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Fanatic24
06-04-2013, 09:45 AM
Top 20 Players in the AFC South, Texans with 9 along with some players in the honorable mention section.

Top 20 Players in the AFC South (http://www.profootballrosters.com/2013/06/04/top-20-players-afc-south/)

AngryNateFTW
06-04-2013, 10:22 AM
Wade Smith?

nero THE zero
06-04-2013, 11:18 AM
Interesting to me that Andrew Luck is receiving accolades because people expect him to be great, as opposed to him actually being great.

Not a snowball's chance in hell he is the 4th best player in the division at this point in time.

IDEXAN
06-04-2013, 11:35 AM
Not a snowball's chance in hell he is the 4th best player in the division at this point in time.
Maybe, but he's probably the MVP and almost surely the most highly coveted.

Playoffs
06-04-2013, 01:33 PM
That list is whacked. Posluszny? Reed? Freeman? Johnson?

Wade Smith?

Duane Brown ... insert any name ... Chris Myers

thunderkyss
06-04-2013, 02:04 PM
I know we give Schaub a hard time around here.... my thinking is that the home crowd "maybe" unfairly scrutinizes their QB & overstate his weaknesses.

This... got me wondering. He's an honarable mention?? Andrew Luck (& come on, as much promise as Luck shows, Schaub had a better season) top 4??

I'm going to have to reassess my assessment.

ObsiWan
06-04-2013, 06:55 PM
Looks like another name recognition exercise rather than actually watching the guys play and making assessments.

Fili
06-04-2013, 10:56 PM
Interesting to me that Andrew Luck is receiving accolades because people expect him to be great, as opposed to him actually being great.

Not a snowball's chance in hell he is the 4th best player in the division at this point in time.

Someone finally agrees with me. Just because he has all the hype and stuff doesn't make him an amazing QB. How you play on the field makes yourself.

Texan_Bill
06-04-2013, 11:04 PM
Admittedly, I didn't read the whole thing but 9 out of the 20 seems pretty good to me.

mussop
06-04-2013, 11:35 PM
Someone finally agrees with me. Just because he has all the hype and stuff doesn't make him an amazing QB. How you play on the field makes yourself.

Maybe you should watch him play.:fingergun:

TheMatrix31
06-05-2013, 04:22 AM
Andrew Luck does things that a 10 year vet does.

He most certainly belongs in the Top 10 best players in the division.

List seems generally okay. Cushing is better than 10 though. I would probably swap Cushing and Reed with each other. Cushing, when healthy, is a Top 5 MLB in the league.

IDEXAN
06-05-2013, 10:05 AM
Would you trade JJ for Luck ? Of course you would, and in a heart beat and you'd also throw in some boot like Andre or Cushing or maybe both ?

Dutchrudder
06-05-2013, 10:22 AM
Top 20 Players in the AFC South, Texans with 9 along with some players in the honorable mention section.

Top 20 Players in the AFC South (http://www.profootballrosters.com/2013/06/04/top-20-players-afc-south/)

That was the most worthless link I have seen on this forum in a long time. Since your post history seems to be only linking that specific website, I can only assume you work for them. In the future, at least get some content, analysis and actual meat in your articles if you want people to take them serious. In the meantime, have some negs.

cuppacoffee
06-05-2013, 10:25 AM
Would you trade JJ for Luck ? Of course you would, and in a heart beat and you'd also throw in some boot like Andre or Cushing or maybe both ?


:pigfly:



:coffee:

thunderkyss
06-05-2013, 10:42 AM
Maybe you should watch him play.:fingergun:

Andre Johnson
Duane Brown
Arian Foster
JJWatt
Jonathan Joseph

That's 5 players who were better players than Andrew Luck

ObsiWan
06-05-2013, 11:59 AM
Would you trade JJ for Luck ? Of course you would, and in a heart beat and you'd also throw in some boot like Andre or Cushing or maybe both ?

Which "JJ"??
Actually it doesn't matter because I wouldn't trade Jonathan Joseph and certainly not J.J. Watt for Andrew Luck. That's just plain crazy talk.

Playoffs
06-05-2013, 12:18 PM
Would you trade JJ for Luck ? Of course you would, and in a heart beat and you'd also throw in some boot like Andre or Cushing or maybe both ?:lol:
http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/files/2012/12/20121230_TexansColts_SNP_22-600x399.jpg
http://media.sacbee.com/smedia/2013/01/02/12/50/V5yYt.St.4.jpg
http://gridirongrit.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/J.J.-Watt-Houston-Texans-Andrew-Luck-Indianapolis-Colts.jpg

Say Watt
06-05-2013, 12:30 PM
That was the most worthless link I have seen on this forum in a long time. Since your post history seems to be only linking that specific website, I can only assume you work for them. In the future, at least get some content, analysis and actual meat in your articles if you want people to take them serious. In the meantime, have some negs.

:spit:

I don't know why but for some reason that post reminded me of the scene towards the end of Billy Madison with the whole, "At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

IDEXAN
06-05-2013, 12:34 PM
Which "JJ"??
Actually it doesn't matter because I wouldn't trade Jonathan Joseph and certainly not J.J. Watt for Andrew Luck. That's just plain crazy talk.
JJ Watt is a tremendous football player who's also very young which of course makes him even much more valuable, but he's not a QB and you can bet the Texans wouldn't blink an eye if they got a chance to make that deal for Luck.

dream_team
06-05-2013, 12:38 PM
JJ Watt is a tremendous football player who's also very young which of course makes him even much more valuable, but he's not a QB and you can bet the Texans wouldn't blink an eye if they got a chance to make that deal for Luck.

Unfortunately, this is true. JJ Watt is currently the face of our franchise, and doing an awesome job at that. He will soon be the highest paid defensive player in history. But he ain't a QB, and this is a QB driven league.

thunderkyss
06-05-2013, 12:43 PM
JJ Watt is a tremendous football player who's also very young which of course makes him even much more valuable, but he's not a QB and you can bet the Texans wouldn't blink an eye if they got a chance to make that deal for Luck.

The Texans had every opportunity to enter the suck for Luck fray, but chose not to.

Besides, this isn't about the player with the most upside poll. It's the top 20 players. Like you said, Jj Watt is a tremendous player & Andrew Luck might be.

Andrew Luck isn't even the best QB in the AFC South, much less player. He might have the most upside, the brightest future, whatever you want to call it. But he's not the best QB, much less player, in the AFC South.

nero THE zero
06-05-2013, 12:43 PM
JJ Watt is a tremendous football player who's also very young which of course makes him even much more valuable, but he's not a QB and you can bet the Texans wouldn't blink an eye if they got a chance to make that deal for Luck.

I would trade JJ Watt for Andrew Luck, and I would also say that JJ Watt is a vastly better player than Andrew Luck (at this point in time).

