UL vs Kentucky 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZzmXxB64ec

UL vs FIU highlights 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Z4sXiTw8zI

UL vs Houston 2013:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQKN-F6fk6I




2012 season in order of schedule (the ones I could find):

UL vs Kentucky 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bQ_uMplUEY

UL vs UNC 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bQ_uMplUEY

UL vs Pitt 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kkk0ZTRPDI

UL vs USF 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k922kI7X2qI

UL vs Cincy 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB5xvBbLszk

UL vs Temple 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZ5uXu_TejM

UL vs Syracuse 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxxnyvJzt-4

UL vs UCON 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjkqprC7jYI

UL vs Rutgers 2012:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ELPwI9_y5U

UL vs Florida in the Sugar Bowl 2012:
http://youtu.be/VmyPaOy7OTs


Compilation highlight/Heisman video of TB. Worth a watch if you want to know some more about his personal life. Kubiak would definitely say he's a good kid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxA8zqa6MEg

Teddy Bridgewater's Story by ESPN (full segment):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lizVzzsbFQU

Found this video, it's kinda funny and I'm sure the critics will enjoy it. TB is terrible at sliding:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8KcWzu7LTI

Cam had all of the talent he needed to be a superstar. I thought he had character/entitlement issues.

I dont have these issues with Teddy, the Questions I have with him are arm strength/mechanics/level of competition/how quickly he can adjust to the speed of the NFL game.

bhsman
12-13-2013, 12:14 AM
I haven't been sold on teddy and couldn't figure it out until now. He has no zip on his ball. He has the arm to throw deep, but his zip, or ability to throw a dart seems to be non existent, even his wr screens are bad. the ball TAKES FOREVER to get there. In the NFL he will need to be able to sling that thing into tight windows, Im not sold he can.......

I wondered that about while initially watching his tape (I need to work through that huge post from earlier) and wondered whether that was just a superb display of touch in not throwing heaters to his teammates or whether his arm strength isn't as good as he'd hope.

DexmanC
12-13-2013, 05:13 AM
In all the clips DutchRudder put up, all I see is a young QB carving up defenses with his mind and arm. He has legs, but uses them to buy time in the pocket for his receivers. He doesn't run at the first sign of trouble, which shows that he knows what he wants to do. Louisville does not have a high-caliber o-line. Teddy shows great skill at climbing the weak pocket his teammates TRY to give him. In the Florida game, Teddy was the best player in that game on either side, hands down. He's the only tier-1 QB in this draft, and if you are the Texans, you'd better take him before Jacksonville or Tennessee does.

bah007
12-13-2013, 08:45 AM
Most of your QB's in discussion to be the #1 draft pick are usually Heisman Finalist.....just saying.

Quarterbacks Jordan Lynch of Northern Illinois, Johnny Manziel of Texas A&M, AJ McCarron of Alabama and Jameis Winston of Florida State were all invited to the Heisman ceremony on Saturday (8 p.m. ET, ESPN)......where is Teddy?.....just asking.

Where is Bortles? I thought you liked him at #1?

Corrosion
12-13-2013, 08:53 AM
Cam had all of the talent he needed to be a superstar. I thought he had character/entitlement issues.

I dont have these issues with Teddy, the Questions I have with him are arm strength/mechanics/level of competition/how quickly he can adjust to the speed of the NFL game.

No , there are no character concerns .... I don't question his arm strength either. He has a plenty strong enough arm. The only question I have is about his mechanics and accuracy when he is forced to put velocity on the ball , which he will in the NFL.

I wondered that about while initially watching his tape (I need to work through that huge post from earlier) and wondered whether that was just a superb display of touch in not throwing heaters to his teammates or whether his arm strength isn't as good as he'd hope.

He's got plenty of arm , you watch him throw deep and even with the hitch in his release , its almost effortless .....

In all the clips DutchRudder put up, all I see is a young QB carving up defenses with his mind and arm. He has legs, but uses them to buy time in the pocket for his receivers. He doesn't run at the first sign of trouble, which shows that he knows what he wants to do. Louisville does not have a high-caliber o-line. Teddy shows great skill at climbing the weak pocket his teammates TRY to give him. In the Florida game, Teddy was the best player in that game on either side, hands down. He's the only tier-1 QB in this draft, and if you are the Texans, you'd better take him before Jacksonville or Tennessee does.

I don't have a horse in this race .... Bridgewater is the top prospect but isn't without his flaws. I've struggled over taking him #1 or a trade down scenario that nets you multiple #1 picks , I just cant make up my mind as he does have those flaws but this league is so QB driven , if you don't have a top tier QB , you go get one.


Derek Carr & Aaron Murray probably have the best mechanics in this draft and Zach Mettenberger isn't far behind .....Murray and Mettenberger both play more pro style offenses. Carr would be a difficult choice considering the history and the injuries to Mettenberger & Murry scare me. Really need to see how they look closer to the draft.

Honoring Earl 34
12-13-2013, 09:13 AM
No , there are no character concerns .... I don't question his arm strength either. He has a plenty strong enough arm. The only question I have is about his mechanics and accuracy when he is forced to put velocity on the ball , which he will in the NFL.



He's got plenty of arm , you watch him throw deep and even with the hitch in his release , its almost effortless .....



I don't have a horse in this race .... Bridgewater is the top prospect but isn't without his flaws. I've struggled over taking him #1 or a trade down scenario that nets you multiple #1 picks , I just cant make up my mind as he does have those flaws but this league is so QB driven , if you don't have a top tier QB , you go get one.


