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View Full Version : The Texans moves didn't raise many eyebrows, but they do provide promise


Zac
06-30-2005, 09:06 PM
The Texans have just taken a big turn to getting younger. They have released key veterans who were leaders!

Now, leadership was replaced by youthful talent.

The upside of Peek and Babin is outstanding :drool: (Greenwood, I know very little about)

A backfield of Buchanon and Robinson sounds like a shut down pair of guys for the next 10 years. :drool: (Glenn and Coleman were solid last year)

And the Defensive line is getting a spark with the first round pick Johnson (I think that's his name) plus hopefully Payne and Walker can come around again to old form.


The offense gets speed injected into the Wide outs. Domink Davis has a legitamite back up. Wells appears ready to take a starters role as a full back. Ragone just won MVP in Europe.

The offenive line is the biggest question mark. Last year they were horrible. Can they get better with one year together. I would like McKinney to be moved to Left Guard.

Well, I hope that these big time changes provide the positive boost the team needs.

Big B Texan Fan
06-30-2005, 11:06 PM
Sometimes change is good and sometimes not.

Defense has been changed, hopefully for the good.

Offense hasn't really changed, especially the O-Line, hopefully for the better.
The thinking must be that continuity is the key for the O-Line.

TommyS
07-01-2005, 08:24 AM
Wells appears ready to take a starters role as a full back. .

people need to get this out of their heads. jonathon wells was not, is not, and will never be, a starting full back. yes, we may see wells and davis in the backfield at the same time, but neither of them will be playing full back! we may see hollings and davis in the backfield, we may see wells and morency in the back field, but that gives us two tailbacks, not an RB and a FB. people are making WAY too much out of the "triple threat" article.

thats the way i read it anyway.

Big B Texan Fan
07-03-2005, 02:26 AM
IMHO our D has improve because with TJ and Peek + Babin we are going to get upfield. Now how D-Rob, Earl, Coleman and P Buch perform.... I dunno. Wong/ Greenwood is definetly faster than Sharper/Foreman combo.
Yer right. yet TJ is gonna be an alternate @ 1st and if the 3 main guys in our D-Line stay healthy. He could not even ever have a start.

cred
07-03-2005, 05:16 AM
TJ will beat out Gary Walker... heard Gary has a little aches and pains again.


Would not suprise me one bit!

brickmantexanfan
07-03-2005, 09:38 AM
TJ will beat out Gary Walker... heard Gary has a little aches and pains again.


I agree with that observation,don't get me wrong walker is big and tough but we didn't draft tj in the first round to put him on the bench. :brickwall

Big B Texan Fan
07-03-2005, 11:15 AM
TJ will beat out Gary Walker... heard Gary has a little aches and pains again.
I tcould happen one day but not the begimming of the season, especially if he's healthy.
I'm one of the ones who is Not a G-Funk fan but Dom treats his Pro-Bowlers different.
This is the year that we need the vets to stand up and rock.

Vinny
07-03-2005, 11:22 AM
If everyone is healthy, Robaire Smith is our least impressive stating lineman, not Gary Walker.

TEXANS84
07-03-2005, 03:18 PM
TJ will beat out Gary Walker... heard Gary has a little aches and pains again.

Thats funny, who did you "hear" this from?

TEXANS84
07-03-2005, 03:23 PM
Wong/ Greenwood is definetly faster than Sharper/Foreman combo.

Here's a good explanationn of Greenwood's skills from a Dolphin fan:

Greenwood has very good speed but they way Jim Bates ran the D Greenwood was used in coverage more than up near the line making tackles. The way he ran the D Zach Thomas was supposed to make all the tackles if the RB got by the D-line. There were a few games last year where Greenwood had to play MLB when Zach was hurt and he had double digit tackle numbers in those games. As far as sacks go I think Bates called blitzes maybe 10% of all the plays we had last year. There were games where we didn't blitz at all. Bates doesn't believe in blitzing. He believes we should be able to get pressure from the edges without blitzing so most of the sacks came from Taylor and the rest of the D-line. Greenwood blitzing will be new to him. With his speed he should be able to cause pressure and get a few sacks.

throwANDREtheBALL
07-06-2005, 02:44 PM
That's good news.

Double digit tackles in the games he played middle linebacker.

Maybe he will make more of an impact in the middle, then most critics think.

El Tejano
07-06-2005, 03:06 PM
I think the big thing that turned Capers head was the intellegence that Greenwood plays with. That is two smart MLB that can both cover. Nice.

Chance_C
07-06-2005, 03:14 PM
I agree with that observation,don't get me wrong walker is big and tough but we didn't draft tj in the first round to put him on the bench.