Your argument is a red herring.

infantrycak
06-05-2013, 12:49 PM
JJ Watt is a tremendous football player who's also very young which of course makes him even much more valuable, but he's not a QB and you can bet the Texans wouldn't blink an eye if they got a chance to make that deal for Luck.

Unfortunately, this is true. JJ Watt is currently the face of our franchise, and doing an awesome job at that. He will soon be the highest paid defensive player in history. But he ain't a QB, and this is a QB driven league.

Y'all are assuming Luck turns into Manning or Brady. Your opinions look a lot more sketchy if you envision the next Bradford, Palmer or Rivers.

thunderkyss
06-05-2013, 12:52 PM
Unfortunately, this is true. JJ Watt is currently the face of our franchise, and doing an awesome job at that. He will soon be the highest paid defensive player in history. But he ain't a QB, and this is a QB driven league.

I bet Jj's effort will go a lot further than Luck's efforts towards winning the AFC South next season.

IDEXAN
06-05-2013, 02:05 PM
Y'all are assuming Luck turns into Manning or Brady. Your opinions look a lot more sketchy if you envision the next Bradford, Palmer or Rivers.
Luck wouldn't need to be a HOFer like Manning or Brady, just a very good NFL QB who was a reliable starter for at least 9-10 years for the deal to be a no brainer for the Texans, even if JJ ultimately went to the HOF as a Colt.

Dutchrudder
06-05-2013, 02:45 PM
:spit:

I don't know why but for some reason that post reminded me of the scene towards the end of Billy Madison with the whole, "At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

I didn't think of that while writing it, but it does have that tone. At least with some of other non-posting contributors (emDiggy, Battleredblog guys), their work has merit and analysis. Some guy makes a list of players with no justifications for anything, and there's really not much to discuss. It's lazy and belongs on Bleacherreport. Anyone can do that, look:

Top 8 AFC Head Coaches:

1. Bill Belicheck
2. John Harbaugh
3. Mike Tomlin
4. Peyton Manning
5. Gary Kubiak
6. Marvin Lewis
7. Mike Munchak
8. Andy Reid


Honorable Mentions:
Rob Chudzinski
Rex Ryan
Chuck Pagano

infantrycak
06-05-2013, 03:20 PM
Luck wouldn't need to be a HOFer like Manning or Brady, just a very good NFL QB who was a reliable starter for at least 9-10 years for the deal to be a no brainer for the Texans, even if JJ ultimately went to the HOF as a Colt.

That's like saying teams would line up to trade JJ for Schaub after his 1st year as a Texan.

IDEXAN
06-05-2013, 05:20 PM
That's like saying teams would line up to trade JJ for Schaub after his 1st year as a Texan.
Schaub after one year in Houston = Andrew Luck after one year in Indy ? As Texans' fans, you and I could only wish that to be true. Schaub at any point in his career never had close to the upside Luck enjoys today.

HoustonFrog
06-05-2013, 06:04 PM
Funny because with all those players I'm already seeing this. Don't agree with it entirely but have seen similar talk.

@evansilva#Texans play in weak division, probably still win 9-10, but I think their window has closed. Will need overhaul sooner rather than later.
1:53pm - 5 Jun 13

@evansilva Good team with arrow pointing down = #Texans. Game-manager QB becoming liability. O-centerpiece RB overworked, already inj. Ed Reed FA bust.

thunderkyss
06-05-2013, 06:51 PM
Schaub after one year in Houston = Andrew Luck after one year in Indy ? As Texans' fans, you and I could only wish that to be true. Schaub at any point in his career never had close to the upside Luck enjoys today.

Sounds like Schaub hate. You said.......
Luck wouldn't need to be a HOFer like Manning or Brady, just a very good NFL QB who was a reliable starter for at least 9-10 years for the deal to be a no brainer for the Texans, even if JJ ultimately went to the HOF as a Colt.

In 7 years, Schaub's been pretty good, & he's been reliable. More reliable than say.. Ben Roethlisberger anyway.

Now you're saying Schaub never had "that" kind of upside? Two years ago the Texans "should have" been in the Super Bowl if Schaub would have been healthy. For most of 2012, the Texans were considered the best team in the league & Schaub was part of that.

If you're taking HOF off the table. If you're taking Peyton-like & Brady-like off the table, then yeah... You are saying you'd trade HOF Jj Watt for Tony Romo, Phillip Rivers, Carson Palmer, Matt Schaub.

ObsiWan
06-05-2013, 06:53 PM
Luck wouldn't need to be a HOFer like Manning or Brady, just a very good NFL QB who was a reliable starter for at least 9-10 years for the deal to be a no brainer for the Texans, even if JJ ultimately went to the HOF as a Colt.

you mean like... saaaay a Matt Schaub or a Carlson Palmer or a Donavan McNabb...?

You'd trade J.J. Watt or a shutdown CB (when fully healthy) like J. Joe for one of those guys??

And we don't know if Luck will even be THAT good yet.

Naaah... not me.
But each to his own.

ObsiWan
06-05-2013, 06:59 PM
Schaub after one year in Houston = Andrew Luck after one year in Indy ? As Texans' fans, you and I could only wish that to be true. Schaub at any point in his career never had close to the upside Luck enjoys today.

Upside is all in the mind of the beholder until shown to be true.

Amobi Okoye had "upside". Flashed talent his rookie year too. How'd that "upside" work? Coming out of college Brady Quinn had "upside". Hell some folks thought David Carr had upside.

I know you gotta put your chips on rookies sometime or you'll end up like George Allen with a team full of old farts. I get that.

But I'm not trading proven commodities like Watt and Joseph on a maybe. No matter how much that maybe is hyped.

Like I said, each to his own.

infantrycak
06-05-2013, 07:28 PM
Upside is all in the mind of the beholder until shown to be true.

Upside is also a result of the starting point. Luck had a miserable 54.1 completion % - he needs a good 10% improvement. Nobody could reasonably expect Schaub to add 10% to his 66.4% 1st year completion %.

I am not slagging Luck at all, I just don't think he had a year close to as impressive as Russell Wilson but one much more like Carson Palmer, Rivers, etc.

thunderkyss
06-05-2013, 07:59 PM
I am not slagging Luck at all, I just don't think he had a year close to as impressive as Russell Wilson but one much more like Carson Palmer, Rivers, etc.

I'm slagging him. The guy just doesn't look like the best prospect since David Carr (if you remember, Carr was at one time thought to be a no miss franchise QB). He looked like a rookie to me. Sure, he was doing some things you only see 10 year vets do, but he showed us plenty that he was without a doubt, a rookie.

Last year, it looked like they were fine with Luck being Luck & they gave him all kinds of freedom to do what he do. But sooner or later, they're going to ask him to start learning some NFL QB stuff.

I'm not saying I don't think he can handle it, I have no idea. But I want to see him actually develop. If he's who they say he is then he can definitely be the next Brady, or Manning. But if he just rides his God given talent for the next 10 years, he's the next McNabb, the next Romo.