Derek Carr & Aaron Murray probably have the best mechanics in this draft and Zach Mettenberger isn't far behind .....Murray and Mettenberger both play more pro style offenses. Carr would be a difficult choice considering the history and the injuries to Mettenberger & Murry scare me. Really need to see how they look closer to the draft.

Whoever you take I think it's time to get some RZ weapons which to me means height . I also think Teddy's most underrated feature is his quick feet . His best comparison ... to me ... is a bigger Charlie Ward . Ward had the quickness to be an NBA PG . I would take Teddy because I think he can make his OL better by sliding or moving while scanning the field .

I also the LG is a bigger problem than RT because Smith and Jones = a speed bump . A QB can't step up because of the pressure up the gut .

HOU-TEX
12-13-2013, 02:00 PM
Just read on Twitter than he was contemplating staying in school.

b0ng
12-13-2013, 02:11 PM
I hope for the Texans sake and my sanity if Bridgewater is drafted he doesn't turn into another Moon. I cant take many more Buffalo/Denver/Kansas City playoff choke jobs.

I would be absolutely delirious with excitement if Bridgewater turned out to be as good as Moon. Maybe him being an icon of my youth might have something to do with it, but if you get a guy as good as Moon on your roster you will be going to the playoffs a lot, especially now with how the rules are set for the passing game. I know Moon was pretty polished having played in the CFL for years before coming to the NFL and he had a crapload of PR work to do because of his skin color, but he's easily the best QB the Oilers/Titans or Texans have ever had.

JB
12-13-2013, 02:42 PM
I would be absolutely delirious with excitement if Bridgewater turned out to be as good as Moon. Maybe him being an icon of my youth might have something to do with it, but if you get a guy as good as Moon on your roster you will be going to the playoffs a lot, especially now with how the rules are set for the passing game. I know Moon was pretty polished having played in the CFL for years before coming to the NFL and he had a crapload of PR work to do because of his skin color, but he's easily the best QB the Oilers/Titans or Texans have ever had.

Yep, having a future HOF'er here as qb would be pretty sweet

PapaL
12-13-2013, 03:32 PM
Teddy Bridgewater Reportedly Considering Return to Louisville for Senior Season; LINK (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1888063-teddy-bridgewater-reportedly-considering-return-to-louisville-for-senior-season?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=programming-national)

Louisville quarterback and potential top overall pick Teddy Bridgewater isn't a lock to enter the 2014 NFL draft. The highly touted prospect is reportedly still considering the option of returning to the Cardinals for his senior season.

John Middlekauff of CSN Bay Area, who's a former NFL scout with the Philadelphia Eagles, reports multiple sources have told him Bridgewater isn't totally sure if he's going to make the jump. One more season at Louisville remains a realistic option:

Interestingly, when pressed on why a top prospect like Bridgewater would consider giving up the opportunity to get selected with the top pick for another year in college, Middlekauff noted he's heard from people at the next level who don't think the Louisville product would go No. 1:

That would certainly change this huh?

Corrosion
12-13-2013, 04:04 PM
Middlekauff noted he's heard from people at the next level who don't think the Louisville product would go No. 1



That would certainly change this huh?




Honestly I don't know if it does change things , If he wasn't going #1 , what does it matter if he doesn't come out .... It might affect trading the pick if there was a team who really wanted him and not one of the other QB candidates. But otherwise for the Texans , if he isn't there to take and they weren't going to take him anyhow .... it matters not.

I do think it somewhat justifies the statements many of us have made about his value at #1 overall if GM's aren't going to take him ....

If he isn't the #1 QB taken , who is ?!? Carr ?? Johnny Football !?! Blake Bortles ??!

PapaL
12-13-2013, 04:29 PM
If he isn't the #1 QB taken , who is ?!? Carr ?? Johnny Football !?! Blake Bortles ??!

I wouldn't take any of those guys at #1. No Bridgewater means Clowney is the undisputed top pick IMO.

infantrycak
12-13-2013, 05:09 PM
Middlekauff noted he's heard from people at the next level who don't think the Louisville product would go No. 1

I'm not seeing the logic here. Does he think he will be No.1 next year? His level of competition won't have changed.

TheDrifter
12-13-2013, 05:39 PM
He's just waiting to make sure the Jags dont end up with the first pick.

Corrosion
12-13-2013, 06:09 PM
I'm not seeing the logic here. Does he think he will be No.1 next year? His level of competition won't have changed.

Level of competition isn't the only questionmark for Bridgewater , his mechanics may be the bigger question.

Most of us agree that if we were to draft him , we wouldn't start him out of the gate for whatever combination of reasons .... If he's not ready , he's probably better served staying in school and playing football than sitting on the sidelines. (But damn , its hard to pass up that big payday).

Is he the #1 overall next season ?! Probably not with Jameis Winston , Mariota and others likely coming out.


I wouldn't take any of those guys at #1. No Bridgewater means Clowney is the undisputed top pick IMO.


I don't think that's set in stone .... There are a lot of red flags with Clowney , this season has been piss poor for him (3 sacks?!).
At least a couple other candidates for the #1 overall IMO starting with Matthews & Barr ... Maybe even Mosley who I think is the best "football player" in this draft.

PapaL
12-13-2013, 10:07 PM
I don't think that's set in stone .... There are a lot of red flags with Clowney , this season has been piss poor for him (3 sacks?!).
At least a couple other candidates for the #1 overall IMO starting with Matthews & Barr ... Maybe even Mosley who I think is the best "football player" in this draft.

Every player has warts of some sort. Let's agree to disagree. IMO it's Teddy or Clowney at #1.