I don't agree at all. We drafted TJ in the first round for rotational purposes and a POSSIBLE future replacement for Gary Walker. I think the only way that TJ takes Gary's job is because of injury. I have high hopes for TJ, but I also remember how effective an injury free Gary Walker can be. Therefore my fingers are crossed for a healthy Gary Walker.

TheOgre
07-06-2005, 03:34 PM
I liked the moves we made in the offseason. With the exception of our D-line, we have a team that can stay together for a few years. If things fall the way I think they will, I think we trade up next year to draft an OLT then take a TE with another first day pick.

cred
07-06-2005, 03:37 PM
I know we are a 3-4 D, but sometimes I wish we would mix it up a little and use a 4-3 D to throw off the opposing offense with a little confusion every once in a while, maybe when in the nickle and dime packages. Like maybe 10% of the time and with the rotation at the D-line that we have now I think we could do this and maybe throw in some different blitzes as well.

What do any of you other fans think about this?
Just a curiosity.

Hervoyel
07-06-2005, 03:42 PM
If everyone is healthy, Robaire Smith is our least impressive stating lineman, not Gary Walker.


Hey Vinny, question. Do you think that's going to change this season or that it's something that can change? Last year was Robaire's first with us and I'm curious to know what you think about improvement from him. Will a year in our defense and say, a healthy Seth Payne and Gary Walker (fingers crossed) translate into more performance from Smith?

AndreJ
07-06-2005, 03:52 PM
I know we are a 3-4 D, but sometimes I wish we would mix it up a little and use a 4-3 D to throw off the opposing offense with a little confusion every once in a while, maybe when in the nickle and dime packages. Like maybe 10% of the time and with the rotation at the D-line that we have now I think we could do this and maybe throw in some different blitzes as well.

What do any of you other fans think about this?
Just a curiosity.

I'm not sure if we could pull it off with the 4-3, DE's who would we put there Smith and Payne in the middle, but Peek and Babin as ends (i think not) we would still need two OLB's and.....i dunno, im not against mixing up the D i think its a good idea and it would keep the offense guessing, but im not sure we have the personel for it...if its not too much trouble would you mind posting what your front 7 would be for a Texans 4-3 D?

infantrycak
07-06-2005, 04:04 PM
I know we are a 3-4 D, but sometimes I wish we would mix it up a little and use a 4-3 D to throw off the opposing offense with a little confusion every once in a while, maybe when in the nickle and dime packages. Like maybe 10% of the time and with the rotation at the D-line that we have now I think we could do this and maybe throw in some different blitzes as well.

What do any of you other fans think about this?
Just a curiosity.

That is effectively what the Texans did in a lot of passing situations last year. 2 DLmen acted as the DT's and Babin and Peek acted as the DE's, just without their hands on the ground.

Vinny
07-06-2005, 04:11 PM
Hey Vinny, question. Do you think that's going to change this season or that it's something that can change? Last year was Robaire's first with us and I'm curious to know what you think about improvement from him. Will a year in our defense and say, a healthy Seth Payne and Gary Walker (fingers crossed) translate into more performance from Smith?
His play improved as the season wore on but he never really needed a double team on a consistent basis. I don't expect him to be much of a pass rusher but his play against the run was disappointing for a guy who came in here as a top lineman. I think he can play better. If everyone is healthy I like our line rotation guys better than last year. Walker, Payne, Smith, Deloach and TJ will play the most, with Sears and Ioane fighting over the 6th spot. Walker will have to prove he is over his turf toe and other nagging injuries, but hopefully we see him play with his old speed and intensity in the pre-season games.

stephen1
07-06-2005, 05:08 PM
i think robaire smith is better than gary walker, but gary is better than tj so he will be a backup

royce1054
07-11-2005, 06:43 PM
Well i think if Walker has another bad year i think we will see TJ playing. I think we did a good job here bc of uncertainty of how Walker would produce. As for next years draft depending on how we do i think will depend on who we draft... and i dont think we will defintely go after a OT bc what if Wand has a breakout season then we dont need OT.... i say wait until after the season to make the descion

Evans Fan
07-11-2005, 07:43 PM
Well i think if Walker has another bad year i think we will see TJ playing. I think we did a good job here bc of uncertainty of how Walker would produce. As for next years draft depending on how we do i think will depend on who we draft... and i dont think we will defintely go after a OT bc what if Wand has a breakout season then we dont need OT.... i say wait until after the season to make the descion