EllisUnit
06-05-2013, 08:03 PM
Wow i cant believe i am seeing some here say they would trade JJ for Luck. Watt has been a big time game changer, Luck had an ok season last year. JJ has had 2 amazing seasons and we know what we got with him, luck not so much.

Lord where did loyalty go ? Especially for a guy who plays his heart out for us, Seems like a lot of you are ready to put luck in the HOF. Not quite yet folks. on the other hand JJ had the best season ever for a player at his position, get real people.

Thorn
06-05-2013, 09:14 PM
8 of the first 11 ranked players seems pretty good.

IDEXAN
06-05-2013, 10:44 PM
Wow i cant believe i am seeing some here say they would trade JJ for Luck. Watt has been a big time game changer, Luck had an ok season last year. JJ has had 2 amazing seasons and we know what we got with him, luck not so much.

Lord where did loyalty go ? Especially for a guy who plays his heart out for us, Seems like a lot of you are ready to put luck in the HOF. Not quite yet folks. on the other hand JJ had the best season ever for a player at his position, get real people.
My comment in no way means any disrespect for the great young talent Watt is, it's just that QB is far and away the single most important position in the NFL. If given the chance, I'm confidant that any team in this league including the Texans that doesn't have a promising young QB would trade ANY single player they have straight up for Luck.

thunderkyss
06-06-2013, 12:01 AM
My comment in no way means any disrespect for the great young talent Watt is, it's just that QB is far and away the single most important position in the NFL. If given the chance, I'm confidant that any team in this league including the Texans that doesn't have a promising young QB would trade ANY single player they have straight up for Luck.

You think the Broncos would trade Manning, The Patriots would trade Brady? The Vikings would trade Peterson?

For the third best rookie QB of 2012? That's insane & would be too big a gamble, I think, for those players, or even Jj Watt.

The QB is a big piece of the puzzle, but even the Colts took several years to win it all with one of the best of our generation. The organization from top to bottom has to be perfectly aligned & there's been way too many changes in Indy to think they've struck gold a second time..... from top to bottom.

Odds are against it regardless how good Luck is. A promising young QB couldn't win a play off game in Atlanta for 4 years. StLouis & Detroit appear to be going nowhere fast. & these were very good prospects, not Jamarcus/Vince prospects.

It would be something, if Luck turns out as good as Phillip Rivers & he hasn't won anything in the NFL.

EVOLVIST
06-06-2013, 01:06 AM
For the third best rookie QB of 2012? That's insane & would be too big a gamble, I think, for those players, or even Jj Watt.

3rd best? And we're talking upside, too, right, out of an amazing football class?

More like Luck was the 4th best, and he was barely ahead of Tannehill in QB rating, but Luck didn't have as good a completion % Tannehill.

Or let me put it this way on the upside scale:

1.) RGIII
2.) Russell Wilson
3.) Nick Foles
4.) Andrew Luck
5.) Ryan Tannehill

Foles, you say? For a kid who was thrown into a shambles of an Eagles team, who never got 1st team reps, and still managed to post a better QB rating than Luck, as well as a better completion %? Yes. All day, please.

I'll take the 6'-6" 243lb pure pocket pass out of Austin, Texas, for upside, over that pretender who was originally born in Washington DC. Oliver Luck is from Ohio. These aren't Texans. :pissed:

Bring Foles to Houston for some of next year's draft picks, because lord knows he's going to rot on Chip Kelly's bench like a Billy Volek. That's my trade for upside.

DocBar
06-06-2013, 01:28 AM
I can't think of a single player I'd trade Watt for. Including any QB in the league. That man is going to be a HOF'er and a monster for years to come. This is a QB driven league and guys that can get after the QB are just as valuable.

I'll taken proven over potential all day long.

Norg
06-06-2013, 02:00 AM
geee I don't think reed has ever played a down has a player in the AFCS I hope there right tho knocks on wood

IDEXAN
06-06-2013, 08:12 AM
I can't think of a single player I'd trade Watt for. Including any QB in the league. That man is going to be a HOF'er and a monster for years to come. This is a QB driven league and guys that can get after the QB are just as valuable.

I'll taken proven over potential all day long.
You just said it all Doc - This is a QB driven league.
To reiterate, the Texans would trade Watt for Luck (or RG3), in a heartbeat.
Rick Smith or Gary Kubiak or Bob McNair would never admit that of course, nor would they ever get the opportunity to make that deal because the Colts (or the Redskins) would never make that trade if given the opportunity.
Anybody who doesn't understand this needs to go back and take the remedial course in NFL 101. The thing is it's almost impossible to overstate the value of a "franchise QB" in the NFL.

thunderkyss
06-06-2013, 08:35 AM
Or let me put it this way on the upside scale:

1.) RGIII
2.) Russell Wilson
3.) Nick Foles
4.) Andrew Luck
5.) Ryan Tannehill

Foles, you say? For a kid who was thrown into a shambles of an Eagles team, who never got 1st team reps, and still managed to post a better QB rating than Luck, as well as a better completion %? Yes. All day, please.

I'll take the 6'-6" 243lb pure pocket pass out of Austin, Texas, for upside...

You make a fine argument for Foles.... but as far as the numbers go, who knows how they would have been had he started the whole season with the Eagles.

& he makes Matt Schaub look like Brad Pitt.

http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/static/img/getty/headshot/F/O/L/FOL058566.jpg

thunderkyss
06-06-2013, 08:39 AM
You just said it all Doc - This is a QB driven league.
To reiterate, the Texans would trade Watt for Luck (or RG3), in a heartbeat.
Rick Smith or Gary Kubiak or Bob McNair would never admit that of course, nor would they ever get the opportunity to make that deal because the Colts (or the Redskins) would never make that trade if given the opportunity.
Anybody who doesn't understand this needs to go back and take the remedial course in NFL 101. The thing is it's almost impossible to overstate the value of a "franchise QB" in the NFL.


http://cbssports.com/images/blogs/cam-newton-superman-hs1.jpg

We'll see in year two. Playing QB in the NFL is not just about talent, that's only part of it. There are a lot more talented QBs who've come & gone in the NFL with less than half the success Matt Schaub has had. & Kubiak picked him up off someone's bench. So I think they may evaluate QBs a little differently than you do.

BigBull17
06-06-2013, 09:27 AM
:lol:
http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/files/2012/12/20121230_TexansColts_SNP_22-600x399.jpg
http://media.sacbee.com/smedia/2013/01/02/12/50/V5yYt.St.4.jpg
http://gridirongrit.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/J.J.-Watt-Houston-Texans-Andrew-Luck-Indianapolis-Colts.jpg

That middle picture is almost like a bad prison porno.

No way Kareem shouldn't be on the list. Dude is a legit CB. But I guess Andrew Brady Montana Manning Luck has to have at least 5 spots to himself. Surprised he isn't #1-7

dream_team
06-06-2013, 11:13 AM
Wow i cant believe i am seeing some here say they would trade JJ for Luck. Watt has been a big time game changer, Luck had an ok season last year. JJ has had 2 amazing seasons and we know what we got with him, luck not so much.

Lord where did loyalty go ? Especially for a guy who plays his heart out for us, Seems like a lot of you are ready to put luck in the HOF. Not quite yet folks. on the other hand JJ had the best season ever for a player at his position, get real people.

I love JJ! No lost loyalty here. Last season, he had the most dominating season I have ever seen by a defensive player. I believe he will be deservingly the highest paid defensive player in NFL history. Not to mention, he's being a model citizen that's representing the Texans extremely well. Unfortunately, if I was presented with a Luck for JJ trade, I'd have to take it. I can understand if you wouldn't, but I would. QB's simply last longer and have more influence in the game.

Playoffs
06-06-2013, 01:26 PM
Actually Idexan isn't that far off, in my opinion. I think Luck will be great. He showed some unexpected courage and toughness last year -- took some withering hits. Maybe not so smart on that count, I bet he had 3, 4, 5 walking concussions. But he got back up.

I just can't give up Watt. http://i660.photobucket.com/albums/uu330/cthulhu19887/smileys/smilie20shaking20head20NO.gif Anyone but JJ.

paycheck71
06-06-2013, 02:34 PM
You think the Broncos would trade Manning, The Patriots would trade Brady? The Vikings would trade Peterson?



To be fair, the Colts did essentially trade Manning for Luck. They could have traded their #1 pick like the Rams did with #2 to build around Manning, instead of releasing Manning and taking Luck. We'll see if that decision was right. But on the whole I agree with you in this argument of where Luck stands as of now.

ObsiWan
06-06-2013, 02:59 PM
You just said it all Doc - This is a QB driven league.
To reiterate, the Texans would trade Watt for Luck (or RG3), in a heartbeat.
Rick Smith or Gary Kubiak or Bob McNair would never admit that of course, nor would they ever get the opportunity to make that deal because the Colts (or the Redskins) would never make that trade if given the opportunity.
Anybody who doesn't understand this needs to go back and take the remedial course in NFL 101. The thing is it's almost impossible to overstate the value of a "franchise QB" in the NFL.

Since this premise (that the Texans would trade Watt for Luck straight up) - as well as my opposing one (the Texans would NOT make that trade) - are equally unproveable I guess we'll have to call this a draw.

I'll reiterate, Watt is a demonstrated talent, who as the season progressed became the one guy who had to be game planned for ...and STILL he exceled. He may well be the first Texan into the Hall of Fame (I know, I know... it should be A.J. but the HoF voters seem to diss WRs)

Luck is a could-be/should be star who was drafted high, with much ballyhoo, but, stat-wise anyway, was kind of a bust.

As someone else pointed out, premier pass-rushers are just as hard to come by as premier passers. Whether you'd trade one to get the other straight up (thereby leaving a big@$$ hole no matter which one you lose) is a function of where your team is perceived to be lacking.

Kubiak & McNair seem to have faith in Schaub. At the moment. I doubt they'd trade Watt for Luck at this point in time.

If we still had Carr as our starter, you'd have a much better argument.

EVOLVIST
06-06-2013, 04:10 PM
You make a fine argument for Foles.... but as far as the numbers go, who knows how they would have been had he started the whole season with the Eagles.

Actually, I think my argument is weak, which brings home my point that my argument is just as strong for Foles as it is for Luck in this case since we are talking potential, upside, etc.

At this moment the same upside for Luck is the same upside that everyone - including myself - bought into with David Carr. It's buying into a concept, when really both Foles and Cousins for that matter, showed that they were just as NFL savvy and ready as rookies as Luck did. And we're not just talking stats: we're talking command on the field, poise, and the ability to improvise.

thunderkyss
06-06-2013, 05:09 PM
To be fair, the Colts did essentially trade Manning for Luck. They could have traded their #1 pick like the Rams did with #2 to build around Manning, instead of releasing Manning and taking Luck. We'll see if that decision was right. But on the whole I agree with you in this argument of where Luck stands as of now.

A little different. The Broncos rolled the dice & took a position the Colts weren't ready to (obviously, they had options the Broncos did not). But if we're talking end of 2012 season Manning, I don't think the Colts take Luck with that pick.

& if they did, we'd still see PM on the field & Luck holding a clip board.

EllisUnit
06-06-2013, 07:59 PM
I love JJ! No lost loyalty here. Last season, he had the most dominating season I have ever seen by a defensive player. I believe he will be deservingly the highest paid defensive player in NFL history. Not to mention, he's being a model citizen that's representing the Texans extremely well. Unfortunately, if I was presented with a Luck for JJ trade, I'd have to take it. I can understand if you wouldn't, but I would. QB's simply last longer and have more influence in the game.

Just think of it like this, how would our dline look without Watt, teams would have all day to pick our D apart. Luck may be good but i dont want to see our offense have to go TD for TD. And yes i think Watt is that big of a game changer.

So we would have a unproven QB taking charge of our offense which has more holes than QB, and losing a key piece to our Defense. This is why we just watch the games :).

TheMatrix31
06-07-2013, 04:46 AM
The four most important positions on a football team are QB, LT, DE, and MLB.

We have the best DE in football. We also have arguably the best LT, and a Top 5 MLB.

Watt had more direct impact on football games throughout the year than any other player did. I mean seriously, go back and look. The guy straight up changed MULTIPLE games. I haven't seen a defensive player dominate a season like that game-in, game-out in my life. Granted, I'm not old enough to have watched Lawrence Taylor play, but that's what I imagine.

Worthless discussion to pass the time, I get it, but LOL. Both these players, barring injury, are going to be around for a long ****ing time.

ObsiWan
06-08-2013, 12:14 AM
The four most important positions on a football team are QB, LT, DE, and MLB.

We have the best DE in football. We also have arguably the best LT, and a Top 5 MLB.

Watt had more direct impact on football games throughout the year than any other player did. I mean seriously, go back and look. The guy straight up changed MULTIPLE games. I haven't seen a defensive player dominate a season like that game-in, game-out in my life. Granted, I'm not old enough to have watched Lawrence Taylor play, but that's what I imagine.

Worthless discussion to pass the time, I get it, but LOL. Both these players, barring injury, are going to be around for a long ****ing time.
In today's pass-happy NFL, I might pick CB ahead of MLB. And, taking K.J. and J-Jo as a pair, we are set pretty well. I'd put them as best set of CBs in the AFC South.

TEXANRED
06-08-2013, 12:35 AM
Would you trade JJ for Luck ? Of course you would, and in a heart beat and you'd also throw in some boot like Andre or Cushing or maybe both ?

If my name were Charley Casserly.

TEXANRED
06-08-2013, 12:40 AM
Maybe you should watch him play.:fingergun:

***********coughvinceyoungcough******************

TheMatrix31
06-08-2013, 05:20 AM
In today's pass-happy NFL, I might pick CB ahead of MLB. And, taking K.J. and J-Jo as a pair, we are set pretty well. I'd put them as best set of CBs in the AFC South.