Gary walker was considered one of the best nose tacles in the league before last year you guys have no idea how good you have it Gary walker Robaire Smith are going to have huge years and Buffalo will have saam Adams being a monster that theyt have to compete with for a pro bowl spot but he will be just edge out walker becuse he went last year and you have D ROB so you are fine on edefense except for linebacker Sharper was great and to replacew him with babin right now is not good plus foreman a former billl is better than Greenwood I would kno Bills -fish game is a great wayt to to scout players Greenwood did start but he wasn't trusted so they let him go for a more reliable guy

texasguy346
07-11-2005, 08:06 PM
I'm not sure if you're all that familiar with the Texans 3-4 defense, but just as a heads up Walker and Smith play as DEs in our scheme and Payne is our NT. Babin was a starter last year as an OLB, and he'll be starting in the same position this year. Sharper and Foreman are gone, and Foreman, although a good guy, wasn't starter quality in the middle. We'll have Wong starting in Foreman's ILB positon, and Greenwood will take over Sharpers position at the other ILB spot. Peek is all but guranteed the other OLB starting spot, and he's proven to be a very effective pass rusher in his limited action thus far. We'll have a very young and very fast group of LBs. How they'll perform as a unit is yet to be seen, and training camp and the preseason will give us a sneak peek at their potential. Our secondary looks to be pretty good too. We'll have DRob and PBuch as our starting CBs with Faggins coming in for nickle packages. Lewis Sanders might end up as our fourth CB. Coleman played pretty well at FS last year, and I expect him to be even better this season. Earl was coming off an injury last year in his rookie season, but he was effective. He should improve as well. Our secondary was very effective last year at creating turnovers, and that was with not much of a pass rush. If we can get an effective pass rush this season I expect our secondary to perform even better than last year. All things point to us having a young speedy defense overall, and they'll have to show what they can do this season. Our offense improved last year, and I think we should be very good this year.

Buffalo seems to have the opposite problem. They have a veteran defense that is tough, but they have a young inexperienced QB whos being counted on to lead an offense with some young talent.

Corrosion
07-12-2005, 01:39 PM
[QUOTE=Zac]
I would like McKinney to be moved to Left Guard.

[QUOTE]




I'ds like to see Mckinney moved to ..... a seat in the stands :brickwall

Evans Fan
07-12-2005, 03:04 PM
Buffalo seems to have the opposite problem. They have a veteran defense that is tough, but they have a young inexperienced QB whos being counted on to lead an offense with some young talent.[/QUOTE]

buffalo is actually trying to get younger on defense
McGee will start for a full season so that will be a plus for us and Tim Anderson will try to fill pat willams shoes which most people here think he can some don't but thats to be found out Plus shoebol and kelsay are our d ends and man did they finsh strong last year plus Clements is on 26 so we are pretty young on defense offense is a little more older moulds is 30 and that means he will use wisedom to make up for losing speed

texasguy346
07-12-2005, 06:06 PM
As far as Buffalo's defense goes if it ain't broke..don't fix it. The young talent on offense I'm referring to is Parrish, McGahee, Losman, and Everett (even though hes out this season). Willis will be entering his 3rd season in the NFL, but only his second where he's seen action. Parrish and Everett are rookies with talent, and Losman is essientially a rookie since he didn't get much experience in his rookie season. How those players perform is going to go a long way in determining how effective the Bills offense will be just as how several of the Texans' young players on defense will go a long way in determining how successful our defense will be during the season. Those are the two biggest question marks in this game, and no one will know how effective either will be until the game gets under way.

Evans Fan
07-12-2005, 07:00 PM
i see but your defense wasn't broke sharper was pretty good pleople thought it was dumb to let him go

ATX
07-12-2005, 07:15 PM
i see but your defense wasn't broke sharper was pretty good pleople thought it was dumb to let him go

our defense has been broke from day one. sharper was good, but he lost a step and seemed to have issues with the management. with that said, if the texans really wanted to keep him, they would have. our defense was lagging last year. the year before our defense was heavily injured and there was alot of optimism about having a healthy defense for 2004. they didn't perform up to their optimum in my opinion. the 2005 defense should be alot better.

texasguy346
07-12-2005, 07:25 PM
When we started out as an expansion team we brought in alot of veterans on defense, and looked for youth on offense. The veteran defense was to help keep the team in games as our young players on offense matured and gained experience. Our defense was getting older and it was evident that we needed to get more young guys into our defense. Capers has alot of experience with what he likes to see out of his defense, and he and Casserley put an emphasis on speed this offseason. Wong will shift from OLB to ILB (he was a MLB for the Vikes), and he is our smartest player on defense. Greenwood will play Sharper's spot, and there is no doubt that he and Wong are both better in coverage and faster than Foreman and Sharper were. Speed worked pretty well for Donnie Edwards of the Chargers last year in their 3-4, and I expect to see similiar results with Greenwood and the Texans LBs once they gel as a group.