I wouldn't. Our defense was COMPLETELY changed once Cushing went down. He's the defensive QB.

ObsiWan
06-08-2013, 06:01 AM
I wouldn't. Our defense was COMPLETELY changed once Cushing went down. He's the defensive QB.

I won't disagree with that, but it's because of the animal that Cushing is, not because of the criticallity of the MLB position. The guys who stepped in when Cush went down were a couple of levels below him in ability and effectiveness.

Let me put it this way, if you're saying Cush is the 4th most valuable Texan because of his talent, I won't argue that. Well, not much.

But if you're saying having a stud MLB is more significant than having a pair of shutdown CBs, in today's pass-happy NFL, I can't go there with you.

IDEXAN
06-08-2013, 09:06 AM
The four most important positions on a football team are QB, LT, DE, and MLB.


Change that to - the four most important positions on a football team are QB, LT, DE/OLB (scheme dependent: 4-3 or 3-4 ?), and CB.

thunderkyss
06-08-2013, 09:49 AM
I wouldn't. Our defense was COMPLETELY changed once Cushing went down. He's the defensive QB.

Technically they stripped Cushing of his defensive QBing duties before the season started, under the guise of allowing him the freedom to make more plays.

Bradie James was the QB of the defense & losing him wasn't a big deal.

Indy Skinnz
06-29-2013, 10:52 AM
Since this premise (that the Texans would trade Watt for Luck straight up) - as well as my opposing one (the Texans would NOT make that trade) - are equally unproveable I guess we'll have to call this a draw.

I'll reiterate, Watt is a demonstrated talent, who as the season progressed became the one guy who had to be game planned for ...and STILL he exceled. He may well be the first Texan into the Hall of Fame (I know, I know... it should be A.J. but the HoF voters seem to diss WRs)

Luck is a could-be/should be star who was drafted high, with much ballyhoo, but, stat-wise anyway, was kind of a bust.

As someone else pointed out, premier pass-rushers are just as hard to come by as premier passers. Whether you'd trade one to get the other straight up (thereby leaving a big@$$ hole no matter which one you lose) is a function of where your team is perceived to be lacking.

Kubiak & McNair seem to have faith in Schaub. At the moment. I doubt they'd trade Watt for Luck at this point in time.

If we still had Carr as our starter, you'd have a much better argument.

Sorry to revive a dated thread that is nothing but message board fantasy stuff but it is the off season and I am bored.

How about asking the question this way - if all 4 AFC South teams were starting over and had their choice of any player, who goes first - Luck or Watt? Personally, I think the answer is pretty clear.

The reality is both teams have a young player who is or will be special.

IDEXAN
06-29-2013, 11:28 AM
Sorry to revive a dated thread that is nothing but message board fantasy stuff but it is the off season and I am bored.

How about asking the question this way - if all 4 AFC South teams were starting over and had their choice of any player, who goes first - Luck or Watt? Personally, I think the answer is pretty clear.

The reality is both teams have a young player who is or will be special.
No Brainer - gotta go with the young, franchise QB. Happy Indy ?

nero THE zero
06-29-2013, 12:22 PM
Sorry to revive a dated thread that is nothing but message board fantasy stuff but it is the off season and I am bored.

How about asking the question this way - if all 4 AFC South teams were starting over and had their choice of any player, who goes first - Luck or Watt? Personally, I think the answer is pretty clear.

The reality is both teams have a young player who is or will be special.

Yes, as I said previously, this is a red herring.

Luck would be taken based on (a) the importance of the position and (b) his potential.

That said, Watt's a better player than Luck is right now.

Indy Skinnz
06-29-2013, 12:33 PM
Yes, as I said previously, this is a red herring.

Luck would be taken based on (a) the importance of the position and (b) his potential.

That said, Watt's a better player than Luck is right now.

Agree all the way around. Complete red herring. And Watt is the better player right now. But with age & potential factored in, I would not trade Luck for any player in the league right now.

ObsiWan
06-29-2013, 01:16 PM
No Brainer - gotta go with the young, franchise QB. Happy Indy ?

ummm... didn't WE do that once?
Hell I'm still having nightmares about how that turned out. Not saying that Luck will become Carr-like, but if I'm starting a brand new franchise I'm building my defense first.
Then I build the offense.
Why build defense first? So if I go young QB, and he screws up - and he will - the stud defense can minimize the damage.
And when I start to build my offense, I'm not so sure I don't go stud LT and start building a solid O-line before getting that young QB. I'd even lean toward trying to sign/draft as close to a stud RB as I can find so when I do get that young "franchise" QB, he has a solid team around him and won't have to carry franchise on his shoulders.

Do you think Luck would have been as successful at the helm of the 2002 Texans as he was for the 2012 Colts?? I sure don't.

And your premise was that we're starting a brand new franchise. Not that your stud QB is stepping into an established, playoff-level team. Just to be clear, everyone knows that 2-14 season was an aberration, not the norm for Indy.

thunderkyss
06-29-2013, 02:37 PM
Sorry to revive a dated thread that is nothing but message board fantasy stuff but it is the off season and I am bored.

How about asking the question this way - if all 4 AFC South teams were starting over and had their choice of any player, who goes first - Luck or Watt? Personally, I think the answer is pretty clear.

The reality is both teams have a young player who is or will be special.

Vince Young was taken with the #3 pick in the 2006 draft. D'Brickshaw Ferguson with the 4th.

Who was the better player?

In all honesty, if I were going to pick players based on winning right now, I'd pick Schaub. If I were wanting to win in the future, I'd pick Luck. Neither are the best player in the AFC South right now, but it's a QB driven league.

Jj Watt is the best player in the AFC South, coming off a historic season. If the question was asked in 2009, CJ2ypc would have been #1. Most other seasons, Peyton Manning.

Indy Skinnz
06-29-2013, 03:07 PM
Vince Young was taken with the #3 pick in the 2006 draft. D'Brickshaw Ferguson with the 4th.

Who was the better player?

In all honesty, if I were going to pick players based on winning right now, I'd pick Schaub. If I were wanting to win in the future, I'd pick Luck. Neither are the best player in the AFC South right now, but it's a QB driven league.

Jj Watt is the best player in the AFC South, coming off a historic season. If the question was asked in 2009, CJ2ypc would have been #1. Most other seasons, Peyton Manning.

Had a witty but sarcastic response all typed up but decided that since I am visitor to be more reasonable. Instead I will just say that I respectfully disagree.

Indy Skinnz
06-29-2013, 03:12 PM
ummm... didn't WE do that once?
Hell I'm still having nightmares about how that turned out. Not saying that Luck will become Carr-like, but if I'm starting a brand new franchise I'm building my defense first.
Then I build the offense.
Why build defense first? So if I go young QB, and he screws up - and he will - the stud defense can minimize the damage.
And when I start to build my offense, I'm not so sure I don't go stud LT and start building a solid O-line before getting that young QB. I'd even lean toward trying to sign/draft as close to a stud RB as I can find so when I do get that young "franchise" QB, he has a solid team around him and won't have to carry franchise on his shoulders.

Do you think Luck would have been as successful at the helm of the 2002 Texans as he was for the 2012 Colts?? I sure don't.

And your premise was that we're starting a brand new franchise. Not that your stud QB is stepping into an established, playoff-level team. Just to be clear, everyone knows that 2-14 season was an aberration, not the norm for Indy.

If given the chance to draft a franchise level QB, no NFL exec would pass up that player to build the team in the manner you suggest. None. It is the single most important position in all of sports. The fact that Carr was not what he expected to be does not change that premise.

The 2012 Colts were what they turned out to be largely because of Luck. The talent on the roster was sorely lacking at a multitude of positions.

ObsiWan
06-29-2013, 03:43 PM
If given the chance to draft a franchise level QB, no NFL exec would pass up that player to build the team in the manner you suggest. None. It is the single most important position in all of sports. The fact that Carr was not what he expected to be does not change that premise.

The 2012 Colts were what they turned out to be largely because of Luck. The talent on the roster was sorely lacking at a multitude of positions.

You asked what we - in this case me - would do. I've seen recovering franchises draft that "franchise QB guy" but not have a damn thing around him. they flounder until they get the rest of the pieces and usually that QB suffers.

Do you really think the Colts would have had the success they did without Mathis and Freeney shoring up that defense or without Reggie Wayne as a proven go-to guy? The Colts were no where near a "starting over" franchise.

Your original question was if all the AFCS franchises were starting over - and starting over, to me, implies they're all new franchises - and they had their pick of any player, who goes first Watt or Luck? You didn't say who would they draft? So that says that, in some alternate reality, Watt and Luck have played as they've played to date, and somehow they're available to each team via expansion draft. Given those parameters, I'm going Watt. I'm building my defense.
That's my decision. Build the foundation first (defense, O-line) then add the fancy accessories (QB, WR).
I have no issue with the path you chose, franchise QB first. It just ain't my way.

Indy Skinnz
06-29-2013, 03:53 PM
You asked what we - in this case me - would do. I've seen recovering franchises draft that "franchise QB guy" but not have a damn thing around him. they flounder until they get the rest of the pieces and usually that QB suffers.

Do you really think the Colts would have had the success they did without Mathis and Freeney shoring up that defense or without Reggie Wayne as a proven go-to guy? The Colts were no where near a "starting over" franchise.

Your original question was if all the AFCS franchises were starting over - and starting over, to me, implies they're all new franchises - and they had their pick of any player, who goes first Watt or Luck? You didn't say who would they draft? So that says that, in some alternate reality, Watt and Luck have played as they've played to date, and somehow they're available to each team via expansion draft. Given those parameters, I'm going Watt. I'm building my defense.
That's my decision. Build the foundation first (defense, O-line) then add the fancy accessories (QB, WR).
I have no issue with the path you chose, franchise QB first. It just ain't my way.

Fair enough. You have your path and I think differently. Silly debate anyway because the neither the Colts or Houston is offering either of their respective best players in a trade. And the alternate reality of both teams starting over ain't happening either. We are both happy with the great players on our teams - that is how it should be.

76Texan
06-29-2013, 05:41 PM
Let's backtrack to 2006, when the Texans had the first pick.
Some wanted VY, others wanted Bush; some of us wanted Mario Williams.

So yeah, people have different thinking about how to build a team.

HJam72
06-29-2013, 05:56 PM
Let's backtrack to 2006, when the Texans had the first pick.
Some wanted VY, others wanted Bush; some of us wanted Mario Williams.

So yeah, people have different thinking about how to build a team.

I have to laugh, because, as far as I'm concerned, everybody was wrong and none of those guys was worthy of the entire first round. We made up for it when we got Ryans early in the 2nd. It's not like I knew this in 2006, though.

BullBlitz
06-29-2013, 06:33 PM
Luck is a could-be/should be star who was drafted high, with much ballyhoo, but, stat-wise anyway, was kind of a bust.

Sorry bro, but that is one of the most ill-informed statements I have ever seen on this Board, which is really saying something.

:vincepalm:

76Texan
06-29-2013, 06:39 PM
I have to laugh, because, as far as I'm concerned, everybody was wrong and none of those guys was worthy of the entire first round. We made up for it when we got Ryans early in the 2nd. It's not like I knew this in 2006, though.

That's besides the point.
What is in play here is that some want to start their building block with a pass rusher, some want a QB, some want a RB, and perhaps others want a different position.

thunderkyss
06-29-2013, 06:46 PM
Sorry bro, but that is one of the most ill-informed statements I have ever seen on this Board, which is really saying something.

:vincepalm:

I agree with ObsiWan. Luck shows promise, but he was not the best rookie QB of his class. If someone were to argue who was, it would be a close race between RG3 & Russell Wilson. It's difficult to say if Luck lived up to expectations without considering RG3 & Wilson. Had they not come in the league at the same time, maybe we can look at the Colts & say, "Yeah, he's the best QB prospect to enter the league in years." But with what RG3 & Russel Wilson did... I can't say that. Then Kaepernick's first year as a starter...

Right now, there isn't much separation between Luck, Tannerhill, & Chad Henne... yes, Chad Henne.

BullBlitz
06-29-2013, 07:32 PM
I agree with ObsiWan. Luck shows promise, but he was not the best rookie QB of his class. If someone were to argue who was, it would be a close race between RG3 & Russell Wilson. It's difficult to say if Luck lived up to expectations without considering RG3 & Wilson. Had they not come in the league at the same time, maybe we can look at the Colts & say, "Yeah, he's the best QB prospect to enter the league in years." But with what RG3 & Russel Wilson did... I can't say that. Then Kaepernick's first year as a starter...

Right now, there isn't much separation between Luck, Tannerhill, & Chad Henne... yes, Chad Henne.

My response was solely to him calling Luck a bust.

Indy Skinnz
06-29-2013, 07:57 PM
I agree with ObsiWan. Luck shows promise, but he was not the best rookie QB of his class. If someone were to argue who was, it would be a close race between RG3 & Russell Wilson. It's difficult to say if Luck lived up to expectations without considering RG3 & Wilson. Had they not come in the league at the same time, maybe we can look at the Colts & say, "Yeah, he's the best QB prospect to enter the league in years." But with what RG3 & Russel Wilson did... I can't say that. Then Kaepernick's first year as a starter...

Right now, there isn't much separation between Luck, Tannerhill, & Chad Henne... yes, Chad Henne.

I am not going to attempt to change your mind because that would be a lost cause I am sure. I will say however the Henne comment has to be just designed to illicit a response because you can't really think that.