BTW Alot of people thought it was a dumb move for Donahoe to trade back up into the first a couple years ago and pick up a talented young QB out of Tulane. I'm sure fans in Buffalo don't see it quite the same as "alot of people". You'll find that "alot of people" are prone to be wrong most of the time.

Big B Texan Fan
07-13-2005, 01:52 AM
i see but your defense wasn't broke sharper was pretty good pleople thought it was dumb to let him go
Nah, he wasn't pretty good, he more like kinda good on a bad team. Never really did much to disrupt plays in the backfield, more of a sideline to sideline guy without the speed and with what speed he has it is on the decline.

Vambo, the Marble Eye
07-13-2005, 04:38 PM
our defense has been broke from day one. sharper was good, but he lost a step and seemed to have issues with the management. with that said, if the texans really wanted to keep him, they would have. our defense was lagging last year. the year before our defense was heavily injured and there was alot of optimism about having a healthy defense for 2004. they didn't perform up to their optimum in my opinion. the 2005 defense should be alot better.

Exactly.... it is not like we have salary cap problems for the front office to be motivated to "force" Sharper's release. Under that premise, you are correct..."if we wanted to keep him, we would have", ESPECIALLY if we thought we could improve. The 05 defense HAS TO BE A LOT BETTER... and will be a key to season. If releasing Sharper and Foreman didn't raise eyebrows, what does? :)

Texan Spain
07-13-2005, 04:42 PM
If releasing Sharper and Foreman didn't raise eyebrows, what does? :)


Releasing Aaron Glenn and not signing a NT

texasguy346
07-13-2005, 06:05 PM
Well we did sign a NT by re-signing Seth Payne. I think he's a very good NT.

Evans Fan
07-13-2005, 08:25 PM
BTW Alot of people thought it was a dumb move for Donahoe to trade back up into the first a couple years ago and pick up a talented young QB out of Tulane. I'm sure fans in Buffalo don't see it quite the same as "alot of people". You'll find that "alot of people" are prone to be wrong most of the time.Hmmm from what i heard up here people thought it was stupid too, even me. People thought drafting evans was stupid but he proved them wrong so will Losman

texasguy346
07-13-2005, 10:11 PM
That's the my point. The whole "a lot of people think" logic doesn't hold much water. No one knows how it will play out till the players get to show it on the field. Guess that part got by you.

ghostlight
07-13-2005, 10:36 PM
These are the posts I was looking for. Great posts on our DL. I started a Thread asking about Walker and Payne. I just read the last 10 posts and got
a complete view of our DL going into training camp. Thanks to everybody for being so dedicaded to this board. I look forward to checking in daily.

DreamCatcher
07-15-2005, 03:04 PM
[QUOTE=Zac]
I would like McKinney to be moved to Left Guard.

[QUOTE]




I'ds like to see Mckinney moved to ..... a seat in the stands :brickwall


:highfive: I hope we see an improved McKinney because its vital that Carr gets more protection.

Texan Spain
07-15-2005, 03:48 PM
Well we did sign a NT by re-signing Seth Payne. I think he's a very good NT.

But we need a decent backup NT to give Payne oxigen and if he is injured, because we have 4-3 DT, but no goos 3-4 NT backup

Vinny
07-15-2005, 04:08 PM
New faces donít necessarily mean better players. Deloach and Ioane are probably as good as anyone's reserve nose tackles.

Zac
07-15-2005, 09:56 PM
I think that the backups on the defensive line are fine. It's the talent that is on the starters core that worries me. Walker and Payne have been :ouch: so much. Can they really contribute now. And Smith wasn't as good as I expected last year.

And even though the Linebackers are the key to a 3-4 defense. It is the defensive linemen that must apply the initial pressure for the 3-4 defense to really be effective.

Vambo, the Marble Eye
07-18-2005, 05:11 PM
Releasing Aaron Glenn and not signing a NT

Huh? Pretty big jump in logic when you have Glenn's replacement in pocket with PBuc (I was a fan of Glenn so I was sorry to see him go)... but where is a nose tackle requirement critical mass for this team when you play Indy twice and need great play out of d-backs and cover corners?

Jwwillis
07-18-2005, 06:46 PM
people need to get this out of their heads. jonathon wells was not, is not, and will never be, a starting full back. yes, we may see wells and davis in the backfield at the same time, but neither of them will be playing full back! we may see hollings and davis in the backfield, we may see wells and morency in the back field, but that gives us two tailbacks, not an RB and a FB. people are making WAY too much out of the "triple threat" article.

thats the way i read it anyway.

amen bruddah