I think the odds are pretty good that Luck is going to be a pain the backsides of Houston fans for the the next dozen or so years.

Playoffs
06-29-2013, 08:06 PM
Right now, there isn't much separation between Luck, Tannerhill, & Chad Henne... yes, Chad Henne.

Okay I'll take Luck, and you take Tannehill & Henne. Every day, twice on Sundays. :brando:

thunderkyss
06-29-2013, 08:15 PM
I think the odds are pretty good that Luck is going to be a pain the backsides of Houston fans for the the next dozen or so years.

Good. That'll leave y'all scratching your heads for the next 4 years. A few of your fans will know, but the rest of you won't believe it. You'll make excuses & change everything about the team before you realize.....

Okay I'll take Luck, and you take Tannehill & Henne. Every day, twice on Sundays. :brando:


Three years from now we'll come back to this.

BullBlitz
06-29-2013, 08:21 PM
Good. That'll leave y'all scratching your heads for the next 4 years. A few of your fans will know, but the rest of you won't believe it. You'll make excuses & change everything about the team.

The primary head scratching that will be occurring in the AFC South will be Texans fans trying to figure out why the team committed such a big long term contract to Schaub before he ever played in a single playoff game. What did he deliver? Out after the wild card round, just like TJ. I keep waiting for something better, but all we hear are .... excuses. Like letting home field advantage slip away.

I am looking forward to 5-10 years of Luck dominating the division myself. It might not happen, but I hope it does.

thunderkyss
06-29-2013, 08:58 PM
The primary head scratching that will be occurring in the AFC South will be Texans fans trying to figure out why the team committed such a big long term contract to Schaub before he ever played in a single playoff game. What did he deliver? Out after the wild card round, just like TJ. I keep waiting for something better, but all we hear are .... excuses. Like letting home field advantage slip away.

I am looking forward to 5-10 years of Luck dominating the division myself. It might not happen, but I hope it does.

We were the favorites to be in the Super Bowl for much of the year. Had we even got to the AFC Championship game, we'd have been paying Schaub like Flacco.

It was a gamble they took, I'd have done the same thing. So I'm not scratching my head. He may not be the best starting QB in the league, but he is a starting QB & they don't come cheap. Contrary to popular belief, Matt's not out there losing games for us. He's not winning them for us, but he's definitely not losing them.

Like I said, I'm glad there are people like you who will be holding out hope against hope that Andrew Luck is the next great QB of the AFC South. It'll make our domination that much easier.

ObsiWan
06-29-2013, 09:52 PM
My response was solely to him calling Luck a bust.
That was a qualified comment. I said, "stat-wise he was kind of a bust". And perhaps "bust" was a bit strong. But that was because of all the hoopla and bally-hoo that preceded the draft.

Anyway, knowing what I know now, I'd take Russell Wilson over Luck. I actually like RGIII's game better than Luck's (Luck threw 18 picks to Wilson's 10 and RGIII's 5; that's right only FIVE picks all year) but I worry that his (RGIII's) very game-playing style won't lead to longevity.
Then again, RGIII was sacked 30 times, Luck was sacked 41. soooo, maybe it's Luck that won't last.... :)

Anyway, point is that of the three rookie QBs that got the most media attention last year, performance-wise Luck came in third. His TEAM did much better than expected but I attribute that to them wanting badly to win for their coach as much or more than Luck's performance on the field.

ObsiWan
06-29-2013, 10:08 PM
The primary head scratching that will be occurring in the AFC South will be Texans fans trying to figure out why the team committed such a big long term contract to Schaub before he ever played in a single playoff game. What did he deliver? Out after the wild card round, just like TJ. I keep waiting for something better, but all we hear are .... excuses. Like letting home field advantage slip away.

I am looking forward to 5-10 years of Luck dominating the division myself. It might not happen, but I hope it does.

Soooo you're a Colts fan?

drs23
06-30-2013, 07:40 PM
Soooo you're a Colts fan?

Obsi, I though that that's been apparent for quite some time. Don't even know why he's around other than to antagonize. That's pretty much all I've seen from him.

thunderkyss
06-30-2013, 08:17 PM
Obsi, I though that that's been apparent for quite some time. Don't even know why he's around other than to antagonize. That's pretty much all I've seen from him.

I don't think he's a Colts fan. He just really hates Schaub. Something about urine & cheerios I believe.

infantrycak
06-30-2013, 09:56 PM
I don't think he's a Colts fan. He just really hates Schaub. Something about urine & cheerios I believe.

Nope - he is a Colts fan. He also likes deriding Schaub.

EllisUnit
07-01-2013, 06:09 AM
Obsi, I though that that's been apparent for quite some time. Don't even know why he's around other than to antagonize. That's pretty much all I've seen from him.

Actually he seems to be a fan of every team the texans play. Dont know why the guy is even here TBH. All his Avis are either Schaub getting sacked or some bad play the texans made.

EllisUnit
07-01-2013, 06:13 AM
My response was solely to him calling Luck a bust.

Us calling luck a bust is like you already throwing him into the hall of fame. His numbers were terrible. And luck didnt beat us because he is a future "HOF" in your eves. He beat us cause Kubiak does what he always does, in a game he gets a lead he goes conservative, we had a lead in the AFC for the #1 seed and he goes conservative.

Luck did "OK" last season but for where he was drafted and all the hype he brought i have to agree with these guys, but he didnt have the type of season he should have with the way everyone, the media including you were and have been putting him on a pedistole.

ObsiWan
07-01-2013, 08:24 AM
Obsi, I thought that that's been apparent for quite some time. Don't even know why he's around other than to antagonize. That's pretty much all I've seen from him.
then he should man up and say so.
then again, I think he just did
:texflag:

76Texan
07-01-2013, 10:32 AM
I must say that Luck lived up to his namesake last year.

He was probably the most lucky QB I've seen in a given year.
Put the game tape on. In the first five games, there were at least ten of his passes that could have been interceptions; at least three were "sure" drops by a defender (and I'm being generous here since I don't want to count on my memory).

Luck has a lot of athleticism and qualities, but if he was the Texans QB last year (and if people don't make excuse for their "idol"), he would have been ripped apart on this forum; I guarantee it.

Yes, I have watched every single game he played.

thunderkyss
07-01-2013, 11:45 AM
Luck has a lot of athleticism and qualities, but if he was the Texans QB last year (and if people don't make excuse for their "idol"), he would have been ripped apart on this forum; I guarantee it.


Nah.... the "new" hadn't wore off yet. We'd make excuses for him for at least two years.

Most fans are pretty "fair" with new players, especially the ones that get a lot of pre-nfl hype. Year one is just to "see" what we got. Year two, they want to see improvement. & that's where most Luck fans are, if they're honest.

He'll get about 10 games to show improvement before there will be much "noise" about not.

Mr teX
07-01-2013, 01:29 PM
Would you trade JJ for Luck ? Of course you would, and in a heart beat and you'd also throw in some boot like Andre or Cushing or maybe both ?

its a toughee, but i think i go ahead and do it if for no other reason Qb is the most important position in the game and Luck's ceiling is higher at this point.

That's not to say Watt still won't be great in the near future, it's just that he was so great last year, he's less likely to live up to that season let alone top it. I think everyone expects Luck to be much better than he was last year...and he was pretty damn good last year.

Now throwing in AJ and Cush? Hell no. At this point in time, Watt for Luck would be about as even a swap as you can get...aside from trading any of the top 3 qbs.

b0ng
07-01-2013, 02:20 PM
I must say that Luck lived up to his namesake last year.

He was probably the most lucky QB I've seen in a given year.
Put the game tape on. In the first five games, there were at least ten of his passes that could have been interceptions; at least three were "sure" drops by a defender (and I'm being generous here since I don't want to count on my memory).

Lots of good and bad QB's have dropped INT's every year.

Luck has a lot of athleticism and qualities, but if he was the Texans QB last year (and if people don't make excuse for their "idol"), he would have been ripped apart on this forum; I guarantee it.

Yes, I have watched every single game he played.

Luck had a lot of INT's last year and his COMP% wasn't anything stellar, but I think it would have been relatively few posters that would've done the "ripping" apart. He showed enough in his play last year to make most people agree that you can probably win a lot of NFL games with Andrew Luck as your QB (Just as the Colts did last year, and with almost nobody else on that team either, especially that O-line dear god).

Anybody claiming to speak with authority on what 32 NFL GM's and execs would do in a given "draft whatever player you want" scenario are full of ****. NFL GM's make dumb moves/mistakes/strokes of genius all of the time and trying to nail down what a GM is thinking at any time in the off season is daunting enough, just ask mock draft guru's.

drs23
07-01-2013, 07:44 PM
Nope - he is a Colts fan. He also likes deriding Schaub.

Yup, and, Yes Sir. Correct on both points.

DocBar
07-01-2013, 09:01 PM
Nah.... the "new" hadn't wore off yet. We'd make excuses for him for at least two years.

Most fans are pretty "fair" with new players, especially the ones that get a lot of pre-nfl hype. Year one is just to "see" what we got. Year two, they want to see improvement. & that's where most Luck fans are, if they're honest.

He'll get about 10 games to show improvement before there will be much "noise" about not.Having been to many other team's fan forums, I somewhat disagree with this. We have our fair share of homers and we all have "our" players that we like and defend, but we also have a pretty good number of guys that are pretty danged objective and will call it like they see it- good or bad. There would've been a fair number of pink soapers calling Luck out for his play last season. In my humble, unbiased(yeah right) opinion, Luck would have a harder time on this MB than anything the Dolt fans would ever give him. :worldpeace:

ObsiWan
07-02-2013, 08:27 PM
Nah.... the "new" hadn't wore off yet. We'd make excuses for him for at least two years.


Is that a fact?
Signed, Kareem Jackson.


Well *I* think its true.
Signed, David Carr.

:D

thunderkyss
07-02-2013, 09:57 PM
Is that a fact?
Signed, Kareem Jackson.


Well *I* think its true.
Signed, David Carr.

:D

Kareem Jackson...... no hype. Most of us didn't even know who he was.


David Carr........ hype. The best QB prospect since blah, blah, blah...... the real deal.

Norg
07-04-2013, 04:10 AM
we really need to sweep the colts this year just to prove Luck will not have it easy in this divison or with this team

thunderkyss
07-04-2013, 10:32 AM
we really need to sweep the colts this year just to prove Luck will not have it easy in this divison or with this team

It would be nice to sweep the Colts, but not a "need"


We need to win the division again, to prove it is still ours.

If we sweep the Colts & go 6-10........ what difference does it make?

darnbni99a
07-07-2013, 01:17 AM
Would you trade JJ for Luck ? Of course you would, and in a heart beat and you'd also throw in some boot like Andre or Cushing or maybe both ?

lol wow...this dude serious??

:swatter:

EllisUnit
07-08-2013, 03:49 AM
lol wow...this dude serious??

:swatter:

sadly enough yes he is serious.

JJ Watt just came off one of the best seasons for a DT ever IMO. Luck had a subpar season. Why in the hell some would trade a game changer like watt and even perhaps throw in an AJ or cushing beats the hell out of me. Some here seem to think Luck is the best QB ever drafted. I thought he was ok last season myself, but not near good enough to trade off Watt, AJ or Cushing.

thunderkyss
07-08-2013, 08:17 AM
sadly enough yes he is serious.

JJ Watt just came off one of the best seasons for a DT ever IMO. Luck had a subpar season. Why in the hell some would trade a game changer like watt and even perhaps throw in an AJ or cushing beats the hell out of me. Some here seem to think Luck is the best QB ever drafted. I thought he was ok last season myself, but not near good enough to trade off Watt, AJ or Cushing.

Agree. That's not to say that Luck isn't the next Peyton Manning. But right now, he's not in the top 20 QBs in the league. Top 5 potential maybe, but he's not on the short list of best QBs right now.

Jj Watt, Brian Cushing, Andre Johnson; among best at their positions right now.

ObsiWan
07-08-2013, 10:46 AM
lol wow...this dude serious??

:swatter:

Yeah, I didn't believe it myself until he posted this


Originally Posted by BullBlitz http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2177589#post2177589)
The primary head scratching that will be occurring in the AFC South will be Texans fans trying to figure out why the team committed such a big long term contract to Schaub before he ever played in a single playoff game. What did he deliver? Out after the wild card round, just like TJ. I keep waiting for something better, but all we hear are .... excuses. Like letting home field advantage slip away.

I am looking forward to 5-10 years of Luck dominating the division myself. It might not happen, but I hope it does.



http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSSAcKjdnURs8evPiUkHroqfe_Y7G3rp K4Xh-mUDCD-4p_FOVskqg

Can you say TROLL boys and girls?
I knew you could.

drs23
07-09-2013, 10:55 AM
Can you say TROLL boys and girls?
I knew you could.

Just follow Champion Texan's sage advice: Don't feed the trolls.

And yeah, spot on.

EllisUnit
07-09-2013, 08:40 PM
Its kind of like SOME of the hispanics i see that are always sporting the mexican flag and talking mexico this mexico that, like i tell them "If its so great why are you here ?"

thunderkyss
07-09-2013, 09:35 PM
Its kind of like SOME of the hispanics i see that are always sporting the mexican flag and talking mexico this mexico that, like i tell them "If its so great why are you here ?"

I remember when I was in Turkey. Everywhere I went I was sporting the American flag. Every conversation I had, I'm sure I was telling them how great America was.

No one asked, but if they did wonder why I was in Turkey if I loved America so much, I'd tell them, "Because my country likes to remind y'all who's the big dawg."

Of course that would be just before a bar fight broke out. They'd blame me... After the third time, my XO didn't believe me.